"Get him! He's ramping!" Is what we say at our table when the Sol Ring comes out 😅
@FutureOverYou
Ай бұрын
@@DisownedVT SAME. But we say it for any ramping. Or card draw. Or any threat that displeases me. "Get 'em, they're ramping!" Lol
@veghost101
Ай бұрын
@@FutureOverYouok saying over sol ring sure but any ramp is a bit excessive some decks need more mana to keep up with other decks
@quincyking010
Ай бұрын
@@veghost101ima be honest the ramping is more subject to the power level of decks. Mee and my friends usually ramp early but we all use 8+ decks
@FutureOverYou
Ай бұрын
@@veghost101 I'm just a big ol' politician while playing Commander. It's needed cuz I am the best player in my friend pod that plays every Sunday and need to stave off the inevitable archenemy situations I find myself in quite a bit. It's always joking but yeah...
@christophernewcomb4518
Ай бұрын
Haha bro, EXACT same words lol I think fast mana is 100% fine. Means more games to play.
@ryanbrackett6463
Ай бұрын
Mana crypt is a card too
@masonmartin6743
Ай бұрын
Yes but in commander losing life is not a huge deal tho sure 20 life but 40 eh
@trojinpig2214
Ай бұрын
To be fair one is a must add cheep staple and the other is expensive as shit and only really sees play at cedh tables
@RhysticTutor1
Ай бұрын
Cedh vs EDH cards ngl
@BrodyMC24
Ай бұрын
@@trojinpig2214 I’ve seen it see play at a lot of optimised tables. Definitely the higher end but it’s not a CEDH exclusive. Honestly no card is because there’ll always be one fun way to play it that isn’t CEDH
@shanebauer8091
Ай бұрын
@@trojinpig2214 pubstompers love throwing it into an extremely optimized, non suspecting deck.
@CharlesLeeRay812
Ай бұрын
If they ban Sol Ring then literally EVERY commander precon ever wouldn't be out of the box legal.
@VvVLuffyM2
Ай бұрын
Jenson carthalion would be the only one
@taofaj4217
Ай бұрын
Funnily enough, because of trade secrets getting banned after it was printed in a commander deck, if you are playing a precon that has banned cards it’s technically legal. If you change the precon at all, you have to remove banned cards
@CharlesLeeRay812
Ай бұрын
@@taofaj4217 that's right. Now that I think about it, the event deck with Stone Forge Mystic. The Challenger Deck for Standard that had faceless haven in it. Wouldn't be too unusual
@taofaj4217
Ай бұрын
@@CharlesLeeRay812 oh I forgot that rule applied to other formats. Neat
@joshua_lee732
Ай бұрын
If sol ring is too powerful for edh. So is mana vault, mana Crypt, mox diamond, mox amber, mox opal, lotus metal, lions eye diamond, dark ritual, cabana ritual, ancient tomb, city of traitors, crystal vein, and so on.
@TeaAddict1
Ай бұрын
It's not about it being fast mana. It's the fact that everybody plays it. Most pods will rule 0 out the rest of fast mana but almost no one rules oit sol ring which is the problem for play.
@fiercedeitylink2019
Ай бұрын
@TeaAddict1 I've never had a pod rule zero out fast mana, but if you are playing then in an explicitly low-power game, the rest of the players definitely "self-correct", lol
@pandaborg2466
Ай бұрын
Exactly the only reason people get mad is because it’s cheap enough for every deck not just for cEDH
@cpt.arctourus7950
Ай бұрын
@fiercedeitylink2019 exactly I have the fastest mana in my play group but no one says rule 0 no fast mana bc we self regulate by playing relatively equal decks
@jonathangitter1311
Ай бұрын
@TeaAddict1 so the problem is people play it? You realize that's because it's actually affordable right? If black lotus was printed in every commander deck we would use that too
@GojiraMusic666
Ай бұрын
I like how powerful Sol ring is, because it makes people keep bad hands out of greed. "ooh, I got Sol Ring and a land, but every card in my hand is double colors... eh I'll draw into a land."
@veghost101
Ай бұрын
I never keep those hands
@ajohnymous282
Ай бұрын
@@GojiraMusic666 if your idea of fun is playing against a mana screwed opponent I guess..
@cippowasd
Ай бұрын
There Is a curated format by competitive players born from EDH. They banned all of the positive mana rock (sol ring and family). They ENABLE unfair strategies and allows non games more often than not (think a turn 1 rystic study).
@Anonymous-ju9bg
Ай бұрын
This is a reason that is not good
@esrasor
Ай бұрын
now that doesnt make sence, but i guess your just projecting.
