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@venti9925
5 ай бұрын
Maybe with less stories about your childhood. 1 min in I already wanna leave lol
@SolidShepard
5 ай бұрын
@venti9925 sorry about that. But tbf I'm hardly the only youtuber that does that for games they love
@Soooooooooooonicable
7 ай бұрын
Oh wow, I had totally forgot about that whole part with Rinoa telling squall how she wishes she could stop time. This theory is just too solid.
@SolidShepard
7 ай бұрын
Right?
@mtownboi4ya
3 жыл бұрын
I still believe this theory and it gives the story so much depth. My fave FF change over the years but 8 will always be my first i completed and ranks high for me
@Gamingnstuff131
Жыл бұрын
I hate to break it to you but the developers stated this theory and the others aren’t true. 8 simply just has a bad story.
@szalaytamas3184
Жыл бұрын
@@Gamingnstuff131 devs can't state it. Only the story creator
@newtype5005
Жыл бұрын
@@Gamingnstuff131 Devs and writers words are not gospel tho. Ridley Scott once "confirmed" that Deckard was a replicant despite co-writer and Deckard himself, Harrison Ford saying he is not. Years later, Blade Runner 2 debunked the theory. Same can be said for FF8
@Llucius1
Жыл бұрын
@@newtype5005 What if Rinoa is future Ultimecia , and Ultimecia planned the plot to bring her past and squall together just to get the chance to kill him when the time is ready. By changing her past , she created a time loop that wipe off the future , but because she is so powerful she could exist beyond time. At the moment of Ultimecia death , her memories of her whole life flash in front of her , then she sees herself actually intertwine with Squall of different ages of growth , therefore she said to Squall to recall his childhood , so that she could change the memory and the past that they never met earlier. Perhaps , her soul went on to another alternated reality where she and squall live happily ever after without all these sad memories. To be continued...
@kjh4496
10 ай бұрын
It’s not true and they said they would never do it. It ads no depth. FF fans seem to have this problem where they invent head canon bullshit and tout it as fact.
@Starch1b2c3d4a
Жыл бұрын
Even if the creators may have not intended it, this is how the story turned out. Rinoa is Ultimecia in the story. Too many clues point to it
@LordMalice6d9
Жыл бұрын
It also makes for a better and more tragic story, especially since the story of FF8 is themed to love if Ultimecia does end up being Rinoa.
@whirled_peas
7 ай бұрын
@@LordMalice6d9 it's not only about love, but it's also about fate, and how love can beat fate (Rinoa literally pulls Squall out of limbo with the power of love) Rinoa becoming Ultimecia (or well, the sorceress that Ultimecia/Hyne possesses) is the completion of the plot point that Rinoa worries about becoming a hated sorceress. It also ties directly into the time loop aspect of the story.
@AsteriaRiselta
16 күн бұрын
Except it's not true. All the would-be clues have been thoroughly debunked. Ultimecia is not Rinoa. Ultimecia is a title that an unknown sorceress took up much further in the future after people vilified her and wouldn't let her become anything else. Has nothing to do with Rinoa outside of them both being sorceresses. Griever has already been debunked, same with the ending scene, and that's not even counting that the creators already said this theory isn't true. FFVIII was going for an entirely different angle, but unfortunately, a lot of things pointing to this got lost in translation and so in the English version it's not really clear why she's doing it. Once you put all that together, it thoroughly debunks this theory and all the would-be clues that would otherwise seem to prove it.
@jonathandanielquinto7308
13 күн бұрын
Rinoa is Ultimecia and Squall is Griever. They will stay together until the end of time as the sorceress and the knight because they promised each other.
@AsteriaRiselta
13 күн бұрын
@@jonathandanielquinto7308 That's very poetic and definitely good fan fiction material for sure, but canonically that's not true. It was never the intention that Square was going with and the truth of Ultimecia was literally lost in translation when the game came to NA.
@PirateKing1256
3 жыл бұрын
Ultimecia is the Rinoa that didn't get saved. Corruption timeline.
@Mithranprincess
2 жыл бұрын
I think so too
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
it definitely makes things more interesting.
@PirateKing1256
2 жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard totally. She is like a witch so she cannot die. She need to save herself with powers but it fuck her up. Losing her memories and become Ultimecia. It is also mentioned that GF junction will cause memory lost. Over time she couldn't remember anymore but become obsessed with seed and squall but couldn't pin point why.
@12trijavirgo18
2 жыл бұрын
The Rinoa that didn't get saved? Explain man
@hangguy209
2 жыл бұрын
If they ever remake this game, they should implement the R = U theory for sure. Tragic, dark, mind-blowing. Possibly one of if not, the best story in game history. Everything connects. Everything makes sense. It gives Ultimecia an entirely new perspective rather just being a cheap villain that is there for no actual reason. I'm with you on this. Since this theory came out, i can never think of FFVIII the same as i did as a kid. As a kid, i saw a happy ending! As an adult, i see that the happy ending was just the beginning of the tragedy that will become of the future. And the cycle will repeat all over again once Squall ends Ultimecia's life in the future. They both will end up in a time portal to the past to restart the timeline by meeting Edea. Not only is it now about Rinoa being Ultimecia, it's about her endless suffering, her endless cycle. Dying Ultimecia passes powers to Edea > Squall tells Edea about Seed and garden's purpose > events of FFVIII > Rinoa becomes Ultimecia in the future after all her close friends leaves the world > Rinoa now Ultimecia loses nearly all memories due to equipping the only thing left of Squall now Griever > Squall travels to future to kill Ultimecia > Ultimecia and Squall goes back into time to meet Edea > Dying Ultimecia passes powers to Edea. REPEAT. I don't feel like Ultimecia is the Rinoa that couldn't be saved. I feel like Rinoa will inevitably become Ultimecia no matter the timeline. Which is why my theory is, Squall teared up after seeing an image of Rinoa's space suit cracking. He knew the truth now. After a few glimpse of Ultimecia in his vision, he realized he should've let her die in space. That's why he teared up. But he was too in love with Rinoa that now there's no turning back. He will swear to protect Rinoa against the world and ultimately becomes Griever. He accepts the truth. Thus, continues the same timeline. The only timeline that will save the world from Ultimecia, is to let Rinoa die in space.
