welp. it's that time again. gonna try changing the thumbnail to see if i can improve performance. 🖤 www.patreon.com/bubbletea_
@josephkokkinos9326
Жыл бұрын
Love this video. Sorry KZitem algorithm screwing up its dissemination. Would love to hear your thoughts on Tokyo Mirage Sessions. Wonder how the characters compare to p4
@javierortega9992
Жыл бұрын
Here to support this vid
@michaelh9649
Жыл бұрын
Great vid, man. I have split feelings on Persona 4 too. I’ll always be a Persona 3 man. I’m glad you ended the video on the game’s pluses, though…makes me want to replay it. I’m gonna subscribe. You ever tackle the Suikoden games? Whenever I want to re-experience the glory of ps2 I hop between the Personas, Suikoden III, FFX, and Dark Cloud 2
@xtzyshuadog
Жыл бұрын
I found your video and MangaKamen's Persona 4 "Love/ Hate" video and watched them a few times each, thinking about style. Both of your editing styles are very different. His is more rapid and full of memes and Persona 5 comparisons, while yours is witty and thoughtful and not without its Persona 3 references. I enjoyed them both, and after replaying Persona 4 on PS2 and Persona 3 Portable for the NG+/FeMC features, it's clear I liked the Dungeons and social links of 3 over 4. Preferred the themes and story of P4 ultimately, but P3 hit harder, deeper with all its death and loss and grief. 3 had you earn trust over time, 4 had everyone close to begin with, and maybe that's to do with how urban island life wrought with midnight terrors contrast with small town life encased in mysterious murders. (Unrelated note: I maximized the social links in P3P just eyeballing it, barely unlocking Orpheos Telos at the last opportunity on 1/30, using guides for the dialogue choices and to mentally figure out what links to prioritize on different days, without using a step by step guide. I'm leaving that here only because I only have screenshots of it and no footage, but suffice to say walking the dog, save states, and Sunday phone calls were a lifesaver.)
@lllllllk5817
Жыл бұрын
@@josephkokkinos9326a😊QA❤😊😊@!z, Q😊😊Q
@kakizakichannel
Жыл бұрын
"To me it seems like gender is a game and Naoto's winning" My sides are in orbit
@Naotosbiggestfan24
Жыл бұрын
I agree
@LampyGames
8 ай бұрын
This is not a downside, this is a victory
@mayayamato7351
7 ай бұрын
naoto stays winning.
@evanberry396
Ай бұрын
I thought her persona awaking was about her not “winning” when it comes to gender
@johans3164
21 күн бұрын
Regardless of Naoto's gender, i'd still hit it
@phantomdriver2010
Жыл бұрын
"Gender is a game and Naoto is winning" might be the best quote of all time
@kurisuisaway
2 ай бұрын
Virginia Woolf would agree
@thequincy_
Жыл бұрын
This wasn't a bad retrospective on P4. Nothing said was necessarily controversial, just interesting. The format was a odd choice, but not a unwelcomed one either. Nice work. P4 is one of my favorites in general, not particularly due to nostalgia but the atmosphere, themes, etc. I always look back fondly on my time walking around the grey, cloudy streets of Inaba, with Heartbeat-Heartbreak softly playing in the background.
@ItsShaz1
Жыл бұрын
“I’ve been waiting for this”, P4 was my first Persona game and I still enjoy it. Afterwards I played P3 and enjoyed that immensely.
@harrisonfackrell
Жыл бұрын
Incredible that you have two first Persona games.
@ItsShaz1
Жыл бұрын
@@harrisonfackrell lol
@sakata-gintoki
Жыл бұрын
@@harrisonfackrell lol
@rileyfreeman4096
Жыл бұрын
did u play P3P or just P3?
@ItsShaz1
Жыл бұрын
@@rileyfreeman4096 P3 FES
@clanofclams2720
Жыл бұрын
the game giving the player a list of every single named character in the entire game and telling you "we gave you all the clues you need, you're not an idiot, tell us who did it" is maybe my favorite moment in any game
@professorlayman523
9 ай бұрын
Even though I knew who it was going in, I can definitely appreciate the game just straight up letting the player figure it out themselves rather than guiding them down a particular path.
@bigtimetimmyjim6486
8 ай бұрын
My problem with this is that there was no evidence tying the villain to the crime; you basically narrow down the list to the 2 or 3 who you cannot rule out, click them, and essentially hope that the perp incriminates himself (which he does). Yes, the game does attempt to to use that one conversation with the diary as "evidence", but it is extremely weak and could have many alternative explanations. Persona 5 is a LOT better about providing definitive evidence to the traitor's identity.
@bakacdaz
8 ай бұрын
The answer is absolutely Nanako Doujima!!
@bigtimetimmyjim6486
7 ай бұрын
@@bakacdaz "You couldn't just quit while you were ahead, could you...big bro?" :)
@looney1023
7 ай бұрын
The fact that Nanako was an option totally killed me.
@akajulester
Жыл бұрын
Part of why I like Naoto is how I relate to hera bit about her issues with her sex, though I fortunately never had it so bad I felt the need to crossdress. I was never a tomboy growing up but I've always found it difficult to relate to other girls my age due to bullying and ostracization. I've always felt more comfortable hanging out with guy friends, especially since nowadays I can't really relate to a lot of what other girls around me are interested in (though this also has a lot more to do with another thing I find relatable in Naoto, her issues with age/maturity, as I've found myself recently around a lot of immature people, largely girls in a former friend group). I really enjoyed seeing Naoto realize and accept herself as a woman, one who isn't any less feminine than other women just for pursuing a more male-oriented job. I also really connected with her gradually showing interest in more stereotypical female things like makeup and skirts/dresses, something I've been doing recently as well. It really irks me to see people completely miss the point of Naoto's arc (that becoming male won't magically solve her issues and isn't really what she wants to do anyway) and tell a struggling woman dealing with some patriarchal issues to just turn into a man (really helpful advice there and not insultingly sexist). I think the people mistaking Naoto (and Kanji) are also forgetting P4 takes place in an Eastern country, not the West - sexism in the workforce is a much bigger issue in Japan than America, which is what Naoto's struggle is providing a social commentary of in the game.
@bubbletea_
Жыл бұрын
yeah. honestly, i've stopped caring about the naoto gender discourse. regardless of which side people take, no one can replace the way the character resonated with you with a completely different narrative. really we should just stop putting each other down and just explain what the character means to each other.
@chaserseven2886
11 ай бұрын
Lol you don’t turn into a man you transition, the ignorance in your comment is staggering
@bakacdaz
8 ай бұрын
And it’s 10 more than 10 years ago. People mindset are still less progressive than modern day.
@killpuddle9977
7 ай бұрын
Isn't it literally just she's a girl but only guys get taken seriously in the police
@allmyhomieshatefreud5501
6 ай бұрын
Not only is that mindset sexist, but it also mirrors the transphobic talking point of “we need to ban trans representation because otherwise girls who struggle under patriarchy will want to be boys instead!” It’s such a shallow idea of trans representation. Sure I want to see trans characters in media, but what I really want is seeing trans characters that are created with their trans identity in mind (preferably by trans writers) rather than attaching head cannons to existing characters while missing the whole point of the original arc
@Flameclaw123
11 ай бұрын
The biggest gripe I have with P4 that wasn't much improved in P5, and the change I most want to see from Persona going forward, is for them to stop making the mascot characters so uncomfortably horny lmao "Is this what it means to score with a hot stud" is funny the first time, when it's a comment by a totally clueless Teddie. It's way less funny the 85th time when the damn bear won't shut up about yukatas
@juliacondensada
7 ай бұрын
Idk, Teddy for me is way way way worse because he sexually assaults everyone. Morgana on the other hand has a innocent crush on Ann and he never makes her uncomfortable (at least i don't remember)
@trulymrword
7 ай бұрын
@@juliacondensadaNah, he doesn't and he's levelheaded when the situation is needed. Mementos dialogue shows that he can talk to Ann in a non-cringey way at times which is a step above Teddie.
@@noah2633 There are multiple scenes where teddy does. I can specifically think of a scene where Rise and Teddy are crying, then Rise immediately says "Where are you touching" before hitting him.
@Natalieowomeow
4 ай бұрын
I agree. It dehumanizes the characters who are supposed to be the characters who learn to be human. Persona just treats women like crap in general. For example Junpei’s behavior, which is meant to be seen as him being a dumb kid, is downright creepy
@LadyVirgilia
Жыл бұрын
Very fitting titling the negative and positive sections, "Shadow" and "Persona" respectively. Appreciated hearing your take on the "special mechanics" in each P4 dungeon. Especially your point on Heaven btw! I never really thought about how it's the only one with no mid-dungeon gimmick, yet it happens to be most people's fav aside from the Magatsu ones. A nice sticking point to the argument that P4's dungeons are just SO much better/"fun" than Tartarus amirite? Always cool to hear takes on the social links as they relate to you personally. People have such different life experiences, and there's always something interesting to parse from hearing about others'. A lot of my friends were also scared AF to go home if they didn't get an A on their exam or paper, so I feel you on Shu's social link. It's very much an Asian thing. Overall really nice job with this one!
@brandonmariomanfanxd
Жыл бұрын
“Persona 4 is hard to love, but harder to hate” wow, that makes a lot of sense! I’ll admit, I haven’t beaten it, I just got to the point where Nanako got taken, man let me say I was so overwhelmed by the Social Links in this game, it felt like there were 100! And the dungeons were really not fun for me. But I don’t hate the game. I dunno what I’m sayin anymore. Great Video!
@planescaped
7 ай бұрын
What a coincidence, I also quit playing the game at that point. It's odd as I remember that I was enjoying it... I just suddenly lost all interest in playing the game. Same thing happened with Persona 5 and around when Haru joins. I quit playing for 3 weeks and had to force myself to come back and finish the game, though I am glad I did. I think the crux of the issue for me is just how repetitive Persona games become. Love/hate sums up my feelings for the entire series. I love them, but I always struggle to finish them, and tend to burn out at one point or another.