@kstephenson5857
Ай бұрын
I think it was the Command Zone that said something to the effect of: '1 card almost never changes the 'power level' of your deck.' It's when you can make that effect consistently show up in your games that it raises your power level.' (I think it was on the Power Level episode of their podcast) And I think that's 100% right. Sol Ring doesn't turn a crappy deck into a sweaty deck. Putting Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, and Chrome Mox all into the same deck, plus Urza's Saga and other tutors? Now you've made it far more likely to draw into/tutor for fast mana every game. If you get butthurt about someone hitting the ~8.08% jackpot of a T1 Sol Ring, then you need to chill out. If that player is getting a fast mana piece out most games by T3, then the sweatiness is most likely coming from their deck's high number of tutors, fast mana, or both. But in either scenario, it is not the fault of 1 card in the 99.
@joedoe7572
Ай бұрын
It's 8% per player without any mulligans. That means it'll show up in someone's opening hand in 25% of games without any mulligans, and more than that with mulligans
@shinigami_0127
Ай бұрын
My rule of thumb is If you are bitching about a sol ring I don't want to play with you
@g.a.studios5084
Ай бұрын
Exactly
@capitalg6
Ай бұрын
If I don’t have like a Signet or a follow up that would be 4-5 mana, I usually just hold my T1 Sol Ring until T2 or 3.
@shawnpanzegraf5642
Ай бұрын
@@capitalg6 Pretty much the only thing that’ll tempt me to not do likewise is *specifically having either Oracle of Mul Daya or more ideally, Skyshroud Claim in hand, to press for the runaway that will make becoming Archenemy almost immaterial. I had that exact situation with the Oracle come up this Friday, and sure enough, the library top-flip was a 2nd land drop for the turn. Which led to a Throne of Eldraine and Bushwhack for another Forest to make 2 land drops on the next turn. I was up against an optimized Korvald and Chulane deck (With a poor newbie on a 5-6 Omnath Deck as our 4th), and there was literally nothing my opponent’s could do. By the time they got rid of the Throne, I had a Forgotten Ancient w/ Lightning Greaves, and they’d let me draw 4 cards to keep my Gyre Sage covered against a determined 3 card attempt to kill/bounce it w/ my Vorinclex, MR out. If you’re going to play the Turn 1 Sol Ring, your answer to the question “Will this enable me to wreck 3 opponents out for my blood?” needs to be an unqualified, no-hesitation YES, is what I’m saying.
@awesometubing9471
Ай бұрын
Same
@ZweihanderLightsaber
Ай бұрын
There is an off chance that someone plays T1 duress on you. Kinda depends on the other commanders but I think more often than not it's just safer to play it. Hand hate is cheaper than artifact removal
@mankdemes4767
Ай бұрын
Statistically, people who play turn 1 sol ring lose more games than average.
@ZweihanderLightsaber
Ай бұрын
@@mankdemes4767 where are you getting this statistic? The amount of mana advantage you have by turn 3 or 4 should be more than enough to pretty much solidify the win at most casual tables. In cedh I can see how you'd be targeted first more often, though, so an argument could be made there.
@jakepack4357
Ай бұрын
My personal playgroup (we play on Cockatrice) has banned sol ring, mana crypt and Mana vault after we started keeping track of our games on a spreadsheet and noticed that the T1 sol ring almost always won and those games were often ranked as less fun by our playgroup.
@jackbuggeln4870
Ай бұрын
The problem isn't exactly sol ring, there are other comparable mana rocks in terms of power. The real issue is that all of those cost $50+ whereas sol ring is $2 and comes with every precon If every deck had a consistent way to ramp as tho they played sol ring, then sol ring is less broken. But most pods it is likely a top card in every deck. All that being said wotc should just reprint all the other fast mana in every deck
@Peachtrain32744
Ай бұрын
@@jackbuggeln4870 Honestly I think reprinting all fast mana just makes the issues worse because then every game would have super sped up pacing, and this argument would be even bigger and more prevalent
@weirdo82
Ай бұрын
And yet, every Commander precon that has Green has like, a half dozen ramp spells/mana dorks. Pease, tell me the precon that doesn't have mana rocks that can keep up with any Green precon deck that ramps out 6 lands/mana *by turn 2 or 3....*
@einstein4555
Ай бұрын
I don't think Sol Ring should be banned, everyone can play and afford it and my personal experience is not that negative, both playing with and against it, wouldn't say it decides games on its own
@JazzOfTheStinson
Ай бұрын
Thank you I 100% agree. Also it's such an easy rule 0 exclude. Like just swap it for a land and you'll have a similar experience without it.
@jolteon345
Ай бұрын
When I started playing Commander (late 2015/early 2016), Sol Ring was a $5+ card despite being in lots of precons at the time. It was very noticeable when decks had a Sol Ring vs the signets and Worn Powerstone. WotC has gaslit us into thinking it’s a fair and balanced card by shoving it in virtually every precon, it really isn’t and still warps matches despite its availability. I don’t think that the RC will ban it for two reasons. The RC is overly hands off and I doubt that WotC will switch to Mana Vault, a card that you need to work to break. “Everyone can play/afford it” just ignores how strong the card is.
