We asked a focus group of people who can't afford the car how we should design it, and they strongly preferred "this".
@fredericoespinoza
Жыл бұрын
This
@MartinFracker
Жыл бұрын
thing is, there are lots of people who will buy cars that they can't afford.
@Choppy2400
Жыл бұрын
This x2
@tri3pleagent
Жыл бұрын
Camaro listened too much to enthusiasts in my opinion...and it's on the chopping block.
@BigfootUnibrowMan
Жыл бұрын
@tri3pleagent That isn't why it is on the chopping block though. GM is going full stup- I mean full EV, and the Camaro doesn't fit into that plan.
@dielaughing73
Жыл бұрын
I've said it elsewhere, but the reason you get this exceptional access to the engineers and designers is because you actually listen to what they say and tell their story. Please keep doing what you do and granting us access to the inner workings of the industry.
@ItsAlive111
Жыл бұрын
They provide a pre-recorded, rehearsed, edited, sanitized, glorified, legal team reviewed and approved, story would be more accurate.
@jakesnake1793
Жыл бұрын
@@ItsAlive111your cynicism aside, it’s refreshing to get perspectives across multiple levels of their development team. This style of video isn’t something you see from any other channels.
@ItsAlive111
Жыл бұрын
@@jakesnake1793 agreed
@davidryder3374
Жыл бұрын
@@ItsAlive111 Exactly. These teams are drooling at the chance to put out these presentations to a cultivated audience. It's called "marketing". Nothing against the Geese, but now these videos all sound exactly the same.
@THESLlCK
Жыл бұрын
@@jakesnake1793 his criticisms are real. These aren't refreshing perspectives. These are prerecorded voicemail messages. You are being lied to and yet you just like it so you're rolling with it
@TheMclaujo
Жыл бұрын
So happy Ford went with dual screens and the innovative 10 degree cant towards the driver. I have a similar setup in my cubicle and after 8-10 hours staring at them I can’t wait to spend just a little more time looking at a similar setup on my commute home. Refreshing.
@MrGamman3yt
Жыл бұрын
I wish I didn't read this comment. Sad but true.
@MrGrim2u1987
Жыл бұрын
Touche
@DUNEATV
Жыл бұрын
I’m sensing some sarcasm
@728GT
Жыл бұрын
"The focus groups really liked the Acer computer monitor setup as it reminded them of working from home during the pandemic."
@ClickbaitMotorsports
Жыл бұрын
😂 😂 😂 But has Unreal Engine graphics. And a shiny new shift knob. 😂😂😂
@Nomikeal
Жыл бұрын
The only people I can imagine saying they prefer entirely screen based buttons have never lived with one. Everyone I know who has lived with entirely screens prefers the mixed style (buttons for climate, seat, and audio)
@AnontheGOAT
Жыл бұрын
Yup. I called BS the moment she said they prefer all digital or all physical but not mixed.
@Beer_Dad1975
Жыл бұрын
"If I had asked people what they wanted, they would have said faster horses." - Henry Ford. Modern Ford "Muh twenty-somethings who can't afford or don't want a Mustang, what do you want?"
@Lazirus951
Жыл бұрын
I feel like they just asked a bunch of people questions with out actually making them to use different configurations first.
@Beer_Dad1975
Жыл бұрын
@@Lazirus951 Prototyping is too expensive when you can rely on people feelz for free I guess.
@CubanRider
Жыл бұрын
I don't think their "clinics" involved changing the climate settings driving on a busy city.
@pvtcmyers87
Жыл бұрын
So great to see Silverback Jack back in his natural environment.
@OdyTypeR
Жыл бұрын
The editing at 29:35 with the Shakeycam and music drop made the whole video for me.
@yamabushi_nate7825
Жыл бұрын
Silver-baku Jaku
@misterhat6395
Жыл бұрын
Raising the T-levels
@mcghee8071
Жыл бұрын
Should’ve said habitat. That’s a bar 😅😂
@buttsexandbananapeels
Жыл бұрын
Ooooh ooooh ooooh!!!
@PianoBlackTrimRep.
Жыл бұрын
Can't wait to see some new content on KZitem with mustangs flooring it 100% while pulling out of Cars And Coffee events and hitting pedestrians, curbs and other cars. It's been a while.
@marcharris4176
Жыл бұрын
Bad drivers drive all brands. Just there is so many more mustangs than others because how good they are.
@fhowland
Жыл бұрын
😂
@Bertinator-nm9ld
11 ай бұрын
@@marcharris4176Honestly, I think it's just a factor of how cheap Mustangs are, considering they make over 400hp. That's a lot of car for not a lot of money! Very often it's someone's first high horsepower rwd vehicle. What do you really expect, at that point?
@bwuki
Жыл бұрын
They reference the data a lot when it comes to user preferences, the one thing I’m curious on is if the data comes from people who buy mustangs or if it’s a general review board from within the company. I personally haven’t met anyone that says they like digital climate control versus physical
@oppos727
Жыл бұрын
I feel like it’s just a plausibly deniable excuse of a story that let’s them justify what’s actually a cost-cutting measure, at least from a PR perspective
@josephkorger
Жыл бұрын
Agree, climate controls in a screen is a bad idea 100% of the time. Incredible car otherwise
@AnontheGOAT
Жыл бұрын
Ya they should learn from other automotive makers who have learned from the mistake of going all digital for HVAC etc. Oh well, they’ll learn soon enough.
@youtubasoarus
Жыл бұрын
The only people they should have been polling were previous mustang owners and enthusiasts who would buy it.
@scholz222
Жыл бұрын
This looks like a video game simulator on the inside.
@SalvoSLR
Жыл бұрын
Mustangs engineer: “we don’t really have any prominent undercuts on the vehicle” Mark: cuts video to prominent undercut on the rear of the vehicle 😂
@squidikka
Жыл бұрын
Reminds me of the Canada Pearson airport video where the boss lady of the airport is lying through her teeth on how the flights are doing great and improved and the cameraman pans to the flight board literally right above her that shows almost every flight delayed or cancelled.
@NotAnonymousNo80014
Жыл бұрын
All about that CO2.
@BizaroStormy88
Жыл бұрын
And the doors lol
@mcbrian
Жыл бұрын
Can't look past the insanely shitty looking black plastic all over the car. Making the focus group out of a bunch of zoomers was a terrible idea. This will age very poorly
@Slipstreamaudio
Жыл бұрын
The iPads stuck to the dashboard have got to be a joke.
