Early on in my flight training, my original CFI was terrific. He was professional and pleasant. Each flight was a challenging and positive experience. Then he got the call from the airlines. My next CFI had the attitude of the captain in this video. An arrogant know-it-all who made me feel tense and apprehensive. I flew one single flight with him. After I landed and secured the airplane, I walked to the FBO and requested another instructor who turned out to be just as terrific as my original CFI. If you're not comfortable with your instructor for any reason, do yourself a favor, make the change.
@32SQUID
2 жыл бұрын
John, the words terrific and terrible. The first 5 letters are the same. I suggest you use another word.
@aineahmed9963
2 жыл бұрын
Same happened to me
@32SQUID
2 жыл бұрын
@@aineahmed9963 why are you replying to me?
@32SQUID
2 жыл бұрын
@@jlockwood65 The United States is very small. We all almost know each other.
@aineahmed9963
2 жыл бұрын
@@32SQUID sorry my mistake - sorry I offended u terribly
@tamipalin8171
4 жыл бұрын
My dad was certified in a Lear from the mid 1960s until he retired in 1996. I asked him about this crash. He stated that just about any mistake that could be made WAS made in this flight. The Learjet is a wonderful airplane, but it isn't a particularly easy plane to fly, the margin between controlled flight and uncontrolled is very thin.
@jumpmasterjm
5 жыл бұрын
Always know when to add power, level the wings, and go around. Totally avoidable. The captain was so far behind the plane, I'm surprised he was in the crash.
@MIckveli2
5 жыл бұрын
i know,...right !
@rpmiracle
5 жыл бұрын
A OK Even more bizarre, why do we still not know his name??
@darrenkall7578
4 жыл бұрын
I wood I want you to do, is go stand in front of the airplane and put your hand on the nose. That’s the last time you’re going to be in front of the airplane tonight
@jnichols3
4 жыл бұрын
That is terrible. Still gave it a thumbs-up. I have to believe that the captain was somehow impaired that day. Don't think he would made it to his position if this was how he normally performed his duties.
@dwightstjohn6927
4 жыл бұрын
@Richard G doesn't look like we'll ever know, but even though pilots get physicals. On job sites I lost count of guys who were borderline diabetic, non linear stuff: dementia, or what we call "having a bad week:, and age has nothing to do with it. A HS friend passed on his couch at the age of 27 after almost a decade of flying and physicals. No idea what happened.
@noonedude101
4 жыл бұрын
I'd actually met the SIC a month before the crash. Super nice kid. At the time of the crash, I was working with his instructor at CAE in a Citation 550 simulator. A further year after that, I was working for a cargo company in Texas where he had washed out of training. Its amazing how closely his and my career paralleled each other.
@sludge8506
2 жыл бұрын
Both pilots had trouble passing check rides.
@anthonydelrosario1718
Жыл бұрын
One ended up in a crash one did not .
@PabloGonzalez-hv3td
5 жыл бұрын
The guy in the stolen Q400 had a better grasp of what he was doing than these guys
@Bartonovich52
5 жыл бұрын
Completely different scenario. The Q400 guy wasn’t concerned about airspace and altitude restrictions or talking on the radio and accepting clearances and complying with instructions or giving briefings and standard calls in a two crew environment or flying an approach profile and landing the aircraft. It’s easy to just throw a plane around in VFR conditions until it crashes. It’s not easy to fly it safely and professionally.
@PabloGonzalez-hv3td
5 жыл бұрын
@@Bartonovich52 That's basically my point that while the Q400 kid obviously wouldn't have concern for proper procedures his situational awareness and basic airmanship were still superior to the professional lear jet crew that not only completely lacked SA they lost control of a perfectly controllable airplane. The q400 kid never lost control his crash was intentional
@Bartonovich52
5 жыл бұрын
How was his situational awareness better? They held departures at Sea Tac to clear the airspace, it was a beautiful VFR day, and ATC was giving him rather general instructions to stay away from or head toward certain areas which he didn’t really comply with. He didn’t know that his fuel was going to go down as fast as it was, and after he did his barrel roll he said one of his engines was messed up-likely from fuel starvation or over temp/over torque-so the crash may not have been entirely intentional. Yes... it’s impressive that he was able to fly that aircraft... but his best day was still worse than this crew’s worse day. They were wondering whether he could even pull off a straight in visual approach and landing to the AFB.. never mind a speed and altitude and airspace restricted ILS circling approach.
@PabloGonzalez-hv3td
5 жыл бұрын
@@Bartonovich52 The kid in the Q400 was flying the plane to the best of his abilities the crew in that lear jet were passengers in their own plane with the illusion of control. If that jet crew displayed any less awareness they would have been asleep that wasn't an accident it was arrogance or complete incompetence.
@Bartonovich52
5 жыл бұрын
Flying a plane to the best of your abilities does not equal good situational awareness. It’s precisely why we have minimum training standards for licensed pilots. Moving the controls and physically operating the aircraft is nothing compared to pilot decision making and situational awareness. In spite of all this crew did wrong, there are still a ton of things this crew did right in comparison to the Q400 kid. They were licensed and approved to fly the aircraft. The aircraft was fuelled for the expected flight. The weather was checked-even though it was hours old. The takeoff was done properly without squealing brakes and smoking tires without clearance into the middle of heavy traffic. They filed a flight plan-even though it had the wrong altitude for such a short flight. They stuck to the lateral portion of the filed flight plan or as cleared-only on approach did they screw up vectors and intercepts and profiles and the circling maneuver. The captain realized late in the flight how close he was and that he needed to get the ATIS so he’d be ready for approach and landing. The Q400 kid probably didn’t even know what ATIS was and had no intentions of landing anyways. So, sorry, I still disagree with you.
@tareqibnziyad4732
4 жыл бұрын
Never seen such an unprofessional captain!, no checklists, no proper radio communications, no CRM. Thanks for the informative video.
