Thanks colin , overall it's correct 👍 One HUGE issue still is if the comms network goes down ( 02 , vodaphone , EE, ) then the cps chargers do NOT DEFAULT to 'free vend' , unlike other networks. In the highlands of Scotland mobile coverage is patchy at best , so another ' thing to go possibly wrong' in the huge complex set up of CPS, where everyone 'passes the buck' and points the finger at someone else to fix a failed charger. Keep up your great vidoes mate , The plugggg seeeakkerrrrr ! Regards from Orkney 😉👍👍
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Hi JP. Looks like I’m not the only non sleeping nightowl 😂. I hope in comments it stimulates some discussion on other issues from actual users like yourself.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Aside from the previous Ecotricity rapids, do any of other current networks default to free vend. ? Not even sure if Gridserve EH ones do now have free vend?
@JonathanPorterfield
2 жыл бұрын
@@ThePlugSeeker yes the john o groats Gridserve rapid is on free vend , i tested it last weekend 😀 😉, mobile signal is really poor here , so rapid is one 'free vend' just like the old EH unit !
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
@@JonathanPorterfield Do you know if any other networks that will offer free vend outside the Electric Highway? I think it may be just them. Be great if more Networks did this, it was certainly one of things Dale Vince got right.
@jennifermaybanks1169
2 жыл бұрын
as a new Scottish EV driver this explains a lot and now I understand the back story much better now, thank you for this
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Hi Jennifer. Thank you so much for your kind comments, am pleased you found the episode interesting.
@laurenz138
2 жыл бұрын
Found you through PlugShare. Lol
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Ah great! I’m not at the top spot anymore as a PlugShare scout. Think I’m in 3rd or 4th place these days. But I do try to add and/or update any charger location I go to. 🤗
@davidthornton3346
2 жыл бұрын
My local rapid charge units are a nightmare for getting use of. Mainly because they're still free, and people don't give a toss about other people and just sit on them, or there's a queue. All the time. I was running on "fumes" recently, stopped by my local rapid, and there was a Mini sat on it at 100%, and had been for half an hour. It was another 20 minutes until the owner of the car turned up. Not the first time this has happened to me either. I wouldn't oppose if CPS decided to add overstay fees
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
It’s probably worth bringing it up perhaps with both CPS and your Local Authority
@johnarthur9323
2 жыл бұрын
A good, and really useful guide to charging in Scotland - thanks! A couple of things that could have been included, in my opinion, would have been the billing issues since the Swarco takeover and the “postcode lottery” of policies and connection fees/charging costs across the 32 local authority areas. It might have been useful to also explain the difference between “owners” and “hosts” and the effect those differences have to the use/availability of chargers. Many points show as “free”, but have restrictions (staff only) when you get there.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
That’s interesting. My understanding on talking to ChargePlace Scotland and work out what is that the terms host and owner could pretty much be used interchangeably mean the same thing. Officially I think they were all referred to as hosts although as the hosts effectively own the Chargers I think they preferred the term owner. Whether it was a private company or a local authority they were still owners at least that was my understanding
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Interestingly I have found out in feedback from ChargePlace Scotland that actually SWARCO’s EV hardware side took over APT / E-Volt even earlier than I thought, actually in 2014 not 2018.
@neilkermode4298
2 жыл бұрын
A good video and thanks for the history which is easy to forget. An aspect that is hard to understand here in Scotland is how the CPS system only covers some of the chargers funded by the Scottish Government. So chargers have been put in at some village halls with government grants, and the NHS Scotland has put them in at hospitals, and Highlands and Islands Airports have put them in at airports with Transport Scotland's money, but they are NOT put onto the CPS network! In addition there are some chargers provided by Transport Scotland for buses which are visible, but which you cannot use! This dog's breakfast seems to be because of the original funding route for the chargers and is a long way from a customer oriented approach to public service in my opinion. It also worth pointing out that the mapping of chargers is a complete mess. Some appear in the underlying mapping from Google (often in the wrong place), but not all. Some appear on the CPS maps as additional icons which might or might not be in the right place. In addition they purport to show the status of the chargers, but this is erratic and unreliable not just because the status might be wrong, but sometimes there is no data and sometimes the charger isn't even on the map. There was great frustration with BP and there had been high hopes for CPS when Swarco took over. They are yet to be realised. It is such a shame that the back-office of the network is still a long way from what a 21st century driver needs.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you for your perspective, I am so interested to read all this detailed feedback from actual Scottish Electric vehicle drivers. Am pleased you enjoyed the episode. I feel I understand CPS so much better having read many of the interesting responses the video has got.
