I am 57 years old and a gating system designed to take me more years that I have left to live is the shits!
@frozethehippy349
6 жыл бұрын
ctbram0627 best comment ever lmao 😂
@cbremer83
8 жыл бұрын
The more and more grindy they make it, the less I want to play.
@SalemShanouha
8 жыл бұрын
I agree with everything u said.. just dont post this on the forums. or u gona get the following responses: 1- "git gud" 2- r u sure ur playing it right 3- ur not force to play the engineer, PowerPlay, CQC, ...etc 4- maybe this game isnt for u.. 5- Can i get ur stuff ?
@SalemShanouha
8 жыл бұрын
Ya i stopped posting there due to these responses, and Its not just for ppl whining about the AI its about anything they dont like to hear about the game. Even when some ppl post videos about bugs some ppl there say "it doesnt happen to me so it must be ur connection or pc".
@SalemShanouha
8 жыл бұрын
lol i just checked the forums RIGHT NOW.. another player leaving and the first comment is .. how about getting good playing the game?! xD they r relentless lol
@SalemShanouha
8 жыл бұрын
Most of the leaving posts were about the RNG. even the one i just saw. Its about a bad roll in grad 5 FSD that got him worse results then Grad 4. Me personally will never leave since i paid like 120$.. i just take a long break till the next update while checking up the forums. But if someone want to vent his or her frustration why not? they r paying costumers like the rest of us rnt they?
@SalemShanouha
8 жыл бұрын
George Pearson I agree, some valid feedback get ignored as trolling coz some ppl just want things AS THEY ARE and no other opinions r allowed. I agree also that there r some "leaving posts" that r just insults and useless to FD. But it got all mixed up these days that u can barely get good posts anymore.
@ecevansevans2566
8 жыл бұрын
Yes I agree,that why I don't post on forums because theirs is always people who know the game is wrong but want say it the players .
@dhoffnun
8 жыл бұрын
I know you are listening, Frontier. You know it's bad when your biggest, most gentle, most optimistic proponent is having to complain. I agree with the sentiment at the end of the video - surely this is not the experience FDev intended - but it's what we now have. And man... the Steam reviews are saltier than ever. You guys would do well to set aside whatever your current priority list is and put all that time into addressing the community concerns - because without that community, you are out of business. I'll fully admit to being one of the guys parroting "git gud" a few hours into 2.1, but that's before I'd wasted hours collecting rocks that, as this good fellow here put it, left me with no sense of progress. My own personal priorities: 1.) Engineers should feel more like real engineers, not casino attendants. See the many comments from actual engineers. Some variability is fine and good - but random effects make no sense at all. 2.) Module storage, module storage, MODULE STORAGE 3.) Ship delivery I also want to echo the recent gold post on reddit - I love Elite and the criticism comes from that place. I don't want to see anyone else leave, but currently I can't blame anyone for doing so!
@maecenus778
8 жыл бұрын
Very on point with your comment. I trust that FDev will rework the Engineers, hopefully soon, along with some of the other bugs, like unbalanced NPCs. That should be their priority.
@madprophetus
8 жыл бұрын
I don't think that it's a problem of time or priority. I think it's a problem of people. Everything that comes out of FDev is technically sound, but none of it has any polish. They need to spend more than one iteration on these things going through, at each step asking themselves 'is this fun?', and not shipping a new system until the answer at every step to that question is 'yes!'. Braben puts too much faith in Sandro, and Sandro is an amateur at best game systems designer. This is a problem.
@admiral7599
8 жыл бұрын
Unfortunately, i feel like this game will die as soon as No Man's Sky comes out. Elite: Dangerous has gotten stale, and doesn't have much to do anymore. Unless the developers come out with something new, this game will dissolve away.
@MizaT11
8 жыл бұрын
If only Frontier were a bigger company altogether :/ The slow development of the game coupled with these unpolished releases are just evidence of their current state. They're working REALLY hard but just don't have the necessary resources to deliver faster, more inspired updates. Perhaps reworking the engineers altogether isn't something they wont want to do, it's something they can't. Due to their resources, amount of developers, and time altogether. They'd have to further delay future releases.
@dhoffnun
8 жыл бұрын
Maybe special effects could even be determined by an additional material that modifies the effect... I think that honestly makes a lot more sense than a random roll. Within a small range, the "quality" of the upgrade could still vary a little bit so things feel a bit more organic, but not so much that it will leave people feeling like they've wasted their time.
@primbascul5666
7 жыл бұрын
Agreed. It doesn't make sense that you have to mine all the Engineer materials. There are miners all over the galaxy! Let us just purchase the common items at least!!!!
@donsparrow4786
8 жыл бұрын
Obsidian in my mind the Engineers system was designed badly from the start. If I got to a welding shop to get work done on a truck I don't show up with all the materials needed, I don't bring 200 pounds of steel, the Acetylene or the nuts and bolts. That is what the welder gets, because he knows where to get good quality stuff, and because he can guarantee its quality. So I see two options frontier can peruse (simultaneously?) 1: Have us supply the resources, but have them gated behind Minor faction/mission systems. For example Polonium and chemical manipulators. They could be rewarded (as they currently are from missions) or there could be special market options to buy them hidden across the galaxy. If I can buy industrial quantities of uranium surely I can buy some arsenic and polonium. The same goes for mechanical parts. But they aren't everyday resources bought and sold all the time, so they are sparsely located, perhaps only sold to friends because the restocking price isn't worth keeping a huge inventory. (plus you can still find materials on the surface of planets) 2: Have the engineers supply the materials and do the work at greater expense compared with option one. Personally I wouldn't mind having to grind out 20-40 million credits to get a 40% boost to my FSD (and the results need to be fixed, no RNG. These guys work for and are paid for results, not magic.). Now if both of these were implemented there should still be a fee, these engineers shouldn't work for free, nobody does. They are spending their time at work helping you. Also, the first option may have some RNG since the engineers can't guarantee the quality of the materials we bring (can chemical manipulators be trusted after being busted off a Type 9 In battle?). Granted my experience with the engineers has been limited to FSD upgrades so maybe I haven't experienced the whole issue. That is my idea. I still love ED and may make a second run to SAG A* this month.
@RealTheNatoorat
8 жыл бұрын
100% of yup. After I unlocked an Engineer (Felicity), which btw was not easy thanks to the broken Barnacles, I was tasked with gathering materials for lvl1 FSD upgrade. For 2 days I drove around more than a dozen planets, mined quite a few asteroids in different belts, did a number of missions, and all my efforts were rewarded with a grand total of 1 (one) unit of arsenic. I have not been to an engineer since. Another issue that I had with the game, is the almost complete focus on combat with nearly absolute disregard for non-pew-pew activities. Do not get me wrong, I still do enjoy the game, but as a non-combat player I find myself to be struggling with finding things to do. With really Uninspiring PowerPlay, grind heavy Engineers, heavily unbalanced economy (or rather lack of thereof) and with more aggressive AI (not wining about it), I am beginning to regret getting the Lifetime Expansion Pass. So, yea... On this year's EGX I will walk up to Mr Barben, and I will tell him: "Look, I like your game, but get your stuff together and improve the existing mechanics before adding new ones. And fix those damn missions!". See you at NEC!