@twotrackjack2260
Жыл бұрын
Thanks to videos like this we can get some answers to what the hell were they thinking when they did this, i really appreciate that. Its interesting that Ford designers managed to capture so much of the current camaros design in the 'all new mustang'. I also old enough to remember the first time the car industry tried going to all digital guages in the late 80's and early 90's.. it didn't go that well. I'll be stunned if any of these new digital guages last more than 10 years without problems.
@apm3rk
Жыл бұрын
There was a jaw dropping amount of discussion from the Ford employees about things that change absolutely nothing about the driving experience…
@12ealDealOfficial
Жыл бұрын
"Here is my personal story that doesn't mention anything specific about the car."
@mikeicee
Жыл бұрын
LOL notice the front badge looks like its just injection moulded with the grill. LOL they digging far to save dollar.
@MrGamman3yt
Жыл бұрын
This is what's wrong with society. NYC and Hollyweird run the media and world, and tell my kids what they should like, and how to act. Oh, and we all know that it's the 5 rich folks running the media. How to be a slave. Good lord this is boring listening to them. I guess car people don't buy cars anymore. No hoods up around neighborhoods anymore. 2 themes. 30 millennial and Gen z. Progressive and modern. Omg, have you had discussions with any of them?
@CozyKG
Жыл бұрын
*watches a video called "why this car exists"*....*complains its a video about why the car exists and not the driving experience*
@728GT
Жыл бұрын
Exactly. Seems like they literally spent their budget to make it a better rental car.
@jonp1115
Жыл бұрын
Very disappointed to hear the engineers chose tacky screens to target a "younger audience" that cant even afford this car in its base form.
@dylan_50
Жыл бұрын
I'm sure cost cutting was the real reason for those screens
@tim3172
Жыл бұрын
Very disappointed that you don't understand that there are *literally* millions of "younger" people who have wealthy parents or who can just afford this. I come from poor-as-hell parents, but my first adult car was a new 2014 Audi S4 that I treated myself to at 24 years old. That thing was $59,590. The new Dark Horse is only $57,970 (bargain). Most of the young people I worked with had cars ranging from new Mustang GT's to Mercedes C 63 AMG's. The narrative that all young people are broke (or don't have wealthy parents) is simply false.
@mattdirks7896
Жыл бұрын
As a "younger audience" member, I'm not a fan of the ipad on a dash strategy.
@RCXDerp
Жыл бұрын
@@tim3172 If you think they aren't going to put 15k of ADM on this thing you're smoking crack
@mementomori29231
Жыл бұрын
I'm digging the big screens. I remember when people moaned and whined about big screen phones, how small screens were perfect. Now all phones are big because they sell. Same thing here. You all can whine all you want but you'll be the minority.
@bobloblaw3191
Жыл бұрын
I always take the story behind the badge design into consideration when I'm car shopping
@rickybobby8224
10 ай бұрын
I know exactly what you mean. One should always lead with the story behind the logo change.
@chuckystang
Жыл бұрын
No idea how those screens passed any sort of legit litmus test unless they only asked 21 year old influencers. At the very least make them shaped like gauges or something or maybe seamless under the dash but to just have them sitting there like an afterthought is a travesty. The issue with the styling approach on the inside is that it will quickly look dated because tech advances so quickly. The interior is a complete miss on this car.
@HerrPoopschitz
Жыл бұрын
Ford does have a love of stupidass influencers...🤔
@Lazirus951
Жыл бұрын
Yea, agreed. This is sexy on a showroom floor right now to young buyers that can't afford it.
@Paulfromwish
Жыл бұрын
Imagine what this interior is gonna look like second hand after 2 years good lord Looks like 2011 android tablets
@mementomori29231
Жыл бұрын
Man you must be an old fogie. The screens will always be up to date vs boring dials that never change. Even the original model S screens look modern because of software updates, vs a 20 year old car. You guys are funny and weird as hell.
@Paulfromwish
Жыл бұрын
@@mementomori29231 mate I’m 30+ it’s not a modern frameless intergrated screen like a Tesla, other then the dark horse for its tremec the GT and ecoboost models are gonna depreciate like hell with these Kia tablets
@sneedweaver
Жыл бұрын
You can tell the exterior design engineer would have had it a different way. I would have liked to see that retro mockup
@d_all_in
Жыл бұрын
The retro look is corny
@THESLlCK
Жыл бұрын
the 2008 mustangs and camaros looked great. Maybe not original and a little disproportioned, but they're great. The challenger still looks amazing.@@d_all_in
@haggard1378
Жыл бұрын
It looks exactly like the last one
@BRAINFxck10
Жыл бұрын
@@d_all_innot if done right like the Challenger, I’d take a Hellcat over a corny Dark Horse any day
@pawg206
Жыл бұрын
@@BRAINFxck10 ok
@Hybris51129
Жыл бұрын
I was really hot on getting a Dark Horse but now as my savings get to the point where I planned on pulling the trigger I am cooling off because of the virtually all digital interior. For me this car has to be my DD for 10 years minimum and I just don't have that level of trust in the reliability of the screens. I am hoping that the Shelby that is said to be coming in another year or two will have a more traditional interior otherwise I will likely start looking at F-350 or something along those lines.
@haggard1378
Жыл бұрын
Get the F350. Fucking beautiful and I’m a Ram guy.
@wh0_am_152
Жыл бұрын
The digital dash will almost certainly last 10 years they are designed for a minimum life of 20,000 hours or 2.3 years of 100% on time assuming you drive less than 5 and 1/2 hours a day they will last more than 10 years.... Hate that they moved climate control to the displays though.
@joshuabennett8110
Жыл бұрын
How about the Shelby 350GT?
@Hybris51129
Жыл бұрын
@@joshuabennett8110 Honestly could never find the appeal of the 350. It usually didn't have the power of the 500 that was usually also available and was only a little cheaper so if you were buy one anyway the 500 was likely with the same budget range.
@Sawubona2007
Жыл бұрын
18:15 "I literally had so much fun in there I didn't think to start the car" That's the damn problem nowadays.
@Asylem9
Жыл бұрын
As a Camaro fan... I have to say that this design direction was a good choice. Nice job, Ford!
@ClickbaitMotorsports
Жыл бұрын
😂 Touche.