@g.a.studios5084
Ай бұрын
Sol ring isn't that bad
@seigwardofcatarina5776
Ай бұрын
Even if it was, which it isn’t, the amount of precons that its in that would become illegal to play would be terrible for the format
@djsedam123
Ай бұрын
Replace the Sol Ring with an Ancient Tomb. Problem solved
@jonathangitter1311
Ай бұрын
@@djsedam123not solved. Ancient tomb isn't less than $1
@tauntdragoon
Ай бұрын
@@jonathangitter1311 yeah just replace a $1-$2 card for a $90+ card then they would now charge 80+ for a regular precon and like 200 for the special precons but sol ring is so printed and it afordable so every can use it like i have a couple deck that are pretty strong but dont have the sol ring but like some said if you ban sol ring then ban every other fast mana card out the or any card that lets you put extra lands into play
@RisinTyson
Ай бұрын
Every precon would be illegal
@jonathangitter1311
Ай бұрын
@tauntdragoon yeah I mean gaeas cradle should be banned way before sol ring
@ninjatoaster924
Ай бұрын
Ban colossal dreadmaw, to overpowered
@livedandletdie
Ай бұрын
MagicTheNoah would cry.
@gjergj7806
Ай бұрын
But then how am I going to take all the sol rings with my Thada Adel?
@thebraveguy9808
Ай бұрын
Asking the important questions right here.
@laurac780
Ай бұрын
My play group just house ruled that Sol Ring comes in tapped, and it makes it a lot more bearable
@philbuttler3427
Ай бұрын
Bro your EDH table sounds like a terrible hugbox if Sol Ring is too strong.
@Aichomancer
Ай бұрын
yeah the card that gives the power 9 a run for their money is soooooo weak.
@joedoe7572
Ай бұрын
It's literally banned in every other format, besides Vintage where it's restricted
@kylevaughn7679
24 күн бұрын
@joedoe7572 yeah because you can run 4 ofs in those formats. We aren't running four sol rings in commander unless you're me playing Osgir
@A.ED00
Ай бұрын
I feel like it'd be ban worthy if it was "1 generic for 2 mana of any one color", instead of "1 generic for 2 colorless mana".
@prestonmitchell9135
Ай бұрын
Don't give wizards ideas
@snarglblargn4986
Ай бұрын
I ALWAYS hold up my sol ring until a turn when i can get something rolling.
@dkznikolaj7013
Ай бұрын
I always play 4 mana commanders, so for me, playing sol ring turn 1 is basically automatic
@snarglblargn4986
Ай бұрын
@dkznikolaj7013 I play alot of tricolor decks. So for me playing a sol ring on 1, without the signet to back it up. Is redundant and will just put a target on my back
@OfficialBigtimeRob
Ай бұрын
Every time we have a turn 1 sol ring we all chant “cheater” it always feels so good to be the reason the table chants that though
@korygurman6638
Ай бұрын
I’m coming back into it after about a decade away and that honestly doesn’t seem too broken compared to other cards that ramp up your mana pool early on and aren’t artifacts
@anthonycannet1305
Ай бұрын
Sol ring being banned in 1v1 commander makes sense because it gives you a huge advantage, but in a multiplayer setting that advantage is mitigated by the other 3 players teaming up on you since you have such a huge lead. 2 extra mana doesn’t really compete with 2 additional players worth of resources you have to deal with
@scruffyryan
Ай бұрын
the thing is, commander isn't meant to be played 1v1.
@robertomacetti7069
Ай бұрын
Mana crypt not being banned in 1v1 commander doesn't make sense though
@stevenlikeslegs6921
Ай бұрын
@@robertomacetti7069mana crypt is banned?
@robertomacetti7069
Ай бұрын
@@stevenlikeslegs6921 not in duel commander
@GoodnightCoombsy
Ай бұрын
You have 30 years of magic history to deal with sol ring, its a 10 cent card everyone can play This is not the issue in the format at all
@SwedeRacerDC
Ай бұрын
Turn 1 Sol Ring has statistically proven to be more dangerous to your self and less likely to get you the win
@nicholasbray3610
Ай бұрын
I don’t auto include it in ont of my decks since there are like 2-3 spells that have generic costs in them outside of other rocks that produce colored mana. Turn 1 is strong, but not always game breaking unless you have magical Christmas land opener.
@Nyrd_YT
Ай бұрын
one thing i’ve learned is if i get sol ring in my starting hand with no colorless 2 drop or any 4 drop then there’s no reason to play it turn 1
@robvakarian2330
Ай бұрын
If you think it should be banned the game isn't for you
@dextoast
Ай бұрын
Saying sol ring should be banned is like saying that you should be arrested for picking up a dollar on the sidewalk
@mikeyg831
Ай бұрын
Be ready to be the threat if you're the only one dropping a ring.