@eillswim
8 жыл бұрын
what were they thinking :/
@thehipinmyear
8 жыл бұрын
Straight up!
@CDMudd
8 жыл бұрын
Warning! Negative opinion! To me it feels like someone at Frontier said "We need to give people something to do while we work on the harder systems" so suddenly there's reputation grinding with Powerplay and now material grinding in the Engineers. Just some non-content to keep people playing and distracted. What a waste of both the dev's and the player's time! 2.2 The Guardians might actually be the first actual content patch in this season as it'll actually add something new to do. I don't think the previous systems are worthless, it's just the implementation is unrewarding and easily ignored. It really feels, to me, that Frontier know how to make pretty planets and stars, but actually don't know how to make a game fun.
@BrevityLC
8 жыл бұрын
It's more that they think they've created a form of MMO, when really they've created a large scale co-op game with a dash of PvP. Sure it's massive, multiplayer, and online, but it feels like they've looked up the sarcastic definition of MMO, where it is said that players enjoy engaging in the same repetitive action for weeks on end. I feel like I've jumped back to the year 2005, where this type of grindplay was acceptable, and it was most commonly found in MMOs.
@CDMudd
8 жыл бұрын
fantomas Kind of a "Now what?" mentality, as if they were surprised that they got this far.
@PanzerMecha
8 жыл бұрын
I reluctantly have to agree. They have yet to really add any truely compelling new gameplay IMO.
@CDMudd
8 жыл бұрын
Helder Perez You just made me realize that the material grinding only makes sense in a Free to Play game. The point of making mats hard to get is to make you want to buy them from the online store. Frontier are borrowing game design techniques from the wroooong place!
@CDMudd
8 жыл бұрын
Helder Perez Nothing would make me jump ship harder than pay to win microtransactions in Elite. I'm also a Warframe player, and I feel like that game at least rewards my time investment. Kind of sad, right?
@xman2008
8 жыл бұрын
I would love there to be slider bars for the different affected stats. The more extreme the modification, the greater it affects the other stats and greater the cost to build. Then when you're happy with how it will affect your ship, you save that custom blueprint to reference the materials needed like it is now. You should absolutely be able to pick your desired effect without it costing rep. Also, when a blueprint is pinned, the wave scanner on the SRV should beep and turn blue when an outcropping with desired materials is detected. And materials found in space or scanned should have like a little blue magnifying glass icon on them to indicate a desired material. That way collection is simple and when you have all the mats you get a little indicator in your inbox that says "Blueprint materials acquired- auto-lock engineer?" for quick navigation back to the workshop.
@robynhighart2026
8 жыл бұрын
I just reached an Engineer for the first time. The journey there was amazing. It was the one on Wyrd. Great location, views and a cool base with a rouge atmosphere. Once I docked and found out the way this whole system works, the joy went out of the window... A shame.
@NaturalRadiation
8 жыл бұрын
5:49 That SRV just got rekt.
@cypheir
7 жыл бұрын
You know, even in Space Engineers... Technologically taking place way before a type of world like Elite, there are Ore Detectors. They dont just find generic "ore" they also identify it without diggin it out. Also, wtf with the no storage in this game with a material grind?
@Kenneth_McGrew
8 жыл бұрын
you are 100% right - ED engineers is soul destroying
@Jaffa79
8 жыл бұрын
I just feel the whole process of obtaining materials is a massive missed opportunity - FD could have introduced some simple narrative game play e.g. a series of side missions with a random element e.g. variable locations, objectives and tasks dependent on the module being modified. Providing slightly more/better quality resources to the NPC could guarantee a better outcome.
@CANDIAINBACONN
8 жыл бұрын
TOTALLY AGREE, i think that the first suggestion the material collection being faster so we could roll more would be far more fun!
@aztecscribe
8 жыл бұрын
The should make upgrades available through story driven missions. A type of mini single player with a story arch given by each engineer.
@Gaardian
8 жыл бұрын
Yeah I feel the same. Hopefully things get better.
@omegapng
8 жыл бұрын
I think module/commodity storage, easier to get materials, and the Engineer "favor" system they've talked about will make this update great.
@JohnEGOGaming
8 жыл бұрын
I agree with you Ant, but overall I'm pretty happy with this update. I'm on Xbone so I'm just happy I got ANY kind of update, but that's something else. I think 2 thing would help the material gathering process. 1. If you have a detailed surface scanner, you can scan a planet and it would show you where there is a greater chance for materials to populate in the planetary view screen. 2. You can make a marker on the planet surface to help you land where your surface scanner told you where the materials might be. I think that would be super cool and make the detailed surface scanner useful to more than just explorers.
@RonRonsen
8 жыл бұрын
Thx for your voice Obsidian. You are not alone. I have the same problem with this patch. Hope Frontier manage to fix those problems.
@808Mordecai
8 жыл бұрын
Good video, I think you've hit the nail on the head. I stopped playing ED about 3 weeks ago, just couldn't hack the grind anymore as I don't often have 12 hours a day to play a game. gonna give it a break and see how things go.
@EricLidiak
8 жыл бұрын
I don't like crafting being random at all. I don't mind searching or buying a few hard to get materials, if I can go to the engineer ONCE and buy the exact module I need. Loot and mining should be random, but not when I carefully build a module.
@32drunkmonk
8 жыл бұрын
Got to agree, I tried to Engineers on the beta, and trying to get a decent roll on a module could take 10-20 attempts, now that was all well and good when your handing over fish, but farming mats for hours and hours to get a bad roll....no, its a bad system, it`s guaranteed frustration.For me they should either remove mats and keep the rng on crafting or keep the mats but make the upgrades set, but having rng and a huge farm is a put off, so much so that I haven't bothered even going to an engineer.on a side note, in my personal opinion having something like 10% more distance on a FSD for example, at the cost of less durability and more power usage is not an upgrade, it is at best moving stats around. same goes for all modules. any upgrade that comes with multiple downgrades is no upgrade.
@cmeves
8 жыл бұрын
Ha this video is pretty much exactly my thoughts when I commented on your video last time. I could not find Yttrium either and after probably 15 hours of searching, I got 3. I wasted 2 when the RNG gave me nothing good and the 3rd roll was a very marginal upgrade. So here's what I've been reading and seeing on forums about this. For the first time, players now have a separate branch, or second path to go after. Before, the sole grind was for bigger, better ships. Everything was done for that purpose. Now, for the first time there is a second path. So the second the update came out, about 90% of my time was grinding for these upgrades. I honestly sort of liked it, as it forced me to do things I wouldn't have otherwise (mining, searching on planets in my scarab). Although I have begun to despise the slip and slide driving. SO frustrating and terrible controls. But biggest thing for me at this point... The lack of external storage. My favorite thing to do is RES zones. I have a fully kitted Python for purely that purpose. Well, now that I have about 25 items in my inventory that I can NOT sell because I may need it for Engineers, the SECOND I get scanned, they attack me. Many times wings of 2-3 NPC's all at once. This has now made RES zones *IMPOSSIBLE*. It is unplayable, unless I have a death wish. My favorite thing in the game and my $150m Python, now useless. I am getting interdicted every couple of minutes, sometimes 5-10 times in a row and my exploring Asp is dragged down with a full cargo hold. I have had to sell important items JUST to get in the Asp because my cargo isn't as large. So yeh, this is a big problem for me. Without a way to store these engineer commodities from mission rewards, it's getting close to unplayable for me.