@TheMsr47gaming
Жыл бұрын
Looks like and aftermarket s550, infact you could make bodykits for the gt500 that would probbly be one to one. The universe is the limit and they move 2ft...like come on ik you can do better.
@THESLlCK
Жыл бұрын
agree, they've designed a fantastic next gen camaro
@Sly_Wolf_1
Жыл бұрын
@@THESLlCK 👏👏👏👏👏👏
@NarLyNaRdi
Жыл бұрын
The hood, and the whole side profile is absolutely screaming Camaro! Hell, the vent inserts in the hoods are exactly the same as the ‘19-‘24.
@SixSpeedSeven
Жыл бұрын
21:41 it was awkward hearing him talk about how much steering feel you get from the changes they made to the rack. Every S650 review I’ve seen has emphasized the LACK of steering feel.
@nicholasn.2883
Жыл бұрын
Is it different in the dark horse, I heard it might be different
@hkfan4596
Жыл бұрын
This. In at least 3 reviews I’ve seen the reviewer demonstrate ON VIDEO just how easy it is to move the steering wheel. There is zero feel and it’s completely overboosted. It’s like Ford made the vehicle for 5 foot tall petite women who lack the strength necessary for steering that has weight and feel. Garbage. No thanks, Ford.
@noodles9345
Жыл бұрын
@hkfan4596 Well a lot of women do buy Mustangs so it wouldn't be surprising lol.
@hkfan4596
Жыл бұрын
@@noodles9345 lol still very annoying that Ford catered to the lowest common denominator. That’s why I love the C7 and C8. Tight steering and decent feel. BMW made their steering one finger light and it feels downright dangerous at ultra high speeds. Why anyone would buy this over a C8 for just a little bit more money is literally mentally retarded.
@AlexWalter
Жыл бұрын
Savagegeese's technical assessment of vehicles is probably the best you'll find on KZitem. Throttle house among others are nowhere near as in depth, and I say that as a huge throttle house fan. I always trust Savages opinion over any other channel.
@FXPhysics
Жыл бұрын
I'm always asking myself: would I still want this car if it weren't the latest brand spanking new model? Then I realize that 99% of the appeal was in the FOMO, not the car itself. Great video nonetheless.
@yungrichnbroke5199
Жыл бұрын
Fomo is driving these insane prices including the black wings. Yeah I said it. CT5-V black wing is severely overpriced.
@Eunos_FD3S
Жыл бұрын
That’s a great question . I’ll use it
@Mr.Thermistor7228
Жыл бұрын
@@yungrichnbroke5199the ct5 blackwing is a feat of automotive prowess. There are loads of overpriced non performing cars you could have used for your example, the blackwing ain't one of them
@borger99
Жыл бұрын
@@yungrichnbroke5199all cars are overpriced as is the nature of our economic system. Competition breeds extinction.
@_IMNNO
Жыл бұрын
FoMoCo
@timothycc711
Жыл бұрын
Being a FORD stock,GT350 Mustang owning fanboy I really, really enjoyed this video. Thank you Mark and Jack very much. I loved the Deep Dive with the car development team and all the technical info and cinematography. You are my favorite car reviewers on KZitem.
@0mnil0rd
Жыл бұрын
Exceptional content, absolutely. I do like that a manual V8 is still available, but if you want to appeal to a younger audience, there are some major financial changes that would have to occur. Cost of living is astronomical in most areas, and with wages stagnating, the likelyhood that a younger person would be able to afford something like this as opposed to a used mustang is low unfortunately. In 1970, a new mustang Mach 1 would cost around $3500, with average income closer to $6000. Being able to spend half a years wages and buy a car outright just isn't how it works anymore. Today the average income is around $55000, which could get you a well optioned GT and leave nothing for food or rent. Younger people tend to make even less than average, so marketing this at them seems like a tough sell. I'm around 28 and work a pretty decent job with a college degree and all, and the only way I was able to feasibly afford a Mustang was because some guy in a Honda Element rear ended me at 70mph in my old car.
@enron9983
Жыл бұрын
The target audience is boomers who want to seem young or hip. They know no young person can afford this. The Ecoboost was made for the Indian market, and pawned off on young ppl as an "affordable mustang" which is nonsense.
@skateinspace
Жыл бұрын
oh theyll be inside this mustang...because it'll be their uber 😂
@truckercowboyed2638
Жыл бұрын
Ummm that's a dumb comment, this isn't for people on a budget.... Buy a Ecoboost for that...
@TheFogmachine803
Жыл бұрын
@@enron9983it’s priced in the exact same range as the MKV Supra and most of the owners of that car that I met when I owned one were younger late 20s. I bought mine when I was 26. Now I’m considering trading for this new mustang, tell me how they got the marketing wrong again?
@728GT
Жыл бұрын
Its always funny seeing old farts try to appeal to braindead younger buyers with stupid focus groups. Just make a good car and pull your head out your ass. We all know those parts bin screens and electronic parking brake were mandated by the upper brass but theyll tell you PeOpLe WaNtEd tHeSe UNREAL ENGINEEEE
@Closertotruth2
Жыл бұрын
I always knew I was different. I like a mix of physical and digital controls.
@728GT
Жыл бұрын
Yeah literally the best option is poo poo'd by some losers in a focus group.
@forrestsautoreviewsofficial
Жыл бұрын
I just love you guys so much. 😂 This Dark Horse seems like a great direction for Mustang. More handling focused and I’m all for it.
@THESLlCK
Жыл бұрын
you've never done a car review ever. You just ADHD swoosh your hands over plastic junk and it's revolting
@exxusdrugstore300
10 ай бұрын
@@THESLlCK goddamn lol
@pavu8469
9 ай бұрын
@@THESLlCKhe used to do full length reviews on his channel and motortrend. But real reviews aren't for the tiktok kid generation, so he's gotta do what he's gotta do.
@phosoup1540
Жыл бұрын
This is the video that finally made me sign up for your patreon. THIS type of content is what the car worlds needs. You're doing god's work.
@jackholmes8105
Жыл бұрын
❤
@JacesOwnWorld
Жыл бұрын
I got to view this video for free lol
@overbuiltlimited
Жыл бұрын
@@JacesOwnWorld You completely missed his point. Lol
@entertained...
Жыл бұрын
@@overbuiltlimited if you've ever had the misfortune of reading his other comments, this one comes as no surprise haha.
@Angry_Gnome
Жыл бұрын
Beyond the amazing (and often hilarious) reviews, I absolutely LOVE the access and interviews with the engineers themselves. Nobody does it like you guys do. Mark and Jack, you are the best, please keep it up!
