honestly just give her omnivamp on her w as a passive, it will legit fix her entire identity as a champ
@aghost3628
2 күн бұрын
Yeah if they seperated her healing from her passive it'd probably be a lot easier to balance her
@mctothec1885
11 сағат бұрын
Yeah unfortunately omnivamp is so limited at the moment that the community would absolutely hate on gwen so much. And then want omnivamp on their champion.
@xxxx3329
2 күн бұрын
Interesting parallel briar was in a similar situation after release, people started to build all dmg and it was the best build on her. Riot wanted briar to be a bruiser so they nerfed dmg... which made people have to build dmg because brusier became weaker. Just like your suggested changes, it was not until they added an hp scaling to the healing of briar's passive and changed the dmg type of 2 of her abilities that brusier briar was finally better that full dmg. If you look at the patch notes in order its funny to watch the thought proccess of the devs. Hope that the changes get looked at, I would perfer to still see brusier gwen in the toplane from time to time.
@FrozenSpaceYT
Күн бұрын
100% worst thing is they also nerfed ad bruiser items the hardest imo, so briar really sucks rn compared to b4 (I play her top) while ap bruiser items are far and few in between besides rift maker and cosmic
@minhocho5487
2 күн бұрын
Bro they literally did this shit on sylas not even 5 patches ago why did they not do this...
@wink941
2 күн бұрын
A bruiser not having a single hp scaling on her kit building full AP . Riot *_*
@kin4244
2 күн бұрын
As someone who mains Rek'Sai and Gwen toplane, If I had a nickel for every time my main got nuked out of the game, I'd have two nickels. Which isn't a lot but it's weird that Riot STILL doesn't know how to listen to the people who actually main their champions. Godspeed Tank Meta. The only reason Gwen is high WR and highly picked, is because Riot decided to make the meta full of tanks (champions that 3 hit you with 5k health and 300 armor), and god bless the game for even allowing Gwen to exist.
@munchiemunchie5226
2 күн бұрын
Please talk about an over exaggeration, Gwen isn't the only tank killer and surely there's something wrong with a character that ignores all of your items, wins HARD early, mid and late game.
@wianwelgemoed5408
2 күн бұрын
@@munchiemunchie5226 If you loose to a gwen early game then you just played bad, she looses to almost all top laners early (ofc if she gets a gank she will be ahead, as will all other champs) then she starts picking up speed after first item. The problem is not everyone knows how to play vs her, which leads to her getting ahead early which shouldn't really happen
@chromas6065
2 күн бұрын
@@wianwelgemoed5408 thats clearly bias she completely eliminates tanks even early game as she does far more ddamage than the amount of hp than they have
@flowbie-1336
2 күн бұрын
@@chromas6065right, butmost top laners avoid playing tanks, so "most" is still true
@munchiemunchie5226
Күн бұрын
@@flowbie-1336 so the counter pick character struggles early when you don't get to counter pick..... Who coulda guessed.
@KingJoeyy
Күн бұрын
you said it perfectly my friend as a gwen otp i 100% agree with you.
@nanashialfarr
14 сағат бұрын
Riot will never hear someone who masterd a champion, they have 200 years of collective development experience, see what they did with the teemo mains about his rework, they just got ignored.
@nemilu
Күн бұрын
I wish they would just pull the Briar and make it so that lethality is still viable (Full AP in this case), but add max/bonus HP scaling so that bruiser items make sense to build.
@HolyShinobi16
2 күн бұрын
Damn, they are nerfing both my scissor waifus this incoming patch harshly, Camille and Gwen.
@Mario-eh9dv
2 күн бұрын
The bruiser build is the most common build with riftmaker right? Or is bruiser built something different?
@KilllaaG
2 күн бұрын
That is bruiser built but no gwen players consistently build it cause it's bad 9/10 games compared to full ap
@billyquezada8166
2 күн бұрын
On WR her passive scaling is 1%+0.05%/100Ap
@niconicoshi
2 күн бұрын
from the start i knew it, Gwen is better at midlane with average attack speed (relying only on runes and E), abusing her passive proc rate from Q and R, building max pen and full ap.