@TheGuyWhoGamesAlot1
8 жыл бұрын
Funny how you feel about the Engineers Update and material collection, is how I felt about the mining career in the game when I got Elite Dangerous. Mining didn't feel rewarding. I felt that the materials actually worth any money were too rare (especially since I started mining in small ships). I have since gave up on mining. Eventually after enough grinding I was able to get a Type-6 transport ship. It took me about a month (mainly because I only played the game the way I wanted to). I actually didn't want the Type-6 ship, I wanted to get some other combat ship that I thought was really cool! The reason I didn't get the ship I wanted was because I knew that if I got that ship it would take me just as long, if not longer to recoup my money back to the same point before spending it. I heard that trading in the game was a really good way to earn money, but only if you had a big cargo ship. So I spent my credits on that. To my surprise I earned more than the ship was worth in about 2 hours. I didn't hate trading, but I didn't like it much either. I thought it was just as "boring" as mining (except actually easier and super profitable). I don't like how to actually make money in the game I needed to play a way I didn't want to. I wanted to be a miner that stayed in one "home" system with a good asteroid belt nearby and then with my profit do combat missions on the side. Maybe if the game played the way I wanted it would also be broken, but I just want an alternative where I could be a miner. I have since left Elite Dangerous. I have actually started playing some EVE online after being unimpressed with Elite Dangerous. I have a lot of fun learning the mechanics of the game, and became the miner I wanted to be in the game. The mining progression was just what I wanted in Elite. It had a progression system that started off small but at the same time, rewarding. It eventually grew into a more complex system with trying to find the right min-max for the situation and learning certain mining techniques to maximize my efficiency. Also mining was a more social experience in the game than Elite (well everything in EVE was more social than Elite Dangerous). Remember that one Elite Dangerous trailer with the ships mining in a group? Yeah that doesn't happen, also there is no benefit to doing that either. The actual "gameplay" of EVE is pretty simple though. It is kind of a glorified point in click game. But I have had more fun in a game that was a supposed "spreadsheet simulator" than I have in Elite Dangerous. I have the Engineers DLC, but I have no intention of playing the game until I see revisions in careers so that it is more balanced. Grinding in EVE is way more fun than in Elite, and EVE is way more of an MMO than Elite is.
@Ifreatking
8 жыл бұрын
Totally understand ya on this, Ant. If there's enough unrest, visible unrest, there should be some sort of response from PR. Even just confirmation of receipt and saying 'we're thinking on what to do'. Some change or offer of perspective from Frontier would be tops. Though it doesn't affect my vessels, I'm flying in 1.6 and having to deal with the fine-tuned fliers that're using the Engineers.
@UrsSchweigert
7 жыл бұрын
Very much agree, the sense of progress is really very subtle. I have no problems with grinding, but you need to feel progress.
@ImAFlyingPancake
8 жыл бұрын
One solution could be to inform players how to find these materials. Introducing more game knowledge in the game is nice, but come on, we can't guess where to find everything with such a lack of information. "Given as mission rewards"... Wow thanks, now I'll just dock at every station in the hope of finding a mission giving the special material I need? Another solution, which is great imo, is that npcs at engineers stations give you difficult missions with only materials as reward. It could allow to get the material you want in a challenging way which is still balanced because there is no credits earned. For example, an npc send you a message : "Hey, I heard you talking with this engineer. It seems that you need some Exquisite Focus Cristals. Oh wow I just got one in my pocket here ! But well, you won't get it so easily... " The game would feel much more dynamic and fun. Moreover, there would be a real feeling of being rewarded. Like Ant said in a previous video, game mechanics would be linked.
@macklroy2005
4 жыл бұрын
Interesting to watch this now after all of the updates to the Engineers. 1-Multiple materials awarded per material collected. 2-Material traders to swap excess unused materials for the ones you need. 3-Less materials needed per modification at the engineer. 4-Guaranteed progress per roll when upgrading at the engineer. (RNG remains as to 'how much' progress. But you will always get an improvement) 5-Experimental effects no longer random, but can simply be added to any modification at any time.
@TheSuperQuail
3 жыл бұрын
This is really useful, thanks
@callummcneill6266
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you for this comment!
@Dark__Thoughts
8 жыл бұрын
In regards on the few words about the delay it should be noted that a good amount of that time went into the QoL improvements and polishing of the base game features, which I think we can all agree on, turned out great overall.
@AZ-Drone
8 жыл бұрын
Obsidian Ant, I have to say you've added so much to my experience with Elite Dangerous. I've learned so much over the past few months following along with you. And I've got to say, your really even handling of this issue is what we've needed. Reading the forums and Reddit there's just so much salt. This video? Hit the nail on the head. While I got my FSD upgrade, and didn't have to grind too much, I believe that RNG on top of RNG is an issue. Too many time gates. I stopped at FSD 4 because getting the Polonium took a good bit of time. And all that time felt a little wasted with the "lottery machine" at Farseer's. So for the time I'm out exploring again, enjoying the added jump range, and I'll be back in the bubble when I feel like docking up once more. Keep these videos coming! And thanks for being a great voice for the community!
@rogerdodgeraviation
8 жыл бұрын
I appreciate your insights and I hope Frontier does too. Sounds like there was a lot of soul-searching involved as you put together your thoughts for this video.
@RANBO2012
8 жыл бұрын
Thank You. This video says it all. I'm a new player to Elite Dangerous, having played for 3 months I've started to love this game. But this is were after the engineer update came by I've feel worn out, day after day trying to collect these materials to upgrade my combat Python and seeing very little to no progress in finding them. Here is my problem as a father i don't have many a day to play ED but when i do, i can play for hours and enjoy it. Now i don't seem to have the same satisfaction as i used to, knowing that i could upgrade my ship modules but can't cause the materials r not easily obtainable. Thank you for pointing this out in the video i hope someone hears you.
@AAAStiller
8 жыл бұрын
Great Video. Very well summed up the problem with Engineers. Thx, from CMDR RhymeRhyme!
@Osti67
8 жыл бұрын
Hi Obsidian, you nailed it as usual. Spending two weeks of your playtime doing repetitive tasks that are not the usual activities I choose to enjoy elite dangerous, just to end up with 2 rolls that then again turn out to be so bad, that they would actually leave you with a worse result than what I had is more than frustrating and makes you ask yourself why you spend all that time in the first place. Also when rolling, often the outcome is not entirely clear leaving you with guessing whether this roll will actually enhance your module or cripple it regarding to the modification you already have on it. An overview like when buying modules and equipping your ship that sums up jump range, energy consumption etc. would be very handy. On top of this, in my opinion, one of the fantastic game mechanics was to be able to outfit your ship for different purposes, to match different needs. Now you are stuck with your modules pretty much once you upgraded them and cannot just equip the ship to go exploring and then reequip for bounty hunting etc. And considering the over all game play experience, the engineers are not adding anything to the game, which would be of use if they hadn´t been implemented in the first place. It is all very frustrating and I am really starting to ask myself, what all these brilliant people at Frontier, who were able to create an awesome game world like this were thinking when implementing this. In my opinion, there should always be three possible approaches to solving a task in a game, brain, skill and luck. Only when these three come together the game play is compelling and exciting. The engineers is just an endless grind and leaves you more than often with a frustrating result that makes the boring effort to gather the materials even more frustrating. well enough wining. Good video as usual glad you are bringing it to the point again in an objective constructive way. regards cmdr Whispers68
@thestaubful
8 жыл бұрын
It's like you took my thoughts right out of my brain and made a video. Very good job. I love elite, I sink countless hours into it, but I barely touched then engineers because of those reasons you mentioned. Very good video.