@cwx8
Жыл бұрын
really? i got bombarded by tone deaf corporate speak for 30 min.
@TheMsr47gaming
Жыл бұрын
@@cwx8 same like a robot trying to convivence me it has my best interest...lol
@DrivenWildOutdoors
Жыл бұрын
Best 2024 Darkhorse Mustang review I have seen.
@yanboa
Жыл бұрын
Whenever you guys make videos that interview the team members, I’m always amazed whenever I hear about people who’ve been working at Ford, GM, etc for multiple generations…! To me, that’s unfathomable, but I also really respect that. Always good to hear about the people behind the products. Always. Stories do matter, and ideally, real ones.
@Corsair857
Жыл бұрын
Nepotism is great
@baronvonjo1929
Жыл бұрын
I would be so embarrassed to work at Ford or GM tbh lol. They are so passionate but they just produce so much crap it's amazing.
@gorgonismztruth1551
Жыл бұрын
it looks like too many designers were involved
@dan6871
Жыл бұрын
Probably explains why none of these companies build cars anymore
@TheChannel1978
Жыл бұрын
@@Corsair857 Or a mixture of not wanting to move due to family. But either way, I don't think somebody who works at the same company for 40yrs is pushing the envelope
@leonardomendez-zapata9032
Жыл бұрын
yeah, ain’t going to capture a younger audience with a $70k car lol
@ilovebanks1526
Жыл бұрын
Right? Why are they trying to capture a younger audience when you need at least decent 6 figures to be able to comfortably afford the car.
@bert_norton
Жыл бұрын
Marketing bullshit spun by people who make money by convincing shareholders that a phrase or moniker will change anything. None of these people care about the engineering, only the sales.
@Lazirus951
Жыл бұрын
Exactly what I was thinking. The vast majority of people you actually see driving $70k Mustangs are middle-aged dudes cause they can afford it.
@MeltingRubberZ28
Жыл бұрын
Those are the 2.3L lol
@offensiveexplosion
Жыл бұрын
100k after markups
@shmurdamma
11 ай бұрын
“I spent 50 minutes playing with the screen” - cuts to video of sg clicking the temp change 10 times before the lag finally realizes he’s touching the screen
@728GT
Жыл бұрын
The fact that the designer said they wanted to drop the roof lets me know these people live in their own world. Literally everyone pans the Camaro for its low roof and shit visibility. Its partially why its dead but these guys at Ford have such a hard on for the Camaro that they were going to make the same stupid mistake 😂
@390fe451
Жыл бұрын
*roof AND belt line, not just the roof
@728GT
Жыл бұрын
@@390fe451 they need to lower the damn seat rails. Sitting in the damn car like im on a bar stool
@revvolutions
Жыл бұрын
@@728GTthat's the Mustang driving position, it's for old people.
@TassieLorenzo
Жыл бұрын
If true, that would explain why (especially with this Dark Horse grille and graphics) it looks so much like a Camaro! IMO it was a mistake for Ford to remove a lot of the strong character lines from the S550 which were unmistakably "Mustang". For a car like this, for the buyers it is aimed at, something that is a bit retro is the way to go -- look at the success of the Ford Bronco.
@sdlausen1
Жыл бұрын
It's not the roof on the Camaro that's the problem, it's the stupid high beltline. Thank government regulations for that BS.
@VWGTI123
Жыл бұрын
This video really explains why I will never get rid of my 2012 BOSS 302
@UncleRayRayGarageEmporium
Жыл бұрын
I love these videos! So much insight into the design and engineering of influential cars. I hope manufacturers take note of you, and the fair exposure you produce for the car nerds lurking the net.
@will3tm
Жыл бұрын
Don’t ever stop making videos. Everyone of them is appreciated
@thelifeofguyon
Жыл бұрын
SO excited to watch this. Thanks you SG for routinely putting out such excellent content!
@saleen367
Жыл бұрын
Chris Walter said all that needed to be said. "We wanted to lower the roof, we wanted to lower the belt line significantly, but that would have meant millions of dollars of investment". Instead of spending the money to do the 7th Gen correctly, Ford half ass'd it and gave it a new name to create artificial interest. They then poured Billions with a B, of dollars of capital into EV.
@ghoulbuster1
Жыл бұрын
Money that will be wasted when none buys those fire hazards on wheels.
@TassieLorenzo
Жыл бұрын
To be fair, the proportions were the least of the problems with the S550. That the S650 is just a facelift and has the same proportions is not one of its issues IMO. The issues are more around the finer detailing of the body lines, the interior, the steering feel (in the standard model) etc.
@Kk_1100
Жыл бұрын
Yup
@XuandePD
Жыл бұрын
All these things would have resulted in a much more expensive vehicle. These engineers are passionate but at the end of the day the company needs people to buy the cars to make money.
@lbgstzockt8493
Жыл бұрын
You mean the fire hazards that burn less than ICE cars both in absolute and relative terms? The ones whose sales percentage increased by 10x in the past five years? Yeah, nobody buys those. @@ghoulbuster1
@Affalterbach1967
Жыл бұрын
I just spent 4+ hours in a debreif on how important this video is and how good the coyote v8 engines are (they are built Ford tough).
@savagegeese
Жыл бұрын
Thanks for being a man for 4 hours
@terrancebulong4573
Жыл бұрын
Yep. The last gen Coyote, RPG took one, swapped out OPG's for billet ones, threw a turbo kit on it and ran 7's on a FACTORY SEALED motor. Unheard-of 😮 Ford knows what they're doing.
@@terrancebulong4573aldowelds took a stock motor gen 2 and went mid-high 7’s with it. Coyotes are the best motor Ford has put out in the modern era.
@terrancebulong4573
Жыл бұрын
@@ralkia international, not built in house like the new bulletproof high output 6.7 making 1200ftlbs easily.
@ChirpingChocobo
6 ай бұрын
Love the Retrowave music in the background 🤙
@jkliao6486
Жыл бұрын
18:06 I don't think sitting in the car for 50 minutes playing with the screen to figure it out is a compliment. But I guess it's just me lagging behind the fast moving world in my mid 20s.
@johnbrobston1334
Жыл бұрын
Yeah. I just want to get in the car and go, not spend an hour fidding with screens.