@azealazar1154
Ай бұрын
I think everyone is forgetting that sol ring is the closest some people will get to owning a mana crypt without forking over $100 plus dollars and it also has zero protection on its own so as easily removed as any of the other rocks lol
@flaetsbnort
Ай бұрын
If you used your Sol to cast something and then someone else removes it you're still ahead in the game
@The_Dying_Rose
Ай бұрын
@@flaetsbnort and?
@Peachtrain32744
Ай бұрын
@@flaetsbnort Oh no you got to play an arcane signet off your sol ring, that one mana ahead is game ending!
@roflsnpwncakes
Ай бұрын
@@Peachtrain32744 mana rocks can be tapped every turn for repeated value. hope that helps!
@Peachtrain32744
Ай бұрын
@@roflsnpwncakes And you can destroy a sol ring on turn 1 or two, hope that helps!
@Dontblink70757
Ай бұрын
"The only cards that should be banned are the ones that stop me from being able to do whatever I want. I can still play those cards because I'm special, but you can't because commander is a format about me being able to have my deck go off every time, and not you." -commander players. For the love of god know that this is sarcasm.
@dragonxlove
Ай бұрын
I think it feels like a big play Hail Mary. Yes, green has this, but it helps non green or non ramp even out as well. Also I’ve seen some people whiff so hard because they thought they could play well with two land and a sol ring in their hand.
@riku2193
Ай бұрын
If you can't win with a 2 land sol ring hand that says more about your deck building than you.
@alexdvf7300
Ай бұрын
@@riku2193 most people play casual edh, rather than competitive. Turn 1 sol ring in casual isn't an insta win, and if your playing a deck in which your that likely to win off it then you probably won't be invited to tables again. Because most people play for fun, with sometimes stronger decks but never on that level.
@dragonxlove
Ай бұрын
@@riku2193 I think it’s more so They believe in the consistency of their deck to get them more land and potential draws. It wasn’t all the time, it was just that they chose a hand for the sol ring rather than other cards of their starting hand.
@riku2193
Ай бұрын
@@alexdvf7300 I find it funny that you defend sol ring because "Power Level". Sol ring is considered to be almost as strong as the Mox cycle and yet people call it casual since it doesn't cost a lot of money. How much money a card costs doesn't change what is on the card.
@alexdvf7300
Ай бұрын
@@riku2193 sol ring is nowhere near as strong as the mox cycle, and saying a 1 mana give two colourless is the same as 0 mana give a coloured mana is ridiculous. Sol ring is strong but nowhere near that strong. Please don't spout such nonsense again
@danielhamilton3496
Ай бұрын
Its like in chess if 10 percent of the time one of the players start with an additional bishop.
@arrivtuber
Ай бұрын
My tip: If you don't have an imitate use for sol ring on turn 1 or 2 like sol ring into signet or land, sol ring, land, commander hold it back for turn 3 or 4. A sol ring on turn 1 while powerful makes you arch enemy from the get go, on turn 3 or 4 most people see it as less threatening.
@mackinzie
Ай бұрын
Green players playing ramp sorceries every turn. The table: get the sol ring!
@christianjohnson8887
Ай бұрын
Say it again but softly for the babies at the tables
@blkvnm6003
Ай бұрын
I don't have much of a problem with green ramp as I have with people not putting interaction in their decks. For instance I run [[Balancing Act]] which for 4 mana everyone sacrifices lands to whoever has the least same with creatures and cards in hand. Or something like [[Illicit Auction]] everyone bids life to control the best creature. So you can steal a Kozilek if it's out on the battlefield which can give anyone an advantage but it comes with a cost. Same with Mage's Contest which bids life to counter a spell. There's so many ways to slow down players or throw "wrenches" in game plans that no one wants to play.
@mackinzie
Ай бұрын
@blkvnm6003 I just mean that, everyone will get target the turn 1 sol ring player ignoring the yadora who has access to 23 mana by turn 6 or whatever. But sol ring bad.
@MarioJPC
Ай бұрын
Gavin Verhey talked about 2 cards that are not meant for Modern, because they are the signature cards of Legacy. I think that about Sol Ring, it is a signature spell for EDH, and it is not an expensive staple on that. I don't play it on one of my Decks in fact.
@trooper8835
Ай бұрын
I have a mono green deck that just doesn’t need it.
@seanbean6893
Ай бұрын
The best way to think of Sol ring in commander is, "The table balances itself" If you truly are the threat don't expect to keep that Sol ring on the field. But people are usually watching out for the guy that's ramping with green and stepping on the gas.
