2 years later from this video you just saved me $200 and gunsmithing fees. thanks!
@PracticalAccuracy
Жыл бұрын
You are welcome
@jthebk3864
Жыл бұрын
If you do change your mind then buy the tools to do it at home, super affordable and better then paying a gunsmith because you can do it again for cheaper on your next build 👍
@ThePeaceMaker09
2 жыл бұрын
I really appreciate that you actually cite legitimate references for your information and demonstrate it practically. Can't wait to see more videos! SUBBED
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you. hope it was helpful and more videos to come shortly.
@chouyi007
Ай бұрын
I tested this once to help me decide whether to go back to standard handguards (lighter weight, easy to replace if broken, better access to barrel for service and cleaning, etc.) from free float, and I took my pencil-barreled ArmaLite AR-10 to accentuate the affect of a sling, due to its long and narrow barrel with thin barrel walls. With a traditional A2 handguard and the sling attached via the standard front swivel on the bottom of the A2 FSB, I fired groups without using the sling, and groups where I cranked the sling down as hard as I could. I am a large man and work out a lot, so this was far more force than anyone would put on a sling to steady a rifle in any practical situation. What I found was that with optics (MRO or ACOG), I could barely shift the group at all with sling pressure, but with iron sights, I would move it a noticeable amount--about 2-4 MOA--to the left, which was the direction I was pulling. What this gold me is that I was able to move the A2 front sight tower a tiny bit with sling pressure, but the deflection and harmonics of the barrel were essentially unaffected. As such, I am now completely using standard A2 handguards on my modern ARs, A1 triangle handguards on my retro clones, and the BCM Gunfighter handguard on my wife's ultralight midlength (she's fancy), and I still cut the same excellent groups as before.
@PracticalAccuracy
Ай бұрын
@@chouyi007 thanks for the insight
@HKHolyDiver
3 жыл бұрын
Great video and well explained. In case I missed it, harmonics also translate to the position of the crown as the bullet exits the barrel. I have often explained barrel harmonics as analogous to a WW2 battleship firing its guns. The harmonics in this case are the ocean waves and firing as close to TDC or at a point of minimal movement gave that mighty ship its best repeatable accuracy. I believe this to have relevancy as a bullet exits the crown coupled with repeatable barrel harmonics. Got a sub from this fella.
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks. Glad you liked the video.
@abstractapproach634
Жыл бұрын
Or minimum, through, or BDC, his picture was a bit misleading as he put the end at a node (center) and not an extrema/anti-node (TDC or BDC in your terms) which seems logical until you think about it dynamically.
@abstractapproach634
Жыл бұрын
However, to get this precision I think you would have to build the gun around a specific, very uniform round. I guess his point about just getting as consistent as possible and learning how to compensate. What do you think?
@ghostmourn_alt
2 жыл бұрын
wow that was instructive about the free floating & gas block. I never thought of that.
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching and the comment.
@kalliste23
Жыл бұрын
If you're gong to use a shooting sling you need a free-float handguard. Also, they're not really any more expensive even at the low end so why not.
@NoGoBu
3 жыл бұрын
Great video, a no bs assessment 👏 I guess there is the proof, no need for $300 Daniel Defense muzzle break or safe sticky to shoot accurately. 👏
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching.
@johnsmithfakename8422
3 жыл бұрын
When it comes to free-float handguards on an AR-15. My rule of thumb is "If you are regularly shooting past 250 yards for accuracy, then free floating your handguard might prove beneficial." Lets see how that rule of mine holds up.
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
In this video, kzitem.info/news/bejne/04eNmHl4g5p5hmU I shoot the same gun out to 567 yards no problem. In my experience, the distance has not mattered. I have also shot non free floats out to 800 yards, just not on video. Hope to get this on video later this spring or summer. Your shooting experience may differ, but distance has not been an issue for me. I do agree with you about being beneficial to take all possibility of barrel deflection out of the equation. thanks for the comment.
@alphawolfgang173
Жыл бұрын
this is good information. im new to the AR platform and ive never really heard about this until recently, now i kinda want to get a free float handguard for my ar. but idk, i like the feel of my a2 handguard and i doubt ill ever need such precision accuracy where the difference will really make a difference. subscribed!
