There is a precedent for multiple officers with the rank of Captain in navies. An aircraft carrier will be commanded by a Captain, the executive officer is often a Captain, the commander of the embarked air wing will be a Captain, the chief engineer may be a Captain, and if serving as a flagship there’s likely to be a Captain or two on the Admiral’s staff.
@talideon
3 жыл бұрын
Those are captains in different divisions, mind, and ultimately subordinate to the ship's commander. The movie-era ship of captains was incredibly silly.
@andrewtaylor940
3 жыл бұрын
Do any aircraft carriers set to sea anymore without at least one Vice Admiral aboard in charge of the Task Force?
@MaxRawhide
3 жыл бұрын
Regarding the commander of the air wing, aren't those air force ranks? If so, an air force captain is not the same rank as a naval captain. A naval captain = air force colonel, while a air force captain = naval lieutenant
@markwilson3697
3 жыл бұрын
@@MaxRawhide no. the Navy pilots and the US Marine pilots who make up the air wing of a carrier use the same insignia but each branches naming structure. A Marine Captain is the same as a Naval Lieutenant. Insignia is the Double bar.
@Mortlupo
3 жыл бұрын
@@talideon Actually the Captains on the Admiral's staff are not part of the Carrier's crew and not subordinate to the ship's commander, in fact the ship's commander answers to the Admiral aboard. The Air Wing has a somewhat strange relationship to the carrier's captain as they both answer to him and are separate commands.
@lucianoduarte891
3 жыл бұрын
"Ensigns were on the job training for three years" *Harry Kim intensifies*
@valhar2000
3 жыл бұрын
It made sense for Janeway not to promote him: there was nowhere to promote him to. Kim should have been promoted very quickly after they got back to Earth, though.
@brendaneichler5244
3 жыл бұрын
@@valhar2000 Not really. We see that by Picard’s time, Helm was a Lt JG’s billet. He’s far too junior to have that job, so a brevet promotion (which we *did* see Janeway do, btw) or reassignment was in order.
@purefoldnz3070
3 жыл бұрын
@@valhar2000 What do you mean nowhere? Just give him a higher rank same post lol.
@valhar2000
3 жыл бұрын
@@purefoldnz3070 And then what? Janeway promotes all her officers to Commander, and promotes herself to Admiral?
@purefoldnz3070
3 жыл бұрын
@@valhar2000 why does she need to promote all her officers when one gets a promotion? lol
@tyler4418
3 жыл бұрын
Starfleet, as well as the ranking system, is based on the the US Navy. It's actually not unusual for their to be multiple Captains on ships. I served on the Eisenhower, an aircraft carrier with about 5000 sailors. The Commanding Officer was obviously a Captain, but so was the XO. There was a Captain at the head of medical, and a few other departments. As well as the head of the some of the many airwings we had on board. So the Enterprise having multiple Captains serving onboard is well within believability.
@whirledpeaz5758
3 жыл бұрын
Did Ike still bite? '88 Med Cruise.
@tyler4418
3 жыл бұрын
@@whirledpeaz5758 bite, like it sucked to be there? Yeah it did lol, but it had its good moments. I was there from 2012-15. Our douchebag CMC secured the E-4 and below smoke pit for 2 weeks mid deployment once. Those were dark times.... 😂😂
@Orca19904
3 жыл бұрын
And now in the 25th century of STO, everyone and their brother in both Starfleet and the Romulan Republic is a Fleet Admiral now, and the Klingon Empire is stuffed to bursting with Dahar Masters. :P
@MandalorV7
3 жыл бұрын
I do get the need for levels in game but I don’t think your game level should be tied to your character’s rank in story. Most likely Hale would be a captain for good ten years or more before advancing.
@RainMakeR_Workshop
3 жыл бұрын
There are provisional ranks too with their own insignia. There is also the Fleet Captain rank with 5 pips that is below Commodore and above Captain. There are also other departments within Starfleet with their own rank structures. Such as Deputy Director Sloan from Internal Affairs who had 4 pips with a bar underneath the pips (though he was really from Section 31).
@jonathanwebster7091
Жыл бұрын
Fleet Captain is historically an appointment in the real life Royal Navy and US Navy-its the officer in command of an Admiral's flagship.
@snowts
3 жыл бұрын
I was expecting the ending 'goodbye' to be replaced with a 'dismissed' or 'as you were' :)
@johnbockelie3899
3 жыл бұрын
Commodore , insane rank between Captain and Admiral.. Why Star Fleet dropped it.
@jacara1981
3 жыл бұрын
Typically Commanders were assigned the role over over seeing Starbases or outposts, while if they serve on a starship it was under a Captain. It appears that Captain Sisko was unusual in starfleet. As normally once promoted he would of been given a ship command instead of a station command. He might have special circumstances like the fact defiant is stationed there and he is the Emissary making him hard if not impossible to replace as the ranking officer.
@jeffumbach
3 жыл бұрын
True, and he wasn't promoted to Captain until he had the Defiant for an entire season.
@oldtwinsna8347
2 жыл бұрын
He had a very small staff at the beginning of the series, as the station wasn't considered a choice assignment and had limited operational duties. Essentially just to oversee getting Bajor back on its feet and ultimately into Federation membership. But that changed right off the bat with the wormhole discovery and relocation of DS9 to serve as an incoming ship repair facility and trading station for the Gamma quadrant. So right there he doubled his staff. Then the staff ballooned a lot more when the Defiant was stationed as it would require a full time ready crew to be based on the station itself, not to mention far more extra security personnel to aid against a new Dominion threat. Increasing staff would warrant a higher pay grade.
@thegodkingalex
3 жыл бұрын
As I recall, there was the rank of Ensign, Junior Grade, with the insignia of a single black dot, as well as Commodore, with the insignia of five gold dots, during the “Next Generation” era.
@xaviermiranda5529
3 жыл бұрын
Ranks on actual naval vessels : I'm going to use more internation ranks vs. the ones used in the US. Each rank in most navies have 3 levels of Lieutenant and 3 levels of Captain. So a Frigate Captain is closer to an O-5 vs a Corvette Captain being closer to O-4 Commander. Similarly, since the LT is the XO of each ship, a Frigate LT is closer to an O-3 LT vs the Corvette LT being an O-2 This also goes with section heads. Usually each section has only one officer commanding each section plus their CPO as enlistend liason to the rest of the department. A Corvette will have the equivalent of Ensigns while a Frigate and above will have an LT JG leading it. So if we used proper ranks to the crew of the Enterprise, you would have O-6 Captain plus O-5 First Officer O-4 LTCMDR in key positions such as the section heads that form the bridge crew. These would be different than depicted. Worf wouldn't be the chief of security since he is the weapons officer and chief tactician. Engineering would definitely have an O-4 as its head 3-4 LTs leading certain sections within Engineering. O-3 LT leading most sections outside of engineering, Some O-2s might lead some sections as well. But O-1s, in the Flag ship? Unlikely. Navigation, the helm, most nurses, and pretty much everyone else would be enlisted. In Sickbay you would have the Chief Medical Officer handling the leadership duties plus admin, probably a few O-4 or O-3 as physician's assitants, head nurses, and other medical roles in each of the three sickbays (since they have over 1000 on board, which means pediatricians, psychiatrists, etc). No ship's counselor and if there was one, it would likely be a whole civilian team.
