Soren Johnson and Sid Meier respectively said: ” given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game,” and that, therefore, “one of the responsibilities of designers is to protect the player from themselves.” I agree with these takes, but... That's the reason why every class feels the same and why the game loop is so repetitive nowadays.
@MaSTARMedia
3 жыл бұрын
Great video. I really felt this when you said "But you're not a mage. You're a warrior with a druid alt" Hit too close to home!
@Titan990
3 жыл бұрын
I never thought to see you here Mastar
@rostyloco1
3 жыл бұрын
I am hunter with a druid alt, only guy on server who offer lv 1- 20 boosting 2 hours 120k xp/hr at around 80g/hr. now no-one does the 1-20 boost.
@peterkroger7112
3 жыл бұрын
Exactly what I thought, too.
@ahahahahahaahahaa
3 жыл бұрын
Buy gold or lvl a mage and stfu
@UAEcableRider
3 жыл бұрын
@Gaius Julius Caesar theres a trick where if a hunter/warlock pet kills a mob with a low level in the party they get the full xp
@thenerdbeast7375
3 жыл бұрын
You can remake the game but you can't unmake the modern player.
@Brumfield85
3 жыл бұрын
Truuuue. Hit the nail on the head.
@BarokaiRein
3 жыл бұрын
GDKP has always been a thing it's not a modern phenomena.
@PretentiousLatinName
3 жыл бұрын
The sad truth
@Random_Person.-.
3 жыл бұрын
It's always been like this. Why do you think retail went pay to win in the first place. Blizzard knew people would do shit like this anyway so they figured that they should be the ones to make money off of it rather than some random guy in China.
@kadashy6072
3 жыл бұрын
Exactly. There's a reason MMO's have died over the last few years and it isn't just because WoW turned to shit.
@laius6047
3 жыл бұрын
Most people just forgot why they play the game in the first place.
@stonemove4207
3 жыл бұрын
took me 102days of gametime to finally ask myself, why am i playing. had 1 warlock lvl 60 only. 5k gold +- left for extras. Had all my big bags, i had all epic mounts i could use. (beside raptor,panther and death charger). I lived phase 2 at lvl 55 going to BRD for months aboard the ghost train. I wiped to MC 2 weeks in a row before meeting my 2nd and last Guild. i ran 485 Dire maul east runs, i saw Emeriss and killed it !! I SUMMONED OMEN , BUT COULDNT GET THE BACK UP TO GET HIM DOWN. He will be my only World Boss undefeated. Then.... i made it to Hyjal, i swam with Nessy , i went to Alcaz Island on my own before AQ gets opened. I farmed 17 000 linen clothes in Deadmines for the AQ war effort event. I ran AQ40, 20, few times..... then i came back online one day and Deathrolled my gold in 4 streak lose my 5000k gold left was gone. I felt totally accomplished about living the MMO/WOW experience, that experienced i choose to avoid 15 years ago. I lived it. Loved it. But love is like a fart, it fades away. And if you try to force it it might become SHIT. Before it turns my WoW classic experience into SHIT. I Crafted MECHANICAL YETIS for my Good boys Guildies so they can have a souvenir of me. . . . . . . To this day, i will have played only ONE MMO , ONE CHARACTER IN ONE FUCKING WORLD. I wonder if STONEMOVE, the Gnome Warlock, will ever get back in business.. . . . . . Im afraid that the game will suck if i go back to play
@Deezuzjohn
3 жыл бұрын
TRUTH!!!!!!!!
@Deezuzjohn
3 жыл бұрын
@@stonemove4207 well worded
@justinarmstrong7532
3 жыл бұрын
@@stonemove4207 There isn't a zg panther mount in classic. There is a zg tiger mount.
@fizzlebank
3 жыл бұрын
@@justinarmstrong7532 Bro everyone knew what he meant. Most irrelevant comment ive ever read.
@alberthcuayla1587
3 жыл бұрын
Classic is the best *Reality Check* that the game wasn't the problem. The problem are the players. Why there is so many WTS, because people buy it.
@btjones874
3 жыл бұрын
But why is it the players? Has the industry created this mindset? I think its the same people(mostly) who played the game in 2004 when we didn't have these issues.
@Williaem00
3 жыл бұрын
@@btjones874 it’s the same players playing who played back in 2004 but what is different now is those players have grown up in the Internet era where information is easily available and everyone is connected.
@Davivd2
3 жыл бұрын
I agree with you. But TBH Blizzard has dropped the ball on botting. I watched this guy with Chinese characters for a name farm the same spot for months. I reported him every day for 3 days when I was questing near him, and everytime I would go back to that area to farm for cloth, he was there. Just botting away. Not saying a word, doing his programmed routine. This went on for the entire time I played Classic (2 and a half months) The earliest that I played WoW was TBC and I can't remember ever seeing a single bot out in the open world. Even the gold sellers wouldn't last more than an hour without getting banned.
@alberthcuayla1587
3 жыл бұрын
*Sighs* Even though that most of vegans try to push you into veganism, you don't become vegan if you don't want to. Vanilla WoW was created with the idea that players should need gold for everything. Repair, Change Talents, Professions, Basic Mounts, Level Up, etc. If you wanna blame the industry blame 2004's Blizzard and the NO CHANGES communities.
@Feast_
3 жыл бұрын
@@btjones874 Garrosh said it best. Times Change
@Banana_Zach
3 жыл бұрын
classic wow is my latest example about how other people are the worst part of life
@Quitarstudent
3 жыл бұрын
classic wow is an example why you cant let ppl be free in real world
@Rare987
3 жыл бұрын
Or that companies and corporate people are the worst part of life? If blizzard banned bots then prices wouldnt be so high that you would need to farm more hrs than is possible in the week. Everyone is looking at this video and going "yeah hes right its the players." But what about the botters and blizzard doing nothing about it? what about the prices going higher and higher ever since the bots weren't getting banned? Its like you all are just mindless brains watching a youtube video and saying "yes sir you are correct and id follow your word to the end because you are the youtuber and youtubers know all"
@calronkeltaran493
3 жыл бұрын
@@Rare987 sure it is always more easy to look away and seach for mistakes from someone else. Yes Blizz could take more effort to punish botting and it would help a lot if they did, but in the end, if everyone would just be nice and not abuse everything they find, we wont need blizz to interfere. the root of evil here are the players, punishing botters is "just" a reaction to it to keep it under control. everyone here, who just buys gold and go on to buy full BIS gear from this gold is part of this problem. thats the ONLY reason this happens in the first place. another example: if you have a high crime rate in a city because you don´t have police presence, is it the fault of the police force or of the criminals? everyone says that he is a good person, but deep down, humans tend to be the worst and it takes a great amount of effort to actualy be the nice guy everyone claims he is. so to end this test of mine: if everyone would just play to get the nice classic experience everyone claims he wants to have, then we don´t need blizzard to permawatch for bots, because they would not exist. because just throwing money at some chinese farmers to get bis gear is not the classic experience, right?
@Rare987
3 жыл бұрын
@@calronkeltaran493 So you're saying prices for things going higher than what it would originally be because of bots and players in reaction can't keep up is in turn the fault of the players? If the bots werent there the prices wouldnt be so damn high that it would be unreachable for most to get bare essentials. You look at it like this is out of humans being evil instead of a reaction created by an event.
@calronkeltaran493
3 жыл бұрын
@@Rare987 somewhat, yes. It is more of a "every man for himself" thing. If everyone, or at least most of the players would play like it is meant to be, the prices would stay normal, yes. But it is more easy to just let the bot farm while I sleep or at work. when I get back, I have a bank full of stuff. You could as well use a cheatcode to just spawn all the herbs and 100k gold. but what do you read in the forums? "omg classic is so much harder, you need to work for everything you need" and these same pll downloard a bot that does everything for them on the very next day. Because in the end they don´t want to work for their stuff, they just want to have it. even the most advanced gear like Rang 14 pvp and raiding endgear, you just bot it (PvP) or pay gold to get it (PvE) wich in turn was also aquired by botting. and what do they use all this amazing gear for? ganking lvl 40th in stranglethorn. if humans aren´t messed up, how does this happen so frequently?
@viciouswindstalkers
3 жыл бұрын
Before classic: I miss the old WoW, the work, the grind was hard, but felt good. Now: Ug, the grind, the bots, ain't got time for this.
@christianholbrook2686
3 жыл бұрын
I love WoW but I hate WoW players sometimes. This has been happening since vanilla. First it's "Oh we want flying mounts cause travel is too long." Then immediately it's followed by, "Get rid of flying it ruined the game." WoW fans get everything they ask for and hate it as soon as they get it.
@petersander5802
3 жыл бұрын
I Saw a few dwarven hunters in duskwood Today while I was doing the spider Quest
@luiscastro6204
3 жыл бұрын
@@christianholbrook2686 That's because there are so many players that no matter the decision, there will be people who oppose it.
@AimRobot
3 жыл бұрын
They arent really winning anything, so its more like Pay To Not Play.