@doychinkutsarov9866
Жыл бұрын
For me the moment I thought about that was, when Squall saved Rinoa on the Ragnarog . Rinoa then mentioned she was afraid ppl will fear and hate her, so she wanted to freeze time at this moment to be with Squall together. It sounded exactly what Ultimecia wanted in the future. The story gives too many visual and logical hints. Probably during production they dropped this idea because it would crush the mindset of some kids. FF8 story was complicated as it is now.
@note20ultra37
2 жыл бұрын
It's not a theory its what the game implies and the only theory that makes sense The ending where Rinoa is flashing into Ultimecia and she uses Griever as her ultimate GF and the name changed based on what you name the ring before you give it to her.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
i just have to make sure to say that or else you will have try hards coming here saying "well achtuallly". lol
@hangguy209
2 жыл бұрын
Yea only Rinoa knows what Griever even is. She was the only one to ask Squall to which he replied, "The ultimate GF". The theory make so much sense. If Square ever try to remake FFVIII they need to definitely use the R = U theory. Makes the story so much better. Possibly the one of the best stories in gaming history.
@SAR-re1fx
3 жыл бұрын
Also... Ultimecia´s wings are similar to the fur that Squall wears, it has the same dress as Rinoa. Open at the front and at the end. Ultimecia has wings, same as Rinoa has, other sorceress have wing type things attatched to their backs, but not angel wings like Rinoa and Ultimecia, they are the only ones with the same body type, face, clothing, etc...
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
definitely an interesting theory.
@whirled_peas
Жыл бұрын
Square making Ultimecia do Rinoa’s exact ☝️ pose in Mobius Final Fantasy is either them messing with the theorists or endorsing it. Square generally takes canon seriously so it doesn’t seem likely that they’re messing.
@dustinmosley5965
2 жыл бұрын
Ultimecia wanted to compress time because she found out that a SeeD named Squall would kill her. She thought it was the only way to get outside the timeline and restart it without Squall existing in it. She was paranoid of her inevitable death.
@hangguy209
2 жыл бұрын
She didn't really die tho. Maybe physically but like Skynet from Terminator, she went back thru time to pass her powers unto Edea. Squall was able to also go back thru time to warn Edea of the future which gave Edea the idea of SeeD and garden. This resets the timeline. An endless time loop. She will always and forever repeat the cycle. I love these time paradox mind blowing plots.
@doychinkutsarov9866
Жыл бұрын
This doesn't make sense because Squall did not live in Ultimecia time. What makes more sense is that SeeDs killed Squall when he was defending her (Rinoa) ,which drove her mad. Sorceress powers are passed from one Sorcerers to another. At this time there were 3 Sorceresses Edea, Adel and Rinoa and both of them passed their powers to Rinoa. Ultimecia passed her powers to Edea, which basically generated this time loop. This is the reason why she wanted time compression. In teh end of the game when Rinoa managed to find Squall in her reality, then the loop was broken. Ultimecia from the future simply did not exist anymore.
@btothekfromg5973
Жыл бұрын
@@doychinkutsarov9866 I really like your interpretation that the time got resolved by Rinoa finding Squall in the void... However... I feel like if the loop was ment to be broken, they could have shown this clearly by not hinting that Squall startet the cicle again. I allways felt like Ultimicias goal never had to do anything with Squall. Because of having Griever junctioned she forgot all about him only having a feeling of having lost something important just like we see the others had. Squall feeling betrayed by his sister leaving, Quistis confusing her feelings for Squall for love, Xell and Cifer hating each other while completely forgotten the reason. I allways felt that Ultimicias goal was clear... Seed's extinction before it was ever created... but she couldn't go back far enough to reach to Adell's reingn and so had to saddle for Edea and started her plans from there. Or in orher words... I am not even really sure the timeloop really was broken in the end... losing Squall and falling into despair might as well be an event in the near future. The more I look into lore of the game and it's myth of Hyne, the more I have the feeling that there is a whole sequel of a story to really break the cicle... a sequel we sadly never got or will get.
@micklucas1451
9 ай бұрын
the maybe maybe will remake the game like they do now with final fantasy 7@@btothekfromg5973
@RP-mp4ow
3 жыл бұрын
“It is my favorite Final Fantasy game” Go ahead and take my like
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
I see, you're a man of cultural as well...