@ericmadsen7470
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the breakdown of Starfleet ranks and responsibilities.
@Stephen-Fox
2 жыл бұрын
I do 'love' how subtle the distinction between ensign and commodore is on some of the rank insignia systems.
@pebmets
3 жыл бұрын
IMO the Rank pins used in ST II-VI, 2280-2360s, were the best. I thought the magnificent maroon uniforms were the best and the pins were a nice complement to them.
@kaitlyn__L
2 жыл бұрын
Yes!
@SidneyBroadshead
3 жыл бұрын
Warrant Officers and junior officers are addressed by superior officers as "Mister" regardless of gender. *Wesley Crusher was formally addressed as "Mister Crusher" when he was an Acting Ensign and Cadet. *There is a ST:OS novel in which Kirk is broken down to Commander and the Admiral now commanding the _Enterprise_ refers to him as "Mister Kirk". *There is an episode of ST:NG in which Riker addresses a female subordinate as Mister.
@kennyfordham6208
3 жыл бұрын
I believe that Starfleet has a superfluous amount of commissioned officers. So much so that commissioned officers would do such mundane jobs as helmsman, radio operator, equipment maintenance, etc; jobs that would normally be done by low-ranking enlisted men.
@oldtwinsna8347
2 жыл бұрын
Indeed. They have teetered into this topic on the shows but it's like they were singular episodes that didn't really carry forward much momentum. In reality, we'd be seeing a lot of enlisted folks on the bridge doing the actual inputs while the officers stand around.
@lovellhawes2175
3 жыл бұрын
Commodore is basically admiral in training kind of rank. It was dropped from the USN which is what starfleet is based on. So, when dropped IRL, it was dropped in trek. There is other parts of this video that line up with real world military ranks and titles. For example, in the USMC, I saw Lance Corporals lead fire teams over Corporals before. Lcpl being E-3 in pay grade and Cpl being E-4. This was based on the billet system. The official ranking structure goes Billet (job title) over rank, rank over time in grade, time in grade over time in service, then whichever takes charge of the situation. There are times where even an E-3 can out rank a high officer even. In a briefing or training situation for example the E-3 is considered an extension of the Commandant's will, the Commandant being the highest ranking Marine. I have had this privilege once or twice as an instructor. Training a bunch of POGs on the M240 medium machine gun for instance. While I was training Marines as high as a Staff Sargent, they all had to listen to what I said, despite being a freshly promoted Lance Corporal at the time. I even got an opportunity to correct a Corporal who did not listen to instruction and almost broke my M240. Another case in which a Marine can be an extension of higher ranking Marine is while on Sentry duty or fire watch. Then, the Marine is an extension of the Battalion Commander. Thus the unofficial 13th general order is "I will walk my post flank to flank, I won't take sh*t from any rank."
@napke8571
3 жыл бұрын
Commander is by FAR the best rank! Nearly the same authority as the captain, command the whole crew, go on away missions and have the most beautiful women :)
@jb03hf
3 жыл бұрын
Commodore historically is a rank for just as you say - a commander of a group of captains on a specific mission - called a squadron. When the squadron is disbanded, they go back to captain. Basically it is a Brevert rank which gives them localized control for the group. When the mission is over, they have control as a captain.
@jonathanwebster7091
Жыл бұрын
It's also still a (permanent, since 1993) rank in the present-day Royal Navy.
@amethyst7084
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for this video - really well explained. It would be good to hear of the other more 'special forces' type ranks, like the MACOs of ST:ENT and the positioning of Colonel West in Star Trek VI: The Undiscovered Country. It seems at different times, there were more militaristic roles which were attached to Star Fleet. Oh, and how about the ranking of Section 31? 👏🏾👏🏾
@42ndLife
Жыл бұрын
Hey, I really enjoyed this video. Any chance you'll do the enlisted ranks soon? I'd really like to see that.
@Pokemc0831
3 жыл бұрын
STO has so many "admirals" that I would like to know how you explain it.
@brodriguez11000
3 жыл бұрын
That would be the, "make 'em feel special so they don't leave" position. Corporations do that.
@Pokemc0831
3 жыл бұрын
@@brodriguez11000 playing through the story of STO I would be more scared if I wasn't in the captain's seat of my ship. Shit goes down in STO.
@Corbomite_Meatballs
3 жыл бұрын
Because it's supposed to be "your" story, focused on your character...you're not supposed to notice thousands of other FA's flying around in all those other ships.
@Stilgarsan
3 жыл бұрын
Admiral Kirk did not regularly command his own flagship. He only held command on two occasions. In Star Trek: TMP, during the V'Ger incident, where he "coaxed it out of Starfleet" (I think Bones said something along these lines) And in Wrath of Khan, where he commanded an Enterprise full of Cadets, mostly because Spock stepped aside for his old friend. After their return (which happened in The Search for Spock if we want to be pedantic about it, but still is the same occasion as in Wrath of Khan) he never again officially held command as an Admiral.
@TheMrPeteChannel
3 жыл бұрын
Scotty was Engineering Captain. Spock was Sciences Captain and second in command while Kirk was Captain of all aboard.
@rakwraithraiser7315
3 жыл бұрын
I was literally thinking about this
@AidestheKiwi
3 жыл бұрын
Never doubt the almighty algorithm.
@mothafraker
2 жыл бұрын
There are some aircraft carriers the US Navy with as many as 4 officers on board with the rank of Captain. The CO and XO, the CAG and Deputy CAG(DCAG). Although in the case of the latter two they while the may serve aboard the carrier they typically aren't attached to the ship's complement.
@zexhavok1027
3 жыл бұрын
There is a Commodore in TNG Series. On a Computer Display in the episode: "The Conspiracy" Season 1 Episode 25..
@ChateauLonLon
3 жыл бұрын
PIC, which is close to the TNG era, also has a commodore!
@Qardo
Жыл бұрын
Commodore has always been my favorite rank. Even if the rank is just a glorified Captain rank. Just a Captain that commanded over a sector or a small fleet. Plus, it sounds cooler.
@stan690
3 жыл бұрын
I'm just waiting for O'Brian's rank to be explained. It seemed to change (without promotion) in/during TNG and in DS9 (where it stabilised). I'm assuming "chief" is short for chief petty officer but the full term was never used, as far as I recall.
@susanscott8653
2 жыл бұрын
The only title I remember him being given in TNG was Transporter Chief. I assumed he was some sort of specialist. I don't recall there being another Chief. I await being corrected by someone. 😁
@willvgo2950
2 жыл бұрын
There was 1 episode in which Riker referred to O'Brien as LT, which matched his rank pins, but then someone recognized those same rank pins as indicating a CPO.