@KLeVoyBarnes
2 жыл бұрын
CAPTAIN WILL BE DOING THE CHECKLIST FOR ETERNITY NOW AND SAYING SORRY TO HIS CO-PILOT FOR KILLING HIS ASS.
@blakjack3053
2 жыл бұрын
Shoot for all we know he was too busy on his cell phone texting
@tareqibnziyad4732
2 жыл бұрын
@@blakjack3053 LOL
@Griff00
8 ай бұрын
idk van zanten from the tenerife disaster was pretty bad
@stelvis7413
3 жыл бұрын
How can a pilot think they were "hundreds of miles away" on a flight from PHA to TEB?
@golferpro1241
2 жыл бұрын
Exactly
@32SQUID
2 жыл бұрын
Vaccine injured.
@32SQUID
2 жыл бұрын
@@stelvis7413 exactly. Flu shots. Thank you for agreeing and seeing the light.
@TheGnarTube
2 жыл бұрын
suicide pilot making this look like a mistake
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
This video leaves out a lot of cockpit recordings and details and this was discussed in the cockpit recordings. The Captain did not know because he did not have a GPS. The copilot offered to let Captain use his iPad and the Captain declined.
@FaFaFohie
2 жыл бұрын
The sloppiness and incompetence of these two pilots is astounding. Thankfully, no one else was hurt.
@MikeJones-rk1un
4 жыл бұрын
Before I pilot my next flight I'm going to take some flying lessons.
@Chevy3278
4 жыл бұрын
Except you are going to need to trust a pilot to teach you to be one.
@MikeJones-rk1un
4 жыл бұрын
@@Chevy3278 My doctor was trained by a doctor.
@vikramm5908
3 жыл бұрын
That sounds like a good idea 👌
@Helibeaver
3 жыл бұрын
Me too bro
@cardinaldriver
3 жыл бұрын
Why? Lessons are a ripoff!
@b767greg
5 жыл бұрын
As a 767 Captain with over 13,000 hours it is painful to watch this video seeing so many mistakes made and SOP not being followed. And after reading the Flying Mag article I can't for the life of me figure how these two ended up in an aircraft cockpit! The definition of professional is doing the right thing when no one is watching. Thank God no one else was killed. RIP.
@jennydiazvigneault5548
5 жыл бұрын
As a completely unqualified person who can't fly and had no medical training, I feel qualified to say that the captain was impaired by drugs and alcohol. I suggest a review of training procedures and hiring practices by the company. I suggest digging up his corpse and charging it with murder.
@glennquagmire3258
5 жыл бұрын
@@jennydiazvigneault5548 You aren't even qualified to know standard NTSB investigations. They would have looked for that and they didn't mention it because it was not a factor.
@b767greg
5 жыл бұрын
@@glennquagmire3258 I would have to agree. Every crash involves a toxicology report done on all of the pilots. Nothing was mentioned in the investigation as a factor.
@stratoleft
5 жыл бұрын
@@glennquagmire3258 I'm qualified enough to know a flight plan when its filed, and how to follow it. Your flight hours means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING as far as I'm concerned. Your NTSB "investigation" into John Kennedy Jr., as well as TWA flt. 800, shows that, at best, your FAA is comprised of criminals.
@Bartonovich52
5 жыл бұрын
Oh @ Stratoleft. Lulz... you’re just showing your inexperience. Flight plans in IFR flight are mostly for basic intentions and in case of communication failures. You accept your IFR clearance, and then enroute you ask for or are cleared different things. The type of approach you do is never in the flight plan. Usually only the arrival STAR is... which can be for multiple runways or if the runway changes or you might get recleared a different STAR or put on vectors for an approach. It’s when you are cleared the approach that you have to comply with that clearance provided you’ve accepted it in the form of a readback. So fly heading XXX to intercept the localizer, cleared ILS 6 circling 1 was the clearance he should have complied with. Not in the flight plan whatsofucking ever. Stick to flight simulator.
@cloudstreets1396
5 жыл бұрын
Controller: cross DANDY at 1500. Captain: Cross DANDY at 200. That sounds about right.
@Pantdino
5 жыл бұрын
I feel sorry for the first officer. He knew he was in over his head and asked the captain to take over, but he didn’t. Captain killed both of them.
@richardbelt3716
5 жыл бұрын
Pantdino Very true.
@robbiebunge859
5 жыл бұрын
He was a second officer who knew he wasn't certified to fly, just observe.
@jetseat
5 жыл бұрын
Exactly
@kimkoch7482
5 жыл бұрын
Suicide murder?
@davidwarkentin9848
5 жыл бұрын
spot on my friend. The SIC asked the PIC multiple times to take the controls.
@larrymcintyre5693
3 жыл бұрын
These guys had no business in that plane. I am a former Naval Aviator, and flew the F-14. I flew a Citation III with a former Air Force F-4 pilot. We always went by every check list, double checked each other, and always determined who was driving and who was backup, before we lit the fires
@merlin4809
5 жыл бұрын
I am reminded of an old saying: Takeoffs are optional, but landings are mandatory. These two should have stayed on the ground.
@janfuger1517
5 жыл бұрын
Someone told me that it was 10% getting it up in the air, 20% keeping it up in the air, and 70% getting the plane back on the ground in one piece. It used to be that most anybody could get a driver's license but only a few could their pilot's license; now it seems like most anybody can do both!
@havenrich
3 жыл бұрын
@@janfuger1517 A license is not a guarantee of ability!
@md65000
3 жыл бұрын
After yelling "Airspeed" 2 or 3 times to no effect, maybe he should have just slammed the throttles forward himself.
@Daywalker_27
2 жыл бұрын
Kinda reminded of UA FLT 173, flight crew kept trying to tell the captain they had fuel problems while he was trying to diagnose another issue. They ran out of fuel over a populated area near a airport.
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
Coulda shoulda......
@SOLDOZER
Жыл бұрын
The SIC had extreme difficultly flying the plane and had no business touching anything.
