A wise friend told me that when I was not eating meat (I was vegetarian for most of my life) that I was denying myself life. Life eats life in service of more life.
@PauperPeccator
2 жыл бұрын
Ain’t that just Charitable? 😃 (Caritas/Άγάπη)
@lucbriedecooper
2 жыл бұрын
Plant life is still life. We can't survive on minerals alone!
@matthewkirkley6171
2 жыл бұрын
You've never heard of Jordan Peterson?
@Wackaz
Жыл бұрын
bruh there's no way
@thenarrowdoor7
Жыл бұрын
Thats why jesus said to eat his body and drink his blood so we become one with christ
@antonia6059
2 жыл бұрын
The science around fasting that has been recently discovered is fascinating. Look up Autophagy Which means self eating. When a person fasts dead cells and excess fat get eaten up. Then new cells are made. It’s extremely beneficial to one’s good health.
@Yukon33
2 жыл бұрын
be careful - there is "fasting" as in "not having any calories" and "fasting" as in "avoiding certain types of foods / eating smaller quantities" (but not necessarily eating less often!). Autophagy is only triggered in the former case, and religious fasts are mostly about the latter.
@piretkivi3218
2 жыл бұрын
@@Yukon33 Most religions have days without food and water in their calendar. Many Christians eat and drink nothing on Good Friday, I believe. It is easy because it would be much tougher to hang on a cross. Naked and between two annoying criminals. ;) Ordinary Christian fasting (in Orthodox Christianity they go mostly vegan, I believe, and drink no alcohol and consume no olive oil) also means not eating anything before the liturgy. That's intermittent fasting par excellence.
@FrJohnBrownSJ
2 жыл бұрын
Search for St. Ignatius Loyola's Rules for Eating. Excellent practical guide to accompany the symbolic understanding.
@SimpleAmadeus
11 ай бұрын
Very insightful. Thank you.
@theeratchat.1948
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you very much brother Jonathan Pageau for your works.
@ruslpit2615
Жыл бұрын
You’re so freaking good at this!
@kami7134
2 жыл бұрын
You are what you eat :)
@rustyshackelford3590
2 жыл бұрын
I’m a cheeseburger?
@kami7134
2 жыл бұрын
@@rustyshackelford3590 you and I both my friend.
@roshan6423
2 жыл бұрын
Moooooooooo
@rc3088
2 жыл бұрын
@@rustyshackelford3590 hahahaha 😆
@brittanysparkman5386
2 жыл бұрын
Definitely would read “cleanse to heal” by Anthony Williams. I see fasting as more of a cleanse - of toxins, troublemakers, old adrenaline, etc. Toxic adrenaline from feelings like fear, hopelessness, anger feed pathogens in the body. There are also foods we eat often that also feed pathogens in the body and different levels of troublemaker foods you could chose to eliminate (for example vinegar doesn’t feed pathogens but it is on level 4 of foods to eliminate because it dehydrated the body on a deep, deep organ level and it preserves poisons, trapping them in the organs. Toxins dehydrate us, as they require an abundance of water to dilute them and eventually flush them out of our cells so they can safely leave the body without hurting us.) Level 1: eggs, dairy, gluten, soft drinks, be mindful of salt consumption. Level 2: all of the above + pork, tuna, corn. Level 3: all of the above + industrial food oils, soy, lamb, fish and seafood (other than salmon, trout, and sardines). Level 4: all of the above + vinegar, fermented foods, caffeine. Level 5: all of the above + grains, all oils (including healthier ones like olive oil). Bonus for fasting cleansing: cut out salt and seasoning (pure spices are okay), avoid radical fats entirely for a period. And also limit or remove: alcohol, natural/artificial flavors, nutritional yeast, citric acid, aspartame, other artificial sweeteners, MSG, formaldehyde, preservatives. There is also a great chapter on Intermittent fasting and what it actually does to the body. If you have any neurological symptoms, fasting can be devastating to your health.
@user-zs3vd5np2s
2 жыл бұрын
It may be the best explanation of fasting I’ve ever heard.
@lucastark1784
2 жыл бұрын
I refuse to eat animals, none of them deserve all of the pain and suffering we cause them. It ruins my day every time I remember that the only thing I can do to help them is to abstain from consuming most animal products.
@AJWRAJWR
2 жыл бұрын
I've decided to go buy myself a nice big juicy steak today, just to spite you.
@heatherwhitehead3743
2 жыл бұрын
Jonathan! I have a great idea. Why don't you elaborate on the different methods of receiving communion? Speaking of eating symbolically. I don't know how orthodox receive. I do kneeling on the tongue. ?