@oldtwinsna8347
2 жыл бұрын
@@willvgo2950 The early episodes of TNG is easily passed off as they had no idea Colm Meaney was going to be so positively received and so would continue to have him appear in the show fleshing out his character and ultimately permanent cast member for DS9. It was supposed to have just been a one off episode kind of thing. For this, it is easily passed off as costume/script error. Also, the finale of TNG specifically brought forward O'Brien as a Chief to reinforce that is what his character was supposed to have been on the show from the beginning.
@ScaryBaldMan
3 жыл бұрын
The most unrealistic part of Trek's officer rank structure is the fact that almost every time you see a Starfleet vessel it's commanded by someone with the RANK of Captain. In a real navy, only the biggest, most important ships have actual Captains in command. Most other ships are led by ranks below that. They want to give real command experience to officers at lower ranks to develop them for more important commands later. So if applied that philosophy to Trek, you'd never have a Captain commanding an Oberth. That would be a Lt. Cmdr. at most.
@oldtwinsna8347
2 жыл бұрын
Possibly, but space travel is far more dangerous, requiring substantially more experienced technical crew, and the amount of ships compared to the entire population of the Federation is quite limited. Far more limited than sea going vessels. It is entire plausible that ship command is reserved only for those who have proven their worth through advancement in other specialties.
@Moonbeam143
3 жыл бұрын
If you could rank the ranks, what would your top ten ranks be?
@troylowe814
2 жыл бұрын
I couldn't see any ensign with enough nerve to boss Chief O'Brien around. He may not have been commissioned but he was definitely a top honcho on DS9.
@thex-philethackery4330
3 жыл бұрын
They don't call aircraft carriers in the US Navy "bird farms" because of the amount of aircraft they carry. They're called that because of all the Captains (O-6) onboard! CO, XO, RO, CAG, DCAG, Commodore of the DESRON, Strike Group COS, CMO, and the Ops Boss and Air Boss are Captains. Aircraft squadron CO's and XO's are both usually Commanders (O-5) with the XO "fleeting up" when the former CO transfers.
@EtsuMatsuya
3 жыл бұрын
Almost like the writers didn't care about rank, and just winged it for most of the history of Star Trek.
@Mortlupo
3 жыл бұрын
Rodenberry has said Star Fleet wasn't military but has also said it was like the Coast Guard. I would point out that civilians by law cannot "COURT MARSHAL" anyone...the literal term Court Martial comes from Military Courts.
@colwebbsfmc
3 жыл бұрын
@@Mortlupo Kirk also tells the Organians he's "a soldier, not a diplomat" and when asked if the Enterprise is part of the Navy says "we're a combined service." in Tomorrow Is Yesterday.
@curmudgeonextraordinaire1884
3 жыл бұрын
Very true. Harry Kim was ensign, but referred to himself as a senior bridge officer on multiple occasions. Ensigns aren’t senior anything, they are lowest officer and their job is to learn to be an officer. Your not considered a senior officer until O4 at the minimum. That always drived me crazy.
@arthurmoore9488
3 жыл бұрын
@@curmudgeonextraordinaire1884 It's Voyager. The show that either hands out field promotions like crazy or forgets that those are a thing. Heck, they completely forgot they had a science officer.
@TheWoblinGoblin
3 жыл бұрын
I personally think rank seniority has a rather big part. Picard was not promoted to Commodore or Fleet Captain because he didn't need the rank to technically outrank every other captain as he had been promoted at sich a young age. Similarly Kirk,bas he had the most years as captain/Admiral under his belt. Sisko in the war is the exception to that, but was explicitly in admiral Ross's staff and in some way had command of a ship dedicated to large fleet actions, so had in any case some kind of coordination duty (which would boil down to command in battle, depending on Adm. Ross's command style)
@charlesmcleod9285
Жыл бұрын
Truly amazing work. I am impressed beyond words. Thank you so much for doing this commodore McLeod :-)
@CampusBoyFeet
3 жыл бұрын
There is rank and billet. A commander filling a captain's position would be an example. The same with a chief medical officer holding a commander or captains rank. The USMC is a lot like this.
@thomaswagner9875
3 жыл бұрын
This is the traditional Navy officer Ranks in most nations. Basically this is identical to U.S. Navy ranking as opposed to British, French, Japanese, etc Navies. The U.S. has omitted the Commodore rank by splitting the Rear Admiral rank into Rear Admiral (lower half) and (upper half) with the (lower half) filling the Commodore responsibilities. The Fleet Admiral in the U.S. were specially awarded to certain Navy Admirals during World War II. A similar rank was awarded to certain Generals during World War II. Currently, Admiral (or General for other services) is the highest rank available to officer. The British (and other nations) do have one officer as a Fleet Admiral (or Air Marshal or Field Marshal depending on service) but this officer is the equivalent of the U.S. Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. In the U.S. this person remains just an Admiral or General, but is over the military authority for all the services. As far as all ranks, line officers are the officers that command units such as ship or bases. There are many special support officers such as Medical, Supply, etc that use the exact same ranking system, but would command only related groups such as Medical Departments, Hospitals, and certain other non mobile units. Thus doctors (or other support officers) can be Commanders or Captains too, but would not captain a ship. Scotty had had line training before he switched to Engineering so he was eligible to command a ship.
@tassadro
3 жыл бұрын
the ranks that you show are very similar in every way to us navy ranking system. or at least as I understand it when I was in the navy
@curmudgeonextraordinaire1884
3 жыл бұрын
Doctors are never commissioned as Ensigns. The usually get made an O3(LT) rank when they get commissioned. So Basir got short changed as a JG
@jacobsmith8593
3 жыл бұрын
I've been wanting a video like this
@MisterDTwenty
3 жыл бұрын
Great video once again! Hoping to see one about sensor systems some time in the future.
@benw9949
3 жыл бұрын
In Star Trek II: The Wrath of Khan, we get that Lt. Saavik was a graduate student, getting a master's degree. I think this was stated in the novel and never said within the movie why she was a "cadet" (red div. color) but also a "lieutenant" (with rank pins). Nurse Chapel (Head Nurse, apparently an officer) was shown as a lieutenant, as was Lt. Kyle as transporter chief (officer). Dr. Bashir in DS9 was supposed to be right out of the Academy as a Lt. Jr. Grade, bragging about getting his choice of posting at DS9 for "real frontier medicine," and snarked at by Major Kira for his unthinking attitude about it. But for a medical doctor, being an advanced degree, it makes sense he'd be a lieutenant, and presumably Saavik, in heavy science or other training, would have a master's or doctoral degree. (Probably a master's, as a doctorate is never mentioned.) -- Then we get "Acting Ensign" as either a pretend rank or a brevet rank as a field promotion (it's never made clear that I know of) for Wesley Crusher. (This, like all of Wesley's character, should have been better handled by the writers.)
