Table of Contents: 00:00 - Intro 00:25 - 22.6mm motor stator numbers 04:49 - 28mm motor 05:52 - 25mm motor with split shift magnets 07:23 - Split Shifted magnets 09:19 - What split shifted magnets are supposed to do 12:36 - Split Shift magnets don't work everywhere... 16:38 - Difference between 25mm and 22.6mm performance FPVCycle.com motor lineup: fpvcycle.com/collections/motors
@R3dryuu
Жыл бұрын
aluminum dont rust
@starsstripesjacket
Жыл бұрын
I love that your selling the motor and bell separate. I've been using your 25mm motor since the first batch (the ones with desync issues which you replaced for free when the second round was made) and I've been running the same stators since. I've only ever had to replaced motor bells and kept on ripping :)
@nickvledder
Жыл бұрын
Splitting bell and stator is a big improvement! I always had trouble dealing E-clips (or C-clips), but as you show, there is just a screw at the bottom: great improvement too! Thanks a lot for sharing!
@BaldmanFPV
Жыл бұрын
I agree with the 22.6 efficiency. I even capped mine by 90%; they have plenty punch. Noticeable more flight time and less voltage warnings.
@spikester
Жыл бұрын
Many motor reviews don't discuss peak efficiency across the entire rpm range not to mention required power to maintain or change speed from the higher rpm ends, it does make sense that a slightly larger motor that is limited from hitting the top end will score longer flight times. RCinpower appears to have this down to a science which is why they regularly do well on Chris Rosser's tests on efficiency.
@spikester
Жыл бұрын
There is some pretty complex physics behind a motor's ability to send a very clean backfeed signal for the ESC the higher the RPM you go, which factors into efficiency when requiring sudden abrupt speed change, which is what we mostly do zipping freestyle.
@gpegasusm
Жыл бұрын
Interested to see who’ll be the first manufacturer to start experimenting with axial-flux motors for the larger sizes.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I've been trying to pay them exorbitant amounts of money to start working on the problem but none of them care. Most will wait for someone else to do all the work to figure it out and then copy it as usual 😞. It's the most obvious way forward for larger crafts however. There are so many human scale projects out there that are working so hard to get a viable craft when the motor is gonna be where they could probably make the biggest gains.
@fpv_am
Жыл бұрын
When Bob posts content I feel like I am back to 2018 🥹🥹🥹
@Memento86Mori
Жыл бұрын
I agree, I just love his style of content. It's tiring to watch some of the wannabe I know it all fpv youtubers.
@kenb6565
Жыл бұрын
Yup...love a bob clip!
@digitalflyfpv6688
Жыл бұрын
The best time for FPV in my opinion
@menthous305
Жыл бұрын
I wish it was...
@thewhitedillard
Жыл бұрын
🎯
@Dec1duousTree
Жыл бұрын
I really enjoy learning about what you're working on, and what you have concluded. I have really loved RCinPower motors, and I look forward to trying yours sometime soon. Thank you.
@baggszilla
Жыл бұрын
I absolutely love your tests and experiments! Thanks Bob!
@mikev2116
Жыл бұрын
Bob's builds are best. I've tried the competitors and what I've found is: Bob's motors offer 12% better throttle control, 7% fewer crashes which equals a 43% better overall flying experience. I invest only in fun that matters and Bob is the chosen investment for me!
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
😂 so many percentages 🤌
@mikev2116
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab Forgot to mention you beat Cheena 100% of the time 💪
@paulhope3401
Жыл бұрын
How did you come to only 12% improved throttle control? I measured mine at 12.091331% 😉
@lemonsquareFPV
Жыл бұрын
Keep doing what you’re doing! A lot of the designs we thought would work, didn’t. All the “technically perfect” motors sucked for freestyle, or were just too inconsistent due to various (mostly temperature, durability, manufacturability) issues. Skewed stator testing caused huge inconsistencies, extra weight from the extra epoxy, harder winding, and poorer cooling, maybe with a pump type bell it would work better, but I don’t know honestly. It was very preliminary and honestly was costing too much already. I might skew the stators on my last few KO pump bell motors… maybe 25degrees, tops (15 will likely be better), but I really dig the custom wind I got on them currently. I’ll think about it, I’m honestly barely surviving my mind ATM and not as enthusiastic as a couple of months ago, but it will likely return, so I don’t worry too much. I love this stuff. It was through real world experimentation and small optimizations that we got to this point. And it’s not a bad place that we are at, but it can always be better! Thank you for your contribution! Happy flying! ❤
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Real world experimenting is just so darn expensive and time consuming
@HolmesHobbies
Жыл бұрын
You should choose your skew based on pole pitch, not angle of the skew. Any different lamination height will need different skew angles. A full skew is full pitch. On 12 slot this is 30 degrees of a circle. Half skew would be 15 degrees. Some improve softness and some make it much worse, and it depends on your magnet shape, airgap, and tooth shape. You will have to physically test each one to know, which is an arduous task!