@terrencebradley5417
5 жыл бұрын
The SIC knew he had no business flying that aircraft and probably suspected that the "captain" didn't either.
@DumbledoreMcCracken
5 жыл бұрын
Go around! Jesus. They aren't flying a glider. If sufficient fuel, go someplace easier.
@zacharyw4628
5 жыл бұрын
DumbledoreMcCracken No place is “easier” for a momo like this captain. He had a history, apparently.
@commentatron
5 жыл бұрын
Too bad the SIC didn't have a qualified TIC.
@DevSolar
5 жыл бұрын
9:03 Tower: "You gonna start that turn?" Captain: "Ah... unable. Can we try the approach again please?" Minor impact on your ego, much less of an impact on the ground. Two lives saved by one simple admittance that you screwed up.
@MarcDufresneosorusrex
3 жыл бұрын
i was curious if they could make a left turn around to runway one; i think the copilot would have had to ask the Capt if he can see the runway from his side of the cockpit; .. but he just wasn't comfortable; I feel bad for the young co pilot though
@MarcDufresneosorusrex
3 жыл бұрын
I come back every so often ; i have to with this flight because i get the feeling that flying every plane is a different experience. This is probably the case with a small jet like this one. But it's just a little too big to pull off a Tomcat stunt (fighter jet). I only have Cessna experience which to me is like being inside an angry mosquito
@Ktaurus26
2 жыл бұрын
Learjet 35 crash in san San Diego this week is eerily similar.
@moggmusic
5 жыл бұрын
I am in aviation but not a pilot, after watching this and reading quite a few of the comments I think the lack of cockpit communication, and obvious distraction from the left seat was very likely caused by texting. The video reminded me of my vain attempts to navigate and land the Lear in MS Flight Sim in the late 90s after 3 successful Cessna 172 landings.
@bhollingsworth
5 жыл бұрын
This is such a strange case. It's almost as if the Captain wanted this outcome.
@lm1584
5 жыл бұрын
no, he was likely imparied to some degree and thought his shit-hot, last minute antics would save the situation.
@Sovereign_Citizen_LEO
5 жыл бұрын
@Anton Zuykov - The question is then how the hell did he get his pilot's licence and type certification rating (not to mention a job with that company)?
@dropcapapp
5 жыл бұрын
SkylineToTheSeaAndMe No
@rjf347
5 жыл бұрын
@@Sovereign_Citizen_LEO Did he????
@scottbaker1018
5 жыл бұрын
Nobby Barnes Pathetic crybaby toddler 😂😂😂
@hllboi817
5 жыл бұрын
So many fuckups in soo little time... if there was anything left of that captain, they shouldve pulled a toxicology report
@justtowatch111
5 жыл бұрын
That is quite possibly the exact reason for this incident.
@normhsmilton2048
5 жыл бұрын
That was my first thought , was this captain impaired or intoxicated? It certainly seems he was
@steveburton5825
5 жыл бұрын
The tox reports came back clean... this was pure, unadulterated, incompetence - from both of them. The SIC had over 450 hours in a Lear and he still couldn't hold a heading or altitude? Whomever checked these two out was also criminally incompetent.
@ivanabcdefg9375
5 жыл бұрын
@@steveburton5825 he held a heading just fine. His captain told him conflicting crap. Maybe we should pull a toxicology report on *you*
@steveburton5825
5 жыл бұрын
@@ivanabcdefg9375 You're beyond help if you can't even follow a youtube video...
@stevesolo16
5 жыл бұрын
When the known course of the Lear was bringing them to within visual range of two other airports it is shocking to hear such little regard was placed upon their approach.
@airplanegeek893
4 жыл бұрын
The most unprofessional flight crew I ever heard of. Lots of lessons to learn from this one.
@kneel1
4 жыл бұрын
Haha you wrote this months before that Pakistan flight 8303 - u should look that one up. They werent as arrogant but seemed just as inept
@OMGWTFLOLSMH
4 жыл бұрын
This company must be desperate for pilots.
@billyray3761
5 жыл бұрын
A lot of confusion in the cockpit, and a captain not qualified as a Lear instructor. Tragic and totally preventable.
@pyromcr
5 жыл бұрын
Where do these people come from and how do they get jobs? Just mindblowing...
@andyburk4825
5 жыл бұрын
More common than many realize - last fall a biz jet over ran runway at Greenville SC broke in two - crew fatals, pax serious injuries. Pilot was technically not certificated for that a/c.
@DumbledoreMcCracken
5 жыл бұрын
Mutual admiration society is in full force with these two. I hope I don't fly with their equals.
@naughtyUphillboy
5 жыл бұрын
@@andyburk4825 IT was a falcon 50, beautiful aircraft, ignorant crew, however RIP
@gregbuck701
5 жыл бұрын
@@naughtyUphillboy the video of the crash shows it's a lear.....tip tanks.
@ohwell2790
5 жыл бұрын
@@naughtyUphillboy Why rest in peace? Thank goodness they did not kill anyone else.
@EnabledShooter
5 жыл бұрын
They zigzagged back-and-forth, deviating from the flightpath multiple times, violated airspeed requirements multiple times, ignored altitude instructions, ignored radio frequency instructions, failed to circle properly for approach to runway 1. This flight was doomed from the start. Fortunately, no one else was on the plane.
@moshunit96
5 жыл бұрын
Thats just scary knowing that guy was somehow a licensed pilot.
@andytaylor1588
5 жыл бұрын
had to have been intoxicated.
@ldlink3935
5 жыл бұрын
@@andytaylor1588 I think it was a suicide mission...the guy had given up. The SIC should have called a mayday and attempted to land the thing himself after knocking the "captain" out somehow.
@Pip2andahalf
5 жыл бұрын
I though both of those things as well. What the fuck. So weird. Wish there was analysis as well! Crazy.
@peterkay2406
5 жыл бұрын
not no more is he a licensed pilot
@markh1427
5 жыл бұрын
@@ldlink3935 sic had NO control whats so ever with plane 40second before crash plane was all over the place durning the off #6 approach.