@Grimerpr2016
3 жыл бұрын
Same
@GCharlesE
5 ай бұрын
Hahaha my thoughts as well lol
@Manoftomorrow6491
2 жыл бұрын
Man… This theory makes Ultimecia arguably one of the saddest, most tragic villains I have ever seen. Goodness gracious, this theory just makes the game darker and sadder. I knew something was up when Ultimecia gave that speech when she was about to die in the final battle. It’s bad enough that her people were being killed in the street for practically no reason at all but to put this theory on top of everything else…
@hangguy209
2 жыл бұрын
If they ever remake this game, they should implement the R = U theory for sure. Tragic, dark, mind-blowing. Possibly one of if not, the best story in game history. Everything connects. Everything makes sense. It gives Ultimecia an entirely new perspective rather just being a cheap villain that is there for no actual reason. I'm with you on this. Since this theory came out, i can never think of FFVIII the same as i did as a kid. As a kid, i saw a happy ending! As an adult, i see that the happy ending was just the beginning of the tragedy that will become of the future. And the cycle will repeat all over again once Squall ends Ultimecia's life in the future. They both will end up in a time portal to the past to restart the timeline by meeting Edea. Not only is it now about Rinoa being Ultimecia, it's about her endless suffering, her endless cycle. Dying Ultimecia passes powers to Edea > Squall tells Edea about Seed and garden's purpose > events of FFVIII > Rinoa becomes Ultimecia in the future after all her close friends leaves the world > Rinoa now Ultimecia loses nearly all memories due to equipping the only thing left of Squall now Griever > Squall travels to future to kill Ultimecia > Ultimecia and Squall goes back into time to meet Edea > Dying Ultimecia passes powers to Edea. REPEAT. Now that is fricken mind-blowing.
@hangguy209
2 жыл бұрын
Makes you realize why Squall was in tears after seeing visions. Right before the image of Rinoa's space suit cracking in space, you see glimpses of Ultimecia. My theory is, Squall realized the truth. Rinoa is Ultimecia. That's why he teared up realizing he should've let Rinoa die in space because now that he has gone this far there is no turning back. He knows she will become Ultimecia because of his action of saving her from space. He now will have to accept that he will protect her from the world and become Griever himself. This gives all those final visions he saw so much more meaning. It was at this moment Squall knew, he f**ked up. He will forever continue Rinoa's tragic endless cycle.
@LordMalice6d9
Жыл бұрын
Imo the story of FF8 makes more thematic and plot relevent sense if Ultimecia is Rinoa. But Kitase says its not accurate. But that's his opinion.
@Pikachu-qr4yb
Жыл бұрын
@@LordMalice6d9pe he recently said he actually does not want to clearly outrule that this theory could be true kzitem.info/news/bejne/zG6X2YeHqKSEoZw
@whirled_peas
7 ай бұрын
It perfectly ties into the fate theme - it's almost a story of Good timeline Rinoa vs Bad timeline Rinoa (Ulti). Good Rinoa uses the power of love to save Squall - Bad Rinoa is a victim of fate and becomes twisted.
@Azrialette
7 ай бұрын
It was my first Final Fantasy game and it was a game that made me feel different from any other games I have ever played, the music, story, and characters, they all hit so hard ❤
@SolidShepard
7 ай бұрын
For me I'd say the mass effect trilogy did all that better, but yeah, all that time between, it was definitely number 1 for me in those aspects.
@yelnats24
Жыл бұрын
In Dissidia Opera Omnia, Ultimecia reveal her background as lonely child at the edge of the future, born as an evil sorceress.
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
thats like using budakai 3 for dragon ball lore. lol
@paulogeracao683
2 жыл бұрын
I still feel emotional on ff8... I dont get it when ppl say the plot os bad... Is one of the most heartbraking, mindbraking, mindtwisting plots you can get.... Thats if you try to think and understand what is happening! I have my own theories...but that goes for another comment!
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
completely agree
@60wwediva
2 жыл бұрын
Squall had an insufferable personality. I never liked his character at all. Selphie and the others really filled in the gaps for his stubbornness and moodiness.
@paulogeracao683
2 жыл бұрын
@@60wwediva true! and thats what makes it good =) they evolve as characters, squall is not the same throughout the game! he still is a moron at the end... but not as bad as he was at the begining =P
@JohnReavesLive
2 жыл бұрын
🙌🙌 Pizza Hut demo disk!!!! Bring back the feels!!
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
big 90's thing. lol
@lartensgrill6106
Жыл бұрын
Another hint are the quotesnin the intro cutscene- the whole "ill be waiting" thing
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
True
@SephirothOwa13
9 ай бұрын
When I found out about this theory years ago I believe it. It made so much sense and connected the villain to the heroes.
@adrov849
10 күн бұрын
There’s a key point when they are on the Ragnarock where she says to Squall “I want to stay here in this moment forever” it was a precursor to time compression.
@instars2027
3 жыл бұрын
This deserves more views. Very good video. Do a video on Squall is dead theory too.
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks man. Here's hoping it gets more. Lol and I'll put it on the list. I'll get to it eventually.
@annahbelle2175
2 жыл бұрын
I love your story, the way you tell it, the past of the characters you explain, you deserve more more views. Excuse my bad english and kisses from France ❤
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
thanks! i appreciate it. hopfully the channel will get there one day.
@eromythosart
Жыл бұрын
this is my favorite Final Fantasy too. i think youre onto something here
@FBI-ju5no
Жыл бұрын
I kinda wonder why people can't figure out what happened to squall. After he reenters the compressed time, he can't get out on his own. Assuming this theory of ultimecia is true, all that would need to happen is squall never getting out of the compressed time, which in the game timeline Rinoa was able to save him, wheras in the original timeline ultimecia is from, she couldn't save him.
@jonnymario771
2 жыл бұрын
Nomura pushed his headcanon onto us xD That douche!
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
ikr
@timothyconklin5652
2 жыл бұрын
I literally just finished my play through of this game (totally awesome game by the way) but I totally believe this theory its really the only one that makes sense.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
sorry i didn't get to your comment sooner, but yeah, it's a crazy one but a good one. lol
@kjh4496
2 жыл бұрын
It was already officially stated that it’s not true. The only similarity between Rinoa and Ultimecia in the story is that they contrast each other as sorceresses.