@harrisonfackrell
Жыл бұрын
There were few enough victims that Mitsuo's copycat killing genuinely threw me off. I was trying to find a connection between Morooka _and_ everybody else, and I didn't consider--at first--that there wasn't one.
@chaserseven2886
11 ай бұрын
The one thing I struggle with is how he took down morooaka and dragged him up that tower
@trulymrword
7 ай бұрын
@@chaserseven2886The one thing I struggle to understand is that the incel can actually kill a grown man.
@xXTheKingEmothXx
Жыл бұрын
I actually kind of like how Naoto doesn't seem to experience much prejudice when her secret is revealed. It reads to me more like her prejudice is self-imposed, as we can see she idealized those hard-boiled, cool detectives in fiction, and she didn't view herself as fitting that bill. We know she got treated like a child in the police force, but we also know no one even knew she was a girl, ever, and her reasoning is 'not wanting to give them a reason to discredit her'. I always read that as a bit of a cop-out, and that it was more of her own views that a girl couldn't be a cool detective. So when we kinda force her out of her shell, we see that people actually don't seem to mind either way, if anything, people like her more when she shows the different aspects of her personality she suppresses. I find it cute how she starts to own who she is over time, and even if the romance options can make you rather grossly force her to be girlier, a lot of the things you 'goad' her into doing are things she eventually starts doing on her own if you dont. A lot of the Fortune arcana is about relinquishing control over aspects of your life to find fulfillment in freedom, and that is shown pretty beautifully in Naoto's gradual acceptance of her identity, and willingness to accept that an identity can change as tastes and feelings change. This is all why I dislike the push for Naoto to be a trans figure, because I feel the solution to her dissatisfaction isn't to push her to conform to a binary. If anything, I vibe more with a non-binary reading of her character, as someone happy to be who she is regardless of structure. I think to push her to be trans also insults her sense of identity, to shrug off all her worries, concerns, and struggles as 'Just be a boy lol' undermines the personal growth of her arc. On top of all that, Kanji's attraction to her starting BEFORE she was revealed to be a girl is the cutest thing on the planet, cause it shows Kanji liking people for more than looks. He may not be gay, but I think he's definitely bi or pan. But his attraction to Naoto being unwavering from anything he learns of her is validating for Naoto's growth, as she can realize that people will like her, find her attractive, or value her opinion regardless of her preconcieved notions of the expectation for her line of work.
@iplayeddishonored2475
Жыл бұрын
A really thorough comment that I like, what I will say is that semantically, non-binary people are generally somewhere on the transgender spectrum, as that process typically involves what we call social transitioning. The dichotomy is less of ‘is naoto trans, nonbinary or cis’ and is more ‘what kind of trans is naoto, if at all’
@Plasmacat1
Жыл бұрын
@@iplayeddishonored2475 tbh I always found any discourse regarding this as funny because a game that tries so hard to show you that labels and social norms don't define a person, fans try their hardest to lock the characters into a label they're pushing into them.
@13kayrine
Жыл бұрын
I totally agree with all your points here!
@jumpingmoose5554
Жыл бұрын
@@Plasmacat1 exactly
@jumpingmoose5554
Жыл бұрын
@@iplayeddishonored2475 why do people wanna put naoto into a lgbtq spectrum so badly? Why can't she just be a girl that's different?
@GRiznitDShiznit
Жыл бұрын
Finally someone that isn’t crazy. I loved P3/P4/P5, but yeah, people forget that P3 isn’t the only one with a slow first half of the game. They all pick up towards the end.
@rayvenkman2087
Жыл бұрын
Or the fact that all three should compliment each other, not be used by opinionated fans to crap on each other. Though on P5, I say it’s got the best first half pacing wise of the three but considering it starts off in the present and rewinds back to the past for the first arc; it can be an unfair comparison. P4’s just fine as is since the game is more scaled back in stakes compared to the other two and that’s okay; Inaba is Inaba.
@777SilverPhoenix777
2 ай бұрын
@@rayvenkman2087 Weirdly enough P5s Rewind gimmick caused me to HATE it to the point where i stopped playing 2 hours in the first time around. I finally slogged through the first part of the game and found myself enjoying it only after I got 20 hours in. the fucking bouncing between times for every confidant activation pissed me off. I really dislike reverse story telling as it gives huge things away (like us getting arrested for example), plus it's usually nonsensical in the way it shows things. I like the characters (mostly) and the story is relatively good. I still hate that everything revolves around the MC where in P3 is didn't. SEES already existed BEFORE the MC awoke, and many characters did things to improve themselves without the MC. Like Yukari helping Mitsuru and helping her persona evolve. Unfortunately, P4/P5 suffer from MC syndrome where the entire cast are dependent upon the MC to improve themselves at all.
@NerevarineKing
7 күн бұрын
P5's best moment are all in the first few arcs and then it kinda goes downhill.
@totallyaploy1824
Жыл бұрын
For me, the characters and atmosphere made Persona 4, as a game. It's designed around that small-town atmosphere, and I feel that the very personal nature of the story arcs fits that well. It also connected more with me, personally, because I grew up in the middle of nowhere. Persona 3 impacted me more as a person, but I enjoyed my time with 4 more.
@totallyaploy1824
Жыл бұрын
But that's just my opinion. I'm glad you get enjoyment out of it in your own way.
@ethanadams8109
Жыл бұрын
I love how your opening monologue about splitting the video into two perspectives with distinct timestamps and offering the audience the option to only listen to one perspective or the other is a true embodiment of the themes of Persona 4
@Dermetsu
Жыл бұрын
My biggest annoyance is Teddy, just like Morgana drives me insane. A boy can dream that we won't get any more animal or mascot characters going forward.
@noe4354
Жыл бұрын
At least you dont have to take teddie home with you
@Dermetsu
Жыл бұрын
@@noe4354 good point. It would have been agonizing for him to tell me to go to sleep.
@Anbird1218
Жыл бұрын
Or that they're Koromaru and don't talk
@coraliii947
Жыл бұрын
Koromaru was great, cmon :(
@digimonlover1632
Жыл бұрын
No thanks. That would suck.
@matteste
Жыл бұрын
For me, one big issue I had with Persona 4 was just how much it relied on the Social Links as a crutch for character development. Pretty much all of the character growth is limited to those. This means that in the actual story they end up pretty static and shallow. Also, this ends up affecting the Social Links themselves as they have to always fit the story no matter where they are in the timeline. Persona 3 actually did it somewhat better by simply not having the party members be Social Links and thus allowing them to grow organically in the story. Also, a bit surprised that you never mentioned that they removed Fusion Spells in the segment about the simplified gameplay.
@blairfujin
Жыл бұрын
The thing is, the party members did get them in 3 (only girls in fes, guys added in p3p, don't know about vanilla ps2 release), the problem, in my eyes, was tying them getting their upraded personas to social links. P3 shown that when you go through some substantial personal growth, your persona evolves with you. This in P3 happened in main story, mostly when characters came to terms with someone's death. This way they could grow in the main story and have some more personal, smaller scale stories in social links. In P4 the big growth got pushed into the optional content, which seemed even lower stakes than in p3 (mostly just repeating character introduction).
@nightwish1453
Жыл бұрын
when it comes to modern persona, even though 4 relies on the social links as a crutch at times it defiently has the best writing quality amongst the 3 at the same time, 3 even in p3p the social links can range from really good to really bad and 5 is like the most condescened where most range from good to meh. You could 4 as being more experimentation on characters being less tangled into a plot in favor of social links which for 4 I think does well and 5 tries to copy it though it's not as good as seemed like they were trying to a balancing act with it's story and social links
@Vlayer
Жыл бұрын
Persona 4 has a lot more character development as part of its story because of how it centers each arc/dungeon around a specific character. The issue with P3, despite it relegating the Persona evolutions to key story moments, is that most of the characters barring Junpei and to a lesser degree Yukari, are introduced and then not explored much if at all until October and beyond. Stuff like Ken's desire for revenge is more so treated like a twist than an opportunity to explore his character, and the subsequent follow-up is swiftly dealt with because P3 crams about 80% of its story/character in the last 20%. In P4 each dungeon gives you ample time with a future party member. It presents you with a character arc, fleshing out what initailly seems like a one-dimensional character, and on top of that ties it in creative ways to the core theme of Truth, presenting differing perspectives. Sometimes contrasting perspectives even, such as how Yukiko wants to escape her "birthright" with the Amagi Inn, while Naoto desperately wants to live up to hers as a detective of the Shirogane family. While the social links do further flesh them out, just their story involvement alone forms a very well-rounded character.
@Kneevirus
9 ай бұрын
Personally i found the p3 party members didnt get nearly as much screentime as in p4 or p5 so i wish they had social links to flesh them out so i disagree
@AutumnMary
Жыл бұрын
I like how you divided this up actually. I thought it would be really disjointed, but it came together nicely
@deadsirius3531
Жыл бұрын
Great video, and I especially am relieved to see someone who "gets it" as far as Kanji and Naoto go. The people who feel personally attacked because Naoto wasn't what they thought she would be baffle me: you don't "own" this character. If you just take her arc at face value, there is no problem at all. For Kanji, I don't think the question was ever about determining if he's gay or not. The whole point, the peace he had to come to, was that this is a question that doesn't NEED to have an answer...certainly not at 15 years old. I think he saw his choices as being either the flamboyant effeminate stereotype of his shadow, or the toxic aggressive bully stereotype he was presenting to the world, and his synthesis with his shadow was necessary to relax and just let it be what it's going to be. This is why I think his shadow was "offensive" very specifically on purpose. I really think he's the most interesting character of the game, ultimately
@VicStrange9
Жыл бұрын
the fact that people keep getting butthurt about Kanji and Naoto means two things: one, we're way too deep in a cultural war debacle, and two, players keep missing the point about how much of life relies on actually leaving your house every once in a while
@jo0rd73
Жыл бұрын
Nah with Kanji as the story progresses any semblance of his sexuality being ambiguous is gone and he’s just a straight dude that’s okay with his femininity (this isn’t a bad thing btw in a vacuum). The only references going forward to him maybe not being straight is when the game is being homophobic like when Yosuke is afraid that Kanji staying in the tent with him and Yu means that he might fucking assault them while they sleep.