@Mortlupo
3 жыл бұрын
lt. Saavik oddly enough was the only thing they partially did right...As a LT she would be going back to the academy to attend the Command School which would not a a track of study in the academy for cadets but a separate course at the academy for those destined to be ship's commanders i.e. the academy version of a masters degree. The only mistake would be that she would not be called a cadet, that is not a military rank or title but a form of address for those at a service school for commissioned officers (West point, Annapolis, Air Force Academy etc. for the first four yeats) and the correct term would be midshipmen.
@matthewshipley739
3 жыл бұрын
That 'Hello' at the beginning was a lot funnier than it should be 😆
@GroupCaptSlow
Жыл бұрын
Wish you would’ve talked about the rank of Fleet Captain, I can barely find anything online about it and what the role entailed
@gallendugall8913
3 жыл бұрын
well if you'd just shower more you wouldn't have to worry about being rank
@antonsmith9788
3 жыл бұрын
I see what you did there! You little stinker! 😜
@violetlight1548
3 жыл бұрын
I'd love to see Harry Kim make an appearance on Lower Decks ... still, and forever, an ensign. Mariner would probably jokingly call him her hero!
@antcow1239
3 жыл бұрын
*Britishness slips through AHA!!! So your british, i suspected it the whole time!!!
@hellacoorinna9995
3 жыл бұрын
"His British"?
@antcow1239
3 жыл бұрын
@@hellacoorinna9995 Im as baffled as your are!
@willcaputo1
3 жыл бұрын
As far as the standard OF ranks, it's not too far off compared to irl. Although in wartime, it's not unheard of to have even O-2s (LT Jg.) as captains of small craft like Patrol Boats.
@homertipton2102
3 жыл бұрын
Starfleet ranking structure is virtually identical to U.S. Navy command hierarchy. All of the ranks mirror their naval counterparts for both officer and enlisted personnel. As others have correctly stated, it is not uncommon for the commander of the embarked Air Wing on an aircraft carrier to also hold the rank of Captain, as well as other members of the ship's crew, such as doctors. Having served aboard U.S.S. Lincoln at the start of the Iraq War in 2003, we had a two-star Admiral aboard who was, in addition to being the task force commander, the de facto commanding officer of the carrier. The actual Captain performed the day-to-day activities of command, but the Rear Admiral was on-hand to make all of the major decisions relating to the overall mission. A similar situation existed for Kirk and Spock in Star Trek II, where Spock was the actual Captain of the Enterprise but Kirk assumed command at the direction of Starfleet. It can be inferred that Spock's decision to sacrifice himself at the end was primarily motivated by his responsibility as the ship's Captain to do whatever it took to save his vessel and crew, even at the expense of his own life. That said, his serving as Kirk's 1st officer in later movies can be attributed to creative license, but there would have been no reason to demote him from Captain back down to Commander simply because he performed the function of 1st officer. Sulu went on to serve as the Captain of his own vessel by the events of Star Trek VI, so the rank structure still followed naval precedent for most officers, even if not in view on the Enterprise.
@cwell510
2 жыл бұрын
"Admirals fly desks, not ships." So damn true, lol!💯
@TheDolfanar
3 жыл бұрын
I think what is always misunderstood about military “ranks” is how they relate to pay grades IRL. It along with how much $$ in military equipment you’re responsible and how many people and what Type of people you are expected to have authority over. A great show to understand this , especially for medical ranks is MASH. If memory serves all of the nurses were 0-1 or 0-2, with the head nurse being an 0-3. The doctors all started at 0-3, with senior doctors at 0-4. Pierce was the chief surgeon as an 0-3 despite having atleast two other surgeons outranking him. Finally the base commander was either an 0-5 (Blake) or 0-6 (Potter). Now admittedly Potter is a special case having served in the cavalry in ww1, but you can see how just because you are in medical doesn’t mean you can’t advance in pay grade or authority. What was weird in Star Trek was that non command officers were line officers. People like Bev crusher or even Scotty should never have been in charge of the enterprise or even in the line of succession.
@oldtwinsna8347
2 жыл бұрын
My guess is that space exploration is extremely dangerous and a very lonely place to be if you end up being stranded with potentially zero help ever coming your way. This would result in very heavy command cross training going on with all personnel involved. This include medical doctors since they may in fact be the only one representing the entire Federation for a relief mission and that mission could go sour very quickly.
@Cotcan
3 жыл бұрын
Great video as always.
@duke4366
3 жыл бұрын
It is not uncommon in modern navies to keep the rank of commodore vacant during peacetime IRL. So I am not surprised commodore only made periodic appearance in Star Trek. A great example would be Capt. Sisko. When he commands the fleet in the Dominion War, he should be given the rank of commodore. This make it clear that he in charge of a fleet full of captains and commanders.
@DannyHeywood
3 жыл бұрын
Also, watching the end of the video, why did Commander Sisko end up leading the fleet against the Dominion? Was that just because DS9 was the nearest base? Or just a Plot Promotion because no Admirals were around?
@CheezyDee
3 жыл бұрын
You think Admiral Ross would go out and fight? He's got a desk to fly.
@Draeandor
3 жыл бұрын
Pretty sure Sisko was acting as fleet commander for Admiral Ross, since he was his adjunct for the whole duration of the Dominion war.
@Goatcha_M
3 жыл бұрын
Starfleet ranks are a combination of US and UK naval ranks and have much the same roles. And like US and other navies the Admiral rank is still a needless confusion as all Admirals are Admirals. They should just call it Flag Admiral and save the headaches. Of course the US navy doubles down on confusion with Rear Admiral Upper and Lower half instead of the Commodore rank and the two lieutenant ranks.
@xavariusquest4603
3 жыл бұрын
Ok...simple. All of these are derived from the US Navy. A commodore is a wartime creation. As you said, they are generally responsible for actions and flotillas within a task force or fleet. Flotillas are 3 to 5 ships assigned a task or action (group of tasks). So, when Picard assembled his task force to stop the Romulans assisting the Duras sisters he could have been granted the rank of Commodore if war broke out. Because it didn't his supreme leadership was conferred by him being the Capt of the Flagship of Starfleet.
@Optidorf
3 жыл бұрын
In Starfleet history there have only been a handful of fleet admirals. Harry Kim is one of them.
@musicgarryj
3 жыл бұрын
Two weird things I noticed as a keen viewer of all the different Star Trek series: 1) In TOS Janice Rand 1:08 held the rank of "Yeoman", which is not mentioned in this video or in any later versions of Star Trek. 2) Miles O'Brien 0:28 was the head of the transporter section in TNG, with the rank of lieutenant, but when he transferred to DS9 he was given a non-com rank of "Chief of Operations". The reason for this apparent severe demotion was never explained. Any thoughts?