@Bargadiel
3 жыл бұрын
Pay to Not Play is so brilliantly true. WoW Classic players swarmed the servers in droves, complained and petitioned until Blizzard made it real, then a vast majority literally pay real world money to play the game the least amount possible so they can raid log. INCREDIBLE GAMEPLAY
@jackmarsk8459
3 жыл бұрын
It's almost like most people who play games nowadays care more about the "clout" that comes with having a bunch of gold and epic gear and to achieve that status as fast as possible (ie. real world money), but couldn't care less about genuinely earning it by...actually PLAYING the video game in the first place? Not to mention they couldn't care less about how it affects *other players'* game experience as well. Everything has to be spoonfed to them; gods forbid that someone might be challenged, have the possibility to fail, and take extra time to learn to get better when playing a game right? Big developers and corporations in general are just as guilty for perpetuating this belief that players should feel inclined to pay a bunch of extra money just to get "ahead of the curve" instead of spending time to get better at a game and gather resources. If you don't have time to get better at a game and gather resources/power and would simply rather swipe a credit card to gain progression, then literally why play at all? I don't see the point of paying for a subscription for a game and paying even MORE on top of that if it essentially means just taking a monetary shortcut to the finish line. When Activision introduced the Paid Level Boost feature in WoD, that is when the RPG/MMO genre as a whole lost a part of its soul that would never return.
@insidetrip101
3 жыл бұрын
rofl so true.
@insidetrip101
3 жыл бұрын
@@jackmarsk8459 I agree with you. I actually like the idea of a game where I'm not on top and there are people that have invested so much more than me. Its one of the main reasons why I chose to play a healer--not much of a reason to go crazy on consumables (unless you're doing insane speed running strats)--and I get to support people that have put an ass load of time into the game and still make a rather large difference. Its a lot of fun in my opinion.
@markblaze4909
3 жыл бұрын
A player that buys gold then can afford consumables flasks crafted items repairs mounts that they otherwise wouldnt have in the raid they then help others in a guild get items they wouldn’t get. Exponentially this boosts everyone on he server and ruins he fdifficulty of the game. It also makes the success of guilds meaningless.
@user-gj8xb8uv4n
3 жыл бұрын
Oh the irony. Retail got rid of grinding (well hardcore grinding that is) and got life quality features. Players wanted it hardcore so they wanted classic. They got classic and what did they do to it? They turned it into retail again. Talk about people knowing what they want.
@Yomom12388
3 жыл бұрын
What people wanted was to try and feel like a teenager again because they’re living shitty adult lives now. Turns out that’s impossible. Eventually gonna have to face that those days are over and done with.
@JustSkram
3 жыл бұрын
People love what they think they remember, not what actually happened.
@jamespwns
3 жыл бұрын
I guess Blizz WAS right this time "You think you do, but you dont"
@kuzuthunder1964
3 жыл бұрын
@Bigdog Billdog Yes, that is true but pretty much everyone I talked with uses stuff like questie, autopilot e.t.c. All the addons, turns the game to retail. I also hate how all the “elite players” in retail lets addons play the game for them instead of actually playing it. They turn the games into a chore, we humans want to get rid of chores, so we use bots, money and stupid ass stuff like that and ruin the experience.
@CrusaderGabriel
3 жыл бұрын
Completely agreed, I’ve jumped into classic every once in a while and I do enjoy to play it hardcore like the old days, rolled a paladin because that’s my main in retail and I’m about 3 months (on and off) barely reached 40 by questing, running a couple dungeons with random people and stuff like that; I did got a couple early levels boosted tho by random mages who were boosting their alts/guildies and needed more ppl, but haven’t spent gold in boosts so far... Sadly reality hits me when I remember paladin is one of the most (if not the absolute most) useless classes in classic and despite people being ultra optimized and proving vanilla content wasn’t hard I won’t even have a chance to do endgame or other cool stuff at max level because people still are elitists jerks that play the game as if it was a world championship or something and can’t afford to have classes that aren’t mages/warrior/priests... so I go back to retail where I can at least have access to cool stuff with the class I chose
@CroneLife1
3 жыл бұрын
I've often said that MMORPG's are great games ruined by the majority of the people who play them.
@jurgenbrenes8332
3 жыл бұрын
Well maybe if the company that created the game gave a fxxk about the game. They would fix it.
@CroneLife1
3 жыл бұрын
@@jurgenbrenes8332 , I can't fault that logic. All of them have a toxic element. Out of the three big ones that I play regularly (WoW, FFXIV, and ESO), I find FFXIV has the least toxic community, ESO is next, and WoW is last. I understand they can't police everyone's behavior - lack of staffing for the purpose, and the negative impact it would have on game immersion for other players to always have an active in-game SWAT squad. But some companies seem to do better than others, for sure.
@amethonys2798
3 жыл бұрын
@@jurgenbrenes8332 I mean any sort of "changes" Blizzard would ever want to push forth would get instantly shut down by #nochanges even to this day.
@Luuniixo
3 жыл бұрын
@@CroneLife1 what about guild wars ? :-(
@CroneLife1
3 жыл бұрын
@@Luuniixo , I said "Out of the three big ones that I play..." Guild Wars is no longer big and I seldom play it anymore. Same for GW2, which I loved.
@MrWobbles
3 жыл бұрын
I mean its not the players fault blizzard has allowed botting to completely ruin the quality of the economies on every server? I play classic everyday, have herb 300 on 2 60's and I've seen 2 black lotus in the past 2 months (And i've looked for them some nights for hours..) It's come to a point where farming is almost obsolete, you can't compete against gold farmers and might as well join 'em...
@dizzywhite4209
3 жыл бұрын
i never found a back lotus lol, so i became a stockade booster with my warrior xD
@DaKdawg
3 жыл бұрын
That's the way of it. If you can't beat them, join them. If there's no negatives or drawbacks, why not?
@ungeimpfterrusslandtroll7155
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah and i found maybe 120+ by now on the largest german pvp server. More than 60 before the nerf, i saw many bots but never a specific lotus bot. I did my rounds in silithus harvesting arcane crystals and lotus at the same time mainly deep in the night/morning every third week. When people say they never found a lotus it's that they in 99% cases never really tried hard enough. Sometimes i make 3h runs and don't see one but then i get three one after another. If you do it consistently you will get them if you do a few hours here and there, there is good chance you won't never see one.
@ondrejgotz3414
3 жыл бұрын
BEFORE the nerf on black lotus spawn, I legitimately farmed 4 stacks of black lotuses, thinking I'd sell them just before AQ and then Blizzard announced the change and I lost 10k gold within an hour. But I can't bring myself to believing that people are telling the truth when they tell me they can't find a BL after 10 hours of trying after increased spawn rate. I once farmed on weekend and had Silithus timer and found 9 BL in a night. Also was common for me to duo hunt with s SP friend.
@tristnal
3 жыл бұрын
Sounds like you missed tyhe entire point of the video. When you stop buying gold from the farmers, they don't continue operating.
@antipathy17
3 жыл бұрын
"Most players don''t want to farm anymore". Botting has made farming so god damn fruitless that it's easier to work the 9-5 and buy masses of gold. I don't mind spening 4 hours a day farming 5 days a week. I do mind that if I wanted to do so in classic, the bots have taken control of all resources and I can't even come close to keeping up. I didn't want to buy gold... As someone who has 40 hours a week free to play wow, I wouldn't mind farming. It's just not worked out as it was originally intended. I'm not going to have a chicken or egg argument.
@lostelegy528
3 жыл бұрын
The complete lack of moderation killed my desire to play less than 2 months in and is the reason I won’t return for tbc. I love the game, but you can only do so much as a single player surrounded by bots and people who are trying to relive their childhood dreams of being the “badass” rank 14 they saw by any means possible. Honestly, the complete lack of care for their paying customers says all I need to know about the company.
@macten6819
3 жыл бұрын
I feel the same man, herbing in open world on my server is practically pointless as well. Only way it is consistent is doing Dire Maul East runs on my rogue.
@fergin4979
3 жыл бұрын
But i mean your problem is solved if either bots get banned effectively somehow, or people tough it up and refuse to buy gold and make bots useless.
@cautarepvp2079
3 жыл бұрын
40 hours farming wow? Dude just do something else rather than grinding lol
@CogniVision
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah, the problem is you literally can't farm in the game. You have no choice but to buy gold, or play a mage and sell boosts. The amount you can farm with any other class can't keep up with the inflated market. I'm always so broke that I literally have people telling me to buy gold...
@Gorrash
3 жыл бұрын
Classic its ruined by "meta" , as everygame nowadays
@someone-ji2zb
3 жыл бұрын
Very true, but the "meta" is also somewhat controllable by the devs of most games. No game will be perfect, but classic is a good example of how things could have been controlled. Example. When people were first playing vanilla for about 6-7 months, the debuff limit was 8, hit chance was not a stat, dungeon loot was in its garbage state (certain shadowcraft pieces had INT for example) and the old talents were weak. So what happened when people started hitting 60 in classic with 16 debuff slots, hit chance on gear, buffed gear and the new talents? Dungeons required little CC to none (depending on tank), MC was an absolute, mindless joke, and BWL came out half a year later with the exact same issues due to when it was released back then. So while a bit awkward, they could have still recreated the pacing of balance changes in regards to what raids were available at the time. This would have made it so the meta was never stagnant, DPS took a back seat in MC to simply surviging, and teamwork demanded a bit more accountability. So the devs certainly (likely more on Blizzard's executive side rather than devs) had potential to make things better. Now think of TBC classic... they will likely release 2.4 on release. That means the meta will be pally tanks > all in dungeons by a metric landslide yet you still need 1 warrior for MT raids (lol... i can't even imagine many will play prot warr in a 2.4 release for 2~ years). Heroics and tier 4 raids will be in their 2.4 nerfed states. Attunements will be removed, meaning less demand to run heroics in general. The meta will be one way for 2 years~. Or... they could NOT release 2.4 on TBC classic release, and progressively balance the game as they did back then to match the content out at the time. The meta can be controlled by the devs in this case.
