The difference in power when you bumped it up to 100 grains of powder with 2oz of shot was obvious. Your videos are awesome sir.
@domarinolo6947
3 жыл бұрын
Thank you Mike. Great insight and information. Nothing beats range time and a note book . Always enjoy your work.
@Rumblestrip
4 жыл бұрын
Mike, I've watched this video several times, I'm glad I did. Back in February I ordered a Fusil from TVM, got it about early October. You saved me a whole lot of time. What worked in mine was a square load, but it's bigger then normal. 110 of ffg and 1.5 oz of shot. Leather over powder wad, and I'm using unspun natural wool like tow for over shot was. I have gotten decent coverage over the entire 11x11 target I was using at 35 yards. Haven't tried 40. Might be something to try in your gun. Either way, thank you for this video.
@jolo4369
4 жыл бұрын
My fusil from tvm should be here Monday or Tuesday
@sethmullins8346
2 жыл бұрын
I got a .69 caliber 1842 smoothbore musket from Dixie Gunworks to use as a shotgun and I'm going to try Mike's loads myself.
@mikemessier7977
10 жыл бұрын
Although I am not period correct kind of guy I really enjoy learning how they did things back in the day. Another great history lesson! Thanks Mike
@hoodoo2001
10 жыл бұрын
Surely you would not have fired this gun in T-shirt, cargo shorts, and sandals... :-)
@mikemessier7977
10 жыл бұрын
YIKES!! Other than the sandals you nailed it. In my defense the T-shirt I was wearing came from the NRA national firearms museum.
@hoodoo2001
10 жыл бұрын
mike messier LOL. :-) I was started doing living history again when I started volunteering at a local aviation museum pioneerflightmuseum.org that actually flies the old airplanes and operates the old vehicles and motorycycles--we are constantly restoring and rebuilding but it's great fun. After a while I got more and more of our hardcases to dress "period" at our air fairs, but there are some guys that just can't bring themselves to do but we love them anyways...at least they wear the museum T-shirts. You are forgiven....and there is always hope that you all will get religion.... :-)
@mikemessier7977
10 жыл бұрын
Several guys I have worked with spent small fortunes on period correct clothes and detail items. Mountain man, WWII GI, Civil war, colonial, renaissance and even a husband & wife with movie quality Klingon outfits. Looks like fun but I have too may expensive hobbies as it is. I am an aircraft guy as well. What aviation museum do you volunteer?
@hoodoo2001
10 жыл бұрын
mike messier I volunteer at the pioneer flight museum in Kingsbury Texas. It's a hoot. It celebrates the early period of aviation, 1903-1939. Kind of a broad subject, but it makes it fun for living history. I was military for a long time but now I am comic relief as the "Kingsbury Kop" on a faux 1903 Harley Davidson (a motorized bike extensively rebuilt to look like the real thing, except I have "Hardley Davidson" on the fuel tank. Many of our guys do the much cheaper civilian impressions. We have done some videos, the best was "the prisoner escapes" in which the infamous Von Whitaker escapes my hapless custody as a US soldier and flies off in his/our Fokker Triplane. All the footage is real, edited together from a different day we flew our Fokker. Really am pushing to get some go pro footage and stuff for our November 8 air fair.
@matthewpering8091
10 жыл бұрын
The greatest thing about muzzleloaders is that we can vary the charge behind our projectiles. I have never hunted with a muzzleloading shotgun, but I have with a rifle. I know your charge can have great effect on where your ball lands. I have a very different load for hunting rabbits at 50 yards, than I do for whitetails at 100 yards. This is part of the beauty of muzzleloading. With or without any choke on a smoothbore, we should expect a sharper pattern with more powder. Competition shooters will agree with this. Keep up the excellent vids, Mike. :)
@gregggibson3109
4 жыл бұрын
Very through coverage of smoothbore loading in this 2 part series. Thanks for the information!
@Captain-Electro
10 жыл бұрын
I love that gun! Beautifully built!