@stefeniedavidmusic
5 жыл бұрын
Reminds me of a guy that worked for Skycraft in the 1980s. Won't mention his name but he was a total know-it-all. I could see him doing something like this. How he ever got and kept his job was always beyond me. Some just slip through the cracks.
@achristian7015
5 жыл бұрын
Talk about being miles behind the aircraft. Incredible that they would even be in in such a high performance aircraft.
@peterduxbury927
5 жыл бұрын
Thank God that Captain was not controlling an Airbus A380 or any large commercial aircraft.
@user-sp8eb6iz7f
5 жыл бұрын
For god so loved the world, that he crashed this plane.
@333anders6
5 жыл бұрын
a380 wudda been gtfo
@markh1427
5 жыл бұрын
At least the big planes have auto land....
@user-sp8eb6iz7f
5 жыл бұрын
@@markh1427 Thank you god for all the plane crashes - Amen - cora madonda massondanda (that's typing in tongues).
@TrueLoveNetwork
5 жыл бұрын
@@markh1427 So does the Lear. I'm almost certain this plane can land itself.
@Tele999zzz
4 жыл бұрын
As a non flyer, it staggers me that ATC rattle off instructions so quickly. In any other environment, if your goal is to be understood, you speak slowly and clearly. Just seems to increase pressure in the cockpit, at the very least it seems unhelpful
@GaZonk100
3 жыл бұрын
xackly!
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
You get used to it as a pilot and can rattle it back just as fast.
@dustchip8060
5 жыл бұрын
This appears to be more of suicide and murder on the captains part.
@carolclmcm1214
5 жыл бұрын
I had this feeling too, watching and listening to this. Like everything was going according to his plan. *shivers*
@lunaazule1899
4 жыл бұрын
That's what I thought as well. Just like MH370
@lunaazule1899
4 жыл бұрын
@tinwoods Or a very smart one.
@stephenm103
2 жыл бұрын
Wow! just listening to this video only I'm struck by the amount of confusion/uncertainty and lack of situational awareness on the part of this Captain. Anyone know if he was ultimately confirmed as impaired??? My first thought was the guy knew he was impaired and didnt want to assume command. FO seems to know they are in trouble and hand off control to the Captain - but Captain refuses (?!)
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
This video leaves out a ton of cockpit recordings and details. There was nothing wrong with the Captain. He was just distracted and busy trying to show the copilot how to fly the plane the whole time. The copilot had a very terrible training track record, failed multiple tests and crashed the plane twice on approach in the simulator, basically failed everything and that's why he was only authorized to call out instruments. In the simulator it was noted that he had a hard time just simply maintaining airspeed. Instead of realizing this kid is terrible at flying the plane and taking the controls back, the Captain tried to make him fly it anyways. When the Captain finally took controls, for some reason he still attempted to land on runway 1 even though they were in no position to to do. He stalled it and crashed.
@stephenm103
2 жыл бұрын
@@SOLDOZER OK - I'll accept your premise. Bottom line - total loss of situational awareness by the captain - - FO seems to know they were in trouble when he suggests handling of command to the captain - captain ignores the FO's request (for reasons you suggest that he was too busy "training" or helping the FO????)
@duanebidoux6087
5 жыл бұрын
Wow, that takes incompetence to another level altogether.
@unclefreddy2009
5 жыл бұрын
Awful, rest in peace. This went wrong from takeoff to crash. Even though it was complete lack of situational awareness, this was an instant missed approach once the realized they were lined up incorrectly a mile out. Puzzling.
@JohnS916
5 жыл бұрын
Makes me wonder how many tragic accidents could have been avoided if only the pilot swallowed his pride instead of trying to pull off a miracle to save face. Generally speaking, I think many pilots have huge egos, thinking they are the smartest person in the cockpit, maybe some are, but everybody makes mistakes, these accident videos are proof of that.
@longshot7601
5 жыл бұрын
Reading about the incident in Flying magazine it looks like even the captain wasn't qualified to occupy the seat he was in. Both pilots had multiple failed check rides.
@kewkabe
5 жыл бұрын
Read the accident report. Both were properly qualified. And you can retake a checkride if you fail.
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
@@kewkabe The SIC was rated a 0 out of 4 in his training and crashed multiple times in the simulator. That's why he was only authorized to call out instruments.
@gmcjetpilot
5 жыл бұрын
This is sobering. I've seen the NTSB videos of security camara footage. There are at least 5 angles to the crash... shocking.
@jjducharme1
5 жыл бұрын
Wow, it's like the pilot never flew a plane before. He did nothing the controllers asked him to do. How bizarre how bizarre.
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
The Captain was not flying the plane, the SIC was. And the SIC had a terrible training record, failed almost everything and crashed twice in the simulator. That's why he was only authorized to call out instruments.
@sterlingarcher4989
5 жыл бұрын
Let’s all talk as quick as possible and hope everything works out fine.
@georgemallory797
5 жыл бұрын
I can't imagine not using at minimum a short verbal checklist with another crewmember present. Mindblowing. Checklists are drummed into ANY pilot by the time he/she has soloed their first single engine propeller airplane. I don't get it.
@ABC-rh7zc
4 жыл бұрын
it's called a god complex
@mitchg7809
2 жыл бұрын
Reading the CVR transcripts of this reminds me a lot of the Air Florida crash in DC. Both captains were about equally as incompetent & had first officers that were frustrated/intimidated by them.
@tweetdriver
4 жыл бұрын
While I agree with pretty much all the comments I've read, I'm going to add one more thing. (Forgive me if somebody already said this, and I just didn't see it.) ATC bares some responsibility here too. They are one link in the chain. Ever heard a controller say something like, "Too far left/too low for a safe approach, execute missed approach. Fly heading XXX, Climb and maintain X thousand. Contact Approach, 123.45?" Teterboro Tower is a RADAR facility, and at some point should have told the crew they were no longer in a position to safely circle to runway 1. At the point when the tower controller asked if they were going to start their turn, he should have instead told them to break it off, give them some climb out instructions, and sent them back to approach to try again.