@storm.57z23
Ай бұрын
Holding things is sometimes good. I bluff a little bit when playing azusa landfall, with one funny scenario being “and damn, im out of lands”. Meanwhile evolution sage is on the field and I have a planeswalker and 3 lands in hand and then proliferate my planeswalker to ultimate it. Popping off too early is sometimes a mistake I make
@Klausbro
Ай бұрын
It’s THE commander card. Banning it would be genuinely a bad call by the crc
@kylevaughn7679
24 күн бұрын
It'll literally kill the card. Outside of commander it's restricted in vintage iirc. Might as well do a recall at that point
@JazzOfTheStinson
Ай бұрын
Sol Ring is ok. If it was way too powerful, this conversation wouldn't be happening for this many years without a ban. It hasn't broken the format and probably never will.
@dongdoodler
Ай бұрын
If it was too strong it wouldnt be in like every precon and reprinted to hell and back. Yeah its a staple and you can pick up a "staple" for like a buck, whats the problem.
@sabertag6992
Ай бұрын
1) Challenge the argument, not the person is a cool as hell guideline, love it. 2) I see Sol Ring as basically the best ramp card (low cost, net positive, colorless), but if it was banned I would just add a different ramp spell, so all banning it would do is make ramp a tad slower sometimes. The Command Zone did a great episode discussing this, and I agree most with Rachael Weeks when she said, paraphrasing, "If Sol Ring was going to be banned, it should have been banned before it was in 80% of all EDHrec - recorded decks."
@Azhi_Dahaka
Ай бұрын
I think there are a lots of other cards that are basically "autoinclude if you can afford it" that are more problematic like dockside extortionist, sol ring is more notorious cause everyone has it so everyone uses it in every deck but the more and better ramp you have in your deck and the more consistent your deck becomes the less explosive sol ring feels
@DanielCotillo
Ай бұрын
Commander is a format where everyone starts at a disadvantage: You're one player with 40 lives against an opponent that has three decks, takes three turns and has 120 lives. If something, Sol Ring is trying to balance the odds.
@Boofzilla98
Ай бұрын
If sol ring is a bazooka then dockside is galaxy ending threat
@zyclaw503
Ай бұрын
Sol ring is good mana production, but I've never seen it be the definitive "you won because you drew that card." Yes it speeds things up, but in edh it does one of two things. In a fast high power pod it is one of many pieces that spreds the game up, and not a needed piece nor the only one of its power level. In a slower low power meta it turns your turn 10 win into maybe a turn 8 or 9 win, which is a long time for no one to board wipe or Krosan grip.
@curtislittrice9023
Ай бұрын
Patience has won me MANY EDH games. Great point.
@Deathyy550
Ай бұрын
Leave it be
@MSNking14
Ай бұрын
100% should NOT be banned
@jessjazzy306
Ай бұрын
I have struggled with this kinda thought in magic for awhile. There are a lot of cards that are so powerful now. My friends and I use to build decks more thematically and for fun. Now we use the same powerful cards and combos that fit our play styles. I really love this game don't get me wrong. I just miss when it was about making a deck with a fun combo and not who gets their infinite combo first.
@TheJackMouse
Ай бұрын
I always liked Sol Ring for it being what is, as you say, basically a universal speed boost. Any deck can Sol Ring on turn 1, and when it does it says “I’m the same deck at the same power level, but I’ll have a bit of an edge this game.” It’s a several player format, where someone being in the lead in terms of threat and value can ebb and flow constantly, and players react accordingly. A world where everyone has a sol ring, and has the same chance of playing it turn 1, is about as unfair as a dice roll determining who gets to go first.
@ember3579
Ай бұрын
It's not that it's too powerful, it's that nobody wants to run the comp level answers because that's anti-casual.
@GoodnightCoombsy
Ай бұрын
If you think it takes comp level answers to deal with sol ring you have no idea how comp really is tbh
@Saajix93
Ай бұрын
It's funny that you mention competitive edh. Cuz a lot of casual tables have a number of restrictions. I know table that just won't let you play if you use blue, or counter spells, or certain exile cards, tergrid, or atraxa, can't have infect, can't have too much ramp, has to be a pillowfort... and so on... the people who suggested the rules for their group do it so that they have a chance to win or play solitaire with themselves. Cuz A the restrictions hinder everyone else or B, prevent exile like interactions. Land destruction, graveyard hate, and infect as well as a very lean deck are usually not allowed at tables in casual around me. My group that I formed, though our one rule, is you can have any cards just don't play them if it will halt the game unless you can win the same turn or on the next one. If you going to play an Armageddon you better win next turn. If your going to play solitaire with yourself for the next hour, you better win that turn or at the start of the next turn in less than 15 minutes. Also explain to me how the combo works this one time and then just say when you hit your combo next time so we can concede and get a new game in. We have people who run eldrazi bs, a nekusar, a tergrid bs, I run atraxa infect n superfriends mix, one guy is a $whale$ and my gf runs a group with a number of instant win cons or Accidental win cons so this way when she starts going into solitaire mode she at least can win without realizing till end of turn.😅 Hell I'm building a not so nice necrobloom based on evil.exe guess what it's got land destruction guess what my group has a shit ton of exile and graveyard hate. Non of us look and say are we running competitive level decks or is this casual. Cuz I can promise you if you remove all the restrictions and just play with what you have and you around friends who cares. For the sore losers, get over yourself. No one has a 100% win rate. I'm lucky if I can get a win ever 9 games with atraxa. We play in a pod of 7 to 9 people. We have 2 hour games and get maybe 4 games in every other Saturday. It's absolute chaos, and the best way to have fun is to do anything you want to win. Just don't be petty about it or sore about losing. Cuz here is what I hate at my tables, people who either halt the game when someone could end it just out of pettiness or someone who cant stand losing, we kicked a guy for being a sore loser a yelling at everyone about what's fair and what wasn't. A few of us pulled out some big combos but needed one more turn to drop the last 1 or 2 cards. He forced us to discard and then played a farewell with no win con. In fact, he scooped right there and we had to restart the game because we were 2 and half hours in and no one could do anything for 3 turns. So yeah like don't be a dickhead.