@pd8529
2 күн бұрын
if you've checked out ninkeys video on the gwen, it's about a 4%-8% nerf, only losing about 300-500 damage nerf to the full ap build he showcased. im not too sure how it'll affect your bruiser build but i personally don't think it's going to be as bad as you think it is, could be entirely wrong. my summary of the gwen nerf is just she scales less and doesn't even lose that much damage early game
@KilllaaG
2 күн бұрын
The bruiser builds is already lacking in the damage department compared to full ap vs bruisers. Let's say bruiser only losses 100 damage, that is still to much for the build riot wants to force us into considering how much stronger full ap is. If their is no compensation change to help bruiser full ap will be mandatory and gwen will lose build diversity
@Dchkim
2 күн бұрын
but the healing is affected on gwen this can kill the identity of the champion of being a tank killer
@fallenangel9614
2 күн бұрын
She’s still likely losing slightly more dmg then it shows bc the test dummies for “tank” dummies were only at 3k hp where buisers have 3.5k maybe 4K while tanks definitely have higher hp/defenses. The nerf seem more likely 6-10% dmg loss late game
@asafpm8196
2 күн бұрын
@@fallenangel9614 he does test it against tank dammies with higher defense and stuff. she loses about 400 dmg with 5 items (from 5300 to 4900). it's not the worst nerf in the world really
@fallenangel9614
2 күн бұрын
@@asafpm8196 unless he tests it off screen the highest his tests were at for his tank dummy was 3k hp. The dmg she loses will start to ramp up depending on how high the hp the enemy is, it’s not as noticeable on a target wth 3k hp. 3k hp is an enemy that built one hp item so ur not rlly gonna notice it when ur fighting vs squishies
@pesky2119
Күн бұрын
Just do the stupid band aid fix riot does to every bruiser when they aren't building crappy bruiser items, hp ratios on their kit 😂
@Kamiisama69
Күн бұрын
as they should
@Linkingx2
2 күн бұрын
Yeah Gwen has been doing well sure - but I think a champion doing well for once is not bad not to mention... idk buff other champs then? But nope Riot wants to nerf everything to the ground, items already suck now champs follow. And yeah, so they say Full AP Gwen burst builds arent what we want - so lets nerf the passive, which sure scales with AP but thats the least "full ap zuck zuck" part about her. Her passive is probably THE key part of Gwen, the anti Tank part. She is the AP kid of Fiora and Irelia - Dashes good vs Tanks a defensive W and still has some good teamfighting if she can flank(or is feed). And like these two shes also a bruiser or how ever thats called now - so she has AP AS and HP as core parts with MS and AH as valuebale secondary stats. Items that Gwen absolutly loves in concept are then obviously Nashors, and Riftmaker - id add Cosmic Drive personally... so when Gwen players dont go for items that feel custom made for their champ, does that mean Gwen needs nerfs or maybe Riot has done fked up these items so much that even Gwen wont go for them anymore? Well Riot hates items now - so they probably dont want to buff them so instead of making Items that are part of Gwens identity stronger and appealing again, as a more reasonable option vs the "assasin" build - NOPE they go and nerf the core part of Gwens identity. It shows that either we are on different planes of existence or they are doing what ever on these patch notes - probably cause they nerfed and "Buffed" gwens passive at the very start of last year as well... "maybe lets just do it again" thought random riot guy 123.
@Linkingx2
2 күн бұрын
ah yeah I forgot to mention - less AP scaling on passive, sure means that high AP builds lose gold value there in the conversion. But "low" AP builds are even more effected, not % wise but just flat out dmg wise - since as you said that build is more reliant on the passive then the full AP one... and for them their main dmg source gets nerfed... wow very smart.
@step9337
Күн бұрын
I dont agree with buffing other champs.Thats power creep thats not good for the game at all.Riot buffing other champs instead of nerfing the strong ones.Thats one the reasons why there is so much dmg in the game.
@Linkingx2
Күн бұрын
@@step9337 I am not saying to always buff champs and never nerf - but personally I feel we need more buffs then nerfs most of the time, especially since the nerfs are either completely useless like idk less ms for katarina, or they gut and destroy champs like they did with the Nihila change. Often many champs are quite viable so a mini placebo buff can just signal hey maybe try this one out, or they buff the counters to strong champs. And power creep just natuarally exists in the game, with champs doing more and more with every release, how is idk ChoGath not power creept by Ornn or Ksante? Not saying thats a good thing but a bit of power creep is not even that bad, especially since they can always dial back due to it being a digital game.
@step9337
Күн бұрын
i was talking about dmg powercreep you are talking about champs being outdated.I dont understand the point if you buff the counters than instead of nerfing the strong champ,you buff another champ (that can become a problem in the meta) that means you are increasing the strentgh of the champs so its even harder for other champs to be viable unless you want to contiune buffing everything.Thats why there was so much dmg in league. Edit: Thats why they nerfed all items bcs for all lot of people it was not fun just being oneshot by almost anything. Edit2:Ofc chogath is not being picked cause its an old champ that has an outdated kit that doesnt work well in modern league.