@grahamleiper1538
Жыл бұрын
You can't explain CYC losing the contract without mentioning their 2020 countrywide outages. Whole days being unable to charge. The "teething problems" are nothing in comparison. Losing the annual fee definitely an improvement. Charging now means other private operators are coming into the market, which is a good thing.
@ThePlugSeeker
Жыл бұрын
Ah interesting. Didn’t know that. How are things going now north of the border?
@grahamleiper1538
Жыл бұрын
@@ThePlugSeeker OK - just 3 years ago my nearest charger was a single CPS rapid 14 miles away (and 2 other single CPS rapids similar distance in other directions that didn't work), now nearest charger is a 22kW AC (not CPS) within walking distance, my nearest rapids are due to be MFG units less than 5 miles away and the previously non working rapids work. CPS is a fall back which makes sense and getting to be what they were really meant to be - provision everywhere rather than the "only" provision everywhere. CPS still have issues where the local authority still gives free charging with people "abandoning" their cars on chargers. Overstay fees needed, but Edinburgh have 30 minute overstay on 50kW rapids which makes about as much sense as a £20 limit on a petrol pump. Like most people, pretty much charge at home 99% of the time. Have a CPS RFID card for when I go further afield. Trust RFID way more than mobile signal. The really sad thing about the 2020 outages - the chargers were still free, but nobody could charge as they didn't go to free vend if they lost connection to the back office. Some chargers apparently keep a "whitelist" of RFID cards for when they lose comms, so if you'd used a charger recently, you could still charge. Heard of people powering other people's cars using their RFID cards. Did it myself once for somebody with a new Taycan that didn't have an RFID card. Think councils/CPS should really be pushing AC charging points for people without home charging and leaving rapids to private companies. Kintore station is a good example of how things should be going forward. If I didn't have home charging, would be far more important to have AC charging within walking distance of home or work than an unreliable (not very) rapid charger a dozen miles away.
@inkpen1999
2 жыл бұрын
CPS followed the failed business model of CYC where landowners (usually local or regional councils) were encouraged to take the grant money for unreliable chargers with little or no provision (or budget) for long term maintenance of the chargers. CYC's hands off approach has failed on countless sites, with public chargers out of service for months or years. Ongoing maintenance always needs to be an extremely important part of the equation, but sadly frequently isn't.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Yes, I had the feeling that there were some parallels with the U.K. CYC chargers in the COS model. Quite different from say Instavolt
@campbellcopeland
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the video - I only got an EV in September 2021 but have mainly used CPS units, usually planning my cafe & restaurant options to be near one for AC charging. I'm based in South Lanarkshire and we're very well provisioned in my particular area - the two rapid chargers nearby (1/2 mile away) tend to have busy periods but there are always the majority of the 18x AC connections are available (8 units spread across three car parks + 2 rapids). There are a similar number about 1.5 miles away too. Rapids are used by a combination of electric black cabs, DPD vans, private hire Leafs and private owners too. One of the rapid chargers CCS occasionally has issues connecting to my car but other than during the database migration period, the CPS helpline have been very good. I tend to use the rapid once a week or so when kids at evening clubs, etc, and occasionally leave on an AC for 4 or 5 hours during the afternoon. I mainly use the CPS AC in conjunction with my home charger (if it's cold and wet, I'll plug in at home and spend the £5 it costs to top up - suppose I'm a 'fair weather' user?) and since they're 50% used at absolute most, I'm not blocking anyone. Once they start to get busier (mainly South Lanarkshire Council vans/car use and occasional local), or when I get solar panels and can charge for free, I'll change my usage pattern. Availability of (free) CPS wasn't a deciding factor in getting an EV but it's covered probably 50%+ of my nearly 4000 miles in the past 7 months.
@lordpitnolen2196
2 жыл бұрын
I recently paid an annual fee for my card by Direct Debit. I received an email from BP Pulse early on Friday advising me of two small amounts that were due. Their website would not give me access (why do folk in back office not realise that folk are using small phone screens? ) Later in the day I received another email telling me to ignore the first. CPS seems to be as bad as ever. There should be a legal obligation on "owners" to REMOVE any chargers that are not being maintained. THE CYC call-handling was pathetic. I strongly recommend that you keep in close touch with Jonathan as he seems to use Scottish chargers a lot. None of these inefficiencies would be tolerated at fossil fuel suppliers.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
How come you are getting charged by BP Pulse or CYC now? They are no longer involved in ChargePlace Scotland network I thought? Is it a direct debit you need to stop? Perhaps get in touch with CPS helpline?