@dsagent
8 жыл бұрын
Player trading would help with a lot of things. We could have actual professions like miners, explorers who interact with each other to help each other out.
@cdbetterley
7 жыл бұрын
I have to agree with you, it has its good and bad points and the roll generators are heavy handed. Something needs to change. After spending several days of grinding for grade 5 materials and then to "waste" them on a couple of dozen bad rolls; only having to start the grind all over again is very frustrating.
@TehKola2
8 жыл бұрын
I've yet to try the Engineers, but from what i've seen it doesn't seem that enjoyable.
@DarthYryn
8 жыл бұрын
Their bases look great. That's pretty much all I have to say about it that is positive.
@MrBothandNether
8 жыл бұрын
Space Flight > Uncompelling Grind
@WagWaggers
8 жыл бұрын
If it helps anyone, Deciat is good for finding Arsenic, and after a little trip to the Hind nebula, found a lot of rare and very rare materials such as Yttrium and Technetium in the craters with small mountains in the middle. Happy hunting :)
@Vaggr81
8 жыл бұрын
i ve been away from elite for sometime so i dont know the situation first hand, but every time i think maybe its a good time to jump back into it and i go online to watch a few videos see whats been happening my desire to start playing again just goes away...
@CMDRRustyDog
8 жыл бұрын
I am so glad you put this video out. I agree on almost all of your points here. But in my case I don't like the grind where the enginreers is concerned. Of all the grinds in ED this is the worst one I think. The reason for this is exactly what you said, too little reward vs time investment. And then what ? All that time can be for nothing if you get a bad roll of the dice. I don't mind investing time in ED but this is just asking too much of me. Since 2.1 launched I have never, since Premium Beta, played Elite so infrequently. Sometimes I see the icon on my desktop and part of me wants to play and part of me just can't be bothered because I know that there is a life-sapping grind ahead and because I'm not so much into the AI right now and I also feel that needs some further tweaking. I was hoping I was not the only one feeling like this and it's a relief to see I'm clearly not. On the subject of storage, I have just this minute put up a video on my own channel regarding that exact subject. I suppose it's already a moot point if Frontier are indeed going to introduce it. Nevertheless I have given some suggestions on how this can be implemented in a pretty cool way. Either way it IS needed now, particularly with the bigger threat of the AI and the new 2.1 game mechanics. Until and if any of this gets sorted out, I really don't know what to do with ED. Perhaps this is a good time for me to finally do my Sag A run. I'm so done with USS's and cargo scooping. I dunno if I can face peeing off planetary base after planetar base, scanning their data access points only to be rewarded with something I don't even want or possibly need. You may have inspired me to finally put my thoughts on 2.1 to video but I doubt I`ll sound as calm as you do :)
@SleepyMcGee
8 жыл бұрын
These problems, which are very real, have a simple solution. Player driven module and material markets. DONE, SALVED. Get on it Frontier. Seriously, every game with this level of RNG has this mechanic. Also, just most MMO's of have this. It increases player interaction and breads community. It's a win win.
@Mandrak789
8 жыл бұрын
Agreed.
@Droogie128
8 жыл бұрын
I have well over 1000 hours invested into this game. I pre-ordered Horizons based on the engineers. Planetary landings don't interest me much until we get atmospheric landings. Ship launched fighters and multicrew are things I will rarely, if ever use. No, I bought it for the ability to upgrade and personalize my ship. After 5 weeks of looking for materials and coming up short, feeling like I have absolutely no input at all into my progress... It's getting hard to even log on anymore. Taking a break won't help. The long non progression will still be there waiting when I come back to it. I just did a grade 3 dirty drive upgrade on my Cutter today. After 2 weeks of looking for specialized legacy firmware, I finally had enough to try one roll. Got the bare minimum upgrade with almost maximum negative effects.
@Talismandanful
8 жыл бұрын
I also agree 100%! I was playing ED daily on my HTC Vive until the Engineers came out. I was super excited to upgrade my ship for exploring, but so far the amount of time I have to spend looking for materials has chased me away from this game. I hope they can find a more fair balance, I want to love this game once again!
@KronekGaming
8 жыл бұрын
Spot on man. I spent a week looking for the materials I needed for a grade 4 FSD upgrade and in the end gave up. Never was able to find the components I needed. I blow up so many trade ships trying to get Chemical Distillers. I think that's what it was. Only found one. I also needed 1 more Yttrium.
@JonAcostaArt
4 жыл бұрын
I’m an explorer at heart in this game. I have made this work for me by being very formulaic. When I am tired of being in the bubble and crave a ‘walk in the woods’, I decide between two motives: am I going out for exploration pleasure?...meaning, sightseeing and pretending im really on these planets? OR....am I going for advancement. If I am doing the latter, I stick to a highly efficient system of keystrokes out to 7kly and back, I barely look at anything in the FSS even if I am scanning a 60 body system. Knock em out fast and THEN check the galaxy map for specific bodies I want. If I see those bodies, I check for those materials. Rinse, repeat, move on. Honestly, I intend to do the ‘for sightseeing’ as my reward to myself later on, almost as an end-game gift to my game play.
@DevilbyMoonlight
8 жыл бұрын
You have hit the nail on the head in a very elegant way.. the engineer upgrades I have tried have all been very poor and worse than stock except for one, I guess i have had a lot of unluck roles... which is a shame considering the time investment I have put in to acquire the materials, you are right it is too much of a lottery in regards to what your going to get, there are lots of other things broken in this update, I have had ships stuck to to what seem like invisible objects above landbases, missions which change and send you someplace you cannot drop the cargo off, & the fines incurred through those failed missions disappear when attempting to pay them off only to reappear later leaving me with no option but to buy & crash a sidewinder in fear of being scalped for a bounty , there are definately a few things frontier need to fix, and a few things they could have added in this update that would make all of our lives easier, it wouldnt be a bad idea to be able to select a bookmark from the left hand navigation panel rather than have to go to the galactic map, also being able to choose your own waypoints through the stars would be quite handy too.... I personally think those 2 features would be more useful than the engineers to me
@pryzmgaming
8 жыл бұрын
You summed up my feelings exactly.. this whole system needs a real rethink.
@TroaBarton
8 жыл бұрын
Couldn't agree more Ant, myself personally I would like to see it implemented into the black market as a player driven economy with the station acting as a fence. The station would pay the player who found the material charging more for them (money sink) and allowing them to be traded between stations with supply and demand playing a role. After a while finding the materials needed for another role can be purchased at your convenience which would be a new money sink. It would absolve the issue here and provide value to all the micro resources as they would be worth credits if nothing else.