@benvolio15
3 жыл бұрын
I don't think "Yeoman" is a rank, just a job position, like the quartermaster. As for O'Brien, he's always been "Chief"...but his uniform rank was never actually changed to reflect this at least until Season 6 of TNG (which DS9 begins in the middle of), where it was shown that even then-Lieutenant Junior Grade Barclay outranks him.
@xyz.ijk.
3 жыл бұрын
Excellent!
@simondaniel4028
3 жыл бұрын
Yo your videos are cool. Nice chart, also.
@omnientertainment5852
3 жыл бұрын
Waiting on the enlisted video.
@BreadApologist
3 жыл бұрын
Or the Star Trek Online model in which theres like 100k fleet admirals all flying ships around for some reason.
@jeffreyatlee8785
2 жыл бұрын
I just wondered how much of The Federation there is in the Gzilt of Banks' Hydrogen Sonata
@paulgrattan3885
3 жыл бұрын
I wonder if they brought the MACOs back do you think Starfleet would use army ranks. In STO Macos are supposed to be purely professional soldiers not base or starship officers. They are infantry so surely give them army ranks?
@CaptainFrost32
3 жыл бұрын
Or ... MArine COrps ranks. This is a fleet.
@uncletaylorify
3 жыл бұрын
Anyone who has been in the military has seen the high ranking sergeant who has been in service for over twenty years versus the baby faced lieutenant fresh out of the academy.
@christopherwilson7092
3 жыл бұрын
You seem to of really cut through this really quickly. Kirk in the films was due to circumstances, the probe, he asked admiral nagura to command the enterprise. Star trek 2 he was overseaing spocks trainee crew as they were mostly newly qualified from the academy. And admirals should be teaching at the academy as they have experience and knowledge of how it was out there. There is also admirals in charge of certain areas like admiral Hanson was in charge of the borg combatancy. Admirals have more to do than you've said
@johnracicot706
3 жыл бұрын
You should do kdf ranks next
@realmwatters2977
3 жыл бұрын
I have ranks that look ike the wrath khan era butt they classed as commodore to a star Base similar too a captain but in middle it was a solid white bar with points at top and bottom for commodore and again white for star base captain, with difference been a commodore top and bottom on main bar was angle inwards with leaf pointing out at the top, and bottom, captains of the star base was long bar which was rounded with points at the top and bottom but white in the middle. I wish i could show the pictures on here of them.
@probochronicles3991
3 жыл бұрын
The exception...."Colonel West" in ST6
@OpinionsNoOneCaresAbout
3 жыл бұрын
Where did Colonel West come from in Star Trek VI?
@freemanacount5609
3 жыл бұрын
I always thought Lieutenant Commander was a type of lower grade Commander, rather than a higher grade Lieutenant.
@CaptainFrost32
3 жыл бұрын
It is the middle ground, so both.
@Mortlupo
3 жыл бұрын
@@CaptainFrost32 LCDR (O-4) is a lowest of the field grade ranks and the first that would hold a department head position of a Ship of the Line.
@Umski
2 жыл бұрын
Most Admirals always came across as being in a bit dodgy in the Trek versions I've seen apart from the few good ones, not sure if that was truly the case or just the way many story lines went!
@exposingproxystalkingorgan4164
3 жыл бұрын
Starfleet is just a diplomatic organization with many powerful weapons at its disposal. Imagine being in a Nebula class ship conference room and seeing the torpedo launcher array at the back of the ship towering over everyone. That is just a friendly diplomatic reminder of take my carrot or I will give you the baseball bat really hard. Make your choice now!
@charlessmith2963
2 жыл бұрын
I can tell you as a former Chief petty officer in the Navy it did not matter that the Ensigns out ranked me they were informed by command to list to me and follow what I said because I knew my shit. I guarantee you it was the same in Star Fleet.
@Arniox
3 жыл бұрын
The ranks come from real life navy ranks. Which my brother explained to me as he is in the navy. Prior to an ensign rank, there's non commissioned soldier ranks. Who are on salaries. But in terms of star trek, those ranks would only be found from people at different stages in star fleet academy.
@rogerlewis196
2 жыл бұрын
Star fleet’s command structure is very similar to the US Navys
@JimMcCray
3 жыл бұрын
So where does Colonel West fit in?
@Turboy65
2 жыл бұрын
The biggest problem of all with the whole Starfleet organization is that it tries to ignore its enlisted corps. You think everybody is an officer except for rarely encountered "crewmen" who are just there to pump up the body count when the redshirts need more deaths to keep battles interesting. Only Miles O'Brien was ever described as being senior enlisted, being addressed as Chief. In truth, Starfleet as a military organization should have a much larger corps of enlisted personnel and the backbone of them, and of the service, should be a professional NCO cadre which carries most of the operational knowledge of the Fleet and does most of the training. There should be about 5 enlisted crew for each officer. That would be a typical ratio of officers to enlisted.
@oldtwinsna8347
2 жыл бұрын
DS9 got more into this direction, but not quite enough. There we saw O'Brien's technical staff was all enlisted personnel. He even had to explain to Worf that they never went to the academy, they are simply technical experts good at what they do so use them in that way.
@darkseid1975
3 жыл бұрын
Job of Ensigns in security: Die to show situation is serious.
@MandoMTL
3 жыл бұрын
LTs were fair game as well in that regard. xD
@WhitzWolf92
3 жыл бұрын
That must be why they changed the colors around - they're canaries!
@kenwaid8239
3 жыл бұрын
“CAPTAIN...LOOK OUAAAIIIIEEEEEE”
@tvdinner1986
3 жыл бұрын
*Harry Kim has entered the chat*
@ecliptorcalrissian5014
3 жыл бұрын
@@tvdinner1986 Lol. He probably died twice on the shuttlecraft ride over.
@shingshongshamalama
3 жыл бұрын
Starfleet command structure is kind of a weird hybrid between military hierarchy and corporate management ladder.
@harrisonfnord5871
3 жыл бұрын
Add to that the shenanigans of a university/scientific foundation board, and you get: Starfleet. Part science collab, part military, part political power player.
@moguldamongrel3054
3 жыл бұрын
Seems like they used military ranks as the foundation of structure, corporates as the driver of structure and science as the tools of structure. Philosophy morality etc seems to come from post apocalyptic (They did nuke themselves) plus it seems to be part of the human identity in general. I think I get what their trying to make.
@Andreas_42
3 жыл бұрын
@@harrisonfnord5871 ...and part of mad 😁 Sorry, while reading your comment, I've suddenly rememberd Terry Prattchet's description of the fiercy creature that ist the Quetzovercoatl: half man, half chicken, half jaguar, half serpent, half scorpion and half mad.
@Aerxis
3 жыл бұрын
@@Andreas_42 holy cow! That's six halves combined. Quetzalcoatl is the trinity confirmed!