@hangguy209
2 жыл бұрын
@@kjh4496 that's the thing tho. Without the R = U theory, Ultimecia is a cheap villain. The story becomes lame. Like hey guys, here's a villain with no actual motive. She just wanna compress time. We don't know her and why she's even doing it. She just is 😆😆😆😆😆
@kjh4496
2 жыл бұрын
@@hangguy209 And? That’s how she is. She is trying to prevent her own defeat and ends up being the cause of it. The theory is debunked fan fiction. Sorceresses don’t live unnatural life spans so it’s not possible for her to exist as Ultimecia in the future.
@hangguy209
2 жыл бұрын
@@kjh4496 i know it's fan fiction but it would make a hell of a better plot than just throw her into the plot in the middle of the story. Without the theory she becomes a cheap villain. Ok here's the bad guy. Sorry we duped yall into thinking it's Edea but this is actually the villain 😆😆😆😆 with the theory it gives her a much darker, deeper, and tragic perspective. Making her an even better villain because of the backstory.
@deadhouse3889
3 жыл бұрын
Might play this again. You got me nostalgic.
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
I'll take that as a compliment. Lol
@deadhouse3889
3 жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard You should! You got me curious to see this theory first hand.
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
@@deadhouse3889 thanks man. Honestly yesterday I was feeling very deflated and unmotivated, and its comments like this that keep me going! I genuinely appreciate it!
@deadhouse3889
3 жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard I know that feeling all to well. I am a visual artist and it can be hard some days or even weeks to get motivated. I usually just find something to indulge in until something sparks my creativity. Can't force it.
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
@@deadhouse3889 its more because I ordered a camera last week. Used it for the first time Saturday and spent the entire day editing the one video. I uploaded it Saturday night, and when I woke up my analytics showed barely anyone watched it, and those that did watch it,, the average watch time was like 44 seconds. The video was around 16 minutes long. That just really stung. Especially when I'm working 10 hour days on top of this. I at least wish if people don't like it, they would leave a comment as to why so I can fix it.
@WarrenValion
8 ай бұрын
This theory geniuely feels like the last puzzle piece sliding into place and makes Ultimecia an actual character.
@ArkiCaloyzki
Жыл бұрын
Nice video brother! This was the first FF8 that I played, and I must say it's also my favorite same as yours. This introduced me to RPG gaming. I am playing the remastered version. I have vids on my Channel with the FF8 walkthrough.
@drippinwet774
2 жыл бұрын
*pizza hut promotion demo* You 90's kid. Bring that sh** in, baby. I love you! We have an insanely similar method of sharing our perspective with the world! Love it!
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
that's awsome. lol thanks!
@richardricafort6631
3 жыл бұрын
you cant tell me this is not true... come on! all the evidence was in the game just slapping us in the face!! this is like harry potter, just because jk rowling said dumbledore is gay doesnt mean its true!
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
lol well that is certainly one way of putting it!
@Peter_1986
5 ай бұрын
This is definitely a very fascinating theory - there is something truly disturbing about the idea that Rinoa would end up as a ruthless goddess, and it also adds some depth to Ultimecia. A lot of people dismiss this theory merely because SquareSoft have denied it, but most of them would find it pretty cool if it actually were canon.
@SolidShepard
5 ай бұрын
True
@lspoulin
2 жыл бұрын
It would make the story better so for me it's canon.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
Many seem to agree.
@nicholasrova3698
Ай бұрын
There's definitely some compelling clues about this theory, but ultimately it's not true. I get the sense this may be where they were going with it during production, but scraped it early on because it's too sad... even if good from a narrative perspective. And by then they'd already sprinkled the game with some minor clues and stuff.
@MarcDLange
3 жыл бұрын
It has flaws but the music is some of Nobou's best compositions. Reminded me more of Emerson lake and palmer.
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
What game doesn't have flaws though? It's one of my favorites personally.
@LordMalice6d9
Жыл бұрын
I always felt FFVIII and FFIX were Nobuo Uematsu's best ff scores.
@teriosshadow17
Жыл бұрын
While i don't think "Rinoa = Ultimecia" theory is true, i actually like the idea behind it. It further fleshes out Ultimecia as an antagonist and adds lot of tragedy to her character than it did her in the game.
@whirled_peas
Жыл бұрын
It really does make the game so much more compelling.
@DGP406
2 жыл бұрын
Rinoa being Seifer's sloppy seconds always bugged me, even when I was a kid.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
tbh when i first played it, that flew right over my head. lol i just thought she was saying seifer helped her find cid or something.
@yelnats24
Жыл бұрын
If you read the conversation at Galbadia Garden waiting room, you would have learned that Rinoa said she did not know whether Seifer had romantic interest on her or not. Rinoa fell in love with Seifer, but Seifer never revealed to her about his feelings toward her.
@ultrawan88v2
2 жыл бұрын
No...this is Canon... 😢😢😢😢
@VincentSaturn
10 ай бұрын
I first heard this theory 16 years after the game came out. I was like 😮 I felt like the detective at the end of Usual Suspects when he drops the mug. It all made sense and I believe it
@SolidShepard
10 ай бұрын
Yeah, it's pretty crazy
@robertorodriguez4304
2 жыл бұрын
FF8 is my 1st Final Fantasy. I remember trying to skip on this as my favourite games are Spyro and Croc but my friend showed me the game one day. I was intimidated on what's happening on the screen with all the explosions and nuke like attacks, "how the hell do you play this?" I said. "Call your GF and shit happens" he said. I bought one the next weekend.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
I'm definitely glad it was my first ff game
@Sattva468
2 жыл бұрын
Great video!! This was the first FF game I played, too, as a Blockbuster rental. Thanks for the nostalgic storytelling.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
No prob! Glad you enjoyed it
@neoarchangemon3460
3 жыл бұрын
FF8 remake could cover this... R=U makes complete sense. But it also means Squall is dead.
