"Firearms are fascinating!" Hear, hear, Clint! 100% agree, and a tremendous thank you to you and the everyone over at Classic Firearms. ✊ I've been into guns for about as long as I could remember but only recently starting learning more about different types of rifles, operation systems, attachments, materials, ammunition, the firearms manufacturers themselves (Stag, DD, PWS, etc.), and all that other fun stuff. This channel is helping me so much along the way. Hoping to start my collection sometime soon. Cheers! 🍻
@maxharris9567
3 жыл бұрын
I really found the way you went through the functionality helpful. I understand so much more about ARs now. Thank you for breaking it down like that.
@spysareamyth
3 жыл бұрын
A bit of clarification: A short stroke piston system typically only travels 5-6mm (1/5"-ish), it pushes to bolt by basically giving it a good kick and trusting that the bolt will figure itself out.
@shawnwood3992
3 жыл бұрын
I run a POF-USA Renegade Plus. DI chambered for 5.56, it has 11 setting adjustable gas block. Enablesme to adjust for different ammo especially when switchingfrom .223 to 5.56, match grade etc...it is the smoothest AR I have ever shot. Has the recoil of a pellet gun, or maybe a .22LR ... great presentation!!!
@mr.workhardplayhard6550
2 жыл бұрын
I'm looking at the revolution pistol (12.5) in the .308 but don't know if I should go for the DI or PD....I do hope to have a suppressor sometime this year for whichever I choose...what say you?
@Dmmartin141
Жыл бұрын
What an AWESOMELY well-narrated video! This is a MUST WATCH for anybody who owns or is looking into buying or building an AR style rifle. I’m a bolt-action 6.5 (Anything) & .338 (Lapua, .338-.378 WBY) long distance shooter because I’ve got 4 miles of land to actually put them to use. There’s nothing quite like banging steel at long range! The shot, the seconds of silence and anticipation, then the gong! Lol 😂 I’m just now thinking about getting back building up my semi-auto Arsenal. I love that LWRC Build! I’ve never owned a piston driven AR before. But now I’ve got a feeling I’ll have a few pretty soon! Thank you thank you thank you for this video!
@markej4801
3 жыл бұрын
Nicely discussed. Thanks for clearing up the long vs short stroke pistons! The show and tell made it VERY clear for me. :D
@jasoncortes2701
2 жыл бұрын
I absolutly love your videos. I am very new at being a gun owner and I'm also in gun smithing school. I use your videos all the time to help me study. your videos help me learn soo much about firearms. thank you for everything
@jeff-ph9bc
4 жыл бұрын
That was a lot of good information. Even unsupressed, the DI rifles seem to kick gas back in the face. Thanks!
@kkuenzel56
4 жыл бұрын
That was a very informative video! Thank you! I've always been a little confused about Direct Impingement and I never knew about a piston system. Very cool!
@SHOWYOURBIZNESS
3 жыл бұрын
Bro thank you for being epic with your convo on here. I'm new to guns. Got my first one and I'm learning. I see myself grabbing the best info from your channel. 💪🙏🎬
@wadesimpson1777
3 жыл бұрын
Same .
@logandive8976
3 жыл бұрын
A year late, but still just on time. Great explanation on DI vs Piston. Always love your content.
@tangoindiamike9189
4 жыл бұрын
DI for me. More than 50 years ago, my father taught me to clean my guns the same day I shoot them. He told me, "If you don't have time to clean them, you don't have time to shoot them." So when I plan to shoot, I plan time to clean. If you have ever seen dirty old pitted guns, It's because they were not maintained and oiled.
@republichq9619
3 жыл бұрын
That's cute... Unless the government goes to crap or an invasion happens.... Then what. Going to ask for time out to clean? Or will you ask to borrow my piston ar15 or my ak74? That's what i thought
@ssjronin3972
2 жыл бұрын
@@republichq9619 you didn't prove anything lol. You act like you will be under fire every single minute.
@ryantobler8552
Жыл бұрын
@@republichq9619 by that logic you'll be conserving ammo at the point. You won't even go through enough ammo for it to make a difference. And most people have there cleaning kits with there gun packed together. You just going to leave that behind for fun lol.