@danTips-tg7zm
Жыл бұрын
some of yall act personally attacked when someone can think kanji might've been gay. Both sides are really toxic, and im sick of this being the only thing people talk about when it comes to persona 4
@chaserseven2886
11 ай бұрын
There’s enough evidence to say he is gay or at least I forgot the actual term but it’s when your attracted to someone because how they look and not because they are a boy girl trans or anything in between
@cooltwittertag
10 ай бұрын
@@chaserseven2886pansexual means being attracted to people regardless of gender
@nathanielduggan1684
Жыл бұрын
Just a quick thought on The Negative section... While the murder mystery theme definitely has its faults which you outline really well, I think the one advantage it has over P3 is it gives the player a clear goal from the start. Instead of this murky 'ok there's this midnight hour that happens where our school becomes a 100 floor dungeon we should probably climb and also every full moon there's a big boss to defeat', the game gives a much clearer, consistent goal -- there is a murderer and we need to save his latest victim. Yes eventually p3 opens up and we realize the whole grandiose apocalypse thing, but until that happens a lot of what you're doing in the game you don't know why you're doing it. The same applies for p4, but the mystery conceit helps to alleviate it a bit
@y2m3e.45
Жыл бұрын
Personally, this doesn't seem like a big deal at all. Especially cause I found P4's story to be pretty weak, and villian kinda predictable
@enchantingggg8399
Жыл бұрын
@@y2m3e.45Why do you personally think it was weak? Additionally I don’t think that it was obvious until Adachi slipped up towards the very end, I think calling him predictable is at all a correct description unless you had preconceived information lol
@jo0rd73
Жыл бұрын
@@enchantingggg8399I’m not the person you replied to but I can tell you why I think it’s weak lol. Just finished it btw and maybe I am being a negative Nancy because it never met the expectations I had upon seeing people discuss it online. So generally I think the main story is exceptionally weak because of the formula of, midnight channel -> abduction -> dungeon of upcoming party member (usually) - no relevant info gained when they recover, repeated for Yukiko, Kanji, Rise, Naoto. We had two red herrings, one of which was the sidest of side characters with that brat of a kid whose motivations to kill the teacher I can’t even remember right now. Then we had Nanatame who at least was more compelling, I also hated the way they used him to set up a bad ending. I think the situation itself is extremely compelling where the gang is ready to effectively kill him while angered at Nanako’s death but I absolutely hate when the shadow version of him pops on tv to be a motivator behind this and we eventually find out it was because that’s how we viewed him. Nanako dying with this bad ending too is pretty dumb she dies just because this is meant to be bad ending, despite Nanatame’s fate being unrelated to her health. I think it would’ve been fine to even imply an apocalypse instead through text after some outlining some fun moments and how you were glad the murders were finally over or something. Hell even say the murders kept happening and the gang never got closer to the truth of why they didn’t stop. The shadow reveal of what they mean especially though I really did not like because of how it recontextualises Kanji’s shadow and kinda falls apart. It makes Kanji’s shadow even more nonsensical than it already was with the direction they took it, maybe I’m forgetting but hasn’t he rejected this feminine side of himself since he was pretty young so nobody should have perceived him as lispy gay stereotype never mind enough to make it a shadow of him, unless it was because that’s how he saw himself in which case….this is just a plot hole because of the shadow reveal opposing the idea we were originally led to believe that it was just a part of themselves they know is true to an extent but refuse to accept. Adachi I loved as a character until the reveal. Literally could not care less for his motivations, he was a loner that realised he gets a thrill from killing people and I guess he finally feels like it gives him power over people rather than being the one powerless. Eh. This being the main human antagonist was so underwhelming, I just thought “Wait that’s it? That’s why he did it all?” That’s without even getting into how he was just a pawn, which made me care even less for him as a final human villain, especially with how poorly the puppet master was set up. Anyway I think something like this can be done well too but imo here it just wasn’t. We spent like ten minutes with him and his mask off as he speedran how and why he did it all. I did however like the letter from prison, thought it was a nice touch. Still just a cherry on top to a shitty cake though. The fighting god stuff is whatever I don’t really have a problem with it but I’m not fawning over it either. It was kinda cool I guess. Marie was a cool character and I loved the idea behind her and her character arc, not much to really say here besides it was easily the most interesting part of the story to me. Dungeon was horrible though, not from a difficulty standpoint either, it was just boring to be stuck fighting such weak enemies with barely any items and the rewards were almost non existent. I just ran through and avoided them all when I could. Then we have the gas station employee reveal to be the otherworldly mastermind…god this was such a horrible reveal, a crumb of foreshadowing does not make up for how unimpactful the reveal was. Ending was super cute though, I cried lol, as mad as the game made me I did really feel a bone with the characters. Despite thinking the entire main cast is a mixed bag and Teddy, Chie and Rise being extremely annoying to me I still liked them lol. So yeah, I found the game to just be overall mediocre? Social links were easily the best part, but the flaws of the rest of the game stood out more when I was often impatiently waiting for it to be free time again whenever I was going through a dungeon or in some story related segment that bored me. If I sound really triggered it’s because I am xD I heard this was amazing and it just never hit those highs for me. It has great points but also so many terrible aspects, there’s great potential there too with the setting and characters but I felt like they rarely capitalised on it.
@samoth5161
8 ай бұрын
@jo0rd73 that's a pretty vast oversimplification of adachi. His character is about the result of being isolated and disconnected from people and society. He grows jaded and bored from everything, and the event of gaining his power is something interesting that happened to him in his otherwise boring life. Since he's so bored and negative this event is just a game to him, and people's lives become entertainment. He is the opposite of the main character and also the rest of the team. Each person's shadow mirrors this throughout the game as they're all similar to adachi in some way. Boredom and waiting for something fun to happen, feeling like they're too good for the town like Yosuke. Jealousy of people perceived to be born with advantages they don't have like Chie. Feeling trapped and wanting to be rescued instead of putting in effort to change like Yukiko. Etc... To me this build up makes adachi a strong villain and a complex character to truly understand. I think the story wants you to see these mirrors, that's why it's kinda obvious adachi is the culprit, it's not really supposed to be that big of a mystery. Golden built on this by giving him that social link and making his warped character even more obvious since it's so in contrast to everyone else's link. It's a message that this is the danger of not having bonds or connections and becoming isolated.
@Kitsu_Worm
6 ай бұрын
@@samoth5161I think the concept of his character are really good. but I feel hesitate to called him complex... why? his entire motivation are just go in and contain only in long monologue old fashion style of villain. it's not really that good execution to tell thesis of disconnection and isolation. I think that's Adachi having social link (in Doylist sense) are for people who already known about his reveal in original version. so it free to design eerie Social link like that. (well at least it give him more characterization than that horm of villain monologue. I thumb it up)
@nozzlium
Жыл бұрын
what the-- is that how you're supposed to say the item's name? "Goho-M" = "Go Home"? Everything makes sense now lol. I've always called it "Go-Ho, Em"
@rdr1g457
Ай бұрын
Me too bro
@MattVirgoTimes
Жыл бұрын
"Gender is a game and Naoto is winning" sums up exactly how I feel about the "Naoto Trans?" debate.
@iplayeddishonored2475
Жыл бұрын
Honestly, as someone who steers more into the direction of ‘Atlus accidentally wrote a trans guy’, I really respect this opinion. Naoto is narratively neither completely one or the other
@lssjgaming1599
Жыл бұрын
"Am I a boy? Am I a girl? Who knows!? But everyone finds me hot and that makes everyone gay" - Naoto prolly
@mythuzalasheir
7 күн бұрын
“I’m prolly nonbinary but I have a job so idrc abt that rn”- naoto shirogane, probably
@Niptonian9551
Жыл бұрын
I can't disagree with any of the criticizms, but Persona 4 is still my favorite after finishing 3, 4, 5. My biggest complaint is the mystery aspect, there was so much potential where you could have gathered random clues through exploring the social links and advancing the main plot, but unfortunately it boiled down to mostly stalling and red herrings.
@christinalittleton3771
Жыл бұрын
I can kind of relate to Shu (despite being non-Asian). Before my mom died from a gran mal, my grades were slightly above average and I'd get various congrats and "I'm so proud of you!" However, when I noticed my mom's "side effects" and my grades would slip, my family would only notice one "D-" or an "F"; they'd point that out, but they ignore the "B's", "C's", and an "A" or two. It was even worse for the teachers. I would get either one or two nice teachers that understand my struggle with me losing my mom at age 12 years old or my struggle with ADHD and the rest of the teachers would either be nonchalant or "mean and hateful" to me for no reason (like they got beef with my mom when they were younger and they're blaming me or something...).
@GG256_
Жыл бұрын
As far as the dungeons go, the reason why people like them, (especially Heaven) is for what they symbolize thematically and their aesthetic. Nanako is a child. Straight forward and innocent with no gimmicks and seeing the world as beautiful blah blah blah allegory about heaven. Compared to Tartarus, they added something: Insight to the dungeon character's depth, or at least complimented the character with consistency in a cool visual way. I do agree P4 isn't perfect, and it's level design is far from traditionally "excellent," but the nature of this particular critique seems like a false equivalence in contrast to the reason why people appreciate these dungeons in the first place. I like Persona 4's dungeons, not because they're fun to play like the map from Breath of the Wild or a level from Mario Odyssey, but because they tonally fit the game at that moment and thematically propel the dungeon character to new heights. Great video though. Valid criticisms and interesting insight.