@kaltaron1284
3 жыл бұрын
I can only talk about Guild Wars 2 but there is a meta and for certain activities like raids, (high level) fractals or strike missions it's expected that you play meta. Unless you know what you're doing and what you're doing works at least as good as meta. If it does, I've never met a group that was adamant that you should play your build not like you want to but according to meta. OTOH there's a reason why certain builds are meta and until you have enough understanding to make your own ones, you help your group more by trying to follow the meta.
@danthompson1131
3 жыл бұрын
I can easily say as someone from a PvP server with a huge GDKP community, it's definitely exactly as you describe it in this video, they even seed each group with an ungeared guildless warrior with 20k to bid up anything worth anything. I've been blacklisted by them for not buying items at insane prices that they call cheap, when i'm blowing full consumes and topping their parse charts.. While they bot EPL on 5 accounts and "lead" the raid. Classic is in a sad sad state for the OG style player.
@fergin4979
3 жыл бұрын
I mean it sounds like you should get in a guild. Or pugs that dont do gdkp
@Hauntedundead
3 жыл бұрын
Agreed. Stopped buying Flasks as a mage because they are too expensive (fyi I don't boost or solo dung cuz I can't be assed to respect every week). Then if I find myself awake at an odd time and can't sleep I just log on and farm some Plaguebloom, got one stack in maybe two hours? Enough to keep me going until I need a new enchant... It is insane what prices there are. The market is essentially holding you hostage because people keep buying items at a higher price than necessary.
@tristansweden2136
3 жыл бұрын
Got brutality braces today for 100g in classic. It was awesome.
@Drain_Life_Archive
3 жыл бұрын
GDKP is the worst. My realm didn't have any but I know others did. It's a system that rewards buying gold over anything else and easily exploited as you've pointed out.
@comq01
3 жыл бұрын
@@tristansweden2136 yeah its kinda cheap now, but other items like accuracia and OSG are going for over 10k gold. Lets not even talk about dft/cts and aq40 loot.
@Cynicallycynical
3 жыл бұрын
Got my Paladin to 60 in 4 weeks spent about another week seeing the enormous amount of time required and said fuck that. Games should be treated like pubs and closed for a few hours a day.
@mcfarvo
3 жыл бұрын
I did the 40man raids back in vanilla. It was fun, but I had the most fun in my 10man prog raid team in WotLK. (I never played any expansion beyond that.) Instead of reliving the raid scene in Classic, I took my time and got all 9 classes to lvl60 and now I've got a lvl42 Kargoz HC toon I mess around on. It fits easily into my busy RL. To each their own, but I'm still having fun after a year!
@dani-uf1eo
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah wow not being enjoyable anymore. I want to quest, partner with people, explore. But it is impossible to get in a group nowadays. Everyone is boosting and paying for their items rather than winning them. This is why we can't have nice things
@Brekner
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah that's because what you want only happens on the first few months of a new server.
@Fabriciod_Crv
3 жыл бұрын
@@Brekner which is why leveling in retail is the way it is.
@SaltyChris951
3 жыл бұрын
its a 15 year old game. no one wants to farm lmao. wake up
@FlabbyX2C
3 жыл бұрын
I’ve started a character doing the Hardcore Challenge, really gets the game back where its supposed to be imo.
@scar9867
3 жыл бұрын
Hardcore challenge may be what you are looking for bud. And you can even get in a discord with other people who are doing it and make friends.
@TheSchantz3
3 жыл бұрын
We're at a point where gold is pretty hard to make but everything is stupid expensive, at least on Faerlina. A single night of raiding can easily cost over 200g, and we raid twice a week. 45g for a stack of greater shadow protection pots? 32 gold for a stack of greater arcane elixirs? All on top of barely being able to herb in the open world? The situation is absurd.
@janboiii9759
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah of course. Because people buy gold.
@fergin4979
3 жыл бұрын
Yea buying gold is the problem, not the solution.
@TheSchantz3
3 жыл бұрын
@@fergin4979 The solution is to ban the bots, which isn't happening. Blizzard also isn't cracking down on gold buying, so people aren't going to stop. The solution requires Blizzard's intervention one way or another, and they aren't intervening. Most people are presented with the choice of buying gold or not being able to consume for raid, this isn't a situation they should be put in. Many would not be gold buying if the situation wasn't allowed to get this bad.
@ethantrout1524
3 жыл бұрын
Hey I haven’t played Wow in a longgg time. Why does raiding cost you so much money? Shouldn’t you be making money?
one of my guildies buys gold and i asked why they do it and they said they can work 2 hours, get $30, and buy like 1500 gold but theres no one on earth who can farm 1500 gold in 2 hours
@Nurofaen
3 жыл бұрын
Agreed.
@michaelebach9707
3 жыл бұрын
Report that piece of sht guildie
@nightowl8387
3 жыл бұрын
@@michaelebach9707 not everyone has time to farm gold dude. People have lives
@michaelebach9707
3 жыл бұрын
@@nightowl8387 that old chestnut again. If you dont have the time, dont play
@YogibearXXL
3 жыл бұрын
@@michaelebach9707 thats a stupid thing to say , so dont play a game if u cant grin 10+ hours a day ?
@furikurifan5
3 жыл бұрын
An under-developed anti-botting team and a commitment to banning in waves that come too infrequently has led to this. If the bot gets it's ROI in a week, then any ban wave longer than a week is going to be a profit for botters. The more bots there are, the more 24/7 contesting of resources, making farming much harder. Back in the day bots weren't nearly as advanced, and you had to pay the box price for the game, making each account cost 400% more than they do today to make. Blizz has made the margins for gold farmers significantly better this time around, without compensating for the 15 years of technological advancement bot makers have had.
@Setnja92
3 жыл бұрын
This is probably the most accurate description of source of problems in Classic. And i feel kinda stupid, because it didn't occur to me myself :D Botters really do have 15 years lead on Activision Blizzard. And it doesn't looks like, that AB is going to catch them.
@Mammel248
3 жыл бұрын
Keep reporting bots. They do get banned. Every time I find a bot in the open world (and sadly, there's a lot of them so it's not hard...) I report them, and I get one of those "Thank you for reporting" customer supports daily. Sometimes multiples. The reports do help.
@Sebastian-nq7qm
3 жыл бұрын
@@Mammel248 when will they get banned? In 3 month with the next wave when they already ruined enough and the botters made so much money that they dont care anymore and just use one of their already created backup accounts?
@Mammel248
3 жыл бұрын
@@Sebastian-nq7qm the message is automated and gets sent the exact moment the ban/suspension is put on the reported account. so when you get a message like that action has been taken
@Sebastian-nq7qm
3 жыл бұрын
@@Mammel248 Sure, that's the reason why you have the same bots in strath for example day by day even if they get reported
@rotobracca
3 жыл бұрын
I recently found out that most of my guild buy 1-2k gold every couple of months, ruined my opinion of them, I work hard to earn my gold and rarely spend on anything, but having them flask every week whilst I only do it for our dmf/speed runs always made it feel that I wasn't putting in the effort that they were
@adam_bbing
3 жыл бұрын
Well think, average WoW classic player is probably in mid 20s to mid 30s, work full time, play on off time, they can work 5 hours of OT one week and that gives them enough $$ to buy 5k gold. 5 hours of in game work isn't going to give you 5k gold. Prices have been so inflated that it is impossible to keep up with the constant price increases unless you start to play 24/7 due to botting.
@2xsumsaR
3 жыл бұрын
I really loved the first 8 months of wow But then the ‘modern’ player mentality emerged, the minmaxing and the P2W way of playing
@koreyp360
3 жыл бұрын
Played classic for about a year straight to see this in full effect... One of a few reasons I left the game till tbc... Only a matter of time that the classic community ruins what we fought for.. Let's get back to reality boys please..
@themukbros8518
3 жыл бұрын
Brah, same thing will happen in TBC (be real). And accept it. Or... just do it and feel less shitty about it lol
@StizzardLizzard
3 жыл бұрын
@@themukbros8518 Hard to boost in TBC
@WillowGreenheart
3 жыл бұрын
Who cares if everything is ez af in Classic? Just play like 100% casual. This is classic not retail lol.
@jarlfisk
3 жыл бұрын
It's not the classic community it's the retail community that joined classic that ruined it together with blizz
@Trazynn
3 жыл бұрын
TBC will be worse with arena boosts.
@Revinance88
3 жыл бұрын
Now, just imagine the impact of systems like these and what people do within them in real life.
@DojuOG
3 жыл бұрын
That's the interesting point to me also, It's complete market manipulation.
@tristnal
3 жыл бұрын
Been saying it since the forums for Classic went up prior to release, the worst part about Classic was ALWAYS the playerbase. They create their own issues, make excuses and blame Blizzard. I was excited at the prospect of TBC coming, but I gaurantee the same community will ruin it too.