@lsun1409
4 жыл бұрын
totally makes sense! the controller was probably more interested in other trivial things than landing that jet.ATC people have blood in their hands but they probably were not even in the NTSB investigative radar.
@philiptadros4981
5 жыл бұрын
So much is wrong with how this flight is conducted. It's hard to know where to begin. These pilots had no business flying. No CRM, no company procedures, unqualified FO, unprofessional (possibly incompetent) captain, no proper radio communications. I mean where do you begin?
@toddlavigne6441
5 жыл бұрын
How could the pilot not realize he was heading down to the ground rapidly, the footage reveals it was a clear day? Not a pilot, but the ATC talks so quickly but I guess if you know what your doing it's easier to comprehend what is being said, but do they talk that fast because they are extremely busy. Kinda seems like the problem with doctors prescriptions, in that the speed-talking increases chances of miscommunication. Just like sloppy hand writing.
@NoelKerns
5 жыл бұрын
@@toddlavigne6441 - Yeah, controllers in the NYC area are extremely busy. And you're correct, as a pilot, you're used to a a stream of information coming rapidly from ATC, and if you're head is in the game and you're not impaired, it's not a problem. I doubt this incompetent PIC ever even glanced at the approach plate for Teterboro before flying into some of the busiest airspace in the world.
@toddlavigne6441
5 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the info. How can someone who appears to be this incompetent ever get their license/ approval to fly this small jet? Seems as though this accident should never have happened.
@TrueLoveNetwork
5 жыл бұрын
@@toddlavigne6441 The SIC made the worst mistake: *he* was flying (whether he "should have been" or not isn't relevant) and *he* confirmed the turn but *failed* to exercise it, which led to the immediate loss of lift due to altitude loss via the abrupt low speed turn; resulting in the stall, roll to inversion; and the final brutal crash.
@toddlavigne6441
5 жыл бұрын
thanks for the feedback....terrible crash
@jerrycowand8090
5 жыл бұрын
Lesson number one!!! Aviate, Navigate, Communicate. They got behind the airplane and failed to break the error chain. Then they paid for it.
@jcwoodman5285
5 жыл бұрын
What sort of 'state' was this Cap in? Impaired?
@donc9751
5 жыл бұрын
@@alleycatvietnam Good article, thanks for posting that link!
@daveth121864
5 жыл бұрын
@@alleycatvietnam OMG! These pilots were a disaster. Their records speak for themselves! I encourage everyone to read this article.
@sailorman8668
5 жыл бұрын
@Ranger.Infantry At no stage did ATC give instructions to turn downwind.
@sailorman8668
5 жыл бұрын
@Ranger.Infantry No probs, but if what you say was said, wasn't actually said ('turn downwind') then your 'joke' pretty much falls flat. It just becomes 'manufactured'.
@hogey74
5 жыл бұрын
My thoughts/question also. Aside from the violation of a bunch of rules, he didn't know how long the flight was going to be from the start. I'd say he made many poor decisions before even launching. The impairment could have been anything from drugs to a massively concerning issue away from the cockpit, based on listening to this. His 2 weeks prior to the accident flight would have been revealing.
@mdd1963
4 жыл бұрын
The video certainly eliminates the need to ask if anyone survived it...
@michaelnunya122
5 жыл бұрын
Jesus! What this captain did is criminal.
@williepierce3933
5 жыл бұрын
He should receive the death penalty! Oh wait......
@ronwilliams357
5 жыл бұрын
What FAR did he violate? They were operating under part 91 by the way.
@gordo1163
4 жыл бұрын
@@ronwilliams357 He was beyond incompetent. He was not fit to be a captain at all if you simply watched the video. He didn't run any checklist, he gave wrong information to the SIC, and ignored the SIC at times. And you're asking "wHat FAR dId hE vIoLaTe?"
@icegiant1000
2 жыл бұрын
It's amazing how many planes crash because of a stall, almost all of them could have been avoided if they had only watched their airspeed. If I was a pilot, I think that would be my number one obsession.
@firstname2807
2 жыл бұрын
Keeping a close watch on your airspeed would make you a very safe pilot.
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
You can stall at any airspeed. You clearly have zero experience and just another keyboard pilot.
@jeffbarr6816
5 жыл бұрын
I am not a pilot but I clearly understood the controller's instructions. This crash should never have occurred.
@mittysmith4265
5 жыл бұрын
A student pilot who gotten to the point of soloing has more comprehension of flying than these guys did.
@MIKEPGH
5 жыл бұрын
I've experienced pilots of all hours and experiences that have egos and worse off complacency. An instructor that had complacency and "flight school pressure" ended my flying. Situations become routine and people become lazy. Okay for flight sim and video games. NOT okay for real life. It ends in tragedy or disappointment.
@TakeDeadAim
5 жыл бұрын
Remember that first day in flight school when you heard "Stay AHEAD of your aircraft? THIS is what happens when you're way behind the curve and have lost almost all SITNESS. Making a turn like that is OK in your 182 on the short final into 27 at Oshkosh...not so much in a Lear.
@crooked-halo
5 жыл бұрын
TakeDeadAim - No, a turn like that in any airplane is not ok on short final. Many stall/spin accidents occur on short final, low & slow, with flaps & gear hanging out, while overshooting the runway center-line. One thing I remember well from early training is my wonderful, old, former military instructor practically yelling at me "NEVER, EVER bank that much on downwind to base or base to final!" While yanking the yoke out of my hands and banking back to the right. I still, thankfully, hear him to this day on many approaches.
@JohnS916
5 жыл бұрын
A turn like that is what it looked like Jack Roush tried to do when he crashed his jet at OshKosh. The approach looked more like Roush was trying to show-off, lucky outcome.