@captainm7722
3 жыл бұрын
It's a loosey-goosey adaptation, or rather a riff on American Naval Officer heirarchy; at least as far as commissioned officers are concerned. NCO and Warrant ranks are a different (and frankly butchered) beast altogether; amalgamating chain structures intersectionary to several American military branches.
@Penfold101
3 жыл бұрын
“Commanders were expected to go on to be Captains” Looking at you, Will Riker.
@Ved000000
3 жыл бұрын
Will never had the makings of a varsity athlete.
@jeffumbach
3 жыл бұрын
Well he did eventually become a Captain after TNG.
@kobayashibrynhild9622
3 жыл бұрын
@@jeffumbach yeah, the Titan.
@MandoMTL
3 жыл бұрын
@Vedran Noneofyourbusiness Small hands.
@Moonbeam143
3 жыл бұрын
He did end up being a captain. A good captain. A titan of captains one could say.
@donaven42
3 жыл бұрын
I really hope you do a video about enlisted personnel because other than Miles O'Brien I know virtually nothing about them.
@JacobHardman
3 жыл бұрын
Agreed!
@MandoMTL
3 жыл бұрын
I only remember Worf's father being referenced as a CPO. Not sure they had much lore exposure at all.
@xaviermiranda5529
3 жыл бұрын
Lore is super sparse when it comes to enlisted ranks. The ranks are probably Crewman, Petty Officer, Chief Petty Officer, Senior Chief Petty Offier, Master Chief Petty Officer. All that was said was that their academy was 6 months long. Beside that I don't think there were that many discussions. I wouldn't doubt that, like astronauts coming out of the Air Force, the majority of ship crews were required to be made up almost entirely of officers. While part of the 32nd Marine Expeditionary Unit, the ships we were transported in had tiny amounts of officers. Pretty much you had the Captain, the XO, the head of each department, and that's it. The rest of the positions were from the enlisted ranks. Yeoman, navigation, radar operators, nurses, gun operators, all of them enlisted
@CheezyDee
3 жыл бұрын
As a US Navy vet I find Star Trek's ranks rather top heavy and vague. My ship had 300ish crew and 24 or so officers, and if any of the officers tried to touch machinery more complicated than a coffee maker the nearest Chief Petty Officer would chew their ass all the way out the door. In a respectful manner of course...
@walterlyzohub8112
3 жыл бұрын
@@CheezyDee in large corporations the unions forced sharp separations of duties so that being hands-on for non union people gets you in trouble. Perhaps non union places allowed people to work together and help out when it seemed right. I had a mental image where soldiers in the field recognized Death does not care about your rank. So soldiers needed to work together.
@brokeneyes6615
3 жыл бұрын
“Ensigns were on the job training for three years” Well... that explains the death rate for Security ensigns under Kirk.
@kengaroo67
3 жыл бұрын
Or, 7 years for Harry Kim.
@brokeneyes6615
3 жыл бұрын
@@kengaroo67 technically the original Harry Kim died when voyager entered that nebula that “twinned” The ship and was he was sucked out into space, body unrecovered anf Thr copy allowed to assume the originals life. Same thing with Naomi Wildman.
@kengaroo67
3 жыл бұрын
@@brokeneyes6615 I need to rewatch Voyager.
@brokeneyes6615
3 жыл бұрын
@@kengaroo67 Harry Kim has a copy of him assume his life in one form or another on 3 separate occasions in voyager if I recall. Edit: 5 times if you count time travel (episodes specific to him), each one ends up with a dead Harry Kim too. Also if you count all his near deaths your pushing it into the teens. Come to think of it he is something of a Kenny. Heck in one episode they straight up kill him.
@nicksouthwell9393
3 жыл бұрын
Poor Harry... I don’t think I’ve pitied a fictional character more. Never appreciated, had a criminal promoted over him, demoted and promoted again. What ever nasty messed up thing that happed happened to him. Well at least he makes captain eventually... I think? No all of those were alternate timelines or dreams or something... Never mind. 🥺
@Vanilla0729
3 жыл бұрын
You could write a book on the title Commodore alone. In the Age of Sail, Commodore was a temporary title granted to the most senior Captain of an ad-hoc flotilla. Sometime in the mid to late 1800s, the British Royal Navy made Commodore the naval equivalent of the One Star Brigadier General. The US Navy has had a complicated relationship with British naval traditions. They used the term Commodore, with the same British definition during WWII, Then dropped the rank entirely; brought it in the early 80s, changed it from Commodore to Commodore-Admiral, and now Rear Admiral(lower half) ...
@chrisgurney2467
3 жыл бұрын
During WWII there was also two ranks of Commodore in the Royal Navy with Commodore Second class using the thick Distinction Lace on shoulder strap and a Commodore First Class with an Admiral's shoulder strap showing an anchor and two small stars and no crossed sword and baton
@jacobbaughman748
3 жыл бұрын
In Bagdad, during OIF, there was a US Navy outfit commanded by a Captain (equivalent to a US Army "full-bird" Colonel) and when he was addressed directly or referred to informally, his title was Commodore. It was explained to me that this was because he didn't command a ship at sea... In true Army tradition, I saluted, called him "Sir!" and kept moving.
@Riceball01
3 жыл бұрын
@@jacobbaughman748 The USN still uses the title of Commodore but it's no longer a rank, it's a billet. Commodore is the title of an O6 Captain that's in charge of a group ships, typically a squadron but can be just a task force of 2 or more ships.
@jacobbaughman748
3 жыл бұрын
@@Riceball01 okay, I can see that. The unit this guy commanded was called a Composite Squadron, but I couldn't tell you how many people were in it. Typically, in the Army, an O-6 commands between 3-5 thousand soldiers. Or, as many as 8 thousand.
@Riceball01
3 жыл бұрын
@@jacobbaughman748 In the Navy, O-6 Captains are typically given command of larger ships, definitely aircraft carriers, possibly amphibious assault ships, cruisers, and I think SSBNs. Of course, they can be in command of a squadron of ships which would equal to several hundred men and women. But I think that overall, a Navy Captain is in command of fewer people, on average, than an Army or Marine Colonel who are usually regimental commanders at that rank.
@daniellewis3330
3 жыл бұрын
Honestly, almost everything described here matches the real-world Navy nearly 100%. The ranks are nearly directly lifted, the disposition of duties is almost identical, the progression from operations to administration and political involvement is spot-on. Yeah, Starfleet isn't a military organization in cannon, but its framing is about 95% identical to the real world military progression. Source: career Air Force, brother career Navy. The annual football game is hilarious.
@roach7000
3 жыл бұрын
While the ranks are near identical I wouldn't say the progressions and duties were.I'm a 11 year veteran of the US Navy. As an example Operations Officers are a bigger deal in the real world than portrayed in Star Trek. There's no way a boot ensign fresh out the academy would report to a ship to be the Operations Officer.