@PracticalAccuracy
Жыл бұрын
It won't make a difference accuracy wise. thanks for watching
@yjoeyyy
3 жыл бұрын
Great video... keep the info floating.. I mean flowing. Smirk
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks, will do!
@sway671
2 жыл бұрын
Great video for a potential purchaser of an ar, was looking into an ar now I know free float won’t effect the one I have my sights on, and could potentially be better.
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
You won't know for sure until you buy it, but if it doesn't shoot well, free float rail is extremely likely not the issue. I've never had it be the issue on multiple AR15"s. If you have accuracy issues it's most likely the barrel itself.
@charlesludwig9173
Ай бұрын
If you shoot in US Service Rifle Competition you must attach sling to a free float tube or free float rail on the gun to preclude the need for sling to be attached to barrel which produces inconsistent barrel tension causing vertical grouping at mid range. This means scores too low to win at Master level thus the free float tube is a must for wins. This is my experience as a CMP-USAMU Military Rifle Instructor assisting the USAMU deliver SAFS Training, US Distinguished Rifleman, and American High Power Rifleman in Long-Range Award Winner.
@PracticalAccuracy
Ай бұрын
I agree that there is too much sling tension in Service rifle competition and that will affect grouping
@sithembisokhumalo9957
2 жыл бұрын
This channel is gold.
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you. More videos to come.
@mastodon24
3 жыл бұрын
This video-however thorough in its delivery-missed a key consideration for the free-float hand guard debate; point of impact shift from different firing positions. Yes, all of your groups from separate strings of fire were repeatable. However, if you take a bench rest/bipod zero and then shoot off hand-in various ways (support hand at gas block, at mid point, at barrel nut, under magazine, with/without sling tension, cold bore vs sustained, etc.)-your POI will vary from position to position. The case for a free floated hand guard is to remove variables from the system. While it does not entirely isolate the barrel’s resonance, it mitigates hand, sling, and bipod position, thereby making all shooting positions deliver a consistent force vector on the barrel.
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
Thank you for your comment. I agree that POI can occur from positional changes, but this can occur with and without a free float barrel. This is why Brian Litz of applied ballistics recommends in his book Accuracy Precision For Long Range Shooting (p. 85-86) to zero your rifle from the position it will be employed in the field. When this statement is made, he is talking about precision free float rifles. Also, recoil management from positional changes can effect POI and this applies to free float or non free float. I also agree that free float removes a variable, but only if sufficient force is applied as I discussed in the video. I also agree that full automatic or heavy sustained fire can allow for easier barrel deflection, but I did not go through an extensive analysis on this point. I think the bottom line is that free float itself cannot guarantee consistent POI, but may give a more consistent barrel harmonics from shot to shot. However, I have not observed this in my ar15 shooting.
@VincitOmniaVeritas7
Жыл бұрын
An informative and cordial debate about guns? Only in a video about rifle precision…😅 Meanwhile, go look the comment section of a .40 vs 9mm video…
@NortheastSurvival911
2 жыл бұрын
I think it's all in the shooter I do believe that you know either variant will or will not work better for you or me or the next guy it's unique to the user. Personally I think no matter what you're using if you use it enough and you practice enough.. you're going to get good if it's long range shots that you're looking for. Thank you though for a very informative video I do appreciate it.
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching.
@NortheastSurvival911
2 жыл бұрын
@@PracticalAccuracy you are quite welcome. After I get good with the stock setup of this particular AR-15 I might just buy an upper with a free floating barrel and see if I can't figure out if it actually increases my own accuracy. At any rate.. keep up the good work. Stay safe God bless.
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
If you do some testing, let me know the results that you get.
@NortheastSurvival911
2 жыл бұрын
@@PracticalAccuracy oh I definitely will at some point this summer. I might record any and all progress with the different barrel setups and upload it I don't know we'll see. But I'll definitely let you know without a doubt. And I don't doubt that you know maybe it does help some people. I do think it's probably situational though I mean if you put a firearm in your hands and you want to get good with it and become a perfectionist you will find a way to do it. I have a bunch of 1911s and as we know your standard 1911 A1 they're not exactly built for accuracy. But with practice you know it's easy to hit an 8-inch Target at 50 ft. Anyway stay safe God bless.