@ObsidianAnt
8 жыл бұрын
I would love to see something like that integrated into the game, and I think it would give much more value to the gameplay. It seems to me that Frontier are far more concerned with time-sinks than they are with money sinks so. So many things within the game seem to be designed to take the longest amount of time possible, and for me this is one of the largest frustrations. Really hoping that the upcoming changes to The Engineers is just the start - and that they will go a lot further with it...
@ericburgett8521
7 жыл бұрын
I love this game but the grind, the grind. Is aweful. I do agree that there needs to be something that slows down game play a little bit but not choke it off entirely for someone like me who works 12 hours a day and the time i do spend in game is collecting. Collecting. Collecting just to keep up. Id rather be out in the black exploring and seeing what trouble i can get into with other players or aliens... Obsidian Ant. i couldnt agree with you more and i am on board with you. Thank you for your videos and the time you spend on them. Its good to see some of the views from people like you so people like me who havent left the bubble can see whats out there. Sometime, someday, my name will be on a star......... CMDR SirBalthazar ps sorry i missed this video when it was first posted. would have loved to comment in it back then...
@klarkolofsson
8 жыл бұрын
Very well put, Obsidian. Good job!
@bmatt2626
8 жыл бұрын
You can get rare elements from mission rewards, and it might be more efficient to scan the boards as you go about your routine, than to spend hours looking for them on the surface. For "ranking up" with engineers, I've just been popping small ships at a RES with a collector-limpet out, and repeatedly buying the easiest upgrade available with the parts. With the latest patch, that also means I can also trade that engineer rep for special effects. If the quantity for elemental mission rewards was increased a bit to compensate for the RNG loss, I think this would be the perfect system. FD isn't as far off as it seems.
@Houseofhogan
8 жыл бұрын
I agree with everything you have said. And, as I am an explorer, and NOT a combat pilot I was very upset that one of the things needed for better FSD required a mission that that involved delivering goods under extreme combat conditions. I don't mind an occasional interdiction from a matched pilot in a similar ship, but seven, on two jumps, by ships that can out maneuver my A rated ASP and with heat producing weapons, that can take out my shields and canopy from behind with one shot, before I even have time to recover from the interdiction, then, after taking him out, and with 25% hull, being interdicted again, only a ls from a station, by a wing of four Condas, for just for 10 units of cargo is a bit much. I made it, but only just. But now, even though I completed the mission, and carry no cargo, and no missions, am interdicted at every system by an MPC who claims I'm a hard one to find. To be honest, I'm fast loosing interest in what I think is the greatest game ever made, but it has now been ruined for those of us who want to be honest, decent explorers and traders.
@CMDR_Evolution
8 жыл бұрын
Thanks Obsidian. I completely agree. I got the 2 exploration engs up to level 3 by simply doing exploration :). Then haven't bothered, for the reasons you mentioned. After then I've just been focusing on trade and now mining, to vary it up a bit
@h.b.3187
8 жыл бұрын
That is all I've done since I started playing five month ago, and now with bugs and very aggressive AI, I've had to take a break. I'd like to know when an update will come out that's NOT combat focused...
@vertwheeler9
8 жыл бұрын
My problem was that it started making me feel like a gambler and I was constantly going to any engineer and just buying any upgrade to watch the bar swing. I had to stop myself and I could totally feel myself feel like a gambler.
@Keberus
8 жыл бұрын
Very good Video. These are in most points my thoughts and feelings. Nicely explained.
@Pecisk
8 жыл бұрын
Ant, just honest question - if FD came out and said it is "fly by" system with no intention to be upgrade progression system top of regular outfitting? Would that give you some understanding how FD designed this? I think we are strongly at odds here. People enjoying system don't grind and don't rush to get modules upgraded. People who doesn't openly grind and just spend hours looking around for materials.
@ObsidianAnt
8 жыл бұрын
I would still say exactly what I am saying now. I would say that the materials are impossible (for many people but not all) to come by unless actively looking for them. That is a problem, whichever way you look at it. I've already stated I don't grind. It seems you are simply telling me to ignore The Engineers as it doesn't fit my play-style. Is that correct?
@AdmiralFloof
8 жыл бұрын
There's quite a lot of people on forum that tells other people not to actively look out for these materials because "you'll eventually get there" and "ignore it because it's not mandatory". But guess what, I paid for it, of course I wanna use it ~.~
@ObsidianAnt
8 жыл бұрын
Also, an honest question to you. I've never seen so many people "complain" about any previous update like they are with The Engineers. Do you honestly believe that all of these people are "wrong"? And secondly. What do you feel the community reaction would be if FD actually came out and stated that The Engineers was never intended to be a progression system?
@DarthYryn
8 жыл бұрын
+Pēteris Krišjānis : Still, a lot of time invested in a game that can be ruined by the RNG mechanic. That's quite sadistic and many including myself don't have time to waste on collecting stuff only to be punished by the RNG. Collecting is fine. RNG that wastes the time spent collecting is not.
@MrSquishedsquashed
8 жыл бұрын
So here's the deal, I refuse to grind, I play and get whatever float my way while I'm doing the stuff I enjoy (mainly bounty hunting, it's got me to about 11mil credits at the moment) so this system doesn't bother me that much. However I can see where the other players are coming from. If you love PvP (for example) and find your ship is now non-competitive because everyone else is getting engineers upgrades because they've been gathering Yittrium since before 2.1 then you are going to have to go looking for mats and at the moment that is a really annoying system. Another thing is knowing that there's all this content that would change your day to day gameplay, locked behind an unfun system so getting it would be unpleasant but not getting it feels stupid... I think it's a shame and because there's so much great stuff there waiting behind this wall of frustration, the mechanics should be revised to a more interesting, challenging (not purely time consuming) and skill based system. However, that's just me!
@MAXLD
8 жыл бұрын
RNG / dice rolling is a thing that people can quicky accept, and get addicted to (FIFA packs, Hearthstones packs, RPG gear drops stats, etc... ) but if you introduce a crafting system with a double layer RNG sytem with a first part that requires of HOURS of grinding/RNG, that then get all gambled in a milisecond on the second heavy RNG part / final crafting... then you're going to loose a lot of players. This happened to a lot of people in The Division too. The hours of rng material search is all gambled and wasted in a single click when crafting a weapon that will have random damage and random perks. If it sucks -> do it all over again. "Nope. I'm out". Most players won't mind a reasonable time consuming task if the final prize is known/clear and worth it. Specially when they can combine upgrades and calculate their stats for good setups for each of their ships. Byt when you get such random results, you might even get several updates that nullify each other, making your ship the same as before or making it even worse. Grinding RNG for a final chance of RNG... Not worth the hours wasted. The idea is obviously to drag out progress and keep people logging in and grinding until the next update or DLC arrives, but this can actually send people away from the game more than actually doing nothing and keeping the game as it is, letting them enjoy the base game.
@achimhanischdorfer3403
8 жыл бұрын
One thing I would say is: If you have upgraded a module you should be able to ask the engineer to review you upgrade and improve it. IE: You may not get any rep from the modification, but you can select to have a particular stat affected and the others would stay the same. 2-fold gain for Frontier: -people who appreciate the gambling process can still do that. I certainly see a reason to do that. -people who want (a) certain quality(ies) from the modifications can get those. It would be rewarding. That with the increased material gains AND the to be made available info on where to find what you need for upgrades would make it perfect.