@SAR-re1fx
3 жыл бұрын
Means Squall is dead in the future. Ultimecia could be either Rinoa from the future or from one of the thousands alternate timelines that the time travel could cause thanks to the Junction Machine and the magic.
@12trijavirgo18
2 жыл бұрын
@@SAR-re1fx Ultimecia is the Rinoa that didn't get saved. Corrupt timeline
@RACH90810
2 жыл бұрын
@@SAR-re1fx disk 1 squall was dead, disk 2 squall was from another timeline. Dead squall was in prison in time compression timeline.
@LordMalice6d9
Жыл бұрын
I always thought the alternate timelines plot that FF7 remake went with at the end of that game, wouldnhave fit in better thematically in a FF8 remake. Ultimecia knows about the time loop where she losses, and attempts to break the cycle.
@terryshadow90
9 ай бұрын
she is ultimecia u can know it easy is when u give a chance to name the Necklace Original name is call Griever and is the Ultimecia Ultimate GF name and if u change the name she will summon GF with the name u choose = that GF is actually Squall
@SolidShepard
9 ай бұрын
I agree, but the debunked argument is that she pulled griever from squalls mind
@yelnats24
Жыл бұрын
2:44 This picture is false and misleading. Rinoa do not has widow peak hairline, only Ultimecia has that widow peak hairline. This is also one of the flaw in R=U theory as it claim they have identical facial feature. I don't know where did you get the picture but it seems the picture creator want to hide the flaw by adding widow peak to Rinoa.
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
people tend to get widows peaks when they get older due to receding hairline.
@yelnats24
Жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard you forgot one thing, if you look at that picture, that would be the opposite of receding.
@iChoseScylla
4 ай бұрын
@@yelnats24 Ultimecia is a sorceress. And FF is a franchise of mortals transforming into deity-like figures. I do not disagree with you that they do not share facial qualities, but I would say Rinoa undergoing a complete transformation of appearance is not out of the realm of possibility.
@iChoseScylla
4 ай бұрын
This is the only head-canon that I will lie on a hill for. FF endings, especially in the PS1 era, leave a lot to the imagination and there is no expanded universe for FF8 to make suggestions in favor or against this theory which itself is not baseless. Even if FF8 got a Remake treatment, we know it would take creative liberties which leave our interpretation of the original game to remain what it is. Rinoa = Ultimecia is the ultimate food for thought that just pushes my enjoyment of FF8 and makes me think about it years after I’ve played it.
@SolidShepard
4 ай бұрын
Exactly. Tbh, idk why square pushes so hard against it. If I was them, and it wasn't my intention, I'd still be like "yeah...thats totally what happened. Yall are too smart for us". Lol
@mrblank-zh1xy
Жыл бұрын
Ultimecia = Artemesia
@TheOmegaDragon
Жыл бұрын
What if Squall is the Griever. Squall considers the Griever to be the strongest GF and you even get to name it. Could be the reason Ultimecia (if she's Rinoa) was able to summon it to protect her.
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
Question is how did squall become greiver, leading to rinoa being able to junction him? And if he was, why would she become evil, considering squall would always be with her in her brain? I like where your head is at, but I can't think of a way to have it make sense.
@mrblank-zh1xy
Жыл бұрын
The answer lies in FFX
@L7Fx
Жыл бұрын
david lynch and final fantasy being referenced in the same thing??? vwow
@TheEndwalker
2 жыл бұрын
Listen, man. It's not that I hate FFVIII. I've finished it several times and it was a lot of fun (for the most part, at least). But unless the theory that Squall is dead and everything post disc 1 is just his final fantasy (no pun intended), the game has *really bad* narrative and plots. I know the director said the theory is not true, but I rather interpretate it's indeed true than to accept how dumb several parts of the game are. The battle/junction/draw system is pretty shitty, though. No fun in that, IMO.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
i disagree with the junctions system. i really liked it. but thats just a matter of opinion. and dont feel like you have to follow cannon when playing a game. do what makes you enjoy it most.
@TheEndwalker
2 жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard Right on!! Cheers, man!
@luciusirving5926
Жыл бұрын
I played FF8 without junctions one time and I agree.
@dZ0647
21 күн бұрын
Naw, I feel like if she knew squall was gonna kill her, why not choose his rival as her knight?
@astralwyrm3787
8 ай бұрын
kzitem.info/news/bejne/2KiNnYNvg3iQhH4si=YPmZb-50ZaCC9839 It may be that Rinoa is AND Isn't Ultimecia. I like the theory linked above because it has some stories within the game to back it up and it explains the motivation behind time compression. Specifically to undo the creation of man. In this theory all the sorceress' are the puppets fully or partially of the power passed down from sorceress to sorceress and each sorceress tries to wipe out humanity in their time. Ultimecia's attempt is the one that proved capable of succeeding before she was defeated. It also fits with the whole Ultimecia having two bodies in the final battle because it's two minds in one body. It also explains for what purpose the Lunatic Pandora was created for.
@jakstorm3180
2 жыл бұрын
I happen to have just finished ff8 today and I have to say I disagree.. I believe Selphie is Ultimecia Selfie is far more evil just because she isn't a sorceress during the game, Rinoa did not know she was a one till she was possessed. Selphie hooked up with Irvine and he kept womanizing Selphie already a walking red flag became a feminist obsessed with power and her only goal was to destroy man.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
its only a thoery. lol if thats your theory, i wont try to take it away from you.
@lestaari-eh6qv
Жыл бұрын
I have another theory... . What if it turns out that Ultimecia is the daughter of Rinoa and Squall? Just like Squall who is always disturbed by the existence of Laguna. In the end, everything is just a time loop that can stop if Rinoa and Squall are not together.