@jarlfisk
3 жыл бұрын
It's the retail community... We never had these problems on p-servers.
@tristnal
3 жыл бұрын
@@jarlfisk Every private server had massive issues with gold sellers, including some servers that were splitting profits with the gold sellers. Stop blaming retail players for your shitty garbage behaviour. You classic shills need a new scape goat, because that one never held water.
@jarlfisk
3 жыл бұрын
@Kokainuser I don't have any comments for retail people like you. Us true classic people know how it is. Have a good day sir. Bye.
@tristnal
3 жыл бұрын
@@jarlfisk LMAO, translation - I'm a dense dumb mother that refuses anything except for the delicate false reality I've created for myself!
@lisavauhti7675
3 жыл бұрын
Hopefully enemies in outland dungeons are about the same as on unofficial servers. And without stupidly broken pathing that makes soloing them impossible. If somebody multiboxes then it's good for him.
@mduffrules
3 жыл бұрын
6:51 is exactly how my thought process works. If anyone was farming 10-20k gold legitimately, save being a complete AH wizard (there are a lot fewer of these than you think), it would take tens to hundreds of hours of game time at least. And to drop all that gold on one item? There's just no way.
@KVPMD
3 жыл бұрын
I got over 10k in TBC and over 100k in WotLK. I lost 30k in the Inscription crash (Blizz increased the droprate after a week to a totally insane level). I bought the Tundra mammoth mount in the days. Getting gold was hard enough for me to wait with getting the mount until my rep was exalted to save (16k instead of 18k). I was one of the richest on server and surely the richest in guild (btw mostly from Gems and disenchanting of jewelcrafting weapons). Never ever would anyone who gets gold by selling, buying or crafting give 50k away for an item. 1k ok, that is already insane. 50k in Classic is obviously wrong.
@comq01
3 жыл бұрын
Onslaught girdle went for 16k on a gdkp run yesterday. Totally insane
@KindaJewish
3 жыл бұрын
"Do you ever have that one channel that's recommended and you watch their stuff but you arent subscribed to them" I feel personally attacked
@jimbo9305
3 жыл бұрын
One? You mean all the channels I watch. +_+
@stanleyparks
3 жыл бұрын
DFT sold on my server for 40k gold. I don't think they grinded that...
@Ky-vv8nj
3 жыл бұрын
Same. But they had their guild buy it for him because he was a main tank or something was his excuse.
@burakkar1068
3 жыл бұрын
i dont think they buy with real money tho. with mage boosting u can earn crazy amounts of gold. 40 k gold equals only 2-3 weeks boosting.
@Tobias.d
3 жыл бұрын
32k yesterday in a gkp I was in. Split after bwl was 1500ish each. Crazy
@burakkar1068
3 жыл бұрын
@John Smitty i was one of them, with 2 mage 50 instance per day. i spend all my gold to gear up my main.
@Gregzoid
3 жыл бұрын
@John Smitty Bro couple months ago when i got my alt to 60 I had a friend boosting me in ZG and everytime he'd have 2-3 others paying him 20g every what 10 mins? Boosting is that lucrative. Maybe not anymore now cause the game is dying but it used to be.
@Predat0r004
3 жыл бұрын
WillE, I'd like to ask you something - as English is not my mother tongue I may have misunderstood the entire video :D I remember back in April and May, I used to farm Raptors in Arathi Highlands with my warrior to make food from their Raptor Flesh and Eggs, but occasionally they dropeed Raptor Hide. Now, on my server one could sell Raptor Hide for around 75 silver (I don't know how real that is, but people bought it, and it worked for about a month for me). I made quite the economy with this: I got what I wanted - much needed food - and also got quite rich off the back of it, I made tons of gold with this method, and surprisingly, the cost for raptor hide didn't inflate that much, and at certain days it even deflated. Then I had to end my sub for a month and when I came back in June, my first act was to maniacally try to sell my stacks of Raptor Hide on the AH. What I found on the other hand was one single person put Raptor Hide on the AH for 1 silver and 39 copper. Lots of it. I mean, like 1-200 items, all from the same character, all for 1 silver and 39 copper. This actually heartbroke me. I built up my economy around farming raptors - don't question it, it was worth it for me :D - and even back then I thought it could have been a bot. What I'd like to ask is, do you think it could have been? Or am I just really missing the entire point, and talking about something completely unrelated?
@TheForrescik
3 жыл бұрын
This is why modern looter games don't allow any sort of trading between players (or are very limited) and currencies like gold are really meaningless. It might sound bad on the surface because developers have full 100% control over the game economy but it really means that they can avoid situations like this.
@Dukenukem
3 жыл бұрын
Well, if you monopolize the trade to be the only seller its called "cutting the competition" not "Beeing good developer"
@akhsdenlew1861
3 жыл бұрын
lets be honest, Gold holding such a signifcant power is not healthy for today's standards.. If u notice, gold is loosing a lot of power even from TBC... and in wotlk gold is like.. ALMOST useless.
@zivkobabz
3 жыл бұрын
i mean ... that's not really right ... path of exile allows trading of anything between players but it's not a pvp game or a showoff game it's more of a solo multiplayer online game so that might be the big difference
@woollerland
3 жыл бұрын
Ffxiv is like this. Money is only useful for roleplay house development. Everything seems alot fairer tbh.
@drayle71
3 жыл бұрын
i know a guy who is a decent player in retail he is generally in guilds that are top 200 EU raid rankings. He is also playing classic and is buying gold almost every week or two from the same group. They apparently have so many accounts including ones they don't actually bot on and just use to store gold that the bans apparently haven't ever disrupted his ability to buy gold in classic. He also has worked as a booster to earn gold in retail and its the same problem of WTS if the market wasn't so big for it in either version game it wouldn't be such an issue.
@themukbros8518
3 жыл бұрын
Good for him! Buy gold .. nothing wrong with it. I do it all the time lol
@madrox4132
3 жыл бұрын
This is really common, and gets more common the higher up you go.
@Emajenus
3 жыл бұрын
Why does he need to buy gold every week? If you buy 5kg or so you'll have enough consumes for a couple of months at least. I play a warr in a high end guild, and I spend around 3-4kg to fill my bank alt with consumes for future raid. I need to replenish maybe every 10 weeks or so. What is he doing with weekly purchases?
@drayle71
3 жыл бұрын
@@Emajenus honestly i don't know, he is someone i know through other people so i talk to him in discord and he comes on our ach runs and did M+ with him but we aren't close. I know atleast at one point he was getting every class boosted to max and then getting them all bis gear boosted. I assume through things like gdkp which with current prices he must be spending a lot
@drayle71
3 жыл бұрын
@@themukbros8518 the thing is the amount of gold he is buying does seem a bit insane at this point buying stuff every week. He started by buying small amounts he boosted in BFA so was using that to buy tokens so he was just spending a bit more then he would have been spending on the game so like £12-20. I dont know how much is buying but he was buying double that easy by the end of bwl/ start of Ahn qiraj gdkp and he kept going. I don't know if these are large numbers because i don't know much about the gold buying scene but this seems quite extreme to me.
@Sxnderjyden
3 жыл бұрын
This is why tbc needs to start from lvl. 1 so we can have 2 month of decent play time.
@Minimeister317
3 жыл бұрын
Indeed.
@kyle3077
3 жыл бұрын
Oh god please no... wipe all my gold and anything that's not soulbound but god don't make me level again
@kylesavage4525
3 жыл бұрын
But then it will be a long time until we get a feeling of actual tbc. Personally i don't really mind bu there are a lot of people who have leveled up alts and who won't be willing to do so again. I'd rather start at 58 or just continue with the same characters but with very very little gold and consumables available to transfer to the new server to prevent the complete fuck up of the wow economy from the start. Also blizz needs to come up with a way to deal with all the bots otherwise it's just a matter of time for tbc classic to be just like classic.
@Sxnderjyden
3 жыл бұрын
If you do not want to lvl new chr are you really sure that shadowlands would not be a better game for you? It is all about late game and if you do not want lvl you can just buy lvl boost. I wanner bet you also use addons then, make what made the old games difference from the new. No mystik in the game just doing the same tasks allways in the best way to avoid playing the game. In the end give bots a market again.
@Sxnderjyden
3 жыл бұрын
@@kylesavage4525 this would make the problem that he talks about start Day 1. If we start on lvl 1 the bots will take a long time befor they can make real gold.
@maxdepinho3650
3 жыл бұрын
I'll tell you why this happens, you see, it's hard for people from the first world to understand but in countries like Venezuela, wow gold is worth waaaaay more than their currencies, and their minimum wages for regular jobs are absolute garbage, so they make mages in wow, farm gold and sell it, it's not fun, it's not healthy for the game, but they don't give a f and i can't blame them, a man's gotta eat, right? I have many friends who do this, i moved to spain last year and i don't have the need for it, but i do get why they do it.
@E-mol
3 жыл бұрын
This video made me so grateful that my PvE server doesn't have bots for the expensive materials! Arcane crystals are 75g, Orbs are 25g and Black lotus are 75g ea :)
@tarron3237
3 жыл бұрын
Nowadays EVERYTHING is about comparing yourself with others. That's what modern media teach us. Ingame and out of game it's all about bragging and/or being hip, trendy, part of the group. Everything is being made competitive, by those who profit from it, and those who need it to boost their ego
@Flufferz626
3 жыл бұрын
Warcraft Logs and parsing is cancer. Also the obsession of speed running. Zoomers gotta zoom.