@RigmorCyrodiil
8 жыл бұрын
I love you Ant xxx Bang on the ball yet again
@richardjackson5085
8 жыл бұрын
Really good response mate, totally agree. So frustrating how the game is so good in so many ways but some of the mechanics & rules continually let it down. Idea about much more dice rolls and lower mat cost is great. Also I'd like to see the surface scanner generate POIs or interest areas of all kinds and link to a database that can include planet type and materials relations, which would be nice if it's another data commodity like other exploration data. The surface map is just so underdone. Also the engineers roll effect result should be in the form of a blueprint, able to be applied n times to that particular module. Rich (CMDR COSMOS)
@sinkpissersupreme
8 жыл бұрын
I agree 100%. The Beta was was fun, because the RNG rolls didn't cost anything. but making us waste hours of our time, to only get screwed over, is nothing but a slap in in the face.
@TeamEnderman1337
8 жыл бұрын
Couldn't agree more, Ant! I spent upwards of two hours driving around on a planet before I found a SINGLE Arsenic. And that's supposed to be a "Common" material! I tried mining in asteroid belts, but that was even more boring and I didn't find any materials I needed there either. The repeated trips to and from the Engineers' hideouts was also not fun, especially since I wasn't able to find out whether or not I had the correct materials for a blueprint that I had forgotten to pin or some other problem. I think that one of the biggest stumbling blocks people like myself run into is the complete and total lack of information about key game mechanics from official sources. There are many community-made pages about where to find different materials, but they are based on statistics gathered from a very limited set of locations throughout a virtually unlimited galaxy. There are also community-made pages for the Engineer blueprints, but they are incomplete and possibly outdated. It's not like what the Engineer blueprints require is a privileged piece of info, so why doesn't Frontier just enable you to see it in-game? Same with things like material locations. Add that knowledge as a reward for using the Detailed Surface Scanner! On an unexplored planet, use the DSS and then check the planetary map for where the materials are! It would save so much time for the players that it might make people start prospecting more. I'm done ranting now. I really enjoy Elite and I want to keep being able to say that I do and Frontier could make a huge difference just by telling the community where to go and what to get while they are there. TL;DR: Frontier needs to make more information about the game readily available in the form of official data and they also need to seriously increase the micro-resource acquisition rate.
@asnail
8 жыл бұрын
To be fair to Frontier, there are a few ways to get Yytrium, you don't have to drive around on planets, unidentified signal sources and mission rewards being two I know, however you are right, the quickest way to get it is to land on a planet. Whilst I agree finding anything on a planet is a role of the dice, you can stack the odds in your favour, and like anything in Elite, its a skill and takes a bit of time to learn how to do it properly. Currently my strategy is land on the flattest part of a high metal planet, preferably with a high gravity and that is known to have Yytrium. Then zoom around at full speed looking for metal meteorites (two close bars at the bottom of your scanner) (ignore everything else unless you feel like exploring, but that will use up your time and is unlikely to get you the very rare minerals). My tactic is to head into the sun or towards a nebula to make sure I don't cover the same ground, with diversions off to get the meteorites. Sometimes the game lags a bit and its worth stopping, and doing a few circles to see what's about before carrying on. You aren't going to get vast piles of the stuff, but you should get some in a reasonable time period. Note: if you want rare minerals, visit the Mesosiderite meteorites (single line at the bottom of your scanner). Just as an aside, typically high metal planets have 1 very rare, 2 rare and 3 common minerals. Keep a note of what you find on each planet, and if you are looking for a specific mineral and you have found all the minerals in that category and its not the one you want, find another planet. Having visited a number of planets, I now have a list of which planet to go to for what resource. My best so far is 1 system with 4 of the vary rare minerals in it (one on each planet), but somewhere out there, I hope to find a system with all 6. Its actually a system you would probably like - 3 stars giving nice views - If your after Yttrium its on COL 285 Sector LM-V d2-38 ABC 3 in that system.So that's how to get stuff. Personally, I think there should be a bit more to it e.g. you need to find planets at certain temperatures (I haven't found enough to confirm if this is happening or not), certain types, near asteroid belts, near certain star types e.g. old stars and their planets are more likely to have had more geological activity than newer ones. Once found then the probability of finding stuff becomes much higher. Currently all you need to find are high metal planets and then look around for the meteorites (which don't come from the high metal world, so presumably they must be drawn in by some special force and its not magnets given some minerals aren't magnetic).
@cmdrflint9115
8 жыл бұрын
I completely agree on finding materials. It's terrible if you're actually trying to find something specific. I was fortunate with my first few mods in that I already had the materials thanks to messing about on planets with distant worlds. I don't think I can ever get over being "forced" to go mining though :(
@JonAcostaArt
4 жыл бұрын
I’m an explorer at heart in this game. I have made this work for me by being very formulaic. When I am tired of being in the bubble and crave a ‘walk in the woods’, I decide between two motives: am I going out for exploration pleasure?...meaning, sightseeing and pretending im really on these planets? (which is very much fun) .....OR....am I going for advancement. If I am doing the latter, I stick to a highly efficient system of keystrokes out to 7kly and back, I barely look at anything in the FSS even if I am scanning a 60 body system. Knock em out fast and THEN check the galaxy map for specific landable bodies I want. If I see those bodies, I check for material presence. If I see them in the list, I land (ive become skilled at low grav high speed srv). Rinse, repeat, move on. Honestly, although I do do a little ‘sightseeing’ for pure pleasure in between, I mostly stick to the formula as a task i need to do with the idea that later on, as my reward to myself, almost as an end-game gift to my game play, I will do more of the pure pleasure of sightseeing.
@elmeric7086
8 жыл бұрын
I agree 100%. Double gated progression is the killer here. I also spent alot of time on planet and in Conflict Zone and after loosing ships and time, I'm a LITTLE closer to getting an FSD level4 roll. Also the mission only ressources are a sub problem.
@FabricioSTH
8 жыл бұрын
I have two main hobbies in my life, astronomy and games. I found in ED a way to combine the two and I was surprised how much science and knowledge the game offered. When Horizons expansion came they throw all away. Frontier constructed a huge database about planets that means nothing when you are finally able to descent to its surface and make some exploration. It would be far more interesting to connect all that data with exploration hints to find materials, but they decided to roll some dices instead.
@IIIIITesuIIIII
8 жыл бұрын
Well said ObsidianAnt! I have invested around 400h in Elite Dangerous, got my Imperial Cutter and a few other ships, I have been trading, bounty hunting, smuggling, doing missions and seen a number of nebulae while exploring. Although I have been with the series since Elite 2 and really enjoy Elite Dangerous I stopped playing it recently. It just takes way to much time to get the feeling of any real progression. Driving on the surface of the planets and hoping for the right materials to drop may be fun as long as it doesn't take forever to get them. I am not that kid who used to spend hours playing Elite 2 every day anymore. Now with my own family and duties I can only spend a few hours on playing games each week. And when I am playing I want to feel I am achieving something, I want that feeling of a small but steady progression. What I don't like is the feeling of my wasted time when I have just spent two hours on hunting the materials with not much luck due to the RNG. As much as I love ED and flying in my ASP Explorer, Python, Vulture, Cutter and Courier the time the game requires from me to be able to have my ships upgraded by the engineers is ridiculous and really puts me off. I do not find the grinding for materials rewarding, it is quite opposite to be honest. Although I have loads of sympathy for David Braben for giving us Elite series, am very thankful for the devs who gave us Elite Dangerous and still want to play this game recently I can't find the motivation to do it. I don't want to play ED without having my ships upgraded by the engineers and at the same time when starting the game to have some fun and relax I do not want to spend many boring hours on slow material grinding since this is nowhere close to the fun I want Elite Dangerous to be. Until this is somehow fixed and burdensome grind is replaced by a less time consuming solution (preferably with some fun included) I am going to have a break from Elite Dangerous. I am not happy about it and I am going to miss the game a lot but I don't want to feel that I am wasting my time while playing it anymore.