@grahambrown1980
3 ай бұрын
Was your dad also the type to exclaim that he used to walk five miles to school each day in the blinding snow, uphill, both ways, in his father’s pajamas? Son, when I was your age… 🙄😬Here we go again moments. 😄😁😆 Dad, do I have to?
@mav2757
3 жыл бұрын
Thank you for the best explanation of DI and gas pistons I’ve heard yet.👍 I have an LWRCI M6A2 and I love it. It does run clean but I don’t feel that much recoil. Very happy with it. Agree with your cleaning recommendation 😊. Party on!
@alien_x8062
2 жыл бұрын
I thought you said m16a2
@quilope
4 жыл бұрын
"Jeffrey Lube" LOLOL XD Clint, you crack me up, dude. What a legend.
@WickedCrispy
4 жыл бұрын
Drink every time he says "pretty cool stuff."
@kevb5802
4 жыл бұрын
And little bit
@42N8_1
4 жыл бұрын
Crutch words
@silver4drrx828
4 жыл бұрын
Unfortunately I have no beer left now
@mc3ruiz
4 жыл бұрын
....and "this guy".... you'll kill your liver!! 😂🤦♂️
@settlesmachiningtools8671
4 жыл бұрын
Game on so gonna be drunk after 10 mins
@galenbutler8619
Жыл бұрын
Appreciate your content.... I was unaware of the different systems implemented in these weapons. Thanks to you, I will do some research.
@ebhsports6251
4 жыл бұрын
I prefer piston for volume shooting, range trips. But DI for precision , long range, hunting. Less volume .
@TTiger86268
4 жыл бұрын
thanks for the explanation, Im old school, bolt, lever etc... While I like my AR's, never got into building any yet... but appreciate the info on differences.
@johnnywadd9918
4 жыл бұрын
I like cleaning my guns it gives me reason to spend more time in my cave.
@fcon8840
4 жыл бұрын
😉
@theflyingwelshman5338
3 жыл бұрын
I prefer guns you don’t have to clean. Those solvents are nasty.
@NopeVS
Жыл бұрын
Miserable life… go see your kids grow.
@gageirwin7206
Жыл бұрын
@@theflyingwelshman5338shooters lube
@navajorezathlete1202
2 ай бұрын
Ammonia @@theflyingwelshman5338
@richardlong5404
4 жыл бұрын
I enjoy shooting both long and short. I am also the guy that cleans after each shooting session since I don't shoot as frequently as you, I keep clean for the next opportunity.
@ramseydoner6487
2 жыл бұрын
Clearest explanation I've come across. Thank you
@Hayabusa196
4 жыл бұрын
Great video explaining systems. Love that Twizzler barrel rifle. My preference is gas piston.
@Vdubb
4 жыл бұрын
The vast majority of gas enters through the chamber as the bolt cycles. Very little gas actually enters the upper receiver through the Stoner internal piston, direct impingement, system.
@jeffersonbuckles8905
4 жыл бұрын
People don't understand this. People see spec ops use 416's and think they're better for them as civilians when there are more cons than pros to the piston driven guns.
@Vdubb
4 жыл бұрын
I've also shot both piston and DI guns over the years and carried the M4 during my time in the military. So yes I do know what I'm taking about. I understand why the Marines would switch to a short stroke piston system seeing as there switching their focus from the a Middle East back to the Pacific and possible amphibious landings. Really the only two advantages the piston system has over the DI is that it's better for suppressing as he stated in this video and they're better at handling being submerged.
@christophersalgado4744
Жыл бұрын
I just stumbled on this channel based on posing the question you just thoroughly and eloquently answered. My takeaway is that I would likely favor the Piston over DI.
@Cliver101
3 жыл бұрын
I don’t think you can blanket statement that DI guns have less recoil. Both systems can have adjustable gas blocks and I believe a higher percentage of piston system set ups go ahead and splurge for this feature. Restricting the gas flow back to bolt carrier reduces force on both systems. Then you take into account the mass of your BCG and how it interplays with your buffer weight and spring combination. I use a low mass bcg and adjustable gas block piston system, so it cycles at the minimum gas/mass combination while maintaining reliability. I think these factors plus your muzzle device like a compensator or suppressor affect recoil way more than just DI vs piston system.
@fatrichie
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks, very informative video. I'm going to look into a long stroke piston conversion for my AR.