@adamyahya4638
Жыл бұрын
A literal ipad as a dashboard. What is up with designers? People want digital gauges sure, but you can absolutely design nice gauge pods as opposed to literally sticking a skinny ipad behind the steering wheel. No to mention this already looks dated lol. Imagine this thing in 10 years? How many critical controls will operate smoothly? They reference studies but garbage in = garbage out. People don't know anything and only look at big shiny new tech with wide eyes like a 5 year old. Once they live with it and see how it actually operates after years of use they'll quickly change their mind. This is where we need to rely on the professionals who have years of industry experience to bring people back down to reality. Didn't VW just go back on their gauge cluster/infotainment system and admit they made a big mistake with the mk8 Golf?
@user-qc7dr3cd3q
Жыл бұрын
Amen
@svn5994
Жыл бұрын
Isn't the MK8 still the garbage touch screen shit?
@erictenbensel6590
Жыл бұрын
Amen
@greenmadness1305
Жыл бұрын
High quality production as always, I really like your mixture of cineastic camerashots, valuable information from first hand sources and a glimpse of comedic entertainment. Well done, guys. Ah, one frank comment: looks like you spun out at 29:44 🙂 Should have done the cut half a second earlier 😊
@MaddNomad1015
Жыл бұрын
Love the Mustang nameplate but the price is insane.
@andyholstein237
Жыл бұрын
Even the base GT starts at 42k. The era of relatively cheap V8 power is sadly over.
@TheNotimprezed
Жыл бұрын
Would have been nice if the base GT had a $39k starting price, but there are not many 480hp cars in the low $40k range...
@clancas01
Жыл бұрын
especially for the power.
@TheMarine015
Жыл бұрын
@@bryangillis1839and Ford is well aware that Camaro and Dodge V8s are gone.
@169abr
Жыл бұрын
@@TheMarine015we’re back in the 3V days where Ford had no competition so didn’t care to push it.
@gadeane287
Жыл бұрын
It's obvious that the Geese twosome is well-respected by the product managers and engineers at Ford. The content of thsi video shows that you have tremendous respect for the Ford team. This is the car that those wishing to have a C8 would possibly buy. The trunk, back seat, and interior focused on the driver makes this a monkey car that's more practical. You could haul a spouse and two kids while hauling ass, something the C8 can't do. Outstanding work Mark and Jack. You are the very best out there.
@117johnpar
Жыл бұрын
"We have a lineup for mustangs to suit anyones needs" Yes, A rental car v6, A GT sports car, a 'scat pack' (but not really) trim, A track package, And a crossover that replaces soccarmom minivans of old. Definitely covering all the bases there.
@LingLing1337
Жыл бұрын
Thanks so much SavageGeese, I blast ropes to your videos daily ❤
@jonesjones7057
Жыл бұрын
The more time goes by, the more I hate digital screens in cars, especially now that they are just propping them up like an ipad on its side, even for the tach and speedo. Looks cheap and generally hideous and usually a pia.
@mmavcanuck
Жыл бұрын
The “digital experience manager” is full of um, hot air. People absolutely want a mix, you just don’t want to do it. If it’s something that will be interacted with while driving, it should be physical so that you don’t need to look at the screen. “But the focus group…” did you give the focus group cars to drive around Ruth? Experiences are very different than opinions on a piece of paper.
@RevMatch92
8 ай бұрын
got to love when you spin out at 29:43 but with the power of editing it seems you recovered! lol nice.
@Redpepper7376
5 ай бұрын
They definitely lost it😅
@dfdorsey85
Жыл бұрын
$70k is atrocious pricing figure for a non-limited run bespoke Mustang. Seems like manufacturers are pricing all their vehicles as if everyone has a million dollar plus net worth. The 6th gen and prior, you use to be able to get a GT manual for less than $40k. I really believe that we are going to be bailing out all of these Auto companies again when their sales slump and they can't move vehicles. It's going to be 2008-2009 all over again soon.
@Xolition
Жыл бұрын
Ford is already in trouble with their Mach Es and lots full of $100k trucks.
@nerychristian
Жыл бұрын
Yeah, it's crazy. It's not worth getting into such a huge debt. Better to use that money for a down payment on a house. In some parts of the country, two Mustangs will get you a little house.
@mikedaleiden7725
Жыл бұрын
Its disappointing that Ford doesn't build anything fun and affordable anymore to bring in younger buyers who want more than a truck or an appliance. A whole generation of car enthusiasts is growing up with Ford being the Truck company that still builds some 4000lb over priced Mustangs stuck in a gray area between sports car and muscle car.
@derekb5749
Жыл бұрын
This is a dumb statement, this is the top trim. The base GT is still available and cheaper.
@nerychristian
Жыл бұрын
@@derekb5749 You're forgetting about all the dealer markups. Last time I went to a Ford dealer, they wanted to charge me almost 50K for a 2022 Mustang GT. Eventually, people are just going to get tired of these prices and just choose public transportation, or motorcycles.
@r000tbeer
Жыл бұрын
"We wanted it to look like a Camaro, so we made a shit front end and mated it with the Mach E rear end, then threw a bunch of tablets inside" - Ford.
@zijunx1595
Жыл бұрын
The front fascia is very similar to the v6 Camaro but a little more aggressive, lmao.
@fdangleshadang-a-lang7149
Жыл бұрын
The front end is atrocious. The regular GT and eco boost aren’t as bad because they don’t have those ugly black plastic eyeliner looking things under the headlights
@singular9
Жыл бұрын
So mustang went from one of the most old school analogue cars to an edgy anime gamer playstation on wheels.
@jjlad5037
Жыл бұрын
I'm guessing they're looking for a younger driver.
@169abr
Жыл бұрын
@@jjlad5037ford looks and namesake, Lincoln price. Not a smart move.
@HuskySFM
Жыл бұрын
15:06 the most violent shifter boot installation that I have ever seen.
@DeadBen.
Жыл бұрын
I have a Mach 1. Normally would feel a little bite for not having the incremental performance updates from the dark horse. But, the interior changes with those screens make me happy to have purchased the Mach 1 and not the dark horse. Still glad the car is being made though.
@fredwilliams7893
Жыл бұрын
Agree ! 15 to 2023 much better looking interior!
@ClickbaitMotorsports
Жыл бұрын
The Mach 1 (HP) is the best N/A S550 made. The GT500 being ultimate Mustang ever made.
@TheMsr47gaming
Жыл бұрын
Just wait lol just wait.