@benevolentdictator2315
5 жыл бұрын
I am surprised the military's flight anomaly detection system did not call for intervention. Excellent NTSB explanation.
@kewkabe
5 жыл бұрын
They were civilian, not military.
@Helibeaver
5 жыл бұрын
Good addition to the airboyd vids.
@NetCerpher
5 жыл бұрын
Thanks for this. I vote for as many as you can so we can learn from others mistakes.
@golbey4780
5 жыл бұрын
I'm just a private pilot but the dreadful "flying" here is thankfully very rare. When ATC give a pilot an instruction that has to be complied with unless an emergency is declared. Ignoring the "Captain" for a moment, the SIC had no business to hold that position on that flight if he wasn't capable of completing it to a safe and successful landing. As for the "Captain" ... he had no business to be in charge of that flight .. or any other flight ... the SIC should have had enough experience to take control of the aircraft ... to override the idiot "Captain" ... unbelievable,
@ronwilliams357
5 жыл бұрын
The SIC was in control of the aircraft for all but the last 15 seconds. And no you don't fight for control when you're in a stall 400 feet AGL.
@spokev
4 жыл бұрын
Not a pilot, here (and I'd probably crap myself flying thru any part of NYC airspace) but, it doesn't look complicated, I bet even I could do it. Fly to TORBY, turn right til you see the big stadium, turn left after the big stadium to get a visual on the runway, hand the controls back over to the guy who actually knows what he's doing to put it on the ground. Did I miss something?
@jumpinjack1
4 жыл бұрын
The problem started when captain thought they were hundreds of miles away and never caught up, then found the true stall speed trying to salvage the approach. Good vid of to much complacency and a true shortage of qualified pilots.
@jugheadjones5458
2 жыл бұрын
Maybe the problem started when the captain got into the cockpit. Not disagreeing with you. How could he think they were hundreds of miles away when he should’ve known the distance from the get go? Maybe he was being cocky. Being cocky cost 2 lives and damaged families.
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
@@jugheadjones5458 Cockpit voice recordings left out of this video, this is discussed. The Captain had no GPS, the SIC told him he was wrong and offer Captain the use of his iPad.
@perfectscotty
5 жыл бұрын
I’ve done this approach many times, it can be a can of worms if you don’t brief it. These guys didn’t do any briefings or follow SOP’s do Darwin Award it is.
@essel23fly
4 жыл бұрын
I used to do this approach when I flew out of TEB, I can’t believe what they must have been seeing. The approach is tight enough even when you make that normal turn but to do it like a mile away is insane
@essel23fly
4 жыл бұрын
Gregg Re no it’s very doable as long as you make that turn from the fix and fly around the MetLife stadium.
@GGiblet
4 жыл бұрын
Thank you for having the CVR it really adds a lot and I love the narration 🌟 New subscriber here
@fanoflakespeed9460
5 жыл бұрын
How did this guy get to be Captain?
@NetCerpher
5 жыл бұрын
Seems he just added a stripe.
@jordanstrub7316
4 жыл бұрын
@@NetCerpher or two..
@thegardenofeatin5965
4 жыл бұрын
Sporty's just sells four-stripe epaulets for $20 a pair.
@5153flash
4 жыл бұрын
After watching many of these crash videos,,it is clear that living near a airport is dangerous.
@donnafromnyc
4 жыл бұрын
Right now I am sitting at max 1 mile from that runway. I am from the town that overlooks TEB and the sound of those jets is the sound of home. The plane crashed at the DPW in Carlstadt and damaged a factory/warehouse, fortunately with no one killed.Those two fools could have killed many in the towns on the other side of Route 17. I also read that the PIC wasn't cleared to fly the Lear either.
@SOLDOZER
Жыл бұрын
The dude was a SIC-0. Had no business at all doing anything but sitting there.
@mytmousemalibu
5 жыл бұрын
Jeebus cripes, wtf! No adherence to company policy, not complying with ATC, no situational awareness... no wonder they lawn-darted the Lear. There is no room nor time for that garbage in aviation especially in a high performance jet. Everything happens a lot faster which means you are in serious trouble much faster. Glad they didn't have any passengers or kill anyone on the ground.
@AC_702
5 жыл бұрын
Chilling to listen and see it happen
@MkmeOrg
5 жыл бұрын
Ugh heartbreaking. Never push a bad approach...
@ohwell2790
5 жыл бұрын
Not heart breaking at all. Now if these two idiots had killed other that would be. They won't be around to do that and that is good.
@conspiraciesarejustgreatst2059
5 жыл бұрын
I remember this accident very clearly. A family member of mine works for the FAA out of Philly so we had a few discussions of what could cause something like that. He expressed that he couldn't tm about this accident in particular but did say that previous accidents like this usually involved someone who has a serious mental problem or is under the influence. This plane flew above my house and where I was working that day. So sad how this captain not only committed suicide but also took a good man with him
@rickfeith6372
5 жыл бұрын
Is it suicide??? Or is it just a simple case of D'oh, I have no clue what to do icide? I think the latter might ge the culprit.
@lsun1409
4 жыл бұрын
Maybe you should not spout this type of comments without having all the facts and reading the NTSB official report. or better yet, cease to exist!
@thomashughes_teh
5 жыл бұрын
I just kept asking "why?"
@getoffmylawn8986
4 жыл бұрын
You and me both, buddy.
@yohonomoe5095
5 жыл бұрын
This whole time I was thinking it was hard IMC. Looked like a perfect day. What a shame, it’s too bad some lessons are only learned this way.
@ronarnott1801
5 жыл бұрын
No professionalism at all here. I believe the captain must have been super distracted about something not associated with flying that day.
@commentatron
5 жыл бұрын
He was checking KZitem for landing procedures.