@dinosabic5383
8 ай бұрын
Hey Bob! Just want to say thanks for the products over the years! I just picked up my 25mm motors that i am going to use with 6" biblades as per recommendation by one of your guys. Just assembled them and they feel AMAZING. I have raw 22.6's as well and the same quality experience. Need Pink 22.6's next for a race build. Cheers man!
@MCsCreations
Жыл бұрын
Really, really interesting stuff indeed! Thanks, Bob! 😃 I like how you try new ideas! Even if they don't work you've learned something! Anyway, stay safe there with your family! 🖖😊
@flat-earther
Жыл бұрын
hi MCs, have you become a flat earther yet?
@MCsCreations
Жыл бұрын
@@flat-earther Dude, I'm an alien. I've been to space... I came from space! So, no.
@flat-earther
Жыл бұрын
@@MCsCreations okay. BTW MCs, what do you think about all gubments drawing a line around you(Antarctic Treaty) and saying you are not allowed to leave? If you don't know what I mean, read my about tab.
@MCsCreations
Жыл бұрын
@@flat-earther I did read it. But I don't really care, I HATE cold... I would never go there. 😬
@flat-earther
Жыл бұрын
@@MCsCreations okay. I suggest watching the 13 part series in my about tab to learn more.
@LovesM855A1
6 ай бұрын
Makes sense, I will say Fpvcycle has always been top tier to me. They are always buttery smooth and have never let me down so of course Im a huge fan what more can you ask for.
@Huck_FPV
9 ай бұрын
Excited to try the 25mm on my chonky 5 inch and the 28mm on my 7 inch. Watching this as I assemble the 25mm and they are impressive. I love that they are serviceable and will probably stick with you guys from here on out!
@EdturdEnfart
Жыл бұрын
fpvcycle motors are amazing was hoping to see more on the drone in the background
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Next video will be about the frames and whatnot.
@fxrc3086
Жыл бұрын
The new motor lineup looks amazing...cant wait to try them... now what i really need is the Sonicare to come back in stock. I need spare parts to get mine back in the air. Its my favorite lightweight 5in.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
it's on the way
@fxrc3086
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab thank you for everything you do for the hobby
@mikebergman1817
Жыл бұрын
I didn't bother doing the math regarding the 2809 vs 30mm, but holy crap that has a lot more volume than I thought. I hear 28 and automatically think it's kind of meh for 7" (freestyle) but 2809 is a fair bit more than your average 2806.5. Very nice.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yeah just look at the chart I put on screen. It's partly why we went with 2809. Specifically the magnet height is much more meaningful, weight is similar and the 3106.5 never got warm to begin with so we can afford a taller stator.
@PortalFPV
Жыл бұрын
Why are they sold like this? BECAUSE we don't buy tires AND rims every time we just need tires. Thank you so much for finally selling motors the way they should have been sold all along 😁
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yeah it made zero sense to me that motors are sold the way they are for the longest time. Especially when a wide variety of 2306 bells will fit a wide variety of 2306 stators. The only variation is a bit of shaft length and that's only sometimes. Stocking all the motors became an issue so I go fed up and just did it this way because it made the most sense.
@JbVest
Жыл бұрын
Very very interesting 🤔
@armandrone9016
Жыл бұрын
I loved seeing your new series of motors, I rewind motors here in Brazil, and everything related to this component interests me. Your motors must be very good or not popular around here, as one has never been by my workshop for repair!!!
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
World wide shipping and the whole sale market is just a total mess on the tail of Covid unfortunately. So it's just not a reasonable market for us to widely access
@armandrone9016
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab Man, you should think carefully about the Brazilian market, which despite all the crises we've been through, is expanding.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@armandrone9016 there's many markets around the world we would love to service. We just have limited time and energy to figure out how to make it reasonably worthwhile.
@Asu01
Жыл бұрын
Slightly unrelated: thoughts on the Jumper T20? I remember you're all about compact radio with full-size gimbal.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I have the T20S on the way. I'm actually pretty excited
@scottmarshall6766
Жыл бұрын
More info is always a good thing. Thanks for "working the problem" on our behalf. It IS appreciated! ..... flossing..
@koki.k
Жыл бұрын
I really like the serviceable motors idea.
@ThirdEyeFPV
Жыл бұрын
Love that your experimenting, failing and learning. That’s proper product design. Question: if the benefits are negligible, do the extra points of potential failure (more magnets) offset any gains?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yeah it's definitely the most effective method by far imo but it's just so expensive and time consuming. But I get places eventually with it.
@runpuppyfpv5744
7 ай бұрын
Im still flying the v1 25mm motors and i love them !
@ShebanFPV
Жыл бұрын
Actually a great idea to sell stators and bells separately 🔥👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
@olafschermann1592
Жыл бұрын
I love highly intelligent people. They always achieve it different than any others or combine ideas of 2 different fields. Thanks for permanently iterating and inventing in our hobby!