@557deadpool
Жыл бұрын
They really don't though, you're just saying that because they have themes to their look instead of P3 where Tartarus was more like an alien or featureless void. It looks more like a place that makes sense for Shadows to be in than 4
@GG256_
Жыл бұрын
@@557deadpool Heaven doesn't fit an innocent child with a dead parent? A bath house doesn't fit a character led to be sexually ambiguous? (And should've stayed that way or at least came out in the game, but cultural barriers/different times.) A castle doesn't fit a character who literally calls herself a princess? Etc. Etc. They are all adjacent to their characters. Yes, I am just saying that because they actually have themes. They, to me, are a blast compared to null and void any day. I love both games, (P3 and 2-2 being my favorite of the Personas) but this was a welcome edition to the 2nd "trilogy" of games that 5r has obviously evolved into what we have today. To say visual style doesn't compliment what you play/keep players interested is a wild take that I see a lot today. (Not saying you said that.) I mainly play RPGs and fighting games. Visual and sound design are extremely important to both genres in certain ways, but I feel like RPGs get the short end of the stick here much too often, compared to my other favorite genre in particular. Games like Xenoblade have fantastic level design, and most of their entries simply have you walking and fighting. The environments and animations are a huge aspect of the entertainment factor of the game. No. I appreciate the care to actually design visual levels, even if what I am doing in said level is detached from the task.
@itsaUSBline
Жыл бұрын
@@557deadpool "you're just saying that because they have themes" um, yeah? that does seem to be the point of his comment. good job.
@sawtoothgrind1981
Жыл бұрын
Eh I think that's surface level and not a massive difference personally.
@enchantingggg8399
Жыл бұрын
@@sawtoothgrind1981I mean when doing further analysis on the characters their palace, naming, music and visually all play into their character at large, and when looking at preference those being there can massively impact perception of them, this is why some people (me included) thinks that Heaven is better than most palaces in P5/R despite being gameplay wise worse, you resonate with them more due to their depth
@darryljack6612
Жыл бұрын
26:10 You hit the nail on the head about the... "discourse" surrounding the game with players. I am personally someone who can acknowledge that the game have in some areas has aged like milk, but people saying the game and or the writers are this or that because it doesnt match to a modern day standard or didnt go how they thought it would in their in heads, is such a bad stance. Its honestly ironic that in a game about truth and seeing things for what they are, some people say no to what is present and seek to substitute it for what they think should be.
@AbstractTraitorHero
Жыл бұрын
My main problem is that the writers have not improved and indeed have been worse in many ways.
@neidhardt8093
6 ай бұрын
Yet the writers still never improved on those subjects.
@skunthundler
Жыл бұрын
From what I've heard, Akihiko isn't flanderized in the spinoffs. He's just actually written like that in the Japanese version of P3, never shutting up about protein. I don't know why they pretty much erased it from the English localization of P3, but I'd imagine they found it as unfunny as we would in the future.
@bubbletea_
Жыл бұрын
source?
@ice1638
Жыл бұрын
@@bubbletea_ cd dramas for the og p3 has akihiko talking about protein pretty often, but not really annoying or anything like that, its just a joke between him and shinji maybe, to put it in prespective, if chie meat shit is like 100/100, akihiko is like 7/100
@omensoffate
Жыл бұрын
Source : trust me bro
@elodis
Жыл бұрын
if there's anything i miss from persona 3, it's the party members second awakenings happening in the main story and not their social links. i really don't like how the characters in 4 and 5 seem to revolve around the protagonist and depend on them for personal growth. i know the protags are "special" but it's frustrating seeing characters shrink into the background after their awakening and treat the protagonist like a religious figure. even though sees were less of a typical friend group i think the characters still had more interesting dynamics with each other. i sort of struggle to picture the investigation team and the phantom thieves hanging out together once the protagonist leaves (with the exception of chie and yukiko). i just hope the persona 6 cast has more main story development and the protagonist is slightly more humble (though that last part may be an unpopular request).
@bluejay9638
8 ай бұрын
I think the investigation team would stick, especially chie, yukiko, and yosuke who are already friends before you even join, but for sure I doubt anyone in the phantom thieves talks anymore, just ryuji and ann.
@bakacdaz
8 ай бұрын
I hope it still based on Social Link but it can help another Social Like too. Like If I getting close to Yosuke he will helping me getting close to Chie easier too or something like that. Maybe Dual/team event would be nice too like going so out with 2 people at the same time too. (Like when Yu, Yosuke and Kanji try to hitting on the girls. But make it optimal as social link event.)
@Solarvortex7286
4 ай бұрын
@@bluejay9638calling yosuke and chie friends seems like a stretch
@bluejay9638
4 ай бұрын
@@Solarvortex7286 naaaah
@philmatibaggg9283
Жыл бұрын
i like the way you structured this video and offered different timestamps for both positive and negative thoughts. letting viewers choose to listen to only one part kinda reinforces their biases on the game itself, and people who do go out of their way to watch the full thing get to see the full picture of your opinions. in a similar way to persona 4 itself, this video challenges people who only choose what they wanna hear (the good or the bad) and determine it as the truth before grasping the full picture. i hope im not overthinking this and idk if it was ur actual intentions behind the vid, but i thought it was an interesting parallel and similarity, keep up the good vids :)
@bubbletea_
Жыл бұрын
yeah, that was basically the idea.
@BigKlingy
Жыл бұрын
The initial craze for P5 was 2018? But didn't it come out in English in 2017? Was it not as big in its initial release year? I think the Shadow and Persona split for this video makes perfect sense with the themes of this game. In general, I've always wanted more video essays like this, that focus on both the good AND the bad, instead of being like "X IS AN UNDERRATED MASTERPIECE" or "X IS TRASH AND YOU SHOUILD FEEL BAD FOR LIKING IT". I feel similarly on the pacing to you, but I prefer to compare Persona 5, since I feel 4 and 5 exist on opposite extremes. P4 has too many slice of life scenes and not enough plot. P5 has too much plot and not enough slice of life. (Most of the slice of live scenes end up focusing on the plot more) This results in P4 having a story where nothing happens outside of the very beginning and very end BUT the party actually feels like friends, and P5 having a better-paced story but the Phantom Thieves barely getting a chance to develop a group dynamic. Meanwhile, Persona 3 has a lot of awkward pacing issues too, I feel, but it balanced party development and story at the points where it did progress. Oddly, I think the only Persona game to completely nail the balance was... P5 Strikers. I like Persona 4's dungeons, but I get your points. I don't dislike Tartarus either. I think it's the aesthetics and music that make up for the bland randomized P4 dungeons to me. They still feel distinctive to me despite their "hollowness". 17:47 Eh, I don't agree with this, since I kept the shovel weapon on the MC for most of the game entirely for Auto-Tarukaja. Naoto also gets a late-game gun with Ice Boost, giving her a slight damage buff. I fully agree with the "pseudo weak"/resist system. It also has the consequence of making the All Out Attack easily the weakest of the 3/4/5 trilogy, admittedly it was pretty broken in 3, but in 4 it's barely worth it half the time. And the "soft weakness" system is dumb, case in point is that damn Knight enemy in Heaven, who's got annoying moves and only takes damage in the teens from its weakness. It feels like an enemy you're meant to instakill, but it's immune or resistant to those. I kinda like to call P4's approach to character development "Fire Emblem style". Containing all the development in optional relationship scenes and assuming you haven't seen them during the main plot. There's a reason FE does things that way though: CHARACTERS CAN PERMA-DIE. That's not the case in P4 yet it does things similarly. I get the issue with the cast revolving around "you" too much, that's another problem with modern Fire Emblem and its avatar system. I think it's more a general consequence of self-insert wish fulfillment than a P4 problem specifically, since MANY other modern JRPGs suffer from it. Come to think of it, maybe this is why I love the P4 anime so much. It made Yu Narukami his own person, and made him a hilarious weirdo, kinda the opposite of a bland self-insert, and it improve the rest of the team by proxy. It's why when I play P4 I headcanon his anime personality in there and it improves things. The whole "the story and writers are bad because they didn't do what I WANTED!" attitude is prevalent in any media, and it sucks. Focus on criticizing what the writing actually DID. Put together in only a year. I still think it's hilarious that base Persona 4 is literally a romhack of Persona 3. The fact it was this successful and good is amazing.
@bubbletea_
Жыл бұрын
it came out in 2017, but really started to amp up in presence in 2018.
@BigKlingy
Жыл бұрын
@@bubbletea_ Note that I'll be editing this comment a lot as I keep watching.
@BigKlingy
Жыл бұрын
Part 2: I agree with you that Golden's new slice of life events are very good, especially given how awful I found most of the vanilla ones. The beach, ski trip and band scenes were all really nice. We're also on the same page with Marie, I describe my feelings towards her exactly the same way you did: "I don't love her, I just don't hate her." The Hollow Forest is great, and she's not intrusive unless you do her Social Link. The main thing though is her existence adds foreshadowing for Izanami that wasn't in the original game, making the final boss less out-of-nowhere. "It might be kind of an Asian thing". That's why I like Shu's Social Link so much. It's a rare criticism of that study culture. Naoki is great, and I'm torn over whether he should've been more involved with the plot or not. The nurse, Uehara (who gets name-dropped in Takemi's P5 Confidant, actually)... I find her Social Link weird, since it flips between multiple angles and it feels like they couldn't decide on a consistent focus. It starts out with rumors of an affair with a patient, then it's about her being a workaholic, then there's guilt over a patient dying. It's like they were trying to write three different Social Links. I still love how Kanji has zero interest in Rise and how bothered she is by it. Chie's Social Link is mostly "eh", but I think her optional romance scenes are pretty nice, I like how surprised she is that you picked her, the most "normal" of the group's girls (she's got her weirdness but the others are even more so). There's just something nice about that. Teddie is.... he's terrible in spinoffs, and terrible in a lot of P4, but his scenes surrounding Nanako later on actually pretty good. "When the story gets good, it gets REALLY good" is how I'd sum up P4. I think P5's plot is more consistent, but its highs don't quite reach P4's highs. I still get chills during the Nanako kidnapping sequence. As for your conclusion, it's interesting. I often get turned away from some games due to HOW the fanbase treats and discusses them, it feels elitist but I guess... praising or criticizing them "for the wrong reasons". Like how it bothers me when people like Persona 3 for being dark and edgy. That's... really not the point of it, and P4 isn't all sunshine and rainbows. (Heck, the literal sunshine and rainbows dungeon is representative of the darkest leg of the story...) Overall I enjoyed this retrospective. I originally rejected P4 BECAUSE it hit too close to what I was going through at the time, or at least I thought it would. It was only later in life that I came to appreciate it.