@1717jbs
10 жыл бұрын
Extremely interesting. Thanks for sharing. Looks like a lot of fun!
@lloydscott295
3 жыл бұрын
I'm only use I am Greenleaf to load my musket that way I'm not a danger to set the woods on fire but my study of different loads you have been really helpful Mike thanks a lot
@TheMountainman211
3 жыл бұрын
You should do a blunderbuss video!!
@RobertoDonatti
10 жыл бұрын
One of your best videos,
@matts.1758
10 жыл бұрын
Outstanding work Mike! Keep em coming!!
@lloydscott295
3 жыл бұрын
Mike you really have some funny face expressions when your target isn't right
@G-man45444
10 жыл бұрын
Thanks so much for this video. With my fowler I've been shooting "squared" loads forever and have never been satisfied with patterning and range. I am going out in the morning for rabbit and grouse .....I'm very optimistic that this 100X2oz load will put meat in the pot.
@warriorways7741
Жыл бұрын
Did it?
@G-man45444
Жыл бұрын
@@warriorways7741 .... I flushed several birds and only the the fleeing butt of a couple rabbits. There's always next season.
@e.kent.d9561
10 жыл бұрын
Yes! I love the stock on that too.
@tiggerr42431
10 жыл бұрын
Good historical science and a good experiment.
@nakoawarrior3186
3 жыл бұрын
The best way to check a shot gun pattern is on paper,...to see where your shot is hitting. And smooth bores are like a bb gun,......accurate at one distance,.....to go farther add more power,.....or you use Kentucky windage.
@robertbrunston5406
7 жыл бұрын
Thank you for the demonstration its good information! I wonder how your loads would pattern on paper!
@mtslyh
10 жыл бұрын
And the learning never stops. Your videos are such a great source of information. And despite the slightly longer length of this one, you kept me interested all the way through. As you stated, I had always heard that a square load is best. But the dramatic results of your tests are hard to argue with. You couldn't have made it any easier to see. Great stuff from another great series. Many thanks!
@straightpipec6099
10 жыл бұрын
Nice couple of videos! Good history lesson. Regarding this video, some things are still the same--2 oz of shot is almost always better to hunt with. Especially for waterfowl & turkey. I suspect many back in the 18th century used loads like you were shooting, since it meant the difference between eating or not.
@Riando4590
3 жыл бұрын
Your French pronounciation is pretty good !
@kennapier9586
2 жыл бұрын
I have a 1760s - 1770s copy of a french .69 cal. smooth bore. I wish you would do a video on those with ball or shot. Right now I have been using 12 gauge foster slugs. Not accurate at all but fun to shoot 5 gallon water jugs with. I would squirrel hunt with it if I find the right load for shot.
@nakoawarrior3186
3 жыл бұрын
Using modern wads should improve efficiency too.
@amunderdog
10 жыл бұрын
I leaned a lot. Thanks
@johnndavis7647
4 жыл бұрын
I see that you have read "The Art of Shooting Flying" . an excellent book. What is available as a reprint now is good but it is the 4th edition and it apparently has been heavily edited. I am looking for a first edition and hoping to find one for less than 100 bucks. Thanks for all you do. John Davis jax fl
@williamcrawford7982
3 жыл бұрын
Leather over powder check! 👍maybe two ?
@fallenpatriot7917
7 жыл бұрын
I was thinking about trying powder-leather wad-tow-paper wad-shot-paper wad. This would be using the strengths of all three. The leather for a good seal, the tow for a cushion (I'm a believer in cushioning the shot). Then paper to seal the top so the tow will not blow the pattern.
@johnndavis7647
4 жыл бұрын
Yes, 100 years of paper shotgun shell developement showed that System produced the best patterns. Hard card over powder, cushion wads,shot, thin card over shot. Tamp the powder with the hard card first. Dont tamp the shot.
@jerrymiller8984
3 жыл бұрын
Very informative video!
@burgtaylor3469
4 жыл бұрын
Interesting. It's hard to imagine that the old timers didn't use patched balls much.