@matthewmalovich64
Ай бұрын
No one complains like EDH players
@markwinterle66
Ай бұрын
Sol Ring is the most friendly ramp I know in commander. There are tons of other ramp sources that are way more threatening
@devilin100
Ай бұрын
Sol ring lets players who get their commander removed early a free recast at its most powerful. My usual play group went over our favourite pair of decks, so 8 total, there was only like 23 cards (so like 2 or 3%, and thats ateast twice as many in a normal game) that a turn one sol ring was 'perfect' for casting: a 4 drop on turn 2 that couldn't be easily removed by other 2 mana removal options. Like I'm rolling Feather half the time so our group is pretty low power, but maybe run some removal when you can. Its almost like interactions are important in commander.
@jmkool01
Ай бұрын
It's not a major problem, and it's also not the only card that does its thing. The issue is the every so often that someone gets crazy ramp on the first turn and has their combo live on turn 2-3, while the rest of the table is still land-pass or land-dork. It doesn't come up all the time, but when it does it's a massive skew in the player's favor. This is true of all fast mana.
@DouglasShulby
Ай бұрын
There was a time when Sol Ring was banned in EDH. This ban didn't last long, however, and was reversed much to the approval of the community. On a separate note, Sol Ring is a card that adds no flavor to your deck except "I get mana faster" which, honestly, is a detriment to the casual intention of EDH as a whole.
@captianbacon
Ай бұрын
They should print a few more variations of sol ring cause its like everyone has one or 2 if u have a mana crypt.
@sollockhart523
Ай бұрын
I never really considered sol ring to be a ban worthy card but wow this short was both the best argument to ban and a great defense of the card at the same time. i much prefer making everyone’s decks better with a one card speed boost to making everyone’s decks worse by removing that option, but I also agree it kind of sucks when one player can get that far ahead jsut because they got lucky and drew into it first. It’s kind of like how in yugioh, something around 15-20 cards out of a 40 card competitive deck are usually the same staples (maxx C, Ash, veiler, ETC) you end up with everyone playing the same cards and it gets old and repetitive and that’s my problem with cards like Sol Ring, just feels like a lot of decks starters become samey when everyone’s relying on drawing the same speed boost card
@blue-tc9jw
Ай бұрын
When my group sees a sol ring drop turn one no matter who got it there is just the unspoken "they must be cheating". A lot of removal built in solves the problem quick though
@smartfoam5107
Ай бұрын
My decks are usually curved enough for my playgroup to both compete with a T1Sol ring that even if i actually get one in my hand it doesn’t do too much for me
@Ragnarakk
Ай бұрын
Literally had an opening turn 1 sol ring in hand last friday and waited one turn. one of the other guys had a leyline and it took all eyes off me turn two which was perfect
@cptnfool
Ай бұрын
The issue is price - if other fast mana was as readily available, it would all be played too. proxies are great, but there are a lot of players who start from a pre-con and upgrade at their LGS from there.
@Jrenzman
Ай бұрын
For cards that are simply strong and not problematic in some way (looking at you Drannith Magistrate) I feel its better to let each group decide what does and doesnt belong in their pod.
@thatguymike7401
Ай бұрын
In a format where you need 100 individual cards for each deck, it's nice to have cheap options that can be thrown into any deck for only cents. Sure cards like command tower and sol ring can be overplayed, but not everyone is trying to play cedh.
@bastenthegreyhound7206
Ай бұрын
For me, i think that i had the convo with my table before. It boiled down to this. We agree if we bring sol ring or not before the game begins. And we have decks without sol ring. That was it, that was the whole convo. It was probably the only decent convo that we had at pre-play
@sgt.zacharyrothschild5280
Ай бұрын
Gotta love how a 2 for 1 increase on mannet is a deal breaker, but all the free counter spells are completely legit.