@stevenray1227
2 жыл бұрын
All about that long stroke! Man I love these videos, great descriptions
@45ruger1
4 жыл бұрын
I have both DI and Short Strokes. I am not a AR Pistol guy mine are rifles with 16'" barrels. My short strokes are all Adams Arms and I prefer shooting them. Living in Komifornia I can not have suppressors. I clean after every shooting day mainly because I like being efficient at taking apart and putting together all my guns plus I usually shoot with my teenage nephews so I want them to know how to clean, take apart and put together guns...
@sarb6p55
4 жыл бұрын
My first AR-15 is a Adam Arms with a gas block which has 3 dials 12 oclock / 9 oclock & 6 oclock I think I clean it out one time after putting 300 rounds throught it and it was hardly dirty trying to pot the rod back in place was fun it too me 20mins but finally got into place , I have to be honest I don't know much about AR's but reading about them stripping it down and putting it back together was fun
@Drillmechanic
2 жыл бұрын
DI is not dirtier but more friction protective system than piston driven one. Modern smokeless powder after burning up leaves only pure carbon as antifriction deposit.
@DeerLodgeBlog
4 жыл бұрын
Neither system is better than the other. Both have their uses, their pros and cons.
@dragoneye6642
4 жыл бұрын
Lol ya ok history says otherwise you think that the AK47 would have the same legendary status that it does with a direct impingement gas system ?? No !!!!!!!! The piston system is KING no if and's or but's about it . There's nothing wrong with direct impingement it works it's reliable enough as long as it's clean to some extent BUT a piston system will work no matter what you can fill it with sand, mud, wet concrete, it doesn't matter.
@KM_1983
3 жыл бұрын
@@dragoneye6642 Funny, because Military arms channel did a test on the MPX which is a short stroke piston and with a literal spoon full of water it would not function.
@rickywoods3101
3 жыл бұрын
@@dragoneye6642 so you don't think it had anything to do with massive tolerances in the old AK47s with only 6 moa of accuracy ?
@rad_lad_2715
3 жыл бұрын
@@dragoneye6642 that's odd because inrangeTV has made 4 different AK variations malfunction with mud...guess long stroke piston isn't as impervious as you think it is
@aidenmcclendon5457
Жыл бұрын
@@rad_lad_2715 I like guns. I'm not necessarily an AR vs AK guy. Both have pros and cons and both were designed for different purposes. The way I see it, buy a gun for every scenario.🤷😂 More guns more better.
@n1c98
3 жыл бұрын
Excellent channel! I'm subscribed for sure, thanks for the material, good work
@edjecollins4141
4 жыл бұрын
I love my nerdy dirty ARs, but I appreciate the simplicity of simple blowback rifles such as a STEN or my Keltec Sub2000.
@patc2515
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks, I like all your videos but this was especially helpful and practical info for me. Appreciate it!
@zoran9a3hpdiy
3 жыл бұрын
Actually if see in details, AK have short stroke. Only gas block is active cilinder. After you have holes to release gas pressure suddenly and what look like cilinder is just guide for piston and prevent hot has to fry face. Ok piston is direct connected to bolt carier but after less inch piston not push anymore bolt carrier at all. By definition it is short stroke piston system.
@kylehill4437
Жыл бұрын
I have no idea but Im going suppressed now Im leaning towards piston. Thanks for the video
@Computerfly
3 жыл бұрын
Love all of your videos, but disappointed we didn't get to see the whole short piston system. If it was difficult to show, does that mean it is difficult to clean?
@sglee4708
10 ай бұрын
Great job now go have a cold one
@MrTacklebury
4 жыл бұрын
I don't work with a suppressor on my .450 Bushmaster and DI is fine for me. I think there are way too many "gourmet" AR's these days. As an ex-army infantryman, my 20" barreled A1 was awesome. I hate short barrels and thus short sight radii. My next upper is the 6.5 Grendel and it's coming with a 24" barrel. ;)
@natetete1379
9 ай бұрын
DI: gas travels the whole way Long stroke: piston goes back the whole way Short stroke: only the bolt goes the whole way.
@robertplummer133
4 жыл бұрын
My DI has never gotten to dirty to work, even after over 1000 rounds. But the only gas piston AR I've shot the forearm got to hot to hold after only after 150 rounds.