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
I agree. God Bless
@newdefsys
2 жыл бұрын
The Army is switching to a free float handguard with the M4A1 Block-II upgrade, and the newer URG-I version, along with swapping the old gov't profile barrel with the heavier profile 'SOCOM' barrel. But the Army is not chasing accuracy. They found the additional weight of the RAS quad rail, weapon light, ATPIAL module, etc. caused the barrel of the M4 Block-I to sag under heavy combat fire, which induced reliability problems. So the Army is beefing up the front end of their M4's for the sake of durability, not accuracy. However, the new M4A1 Block-II (and the URG-I) are inherently more accurate because of these changes.
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching. I would agree that the heavy volume of fire and extra weight causes problems. Personally, I like the light weight plastic hand guards.
@newdefsys
2 жыл бұрын
@@PracticalAccuracy I prefer the lighter weight too. I use a Magpul MOE SL
@anthonymartin6831
2 жыл бұрын
The army is looking to replace the m4 with a new rifle firing a 6.8 short magnum cartridge.
@newdefsys
2 жыл бұрын
@@anthonymartin6831 They're not looking too hard at it though since they kicked the whole program down the road to the end of the year. Another 9 months is a lifetime for a weapons program to sit in limbo.
@anthonymartin6831
2 жыл бұрын
@@newdefsys They can proof test them in Ukraine
@Larry-ds6ib
2 жыл бұрын
Free float, tactical and tacticool Drop-in, cheap and practical and sometimes practicool too if you actually put in a carry handle that makes it Namcool!
@jerrypreen2665
Жыл бұрын
If you used a laser bore sight could you see the laser POI move on the target while applying pressure with a sling or bipod?
@toddr5732
5 ай бұрын
Great groups with that standard handgaurd. Do you have any other upgrades like a better trigger on that ?
@PracticalAccuracy
5 ай бұрын
on this rifle, it's the standard Rock river trigger. Its about 4.5 lb break.
@DecentRecruit
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you. I was really about to drop loads of money for a free float. Currently getting 2-3 MOA using IMI 55 Gr. I guess I'll instead spend that money on Match ammo.
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching. Every gun is different. Try some different loads. It could also be your barrel. I have a free float rifle that won't shoot better than 2 moa and I've tried 55-77 grain loads. I think it's the barrel.
@bobbyc2768
3 жыл бұрын
With a 20" HBAR with old a2 handguards you don't notice much of a difference even with different positions and applying different forces from resting on the handguards and stuff like that, the heavy barrel resists those forces and is much more consistent. With a pencil barrel I'm sure I'd notice much more of a difference when resting on the handguard or applying a force with a sling or something
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
I agree. I've never seen a difference.
@michaelsullivan988
Жыл бұрын
I have heavy barreled and light barrels free floated and two piece non free floated. You are correct. Putting a lot of tension on a sling attached to a pencil barrel can make a difference.
@sunxishan
3 жыл бұрын
Good info. you deserve more subscribers.
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
Thank you. i hope it helped you. I will have more educational content out soon.
@Matt_justlikethat
3 ай бұрын
All M4’s have a secure, via delta ring (rear) an locating ring behind the front sight….. Thanks Also…. Mine is Very accurate.
@kennybriceno2002
2 жыл бұрын
What distance do you do your shooting at? I don't think accuracy will start to matter too much until youre shooting at 300 yards and further. and Im sure u can calculate what a 50 yard grouping would be at 300 yards
@PracticalAccuracy
2 жыл бұрын
I've shot my non free float Ar-15's out to 800 yards no problem with no accuracy issues. i should probably do a video on this. thanks for watching
@yjoeyyy
3 жыл бұрын
Hey long time subscriber here. I was wondering if you are planning to make a video on zeroing an AR15 with iron sights? What is the easiest way to do it ? Do I adjust the front post for elevation or rear sight? Thanks in Advance.
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks, I'll work on it long term subscriber. lol
@billmelater6470
3 жыл бұрын
It honestly depends on your sights. A2 sights will be zeroed differently than say, Magpul backup sights since they are completely different designs.
@oldschoolpreacher5785
3 жыл бұрын
Great video, very informative and helpful God bless
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for watching. Glad it was helpful. God Bless.