@ClickbaitMotorsports
Жыл бұрын
@@TheMsr47gaming Huh? Is Ford adding jet propulsion to the Dead Horse or something?
@TopAliGi
8 ай бұрын
@@ClickbaitMotorsportsif equipped with the Tremec manual transmission and Handling package
@rosgoncharuk2403
Жыл бұрын
Nothing makes me wake up faster then Ford marketing explanations and big touchscreens talks!
@728GT
Жыл бұрын
FOCUS GROUPS
@TassieLorenzo
Жыл бұрын
@@728GT Did those focus groups mention how they like the Ford Focus more than the Ford Escape? 🤔
@bleebleblahble8833
Жыл бұрын
Good to see Tim get the nod from the mustang group after being responsible for cars such as the Fiesta ST. He’s the best of the bunch.
@Arcticfox7
Жыл бұрын
Mustang isn't a living room, it's a sports car. Big screens are nothing but a distraction.
@AncientFlorida
Жыл бұрын
Dude said, yea we wanted to give it more modern cues.... Put a grill opening here, a slot there' paint that area black. Perfect
@thegirthquake8574
Жыл бұрын
I enjoyed hearing the engineer mention there's more direct feeling steering-- yet Throttle House stated they couldn't trust the car because the steering was completely dead.
@Aki_Lesbrinco
Жыл бұрын
Throttle House were driving the regular GT trim and Savageese were testing the Dark horse. It's safe to think that the tunning is different. Hell, the manual transmission unit is different between the two.
@UnitedNaishuns
Жыл бұрын
Dark Horse prolly has different tuning and also has massive tires in the front which can push an illusion of good steering. You have so much grip up front you don't comprehend the lack of feel until the turn is already over lol
@AnontheGOAT
Жыл бұрын
@@Aki_Lesbrincoya but the engineer said the faster steering ratio is across all models.
@TassieLorenzo
Жыл бұрын
The Throttle House car had Pirelli P Zeros, presumably with soft sidewalls. It could be that the Dark Horse comes with better tyres (like Goodyear Eagle F1 Supercar 3R)? ...Nope a quick Google suggests it has the same P Zero PZ4 tyres. So I'm out of ideas on that one! Perhaps it is just the calibration (and steering rack itself) that is different?
@TassieLorenzo
Жыл бұрын
@@DragonKnightX12 They tried all three modes. Unfortunately Ford has the mistaken idea that buyers want pull-drift compensation, which filters out steering feedback: "A software-based pull-drift compensation program that helps keep a vehicle equipped with EPS on track when faced with crosswinds or an uneven driving surface. ... The pull-drift compensation program operates via sensors that constantly measure wheel torque applied by the driver to maintain direction. Ford says the pull-drift compensation program is designed to increase customer satisfaction in steering, suspension, and ride quality surveys by up to 50%." Normally it would be noted that sportscar buyers *do not want* this, but Ford seem to have failed to oblige that! The old Mustang even had a rubber coupling in the middle of the steering column like a Hyundai Elantra (BMW E46 M3s had that too), why you would put a rubber isolator in the steering column on an enthusiast car, I have no idea!
@sshhddoo9892
Жыл бұрын
I'm a milennial and grew up with tech and video games and ect like the guy says, and I do not want screens as my gauges. Analog gauges supported by a touch screen infotainment is as good of a balance as you can get, but we must be a minority because according to their data, everybody wants these screens which is unfortunate.😮💨
@io3010
Ай бұрын
Ive owned Mustangs and Mustang Cobra's since my 1989 GT 5.0. Just bought a new 24 S650 GT premium and have to say, this car just rocks. Car is fast, rides fantastic, handles well, super quiet cabin, killer exhaust note, 27 MPG at 60 MPH on road trips. Okay the iPad dash isn't the best, but it's the future and is in every top tier car these days, Mercedes BMW etc.. I do admit its fun to play with all the dash features and there are alot. Overall, love the car, it's an absolute blast to drive and you will blow the doors off every grocery getter Camery, Rav4, Escape, Prius, Hyundai, Kia, boring blah, blah plastic cars these days.
@chkndnts
Жыл бұрын
They designed their only sports car based on the feedback of interns. And then "I spent 50 minutes in the car messing with settings" Ford's described design process is everything that is awful about the auto industry. The fact they did this on the Mustang of all cars blows my mind
@johnbrobston1334
Жыл бұрын
Just remember that they're in business to sell cars to as many people as possible, and most buyers aren't actually enthusiasts.
@911goodlife4
Жыл бұрын
They definitely led the audience with their questions on digital vs physical buttons… I’ve never met anyone that actually lived with touch screen solutions that like them. Honestly kills what seemed like a driver focused car.
@tufluxed3293
Жыл бұрын
God the double screens looks terrible 😂
@kalmmonke5037
Жыл бұрын
🤓
@ShadowBend
Жыл бұрын
The screens remind me of a racing sim setup. The graphics and performance of the screen look fine, just the screens themselves don't look great. It is nice the amount of info they seem to provide also, but the previous gen had a better integrated digital display.
@MrCarGuy
Жыл бұрын
None of it looks appealing. Especially the UI
@noble20xx56
2 ай бұрын
For real. The dude did mention the use of Unreal Engine too. No wonder people are talking about the steering feeling empty. It mimics the the weightlessness.
@Bnhuskins
11 ай бұрын
As a previous owner of multiple Camaros, I like this new design😜
@mmavcanuck
Жыл бұрын
Did ford ever sit down and ask themselves who they were building this car for? The “younger buyers” can’t afford to eat breakfast, let alone buy an up-priced car.
@mikedaleiden7725
Жыл бұрын
ZL1 and Hellcat price with only Mustang GTish power. Their target market can be described as SUCKERS!
@RCXDerp
Жыл бұрын
@@mikedaleiden7725 nobody buys ZL1 though
@G82Jesse
Жыл бұрын
As always, highest production quality car-related content on this platform. Well done guys!
@azizbassman
Жыл бұрын
Wow,I'm very impressed with this production, Docufilm 👏 Mark. Your editing skills are amazing and must have taken says to do. Jack, great presenting, too. Thanks, guys. This film should go out on national TV.
@dustinbonivert
Жыл бұрын
Unbelievable! 29:41 they blew out the drift and edited it out! Ford reigned them in!!