@letsplaypros1
2 жыл бұрын
@@roach7000 it honestly depends on the ship and how many officers you have, I'm a submariner and we had an ensign commo for a while
@joekerr3638
2 жыл бұрын
Gene Roddenberry was part of us army Air corps. Star Trek Ranks were designed to imitate military. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_life_and_career_of_Gene_Roddenberry
@MrSheckstr
2 жыл бұрын
@@joekerr3638 true but just because he had dirt and air military experience doesn’t mean he fully appreciated how military hierarchy (specifically naval military hierarchy) works
@MasterUriasFenris
2 жыл бұрын
@@MrSheckstr HE took his inspiration from the US Navy and used his imagination.
@robertvantine2810
3 жыл бұрын
Please do a follow-up video for the crewmen ranks. It's is sorely needed.
@A407RAC
3 жыл бұрын
Duty of a Cardassian Glinn - cleaning out a room after 3 men suffered explosive decompression...
@goldenknight578
3 жыл бұрын
I think you just described chilli night on the Enterprise.
@kellyweingart3692
3 жыл бұрын
😂😂😂😂
@travisfoster1071
3 жыл бұрын
@@goldenknight578 or, a bad night of gagh in a Klingon mess hall.
@goldenknight578
3 жыл бұрын
@@travisfoster1071 Knowing the Klingons, I'm sure it'd more likely be a *good* night than a bad one.
@richardlahan7068
3 жыл бұрын
Builds character.
@Axel0204
3 жыл бұрын
Having multiple persons with the rank of Captain serving on the same ship has precedent in real world navies. On US Navy aircraft carriers for example, there are usually several officers with the rank of captain, the Commanding Officer of the ship is always one, the Executive Officer, the Reactor Officer and the Chief Engineer often are, and there may be others aboard as well, not to mention Captains in the Air Wing and on the embarked Admiral's staff. Also, in general, the Starfleet rank structure and chain of command actually is fairly close to that of the real world US Navy. The ranks of Commander & Captain in the US Navy haven't been directly tied to holding a command for well over a century.
@jamesrussell8256
3 жыл бұрын
When I was on the Kitty Hawk, the Air Boss, CMO, and Chaplain were Captains.
@MandoMTL
3 жыл бұрын
Is there any way of visually differentiating CO and XO in this scenario?
@jamesrussell8256
3 жыл бұрын
@@MandoMTL in the US Navy? Yes there is. In Starfleet? Not that I have seen.
@jasonskeans3327
3 жыл бұрын
Carrier's are headed by admirals
@titan_d9795
3 жыл бұрын
@@jasonskeans3327 Carrier groups are headed by an admiral, not the carrier.
@Peregrine57
3 жыл бұрын
I've often felt Commodore was a perfectly fine, under-used rank in the TNG/DS9 era Trek. Commanding a fleet or task force, but not quite an Admiral. In the novelizations, Sisko talks about being in something of a Commodore position during the war under Admiral Ross, even though his official rank was still Captain. Picard would likewise have been a Commodore during the blockade of Romulan boarder during the Klingon civil war. Technically, Picard should really have been an Admiral, or at least a Commodore for the entire run of the series, since he was in command of the "flag ship", which are typically commanded by flag officers, and he would have been called upon to command full fleets or battle groups when needed.
@mpsmith47304
2 жыл бұрын
You might be interested to know that in the USN, a Captain given command of a squadron of ships is often informally referred to as the Commodore, though there is no such official rank in the USN anymore (it being called Rear Admiral (Lower Half).
@MrSheckstr
2 жыл бұрын
Except that when they refer to the enterprise as being the “flag ship” they use it the term in a more of a ceremonial manner than as a practical one. It’s just been a tradition that every lead class of ship since the constitution class (one that class has been successfully established) it gets a ship named (or renamed ) Enterprise AFTER the previous incarnation has left service in one way or another.
@michaelbedinger4121
2 жыл бұрын
Would command of a star base, or space station be assigned to a Commodore possibly?
@Peregrine57
2 жыл бұрын
@@michaelbedinger4121 It could, and has. Starbase 11, in The Menagerie was commanded by Commodore José. Mendez
@michaelbedinger4121
2 жыл бұрын
@@Peregrine57 I forgot about that. Thank you very much for the reminder.
@starliner2498
3 жыл бұрын
The discovery rank insignias are so tiny, don't like them at all
@richardm3023
3 жыл бұрын
THAT is your complaint about STD?!? That's it? Nothing else?
@starliner2498
3 жыл бұрын
@@richardm3023 naw man that's *one* of my several complains about it, the rest are not relevant here
@aldyhabibie9717
3 жыл бұрын
@@richardm3023 Arguments and statement has its time and place. People tend keep things relevant to the topics at hand to keep the discussion focused on one thing at a time. Yes, Discovery has the worse ranking insignia in Star Trek because its design was too small for other member of Star fleet to see especially those who need glasses, yes, apparently many of starfleet officers prefer to keep their eyes and uses glasses over artificial or bionic or any robotic eye implants but more importantly it is also hard for the audience to see and recognize which is which because we still had to count the dots even if can see it. In a show with ranks and hundreds of supporting cast with minimum screen time, people have to be able see their ranks since they will not remember their names, their face, and their role beyond the main and major supporting characters who appears almost in every episode (But even then people can still forget about their ranks). One of the main reason was in our world, army ranks insignia is big and placed where it is easy to see. On top of that they also had names on their chest along with their rank so soldiers can see who is their superior officer or who is reporting to them right when they meet each other.
@richardm3023
3 жыл бұрын
@@aldyhabibie9717 wow! You really do have a lot to say. And yet you are just making noise. I don't even bother reading long winded preaching posts like that. You have wasted your time.
@nobodyyouknow1065
3 жыл бұрын
Bracing for a joke about how its an Admiral’s duty to be pure evil.
@pauljackson3491
3 жыл бұрын
Admirals Ross and Paris weren't evil. Though there is that one episode with Ross. And wasn't Kirk an admiral for a few movies?
@nobodyyouknow1065
3 жыл бұрын
@@pauljackson3491 all fair points, though on a sidenote I never thought Paris exuded admiral-ness so maybe thats why.
@weldonwin
3 жыл бұрын
Admiral Nakamura seemed like an okay guy
@Mortlupo
3 жыл бұрын
@@pauljackson3491 Yes, Kirk as an Admiral in the first four movies and was "busted" to Captain at the end of the forth one.
@hellacoorinna9995
3 жыл бұрын
Kirk was a dick to Decker, though.
@jameshunt4978
3 жыл бұрын
The refit constitution class enterprise was being used as a training vessel so having multiple captains from each division kirk(command) spock(science) and scotty(operations) to allow for in the field command level reviews without having to dock at appropriately staffed starbases
@Mortlupo
3 жыл бұрын
Not the case, Kirk was an Admiral and Spock was the captain of the Enterprise. When Kirk was busted to Captain, Spock still was a captain as his first officer. Scotty became an Captain when he went to the Excelsior and retained that rank when he came back.