@flat-earther
Жыл бұрын
hi olafschermann, have you become a flat earther yet?
@olafschermann1592
Жыл бұрын
@@flat-earther no. I prefer to talk to smart people.
@flat-earther
Жыл бұрын
@@olafschermann1592 okay. BTW olafschermann, what do you think about all gubments drawing a line around you(Antarctic Treaty) and saying you are not allowed to leave? If you don't know what I mean, read my about tab.
@fooojin
Жыл бұрын
You can anodize aluminium without color. It will be protected just like any anodized colored aluminium, and look raw. Either way, our quads are not really exposed to the elements for that much time, so guessing they dont oxidize that much anyway.
@silkjamfpv
Жыл бұрын
...it would be logical for them to feel smoother with more positions. I love new innovative things.
@davepv9045
Жыл бұрын
Your videos are so easy to dig in and make own thoughts about the content, no harsh movement on the surface that distracts the mind. Thx. On your product page of "your" spry toothpaste, you speak about a low abrasiveness. Do you have a RDA number to compare it to others? Greetings from Switzerland.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I don't have an RDA number unfortunately and the grit number for the dentifrice isn't standardized properly unfortunately.
@spikester
Жыл бұрын
Pretty cool, the dual magnets will certainly smooth out noise & vibration in cinebuilds especially.
@spikester
Жыл бұрын
The logical solution would be slanted+concave magnets but until those finally get mass produced in every flavour imaginable they will never come cheap in low volume.
@piefpv3233
Жыл бұрын
Request Please: can you do a run of that emerald green that the old motors came in? I have a set and really love that colour.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I will find out how that might work because I think we can do really small batches of motor bells in all sorts of colors, especially The anodized colors
@daviddavids2884
Жыл бұрын
information you may know: a typical electric (inrunner) motor is always loaded via reduction/Mechanical Advantage (MA). in contrast, an outrunner motor is usually loaded via fractional/negative MA. ( compare the radius at which the force is produced (in a motor) to the radius at which the load occurs, at the prop/rotor. )
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
The long hand way to explain that gears are smaller than props. That being so, the diameter of the motor isn't necessarily indicative of it's torque. Usually 1mm more magnet height is FAR more beneficial than 1mm more diameter.
@flyingwithtofu
Жыл бұрын
Thanks for sharing your findings, I have ordered a set of the 28mm to replace my existing 2809 from another manufacturer. It would have been great if some of these high vis colors were also available in the larger bells. Looking forward to experiencing these new motors.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Usually these larger motors are used by videographers. That's why we don't opt for crazy colors. Just doesn't look professional and may even show up on camera. I still may make some hot pink bells. The hot pink looks beautiful
@flyingwithtofu
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab That's entirely fine, there must be more than 1 professional look though. I would have opted for a plain unpainted silver bell, or a colored trim like the T-motor 2808/2812. It's already all black on these larger builds, a little personalization would go a long way. My 1 cent, thanks.
@2tekno77
Жыл бұрын
Barbie motors!!!
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
swear it was just a coincidence but I didn't actually realize that until I read your comment.
@xymaryai8283
Жыл бұрын
now Oppenheimer motors! XD
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@xymaryai8283 I'm unsure what the color of ☠️ is 😔. (Good story content, good acting, boring movie.)
@CarbonGlassMan
Жыл бұрын
It took almost 2 years but I finally broke one of your 2203 motors on my Fouride quad. Had to replace it with a StanFPV 2203 motor though. The FPV cycle motors were not in stock at the time.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Unfortunate that Stan took my design to TMotor and ripped me off. Never nice to lose friends like that.
@CarbonGlassMan
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab Oh wow. I never heard of the name or brand, I just seen it was the same size and close to the same KV. It is frustrating to have your personal design copied. Anyway, the FPVcycle motor broke because of a hard crash into a parking lot. It broke 2 arms on my Fouride frame and one of the bells separated when it went from circle to oval. So, the failure was not a motor failure. It was a blunt force trauma failure.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@CarbonGlassMan blunt force trauma is deadly to all sorts of organisms 😂
@fenrer1
Жыл бұрын
wouldn't split shifted magnets require directional motors? like cw and ccw would need the shift in a different direction? did i miss something?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
No. It's not directional in any way. The stator poles don't know and don't care what orientation the bell magnets are in
@MANDOXsquid
Жыл бұрын
So are these manufactured by rcinpower?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Correct. We work with RCinpower exclusively at this point. They have been excellent since the beginning
@MCsCreations
Жыл бұрын
It's difficult to find a better fabricator than them. They've been kicking *ss.