@bmxdude1337
4 жыл бұрын
My T-91 is short stroke which is great for maintenance and cleaning
@stratoplayer1988
4 жыл бұрын
I go with piston driven. If DI is so great, why is it that newer military rifles such as the the HK416, FN SCAR, IWI Tavor, etc use piston-systems?
@jeffersonbuckles8905
4 жыл бұрын
Most of the military uses DI guns. Spec ops have way less people to supply so they can rationalize paying more for a THEORETICALLY more reliable rifle. For civilians though, the DI gun is going to have many more pros. Its lighter, cheaper, less recoil, easier to suppress, cheaper to fix with more widely available parts, and this is nitpicking but it is technically more accurate. The piston driven guns are more similar to the "AR DI" then the "AR DI" is to other DI guns btw. I think most people have no problem out of a DI gun maybe if you're 10,000 rounds without cleaning and going swimming with your gun then a piston system would have an advantage. But Another advantage of the DI gun is that it is quicker to clean than a piston gun.
@alenmoradian6875
4 жыл бұрын
Booooom well said my friend 👏 Thats why my go to rifles are, ace 7.62x39, pof 5.56,scar 17s. Personal opinion
@Vdubb
4 жыл бұрын
The US Rangers and SOCOM dropped the FN SCAR because they found out that they got a heavier weapon with the same reliability as their M4s. And those weapons were developed in the early 2000s when the group think was that pistons were more reliable without looking at empirical evidence. Don't get me wrong, they're all good guns. Just the perceived benefits usually aren't there to justify the extra weight.
@gld1010
4 жыл бұрын
My next American made rifle will be gas piston but my current, an AR, is DI. I have had less problems with my AR than I had with my M-16A2 but of course precise machinery have gotten better since the late 80s.
@wanttowatchamovie
2 жыл бұрын
I love how much you love firearms bro great content keep it up!!!
@davidwalters9462
Ай бұрын
How about when a gun is submerged...what happens when waterlogged? Curious.
@ericsanders8399
Жыл бұрын
I am a piston system operator. Piston system is the best system on an AR15 rifle perform. 😊
@thecheapshot1065
9 ай бұрын
I used to clean my guns all the time. I bought a spray can of CLP last spring, after all I shoot several times a week, the cap and spray straw still have tap on them. I think my new year's resolution will be to clean my guns weekly but Like a fat girl Giving up sweets and hitting the gym daily I'm sure I'll stick To that resolution.
@jimmyjameswu6474
4 жыл бұрын
I am waiting for that exact PWS from my FFL. Can’t wait to shoot it! Great video!
@WardenWolf
4 жыл бұрын
Both systems are just fine, although DI is probably better due to its better accuracy potential due to less moving mass. The extra money for a piston system isn't going to matter unless you're shooting a lot of full auto, in which case accuracy isn't something you particularly care about, anyway.
@jamespatterson3620
2 жыл бұрын
Excellent explanation for us all clint! Thanku for sharing your knowledge! I'm a classic firearms purchaser, you guys rock, I just watched your. How to shoot out of a moving car!! Lmao. You guys made a badass video, brother Lmao we appreciate you all!! At classic firearms!! God bless, james
@blastnick
4 жыл бұрын
Great video and I too appreciate and am fascinated by firearms. So cool, man! Subbed 🍻🇺🇸
@michaeldarden2302
3 жыл бұрын
Great explanation. Keep up the good videos
@krisssilco
4 жыл бұрын
Even though gas piston is more expensive, I think it would be great for a shtf situation. You don't know when you are going to be able to clean your gun. I think the extra $500 is worth it especially if you are going to be using a suppressor
@TylerO_O.
4 жыл бұрын
Long stroke is my middle name
@thecheapshot1065
9 ай бұрын
As he pulls out an AR10 that I will never be able to afford or justify spending that much money on but Will remain envious of Till then last of my days. I would love a 7 mm PRC AR10 As a precision rifle. I will also take 65 and 243 Winchester Any of the Sherman Cartridge lines Or the Winchester short magnums.
@sonatine3266
2 жыл бұрын
As a sport-shooter I like DI more for the range, but for all-around I prefer a Gas-piston system.
@jamesg9391
2 жыл бұрын
Great content as usual! Very informative. Thank you 👍🏻
@tnmed18
3 жыл бұрын
Great info. Great help with deciding my first ar purchase :)
@owens417
3 жыл бұрын
i have the adams arms conversion kit. i havent cleaned it in 5000 rounds, still rounds like a champ!