@flatwoodsdaemon
Жыл бұрын
Potentially after the Joker Smash Bros reveal, although that was later in the year. That's certainly what inspired me to pick up the game, as I thought the character design and style of the Smash Bros reveal looked sick af
@insertnamehere658
Жыл бұрын
Eh, I disagree. The PTs constantly text each other, and do hang out a lot. Even if it more focuses on the plot, they clearly do spend a lot of time together, and care for each other (besides the girls beating up ryuji for not dying). Sure, I agree that they have less chemistry than the IT, but saying they don't have a dynamic is a big stretch.
@XVMatthew
Жыл бұрын
On the Kanji topic imo the real problem with his storyline is that the whole dungeon and characters' reactions are centered around internalized homophobia that never goes questioned. Yosuke in particular is assigned the role of bigot du jour in that his entire reactions are disgust at Kanji possibly being a homo. After the plotline ends and we get the conclusion that yes it was internalized homophobia but it's fine because he's not gay, just likes "girly" things. The rest goes entirely unquestioned and Yosuke continues to crack those jokes well after the dungeon is over. To me the intended message failed because the overtones were mostly huge relief that "at least he's not gay!". But then again, while I like the games just fine I tend to be far less charitable towards the cast of Personas through 5 so YMMV. I do also think the dungeon theme vs. Kanji's shadow self's actual issue have the largest disconnect in the game, which imo detracts further bc it read to me like they chickened out halfway through. I understand this take is a little less widely accepted, however. On Naoto's dungeon I thought her storyline was fine, if extremely heavy-handed. And on that topic I guess the message came across clearly.
@BigKlingy
Жыл бұрын
I think Yosuke's internalized homophobia makes more sense given unused voice clips imply he might have been a romance option at one point in development. While this absolutely doesn't justify the behavior, I've always interpreted Yosuke as a closeted bisexual and his homophobia is psychological projection.
@13kayrine
Жыл бұрын
I totally agree.
@trulymrword
7 ай бұрын
The Bathhouse dungeon in my opinion would have been better if it was the Textiles Shop instead and Kanji's Shadow was portrayed as a flamboyant fashion designer instead.
@Solarvortex7286
4 ай бұрын
I know im late but have you ever talked to a teenage boy? They act pretty homophobic until they learn otherwise
@yuantheblue
Жыл бұрын
I too have a love/hate relationship with this game, but for very different reasons. The battle system was just fine for me, and the whole random floor thing didn't even register as a carry over of P3. It just how it was and that was that. What did stick out to me were the team themselves in several situations and the option to romance practically every female of the team (too much, a few options would have been more than enough). The spa scenes with the guys always make me cringe, whether it is 3/4/5 or even the Tales of scene. Rise's attempts to gain his affection wore off fast. The guys always got the short end of the stick with suspicions (see: them being dunked in the river for Kanji's nosebleed and the whole spa scene debacle). The whole 'do not eat the girls cooking -- except for Naoto, she actually follows instructions' thing was deeply amusing tho! And man, the music. Even now sometimes I will turn on an extended loop of the boss music while cleaning or in case its been a downer of a day. And the fox was just adorable, and one social link that was very much appreciated late game!
@totalwasteofmytimee
Жыл бұрын
Hey, got here from the most recent video about Persona's dark endings and I truly hope both videos get the recognition they deserve :) Keep up the good work !
@billy65498
Жыл бұрын
I feel like Kanji and Naoto's stories are like painfully close to being affirming for a lot of queer people, so I get the frustration when it misses it, but also this is mid 2010s japan and culturally even the messages about not fitting into the common gender roles and how that can affect someone's perception and acceptance of themselves is still important.
@Fastwalker22
Жыл бұрын
The scene where you have to choose whether or not to kill Namatame felt ridiculously manipulative to me. If they actually stuck to their guns and truly killed Nanako, saving Namatame would stick in your minds as the player and as the party; This guy, who very much isn't the true culprit, still killed someone that was very dear to you, and very well may end up running free for it, even if he didn't have any malice in what he did. Nanako's death just feels like a cheap plot device that exists to add fake tension to the confrontation with Namatame, one that they're far too spineless to follow through on. Sure, just kill off a beloved character for all of five seconds just so you can say "Look at how evil this guy is", then bring her back because you only wanted the death for the shock. (To be clear, I don't think Nanako should have died. There's plenty of genuine drama in the situation just with Nanako being in critical condition. No need for fake stakes, just make it clear that Nanako is in bad shape both before AND after you confront Namatame. This drives home the impact of what Namatame has done and doesn't retroactively try to make him less bad by disingenuously saying "look! Nanako is all better!" after you decide to spare him, while not ever demonizing him beyond the actions he actually did take. It's just that if you're gonna go so far to actually kill Nanako, you better actually stick to it.)
@thatonepyronoob
6 ай бұрын
If you haven't seen it already, the Persona 4 anime (original, I haven't watched Golden so I don't know what it does with this plot point) handles this infinitely better than the game. Basically, in the anime, Yu has Namatame like halfway shoved into the TV, but stops himself from killing him because it would make the Investigation Team no better than him. It's a little tropey, but hey, what can you do.
@johans3164
21 күн бұрын
@@thatonepyronoob Persona 4 anime did a LOT of justice to the main character, tbh. There are so many great, vulnerable moments that managed to make him NOT being a perfect Gary Stu
@MoneyFolder
Жыл бұрын
Brilliant video. Honestly made me re-think a lot about this game. I really love this game, and your video made me honestly love it even more.
@Thetom5000
7 ай бұрын
Fun fact if you play P4 Golden with a controller it vibrates when the gas attendant shakes your hand
@SomeAsian
Жыл бұрын
Persona 4 is like that really talented kid in school who never actually does work and then the group project happens and then they hard-carry the team.
@frankwest5388
Жыл бұрын
So anime Yu then?
@DOCTOR.DEADHEAD
Жыл бұрын
While I don't think the game or its writers are bigoted for how Naoto and Kanji are portrayed, I do believe their struggles could've been written with a bit more sensitivity given the parallels players could draw. Not to mention Yosuke showing disdain when Kanji (or the player in some dialogue choices) so much as implies liking men.. It's just poorly handled if you ask me, but then again I guess I shouldn't be too shocked considering it's a game from 2008.
@omensoffate
Жыл бұрын
This comment is the problem in todays society.
@DOCTOR.DEADHEAD
Жыл бұрын
@@omensoffate lol okay
@Solarvortex7286
4 ай бұрын
@@omensoffateboth comments are. people can simply be without boxes and people can be assholes about it
@redmage5251
Ай бұрын
I'm not qualified to talk about Kanji but it's not Atlus's fault people looked at a story about misogyny and thought "ah yes, a trans guy"
@TheKewlPerson
Жыл бұрын
Honestly, my biggest problem is how much the plot revolves around who the culprit is, that if that gets spoiled for you, so much of the games plot is ruined. Especially with how popular on the internet and meme culture the game has become, it's almost impossible to avoid being spoiled during or even before playing the game, and with how long the game is, that just gives you more time in between starting the game and finding who the culprit is to be spoiled. Also since it's a murder mystery, the whole game feels pointless after you know already who it is.
@itsaUSBline
Жыл бұрын
I just recently played it for the first time, was spoiled by memes about who the culprit was, and I still enjoyed the game immensely. I feel like the plot is actually kind of secondary to the game's themes. Only Persona games I've played so far are Persona 5 Royal, which was my first and inspired me to go give the other ones a try, and I just finished Persona 4 Golden for the first time last night, and honestly I think I liked P4 a lot more than P5. So I wouldn't say it was ruined at all.
@rayvenkman2087
Жыл бұрын
I think the mystery is just a means to an end, not the end goal.
@chandra_creator
Жыл бұрын
I've been spoiled a LOT and I'm still enjoying it, particularly the characters (with the plot it's like there's a sense of dread in terms of "ohh but i know what happens after this"
@keenoyo
Жыл бұрын
Earlier this year was the first time I played and finished Persona 4 (original). I couldn't agree more that this game is harder to hate than love. I was truly invested in this game for about 100 hours game time and got through every ending. The true ending had me in tears. Awesome video bro, keep up the amazing work.
@bartsneezin
8 ай бұрын
Honestly shocked that the "detective gameplay" didn't come up at all in the "shadow" section of the video, I think it's easily the worst thing Persona 4 does. In order to simulate a detective game in a JRPG, the player has to... speak to literally every NPC in town until one of them randomly advances the case. But they have to be spoken to in a specific order, so you'll often have to speak to every person in town, multiple times, per case to advance the story. Putting this grind off causes you to literally lose days since all of the team links get locked behind story advancement. There's even a case at the very end of the game where the game tracks whether or not the player has interacted with every single NPC before giving them a special dialogue option that allows them to access the true ending. This is some of the worst gameplay i've ever experienced in a game. It is way too often that the "clue" you get is nonsense, meaningless, or actively wrong, so you have to speak to everyone once you deduce the first NPC in the chain. Playing these segments without a guide handy is videogame hell. I think it's easily the worst part about Persona 4, and if it was any more prevalent in the gameplay loop i think it would actively ruin the game.
@magiciansarcana
10 ай бұрын
As a lesbian, I don't feel like the game is actually discriminatory towards LGBT people, but I do feel like some of the decisions made weren't the best ones and don't hold up well. I'm not talking about Naoto not being trans, I think it would've been cool but her struggle with Gender as a commentary on sexism is still interesting and worth thinking about. Removing Yosuke's romance is my biggest complaint actually, in my eyes it takes away a HUGE chunk of context for his character and the behavior he's shown before. Removing it kind of makes him go from someone who badly expresses a struggle he has with himself to just kind of a jerk who barely ever gets told off. Not that having a character who's sort of an ass is inherently a bad character to write, it's a very interesting take but in this case it turns a nice character arc into a bad personality trait that never ends up being addressed or handled well even though EVERYONE notices it. The tent scene and his treatment of Kanji in general left a bad taste in most people's mouth and having some sort of in-game resolution besides the obvious "homophobic teenage boy" would've been good. If a game doesn't have a character be LGBT because there's another compelling story to tell I have no issue, but in this case all you're left with is a "realistic" portrayal of a teenage dude and his bad traits, which just feels weird considering none of the other characters have any bad traits that are taken and portrayed as that serious iirc.