@marsstubblefield
4 жыл бұрын
he was doing blow in the cockpit
@ItsCarlnotCarla
2 жыл бұрын
WHen I was in the Air Force I caught a ride in a chase place (something like that) for F-15's from the base anyway it was a great flight but the SIC was new and nervous I dont think he ever landed one. Anyway he asked the pilot to take the controls about 1 minute from landing the pilot refused and told him he could do and talked him to landing which he did. But man watching this made me realize how short life is. that plane is a rocket too , taking off and landing
@richardbelt3716
5 жыл бұрын
At no point was the Captain ahead of this aircraft. Poor souls. RIP.
@eduardo88
5 жыл бұрын
Can you imagine how messy that cockpit coordination was? That’s sad
@MrFg1980
5 жыл бұрын
Yes. It was the surveillance video that cemented it.
@ohwell2790
5 жыл бұрын
Not sad. So glad they died and no one else.
@3dsman
5 жыл бұрын
@@ohwell2790 Can't use the word glad in any respect. Especially for the SIC... poor bastard.
@3dsman
5 жыл бұрын
@@MrFg1980 "cemented it"... that there's funny!
@whophlungdung482
5 жыл бұрын
Completely the PIC's fault. This incident clearly demonstrates that there is absolutely no tolerance for not following procedures. That's why it exists...
@Jhihmoac
3 жыл бұрын
I'm not a pilot, but even if they had managed to land safely at Teterboro, wouldn't there have been enough done and documented to get them both grounded and/or fined?
@chucksavall
2 жыл бұрын
Nope.
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
If they landed safely they would not get anything more than a "bonehead" mumbled by ATC.
@wethackrey
5 жыл бұрын
This was the most incompetent and disengaged captain I think I've ever heard of. One gets the impression from his actions that he was impaired by alcohol or drugs. How does he think they're still hundreds of mies away if he filed a flight plan? Unbelievable! The poor first officer, as is too often the case, showed complete deference to the captain. It's a shame he didn't say "Dude! I'm not doing this! Take the g@&&am controls!"
@rinzler9775
2 жыл бұрын
Even if in theory there was zero flight plan - the aircraft has top notch GPS that shows you exactly where you are. Its not like he was flying with a paper map, stopwatch and compass.
@SOLDOZER
Жыл бұрын
@@rinzler9775 He did not have GPS that's why. The SIC offered him to use his iPad by Cap declined. This video leaves out some details.
@rinzler9775
Жыл бұрын
Having the PIC and SIC in disagreement is a dangerous situation. Sometimes having thousands of hours can be just as dangerousxas too little - it develops a potential immortality power that because nothing happenned in the last 10,000 hours, then "all I do is good" thinking.
@SOLDOZER
Жыл бұрын
@@rinzler9775 Captain was like 52 years old and only had 6,000 hours. Another oddity.
@theflyinglawyer5411
4 жыл бұрын
For me, this highlights the requirement for a legal obligation upon airlines to pair junior/inexperienced pilots with experienced pilots with an excellent track record.
@chateaupig826
4 жыл бұрын
Thank God this wasn't a passenger jet flight
@jjaus
5 жыл бұрын
No checklists? This guy was a cowboy.
@michaelmarfell7442
5 жыл бұрын
The captain had to be impaired in order to demonstrate this level of incompetence.
@glennquagmire3258
5 жыл бұрын
That would make more sense but wasn't the case according to to the report.
@joeyjamison5772
4 жыл бұрын
And neither bothered with the check list? Then it was inevitable. I drove past there 2 weeks later and while passing the airport, briefly turned my head, taking a quick glance, thinking about what had just happened. It gave me a sickening chill.
@copperheadh1052
5 жыл бұрын
Hundreds of miles away????what the hell?
@333anders6
5 жыл бұрын
the findings were bs! philly isnt even hundreds of miles from teeter/ proves he was on sumthin
@notthefather3919
4 жыл бұрын
@@333anders6 did they release tox results?
@333anders6
4 жыл бұрын
@@notthefather3919 yeah and he WASNT the father
@notthefather3919
4 жыл бұрын
@@333anders6😐
@333anders6
4 жыл бұрын
@@notthefather3919 totally sure they did but ive not researched it
@SsgtMcNasty1
5 жыл бұрын
Apparently, that captain is a shining example of "Fake it till you make it".
@janfuger1517
5 жыл бұрын
In this case that didn't work.
@htos1av
5 жыл бұрын
I'm not even a pilot but these guys were lost in space.
@stephenrich3029
5 жыл бұрын
Was the SIC incapable of flying the jet himself? Thought by the time you were sitting in the cockpit of something like a Learjet that you’d have enough hours to know file/review your flight plan prior to depart, know how to fly your plane, know how follow simple ATC instructions, and know how to land. Just WTF.
@ronwilliams357
5 жыл бұрын
Yes, he was type rated and proficient. It was company policy to have him only doing monitoring duties but legally he was allowed to fly.
@SOLDOZER
2 жыл бұрын
SIC had a terrible training record, failing almost everything and had a record crashing planes in the simulator. That's why he was only authorized to call out instruments. Instead of just calling out instruments, Captain bonehead had him flying a real plane which he also almost crashed. When Captain bonehead took over they were way off course and he still tried to bank hard and still land on Runway 1. Only they had no speed, he stalled it and POOF!
@gendaminoru3195
5 жыл бұрын
WTF, capt was drunk. I knew I didn't want to watch this thing - avoided clicking it for weeks. How can he say we're doing it when no attempt is made, then both totally forgot about "lawn darts at the end." I've done circling in MD-80s at JFK and can tell you ATC has no patience for this. After 2 years I am going to amend my remarks -- in the wake of a similar L-35 crash at Gilespie, CA -- to say that ATC probably should have told them to go around when they went less than a mile out and still had not started the circling maneuver. They MIGHT have lived if they woke up to what was going on as they never established a stabilized approach and it only got worse throughout what they did.
@steveburton5825
5 жыл бұрын
The tox reports came back clean on both of them. They were both doing their best Leo DiCaprio imitation of being a pilot.