@PetrolMediaInc
Жыл бұрын
Can’t wait to try it out
@HolmesHobbies
Жыл бұрын
Your findings of "should do this" not working as expected is because motors don't always follow simulations and it's much easier to screw it up than it is to improve the magnetics. It has nothing to do with the length or diameter, it's all about tooth shape, airgap, magnet shape, and magnet coverage. Skew and stagger will decrease motor efficiency and torque in 100% of the cases. Unless it's designed outside of regular parameters like super low magnet coverage or other silly choices. Or extreme detent force causing excessive unloaded amp draw, which is normally poor magnet coverage choices combined with delta terminating.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
In this case it does essentially nothing but does increase throttle feel
@___echo___
Жыл бұрын
really cool, I recently saw newbeedrones bonded magnet motor (the smoov) and got me thinking, with the bonded magnet all you would need to do is cut it in half and shift it for the same effect, or even cut it in 3 rings or even more??? but I guess other merits like durability aren as sought after with quads that size. That, and I wonder if the tradeoff of efficiency would be worth it.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
The smoox was intesting but magnets like that are generally much lower strength and so the efficiency and power of that motor was very limited. The split shifted magnets that we're doing now are considerably more difficult to manufacture and they are a bit more efficient on average while generating about the same power.
@JPspinFPV
Жыл бұрын
Awesome, I'm a big fan of repairing my gear.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Absolutely. This throw away culture is ridiculous
@genesisfpv
Жыл бұрын
So excited to see the best result of these experiments.. Feel like These motors are going to charge our cells soon 😅😁
@LehtusBphree2flyFPV
Жыл бұрын
Can we get reflective material motors so if you lose it, you can find it with a flashlight near Dawn or at night easier I LOVE that split magnet bell
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
The motors aren't what are going to light up in that situation. Some sort of a beeper is still the best tech we've got for things like this. Someone could probably write a script such that the controller could triangulate the position since pretty much all Rx's now have good telemetry...
@dingusmagee3326
Жыл бұрын
Building my first fpv quad, and just decided to use bobs 22.6 motors based on the info he supplied on the product page for them, and the gemfan 51433 props. All before Bob made a video about them or any reviews had been posted hahah I trust kebab enough, I'm fuckin pumped to throw this thing together. Just need Batts, charger, and soldering materials now.
@JPREEDY77
Жыл бұрын
The revolution (no pun intended) will come in a novel stator pattern .
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Been trying to get axial flux off the ground for years...
@LowetheTechGuy
Жыл бұрын
I gotta have some hot pink! Also, aluminum doesn't rust, it may oxidize eventually but not rust except on steel. Aluminum oxidation is a central part of it's corrosion resistance due to it's high affinity for oxygen. It also depends on environment, the purity of aluminum and the presence of other substances.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yeah it doesn't explicitly rust but without anodization or paint, it's supposed to oxidize and sort of rust....but doesn't unless it's exposed to quite a bit of salt water in my experience or some other ion heavy solution in a liquid medium.
@duderguy1571
Жыл бұрын
I love the 1s 13mm motors. Can we get bells with spokes not quite so thin? I feel like the og teal 13mm were tougher though i only have the 5000kv. Limboing drainage ditches with pipes running across has its moments 😥😂. But i love the ability to purchase just the bells as that's usually all that's needed. Cheers 🐝
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yeah next batch we'll make them a bit thicker or maybe just add spokes.
@miketech2
Жыл бұрын
Cool shit
@Wheelieking619
Жыл бұрын
I’m loving those colors \!/
@Skylionfpv
Жыл бұрын
just here to say that 2803 motor also works on 5s 6" just fine I still fly them on my flosstyle from time to time when I get out to fly
@terminsane
Жыл бұрын
finally some cool motor colors
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
The pink was super hard to get looking right. Was well worth it.
@JuicyJ_FPV
Жыл бұрын
I was going to buy the T-MOTOR VELOX but mostly because they are CHEAP AF 14$ a piece. Mainly because in alot of manufacturers these days you can't even get replacement bells (witch is what I mess up on motors) Then I saw this video and I think you sold me in your one comment about "selling bells separately" because EVERYONE should.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I don't know why it took so long for even us to do this. I wanted to do it years ago. I actually think it should go a step further and we should standardize shaft lengths. That way you can choose any stator size base and choose the appropriate bell of your liking. All 2306 bells will fit all 2306 stators as long as the shaft matches. Almost all shafts are now 4mm diameter so pretty easy to just choose a length standard or at least list shaft length from the underside of the bell top to the end of shaft.
@jeff2633
Жыл бұрын
The split shifted magnets sound like they would work good for RC crawler trucks if it has better low end control?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
It's supposed to have more low end torque. I can't feel any of that in the air. Might be able to be felt on something spinning slower but I can't speak of it. I would expect there to already be RC car motors with designs like this but I haven't looked.