@Linkingx2
Күн бұрын
@@step9337 okay so you were more focused on the dmg part - but why then cant they buff supportive or tanky champs, and dmg is an umbrella term it depends on what and how champs aply dmg and how fast. So sure people were complaining about too much dmg, and now id say yeah the item nerfes succeeded somewhat into nerfing that. You still get your face ripped of by a Rengar but in most cases you can have more gameplay. Which I also do prefer. I still think that the way of nerfing something to make something else viable is not the best way and not the fun way. You want to feel excited to pick up a champ or item cause you think its good and fun, not cause the thing you liked before is now terrible. That creates the feeling of being forced to do xyz - and sure in extrem cases thats nessercery and it also means you cant have nerfs whats so ever; but so many older champs OR champs that were good once and got nerfed never to see the light of play again - have no reason to be picked up. So sure DMG down is a nice thing and it had to be done, but still some champs probably didnt get buffed in years. And also have not seen play (referring to high elo and mainly pro play tbh.)
@20Twenty-3
2 күн бұрын
If Riot wants Gwen to be more bruiser-like, they shouldn't just nerf her damage, buff her tankiness as well. Both you and Faedream suggested giving her scaling HP damage, sounds like a good idea to me (then she can finally build Heartsteel lol)
@paradoxwraith5275
2 күн бұрын
Bruisers are kinda cooked right now though. You don't want to be a brusher in this season. Especially aatrox
@aghost3628
2 күн бұрын
Hope they do this
@asafpm8196
2 күн бұрын
I don't get why do you think that she's gonna become unplayable after these changes. her early game is basically untouched and the nerfs really start to hurt at the very end of the game with 4-5 items. bruiser build was already the inferior build for so long now. we're already going full ap almost every game, so why now does it become a problem? it just means that's the only build we can go for. she still has an amazing late game with this build, so it shouldn't matter that much.
@KilllaaG
2 күн бұрын
The nerfs affect every part of her game. They matter less early, but they matter starting from level 1. The problem is that if we are forced into building full ap like I predict, Riot will see this and nerf her again. The cycle will continue (just like briar) to the point that Gwen is unplayable. Also it's a massive problem to ruin build diversity on a champ, if you don't believe me go ask Urpog on twitch/youtube.
@asafpm8196
2 күн бұрын
@@KilllaaG ofc the nerf applies to early game as well but it's definitely not as big as late game. you lose like 40 dmg. anyways gwen has been building full ap for a few months now and hasn't been nerfed really up until now, so why do you think all of a sudden they want to just kill the full ap build? I might be wrong but I think they nerfed her really just because how powerful she is now. I do agree tho, that's really not the nerf they should've went for. sure, ruining build diversity is not a good idea, but since we've already been building full ap 90% of games I don't think it's going to affect her much right now. we'll have to wait and see if they nerf her more later down the road, but right now she still seems very good
@KilllaaG
2 күн бұрын
And does 40 damage not change the an entire out come of a 1v1 early? It's sounding like you did not play during the early season patch that lowered her damage significantly to the point they had to pull back and meet in the middle. A nerf is a nerf and -40 damage as early as level one is horrible in top lane. Build diversity is also way more important than you think it is. Too many people lose to shop keeper and those that cookie cutter their builds from u.gg and such are hindering their ability to climb, just hoping that if they play enough games it'll work out
@asafpm8196
2 күн бұрын
@@KilllaaG ninkey did a damage test vid for the nerfs to see how much it affects her. what I meant was how much you lose in a full combo. she loses 18 dmg with only d ring and 46 with 1 item (nash). kzitem.info/news/bejne/pn2Vu4GKiHuemH4si=9cBK6t1zDpoYE8KA she's still very good right now. as I said, we'd have to wait for the next patches to see if they're gonna change anything other than this. you are right on build diversity, tho my point still stands. she had very minimal diversity even before the nerfs. now she'll have even less, but her strongest build is still gonna be strong
@1lik3Fir33mbl3m
2 күн бұрын
My main gripe with her is her W and her healing, while dishing out insane dps. If I could I would delete her, but the balance team at Riot is way too weird, they either buff damage or nerf it, they don't know what else could be done to champions (most of the times). Even tho the best nerf to her would be a MR-Thornmail (btw without compensating her with buffs to offset the introduction of said item, which riot likes to do with champs they like aka Yas, Yone, Irelia, Ezreal etc) that is made specifically for her kind of champion-class/-identity. At least in my oppinion.
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