@Chris_P_Bacon62
Жыл бұрын
I don't know if this is true or not, but from what I've read, all Square said was that sorceresses do not have longer life spans than regular people. If it IS true, then it doesn't necessarily debunk the Rinoa=Ultimecia theory because iirc, we don't know how many years into the future Ultimecia is. It could only be a few decades for all we know. Either way, I believe that in Ultimecia's time period, all Seed members are mean and ruthless witch hunters. That would explain why Seifer believes that Squall and the others are evil monsters, because Ultimecia told him so. One possibility is that Squall and the others died defending Rinoa from those ruthless SeeD witch hunters...and that would push her over the edge for sure. And of course, her GF would eventually block out all of her memories of Squall and the others. With all of that being said, I know that most people won't agree with me on this and that's fine, but I've always thought that Ultimecia looked a lot more like Quistis than Rinoa tbh.
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
Everyone is entitled to their theories. But me myself, i just find the loop I discussed in the video, and it finally being broken, to just be cleaner narrative wise.
@Chris_P_Bacon62
Жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard I like that theory, too, because that means that even if the Rinoa=Ultimecia theory is true, there is still a happy ending.
@LaliaNoiseGlass1
10 ай бұрын
5:55 Nomura has since said that he was wrong to come out and way it's not true in a more recent interview. His more accurate answer is that HIS interpretation was that it wasn't true, but that he can't speak for the other writers.
@SolidShepard
10 ай бұрын
Wonder if he saw my video. Lol
@LaliaNoiseGlass1
10 ай бұрын
@@SolidShepard Sorry, it wasn't Nomura. It was Yoshinori Kitase. I tracked down my source for you: kzitem.info/news/bejne/zG6X2YeHqKSEoZw&ab_channel=reibitto
@runeramdas
2 жыл бұрын
At the time, I did think they alluded to this theory in the final battle. Had they really leaned into this idea, it would have elevated FF8's story above most games at the time. The theme of the story is about Love. What on earth is "time compression," and why would any future witch want this?.... unless something happened to her in the past, Love-related perhaps, that filled the rest of her life with regret, to the point where she wanted to use her powers to... do away with the very idea of the passage of time. If only we could have heard Ultimecia speak on her own behalf before the very end. Love is all well and good, if it's the real deal then it lasts a long time. But the dark side of that is that it can also hurt you for a very long time if things go badly. If Ultimecia were something more than a cackling villain at the end, if she were someone whose anger and motivations we grew to understand over the course of the game... and then we find out Rinoa becomes a sorceress, with wings, and where else have we seen wings, and all the pieces finally come together, and we realize it's her? It would have been genius. And, most importantly, Squall might figure out by listening to this angry, sad witch's regrets that... whether time is getting compressed or not, either way he doesn't have a lot of it -- he has to live in the now, and seize the day before things go bad and his girl ends up a future time-terrorist (deal-breaker or not, who's to say?). Just my thoughts. If I were in charge of an FF8 Remake, yeah, I'd make a few changes. (They changed FF7 Remake quite a bit, so, should be fair game.)
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
if you really pay attention, there are several hints at it though. the only argument i've ever seen is why would they hide such a big plot detail as that...but they did the same thing with squall being laguna and raine's son, and that is accepted as fact. rinoa tells him she never wanted that moment to end as i illustrated in the video. and of course you are right, the major themes are love and coming of age. but another major plot point it seems everyone just disregards is memory loss due to the GF's. i truly believe if it was true, she wouldn't even remember why she wanted to do all this in the first place. she would not remember who she really was, and she would not remember squall. all that would be left are the lingering subconscious feelings and regrets driving her. i mean they spent so much time talking about memory loss dangers of the gf's, then did nothing with that after the basketball court scene at trabia garden. to me it just makes sense. even if the devs admit its not true and square comes out and 100% refutes it, i dont really care. it makes too much sense to me.
@whirled_peas
Жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard I’m just now hearing this theory and on the same page. The idea of Ultimecia being a bitter twisted Rinoa demented by grief and amnesia is such a powerful story and perfectly ties into the theme of the story, that being accepting fate and impermanence.
@robinkron1685
11 ай бұрын
Haha, no, Rinoa contacts Balamb Garden to SAVE Squall NOT herself. If he dies at the parade she can cast Time Compression in the future which is Now in the Past. Don't think she would cast Time Compression to save herself when her Motivation was to Save Squall (She's the only Sorceress at her Time alive). Rinoa contacts Squall, Squall defeats Edea that is possessed by Ultimecia that is Rinoa in the Future because Squall Died in that Past. It is Squall that warns Edea of Everything in the end. ( The Ending of the game is the Beginning of Ultimecias terror). That's how Edea knew Ultimecia is from the Future. The Squall seen in the end of the game at the Orphanage where Ultimecia kneels down is where and How and Why Edea got her power in the First and Last place. But it still started with Rinoa losing Squall.
@cristinacho7881
2 жыл бұрын
I believe it. I don’t care what the guy says! 🤣 I want to believe!!!
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
dont stop beleivin
@cristinacho7881
2 жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard Hahaha now I have that song stuck in my head! Every time I play the game now, I’m gonna think of Journey! 🤣🤣🤣🤣
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
@@cristinacho7881 lol glad to be of service.
@chrisgee8441
2 жыл бұрын
FF8 was my first. I LOVED it. Would reenact the opening CG for my friends... I was the coolest. Played it again a few years ago. I was extremely disappointed. I personally adore this theory and have been a fan of it for yeaaaaars. I feel the biggest problem with this game is how hand wavy it can be; ultimecia being the biggest example. Theories like this make the game better.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
yeah. like i said, as long as no one is spouting it like its canon, i dont really see the problem with fandoms having their theories.