@Nick-wn1xw
3 жыл бұрын
I think some of it had to do with the expense of cloth. J.F. Cooper in his Leatherstocking Tales has Natty Bumpo talking about using leather for patches because it was something he always had available.
@win1885
10 жыл бұрын
Mike, I've enjoyed All of your videos. These two in particular because a lot of folks forget or disregard the importance of the smoothbore in the development of our country. I fell into that category after reading John Brick's The Rifleman. Then I read Kenneth Roberts Northwest Passage and realized that there were more smoothbores around than rifles. I saw fusils on Red Jacket's site that are almost exact copies of the one you used. Which begs the question, What are your thoughts of Will Hayden in light of his daughters accusations?
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
He's innocent until proven guilty...but, I think he'll be proven guilty....
@lawrencesmeen522
5 жыл бұрын
Great video !!!
@lyleinmb464
10 жыл бұрын
That was great. Thanks
@Blackbart5118
7 жыл бұрын
Very interesting!
@Nick-wn1xw
3 жыл бұрын
This was what, about 2 years before the truth about Will Hayden came to light? Too bad such a craftsman is such a monster in real life. Hang on to that fine smoothbore.
@drmaudio
10 жыл бұрын
Do you have a video on the paper cartridges? It would be interesting to see you make and shoot those.
@yankeedoodledandeefirecrac7518
9 жыл бұрын
Mike,Can you do a video about how effective pattern recipie you do on a paper pattern for a turkey head on paper? no clay birds but rather patern of hist on a turkey head traget.? Please,.. so we can see the tighness of patterns.
@ryanbaker614
3 жыл бұрын
What kind of paper are the paper wads cut from?
@greatpapa502
8 жыл бұрын
Durofelt comes in several qualities ... Soft is F-10, Medium is F-5 and Hard F-1. All are wool and 1/4 inch thick. Which felt did you use for the felt wadding?
@randyreichert5911
3 жыл бұрын
Hello Mike, Is there a reason why one wouldn't use a leather wad over the shot, or a felt wad over the shot?
@timnelson75
Жыл бұрын
Eight years after this video, and I have a question. Anyway, can you shoot steel shot in the modern fowler reproductions without damaging barrel? My state requires non-lead ammo for all hunting.
@duelist1954
Жыл бұрын
Probably not.
@Yosemite-George-61
4 жыл бұрын
..what's the diameter of the punched wads? Is there a percentage to go over the diameter of a given bore? Thanks !
@twil1818
8 жыл бұрын
Has anyone done load data, and pattern test on swan shot. I know any info would be speculative due to the shot variable. But it might be interesting.
@ericgross6932
4 жыл бұрын
Would a heavy charge of shot like 1.5 oz in a 28 guage be safe to shoot?
@jamesondancy2183
3 жыл бұрын
What diameter should the paper or leather be cut relative to the bore diameter? Same diameter?
@duelist1954
3 жыл бұрын
Leather needs to be punched out, circular, bore diameter. Paper is a foldeed square, One inch square for 20 Ga, about 1.5 inches square for 12 GA
@TheTrinityKid
10 жыл бұрын
You're crazy, Mike (someone had to say it.) Then again, so were Wilbur and Orville Wright.:P On a serious note, for a person who wants a period correct Montana frontiersman's outfit, would a smoothbore flintlock, or a .54 rifled gun (flint or percussion)?
@GaryED44
3 жыл бұрын
Does the black powder hunting time come before modern season or after?
@duelist1954
3 жыл бұрын
Here, we have muzzleloader seasons both before and after.
@KhanGirey
10 жыл бұрын
What would be the first step into black powder shooting? Should I go with cap or flint? Pistol or long gun? The most important thing is money, but I want it to be different from all of the modern guns I have.
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
if money is an issue, good rifles are quite expensive, so I would recommend a good, steel framed 1851 Navy revolver made by Pietta
@armchairdisaster905
Жыл бұрын
Where can I get the cutter for the leather and fiber wads???