@station428
6 ай бұрын
I feel like Persona 4 has way too much filler. I don't really know how to put it. I think the way I'll say it is; you play Persona 3 and Persona 5, but you don't "play" Persona 4. I bet that makes no sense.
@tasked5720
Жыл бұрын
Don't know if someone ever noticed this, but in Void Quest, the camera turn happens ONLY IF you go at the center of the cross... You can literally go around it... That's a bad gimmick for a dungeon
@TheWolfgangGrimmer
Жыл бұрын
Not to mention than even if it does happen, it gives itself away with a loud clack and doesn't even actually change your position on the map, which makes it straight up pointless. I generally like the dungeon gimmicks however.
@soundonly7155
8 ай бұрын
I have a love hate relationship with all of the persona franchise they're such good games but they're ridden with constant sexism, homophobia and transphobia it's so weird playing games where I know the writers actually hate me
@realnito6422
Жыл бұрын
49:26 Chie missing gods hand is probably the most relatable experience ever
@Vexxing_0001
6 ай бұрын
I enjoyed persona 4 the most because it really feels like all the characters are still kids trying to live their lives and make it through high school and love their daily lives. Not saying that persona 3 or 5 didn’t also have that, but I really feel like the little celebrations after a dungeon shows that this is just a group of high schoolers trying to deepen their bonds with each other and become better friends and allies. Persona 3 feels like it’s just a bunch of adults (due to lack of supervision aside from ikutski, but we all know how that ended up) trying to fis the worlds problems from under the covers, and persona 5 just feels like a bunch of under cover cops hiding in day to day life while fixing Japans problem in the background. I like that persona 4 doesn’t give recognition to the cast of characters for fixing everything, the only ones who know are you, the crew, and the dojimas, the world doesn’t commend you for fixing the problem because there’s no need to. Persona five the entire crew has their fan base cheering them on and pushing them to the finish and everyone contends them for it (if I’m being honest I think persona 5 suffers from your social links finding out that you’re a phantom thief)and persona 3 like I said earlier just feels like adults doing their job. There’s something surreal about a bunch of high school kids who realized they saved everyone they care about and being joyous over it and I feel that persona 4 captured that extremely well. Their just kids who want to live their day to day lives, they want to become better friends and in the end they saved the people they cared about most and never sought praise, they successfully brought that peace they always wanted back and became better friends because of it. Persona five is a rant on society and politics that’s its big issue, persona 3 you’re thrown into an ongoing problem that’s my issue with it. But with persona 4 the problem solidifies itself and you make the choice to fix it and restore peace to your small town. Persona 4 does have negatives, I do think that pacing at the start is boring but once they realize what they need to do to bring back their normal lives the pace picks up and I love that. At first it feels like some kids trying to play detective and then I’d say after rise’s dungeon it changes and their motivation to fix everything steps up and their determination becomes unmatched, and to close if if they get rid of any way for the fog that ruined their peace to come back. That’s why I like persona 4
@ShursGarden
9 ай бұрын
"There are people who argue that the filler moments in P4 improve the pacing." Yes, and I'm one of them. Filler isn't inherently bad, the filler moments in Persona 4 have made the Investigation Team the most tight-knit group of Persona users in the modern trilogy.
@MysteriousMusician33
7 ай бұрын
You would enjoy Spy x Family. It’s like P4G in the way it uses the filler to build bonds between characters, as well as subtly hint at important stuff that happens down the line. P4G and SxF really contribute to the thought that filler doesn’t really have to be bad, and it can even contribute to the greater story as a whole.
@ShursGarden
7 ай бұрын
@@MysteriousMusician33 I *would?* Honey, I *do* enjoy Spy X Family.
@CheesyLizzy
Жыл бұрын
This is an amazing review and I'm glad other people also have mixed feelings on this game ^^ Overall I do like it because if you focus on the good this is a fun persona game But the thing that makes it my least favorite persona game is it's handling of the characters I think the best way to handle it in future Persona games is if they had character growth moments within the story itself like in p3, but then still had social links for all your party members, but those social links are simply for just spending time with your buds ^^
@sashalvy
7 ай бұрын
for me its a hate-hate relationship
@vibespidersstudios8895
Жыл бұрын
To be honest the only thing you didn’t talk about is the P4’s velvet room which is my fav in all the games. It just a fancy limousine driving through the endless fog and not knowing where to go. That is where the theme of P4 shines the most is the moment when you lose the things that are important to you like your bonds with your friends. Or life doesn’t give you anything and you just walk the world like a zombie and being in a endless job where you’re feel you are content. However you know the sad feeling that you’ve just sacrifice your own individuality for the state of being secure. That is what P4 meant to me is the world is an endless fog you are driving yourself into and you are feeling like a zombie because nobody gave you a chance to become your own person. I think it is always best to peruse what you like and stop actually thinking this one small thing is a failure when it is not unless you try it out sometime. Btw I loved how you format this video to have negative first so it can be positive at the end. Though I do have bias for P3 and P4 being way better than P5 (especially in the music part where they recycle boss music and normal battle music in P5. I felt so connected to P4 because at least the final boss has different music and I instantly connect that I need to win so hard and cannot lose.) I also say negative on the dungeons being way too bland didn’t care but the purpose is to finish the boss before getting kicked out of the tv world to at least spend more time doing other things.
@technicallythecenteroftheu1349
Жыл бұрын
With the Naoto and Kanji stuff, it's not so much that their characters in isolation are bad, it's that some people are annoyed that it fits into the trend of queerbaiting. This has mostly stopped but for a good few decades writers would *hint* that a character *might not be straight* to get attention without actually doing anything. (Also it doesn't help that Naoto's conflict is an actual real-life argument that people use to infantilize trans men.) This doesn't happen so much now, but I think it's still fair to critique media that engaged in it when it was a common practice. Now we have big movies giving throwaway confirmations that a minor character is queer before quickly editing it out for the Chinese market.
@peterparker1683
Жыл бұрын
To be fair with Naoto. Dojima mentions how pissed he is in a drunken fit about how he has to listen to “some junior detective from the city”. They also bring up her prejudice again when investing her history when she is kidnapped.
@pokemonduck
Жыл бұрын
I like P4, but the main problem I have with the game is that there is just sooo much filler content that doesn't add anything to the story or characters. I understand that some people might like this but for me, especially coming from P3, it got incredibly frustrating when I just wanted to see where the murder mystery would go
@rogercheetoofficial
Жыл бұрын
I would have preferred if P4 had smaller, hand-crafted dungeons if it would mean more could be done with them. Sure, it could mean some might find it less interesting, but I want some substance to accompany the honestly pretty tight aesthetic variety
@sakibahmed2063
Жыл бұрын
As a bangladeshi, i will always welcome the p4 crew
@bubbletea_
Жыл бұрын
let's goooo. i was waiting for someone from bangladesh to comment on that joke.
@sakibahmed2063
Жыл бұрын
@@bubbletea_ omg ly content. i have been binging your vids today. keep up the good work
@morkgin2459
Жыл бұрын
What did the crew do?
@KommandeurMumm
Жыл бұрын
I might ruffle some feathers here, but well, let's see how much hate i can draw. It's about Kanji and Naoto and my take of them. Kanji: He's not gay. He is insecure about his manliness because of his hobbies and likes. He is also influenced by his, and the expectations of others about himself. What sends his feelings haywire is Naoto, who he feels attracted to, even though he believes her to be a boy. That scares him, because now he comes to the conclusion, that he has to be gay, and he has no idea how to deal with that. And even though he comes to terms with his feelings, and that it's okay if he likes non masculine things, he is still relieved when Naoto is revealed to be a girl. Because now he has an explanation for why he feels attracted to her. And Naoto is the only "Boy" Kanji ever shows attraction for in the game. So no, Kanji isn't gay, neither does he promote homophobia. He's a teenage boy, and he is written like one. And I personally wouldn't call Naoto trans either, because she crossdresses for one reason only: Her job as a detective. She thinks she can't be a successful detective as a girl, because she won't be taken seriously. And without someone to talk some sense into her, she starts to spiral and believes she has to become a "real" boy to succeed in life. She basically convinces herself that being trans is better than being a girl (A topic that somehow only got more current and relevant since the game released). The fact that nobody gives a damn when she reveals herself as a girl, just goes to show, how skewed her perception was. And no, her realising, that she isn't trans and can live a happy and successful life as a girl is NOT transphobic. Most people forget that these characters are teens and they absolutely behave like teens. Their knowledge about life is limited (despite them thinking otherwise), and they react to certain situations in certain ways. They don''t think in grays, they think mostly in black and white. They are still impressionable by and dependent on others, while trying to be independent and self sufficient as much as possible. And I think Persona's depiction of that is spot on.
@shmeebs387
10 ай бұрын
Yeah. Kanji's defining moment in his life was his dad dying. His dad told him to be strong, but with his dad now gone, Kanji didn't have that role model for what a strong man looked like. He became self-conscious about it because his interests didn't align with what he thought a man was supposed to be. So he overcompensates and tries to turn himself into a stereotypical though guy. The reading that Kanji is gay and Naoto is trans misses the point of the shadows. They aren't literal. Like Rise doesn't actually want to be a stripper, and Yukiko doesn't actually want to be a princess with a harem. They are not really the "true self" like they claim. They are kernels of a repressed inner truth that manifest in malignant, hostile ways. Kanji's shadow is a stereotypical gay guy because that's the how Kanji is scared of being perceived. It's his subconscious berating him with how he's afraid other people see him in contrast to the version of himself his dad told him to be. It's not him.