@TheLoneRanger745
Жыл бұрын
Great lesson, thanks Bud
@PracticalAccuracy
Жыл бұрын
Welcome
@marlo916
3 ай бұрын
What distance were those 1 inch groups shot at?
@travisbill5483
Ай бұрын
100 yards
@exquisitearangement
Жыл бұрын
I suspect based on my nonscientific experience, that free floating barrels are more likely to have poi deviation based on changes in projectile design,weight and velocity.
@rj8709
3 жыл бұрын
Good info.
@PracticalAccuracy
3 жыл бұрын
Glad it was helpful!
@The_Great_White
2 ай бұрын
Just had an argument with a guy about this, there is no such thing as a free floating barrel ar 15 lol, might as well get the durable fixed irons.
@charlesludwig9173
Ай бұрын
Shoot with sling support at mid range and you will understand the absolute need for either a free float tube or a free float rail to which the sling is attached which eliminates the tension otherwise present when sling is attached to the barrel.
@zijie-he
Жыл бұрын
Anyone has the same feeling that the float barrier looks awful?
@hatmatrix4376
Жыл бұрын
rifle?
@johnviera3884
3 жыл бұрын
No one is bending a barrel with a sling. Ok maybe Thor
@Gchang54
6 ай бұрын
Exactly, even with a m203 mounted it dosent make a difference
@johnviera3884
3 жыл бұрын
Imagine drilling holes all over your hand guard and placing screws and testing accuracy. Who would come back and say “makes zero difference” lol. Of course they found a difference. But it could be so many variables. Seems all this free float crap is just marketing
@nbonner75
2 жыл бұрын
If you’re getting what you consider to be acceptable accuracy from your rifle, fantastic! However, if you’re looking for accuracy improvements from an AR pattern rifle, the formula has always included removing as many artificial harmonic nodes from the barrel as possible. I definitely agree with you that there are lots of trendy (but useless) gimmicks and gizmos marketed to those with more money than sense. But, for those pursuing ultimate accuracy from their AR’s, the free floating hand guard isn’t one of them. I’ve personally seen improvements of about 0.5 MOA in accuracy on multiple rifles simply by removing the original hand guard and fixed front sight block in favor of a smaller (lighter) gas block and free floating hand guard - same barrel, same trigger, same muzzle device, etc. Keep in mind that “mil spec” AR’s are built to shoot under 3 MOA with most averaging around 1.5 to 2 MOA from the factory using reasonable quality ammunition. Shrinking groups by 0.5 MOA is a 25-33% increase in accuracy for these guns - that’s not insignificant. Getting that level of improvement for less then $200 is smart money.
@johnviera3884
2 жыл бұрын
@@nbonner75 what sight did you replace the fixed gas block sight with?
@nbonner75
2 жыл бұрын
@@johnviera3884 both the “before” and “after” shots on all rifles were taken with either a red dot or magnified optic with the same optic/rifle combination used to insure consistency. If the owner wanted to add BUIS after the hand guard swap, it was usually a flip-up like the MBUS or a rail mounted fixed sight like the DD or MI sights. However, this variable had no impact on the test results other than the elimination of artificial harmonic nodes and reduction of point mass on the barrel.
@johnviera3884
2 жыл бұрын
@@nbonner75 I’m skeptical of this harmonic thing. But I’m also ignorant. So hypothetically, a free barrel floating solely suspended from the barrel nut, is the most accurate design? More accurate than the same barrel completely encased in concrete block?
@nbonner75
2 жыл бұрын
@@johnviera3884 accuracy is primarily about consistency - each part of the rifle should behave the same way shot over shot. Setting the barrel in concrete would certainly ensure some degree of that “consistency” but might also reduce portability of the rifle due to the added weight. In the bolt-action rifle world free floating the barrel is USUALLY the answer but some rifles actually shoot better with the barrel completely bedded to the barrel channel of the stock. When it comes to barrel harmonics it may be easier to envision the vibration of a plucked guitar string - it gives its clearest tone when it’s allowed to oscillate freely. If something is placed in the path of the string’s movement, the tone is altered (usually in an unfavorable way). In the case of a rifle barrel with an artificial impingement there can be an unfavorable impact on the consistency of the internal ballistics (action of the bullet before it leaves the barrel). Hope this helps.
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