@gregblack2628
2 жыл бұрын
Why?
@oldschooldude8370
10 ай бұрын
Piston with an upgraded buffer & trigger and youre good. Stock piston is nice enough.
@C4PROOF
4 жыл бұрын
My gasses always come out the rear. Got a special hole for that. Never clogged up though gets hot from time to time.
@coryw.5755
3 жыл бұрын
I'd like to punch you in the face.
@farrell_tyler89
3 жыл бұрын
DI because im not lazy, less moving parts, staying on target better and ill have more recourse for other goodies
@republichq9619
3 жыл бұрын
I'll cover you during an invasion of America while you baby sit your DI 😆
@stevesigler3697
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks, I learned a lot from your video.
@joshuacarrera6440
3 жыл бұрын
The AR-15 in the M16 are based on the lunjamin gas system similar in operation to the Garand
@ortiz11039
4 ай бұрын
Get a gas adjustsble bolt carrier group. Close the gas screw 100%. Shoot the gun and lets see if the gun cycles as a true direct impingement. 😊
@tgworks5791
3 жыл бұрын
There is a reason almost all new military trial entries are short stroke gas piston.
@09faraha
2 жыл бұрын
I’m considering buying POF Revolution with a short barrel(12.5). Do you think I should go with DI or the gas piston.? … I don’t like big recoils and heavy ARs.?
@justinbeck8001
Жыл бұрын
I like any piston over DI simply because it's much cleaner. I would like to have DI as well because of the simplicity and not having proprietary parts for piston system.
@hairydogstail
5 ай бұрын
The AR is an internal piston, not a true DI..
@RossSeymour
4 жыл бұрын
I'll take the one the military uses.
@justanotherinternetexpert7743
4 жыл бұрын
Our military uses both.
@RossSeymour
4 жыл бұрын
@@justanotherinternetexpert7743 My point.
@justanotherinternetexpert7743
4 жыл бұрын
@@RossSeymour ahh ok! 👍👍👍
@fishsticks88
4 жыл бұрын
Please Correct me if I'm wrong. But wouldn't a di system be easier to replace or repair OTF then a piston system. If needed to be done quickly.
@danielhenderson8316
3 жыл бұрын
And unlike piston guns, you don't have to hope that manufacturer has replacement parts in stock.
@republichq9619
3 жыл бұрын
@@danielhenderson8316 unlike DI we piston guys don't have to hope it doesn't jam during a shtf situation 😆
@AdamAnthonyAdventures
7 ай бұрын
0:32 this man changes his own oil 😅
@Whodunnit4eva
2 жыл бұрын
So as a lefty would you recommend piston driven to reduce the gases coming out of the ejection port?
@AC.Balteus
2 жыл бұрын
I dont own one but many lefty’s have been citing the positive of less gas in the face from piston AR’s. Im planning on picking up a IC-SPR as my first AR.
@javierguzman8644
4 жыл бұрын
Recoil: Actually the more mass you have moving in the opposite direction of the bullet the less recoil. An extreme example is field artillery, the whole barrel slides backwards to smooth out the recoil, otherwise it's destroy the carriage.
@Unfrosted_flakes
2 жыл бұрын
That's not exactly how that works
@bobbyraejohnson
Жыл бұрын
What???
@BlazingGunner
3 жыл бұрын
I went to the range last Sunday and did not think about it but I took only short stroke piston guns to shoot CZ Bren 2 pistol, Sig 516 14.5 pinned barrel and a Scar 17S. I guess I like my piston guns better. Still waiting on my Omega 36 M suppressor NFA hell.
@wadesimpson1777
3 жыл бұрын
Thank you bro . Great content . I learned a lot
@michaelhead8510
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks a lot video helped me out a lot with a class paper. 👍👍👍
@samuraisurge
2 жыл бұрын
Clear breakdown, thanks
@martyisabeliever
Жыл бұрын
What about an Adj. Gas block for d.i. guns?