@overlordchemm3705
Жыл бұрын
The only thing I like about Teddie, and something I've not heard a single person talk about, is Kamui Miracle. He was a pretty key member of my party before getting that skill, but combat became so much more fun with a dice roll like that in my back pocket. There were several times in the Hollow Forest alone where I was running low on SP, only for Kamui Miracle to trigger a full HP/SP recovery for everyone.
@azolaun
Жыл бұрын
3:30 gotta be one of the best intros I've ever heard that represents Persona 4 quite well. Very nice
@adhdlorde
Жыл бұрын
I think naoto’s gender is a pretty complex subject. I personally don’t think she’s trans. Now I don’t know the writer’s intention but this isn’t to say the writing wasn’t transphobic. There are 3 popular transphobic troupes that I could see in her writing: 1. the fantasy that transgender men will go back to being female if he finds the right man 2. Transgender men only transition to escape misogyny and to obtain male privilege 3. Trans people are just insecure and will eventually learn how to love themselves as the gender they were assigned with at birth I really like naoto and find her relatable but I also realize there’s a lot of problems with her writing. I’m not to fussed because the game was made over a decade ago but I still think it’s important to discuss and learn from this. Anyways I really liked the video sorry for the long and possibly controversial comment!! ^^
@sm3argleliker
Жыл бұрын
all of this only applies if u assume naoto was written as a trans man, though, which she wasn’t. not every story arc involving a cis person questioning their gender needs to end with them becoming trans.
@sm3argleliker
Жыл бұрын
like not that it’s necessarily you _in specific_ expressing this, i just generally dislike the mindset that if someone (a) has any hangups related to gender stuff and (b) doesn’t conclude that they are automatically 100% trans beyond a shadow of a doubt, then that constitutes a “transphobic trope”
@cheesykebs708
5 ай бұрын
I think P4's biggest problem is how fucking boring the non-essential characters were like the a lot of the persona wielders and nanako and dojima are great but when its not to do with main characters of the story the game seriously drops the ball I used to think it wasn't so bad cuz "ah well P5 has ohya, mishima and gamer boy they cant all be winners" but since playing P3 and that game having near immaculate character writing (aside from the fat kid) I just end up being bored out of my mind doing social links not relating to the main cast in P4 I could not be any less invested them
@JohnSmithIlIlIlIl
Жыл бұрын
Persona 4 is one of only a handful of JRPGs that I actually feel something when playing. The other games are Grandia, Tales of Vesperia, Final Fantasy 4, Legend of Dragoon, Chrono Cross, and Wild Arms. Especially Grandia! There are scenes in that game that make me tear up EVERY TIME! Violins and soft piano music are my weakness!
@hwex_9461
Жыл бұрын
babe wake up bubbletea just made a video essay on the best game ever made
@Xenosaga
4 ай бұрын
I like how the thumbnail is reminiscent of megami ibunroku persona and both persona 2 games
@rpgcraftsman520
Жыл бұрын
0:38 - Somehow, Makoto accidentally activating the Demon Summoning Program (which let's say Futaba made) seems completely in character for her...
@tteister
9 ай бұрын
What a good video, srsly! Regardless of agreeing or disagreeing wt your points, the way you structured them, the editing choices, everything is so on point. Good job!
@bubbletea_
8 ай бұрын
thank you
@Popinazo
Жыл бұрын
Bruh, as a person who has played all 6 Persona games, you can't say that the dungeons here felt emptier and longer than Tartarus... I haven't feel as exhausted of playing a video game as I did in P3 FES.
@bubbletea_
Жыл бұрын
yes i can. i just did. i’ve played all 6 games as well. you can disagree all you want. i straight up said it’s an unpopular opinion.
@nunyabiddeness6544
Жыл бұрын
Sorry to necro an old comment but I agree that Persona 4's dungeons feel emptier than persona 3's. To start off with, movement matters much more in FES than in Golden. Getting hit first by a shadow can always threaten an instant wipe due to the way that game handles knockdown and the "one more!" system. When a character uses a full turn just getting back up, especially in a game where you can't force other characters to use re patra, you're ALWAYS at risk of a wipe, especially getting hit by the opponent first. Tartarus also has physically more room to maneuver around shadows, with many shadows spawning in square rooms, usually with some kind of ledge for the player to retreat to. In persona 4, shadows spawn in those awful little hallways and corridors, which offer less opportunity for movement. Shadows also take longer to react to you in persona 4, making stealth, a huge part of sneaking up on enemies in persona 3, matter way less. Combined with the fact that you'll almost never see your main character get dizzy from a first strike, and if you did you could fix it with amrita, there's less tension in exploring persona 4's dungeons. I also think Persona 4 encourages badly paced exploration in dungeons. Every dungeon can be finished in a single day, and using multiple days for a dungeon wastes valuable S-Link time. So the most efficient strategy is to manage your SP resources and try to finish the whole dungeon in one straight shot. Contrast this with Persona 3, which encouraged multiple shorter tartarus sessions per month, AND had the player managing resources between teleporters, a much shorter endeavor with higher stakes due to how easily it was to die to random shadows, and you get a much more consistent dungeon crawling experience. Persona 3's "train sporadically the whole month in preparation for the full moon" encourages good pacing and creates ludonarrative harmony. The gameplay loop of 10-15 floor resources management segments leading nicely into a big flashy boss, usually accompanied by beautiful anime cutscenes and unique (sometimes explorable) locations make a much better payoff. Compare this to Persona 4, where its often most efficient to leave dungeoning to the end of the fog cycle or wait for a rainy day when you can't do social links. You're encouraging the player to allow a character to languish in a mental torture chamber for a week or two while you and the homies hang out at the corner store. Then you have to stop all the fun life sim gameplay and hit the dungeon for 3 hours straight before you can resume the life sim. The dungeoning doesn't fit as neatly into the wider game as persona 3's does. Persona 4's bosses definitely DO have great character moments, but the raw gameplay experience between the cutscenes where a character gets kidnapped and the cutscene where a character has an emotional resolution is worse designed than the gameplay in persona 3, in my opinion.
@vanillafloat
Жыл бұрын
I don't even think that having social links with all your teammates is a plus. Because of that there are less of unique only social link charachers. And especially it is not a big deal in persona 4 because you spend A LOT of time with these charachers already in the main story.
@Rosie_Cozy
Жыл бұрын
3 portable proves you can have a very involved story in the main story and have a social link, just look at junpei
@Skallva
Жыл бұрын
@@Rosie_Cozy Not the argument. The SLs may work for the PMs in P3 (except Mitsuru's - that one just sucks lol) but it still kinda takes away from the whole vibe of 'fool's journey' when so much time ends up being spent with the people you already know instead of forming new and equally valid relationships. More of an aesthetic thing, really.
@PoisonedElite
Жыл бұрын
tbh my big problem with naoto and kanji is less that they arent what people want them to be but the fact that they handle that kind of subject matter with the subtlety and care of a kid dropping a glass vase.
@Valenciaga.CrocHeels
5 ай бұрын
to be honest my homophobia complaints don't really come from kanji himself (he's objectively one of the best characters in the game) but rather from yosuke. He has so many comments that he makes towards kanji that are just so mean spirited for literally no reason. Worse part being that you can't even like call out yosuke for it at all because god forbid narukami ever butt heads with his friends (except for the one time where he's objectively in the right). And yes i know every yosuke apologist will be quick to remind me that "he was supposed to be a romance option so it makes sense!" and if he actually was a romance option it would have made sense that he has internalized homophobia and projects it onto kanji because of his own insecurities. But he isn't. So Yosuke just acts like a dick for no reason with ZERO character development to address it. And while Persona 3 wasn't much better (with the trans lady in Yakushima) the remake at least removed the lines and changed the context of the scene so that Junpei isn't just randomly transphobic. I don't get why people try so desperately to justify his bad behavior.
@reflex_1019
Жыл бұрын
It's crazy that I started with 5R and went into 4 with not feeling it in the beginning and forced myself to play through it, it easily became one of my fav JRPGS and I liked the main cast in 4 more than in 5. Interesting to see how someone who played through the other games 1st views 4 on it's own
@KonK4tsu
Жыл бұрын
Maybe the best way to write a social link is to put it around the story. That is to say, tie social link progression around story progression so you could finally be able to have a character change in both the story AND the social link believably
@AivarSablinski4705
Жыл бұрын
Now that would be amazing!
@solidcake235
Жыл бұрын
Honestly, I was preety engaged for the entire runtime of the game. Sure November is absulutely crazy and I loved it especially nanako's dungeon and the Ameno sagiri fight but during my first playthrough, even before then I found the story preety engaging. I couls kinda predict that half the game would revolve around saving the main cast depicted on the cover of the game (as tou can guess it was my first persona game) but just enough events occured in the middle of it to throw me off. For example I didn't really expect the whole mitsuo situation and I genuinly thought he was the culprit. Also the emphasis on meeting the people of the town and doing their social links was enough to keep me engaged anyway along with the fun battles and the calendar system and all that.The relatively simple mystery felt appropriate for the game. That also the reason I don't really like the anime. I kinda liked marie but not nearly as much as all the other chracters. I don't think there really was a character in this game I didn't really like And apart from the dungeons being kind boring sometimes, and me not liking some of the vagueness on how certain things worked in the story like the midnight channel, I don't really have anything bad to say about the game And maybe Im new here but I can see the "Megaten fans don't like megaten games" thing Or I always see the glass half full
@SakuraPottage
Ай бұрын
The Pink Plague duo of Yasogami has broken all the aesops
@_Kaori_Miyazono_
Жыл бұрын
I love Persona 4. I completed it two days ago on PS VITA, I had got a normal ending without facing goddess Izanami. I did have questions in the back of my mind. Like about why people appear in the midnight channel in the first place? Because Adachi had nothing to do with it. I rushed the game as much as I could because of my exams coming up. Yet I still failed to complete the game, and it's message. I shall never let myself be rushed again, and seek the truth and only the truth! So I am replaying this game now to actually get the truth behind the truth. Thank you Persona 4 for the life-changing experience for me Your channel motivated me to play persona 3 FES afterwards I will even buy PS2 just for this game. I hope it will be a blast!)