@lounaannajung4454
2 жыл бұрын
As a carnivore who is seriously considering Orthodoxy I'm having a great battle. I know that for me, carbs are the passion and the food that makes me "fall" most. Yet I can't convince myself to just "rule out" these guidelines as "not for me". I wonder if there are any Orthodox Christians who are also carnivore out here?
@rodrigorecaredo9632
2 жыл бұрын
Good! That means that abstinence from meat will be that much more special for you. Your suffering will be greater as you struggle through it. Better that than a vegan who becomes Orthodox, it won’t have any impact on them. Do remember though that you need to fill the void of your sacrifice with prayer.
@olgakarpushina492
2 жыл бұрын
@@rodrigorecaredo9632 that is true. I had more fun gorging during the Lent period when I was a vegeterian. It was not fasting but feasting for me because during our agape Sunday lunches I got to taste the food that I'd normally eat but in a variety of cuisines ( our OCA parish is very multiethnic). And when you're mostly vegan, there's no true sacrifice in fasting.
@CHURCHISAWESUM
2 жыл бұрын
Look up Primal Edge Health. He's a carnivore nutritionist who is piously Orthodox Christian. He may be able to guide you during Lent.
@burtnoyes6014
2 жыл бұрын
If you are not Orthodox yet, don't worry about the fast during Lent. Concentrate on prayer instead.
@autisticheadscarf
2 жыл бұрын
I can’t adhere to traditional Orthodox fasting due to severe health issues. My diet is primarily animal-based and will probably become exclusively carnivore. There are many Orthodox who cannot participate in Lenten style fasting for a multitude of reasons, and that’s why the Church has ‘economia’. My priest has me participate in fasting by limiting the quantities of the foods I CAN eat and eating them plainly. So if you’re carnivore because you HAVE to eat that way, you can still eat that way and fast. Just don’t come up with your own means of fasting. This is something you must speak to your priest about and have him bless!
@jofo1274
2 жыл бұрын
This one was hard to digest 😉
@krisphiles
2 жыл бұрын
Why is moving out, away from the center, toward the animal, where God wants us to go? How does this represent the kingdom, or does it? Makes me think that the going doesn't mean good or bad, or more toward God's will, but just that that is how it has to be because of the fall? That where God is telling us we are going isn't working toward the 'good'.
@machinotaur
2 жыл бұрын
I began attending my local Antiochian Orthodox church the first Sunday of this year. I've loved it, met some great people, dove in headfirst into the entire practice; but the prospect of Great Lent fills me with some trepidation. I don't do well with many plant foods, including what would be considered "staples" of a plant based diet: grains, pulses, legumes, etc. I fear I'll either be a bloated, miserable mess, spending much of my days on the toilet; or I'll turn to legalism, eating an inordinate amount of shellfish and coconut milk and such; or else I will simply starve to an unhealthy degree. I will do my best to follow the rules, but the physical realities are daunting. I will continue praying, and I will use the most of my God-given ingenuity to find something within the spirit and letter of the fast.
@olgakarpushina492
2 жыл бұрын
One priest used to say during Lent, "Eat whatever you want, just don't eat your neighbor".
@MRresoMC
2 жыл бұрын
Consult it with your priest and see how economia plays in.
@autisticheadscarf
2 жыл бұрын
I can’t adhere to traditional Orthodox fasting due to severe health issues - including many of the reasons you stated. I have to eat a primarily animal-based diet and will probably become exclusively carnivore. There are sooooo many Orthodox who cannot participate in Lenten style fasting for a multitude of reasons, and that’s why the Church has ‘economia’. My priest has me participate in fasting by limiting the quantities of the foods I CAN eat and eating them plainly. Don’t let this deter you from becoming Orthodox! Just talk to your priest…I was so worried I’d have to suffer so much, too, and was so relieved when i worked out an alternative way to fast with him and got his blessing to do so. DO NOT devise your own fast. You need to work this out with him 🙏🏻
@anastunya
2 жыл бұрын
You might have gluten intolerance. So do I. I eat lots of nuts and dry fruits during Great Lent. Try eating rice as grain and no wheat whatsoever.
@brendabergstrom-graf6729
2 жыл бұрын
@@autisticheadscarf I have been Keto for 7 years and am this year carnivore and I am the healthiest I have ever been. I grew up SDA and vegetarian and suffered greatly hormonally as a vegetarian. Concerning Orthodox Church, I have been considering attending an Orthodox Church. The only experience I have had thus far is Jonathan’s videos on KZitem and looking up what a typical service is like. I’ve been a bit nervous about attending because of how I eat and that I don’t know what is acceptable to wear and I don’t know any of the terminology.