@Johaniona
3 жыл бұрын
Life has always been like this and will be. Sadly. But you can't expect anything else.
@Middlerer
3 жыл бұрын
What lone wolf said: that's not a modern day problem, that's just humanity lol
@Altobrun
3 жыл бұрын
@@Flufferz626 Yep. It's why people are so toxic to guilds who run with meme specs (ret pally, boomkin, non-resto shaman, even spriest and ferals). They're obsessed with parses and speed runs and can't understand people not having that same mentality. When they see meme guilds clearing the same content they do while only taking 20mins longer and having as much or more fun, it upsets them.
@Flufferz626
3 жыл бұрын
@@Altobrun we have a Boomkin. We are a NA server and he is from Russia and is a jolly time to play with. He has helped with the guild at the beginning especially too. We just wanna not wipe repeatedly, that is all we want. Barely any of us (maybe like 2 individuals) got to Naxx in Vanilla. Boomkin slav is playing the smart long game for TBC lol.
@brotatoto
3 жыл бұрын
This video perfectly incapsulates the impact of a large disruption of closed economies by outside market forces and unfair practices. Black market currency (in the form of gold to RMT exchange) Bypassing Labor Laws ("enslaving" bots that don't sleep or require pay, besides the electricity to run them) The devaluing of labor and currency leads to massive inflation, which also leads to more players leaving the "workforce" by giving up on farming and buying into RMT, further growing the Black Market, which further devalues currency and drives inflation. Eventually the market consists of Bots and Buyers, and at that point people stop logging on, because they aren't playing the game anymore (moving away from the city or economically motivated suicides)
@Raoul9753
3 жыл бұрын
I said it before I say it again: Noone was really missing classic. We miss gaming as it was back in 2004, before everything got competitive and ended up with every small player being expected to put in as much work as progression guild veterans. We miss the time before every game was filled with tryhards and you were flamed for not following the top tier meta builds. We miss the time when gaming was still for Fun and not to proof how big your dong is.
@kingerz
3 жыл бұрын
I did miss Vanilla
@Raoul9753
3 жыл бұрын
@@kingerz Why?
@jimmyandersson9938
3 жыл бұрын
I guess there are different experiences on each server, but i havent seen any of this what you mention. I dinged 60 for about 7 weeks ago, i have been joining pugs constantly since day1 with full greens. ZG / MC / ONY and after 2 weeks when I atleast had a few T1 items, BWL / AQ20.I have never been gearchecked before inv, nobody has even commented on my gear. I even asked a BWL pugleader the 1st time if there is a gear requirement, he said " just bring a brain and listen to instructions on discord ". This has been a very happy suprise for me, having in mind the time I spent on a TBC Pserver, where every pugleader ever allways gearchecked you before inv, with very high requirements. I was expecting the same here where grumpy neckbeard vanilla vets telling you how the chest you have is not the right one but so far, nothing of this.
@Raoul9753
3 жыл бұрын
@@jimmyandersson9938 well, you are lucky, but your experience is the minority
@jimmyandersson9938
3 жыл бұрын
@@Raoul9753yeah most likely. Gaming in general have definitely changed to the worse as you describe.
@zarebear5690
3 жыл бұрын
Had a guildie and his brother that were both like this. They joined while leveling around 40, same as me on my warrior. They hit 60 around the same time, somehow shooting up 10 levels within 24 hours of hitting 50, one had Benediction and the other LHH within a week of hitting 60 and still in greens 🤔
@RW77777777
Жыл бұрын
warrior leveling tears also: while being the #1 in demand for raid and dps
@OleaiD
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks WillE, you convinced me to stop playing Classic.
@virgileusa
3 жыл бұрын
Dont let him influence you, actually everything is much cheaper beside the endgame consumables. I leveled up 60 a month ago and had 1500gold without farming and wasting a ton of golds on 5 to 6 epics i bought. I never had so much purchasing power in all wow than in classic
@OsterHase0O
3 жыл бұрын
Yep, this video is really exaggerated and not even close to be bad as he is saying.
@bryanheilman4376
3 жыл бұрын
same
@PSBore
3 жыл бұрын
When I played classic I felt such a rewarding feeling for doing everything the way it was originally intended to be done and earning things along the way.
@stormav
3 жыл бұрын
Players who play the game honestly the way it was intended are left in the dust. We can't keep up with exploiters. Because wow classic depends more on logistics and economy rather than skill, the player who game the system are the winners. Us who played classic because of vanilla nostalgia quit the game when we realized that we can't compete. Not only can't we compete but we suffocate from the logistical and economical demands of raiding which we can't sustain due to no exploatation when the meta is to exploit.
@Drain_Life_Archive
3 жыл бұрын
Most legit players will never finish AQ or go into Naxx because if they don't buy gold, they'll struggle to afford it. This is the situation created by rampant cheaters on an economy. You can't compete with them on farming, nor vs anyone else that buys gold. You must either join the crowd, or fight a lost cause.
@stormav
3 жыл бұрын
Or in my case, quit the game.
@Drain_Life_Archive
3 жыл бұрын
@@stormav That's what I did too, although I got my 5 60s ready for BC. This is perhaps the best use of this classic; to prep for the BC launch. Get your toons to 60, max skills, epic mounts, farm gold/materials if you want, then unsub. Now when BC launches you can dive right into outlands. If you plan to play one of the new races then you obviously have to wait, but you could stockpile low level gear.
@mythmancer
3 жыл бұрын
I had a blast early in classic farming WS at night when most people are sleeping. Around the time the COVID lockdown happened, I realized that farming in this game was totally broken outside of instanced mage farming. I flew out to WS as I normally do about 3am on a Tuesday and found every camp loaded with players, every herb picked clean. I did a quick /who to see how many people were in the zone and to my surprise 62 horde at this crazy hour midweek. My server is 60/40 Horde/Ally - so it's safe to assume there were likely 100 people in that zone that morning. At that point I pretty much gave up on farming and have been chipping away at all the goods I farmed in phase 1 till now. Players don't even have the option to fairly farm gold anymore and you almost have to run GDKPs or buy it to keep up with raid consumables each week.
@greedfox7842
3 жыл бұрын
The trick is to use a bot that runs on a separate PC or raspberry unit... it still acts like a robot, but there is nothing to catch that they could see. These days you could probably even program a chatbot to run with the farmbot to make a a decent bid at looking human, most people can't sus out a talking robot in chat.
@Bargadiel
3 жыл бұрын
Classic players: "I hate retail, it's so dumb. WoW token makes it pay to win, and people just AFK in cities, never party up or talk, and pay for boosts" Also classic players: "I'm going to buy gold from a farmer, then pay this bot to boost me in ZG, and AFK here for 4 hours while watching Netflix" Finally, classic players: "BOTS ARE RUINING THE GAME"
@cattysplat
3 жыл бұрын
Everyone is doing it, this is what I find so sad but there is nothing you can do to change people's minds, everything in this world has a price and gaming lost it's ethics years ago. Today it is World of Boomercraft and people have more money than time as adults or zoomers who've grown up with pay to win being normal.
@HappyPow
3 жыл бұрын
Exactly what happened 10 years ago in TBC and WotLK
@Fabriciod_Crv
3 жыл бұрын
@@HappyPow 10 years ago is more akin to wrath and cata (2010)
@NetherAngelGaming
3 жыл бұрын
My personal favorite is how the same people selling gold have made it almost impossible to find a leveling group. They sell you gold, then you buy boosting services and they get that gold back to eventually sell it back to you for buying your mount when you hit 60....
@zyxwvutsrqponmlkjihgfedcba0
3 жыл бұрын
Seriously though. I blame everyone being obsessed with their online presence and borderline psychosis fueled by social media and dopamine addiction. Remember every creation eventually comes for its creator, and you've all a hand in this one.
@Middlerer
3 жыл бұрын
I first noticed this when playing oldschool runescape. "Creators" would make videos on niche methods to earn gold and, obviously, the method was killed right there.
@heftymagic4814
3 жыл бұрын
@@Middlerer whats that got to do with the comment
@GTJW22409
3 жыл бұрын
Or they can just handle the botting problem. It really isn't hard.
@Middlerer
3 жыл бұрын
@@heftymagic4814 Dunno, it was late at night lmao. I suppose I was thinking of how 'creators' basically write a guide for which methods of gold making would be the most effective to bot. That goes 10x so when you consider groups of mage bots farming dungeons. They even make detailed tutorial videos showing them how to do it.
@cweston9440
3 жыл бұрын
Very true man, feel like some people would rather be boosted all the way through the game to be able to flex their epeen, but the real question is did they actually play the game or where they just watching someone play it for them?
@Palentir
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah I quit around phase 3 came back a couple weeks ago and saw GDKP. I asked what it was and my heart sunk into my stomach.
@scar9867
3 жыл бұрын
What are you talking about? GDKP has been a thing since uh, forever?
@DrakodanSRL
3 жыл бұрын
There's nothing wrong with GDKP as a system, it's just abused by people who buy gold. If you're someone who isn't in a raiding guild it's a perfectly good way to get gear that's otherwise out of reach for you.