@KarlBarbosa
8 жыл бұрын
Excellent, excellent video. You brought up points I hadn't considered. I'm familiar with grind mechanics in many games, and considered the ones here for engineer mods fairly light compared to what others have ... but you're right in saying most games make it so that time investment is enjoyable. But here, it's pure grind, And while it's less time investment than most MMOs, I know what the final stats will look like once I've completed the work. So the combination of grind and uncertainty makes it so that it comes down to straight RNG. Now that being said, one problem I strongly recommend is that the RNG rolls in engineers is never possible worse than what the player has. An upgrade should feel like an upgrade. In the case of Dirty Drives, it seems to be the case, but I don't see it in most places. For example, I went from rank 4 FSD to rank 5, and only gained 1%. And the roll could have made it so that it could have been worse than what I currently have. That should never ever be the case. Basically ... the problem is the uncertainty and pure RNG of the whole thing. I don't mind some randomness in terms of either material acquisition, or final result ... but not both. The other major problem with engineers right now is storage solutions for modules and commodities. The lack of that is problematic as hell. That all being said ... the 1.6 side of things, namely the new missions and galaxy map, and even the AI post-fix ... all solid in my eyes. Really, it's the engineers and the elements around them that is blowing up in their face.
@UniversalSoldier3k
8 жыл бұрын
I am having the same issues with the engineers. When they came out I unlocked a few. Then I went back to performing long range transport missions in my Python. Buying the Anaconda was the ultimate reward for this. Now I'm back to working the BGS which offers nice difficulty, progression and rewards. :)
@SpaaaaceMaan
8 жыл бұрын
Great vid as always, I agree with you entirely. When the engineers were released and I had Horizons under my belt I rapidly lost interest after spending my whole first night trying to find materials for even one upgrade/progression. It took me 5 days until I found arsenic for my FSD upgrade, talk about bad luck, eh? Even then, that was 1 material. I'm currently working on the second material still, as I do not play all that much now. I prefer your first quick-fix over the second though :)
@FullBitGamer
8 жыл бұрын
I gave up on Elite: Dangerous about 5 months ago and have no regrets. The game just doesn't have anything special to me. FD is letting it fall apart, then and apparently now still. I still enjoy watching ObsidianAnt's videos to kind of see how things are going. And really it looks worse than ever.
@Xcom332
8 жыл бұрын
You are so right ;(
@choc113
8 жыл бұрын
I think your point about incremental progress is exactly right. I hope someone at Frontier see's this video.
@lazaros23
8 жыл бұрын
Right on! Great video from a man who greatly represents the community and certainly is noticed by frontier! Thank you for representing us and making our thoughts about the game being heard by frontier..
@n3rdm4n
8 жыл бұрын
An idea on how to fix the system is to open a market for materials. Each piece of Yttrium going for 1 million or whatever. Then you can go and mine for it, or trade for it, or whatever for it. Same with the data bits. That way you can do what you want, RES hunting or trading, and still do crafting. IDK why they didn't implement it like that in the first place.
@Storm_.
8 жыл бұрын
And on top of all this enemy ships seem to be getting a lot of these upgrades. The other day my friends Anaconda got destroyed from an interdiction by 1 shot.. no joke, 1 shot.
@Madhuntr
8 жыл бұрын
exactly what i was thinking. the very rare materials. ok they are very rare. But searching for hours and hours to find only one of them? way too rare. hate that too.
@MizaT11
8 жыл бұрын
Meanwhile I found like 5 unites of Yitrium within two hours, on a planet orbiting Betelgeuse. Not sure if I was lucky, or if that planet actually spawns it more frequently. But man, is the process so frustrating indeed when it takes it's damn time :/ I mean, even "Common" materials seem to rarely spawn.
@darthravadge4396
8 жыл бұрын
I have to agree O.A.My only issue with the engineers is the material gathering. As I watch and hear you talk about yttrium I am actually looking for it myself on Deciat 7B. Supposedly many players have had success here and I have found a few pieces here before. I'm now 12 hours into my search and have 2 yttrium.Now my plan is to use this yttrium for a mk4 FSD upgrade. I made one attempt already but the rng actually had the secondary effect of reducing the jump range of the fsd by impacting the optimal mass. The entire upgrade and a day worth of material gathering for nothing :(As for the topic of game depth I think that will come in time. I think of the engineers as more basic framework.Great job with channel,Keep up the good workCMDR Darth Ravadge
@kevg3563
8 жыл бұрын
Engineers is just another 'easy to implement stocking filler' like Wings & Powerplay. These minor intermediate updates were introduced to try to keep us happy while FD continue to develop other major updates like atmospheric planets, cities, comets, thargoids etc... In other words they were done to keep our interest in the game until the major updates come along.
@panko2848
8 жыл бұрын
but they have, for me at least, done the complete opposite. The annoyance at the Engineers, as well as all of the bugs I've encountered trying to do missions or just have fun on planetary surfaces has put me off the game as a whole, possibly for good. It's just so hard to start the game up knowing there is a good chance i will end up frustrated without having made notable progress.
@digiscream
8 жыл бұрын
There's another solution to this - get rid of the modification levels, and separate the materials into classes (which they already are - eg flawed/refined/exquisite focus crystals). Simply list material *types* for each mod, and the quality/rarity of the materials you give the engineer determines the outcome stats. Mods become easier to achieve, and there's a direct link between material rarity (ie the work you have to put in to collect them) and the end result. It also naturally gates the ultra-high-end mods (because they're as rare as the materials they require), yet still gives the player the sense that there's a precise link between what they're doing and what they're getting from it.
@GoateeH
8 жыл бұрын
Sound solid and considered response to the update. I Pretty much agree with all you have said and possibly some of the subtext; if I am reading it correctly. ED do seem to be tweaking the way engineers work but the double gateway issue means, for me at least, that level 3 upgrades are as far as I will go until they have stabilised the functionality: I am sure they will in time. My other concern is that in open play some players with lucky RND results can end up with rediculously over powered ships. My other views? Basically I would like the materials to be easier to find or at least easier to know where to look such as a detailed surface scan giving you a list of materials that can be found on landable planets with the surrounding rings to having the same materials, depending on ring type. Additionally I would like the engineers to be able to tweak upgrades so further "roles" will, even if only slightly, improve on the previous one so you can keep pushing towards the optimal result. I don't like the way it feels like rolling dice, it should feel like they are tinkering and improving your ship. To have incremental improvements would lead to better immersion in the ED world and make the whole process feel more interactive and worthwhile.