@ryanpuryear
Жыл бұрын
Yeah, there was a spin out
@davedave2882
10 ай бұрын
Personally I wasn't too sure about the screens,im 51 an love analog , but actually sitting in the vehicle. It actually feels pretty good, it doesn't seem out of place, and blends in to the dash very well. I do you have the premium so I have the one big screen. An of course 6 speed manual! Because who buys an automatic mustang 😂
@Xdev1lG00D
Жыл бұрын
I'm excited for this. I'm bricked up off this and it's not even the full video
@SupremeKid98
Жыл бұрын
Simping for sure
@simon.templar9998
Жыл бұрын
Dude!🧐
@TJ_Kirkland.
Жыл бұрын
Same. I’ve had a hard on for the past hour.
@ThisisPhillip
Жыл бұрын
Calm down sir !
@Markus56165
Жыл бұрын
Well done boys! The time and effort that go into videos like this is amazing. We're so lucky to get videos like this with access to the teams that build and design these vehicles. Thank you.
@revmatchtv
Жыл бұрын
A couple months back I was going to put a deposit on one. I didn't because although it's a very emotional vehicle, its $70K+ loaded price is too rich for what it is.
@eggy7346
Жыл бұрын
I'd like to see a better integration of the screens in the future. The facelift itself is seggsy as hell but I'm not the biggest fan of the "slapping on an ipad" trend
@bigmacdaddy1234
Жыл бұрын
This car IS the future and they made zero effort to get the screens right.
@s197mustangfan
Жыл бұрын
Does everything now Have to be a damn video game design for attention span limited kids? There’s nothing wrong with a mix of analog gauges and modern technology.
@tibidt
Жыл бұрын
Some other brands had better integration in like 2015.....and now on the all new and improved models they have shit squares
@youtubasoarus
Жыл бұрын
I think these fucking screens were on a bean counters checklist and when they realized they could get rid of 20 physical buttons they came in their pants and said everything goes into the touch screen. Mission accomplished. 🤮 This is the most irritating trend in the industry.
@UnorthodoxMasterOfGames
Жыл бұрын
19:51 Okay, you got me. I thought he was an alternate universe version of Mark until he introduced himself.
@shanGoes924
Жыл бұрын
I could watch the driving impressions over and over and over and over again. Superb video
@srkvhozite2424
Жыл бұрын
Great video on a mid car. I love Mustangs (I daily a 2011 Mustang GT) but the S650 is a miss from me. Too expensive, too heavy, and that interior is a crime. Despite all that you guys still make me kinda like the car, which is a testament to the quality of your videos. Keep up the good work!
@169abr
Жыл бұрын
Like 60% of the interior looks like my 2020 GT/CS, my next mustang will be a 12 BOSS302
@billymania11
Жыл бұрын
As we approach the twilight of the gasoline car era, the Mustang has turned into a fine automobile. It's head and shoulders above the earlier generations of this model. We've just gotten a little spoiled. I drive a 2023 Mustang GT 6 speed and I've owned many cars and that includes BMW M automobiles and my Mustang compares very favorably to what I've owned previously.
@billisdewillis5
Жыл бұрын
I too would like a Boss…their values tipped upwards sharply in the past few years. I should have bought one in 2019 when they were sort of at their best price.
@169abr
Жыл бұрын
@@billisdewillis5 same man, I was torn between a Boss and an S550 as a daily and I picked the S550 cause I wanted a better interior.
@rowanyuh6326
Жыл бұрын
This is like the Whole Lotta Red of cars people are hating now but in 5 years theyll see the genius
@Riley8425
Жыл бұрын
Who exactly did they focus group that told them they preferred all digital vs physical and digital mixed????
@dooder126
Жыл бұрын
Guarantee it was internal and the people that know how an interior should be constructed were too busy being slammed with work 😂
@dougrobinson8602
Жыл бұрын
Millennials and younger, I'd imagine. To their credit, keeping the climate controls visible at the bottom of the screen at all times is a great idea.
@MrCarGuy
Жыл бұрын
Obviously not existing Mustang fans. It's a biased sample when only the technology-obsessed types would end up in something like a focus group. Only a small number of Mustang people would even sign up for one
@169abr
Жыл бұрын
I hate to say it but I think the Focus Group was younger and a good chunk women, this is stuff I see in “Mom Car” SUV’s and what not. Younger people tend to prefer screens, over physical controls.
@joe718gt4
Жыл бұрын
I've been to a few focus group activities and I've never been asked that kind of question. It's more like which GUI you like better. You can probably thank (or hate) me partially for whatever Dodge comes up with next
@asheru9254
Жыл бұрын
I'll never afford this type of car but I enjoy watching savage guesse from Kenya since 2018. Keep the good work guys
@twowheeler1000
Жыл бұрын
Never say never, who knows how your life will work out dude
@JJ-mh3hb
Жыл бұрын
If it makes you feel better I'm in NYC and just like you, can't afford it 👍 head up
@Josh-cw8by
Жыл бұрын
I hope you stumble upon a backpack of 400 grand and buy yourself a Dark Horse.
@bwSteen
Жыл бұрын
move to america and can achieve a car like this in 5 years from ground 0 hardest part is credit history
@Josh-cw8by
Жыл бұрын
@@JJ-mh3hb That doesn't make him feel better. NYC has the most expensive rent on the planet. Of course you can't afford a car. Hahaha
@chrisfreemesser5707
Жыл бұрын
Great video guys. I'd be curious to know what the demographics are for the average "higher-end" Mustang owner. The design team seemed to put a lot of value in what millenials and Gen Z'ers wanted in the car, but if the buying demographic skews towards older folks who can afford a $70K car, has Ford set themselves up for failure with such a digital-heavy interior?
@KC-lg8qf
Жыл бұрын
That's the problem when you have such old people working on development of these cars. They merely theorize what a young person might want or be able to do. HIs example of young people spending time setting up phones and iPads in cars before driving was ridiculous. Being younger doesn't mean you're still not buying this car because you want a screaming V8. It means you want Screens!!
@Mr.Thermistor7228
Жыл бұрын
Lmao they have no clue who they are trying to appeal too, lost development team all around. Typical mustang
@zijunx1595
Жыл бұрын
@@KC-lg8qf Exactly, the two screens lack styling. They should at least take the 911's interior as reference.
@elthionel
Жыл бұрын
1500 a year will sell out and have wait lists. Likely more Gen Xers than Millenials, but millenials being in their late 30s ...a good chunk unmarried, a good chunk resigned to renting and/or living in condos the rest of their lives...will look to splurge on something that brings them joy. Why not a Mustang?