@Dez_27
3 жыл бұрын
gold runs have been a thing since phase 1, when gold was too expensive for most people to buy a lot of
@Emajenus
3 жыл бұрын
How about joining a guild?
@krugec23
3 жыл бұрын
join a guild,everyone is recruiting extra to be safe for naxx release
@CoreSystemDev
3 жыл бұрын
Its funny how a large part of this comment section actively promotes/supports goldbuying. People who dont buy gold are so poor and stupid... am i right guys? Thanks for ruining the game
@heidituffin3511
3 жыл бұрын
Go look at the official forum posts. It's the same way -- every few days a post criticzing gold buying and the buying and selling of boosts is met with anger and hostility from the buyers and sellers of boosts.
@MultiCommissar
3 жыл бұрын
It's only logical. Do you remember how much we used to farm back in 2004? We'd spend what amounts to endless double shifts working for absolutely minor rewards, and the only reason for it was because MMOs were relatively new, and we had no real alternative. So now that people do have an alternative, who in their right mind would work for 60 gold an hour when they can work for 800g an hour, instead?
@ELDevaux
3 жыл бұрын
When classic was coming out, people on reddit told me gold inflation wouldn't be a problem lmao
@Hero-oz9gx
3 жыл бұрын
inflation isnt a problem because when the economy inflates so do all the items with it, so money becomes easier to make too, the real problem has always been the bots.
@TheDrexxus
3 жыл бұрын
Blizzard will never FULLY commit to cracking down on the botting because it is what keeps the game running. They are fully aware some players enjoy tedious activities like farming or daily quests, but some don't have the time or patience to deal with it and would rather spend money to get it done. If blizzard got rid of all bots entirely, those players who don't enjoy farming/dailies/whatever would simply quit the game as it would no longer be fun to engage with anymore. Players quitting means less monthly subs for blizz, and less players for everyone else to play with. As populations go down, it takes longer to find groups, especially groups full of people with good gear, and it becomes frustrating and tedious, more people quit. The cycle of population decline increases. Like it or not, bots are part of the economic ecosystem that keeps WOW alive. They're paying blizzard quite a bit in monthly subs to do what they do and keeping portions of the playerbase happy by just enjoying the more fun parts of the game and bypassing all the grunt work. I think MMOs were a great concept when they were created and ramped up and hit their peak in early World of Warcraft, but it's been a downward trend ever since with fewer people being interested in general, usually because of the time commitment required. They aren't the sort of game you can get a whole lot of satisfaction from when you just play 30 minutes a day and a lot of regular people have too many responsibilities in their life to be able to dedicate hours every day. They're just dying out and being replaced, unfortunately, by mobile gaming because a lot of those games you can get some satisfaction from in a few minutes when you have nothing better to do and while you're at any location, without having to be at home on your PC. Many of these mobile apps are also trending towards designs that operate on the assumption that you will only play sporadically throughout the day and design themselves around that concept with a lot of work being done on your behalf even when you aren't actively playing. I don't like it personally, because I love more active gameplay on the PC, but this is unfortunately where the future of gaming is headed at the moment. Mobile gaming accounts for the majority of money made by the gaming industry as a whole these days and is played by even people who never played a normal game before in their life. Maybe eventually as culture changes and technology improves, we'll head to a place where games focus more on the quality of gameplay and storytelling instead of just ease of use or pretty graphics. But the supply and demand nature of economy dictates that to make the most money, you have to appeal to the largest audience, so niche games are becoming more and more rare while incredibly easy/simple games are becoming the mainstay. There is no way to "fix" this issue because it is a fundamental problem with human nature and human culture: People these days like things to be instantly satisfying and easy to use.
@joeycrow
3 жыл бұрын
Makes me feel good I paid $0 and 0 gold for my rejuvenating Gem.
@veiseren
3 жыл бұрын
A boomkin on my server spent 20k on the amulet of Vek'nilash in a gbid pug. Every week he spends at minimum 8k in AQ40/BWL gbids. It's just too obvious
@Mksui
3 жыл бұрын
lmao
@maxinvasionleet
3 жыл бұрын
Call him out and shame him for it
@jeremybrio3291
3 жыл бұрын
not unreasonable for someone who sells ZG boost. I have tons of friends who sell ZG boosts and spend thousands and thousands in GDKPs and are legitimate farmers. definitely possible.
@Veritassify
3 жыл бұрын
@@maxinvasionleet ye burn the witch
@johnhandcock3242
3 жыл бұрын
@@jeremybrio3291 Boosting in ZG isn't legitimate...
@magaras
3 жыл бұрын
Toxic guilds that demand max consumes every week to farm easy content.
@oceandreams7774
3 жыл бұрын
This is it right here, they turned a grind into something far worse.
@mrgankface8687
3 жыл бұрын
The hardcore challenge community cannot be deterred and is bringing back the real game! Look it up WillE
@waterjabbers1159
3 жыл бұрын
"We want the classic experience!" "People are buying gold!" Yep, that's the classic experience
@kaceydillin7367
3 жыл бұрын
I have bottled for years. If Blizzard really wanted to stop it, they easily could. Why they don’t? I have no idea. No one is actively online 6 days a week for 18 hours a day...month after month after month. Doing nothing but gathering and crafting. I will never know how this type of consistent activity does not trip some sort of red flag internally for Blizzard.
@SinaKec
3 жыл бұрын
This is one of the things I've heard that WoW Classic has done and controlled WORSE than the WoW Vanilla private servers. If you sift Chinese gold farmers, exploiters/glitchers/hackers that farm insane amounts of experience per hour and GDP systems, it all makes me choose a private WoW Vanilla server instead. You shouldn't need to pay 15$ a month for things that the devs don't care about. PS: Great video, nonetheless.
@Drain_Life_Archive
3 жыл бұрын
Good private servers banned cheaters on the spot. They did a better job than Blizzard and this was with unpaid volunteers trying to police a F2P game. Blizzard has paid professionals in charge of a game with a monthly sub. That said, the official version is better for all the other reasons... especially you not losing your work when the server decides to go down one day.
@CeilingPanda
3 жыл бұрын
LOL, I was totally that guy that wasn't subscribed, no wonder I never saw your videos in my subscription feed, fixed it, and so should you!
@Kersakofu
3 жыл бұрын
I quit at level 30 on a hunter on classic, it started to get too grindy for me. Came back, decide to roll a shadow priest. Everywhere is barren. Wand upgrades are in dungeons, naturally. People only boost in dungeons, takes hours to get a dungeon group together. Legitimate group, anyways. Say what you want about retail, but I can get to max level without having to pay someone else to do it for me. And in less than half the time.
@someone-ji2zb
3 жыл бұрын
Well, classic has lost a huge amount of players this year. Turns out when you can steamroll dungeons and most of the raids off the bat, it doesn't stay very interesting. As for your personal sentiment, I suppose different strokes for different folks. I prefer longer leveling time, but yea.. kind of need players around for it to work in vanilla, TBC or lich king.
@OboYarn
3 жыл бұрын
On pRivAte sErvErs they often nerfed dungeon farms (and Dungeon XP Boosts did not reward at all the same amount of XP/hour) and increased herb and mining spawn rates by A LOT. This made herbing / mining more or less close to dungeon farming gold (and more active world!!). And the gap between dungeon farm and open world farm became smaller. In Classic, mages can farm 800g/h in Dungeons due to dungeon boosting XP giving unreasonable amounts of XP/hour. This creates a HUGE gap with other gold farm methods (and among other things, a lot less people play their characters outside of dungeons)
@MasterCookies
3 жыл бұрын
I was Priest with Druid Alt, imagine being locked out from Farming by desire to support other players
@grimreapper
3 жыл бұрын
Here's what I do: 1) Don't buy gold. 2) Don't buy boosted runs. 3) Don't join pugs where they auction off items. I am able to come across like minded people who hate this sort of thing and we have a good time leveling up or doing dungeons. I encourage others to do the same. If you stop giving goldfarmers a demand, the demand will diminish.
@Dukenukem
3 жыл бұрын
4:19 - that is called a "Good Guild",you dont need to buy gold if you have one (as guild sharing and services are way cheaper/free and your gold just accumulates naturally)
@ThaPlayahx
3 жыл бұрын
Having a guild certainly lowers the gold cost of raiding and such but it definitely doesn't remove it. My guilds offers 50% discount on enchanting mats but it's not free. We might receive the occasional flask for a raid but not every raid. The money you make from a raid doesn't even cover half the money you spend on consumables. Raiding and pvping costs a lot of money assuming you do it properly. If you only have time to raid or pvp, you're losing money and not gaining. This is why people buy gold because it takes 2 hours of IRL work to make 1500 WoW gold but you can't make 1500g in 2 in-game hours. Not saying I agree with the practice or that this makes it okay but being in a guild doesn't solve your gold problem.
@mesozoicera87
3 жыл бұрын
Thankfully, the bot rule changes are going to help this significantly.