@duelist1954
Жыл бұрын
Dixie Gun Works
@smackarel7
9 жыл бұрын
Have you ever tried a buck and ball load in any of your guns?
@billmazzocco5275
3 жыл бұрын
How did you make shot cartridges. Did you include powder in cartridge or just prepackaged the shot?
@duelist1954
3 жыл бұрын
I do it with powder. I’ll do a video on it this year.
@ronaldbest1874
7 жыл бұрын
That's effective for a target, but what would such a load do to a bird? Would it make the bird uneatable?
@WhatIsYourMalfunction
10 жыл бұрын
Excellent video. I am saving it for reference. Do you think the small shot gets caught in the flax tow? perhaps the flax over the powder and paper over the shot would work better? Not an experienced BP guy, but wondering...
@shrugger1
10 жыл бұрын
I'm thinking with the flax wad it's a combination of an uneven contact area and the porousness of the fibers. Allowing higher pressure gas to get around the circumference of the wad. This may very well explain the donut pattern he mentioned.
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
I don't think the shot gets stuck in the tow,
@flintlockDave
2 жыл бұрын
Hello Mike. This may be a silly question but do you just use regular lead shot in a smoothbore? Or is it different from modern lead shot?
@duelist1954
2 жыл бұрын
Just regular lead shot
@flintlockDave
2 жыл бұрын
@@duelist1954 Thank you.
@M29WeaselDriver
6 жыл бұрын
What size shot was used in the 18th century?
@mikemessier7977
10 жыл бұрын
Do you ever hunt with a flintlock??
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
sure
@KhanGirey
10 жыл бұрын
Also, what do you mean by square load?
@leighrate
10 жыл бұрын
Mike, You showed shot in a twist of paper. What's the pattern like if you used a leather wad with the shot loaded in the paper? I'm sure the old timers used that.
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
it would shoot like a big ball
@rustyroxy0462
9 жыл бұрын
For us Turkey hunters, you forgot to show the pattern on PAPER!!!! useless to see a clay bird blow up. I need to see the patterns and gaps in patterns for the loads, can you do another video??? Please!
@duelist1954
9 жыл бұрын
Tania Gilkey I'll try to get that made, probably won't be for a month or two though
@jamescarmean2701
8 жыл бұрын
This is the fifth video I have watched tonight (subbed and liked). I am very interested in the Fusil de Chasse 20 gauge. So this set of vids was much fun for me. I love that powder horn. I hope you have some detailed vids on black powder "Accoutrements. I may try my hand at making some powder horns. Do you have any recommendations for horn?"
@duelist1954
8 жыл бұрын
+James Carmean Go to one of the larger events like a rendezvous or a re-enactment. There will be horn merchants there with raw horns.
@jamescarmean2701
8 жыл бұрын
duelist1954 thanks I will check it out.
@dariuswhite23
8 жыл бұрын
+duelist1954 if u use powder ,over powder wad , a lubed cushion wad, shot, then a over shot wad .U will get a way better pattern .Cause the cushion wad acts a shock absorber ,and u won't blow the pattern.
@shellmaker10
10 жыл бұрын
Another great video. What is your experience in shooting this style of gun. I have read that the pronounced drop in the stock causes it to recoil hard against the cheek.Thanks for any thoughts on this.
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
I love this gun. accuracte and comfortable to shoot
@shellmaker10
10 жыл бұрын
duelist1954 Mike, thanks so much for these videos. I can trace my ancestry to the early 1650's in French Canada and have been thinking about getting a Tulle Fusil De Chasse but was wondering about the recoil issue. What a beautiful gun. Thanks again.
@RabidMortal1
10 жыл бұрын
Nice video. In the 18th century was there a "standard" size of shot?
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
There were various sizes, just like now.
@RabidMortal1
10 жыл бұрын
Can that paper tube of shot be used in place of the two paper wads? (ie, just ram the whole tube down)
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
Yes, When I used a Brown Bess with shot, I'd rip that tube in half and ram both pieces down on the shot.