@windyday8598
2 жыл бұрын
eating meat is no longer connected with moving out, away from purity. the kingdom of God is not about food and drink, but righteousness, peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. just eat, and give thanks. don't become preoccupied with foods. but. eat the true bread from heaven.
@jonathanlove7078
2 жыл бұрын
this rings as truth in my estimation
@dennysant
2 жыл бұрын
Amen brother
@KizaWittaker
Жыл бұрын
No thanks. I live in a fractal structure
@jonathanlove7078
2 жыл бұрын
I’ve been trying to navigate the idea of eating meat (at the moment I don’t partake)
@beautifullybroken2926
2 жыл бұрын
I have healed mentally by introducing meat into my diet. Red meat to be specific. Last year before I made the switch I was eating mainly vegetables, some fruit and small amounts of very lean protein (white fish or chicken breast). I was very thin but very weak, would get tired easily, hair was thin and my skin was very dry. The worst part of it was my mental health issues with anxiety, etc. Introducing the meat into my diet has made a world of difference.
@jonathanlove7078
2 жыл бұрын
that’s beautiful! I relate to the mental health deeply. I just happen to find such difficulty navigating the idea of eating flesh. For context, I originally come from a Bhakti tradition. in Bhakti the eating of flesh is prohibited. so there’s some inherent spiritual fear. but coming to know orthodoxy I’ve unpacked new workings, and they make sense very much so. I really only wish to do as god commands, I am just unclear of that certain word at the moment. I know many who have done well with meat (such as your case). it’s a tricky confusion comprised of clashing philosophy. That’s why im looking deeper into it. I appreciate your response, truly. It is lovely to hear and beneficial in my search. (More context if it means anything: at the moment I eat only fruit, dairy, herbs and honey with some wild rices)
@beautifullybroken2926
2 жыл бұрын
@@jonathanlove7078 that has to be a difficult undoing, coming out of a tradition where eating “flesh” is prohibited. Hopefully the associated fears / guilt will subside. I’ve been Christian for 10 years (not Orthodox but I do enjoy Pageau, which is why I am here) and my reluctance to eating red meat has been superficial at best and downright stupid at worst.. I know that meat is very calorie dense and out of senseless vanity I avoided it. When I made the switch I went almost full blown carnivore with mainly red meats and very little veggie/fruit and my mental health healed but physically I put on a good 25 pounds 😳. Despite the extra weight I am mentally very clear, full of energy and can run a few miles without skipping a beat! I incorporate a lot of fasting (24-36 hour chunks) with feasting on meats. Meat (red meat in particular) is one of the most nutrient dense foods on the planet. In relating this to my spiritual life, I do believe God’s wisdom is supreme and He created animals to be a food source for us that provide many vital nutrients for our existence. What I really connected with in this video is Jonathan’s comment about Adam and Eve attempting to cover themselves with “plants” when they were ashamed of their sin and that being insufficient to do the job, the LORD moved toward them with the animal skins. That is a very powerful connection ( for me, not that I need the convincing) in my mind on the importance of incorporating meat as a food we consume. Keep us posted on your progress, would love to hear how it goes!
@olgakarpushina492
2 жыл бұрын
@@jonathanlove7078 my former Orthodox now Krishna following friend convinced me to give up meat. Which I did, followed by abstinence from anything "killed": poultry, fish, eggs. 1.5 years ago I started eating mammal meats again because I realized it was my attachment to false purity and pride. Jonathan helped me see it. "Slaughter and eat, Peter. What I made pure cannot be impure".
@jonathanlove7078
2 жыл бұрын
@olga karpushina yeah it’s quite tricky. Going as deep as beliefs that meat and such things are “tamasic” meaning the modes of passion and ignorance. And eating tamasic foods (meaning meat) agitates the mind and brings you into your lower nature and passions of the flesh. it’s beliefs I indirectly hold.. well, let’s say they hold me 😂. The Christian perspective, however, is making more sense as I explore it
@heatherwhitehead3743
2 жыл бұрын
When I was young I tried to explain to my mom that our words in the conversation we we having turned into animals. I saw hers as a swan and mine a feline. And that these turned into shapes that then turned into shear pure color. That the narrative is just the surface beginning or the deliverance of truth. Yeah...i tried to explain that.
@DFMoray
2 жыл бұрын
Look at videos from factory farms.
@AJWRAJWR
2 жыл бұрын
Yes, it's reassuring to know that my meat is made as cost-effective and efficiently as possible. 👍 Time to sizzle some bacon.