@ChippiesBR
3 жыл бұрын
It sucks tbh. I've been feeling rich sitting on 10k gold for most of the year...now gdkp has become so huge it seems everyone and their mum has that much gold now . Not to mention all our fun raids are done in the guild because everyone wants to do gdkp. People suck man
@Veritassify
3 жыл бұрын
ye "fun raids" with loot council or /roll for item lol
@moonstakerasmr490
3 жыл бұрын
Part of the problem is the Modern Player mentality. Botting and Gold Buying aren't anything new, it was around back in Vanilla and BC. But it was nowhere near this rampant, at least on my server, because it wasn't an acceptable thing to do. Now its seemingly so widely accepted that people openly talk about doing it, I've seen my guildies buy gold then complain about botting. I know I sound like a boomer, but I was super young when Vanilla first came out, and some of my earliest memories were watching my Dad play it. I played it a fair amount back then, and have played consistently since then. I was excited for Classic, to get to play through these old memories that I had. It was great for maybe the first month or two, but it quickly became bastardised when people became impatient with dungeon groups/levelling time and started paying for boosts, and buying gold for raid mats and other stupid shit instead of grinding it themselves. Classic is a good game, great even. But its the community that's thoroughly ruined it.
@Williaem00
3 жыл бұрын
So many people took advantage of the scarlet monastery farm before it was fixed when classic came out.
@honokakousaka5742
3 жыл бұрын
@Tony Garcia in early classic you could do sm with a raid group of 10 and not get reduced xp or something, this was quickly nerfed but "damage" was done already so to speak
@erinspitfire
Жыл бұрын
it's really depressing that you can't escape our toxic hypercapitalism even in wow anymore. it's impossible to enjoy the game now and it's really sad.
@yesapples1009
3 жыл бұрын
I play on a small server, non of this exists on our server. We have no bots, we have no gdkp runs and we have no boosts. Playing on a small server is the most true to vanilla way to play classic
@discodoni1337
3 жыл бұрын
Same, feels so good.
@bourbon5983
3 жыл бұрын
Same! Nethergarde Keep EU
@Domebuddy
3 жыл бұрын
@@bourbon5983 Nethergarde Keep has plenty of people selling gold, so maybe its not as pure as you think it is.
@sadlad2845
3 жыл бұрын
I miss release day. I miss the community we used to be.
@XenoWalkerEVE
3 жыл бұрын
is it still worth it tho? I wasn't there for release of classic or the updates
@shivasthong4924
3 жыл бұрын
That was a long time ago, and even then. The nostalgia is real.
@Zcyteck
3 жыл бұрын
Seeing a video like this, still makes me feel a bit odd, when trying to maintain my 150g between my farm & raid toon(s). I've always wondered hwo on earth that warrior in a gdkp run was ablr to pay a staggering 17500g for a Band of Accuria. I've never really thoguht about p2w being the reason.
@drewschneck9016
3 жыл бұрын
I am so glad you made this video. This is a huge thing that gets brushed over and is the biggest difference from back in the day to now.
@hizzousekakashi8836
3 жыл бұрын
Guildie was just in a GDKP two days ago on biggleworth where a priest was multiboxing with a rogue and paid 18k total for Death's sting and Jom Gabbar, I'm willing to bet he either has a bot farm or paid cash for that gold.
@yeetdeets
3 жыл бұрын
Death's sting is worth more TBH. It's around 3% drop and the best offhand dagger in the game. Until p6 it's the best main hand dagger as well. It's like Thunderfury for dagger rogues. I've made around 30k so far only flipping items on the AH. I've spent or invested most of it, and have an inventory of items worth around 45k at current server prices. That inventory should appreciate to around 55-60k around p6 release. If I actually played in p1 and p2, and knew more about the game from playing private servers, I could probably have at least doubled those numbers by now. I'm not even multiboxing, and I don't farm. I do transmutes daily on 6 lvl 35 toons and some alchemy/engi/cooking/first aid crafts occasionally on my main. Imagine if I actually had more than one account, farmed, and did more than scan the AH and transmuted every day?
@Emajenus
3 жыл бұрын
@@yeetdeets You sound like someone who buys a lot of gold but thinks that they can convince others that their gold is legitimate.
@yeetdeets
3 жыл бұрын
@@Emajenus Why the hell would I try to convince you here then? I would have no reason to, aside from me thinking you are wrong and should get over yourselves. You have 0 proof I have bought gold and are only accusing me of it to rationalize your inability to get it legitimately yourself. I couldn't even afford to buy it if I wished to. I'm flat broke IRL, rich in a game. How is that for irony. I'm not saying it's legitimate when people are throwing away 50k+ gold every week in gbid pugs. I'm saying that a multiboxer spending less than 20k on a really good, current phase item with a low droprate is not strange in any way.
@Emajenus
3 жыл бұрын
@@yeetdeets I don't need proof. You're getting too defensive and it's too suspicious. Definitely a gold buyer.
@yeetdeets
3 жыл бұрын
@@Emajenus I hope you never attain any position of power. Also don't vote, I don't want any gulags in the future.
@markblaze4909
3 жыл бұрын
The twist. Blizzard employees are selling the gold
@clamzzee7994
3 жыл бұрын
Its a pro tip, its true.
@sven849
3 жыл бұрын
Id like to just comment on how GDKP's work since I lead a normal DKP raiding guild for 5 months before switching to GDKP 1) Guilds Need players, players don't need guilds Its sad but its true, there is no reason for a player to look for a guild, gdkps and pugs are so plentiful that theres no reason to bog yourself down with a schedule in a guild when you can just play on your own when you want with no downside. The quality of players in a guild vs a pug are most of the time no different. 2) All of the good players on your server are in one guild already - and you're not allowed in Trying to make a raiding guild that isn't dog shit is an impossible task. Every good player is already in a guild and they aren't moving. If you aren't there to make a guild in the first few weeks of a server launching - forget it. 3) Trying to fill a pug after only 70% of your guilds "sign ups" showed up is exhausting No matter how many people you have sign up, you will always need to pug people. and trying to get someone to join a pug is a nightmare because gdkp's exist 4) When very good items go to players, they either leave your guild for a better one, or they just quit the game Losing DFT, Maladath, Tear, Gem, all the great items to people in your guild who just leave never feels good. As a GM you just lost 2-4 weeks of time in terms of progression For all the reasons above, GDKP is better 1) GDKP runs can be started anytime YOU want, not when the guild wants 2) Filling a GDKP run is extremely easy and fast, like 800% faster than a regular pug. This is because ppl wants to spend the gold they bought, and legit players wants to take that gold from the pay pigs. 3) The quality of players in GDKP runs is MUCH higher than a pug You will get fully BIS geared players from the top guilds on your server just looking to carry and get paid, these players you would never get to interact with before 4) Personal responsibility of members in a GDKP is MUCH higher than any sort of run No one wants to get kicked and lose there 1/40 cut of the gold, so everyone is very careful If someone does fuck up, you can kick them and the entire raid is happy because THEY GET MORE GOLD 5) Anytime anything drops thats good, everyone is happy about it Better items -> bigger pot 6) The entire server is your guild now, no longer do you need players, but infact - players need you Paypigs usually have 5-6 alts, and all those alts either wanna get geared up in gdkp or carry to get gold to be able to gear up 7) You make a ton of gold I wish it wasn't the case, but in 2020 gdkp is the only system in classic wow that works - i hate everything about it on a fundamental level however because of the way it works its the best system to use if you want to run raids as a raid leader - least amount of headache and biggest pay off. None of it would work without gold buying however. Ill add one more thing, to boost a character to level 52 - which when you can start doing BRD and end game content to gear up for raids, is about 800 gold on benediction. In one week of GDKP lock outs, if you don't buy any gear in the runs, you will make about 1000 gold on average. That means doing GDKP's for one week can provide enough gold to boost a character. This is why no one is leveling naturally anymore, which also leads to why everyone is even more hyper focused on the end game content now
@justjestering1646
3 жыл бұрын
The only difference is Blizzard employed thousands of Live GM's back in vanilla and if you filed a report they would respond in 5 minutes or less and would actually take action to remove bots, cheaters, spammers ect.
@_faythene
3 жыл бұрын
Sadly only had to see the title of the video and knew it was getting a thumbs up. Absolutely kills me seeing people just throw real life money at ingame problems, which is only enabled by the mass amount of bots which have raw farmed gold and the GDKP communities which enable the expenditure. And yet to be able to afford all the consumables to continue raiding GDKP's have become to most time efficient method to gather gold. Rip classic.
@filipfenix
3 жыл бұрын
Boosting went form a nice little niche to literally mainstream main-game feature.
@krugec23
3 жыл бұрын
herbing is really bad on big servers,the spawn rates are too low for such a huge number of players active
@Flufferz626
3 жыл бұрын
I picked a black lotus in Plaguelands for the first time the other day. I was surrounded by 3 bots.
@relog
3 жыл бұрын
That’s why I put my 60 on a completely dead server and picked all black lotus and everything rare then xfer’d back 3 months later and now I got 34,000 gold with not much farming
@alessiofe
3 жыл бұрын
@@relog still paid 2 transfers, isn't it "pay" 2 win?
@PRODBLANE
3 жыл бұрын
I enjoyed classic until it became my full time job during this pandemic. Now I play retail. lol
@spooky_zen
3 жыл бұрын
"the meaningful journey"
@bryanheilman4376
3 жыл бұрын
I've become one of those people who thought they did, but they didn't. And I wanted Classic so bad! It's always about the people, not the game.
@Tightata
3 жыл бұрын
The problem is farming gold simply doesn't make any sense when you have a job. On most servers 100g costs between 1.50-2.00 $. Most people can't farm more than 100-150g/h. Equate that to your hourly earnings and you realize you're working for a pittance. In a community full of min maxers buying gold is just the next logical step.