@HappyBeezerStudios
Жыл бұрын
@@Mortlupo I could totally see starfleet command deciding to keep Spock around him in case Kirk causes more trouble.
@davidmeloche3563
3 жыл бұрын
Ahh, Space Navy. As a Boatswain Mate myself, I was particularly fond of Enterprise, since they made that ship look as much like a submarine in space as they could.
@stevenclark2188
3 жыл бұрын
I think so many captains aboard a vessel was originally a matter of being a training ship, and then unusual diplomatic duties used as an excuse to keep the popular mutineers contained after that.
@Strash1892
3 жыл бұрын
It may also have to do with neither Scott nor Spock being interested in taking command of their own ship, but somehow couldn't escape a promotion to captain after serving in the fleet for so many years. Mr. Scott was too much of an engineer and Mr. Spock too much of a scientist to leave their positions.
@HappyBeezerStudios
Жыл бұрын
@@Strash1892 If Starfleet is anything like the USN they have a limited amount of spots of admirals anyway.
@gallendugall8913
3 жыл бұрын
Starfleet seems to follow the practice of the assigned job providing authority and the rank being primarily for denoting experience level.
@ptonpc
3 жыл бұрын
Which makes sense considering the culture of Star Fleet.
@henriblakeley5185
2 жыл бұрын
@@ptonpc Could you elaborate? An interesting comment :)
@ptonpc
2 жыл бұрын
@@henriblakeley5185 Unfortunately I have 'Covid brain' at the moment so can't give precise examples. However In real Star Trek (TOS, TNG, DSN, VOY and to a certain extent Enterprise), you can be a high rank but your rank only works to show you are a specialist, it doesn't mean others of a lower rank have to obey you if they know more than you do about a situation. It's more a 'leadership by expertise' thing. Of course, there are variations depending on the needs of the story
@jowinn
3 жыл бұрын
Love to see the NCO ranks. Never understood that in Star Trek.
@sabbyreloaded
3 жыл бұрын
Especially with voyager
@MandoMTL
3 жыл бұрын
"Crewman". That's all we ever really got in terms of ranking clarification.
@thesinfultictac5704
3 жыл бұрын
Enterprise had them pretty much fleshed out. Which was fun.
@mazoku112
3 жыл бұрын
It's based on a naval structure. Officers went to starlets officer training program. Crewmen are those who just enlist and are trained for the specific role they chose.
@ryank5424
3 жыл бұрын
Crewman which I assume is the lowest non officer rank and Chief Petty officer are the only ones I know of but I assume that means there is at least one Petty officer rank.
@darkwalkermyth
3 жыл бұрын
In the United States Navy, which the officer rank structure is based, did, at one time, have the rank of Commodore, and was the entry into the flag ranks. The rank of Commodore was abandoned in favor of the rank of Rear Admiral Lower Half (one star), and Rear Admiral Upper Half (two stars). There has not been a Fleet Admiral appointed in the Navy since World War II. Even the current Chief of Naval Operations is only a full Admiral at four stars.
@mdlcrochet
3 жыл бұрын
Exactly but he technically is a Rear Admiral Upper half, two stars. Anything above that is what is called a temporary rank or rank of position. What that means is if the current CNO retires which he will at the end of his current posting, and he does not petition congress to allow him to retire with admiral rank he will automatically retire at rear admiral upper half. Its complicated and all that but when a vice admiral is removed from position due to any number of things he will revert back to 2 star. Pretty much its the posting that holds the rank and the person in that posting is allowed to use that rank while they hold that position.
@jonathanwebster7091
Жыл бұрын
Same with the Royal Navy as regards Admirals of the Fleet (the equivalent of Fleet Admiral in the USN). Since the end of the cold war, officers haven't been promoted to the rank, and only two officers still remain on the Navy List holding this rank (and one of them is the King). The professional head of the RN-the First Sea Lord; is, like his US equivalent, 'only' an Admiral.
@CorvoFG
3 жыл бұрын
Gotta say, much respect for the research time and diagram drawing you put in!
@themodernmusketeer877
3 жыл бұрын
There are often times in the military where a person has to assume the duties of a rank above the one they actually hold. For example, a squad leader is usually a sergeant, but a corporal might often have to fill the role instead. Or a first lieutenant might have to assume command of a company if a captain isn't available
@JonBerry555
3 жыл бұрын
And in wars (like the US Civil War) where this became even more common due to causalities occurring faster than promotions and replacements.
@Otokichi786
3 жыл бұрын
"Corporal Hicks is next in chain of command."
@MandoMTL
3 жыл бұрын
Guessing that's a big in when promotion time comes 'round.
@CaptainFrost32
3 жыл бұрын
@@JonBerry555 ":Congratulations, you are now a Lieutenant. Now, get me some gorram air support!"
@xaviermiranda5529
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah, I served as squad leader as a Lance Corporal and Platoon sergeant as a Corporal on several occasions. "Needs of the Corps" and all that
@andrebrynkus2055
3 жыл бұрын
Good thing Voyager kept everything making sense. Ensign Harry Kim giving duty orders to lieutenants. Janeway promoted from Captain to Vice Admiral skipping rear admiral and commodore.
@SantomPh
3 жыл бұрын
Commodore was not used by her time, and everyone got a two rank promotion. Tuvok would be a captain if he wanted it, Harry would be a Lt.Commander etc. There is no point in making Janeway a rear admiral, she has no need to be the head of a small project or starbase. She gets a desk
@L1z43vr
Жыл бұрын
@@SantomPh Even when he’s promoted, Harry still isn’t a Lieutenant… He is a Lieutenant Commander, though
@HappyBeezerStudios
Жыл бұрын
In Harry's case it was part of his position, not his rank.
@neopolitangaming1362
Жыл бұрын
To be fair, it's common in the US Navy (probably other navies as well) for someone who is lower rank but more knowledgeable about a given issue to tell someone who is higher rank how to go about finding a solution. As an example, I'm an IT3 in the Navy. If I know more about fixing a computer than an LT, then I can tell the LT how to fix the problem.
@HappyBeezerStudios
Жыл бұрын
@@neopolitangaming1362 not sure if they still use warrant officers, but that basically what they do. still non-commissioned, but far more experienced than the ensign or lieutenant fresh from the academy.
@HUDDYBUDDY101
3 жыл бұрын
There’s very few fleet admirals STO: ummmm well
@talideon
3 жыл бұрын
Space... is big.
@Panzercommander121
3 жыл бұрын
From what I have been told, the higher ranks in STO are more of an "honorary" rank, that allows you to take charge in situations that require it. Otherwise you're still basically just a Captain.
@gaboversta2.423
3 жыл бұрын
@@Panzercommander121 A perfect example of rank not playing a role in what you end up doing.
@Panzercommander121
3 жыл бұрын
@@gaboversta2.423 a friend of mine who has been in contact with the devs says that as a Federation character in STO, you're basically Fleet Admiral Quinn's favourite protege, and as such end up with special command privileges.
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