@Sinraiser
6 ай бұрын
Rinoa evens says to Squall after recieving the lionheart (Griever) "Who knows maybe I can become a Liuon too" which Ultimecia does in disc 4, Ultimecia has wings like Rinoa limit break in disc 4, after Squall's death she became powerful with all GF in the world that killed everyone and forgot. I guess in her heart she was able to control someone on her past just to be near him again.... she picked the wrong knight since it was her first but wrong first guy...Seifer but later on they connected face to face.
@SolidShepard
6 ай бұрын
True
@Sinraiser
6 ай бұрын
@@SolidShepard Nobody explains how everybody got back to that ending where it's like a "And they lived happily ever after". the background was all white and all kept running around. Dissidia opens a door to where Squall left to after meeting his younger self and then moment where he walks alone it could be after all the Dissidia storylines. realizing that their love and hate lasted in infinite timelines. The moment where Rinoa finds him THAT'S where she becomes Ultimecia. While we see all the gatherings that's just her dream while in reality Rinoa already became Ultimecia and started killing everyone. I mean everyone has their own theory but look at all the other games with timelines changing. MK9, MW7, MW2, etc
@SolidShepard
6 ай бұрын
@@Sinraiser idk. I personally don't think this version of Rinoa becomes ultimecia. Like I said, I think this iteration of her and squall are the ones to break the cycle.
@SolidShepard
6 ай бұрын
@silentscope1483 I don't really tbh.
@SolidShepard
6 ай бұрын
@silentscope1483 lol I might consider it. Haven't been able to upload in quite awhile because l8fe kicked me in the nuts. But I'm about to start again finally here in a day or 2. I might decide to if I can find enough to make a video out of.
@larongpating4312
2 жыл бұрын
yeah the only final boss that says to you while defeating her said to her enemies remember your youth enjoy your youth etc thats what i remembered wtf is that?
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
idk man. the game is weird sometimes. lol thats why i love it.
@ryann8348
10 ай бұрын
Square should have taken this theory and ran with it hard. "Oh yeah... yeah... that's *totally* what we were going for", because it adds so much to a not-great story/final villain
@SolidShepard
10 ай бұрын
I mean, I feel like that's what fnaf did. It was probably just going to be a 1 off game, but then dude saw matpat's videos on it and was like "I can do something with this".
@chrisphipps432
2 жыл бұрын
I do think this theory is correct it's to much coincidence and the director has even hinted this is true
@chrisphipps432
2 жыл бұрын
And I played pizza hut demo first too and my mum got it for me at Christmas too my fav game
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
@@chrisphipps432 it definitely adds to the story. And yeah. This game is so important to me. Viii is the game that made me fall in love with gaming. Also, the friend of my stepmom that I mentioned that rented it for me...there is a reason I mentioned her. A few years later, she actually passed away in her bedroom on her birth day. She apparently had only been eating Popsicles for weeks and her body gave out. We were coming over to celebrate her bday, and when we got there, her husband went to go get her and found her there...so playing this game, and talking about it in a video is kind of my way to keep her memory alive as well. Its a really important game to me on several levels.
@jtninja6
11 күн бұрын
This is my favorite Final Fantasy of all time om the PS1.
@IamtheMan1111
2 ай бұрын
Rinoa become sorceress because she received power from ultimecia, right? Then when you are saying ultimecia is first rinoa, where is the first rinoa received the power from?
@SolidShepard
2 ай бұрын
I mean, in ocarina of time, link taught the song of storms to the guy who taught it to him...it's called a bootstrap paradox.
@zleo7054
22 күн бұрын
Technically she received her powers from Edea, then Adel. Ultimecia only possessed the sorceresses she wasnt there in person. Edea receives the dying Ultimecia's power despite her already being a sorceress
@user-nx6zp5qk9u
8 ай бұрын
100% and anyone out in the wild who recognizes my Griever tatt instantly gets 80 cool points. FF8 is peak FF
@hildaibuyan4161
2 жыл бұрын
Nope, Rinoa has 4 syllables, Ultimecia has 5. *my bad Rinoa has 3 syllables
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
well darn. case closed ig.
@hildaibuyan4161
2 жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard Glad I could help. ☺️ Oh, don't forget that since Ultimecia likes to use Ks instead of Cs, her real name's probably Mortal Kombat.
@DukeKorcassen
Жыл бұрын
It was Kitase who said the theory is not true.
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
not according to the book i read. kitase did dismiss it, but he never flat out said "no its not true"
@DukeKorcassen
Жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard He said it wasn't part of the plan, very recently so, too. You claim he's the highest authority in your video. By your own logic that would outright disown the theory.
@ZxChrono
Жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard Kitase debunked it in the interview. Also Kitase/Nomura are just like Akira Toriyama that they won’t ever outright tell you “no that theory is wrong” as they rather “leave it up to the fans” so they can enjoy their own theories. But it’s been made *very clear* that the R= U theory is not what their aim was for the game. Nobody is saying not to enjoy this theory, but *you’re being a try-hard* by trying to dismiss all the evidence against it.
@marianelatovar9500
3 жыл бұрын
Keep the good work, very good video
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks man!