@toddpilling4985
Ай бұрын
It’s almost like they should probably get rid of the “power 4” sol ring, mana vault, mana crypt, and mix diamond. But I also get that it’s a bottom up banlist where they mostly balance the banlist for casual play
@Watchwolf93
Ай бұрын
Be patient is the correct answer. Don't always have to turn 1 sol ring. Waiting 3 or 4 turns is perfectly fast and even more safe. 😊
@tesuya457
Ай бұрын
I agree, I've just stopped playing Sol Ring turn one, as a rule, you just get focused down and you can save it for a small burst later
@jasmint6703
Ай бұрын
It's fun to experiment with bannings in individual playgroups, especially fast mana and tutors. Dockside and Thoracle and DT are also worth experimenting with. The format is totally different without these cards.
@johannn1805
Ай бұрын
With cards like Mana Crypt in the format, sol ring is rarely a power-play. If we wanna talk about broken cards, I'd look to hand-locks and AOE static effects on permanents before a piece of ramp that's really only powerful with generic two-drop follow-up play.
@camerons6028
Ай бұрын
Love pulling a sol ring on any turn past 12. Might as well be a land card at that point.
@bardofsnow
Ай бұрын
The biggest issue that I have with Sol Ring is that I just find it to be boring. It's so good that you just put it in your deck if you can run it. Exactly like cards like Mox Diamond, Mana Crypt/Vault, Ancient Tomb, City of Traitors, etc. etc. I don't have a problem with fast mana in general, but the issue is that the gas is just so good 9/10 times that you might as well just keep the hands that have them.
@Kladrin
Ай бұрын
the problem is not sol ring itself - it's the aviability (price) of the other colorless mana sources (mana crypt, mana vault, the legal moxes) that makes it stand out so much; if those were as accessible as sol ring sol ring wouldn't be the problem
@jumpanama
Ай бұрын
Sol Ring is why I play Mental Misstep because nothing feels better than countering it before my first turn.
@oni739
Ай бұрын
Solution! Everyone starts with sol ring already on the battlefield or sol ring now goes in the command zone with your commanders
@mrtrash4128
Ай бұрын
In my pod someone legit printed a sol ring with a picture of a sol ring getting counterspelled with the flavor text "God damnit Nemmy" - Mp It is now a pod tradition to fake panic when someone plays sol ring
@perinthia6829
Ай бұрын
Iv seen so many times people will play a sol ring, then do nothing for the next 2 turns and get targeted instead of waiting until you actually need to cast it
@travismurtland3257
Ай бұрын
I played a Yuma deck. Forest, Sol Ring, a mill artifact I don't remember. I had my commander and 6 tokens on turn 4 or 5, only for my entire board to be wiped by a Balefire Dragon every turn.
@noahlong6130
Ай бұрын
In a 4+ player game in a sub 8/10 power level strategies without crazy fast tutors and combos, it's usually not an issue. Even in the games with each deck being crazy consistent and powerful, it's usually also not an issue because everyone has FOW, Crypt, or other early game mana rock removal like any competent multiplayer EDH deck. The issue seems to be when the power level of decks are mixed where to 5/10 plays with a 9/10 where the 9/10 draws Sol Ring and has the best most expensive curve consistently that can solo most games against 3-4 other 5-6/10 decks vs it.
@Tiragron99
Ай бұрын
I feel like Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, and other similar cards that for a small (ish) initial cost you get a good speed boost to your strategy are all ok in EDH They feel almost like how cards like Pot of Prosperity, Pot of Avarice, Graceful Charity, Trade In, and other such cards feel in Yu-Gi-Oh! For a small (ish) cost, you get to speed up your own game plan, sure if they speed it up too much then it's a problem, but if it's just 2 mana, then that's not that big a change imo
@faeriedragon348
Ай бұрын
Whenever someone talks to me about banning Sol ring, I tell them, “All right, then also ban Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, jeweled Lotus, and all the expensive fast mana.” They usually immediately shut up😊
@akashiya221
Ай бұрын
the issue is there's a 4/99 chance to see it in an opening hand since all players have it and all it takes is 1 person to have it turn 1 to make it feel like you're immediately starting behind. I know the argument of we have mana cypt/(insert fast mana), however those aren't as socially acceptable at lower power tables so it isn't as prevalent. While I think the format is more fun without it I wouldn't ban it given how much commander product is already out with sol ring such as all the precons ect.
@Gh0stWh33l
Ай бұрын
Mana Crypt, Lotus Petal, Jeweled Lotus, Name any Mana Rock, Chromatic Lantern, there are so many other things that exist in Sol Ring's power level and higher, and none of them deserve hate at all. The Ring is fine, it's a staple in just about every deck but so is Arcane Signet and I don't see anyone calling for that things ban, and it's newer and harder to find!
@Slightly.Lost.
Ай бұрын
I'm a firm believer that, at a casual level, turn one sol Ring is the worst play you can have if that extra two mana isn't going to be immediately helpful. Because you will be targeted whether it's helpful or not.