@carbonEYE007
Жыл бұрын
That tester always says that there is no noticeable distinction between your motors and others I knew he was off on that assessment long ago. It’s bad that he and the other guy couldn’t tell. I noticed that your last batch , the first with shifted magnets were the best yet. Most anyone serious in the hobby knows the best motors and development are at fpv cycle
@HolmesHobbies
Жыл бұрын
It feels like more throttle resolution because it reduces the motor reactance. It makes the motor softer on response. Aka weaker. I've never seen a skewed or staggered construction be a better motor unless it's strictly feel or harmonics issue being addressed. Or if the origional design is very poor in some factor.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Different applications have different need. In this case it was supposed to increase the average torture which it probably did, just no real value in that aspect
@MysteryD
Жыл бұрын
My v3 25mm Imperials have taken many many impacts, but still sound and perform like new. That said, I'm not sure I'll ever need new motors. They will not die.
@ChrisHarmon1
Жыл бұрын
Gonna wait for the axial flux motors 😮
@infiniteefpv
Жыл бұрын
Anodization on aluminum bell can make the bell harder to ding. Anodization can increase hardness depending on the type
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Not in our use case as far as my experience goes.
@KelvinFPV
Жыл бұрын
It sounds like 2 smaller motors vs 1 larger motor spinning 1 prop? After thinking more about it, its the equivilent to more poles.
@gloorfpv1801
Жыл бұрын
That’s pretty neat
@paulhope3401
Жыл бұрын
Interesting idea... it would be great to be able to compare the overlapped magnet idea to stators with vertical at the shaft morphing into diagonal 'paralelogram' shape at the ends instead. Too much work for non guaranteed gains?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
That is the ideal way to go, just expensive to manufacture
@Wheelieking619
Жыл бұрын
Every video you release, somewhere a textbook has become obsolete (probably).
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
😂 thanks but unlikely. Maybe in dentistry since those textbooks are often confused on their own and directly contradict each other
@butterflyfpv
Жыл бұрын
Great Video and work KababFPV!😃 I have to admit that I didn't quite understand everything because my eyelids closed in between😜But something that would be very interesting for Tinywhoop motors would be the better throttle resolution or the easier handling of throttle with split shifted magnets. If the split shifted magnets would help with that in any way, that would be very nice. That would be a game changer. (as well as throttle MID to 0 and throttle expo to 30-70% was a game changer for me when flying tiny whoop) However, tiny whoop motors are always high kv motors. In any case, I would be happy if you were able to build 1S motors with Chinese manufacturers again at some point. Especially also ultra light 702 802 1002 motors for whoops. I'm looking forward to your next video :-)
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Ooh it's hard enough to make those tiny motors as is. There's no reasonable way to adjust the magnet design like this in such a tiny motor and still be able to manufacture it at scale
@butterflyfpv
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab Ok I understand. To hard to manufacture..
@HolmesHobbies
Жыл бұрын
Looking at the stagger i can see some design problems that explain your poorer results. Your magnet width is too wide for full pitch stagger without overlap. So now you have a generous portion of magnet that is fighting each other and shorting to thr opposite magnet instead of flowing through the stator!
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
The overlap is not flipped polarity. There is no polarity overlap
@HolmesHobbies
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab must be parallax in the thumbnail then. Corners touching, there will still be generous flux leakage between those touching opposites. I'd recommend a reduction of magnet coverage if you wanted to further test. It already a little high for a delta and the stagger reaching full pitch will cause recirculating current. Magnetics is my specialty, feel free to reach out if you want to further the project and bounce ideas around!
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@HolmesHobbies that is very interesting. I didn't realize that at all. You're right, the fields are likely recirculating and it's counter productive. The stator poles should then be narrower.....so the magnetic pitch being wider makes sense.....but still shouldn't quite be overlapped so closely. Interesting.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@HolmesHobbies happen to have a FB or something? Maybe you could help with my understanding of axial flux and various induction properties.
@HolmesHobbies
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab shared my website, look in moderated comments.
@prottentogo
Жыл бұрын
wait.. generally speaking these spacers could also go underneath the bottom bearing? I thought it was to lift the bell up a tiny bit (and it being at the bottom wouldn't do that right?). what slack will it take off then? are bell threads too short or something? I actually don't get it. 🙃
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
It's sort of vestigial because the rubber O ring pretty much makes the 0.2mm spacer moot. It used to be a washer to keep the screw from backing out too easily under the friction of various things. At least that's how I know it as.
@AerialWaviator
Жыл бұрын
Curious, were any experiments preformed with configuring the ESC's differently for use with the split-shifted magnet motors? Mentioned in the video is the number of pole positions (8:11, with manual rotation) is a doubled notch feel with the split-shifted bell, so wondering if configuring the ESC for 2x the number of poles would change any performance characteristics like torque, rpm response, or efficiency.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Kiss has their sine wave ESC which should be the most appropriate match for this motor but it also shouldn't matter a whole lot either. The benefits should still be obvious without any effort like that. The ESC also wouldn't do anything differently if it was told there were 2x the number of magnets. It still just sees one magnetic field per pole. Technically there isn't 2x the poles anyway because that would mean there would be 2x the flip from N to S polarity
@IvanEfimovLimon
Жыл бұрын
All of that could be measured if desired.... Motor rpm resolution is not an exception :) would love to see some data. Interesting idea for sure tho
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
MQTB has had the motors for a while. Hopefully he'll get around to tests soon.