@lordpitnolen2196
2 жыл бұрын
@@ThePlugSeeker Thank you. Your video made it clearer what was going on but I think confusion still reigns with CPS. At least Pulse cancelled their email. (I live only about 5 miles from Dundee SWARCO, in part of a previous Michelin tyre factory.)
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Oh so you’re down the road from ChargePlace Scotland Central then. At least it’s a good move that when SWARCO took over the moveD the base of their operations to Scotland. It’s good to see them supporting Scottish jobs and Scottish staff.
@duncanheyes8168
2 жыл бұрын
Great review of the history of CPS, having only started using it in December 2021, initially using the app, then later using the card. I must say that I find the card very easy to use, and the app a bit fussy when starting a charge or finishing. The app in itself works well regarding identifying vacant chargers, on a couple of occasions the systems went down, but I could still charge using the card. I like the ability to log into your account and track, costs and kWh usage, this can only be done on line, and not throughout the app.I use the CPS at least once a week, luckily for me our local council is still not charging, but I am certain that will change, let’s be honest, we cannot expect the cost to stay free, especially as the cost of electricity has gone up so much. The one good thing about areas that charge is that they usually have an overstay charge, and that is most welcome on a rapid charger and stops selfish people hogging a charger all day, even though it’s finished charging.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the reply. And I’m pleased you enjoyed the video. If you watch my videos you’ll see that I share your reluctance to use apps. I also find it even the best of the apps can be temperamental. That being said I actually thought the charge by Scotland it was quite straightforward to use and worked for like a treat for me when I was up in Scotland. However I keep a Wallet with all of the possible RFID card handy for most of the UK networks.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Interesting to hear that you live in a local authority that still provides the chargers for free. I totally agree that just with electric highway before it I’m sure that charge by Scotland cannot really continue to have them for free as there’s not really a viable model I think going forward. In your experience how many of the local authorities still are providing free charging. I thought it was pretty much being phased out.
@duncanheyes8168
2 жыл бұрын
@@ThePlugSeeker Difficult to say how many authorities still free. I live in Renfrewshire, the area’s around such as Inverclyde, Glasgow city, are charging, yet Dunbartonshire aren’t. I am not close enough to the politics of the local authorities to understand the why some aren’t and some are. Fiscally it has to make sense to charge, albeit I still hear people complaining about the charges, why do people expect something for nothing, they would not expect to get petrol free! I feel CPS have to further improve the infrastructure, there is quite a difference between Glasgow and Edinburgh on numbers of chargers, Glasgow having far more in my opinion, hopefully there will be an increase in units, especially in Highlands and Islands.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Yes when I was up in Edinburgh I was a little surprised that the capital of Scotland had rather poor rapid charging in the town centre. There was one old E-Volt at the bottom of a car park basement and that was the only one I could find.
@handheldgaming4life
2 жыл бұрын
What happened to 2020?
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Well nothing really happened in terms of the ownership and the organisational side. In the interim. ChargePlace Scotland stayed under the management of Charge Your Car which was in turn a part then of BP Pulse. It’s only really last year that things started to change as SWARCO took over.
@handheldgaming4life
2 жыл бұрын
@@ThePlugSeeker you mean fell apart with more effort put into finger pointing than resolution. Yeah I was there as a Scottish resident. Fluster Cluck from start to finish.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Do you think broadly things have improved since SWARCO took over ? I hear there’s been a lot of teething problems. In my next video I’ll be demonstrating one of their new units. And in fact I’m embarrassed to say I’ll have to show in the video that I couldn’t get the contactless to work. And that was one of the new ones
@raymoyes3967
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the very informative video. It certainly clarified a lot of misunderstandings I had about the role of CPS. I'm a recent convert to EV ownership and live in Scotland. I find the biggest issue is that CPS don't own the network and the maintenance. I believe a one-stop-shop solution would solve most, if not all, of the problems mentioned. Talking to other people it seems quite common to find chargers not working. Often there is no notification of this either on the app or on the charger itself. It seems chargers in general have frequent faults, so there is a clear need to have more of them. I disagree re the 7kw chargers. I would rather see an all rapid charger setup as most people just want to get enough "juice" to get to their destination or next charger and not hang around - especially in remote Scotland in winter! Also most locations have limited physical space, so a few bays offering 7kw "wastes" that space that could be used for rapid chargers giving higher service throughput. As your video said, 50kw chargers are 10 years old, so they should now be discontinued for all new rollouts and more powerful (150kw+) should be mandated instead. I've yet to see a 50kw charger actually deliver 50kw and newer EVs can take much higher rates. The faster we charge, the less time needed and more people that can use them.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for your detailed and interesting response. One point I would make is that chargers are not just there for those in a trip who want to quickly rapid charger and move on. Public chargers are also there for locals without off street parking to charge at home. Remember only 60% households can charge at home with possible off street parking. Also remember that each rapid charger costs 10’s of thousands pounds. Can easily get a row or 2 of 7kW posts for same price as a single rapid charger I think. So if you just want to park and charge overnight and come get your EV in morning with enough charge to last a week, 7kW posts make a lot more sense and value for money. Equally if you pitch up in a PHEV then you can use a 7kW post instead of blocking a rapud and charging still at only 7-22kW.