@zacherymathison7274
Ай бұрын
I think the ban question isn't really about the power level of sol ring but the fact that it is an auto include in every deck. There isn't a single deck that wouldn't want it.
@davew1503
Ай бұрын
I often wait to play unless I can really go off fast but often I wait until turn 2 or 3 depending on how fast I have to play my hand
@XxSTEVE559xX
Ай бұрын
One of my friends new to Magic had a proxy for Mana Crypt and we allowed it. By the end of the game Mana Crypt dealt 30 damage to him. He then threw that proxy away and decided it wasn’t worth it
@Leonidous
Ай бұрын
When every deck has mana acceleration like Sol Ring, Mana Crypt, Ancient Tomb, Gemstone Caverns, etc. it becomes a lot more balanced because everyone's playing a turn ahead
@RadDuck7
Ай бұрын
Strictly from a Cedh perspective. The only card I could see needing a ban is Mystic Remora (and maybe Nadu). That card warps games in such an unhealthy way, and the cumulative upkeep thing is hardly a self balancing factor for it.
@TabletopGamer99
Ай бұрын
If Sol Ring wasn't removed from the Reserved List in 2002, it would be banned in Commander by now. But it was removed from the Reserved List, and its existence and playability in every deck is now such a part of the history and culture of Commander that it's here to stay.
@jordanwilliams3984
Ай бұрын
It comes in almost every precon and that is half the fun of the format is when you get to pop off on your turn and swing the advantage your way
@NakanoHitori
Ай бұрын
I had my eldrazi commander in 2 turn. I also keep getting some good cards that started to make other people feel threatened. I don't blame them. Also I had a conversation with my group about this exact thing
@samuelleger2912
Ай бұрын
Sole ring is honestly the best thin mtg ever did they made a good card and printed it so much it a casual card
@TijnMercx
Ай бұрын
It’s a thing that should not exist on every table Fast mana (not talking rituals) is just not meant for a casual table
@davidbice3154
Ай бұрын
It and several other low cost high mana producing mana rocks are banned in the 1v1 rules of Commander called Duel Commander because in a 1v1 situation it literally is just who drew the mana rock first. With no politicking or other targets its just who plays the combo first.
@logancampbell783
Ай бұрын
Ban Sol Ring? Okay, ban: all signets, Mana Crypt, Mana Vault, Doubling Cube, any card that makes treasures, any card that lets you draw more than 1 card a turn, any card that lets you play more than 1 land a turn, all tutors, all boardwipes, any combos in the game, any lands that can add more than 1 color of mana, any lands that add more than 1 mana, Griselbrand (just in case he thought we were sorry), any card that reduces casting cost, and anything that goes through your deck like cascade or discover. They make your game faster, after all. Oh, look, my whole deck is now basic lands and commons with little to no abilities. Look at all the fun we'll be having.
@liberty2087
Ай бұрын
Sol Ring is in the spirit of casual commander, where winning isn’t the only goal. At low power level, turn 1 sol ring does not equal victory, whereas at higher power levels, it can. I think it should technically be banned for being too powerful (and it probably would be if it never got reprinted), but it will never be banned because it’s in too many preconstructed decks. At the very least, my house rules have banned it for lower power games.
@toxicsledgeful
Ай бұрын
my opening hand in my Tymna kraum (Blue farm) with two fetches, mox diamond, mana crypt, ryhstic studies, ragavan, and a imp seal
@PlanetGeoOG
Ай бұрын
My personal problem with sol ring is less about power and more about how it harms format diversity. Due to both wide availability in price, able to be put in any deck, and just makes your deck better % wise it makes it so it’s always your 100th card. A phrase I like to say is “commander is a 99 card format with sol ring”. I hate the card because of this and cut it any chance I get.
@Luuute
Ай бұрын
Ban Mana Crypt and stuff thats literally a price gate for people getting into cedh Sol Ring is accessible to everyone who gets into the format and if you dont get a precon with one its a very cheap card. The problem is players who would bitch that their broken money cards get banned and lose value because for some reason people look at cards with dollar signs in mind
@RhysticTutor1
Ай бұрын
Because of how widely available Sol Ring is, it’s not really “unfair.” I think EDH vs CEDH should have different mulligan/start rules, and the one my group uses is “mulligan until you have 3 lands, then force keep.” There’s a guy who uses 29 lands and a shitload of ramp, but other than that it keeps everything pretty balanced. Either way, net positive mana at PL 5-7 isn’t going to be super devastating to anyone because it immediately turns the table on you
@RhysticTutor1
Ай бұрын
Free spells like Crypt/Keep and the Forces, Pacts and other non-start stuff (leylines, from your “opening hand” effects) are also hard table bans. Board state cost reduction is ok by us, but we generally have a hard “no” when it comes to cost 0 spells or anything that has a cost 0 alternative cost
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