@gendaminoru3195
5 жыл бұрын
geezus christopher, shame on the management. And I place no blame at all on ATC. If anything they were a little too patient with this crew.
@markh1427
5 жыл бұрын
Definetily not doing their best.
@budwhite9591
3 жыл бұрын
@@steveburton5825 Leo, that’s exactly what I thought. Must have thought the SIC would carry him through. SIC at best knew he was over his head, and as soon as the PIC touched the stick, boom!
@gusm5128
3 жыл бұрын
What was left of them to do tox tests ? Be fkn vaporised into mist
@TheBeingReal
4 жыл бұрын
Really impressive both pilots f’d up that bad, that many times.
@seinfeld11123
5 жыл бұрын
some things the FAA/tower can take from this. they failed to follow many instructions. after the 3 rd failed instruction. perhaps tower could have said sir I am declaring a pan pan for you. climb maintain 2,000 feet. and then vector them in very closely and get them back onto the localizer and get them back on the ILS etc . that might have been the only way to avoid this. The problem is approach/departure/Tower is always hella busy . but as Isaid after the 3rd order/instruction. id be worried
@sundevilification
5 жыл бұрын
This X Controller concurs. Well stated..
@chuckschillingvideos
5 жыл бұрын
I think that may be asking too much of the ATC - that is one hell of a crowded airspace and it's probably all they can do to keep 'em from running into each other. Also, it would be a mistake to judge ATC too narrowly, solely based on the transcriptions to/from the Lear because in the existing wind conditions there were probably many other aircraft having similar difficulties holding to the directed course, altitude, etc. They likely had their hands more than full handling general aviation as it was.
@sundevilification
5 жыл бұрын
@@chuckschillingvideos Yes. I have personally overlooked situations due to higher volume. It really was a pilot problem. If the transponder was and it probably was then TCAS would help with conflicts. I think I will reserve any statements until I get my eyes on the NTSB report and findings. Thanks for the input.
@Bartonovich52
5 жыл бұрын
Uh.... towers don’t declare pan pans. They can just give the punishment vectors and go from there. Tower should have cancelled approach or landing clearance and said to go around
@seinfeld11123
5 жыл бұрын
@@Bartonovich52 towers and ATC have declared emergencies for ppl all the time. they do it for VFR only pilots getting stuck in IMC. plus engine issues over the water. nicko's wings is perfect example they declared an emergency for him when he had engine problems
@airboyd
5 жыл бұрын
NTSB Docket CEN17MA183 go.usa.gov/xnsUu
@matthewstuart4840
5 жыл бұрын
Truly baffles me. Never were they ahead of the approach.
@johnroddy8756
5 жыл бұрын
The Actions of a mad man ,He took the second in command with him
@effemess
5 жыл бұрын
There is no way either these two people should have been at the controls of this aircraft, they displayed no airmanship whatsoever, from a retired Captain!
@NutmegThumper
4 жыл бұрын
Great video, maps and narration!
@Bartonovich52
5 жыл бұрын
I have no idea how he could have died considering he was at least 50 miles behind the aircraft. Didn’t know how long the flight was since he asked for higher altitude and wondered why they said approach and runways in use. All the while trying to teach and monitor this kid what sounds like basic flight maneuvers. Had no situational awareness on the approach-even just tune up an NDB and watch the needle on the RMI.. you’ll know exactly where you are in relation to it-never mind the moving map I’m sure he had. Not aware of the descent profile. Every good jet pilot knows 1000 feet/3 miles instinctively. Not listening to his SIC who is getting nervous, completely helpless, and wants you to take control. And finally... trying to salvage a bad approach by hot dogging a high performance aircraft rather than fling missed, collecting yourself, rebriefing, and attempting again.
@markk364
5 жыл бұрын
"A background check on the captain discovered he had a 2002 driver’s license suspended due to an excess of points that was not reported on his most recent medical application as required. He was also in 1986 convicted of assault with a deadly weapon, a charge that was reduced to a misdemeanor, but was also not self-reported on his recent medical certificate. The captain’s training records uncovered a number of failed checkrides, including a December 1996 disapproval for a certified flight instructor rating, a November 1997 disapproval for a commercial pilot certificate and a February 2001 disapproval for a multi-engine airline transport pilot certificate. He did eventually earn his commercial and ATP certificate." "Training records from CAE reported issues with the captain transitioning to the left seat of the Learjet in October 2016. In July 2016, CAE records indicated the captain was found not proficient in circling approaches and not recommended for his type rating checkride. Specifically, the captain’s CAE instructor on July 17, 2016 reported to his boss that “the Captain had been out of the airplane for 7 years and the instructor could not recommend the Captain for a check ride due to a lack of proficiency.” Excerpts from: www.flyingmag.com/teterboro-learjet-crash-raises-questions-about-crew-qualifications
@jnichols3
5 жыл бұрын
Sounds like the SIC knew he was in a situation over his head early on and wanted the Captain to take control, but for whatever reason he would not.
@navelriver
5 жыл бұрын
Indeed! Mind boggling!
@OOpSjm
5 жыл бұрын
Because the captain was obviously out of it.
@adamw.8579
5 жыл бұрын
@@OOpSjm Even unexperienced pilot may abort approach, call for goaround vectors, engage autopilot and kick captain ass hard few times. Better being living unemployed than hired dead.
@3dsman
5 жыл бұрын
He even TOLD the captain "I don't want to F this up". Hard to understand what the captain was thinking unless maybe he wanted to crash... we'll never know but we do know the cap had a really bad track record. One wonders why the owner of that plane ever hired him given his terrible resume.
@kewkabe
5 жыл бұрын
The captain did take control.
@chuckkirkpatrick6712
2 жыл бұрын
And this exact same accident repeated itself on Dec. 27, 2021...
@Snowboard4466
5 жыл бұрын
As the SIC asked Clint Eastwood, " Excuse me captain but can you fly ?" Clint Eastwood, " No , never had a lesson. " and it still had a better ending that that Lear.
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