@andrewcruz1931
Жыл бұрын
I’ve always hated Rinoa regardless. I first played FF8 on the Pizza Hut demo disc also lol
@RichardGrat
Жыл бұрын
My theory about Rinoa " father " ?? Not the major Caraway of course Not the same name . If you watch carefully each scenes , especially with the first change of team, that means when Laguna, Ward and Kiros appear for the first time they say : 17 years ago ......... And this is the age of Rinoa . Plus, RPG are all based around subtilities, that the developers ask to us to notice for progress . Here, the details we must pay attention, are : 17 years ago... Second : The devellopers ( Sakagushi ) have designed Laguna and Rinoa, physically almost the same
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
It's possible...but she uses her mother's last name due to her strained relationship with her father. Also, caraway and Julia hooked up after laguna never returned from his mission after that hotel room scene. That's when she wrote eyes on me. Laguna and her never actually slept together so it's impossible for him to be the father unfortunately.
@RichardGrat
Жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard Yes, i have to play again and seek for this Thx mate for the help here
@DiddyCanFly
Жыл бұрын
No I’m not. Siefer was just a throwaway knight and let’s be real, if you could chose between Squall, Zell or Irvine from a power fantasy point of view, there’s only one right answer. Time compression is a bitch to pull off so it’s very trial and error… …wait, why do I know this?
@midnightpanda10
11 ай бұрын
underrated game for me. i love the GFs sooo much
@SolidShepard
11 ай бұрын
True
@Grimerpr2016
3 жыл бұрын
They need a sequel
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
I'd take a remake
@Grimerpr2016
3 жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard final fantasy 8 is my hands down favorite final fantasy out of all the final fantasies..
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
@@Grimerpr2016 mine as well.
@orwellianwiress
3 жыл бұрын
Ultimecia is one of my favorite characters, so I think it would be really weird for her to be Rinoa, who I'm not a huge fan of. Although I do ship Squall x Ultimecia...
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
Well it is just a theory. Many from square have said its not true.
@zeaferjones1404
3 жыл бұрын
I agree with you about Rinoa but I think that could also be a hint. Rinoa is very unlikeable so that could hint at her becoming a villain.
@Gamingnstuff131
Жыл бұрын
This theory, much like the other fan theories that attempted to make this disastrous story better, have already been stated as false by the developers. Although it could’ve made the uninspired mess of a story in this game more interesting and deep it simply holds no water when the developers already admitted they put no thought or passion into the story.
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
when exactly did they admit they put no passion into the story? you just sound like the other 7 fanboys who love to hate on 8. it's fine if you dont like the theory, or even the game, but come on dude...most basically everything you said is just false. kitase never even outright debunked it. the only one who did was Nomura, who was the character designer.
@Yugiohsachse
2 жыл бұрын
Best game
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
its up there for me.
@dertobbe1176
3 жыл бұрын
This game was awesome.... It still is!
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
Agreed
@tribaldefender473
3 жыл бұрын
One of my all times favourites.
@luciusirving5926
Жыл бұрын
We should keep in mind that astrophysics in the 90s was incomplete. The Final Fantasy team had limited knowledge of general relativity then and they have limited knowledge of it now.
@DakinRinone
Жыл бұрын
The creator came out and said it's not true
@robthames5065
Ай бұрын
Eyes on Me is a wretched song.
@SolidShepard
Ай бұрын
@@robthames5065 you are entitled to your wrong opinion.
@_Brennus
8 ай бұрын
You know the plot of FF8 sucks when people have to contrive theories like this to actually make it interesting.
@JuicySmooyayy
2 жыл бұрын
Ff8 demo! The memories haha
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
I know right
@Issac_The_Last_N7
Жыл бұрын
Final Fantasy 8 is awesome
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
It definitely is
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
@yumenoshima I got a notification from your comment but do not see it.
@pohtangeynamo3351
3 жыл бұрын
Ultimecia has all the reasons to turn batshit crazy and kill everyone because in her time (the future), sorceresses are already being persecuted for generations because of what happened in the game (the present) which she ultimately started when she compressed time and went to the past before biting the dust. She may or may not have realized it already that she's predestined to become the ultimate villain so she tries to end the infinite time loop by compressing time in a place where past, present, and future doesn't exist, all existence except her is denied. It's pretty much the only way for her to survive. It may sound convoluted for people with lower than average braincell count but for most people, it's a simple time paradox story.
@SolidShepard
2 жыл бұрын
yeah, but that isn't nearly as interesting.
@KillChaos7
2 жыл бұрын
yeah but this is really out of place in the way how they telling story before Ultimecia arrives, everything is connected in ff8, everybody, past, present, and future... and then you suddenly drops in a villain who does not has any connection at all to everything has comes before???
@megadiabrous
3 ай бұрын
Idc if the creators deny it, it makes for a more compelling story that Ultimecia is actually Rinoa. I hope they make this true if ever they remake 8
@xmgentertainment
Жыл бұрын
Let's have a discussion if ultimecia is renoa then why did she try to kill renoa if they are the same person
@SolidShepard
Жыл бұрын
she doesn't remember it's herself. she doesn't remember anything. its a pretty big plot point about GF's and memory loss in the game.
@xmgentertainment
Жыл бұрын
@@SolidShepard yet renoa has never used the GF until she joins squall's party on top of that squall never gave rinoa the griever ring zell did after borrowing it from squall and then Squall allowed her to keep it and ultimecia drew graver from squall's mind
@theyracemesohardchair
7 ай бұрын
And you can’t pronounce Rinoa!
@SolidShepard
7 ай бұрын
I used to call her Riona when I was a kid. Progress.
@brennanlable
3 жыл бұрын
this was debunked a while ago by the game's directer as well as the squall is dead "theory".
@SolidShepard
3 жыл бұрын
I'm aware. I addressed this.
@layom444
2 жыл бұрын
Reddit
@theyracemesohardchair
7 ай бұрын
Your favourite game yet you can’t even pronounce Ultimecia correctly!!
@SolidShepard
7 ай бұрын
Such is the way with those early text based dialog games. Lol
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