@mr-huggy
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab You should get some to Chris Rosser for him to test with his setup.
@4helixFPV
Жыл бұрын
Thanks for sharing this information!! Where can I found the complete graph? I'll build a 6inch long range soon and I would like to see which engines to choose
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
You're right. I should post the graph on our site. No idea why I haven't already. I'll put it up shortly and send you a link here. It'll still just be an image so won't be workable but definitely useful to see how things pan out. Thanks for pointing out my thoughtlessness.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
here you go d97lag4vjfzlh8q5-17260511286.shopifypreview.com/blogs/build-guides-and-discussion/motor-chart-vol-vs-surface-area
@4helixFPV
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab don't worry, thank you
@mikebergman1817
Жыл бұрын
Bob, is there any chance you will be doing more of the clean white 25mm bells?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yes definitely. Next batch is coming
@GtFqt
Жыл бұрын
Really cool products! Just curious, why did you choose a smaller offset on the split shifted magnets and not more of a shift where the gap was centered between the other row of magnets, much like a brick wall? Thanks.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Because then there would be no way to distinguish one flux field from the next. That's not totally true, it can be distinguished, but you ideally want a smooth transition. There should not be much need to overlap magnetic fields from one set of magnets to the next
@GtFqt
Жыл бұрын
Very cool, thanks for the explanation!
@tc-fpv3621
Жыл бұрын
When will 25mm 2150kv be back in stock? White or high vis? Might switch over to Wasp stator size motor but need to switch to 6s.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
For now we're not planning on restocking the 2150kv because it was so unpopular. The new batch is in progress in white/yellow for likely 2-3mo delivery. Manufacturing is sllllooowwww these days unfortunately
@gus8378
Жыл бұрын
What is that white canopy? Is it possible to get it somewhere? I’m designing a canopy and recently got the idea of splitting it in two to reduce mass and weight like this. Nice to see it out there
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
White canopy is from the emax tinyhawk III. I have a video on that coming around September
@TysPOVs
Жыл бұрын
I've been following for years, You've actually sent me extra full motors when I bent a drum. I can answer many of the manufacturing questions you had. 3:11-3:16 - that washer is not to take up slack. It equivelizes the magnetic field between the magnets;;; the reason the color stinks on motors is that color is like painting a picture - gravity, and color changes weight.; if you leave it hanging it falls. if you spin it then you get technicolor. either way the color is not a good way to measure performance.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
The washer is said to do lots but it's really minimal in reality and it's also pretty much nullified by the rubber O ring
@djs134
Жыл бұрын
What canopy is that on the tp3 in the background? I’m looking for a better hdzero canopy and maybe that’s it?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Its the tinyhawk III canopy. something I'm working on and will have a video out around September. Good eye to catch it
@user-yk1cw8im4h
Жыл бұрын
which flight controller would u recommend these days for a 1-2s tp3 build?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
There's nothing I know of that does 1s-2s well. I would look to jemchu and see what they've got. I've had good experiences with their boards
@JbVest
Жыл бұрын
Has this already been done with the flying wing motors that are typically longer and skinnier?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I'm not sure about that but that sounds like a very appropriate application for this design. I believe for a consistent RPM level, you can achieve higher efficiency in the mid-range. It just doesn't work for us multirotor pilots because we spend most of our time at a very low throttle and just zip to max occasionally
@_.kvng.ky_1081
9 ай бұрын
Alright sooooo I need 1 or the other 😂 well first let me ask are you discontinuing the 23mm Tall motor for these? If so can I request these in a white color too, I use all your motors from your 13mm and up and have them and white and love all my stuff to match or… hear me out can I get that raw finish in the 13mm? 😂
@Kabab
9 ай бұрын
Check the site now. We have the 22.6mm motor with 12x12 M2 mounting base. This is literally the best all around 5" motor as far as I'm concerned and I believe the largest motor out there on the 12x12 M2 mount
@fpvgiggles
Жыл бұрын
Very cool!
@Skylionfpv
Жыл бұрын
Also who was that blurry toothpick in the back???
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
It's coming in a video around the end of September apparently
@thewhitedillard
Жыл бұрын
@kabab what timing do you run with these split shift magnets in BLheli_32?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Nothing needed.
@JoeA12212
Жыл бұрын
Not sure if I missed it or not but does the split shift mags affect the rpm filter? Or timing?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
na, doesn't affect anything like that. The back EMF seems to be a bit less but I didn't measure that much. I focus more on if it's actually useful to continue investigating for our use case before I look at all the other side effects. So far I've found that it's not very useful but the 25mm motor is a specific use case that has little to no downside with a reasonable up side for the added cost to manufacture.
@theflyinggrip
Жыл бұрын
Are the 23mm short motors going to be coming back into stock anytime soon? I have a new cinesplore that needs some motors, lol...I dig the hott pink. Cheers!