@Siinory
Жыл бұрын
I was kinda expecting some blind hate towards the game (While I am literally binging your content that youtube recommended me out of the blue). In the end I found out a very well constructed video on why you don't like it, giving really good arguments while also giving arguments on why you like it. KZitem needs more people like you, I'm currently experiencing the game as a newcomer to the whole SMT/Persona series and so far I like it, my gripe is the pacing beiong quite slow especially at the beginning but you gotta set up the stage and characters after all!
@omensoffate
Жыл бұрын
Blind hate ? You expecting it is the problem in todays society. Good on you for giving it a chance at least.
@Siinory
Жыл бұрын
@@omensoffate You kinda misinterpreted my words but it's fine. I'm just extremely cautious about this kinds of vids in youtube
@pineappleactavis420
Жыл бұрын
i like how this video was structured btw, it works pretty good. overall good vid bro keep doing what you're doing
@thebige6347
Жыл бұрын
P4's OST brings a tear to my eye
@lawrencesolomon8325
10 ай бұрын
Funny how I suspected the gas attendant to be sus was because she never offered me that part time job at any point in the game
@melteddali8000
7 ай бұрын
P4 has some of the highest highs and lowest lows of the series. Good game overall but an uneven ride. Love (most) of the characters and the social links but yeah the gameplay and pacing can feel rough. Music is fantastic ofc but thats expected with Persona. Such great ambiance. And yes I would kill Teddie with hammers if given the option. Never have I hated a character more.
@dachking6657
Жыл бұрын
Persona 4 is my third favorite mainline, only tailing Eternal Punishment and Persona 5. I really like the characters, enjoy the mystery, and adore the setting, just to name a few things.
@ryandullaghan7021
7 ай бұрын
You are missing the point of people's complaints about Persona 4's queer representation. I think you need to research what 'Queer Baiting' is before you put down people's legitimate critiques of P4's character development. The issue isn't with Kanji, for me, isn't that the game never explicitly calls him gay, it's that his shadow world is a fucking gay sauna, and you would have to be pretty fucking in the closet or sheltered to misinterpret that as anything other than, 'I wanna have anonymous sex with men.' His shadow-self is an amazing showcase of the struggle of identity and sexuality. Kanji emerging from a flowered muscle body between two stereotypes, the mean guy and the nice guy. JRPGs and Anime are littered with that dichotomy stereotype. His boss fight shows an amazing portrait of shame and acceptance of sexuality... Then his social link is trying to explain that away, "eh I'm not gay I just think knitting is neat!" Fuck that noise, your shadow self, the repressed part of you, was naked and flirting with men! Stop changing the fucking subject on to wool, Kanji. You did not have to make a statement like that, calling out people who are seeing their own identity portrayed in this game then having it pulled away at the last minute. Announcing that upset and disappointment is a very understandable emotional reaction for someone to have, when they never see themselves represented, only to see it for a second before it's written off so lazily. You need to respect that, and not make your voice a deciding factor on whether something is or is not bigoted. Things are more complicated than the sum total of one person's experience, listen to voices that are not just your own. Ricky Gervais once said something along the lines of just cause you're offended doesn't mean you're right, and that is absolutely correct, but the reverse is true also, just because you're not offended does not mean you're right. Neither side gets the final say, but at least if someone is offended, they're showcasing some level of vulnerability and truth. I couldn't continue watching the video without commenting on this. As for Naoto, I'm not trans so it is not my right to pontificate, but the issue wouldn't be a Mulan trope. Probably has more to do with the fact that Naoto's shadow self tries to give her an actual medical procedure the mirror's what trans people do in real life.
@onioncultistlordoftheonion8315
Жыл бұрын
As a gay teen i admit i projected myself heavily into Kanji, but at the same time, I think even then I could acknowledge that what they where doing with him was not what I wanted out of him. I actually self corrected that by a Persona OC with heavy self-insert characteristics that was heavily inspired by him, with influences from my other favorite persona characters (like Eriko form P1/2 and her love of the occult.) Who was explicitly gay and who's shadow directly confronted that feeling of internalized homophobia I had at the time. Basically the character was Kanji if Kanji was actually gay, threw knives and razors in combat, and was obsessed with the occult and witchcraft and the like instead of sewing. While I'm older and alot of Persona's elements don't really sit with me like when I was younger, I do think it was very formative in the way i think about character creation (and was what got me into the tarot, I haven't read the cards in several years but i used to do it all the time in high school)
@oldlemon1533
Жыл бұрын
It's definitely sad to admit the majority of the problems with Persona 4. But for me that is part of the "charm", to put it nicely.
@FlamasNegras
Жыл бұрын
I just came from your bad ending video. I guess the performance of this video is the bad ending of this timeline O.O
@chasebladesword1211
Жыл бұрын
Sad that this video didn't do as well as your latest video, but if it makes ya feel better I just spend an hour of my night I should've been sleeping watching and enjoying it.
@4wingedowl
Жыл бұрын
Hello, this is a comment to help boost the algorithm
@iamafanofmanythings3973
7 ай бұрын
my bf and i often debate about persona 4 being good. the consensus we've landed on is that by its self? its a good game. but as a persona game, it feels lacking especially with the lack of stakes.
@xithael8709
Жыл бұрын
“Naoto is kinda mid, to be honest.” (Behold, the persona fan’s wrath)
@browserjunior4707
6 ай бұрын
Man I still feel so bad for Snapcube when she complained about P4’s writing. Like all she did was complain about the message of a specific scene got muddied and wasn’t really conveyed as tactfully as it should’ve been and then EVERYONE in the Persona community jumped her cause they assumed she was complaining about “Kanji isn’t gay? Cringe!” when she didn’t even say any of that and was just put off at how his message while good could’ve been expressed a bit better and Yosuke not helping at all in that message having meaning cause of his constant belittling at Kanji’s expense. The fact that people still have this belief that a story must be digested diluted and interpreted one way and only one way is disingenuous to the persona series as a whole cause they clearly want these characters to be interpreted in different ways outside of their portrayal in-game. If someone resonated with Naoto’s story and felt seen, whether that person was a woman or a trans man, then that’s wonderful. We shouldn’t belittle or be accusatory if someone doesn’t see a character the way you do. I’m Bisexual and I fucking ADORE Kanji cause I relate hard to his need of wanting to be accepted by someone no matter who they are. That’s something that resonated with me, yet people out there in the community will vehemently say I’m misinterpreting his character. P4 has some good highs and some bad lows, and it’s fine to acknowledge them like what this video’s entire existence is about. It can do things very well but it can also muddy up its own themes and messages.
@Locaneo
Жыл бұрын
I agree with everything you said, and I'd like to add that one of my most concerning issues with the game is the utter lack of connection with Izanami when we get to know Nyx/Pharos so well in P3. They tried to bandage that with Marie, but I don't like her and she's not even really Izanami, just a stand in.
@Psycho_Psy
9 ай бұрын
Persona fans trying not to dislike 5 cause it's more popular (Challenge: Impossible)
@BetweenTheBorders
Жыл бұрын
So, just watched your P3 and P4 videos, and while I have things I could say, they're likely not anything you haven't heard before. But I did want to say, as someone who played P3 and P4 at launch (not FES or Golden, that was much later) I'm happy you saw what I saw: something so different. Even now it's hard to find something with this style and focus on life and interpersonal relationships. I will never forget the first time I saw P3. It was the end of a battle, and the splash of color, the music, and the motion. I couldn't believe it was an RPG. So, P3P, FES, Golden, P5, P5R, PQ 1&2, Soul Hackers 1&2, DS2: Record Breaker, Strange Journey, and SMT4&5 later and all I can say is they each did something right, and I'm still excited to watch a streamer I know continue in P4. It's been a great journey, and while I am cautiously optimistic about the re-release of P3, I hope it keeps the story with a few mechanical tweaks, even just the P3P level of slink tweaks. Thanks for the videos. Must've taken forever.
@vietnguyen2293
7 ай бұрын
Played P5 first, then P3, and finally P4 Golden. Can confidently say I enjoyed P4 the least
@Mahagion
Жыл бұрын
I haven't had the time to watch KZitem much at all lately, so it took a little time before I got to watching this. Overall, opinion-wise I found this video to be very interesting. I enjoyed hearing your thoughts on this game, both negative and positive. It's a shame it hasn't gotten that many views considering how good this video really is! Very well-paced, interesting and entertaining. I like it!
@Guntherson220
Жыл бұрын
The whole thing with us being ahead of the characters in terms of the MO of people that are on the news and therefore being in the public consciousness being the next victim is only because 4 games in we, as the players, know this series is firmly planted in the Collective Unconscious a fact that I don't think is concretely stated in 3 or 4 outside of a blink and you'll miss it clue given by Igor when he says that the Velvet Room exists between mind and matter, dreams and reality and that's only said about the Velvet Room.
@shinigamisway1645
5 ай бұрын
Absolutely fantastic video, dude. I really resonated with the part where you mentioned you weren't at the "right place right time " for this game to really reach ya , yet you still enjoy it regardless. Im definitely not the target demographic for these games (24M) as im closer to age with Adachi then the Investigation team, and yet the games still spoke to me in a profound way that has me rethinking my whole life and studying Jungian philosophy. A scarier parallel than the investigation team, is to the villian, Adachi. Persona 3 taught me to reexamine my views on life and what it means to be a nihilist. And Persona 4 taught me to face down the ugly parts of myself and to keep myself grounded in reality and surrounded by caring people who will keep my head on straight. P5R is next, and I'm pretty damn excited for this playthrough. This is coming from someone who played p5 when it first dropped and is only getting into the other games and tackling royal this year. Such a fantastic series.
@gaberobison680
Жыл бұрын
You’re right on! I don’t play P4 for the story I play it for the experience of just not rushing, enjoying what’s around you, believing in people, having purpose.
@Ramiel1point0
Жыл бұрын
P4 Dungeon Crawling: You're not alone. I completely agree. I've never seen someone else say it out loud!
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