@StephenGoddard-MiisterSpiice
6 жыл бұрын
I have not used any engineers yet but I have been driving around on surfaces just to get the feel of the SRV. I have found ytrium on several occasions and have been hanging on to it to use later.
@sammorrow8420
4 жыл бұрын
Thank you RnG Jesus, engineer upgrades are no longer random results. However, filling up all ingredients still takes over 100 hours if you start from scratch unless you do some immersion breaking of logging out and back in or quiting to desktop and restarting the game to get things to respawn.
@Rydralain
8 жыл бұрын
Another possible idea to help reduce RNG on the materials side would be to implement material trading. Not player-player, since that's not really something we have yet at all, but if there was a way to trade, say 100 iron for 1 Yttrium, I'd totally take it. That would mitigate a lot of the issues with multiple bad rolls on the mat gathering side.
@bloodpythonkb
8 жыл бұрын
Spot on. i pretty much nerd raged trying to get a weapon special effect, 20 rolls to get one. Ive abandoned engineers and just gone back to playing normally. And thank you for pointing out the obvious about people saying it is meant to be non core game play. if that was the case why the hell did they market an entire expansion around it and show us how cool these mods are if we are not meant to be pursuing upgrades. I love the game and i can tolerate more then most but there is no doubt that expansions like this are not going to bring more people into the game..
@doppelganger9254
8 жыл бұрын
Finally! You made this video. I've been waiting for someone more prominent to speak about the issues with the Engineers. While this patch was delayed for "quality", I feel that it was rather far more neglected than any other patch so far. Even Powerplay was an attempt to make something new and interesting, even if it failed. But Engineers is just a shell of what it could have been. Thanks Obsidian! FD will probably notice this video
@Axeon
8 жыл бұрын
Okay Ant, allow me to thank you deeply. Looks like Frontier really listens to you! Today's newsletter mentioned upcoming changes, which are pretty much point-by-point what you suggested here! YAY! :D
@ravenwind1062
8 жыл бұрын
So you never grind, yet you spent several hours planetside in the SRV looking specifically for Yytrium. Isn't that grinding? You're not concerned with how long it takes to get the ENG Upgrades, but after 3 hours you felt like you had made no progress. So you are concerned with the time it takes. You want to feel like you made some progress on the task. You needed to collect 3 pieces of Yytrium for each roll you need at the ENG and you collected 3 pieces or enough for one roll. Isn't that incremental progress? Isn't that why we have grade 1- 5 upgrades. Now, don't get me wrong, I believe the ENGs need some serious tweaking and I think we are already seeing that with the help in finding MAT locations. that's a start but more needs to be done. If we are going to give feedback to FD we need to honest in what we are wanting however.
@ObsidianAnt
8 жыл бұрын
My point is that it took 3 hours to find 3 pieces of Yttrium. If I only play for 30 mins then I will likely get zero Yttrium. So no, that is not incremental progress. :)
@ravenwind1062
8 жыл бұрын
So once you find the right location you want increased spawn rates for rares. Ok but what's to stop people from farming way more than they need in a very short time and just going straight to Grade 4/5 upgrades. I guess I come from a WoW background and farming Rep with Factions for better gear. You had to kill faction enemies to get badges to drop randomly but here was the kicker, there was a limit to how many you could gather in a day. There were several levels of REP you could get from a faction with the best gear at the highest level. This system was designed to take you about two weeks to get the first level of REP and about 8-10 weeks to get the max. In Elite we seem to be burning to level 5 upgrades in a week or two. Some folks in just days. If that's what we want we need to tell FD to do away with Level 1-5 and just have Upgrades. In any case, you are right, being silent on the topic won't get us anywhere.
@ObsidianAnt
8 жыл бұрын
Yes, there are serious issues with that - which is why I touched on the gameplay mechanics in this video, but mentioned also that I want to talk about those separately at a later date. Way I see it, the "solutions", I mentioned in this video are just "quick fixes" which require little development time. But the bottom line is I feel the entire system needs reworking from the ground up, but that is extremely unlikely to happen.
@maecenus778
8 жыл бұрын
I've spent over 8 hours looking for Polonium on one of the Polonium planets mentioned by the game. I know how the scanner works, I've found probably 10 different metallic meteorites, not 1 polonium. 8 hours of game time and no progress toward anything, no credits earned. Only useless materials gathered.
@ravenwind1062
8 жыл бұрын
So this is all good stuff. Clearly Fdev wanted this process to take time and especially for Grade 5 to feel like an accomplishment, yet they gave us the ability to bypass 1-4 if we really want to. Mistake #1 Mistake #2 the Mat delivery system needs to be something different so you know you can make some progress by spending time at it but probably needs a daily limit or Grade Cooldown period to force you pace the upgrades as well as your expectations.
@MakoIIe
8 жыл бұрын
thanks for watching, and i catch u guys and girls next time :)
@markaudette7016
3 жыл бұрын
To be honest I don't bother with the Engineers. I find that my explorer ship with minimal light year range is more fun and challenging and I still traveled two or three thousand light-years out with no problems at all.
@eyemage
8 жыл бұрын
we really need clear information from frontier about what their intent was and what they will do to respond to these very clear and well thought out complaints for what we hope will be one of the best space sims in the market.
@starkiller3564
8 жыл бұрын
I just hope that patch 2.2 can turn things around for me
@jasonhallam2644
8 жыл бұрын
another solution would be to scrap the current system and have certain materials for higher level rolls of the dice, it could be a system that has when an engineer starts workin. on a module that rather than the roll of the dice gives you a weapon upgrade but also has the chance of destroying that module during the upgrade process, with higher level upgrades having an incrementally higher chance of destruction also with a pre requisite of having to have the previous upgtade before attempting the next
@hibiscus779
8 жыл бұрын
Very good video. The key problem is that they are trying to create reward based time sinks without giving us PVE content to give those time sinks meaning, while at the same time ignoring the gameplay mechanic shortcomings, such as no module and commodity storage (while requiring commodities for many upgrades) or ship delivery. The devs are not playing the game so they have no idea what is required.
@MrJohnnygo
8 жыл бұрын
I have over 800 hours on this game so far and enjoyed it immensely. However I have spent weeks trying to find polonium. Even on planets that the DWE listed as having Polonium, none was to be found after four hours searching. I did find 4 units of Yttrium on my own and got a decent grade 3 FSD upgrade. I went back to those planets for more and never found another single piece. I agree with making things 'challenging' but 'next to impossible' is just plain frustrating. It's almost as if the developers don't want us to enjoy the game. Also, in your last post you mentioned the News panel at the Engineers base had a section listing which planets the materials could be found on. Haven't seen that anywhere yet. Is that in the 2.2 upgrade?
@Jokerlokka
7 жыл бұрын
Another way to fix the issue with the rng would be implementing a way to Upgrade the materials to a higher grade ( for example at a 2:1 ratio) they can still keep the rng that way , you gett progress and it also means a way to gett rid of lower tier stuff.
@Mark_o00Six00o
8 жыл бұрын
I have no problem with the material collection, but I'm not a fan of the RNG in the upgrades, a guarantee of a good upgrade (as Obsidian stated) would solve the majority of the problems in my opinion. And yeah a place in the station to store your engineers commodities would be nice
Пікірлер: 662