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yes. Unfortunately about 2mo. Manufacturing is heeelllllaaaaa slow these days but they're coming back in unibell so they'll be super slick
@WEEBER13
Жыл бұрын
Hell yes
@theflyinggrip
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab That's great to hear!
@ChrisGripeos
Жыл бұрын
I purchased 6 Ethix cinerats motors, but noticed that 2 of those have almost zero "nochiness" while the others ones are pretty nochy. They seem to fly okay on my 3" quad, but should I be worried ?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
No need to worry. The Ethix motors generally use pretty weak magnets and a moderate air gap on purpose. This is also a way to smooth out the flux field and further reduce back EMF. You do lose a considerable amount of power and a fair bit of efficiency, but the motor becomes super problem free and the throttle control is excellent because of the reduced power. I know chris rosser has totally wrecked the Ethix motor in terms of performance but charts are just charts. They don't mean all that much. For the use case and expected flying envelope, the Ethix motor is perfect and there's nothing else like it on the market.......motors used to be built that way in ~2012-2015, it's essentially just a motor from that timeline.
@ChrisGripeos
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab thanks man!
@keylitho
Жыл бұрын
Hey I love the 25mm Motors... I have purchased the last 2 versions.. I would like to know If I just buy the Uni bells will it fit on my motors that came with the "NOT unibell" bell..?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yes the unibell will fit on everything except the original batch that had a drawn line around the bell. Not the split bell gap.
@keylitho
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab Are you going to have the Raw finsh for the 25mm Motor..?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@keylitho so far the only colors for the 25mm will be dark grey and white. We may add colors but not sure for now.
@keylitho
Жыл бұрын
@@KababSo not Grey, Yellow and the Pink Coming soon.. Like is says on the site..? And there is no option for White.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@keylitho oops, you got me :-D, they're coming, just gonna take time to manufacture
@dennismatovich8411
Жыл бұрын
Thank you, great info. Do you think the 2812 size can be used for a 7" chase build? really trying for 120+ mph
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
yeah I think that's an appropriate size. The Kv and prop selection is going to be important however and will take some testing to fine tune. I would also aim for 8S if you can. It'll give you more oomph to maintain speed for a bit longer. I'd guess something like 1100-1200kv on 8S
@dennismatovich8411
Жыл бұрын
thank you for the fast response!!!@@Kabab
@dennismatovich8411
Жыл бұрын
Here is the link for the edf jet chase used 2812 1300kv 7x5x3 hq props xl8 frame kzitem.info/news/bejne/sYGDmZd7n4VnooI@@Kabab
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@dennismatovich8411 that is impressive. Keeping up with at times a swept wing med size model for 3 min is not easy. Also, you made your video 'safe for kid's on KZitem which turns off the comments on it.
@neilfpv
Жыл бұрын
What aluminum type is the bell specifically the number?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
7075 aluminum or otherwise the highest grade Chinese manufacturing of this sort of product work with.
@neilfpv
Жыл бұрын
Awesome!@@Kabab saving up for it Bob!
@chrisbee5481
Жыл бұрын
If rcinpower manufactures them for you, why can't you make a deal with them, to sell them alongside with rcinpower motors, worldwide outside the US? I'd love to get them in europe. Shipping and tax from the US is too expensive. Amazing how you get your motors so light. Lighter than rcinpower makes their own. What's the trade off ? Durability ?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
The motors aren't particularly light. We aim more for durability than weight savings. Some of the designs are generally lighter because of the component selection....smaller bearings, mounting patterns and whatnot. Regarding world wide distribution, wish we could but we would need to work with someone like banggood or AliExpress on something like that. We absolutely would if we could figure out a way to check their work and prevent 'miscalculations'. I completely understand the frustration and we are far more frustrated about it.
Жыл бұрын
send em off to chris rosser and he'll explain why you are incorrect lol
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I'd love to but I'm allergic to people that can't see beyond their own arrogance. He has improved with experience in the industry and I do appreciate that but still a ways to go. Smart guy with an unfortunately constricted view of the world. I comment on him because I speak from personal experience. I'm not perfect in any imaginable way myself and have absolutely been an arrogant prick of a guy in the past. I hate myself for it and hope to maintain my awareness to save myself from my own ignorance. I also sent the last normal magnet 25mm bells I had to MQTB and the other sets to my 'test pilot' that shall remain unnamed out of respect so I couldn't send him good comparison motors if I wanted to.
@mengleelim1054
Жыл бұрын
Does that mean that if I have a rcin power wasp motor and wish to purchase these bells, they will fit?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yes it will fit however the shaft will be long so you'll need a bunch of spacers out the bottom. Also, it's not helpful from a performance standpoint. I think the wasp was 22.6x5 but then became 22.6x6.5. It's not that big of a impact to performance (very unlikely for anyone to be able to tell from flying) but just something to keep in mind. Also, have you tried to get your wasp bells off? It takes some doing and the top bearing usually comes out and gets stuck on the shaft. This is a major change we made that rcinpower was super resistant to. The best way to get the bell off that I have found is to thread a longer screw 3/4 way into the shaft, stick your hex driver in and hammer the driver to pop the bell off. It takes some hard hits. Also make sure the motor is screwed to a carbon arm for leverage and put the arm/quad in your lap upside down so that you can hammer without hurting the rest of the craft. This is not fun to do.....but then the darn bearing comes out with it.