@malcolmfowler8972
2 жыл бұрын
I paid £20 for a ChargePlace Scotland RFID card last June and used it when I spent five days in Scotland last July. Will this RFID card still work if I return to Scotland this summer? I believe the CPS chargers are no longer free. Do they accept contactless payment?
@adrianwiuk
2 жыл бұрын
Your CYC issued RFID card will still work assuming it was transferred across to Swarco when they took over in the middle of last year. I'd call them before heading north! There are still some free chargers on the CPS network, usually depending on which Local Authority area they are in, but most are now chargeable. Some of the newer chargers have a contactless option, but lots of the older ones don't, so you need an RFID card and/or the App to cover all bases.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
That’s really useful to know. Thanks.
@davidbarr5783
2 жыл бұрын
A lot of the standalone AC posts next to the rapids, like Crawford in your video, are actually 22kw posts. The biggest problem is that the councils don't have a proper EV strategy. In East Renfrewshire we have chargers that are simply either broken or orphaned. My local town has no working chargers at all. And the only rapid charger was vandalised and has not been repaired 6 months later. However, the biggest problem is still that there is no national pricing strategy. A lot are still free so you end up with expensive cars with big batteries hogging the 50kw chargers for hours on end. Indeed, I reckon my local rapid was targeted by vandals because of just that. CPS need to have a national pricing tariff to stop such abuse of the chargers. In Manchester, when BeEV came in, and made the chargers no longer free, there was a massive drop in the hogging of chargers by big battery EVs. People don't like to pay for their leccy it seems.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
Interesting. I thought now most of them would be charging for use at the rate the LAs thought appropriate
@davidbarr5783
2 жыл бұрын
@@ThePlugSeeker you would but there are vast areas where it is still free, Crawford for example, the tariffs are not consistent and some places still have connection fees. Scottish Government are mucking this up...and losing a great opportunity to aid the transition. Some councils, like mine, seem to be just leaving it to commercial companies to provide the service...but at least Osprey, InstaVolt, etc actually work.
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
David - you are quite right many posts are 22kW, although most EVs only can draw 7kW, a few can manage 11kW, and ZOEs can draw up to full 22kW.
@davidbarr5783
2 жыл бұрын
@@ThePlugSeeker hence why I'll be sticking to my Zoe even though it has not very fast CCS. Until battery heating is cracked I'm more than happy to arrive after 150 miles with a hot battery in 0c, charge and leave faster than the guy who has driven a few miles and waits...and waits...and waits for his car to get 100%... Seen it too many times
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
I think if they stay to 100% they never watched my earlier video “How fast can you Rapid charge an EV” 😂😂😂 kzitem.info/news/bejne/z4yH02mDjKuGkm0
@stanwilliamson776
2 жыл бұрын
Wish that network was as good as your video!! Things are better than before under CYC. One weak point is a lack of clear consistent signs on some chargers about pricing. Also a lack of maintenance/quick repairs in certain local authority areas. I have encountered chargers in Aberdeenshire and Perthshire which were/are out of action for months on end. I am beginning to think the "model" is not fit for purpose. Instavolt and Ionity have been 100% reliable in my experience, if expensive. Why?
@ThePlugSeeker
2 жыл бұрын
I know what you mean about Instavolt and some of the other newer networks that run by private companies. I would point out however that these companies have only been around for a for a short of time and the charges remain rather new technology. I suspect often the charges that you have the most problem with are those early first generation E-Volts that are nearly 10 years old. Will companies like Instavolt still be as reliable when some of their machines of aged a bit. I guess in the beginning if you’re going to get rapid chargers rolled out that each cost tens of thousands of pounds then the local authority couldn’t really justify that sort of cost in 2013 when they’re only 200 EV is in Scotland. Are the prices on the app? I wonder when the charges are out of action for such a long time is it because of a technical or parts issue or is it a difficulty between those local authorities and the companies who are doing the maintenance. It is a difficult and I am understand your thoughts that maybe this isn’t the right model going forward. Some of these private machines may be expensive but hopefully some of that money can be channelled into better upkeep
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