@brandonlindley8697
3 жыл бұрын
If you cant farm the gold fairly by in-game means then you shouldn't be min-maxing because your not good enough/don't have the time. Your last statement just sounds like your justifying gold buying. ""If you can't rise to the standard of play, then quit."
@ForOne814
3 жыл бұрын
@@brandonlindley8697 there's nothing wrong with gold buying. Farming isn't content, it's a waste of time. Or a relatively well-paying job, depends on your attitude.
@Tightata
3 жыл бұрын
@@brandonlindley8697 You enjoy the morale high ground, I take my free time.
@brandonlindley8697
3 жыл бұрын
@@ForOne814 farming is a necessary evil and its something you have to do if you want to make a lot of gold of raid with flasks. Gold buying is cheating. You avoid putting in the effort to prep for raid by using your wallet. If you don't want to work for your gear, it sounds like you don't want to play an mmo, so go play a p2w one
@ForOne814
3 жыл бұрын
@@brandonlindley8697 it's not p2w. It's p2p. Just having the resources to do content doesn't mean that you'll be successful at it. And WoW is literally a p2p game, lol. Games exist to enjoy them, and farming is fucking boring and you're insane if it's something you like to do.
@NightpireVideos
3 жыл бұрын
I want to add that this is not something that comes from the private server scene. They were always fairly casual and just played the game like back then with more knowledge. It was not the standard to speedrun BWL like Apes and other top guilds with every possible buff and consumable. It was retail players that picked this style of playing the game up as the standard and min/maxed it across entire servers and it's not healthy for the economy and the players to keep this high standard up for a longer period of time to beat 15 year old dragons faster.
@shinku2826
3 жыл бұрын
this is why i refuse to continue playing on my old server (herod) whenever tbc classic is released. the economy has been beyond fucked since t2
@Wellshem
3 жыл бұрын
I want fresh server
@HappyPow
3 жыл бұрын
Honestly, there are so many players who want p2w. Even when company doesn't want it, players do it by themselves.
@AdellRedwinters
3 жыл бұрын
Your videos are literally recommended to me so much that I did actually subscribe even though I don’t play either version of wow and never have! (I’m an ff14 player so I guess that was the connection in KZitem’s algorithm). While I’ve never played the game, I find the discussions around classic and your covering of it fascinating!
@Giogiogio4
3 жыл бұрын
I think the big issue needs to be solved is more of a society challenge. It's the never ending challenge of what makes us happy in life vs chasing a pipe dream. And it's showing in the game.
@brandonlindley8697
3 жыл бұрын
9:50 Literally me, but I quit. Like three times in classic I've had over 100 gold, I've always been poor and farmed all my consumes for raid myself to be #1 for loot prio. No point in raiding or putting in effort if people are shortcutting that process with their wallet. Even if its a small % of players that do it, it ruins the integrity of the game because each time you see a warrior in SW with AQR, full t2.5, dft , etc you don't think "wow he's a core raider", no you just think "did he buy all of that gear?"
@Quitarstudent
3 жыл бұрын
no, i dont even think those ppl that buy gear even play the game, the only reason why they buy gear to utilize it is pvp, but i dont think ive seen a pvper that would obviously buy gold or something
@hurotiz
3 жыл бұрын
It's true, on the server I played before i quit it was impossible to find a dungeon group unless it was with your friends, and most of them were just boosting. It became a game of finding ways to make enough money and then budgeting your gold so that you could make a milestone without having to quest, on my server it was worse because it was a pvp server and 60s would kill you on sight in every zone, making questing very difficult after level 30. I joined late and as a level 42 warlock I just couldn't go on, farm for 3 days with stiff competition for 2 more boosted levels or get killed 30 times in a zone that no alliance has any reason to be in except to kill lower level players. I will say that the number of skeletons around gadgetzan was impressive though. This is coming from a more casual player but I feel that it's relevant because without new players the servers will stagnate and die out as the player base eventually burns down to the oldest most hardcore players. When they've done everything and have everything, then classic's light will finally burn itself out. This isn't a Blizzard problem, its a player made problem. I've noticed its become an expectation, I've joined several guilds and when I ask for help, I get: just do X to make gold and then get boosted. Or: I'll boost you for a discount price. it just doesn't feel like i'm playing a game, I feel like i'm playing boost simulator.
@ljc77777
3 жыл бұрын
people want what they want now! easily! they will always find ways to pay for it.
@lostcrusader8053
3 жыл бұрын
It goes to show that you can scream #nochange but that doesn’t mean it will make the game as good as you remembered especially with those who intend to change it
@nicepeps
3 жыл бұрын
I'll be honest, I thought I was subscribed this whole time. Sorry WillE...
@zedthefish
3 жыл бұрын
This topic is just a minor reason for classic not being the same as it was back in 2004 and onwards. There is NO wonder, there is no exploration, there is no mystery, there is no excitment. Most people coming in to Classic either played the game in this version or played on P Servers. Everyone knew what spec to go, what class to pick, what leveling path to take, what strat for that dungeon, what gear to look for, etc. Back in 2004 I remember my guild members discussing their choice of playing Paladin. They had imagined themselves as holy warriors smashing monsters with their big mace... only to be forced in to wearing cloth robes and healing. As much as this is a sad tale, it's interesting because there was mystery and discovery involved. I remember my first toon was an undead mage and I upgraded my gear by armor rating alone... I was wearing a robe with like 55 armor and +10 Nature Resistance. I was pulled aside by a fellow mage and he taught me how to gear up. This kind of stuff doesn't happen any more. There is no discovery, which really takes away a lof of the joy and community. In this case, players have so much information on how to 'win the game' that they can sell items to players. I don't understand how this can be 'fun'. Ok the seller has a lot of gold now. Cool. Nothing to strive for, you have everything. And now the buyer has a fancy new piece of armor but is it really satisfying getting that item? What's the metrics on 'fun and enjoyment' of being carried to get a piece of gear? The whole point is to rally with your friends and work together to grow stronger together... that sound much more fun and enjoyable and satisfying if you ask me.
@Talon323
3 жыл бұрын
Ive never realised how big a problem this actually is. But maybe thats just cus I dont really raid or pvp, I just level new characters.
@amen7692
3 жыл бұрын
lmao same, but I actually want to pvp but I always get bored of my new class and make another, currently leveling 4th and playing since april, but I ahve to admit I pay for boosts after certain level, cause Im awful at leveling and would take me ages to hit 60
@ollep0lle
3 жыл бұрын
Youre like me then. You should really check out the ”Hardcore Challenge”. Its alot of fun! Level with one life only, solo self found items only. Go to classichc.net for info. Let me know if you try it out!
@NightpireVideos
3 жыл бұрын
The last time I played classic was like a half year ago and only leveled an alt to 60 with gathering professions and I had the 1k gold for an epic mount casually ready when I hit 60 without putting any farming sessions into it. Probably the only good thing about this gold inflation, that set prices like skills and mount skills come easier.
@insidetrip101
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah, man, people act like raiding is the only part of the game, and its just not. Its so irrtating. A lot of these problems just go away if you stop stressing out about min/maxing in the end game.
@calze6
3 жыл бұрын
As a person who frequents GDKPs since near the beginning of BWL runs, stories of crazy RMT big ticket spenders are vastly exaggerated. I haven't seen a single item go for over 15k gold. Sure there are occasionally some people who are probably rmters who spend big on bindings/dft etc, but the vast majority of items go for under 1000 gold, and can easily be farmed simply by mage boosting or participating in a decent number of GDKPs. People tend to think that GDKPs are just full of big ticket RMT spenders, but that simply is not true. If you GDKP on 2-3 characters in BWL and AQ, you would naturally earn about 3000 gold per week, which is more than enough over a reasonable period of time to obtain some big ticket items.
@epitaph8704
3 жыл бұрын
"No changes!"
@Veritassify
3 жыл бұрын
no changes what?, blizzard keep making changes
@shivasthong4924
3 жыл бұрын
By trying to avoid one hole, they blindly marched into one they themselves made.
@Josh-99
3 жыл бұрын
In Vanilla (not Classic -- I mean 2004 Vanilla) Blizzard broke out the banhammer frequently and used it with EXTREME prejudice against bots, speedhackers, terrain hackers, etc. They would actually post notices about the number of bots and cheaters they had banned. Yes, there was still gold buying and selling, but it wasn't anywhere NEAR the problem you see in Classic.
@zugdarr
3 жыл бұрын
This is absolutely the cycle. I started doing gdkp because there are terrible raid times and I made a fortune in alchemy. I'm at a point right now where I'm getting 1500g splits for 2 hours work and seeing people throw down tens of thousands in runs. It is starting to make me feel cheap though. We are always looking for asian guild warrior players to join the runs because they bring the largest wallets you ever saw, and we are masters of running up their bids because they simply don't stop bidding. DFT earns us 250g minimum everytime it drops. Armaments go for 10 to15k. Armor pieces 2 to 10k. Rare bwl weapons at easy 10k. It's a total trap. The bids get higher each week in aq40. They drop 40k without flinching. I look at gold sites, 100 bucks buys almost 5k. These people don't care and Blizz doesn't either. If they did do something it would seriously wipe out the playerbase because nobody plays the actual game.
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