@mengleelim1054
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab Thanks appreciate the explanation! Haven't tried removing them and gosh it really doesnt sound fun. 😵
@Zerbabilon
Жыл бұрын
It’s a V12 vs a V6 engine brah. 🤙🏻🤙🏻
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Good analogy.
@Greenhairchris
Жыл бұрын
Old school vibes
@daviddavids2884
Жыл бұрын
information 8:08 the reduced gap size (at the stator poles) helps to reduce cogging and cogging-related losses. the use of this low-tech offset magnet configuration 'increases' those affects. 8:36 COGGING. is the 'drag' that occurs when a magnet(s) is aligned with a stator pole(s). cogging is less apparent when a motor is running; but it's still there. specious remark. to the extent that it's possible, the generation of back-emf in a motor is minimized via stator design/materials. 11:05 bla-bla-bla-feels like-bla-bla-bla because there are Two sets of magnetic poles (on the rotor) where there was one set before, the number of cogging positions HAS Doubled.!
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
each 'cog' position has lesser 'drag' however. As a result, the emf peaks are reduced but there are more of them. Generally reduced peaks are easier to deal with as they don't cause as much disruption. I personally didn't measure this and don't really care because the regular magnets run fine too with a decent cap on the ESC. I'm strictly focusing on flight feel because that's really all that matters. Increased stator/magnet gap reduces cogging from my experience. It lets the magnetic fields space out and blend better while also just being less strong at a distance since field strength drops off very quickly at 1/r^3 or something like that.
@olorf
Жыл бұрын
Any EU reseller of these?
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I'm actually not sure. Josh would know. Email fpvcycle from the site.
@Quick-Flash
Жыл бұрын
I wonder how am32 or escape32 would handle it.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Am32 just generally has more torque from low rpm. Same with the split magnets. I don't feel much consistent difference with AM32 vs bl32 in the air. I haven't done a like for like test yet however. Just doesn't seem that different however.
@Quick-Flash
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab If you have any AM32 escs you can fairly easily flash ESCape32 to them. From my experience it feels like it has even more torque than AM32 gives you.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
@@Quick-Flash but is it torque all the way through the rpm range or is it only at low rpm...which is great to get out of trees and whatnot
@Quick-Flash
Жыл бұрын
@@Kabab from feel i don't really know, haha. Haven't done any real data logging to see what its doing.
@slappomatthew
Жыл бұрын
why do you hate 5" 4s. it was THE standard for many years.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I don't hate it at all. I just don't see a point when all our electronics are comfortable with 6S. 4S was the standard because we couldn't support 6S. Not because it was particularly good or anything. As long as you're not racing around at high speeds, 4S is great and more efficient.
@decompyler
Жыл бұрын
Totally perplexing how anyone involved in this hobby would ask how you put the motor together. If you have to ask that question, maybe this hobby isn't for you.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
I don't like to make anyone feel bad but I was genuinely surprised by that one. More than one person too. 🤷🏻♂️
@TechTimeElectronics
Жыл бұрын
Dude you got way too many different Motors and not enough consistency man. I'm sure everyone including myself appreciate the level of commitment but you have Motors that are discontinued after one or two batches the people are stuck with three motors that work and can't get anymore. I don't get it
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
What motor? We have only discontinued one motor line which isn't even discontinued, just had low demand. That was the 2104 motor. The 23mm short functions the same as the 2104 so it didn't seem logical to maintain that entire line because it's 1g per motor lighter. Otherwise, the looks might change but the line is still the same.
@alperenozgur
Жыл бұрын
i like many fpvcycle stuff but cant buy them. because we have %50 customs tax for packages from USA and China 😂
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
Yeah the world wide environment of products is absolutely ridiculous. Frustrating
@josephrsalexander4589
Жыл бұрын
Hi kebab - you want to help everyone - produce a custom drone beraing press thatt makes it super easy to replace bearings. I race and always replace my bells - I hate replacing bearings - I damage them 1:5 that I replace - I'm not sure if I'm buying bad bearings or breaking them. Yo make a custom press and sell high quality bearing - I bet bearings are the missing link for efficiency - there is so much quality variations for bearing - stainless, ceramic, sealed etc.
@Kabab
Жыл бұрын
The issue with bearings is that they're small. There's very little we can do about that. Increasing their size helps a bit but also adds significant weight to the motor with the only real benefit being that they'll hold up to just a tiny bit more punishment, not a lot more. They're really super easy to replace now so just buy a bag of them from anywhere and pop them in whenever you need if you need...
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