@@AJWRAJWR As a dog returns to his own vomit, So a fool repeats his folly.
@AJWRAJWR
2 жыл бұрын
@@DFMoray yes, dogs = vegetarians, vomit = vegetables. Great analogies, not bad thinking for a low brain powered vegetarian.
@CVsnaredevil
Жыл бұрын
Brilliant
@tietomallintajat
2 жыл бұрын
I like the content, but I'm wondering about the last point. You said in a joking or a derogative manner that some people think that they can just eat anything, but I think it comes from Christ Himself in Mark 7:18-20, where He suggests that no food can defile your body. In my sphere of influence there are people who try to take Christians back under mosaic eating prohibitions, so I immediately get an emotional response and want to point out that we indeed can eat anything and we are not under the mosaic law. But I know you probably talked more about the spiritual discipline of fasting and being able to not eat everything all the time, and having a healthy view of food as a source of nutrition, instead of consuming it sinfully, etc.. Just pointing out that some people might - out of emotional first response - suggest that they can eat anything if they want, and they may want to distance themselves from legalism when saying something like that.
@russellhoward3866
2 жыл бұрын
I'm pretty legalistic about not eating fast food!
@tietomallintajat
2 жыл бұрын
@@russellhoward3866 That's a good one..
@Chamindo7
2 жыл бұрын
"Junk food" is endemic in our world. I LOVED potato chips, french fries, sugar filled cookies. I have given them up completely. However, I would not force that upon others as a requirement to please God or to be a good Christian. But, I do wonder about how easily we over-eat things that are patently destructive to the bodies that have been gifted to us from our Maker, God Almighty. Thank you for your thoughtful post, certainly got me thinking. Ave Maria Deus Vult❤🔥
@tietomallintajat
2 жыл бұрын
@@Chamindo7 I agree, many things can become sinful, even if they are not inherently bad or sinful in and of themselves.
@russellhoward3866
2 жыл бұрын
@@Chamindo7 Artificial fake pseudo-food's been "gifted" to us by somebody, but it's surely not God. GMO, Roundup-Ready, factory farmed, & doused w/ poison... good stuff. The regular rich foods in moderation are fine, but some of the stuff out there nowadays would make our ancestors weep for us. Don't HAVE to eat them though. Unnatural food just isn't natural, lol!
@someotherguy43
2 жыл бұрын
Is fasting for weight loss considered an evil thing?
@EamonBurke
2 жыл бұрын
It is simply a thing. All weight loss is caused by running a caloric deficit(less inputs than outputs). The nature of that action is variable. The question is "How does it serve?" Are you fasting for weight loss because you refuse to exercise and fasting hurts, so you're starving yourself as a way of inflicting pain and finding strength in that pain/control, so you can get body you want? In that case, it is a kind of black magic, aka an eating disorder. Fasting for weight loss so you can regain health and vitality, that you can be strong and vigorous and attain higher potential(and thus higher responsibility), is a noble thing. Fasting in the religious tradition and seeing it as stone-age healthcare or systematizing the Lenten calendar into some dietary health guidelines is vain and simple minded.
@someotherguy43
2 жыл бұрын
@@EamonBurke I really appreciate the response, thank you and God bless.
@dennysant
2 жыл бұрын
@@EamonBurke Good insight
@youlig1
2 жыл бұрын
I would say that fasting is probably not the best thing to do for fat loss. There certain diets which are even better. But intermittent fasting is definetely good - i try to do it myself at the moment. I think that health is a very important thing and probably the health of men and women is aligned with goodness. People who are healthier can be of greater service, they live longer to care for people and need not to be taken care of. Healthier people live, on average, overall better lives (probably) and are more beautiful. All of those things seem to me to be good things. Sport, fasting and nutritious foods are the best medicine also. Many diseases can be mittigated or completely avoided by a healthy body. Also a healthy body means a healthy mind in terms of schizophrenia, sleep disorders etc. So i honestly do not see a reason for fasting and fitness to be evil. Maybe if you go full Bodybuilder animalistic, that might have some ungood consequences
@EtherealMaryJane
2 жыл бұрын
Hum , I love meat. ❤️
@sdrc92126
2 жыл бұрын
"One may regret living at a period when it's impossible to form an idea of the shape the world of the future will assume. But there's one thing I can predict to eaters of meat: the world of the future will be vegetarian." Google it
@KizaWittaker
Жыл бұрын
😂😂😂 Humans have been eating meat for hundreds of thousands of years. I love how vegetarians and vegans want to ignore a hierarchy when it comes to humans and animals, but not animals and animals, animals and plants, humans and plants, etc.
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