@joehernandez5466
Жыл бұрын
Man di is the least complicated lol that shits crazy
@robmarq1
11 ай бұрын
Very good explanation
@warlockcommandcenter
4 жыл бұрын
I own both even owned an AR180 direct impingement best my mini 14 has a noticeable slower feel a chunk-chunkthat has its own cadence my AR180 has the same just like a SKS or Ak. I don't hate it it just will throw a shooter off switching over. Yes op-rod is more robust but I find the impingement better in it is quicker or feels quicker per shot. I've shot m1's both types M14's it's not noticable in Full auto. But it's there. The AR10/AR15/M16 is best overall.
@311hitwall
4 жыл бұрын
Which one for home defense - piston vs DI? Isn't the recoil more with the piston and and also less accurate because of the flex on the barrel?
@arthurmello8699
Жыл бұрын
So what would the DI gun be called a mini/piston
@VTPSTTU
4 жыл бұрын
I know that KZitem is full of videos about cleaning an AR, but if you are looking for topics to cover, I think you'd do a good job with that kind of video. With many new AR owners out there right now, the video could be useful.
@AERoVALKYRiE
3 жыл бұрын
Piston is the way to go. DI belongs in museums.
@jasonneucere8886
2 жыл бұрын
I always like these videos.
@carsonwoodward8000
3 жыл бұрын
Can you link the piston systems that you’re using? Also can you retrofit the long stroke into an already built upper?
@joshuathomas8529
4 жыл бұрын
I had no idea that their were long stroke AR-15s. Where can I get one preferably in pistol form? How hard is it to get to the gas block to clean the long stroke AR-15? My preference is long stroke because it keeps the carbon up front making it easer to clean at least in an AK platform. I like ARs I learned to love the M4 in the army after it save my life. How ever I just cant get away from loving the AK for its larger cartage (typically) and its ease to clear jam. After training many friends that had never shot a gun before it is much easer to train some one to shoot a AR plat form than an AK. Most have a hard time getting the magazine in an AK. Putting a Magazine in an AK seems simple enough to me but for my wife, her sister, and my sisters kids that magazine is very tricky. So to put the AK's operating system into an AR would be a match made in heaven.
@buddiswiser
4 жыл бұрын
Great content! Keep it up
@sjfarish
4 жыл бұрын
Been shooting for 50 years love all of them . Give me one or 5 of everything and I will be as happy as a fly on a horses rear...
@zakirali8721
Жыл бұрын
Thank you
@chiliredDX
4 жыл бұрын
SA short stroke piston in a .224 Valkyrie
@joshuapatterson7400
2 жыл бұрын
I feel like if your not shooting in full auto or like 1000 rounds a day go DI if your going full auto suppressed go gas piston obviously, This is a civilian asked question, not from a military stand point. And also I would like to add for the longest time if not still our military were running DI
@Phoenix90384
4 жыл бұрын
I'm a lefty, so short stroke piston is the way to go. I'm tired of tears of joy obscuring my vision when I try to shoot faster.
@christophdavis6453
4 жыл бұрын
I mean, you could just buy a lefty AR...
@Phoenix90384
4 жыл бұрын
@@christophdavis6453 that is an option, if you can find one in stock
@christophdavis6453
4 жыл бұрын
I built a full left handed piston AR. I could give you the build list if you're interested? Cost me about 2k or so.
@Phoenix90384
4 жыл бұрын
@@christophdavis6453 I considered building one a couple years ago, but left it be. I was planning on using a left handed BCG and receiver set from Stag, with an Adam's Arms P3 piston set.
@Phoenix90384
4 жыл бұрын
Then I remembered that I couldn't interface the piston with that bolt carrier
@seanrodriguez3413
3 жыл бұрын
Technically the gas key on the bolt in a mini piston
@AtroposLeshesis
3 жыл бұрын
Cleaning your guns is half the fun!
@Dmmartin141
Жыл бұрын
Question: can somebody with a decent amount of experience with all 3 systems tell me which one gives the best groups? It seems like the short stroke would win in theory because the piston isn’t directly connected to the bolt. Again, I’m a rookie when it comes to Semi-Automatic RIFLES. I’m a bolt action guy all day.
@penedrador
Жыл бұрын
As long as you don't plan to to shoot a hundred rounds in a few minutes, they are all the same
@Nas45677
2 жыл бұрын
piston driven for sure
@a3300000
Жыл бұрын
Not trying to reinvent the wheel, just trying to make it rounder.
Пікірлер: 280