@todaytriper
10 жыл бұрын
Is" wauser" period ?
@davidlane2255
6 жыл бұрын
Would it not be a square load for 2 oz. shot be 144 grains of powder? Just a thought.
@bowlofrice8
5 жыл бұрын
David Lane pretty stout load
@thomaskwei9119
5 жыл бұрын
In your opinion, Fusil de Chase vs. English or Colonial style fowler, which style do you think is better?
@duelist1954
5 жыл бұрын
Thomas Kwei In terms of performance, they are equal. It is really a matter of which looks better to your eye, or which one fits your impression better.
@hoodoo2001
10 жыл бұрын
Thank you for this great and educational video! As always the period clothing really adds to the appreciation of the weapon. And having the wooden fort wall beside you was quite cool.... or is that a privacy fence? Don't want to know...it fit in regardless. :-)
@ibpn4284
10 жыл бұрын
thank you for the very useful info. I've heard the term "loaded for bear" meant a powder charge and two or more balls. what are your thoughts?
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
Never hear that.
@ipodhty
4 жыл бұрын
@@duelist1954 in "the mysterious island " they mention loading 2 balls for dangerous game defences, that book was written much later and is quite fictional but is a interesting source
@saltcreekammo
3 жыл бұрын
Why not try 100 grains of powder and 1 ounce of shot, or 1-1/8, 1-1/4, 1.5 ounces etc... no need to waste shot if you don’t have to.
@olebluedogfl9490
10 жыл бұрын
How about buck and ball how would you load that?
@duelist1954
10 жыл бұрын
I'll do a video on buck & ball and on buckshot loads, but the short answer is 110 grains of 2Fg, paper wad, 3 ea #2 buckshot topped with a .61 ball.
@olebluedogfl9490
10 жыл бұрын
duelist1954 Cool Thanks!
@beverlybrevit4288
3 жыл бұрын
A square load is not as you state, a square load is a shot column length the same as the width (at rest before firing), each gauge has it's own square. Bridges did a test to improve pattern on a fowler and found loading with over powder card then a cushion wad torn into pieces and packed with loading rod, then shot and an over shot card. The torn up cushion wad still acted as a cushion but blew apart on exit and did not blow a hole through the shot column a foot or so ahead of the gun. Your gun may shoot better with 2oz , just as any gun with over two times the standard load. Not really a fair comparison test , I say the paper over powder patch you are using is not holding together and permitting powder and gas to get into the shot column and donuting the shot pattern (gas will want to go through the center, line friction etc), the reason 2oz load is working, apart from just the volume of pellets is the long length of the shot column and set back cause by the 100 grains of powder packing the shot and blocking the gas. The 2oz load is just a hot core load .
@FatGuyWithAKatana
10 жыл бұрын
i bet trap shooting is an enormous pain in the ass with it.
@drawlr55
6 жыл бұрын
I like hornets nest for wadding.
@cephasmartin8593
5 жыл бұрын
I have a .50 caliber rifle. Can I shoot shot out of it without leading the rifling up too much. Be aware that you answer could force me to buy another black powder gun and I would have to justify it with "the Boss" (wink, wink).
@duelist1954
5 жыл бұрын
Eventually you'll lead it up, but you'll get crappy results from shot anyway because the rifling will blow your pattern.
@cephasmartin8593
5 жыл бұрын
@@duelist1954 Thank you. My wife won't be happy, but I will be.
@TheNickathome
8 жыл бұрын
Shooting at clay pigeons does nothing to tell you what your shot pattern is doing. You need to shoot at paper while from a bench rest, then you will clearly see what your pattern is doing.
@duelist1954
8 жыл бұрын
I actually did all my tests using a pattern board. My companion article in "Muzzleloader" magazine had pictures of them, but breaking clay birds made for a more visually interesting video. However, here's one with a smoothbore patterning on paper kzitem.info/news/bejne/sa6KvnqugKuFo2k
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