@CobraCinci
Жыл бұрын
i like how at 29:40 you can clearly Jack loop the car out but the in-car is totally fine haha. Editing makes us all good drivers.
@savagegeese
Жыл бұрын
I purposely did, only two people caught it.
@CobraCinci
Жыл бұрын
@@savagegeese someone at the apex must've been waving a banana and the gorilla got target fixated
@VacFink
Жыл бұрын
Great job on the in depth video gents. I appreciate the efforts but wish it was on a worthy car. The exterior designers did an excellent job designing the 2door Honda Accord disguise for the coyote V8. Starbucks order kiosk in font of the steering wheel! Awesome. Getting feedback from generations that don’t drive or own cars, chefs kiss….. Instead of making the car what actual buyers want, they SN95 Bruce Jenner-ed another generation of Mustang and send the NA pony car to its executive committee lined grave. At least Millennials and gen z get their own Mustang II! I’ll end it with the cherry on top for me…skinny jeans and bar stools…..mangina camel toe…can’t unsee that. 😅
@THESLlCK
Жыл бұрын
I'm gen z and I hate this crap
@VacFink
Жыл бұрын
@@THESLlCK Exactly. Your not gonna like it, nobody liked the Mustang II. Nobody. But ol' Ford had the pulse of the people in mind when they made it.
@THESLlCK
Жыл бұрын
@@VacFink This will probably go down with the mustang II as one of the worst. Even the foxbody is more memorable
@jackholmes8105
Жыл бұрын
Tell everyone you know to go watch this tang film
@LingLing1337
Жыл бұрын
OK I will 👍
@Tsharetrainer
28 күн бұрын
This car is a master piece that combines the best aspects of all generations of mustangs. This “pura raza” of a mustang will be a collector’s favorite. If you own one treated like a collector’s item but don’t forget to enjoy it.🏆
@MovieMaster0001
Жыл бұрын
All I think of is that Katy Perry song.
@tossmonkey1
Жыл бұрын
I kissed you mom and I liked it?
@svn5994
Жыл бұрын
Are you ready for? are you ready for?
@brianc7474
Жыл бұрын
I didn’t know Mark have a brother 😂
@_IMNNO
Жыл бұрын
It’s Mahk from Boston.
@IamJewz
Жыл бұрын
Imagine playing in the car before driving, we truly are in different times 🫠
@Edge-mv3jw
Жыл бұрын
As a Camaro guy, I’d love to get one of these in a few years, as it’s really grown on me. But these prices are getting insane, especially while there’s supposedly going to be a Shelby coming as a 2026 model. (Yes, I know I should get the Camaro but it’ll be harder to find one speced the way I’d like it)
@zijunx1595
Жыл бұрын
GM is far superior to Ford regarding performance cars. Although not much info has been released about this S650 chassis, I doubt it could be better than GM's Alpha platform.
@joe718gt4
Жыл бұрын
Get a 6th Gen SS 1LE. Loved mine
@arigaberman8319
Жыл бұрын
i think the reason theres so many people arguing in the comments is because the interviewers ask really good questions and know what buyers actually care about
@bikingshaun
Жыл бұрын
They are trying really hard to make this seem like not just a face lift and blacked out badges.
@tomgumbrell3749
Жыл бұрын
I am a member of this 'younger generation'. When will these companies learn. A car, especially a performance car, is not an iPhone.
@JJ-df4kx
Жыл бұрын
I I were in the market for a car like this, I would definitely go for the Camaro LT1. You get the LT1 6.2 which prob makes more torque then this thing and has a bit more grunt down low which is nice for a street car. Also a tremec 6sp and a lighter chassis for sub 40k.
@khoanguyen1176
Жыл бұрын
I wouldnt buy the camaro but this is definitely a smarter decision to make.
@newfie-dean5803
Жыл бұрын
The Camaro is cheesy. What do you drive? “A Camaro”. I’d be embarrassed to say that! The Mustang has always been a cool iconic car.
@JJ-df4kx
Жыл бұрын
@@newfie-dean5803 I think real car enthusiasts can appreciate any platform. I buy it for myself, don’t care what other people think.
@mikuelmellieha7943
Жыл бұрын
Big respect to the geeseman please keep up all the hard work ❤
@TheSkyline5467
Жыл бұрын
They are doing a great job of talking. The only thing I care about is whether it has steering feel and feedback when driving at speed. That's what I'll be looking for watching this video.
@Maximum_777
Жыл бұрын
28:16, I love you guys for pairing engine audio with the music, you get it in tune, and you make it swell a times with the track that's playing, absolutely love it.
@PotatosPotatoes
Жыл бұрын
This car reminds me of the new Z in so many ways. Mainly how a global company restricted the R&D to the point that they reskinned an old chassis and tweaked an existing engine, then gave it obnoxious screens and digital gimmicks. I'm sure the dealerships will complete the trifecta and charge $30k on top of MSRP to make sure that "cars don't sell as good as SUVs."
@JollyGiant19
Жыл бұрын
They don’t have to “make sure” of that. It’s just a fact that general car buyers want an SUV appliance and not a drivers’ car with connection For those who want to do more, they buy a track for full size SUV. That’s reality
@michaelgrayson409
Жыл бұрын
Closer to a warmed-over S550 than a new generation. Even the door cards are the same.
@danielrivers4850
Жыл бұрын
I have been hoping that you all will do a video on my dream car... FINALLY!!
@sachafievet3131
Жыл бұрын
Assembling 30 millenials and gen-z's sounds scary, either in a good or a bad way
@07wrxtr1
Жыл бұрын
I would have asked them how inflation is created - be sure to have a comfortable chair!
@fredwilliams7893
Жыл бұрын
Over half of them probably wanted it be a E V mustang. SMH!
@MumrikDK
Жыл бұрын
Adults younger than 44 are scary?
@InnovatinatorType
Жыл бұрын
@@07wrxtr1ok boomer
@srhatfield
11 ай бұрын
Essentially: "We wanted to make the car so much better than the 6th generation car, but that would have cost $$$ so we didn't"
@gravel_trap
Жыл бұрын
I would have loved to have seen the whole design decision process.
@mmr0221
Жыл бұрын
Design by diversity quotas
@THESLlCK
Жыл бұрын
"how much black plastic can we put on this car? Can we put lithium batteries in it???"
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