Time-stamps for other viewers 00:00 Introduction/Disclaimer 2:43 The actual experiment 6:10 Winrate's 7:45 Survivor Reactions + perks 10:18 Map Data 13:00 Conclusion 16:27 Dracula 17:08 Vecna 17:42 Unknown 18:33 Chucky 19:20 Xeno 20:00 Singularity 20:45 Skull-Merchant 21:23 Knight 21:58 Wesker 22:35 Dredge 23:06 Sadako 23:38 Artist 24:22 Pinhead 24:48 Nemesis 25:25 Trickster 26:05 Blight 26:27 Pyramid-head 27:07 Deathslinger 27:37 Oni 28:07 Plague 28:35 Legion 29:12 Spirit 29:52 Clown 31:14 Pig 31:56 Freddy 32:27 Bubba 33:08 Huntress, Lee ruined the 100% kill-rate good job Lee >:( 33:45 Doctor 34:14 Hag (hag player is color-blind, filters are required for them to play the game) 34:50 Myers 35:27 Nurse 35:55 HillBilly 36:34 Wraith 37:23 Trapper
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
i totally didn't pay em to do this btw
@Borf1987
2 күн бұрын
@@Carniveris how much was it
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
@@Borf1987 i gotta predrop for noice dailies now :c
@LegionTree
2 күн бұрын
Lee would ruin something smh
@jamespotter779
Күн бұрын
@@Carniverisshould have asked king Wolfe for Ghostface
@PrinceofSwordsFury
2 күн бұрын
850% win rate Hag, Massive W for the granny
@themrheadacheQ1
2 күн бұрын
Everyone in the experiment: "WOW slugging IS so much better! 🥰" My Xeno in the same experiment: 😨
@Crispy_DAWG
Күн бұрын
Xeno and slugging just feels bad because a lot of times you can hook near a tunnel and make it back to tunnel or pressure the unhooker. It’s not any more advantageous than tunneling from what I’ve found.
@Braddubb_real
Күн бұрын
Xeno and slugging IS bad. It’s how I lost my twitch acc. Some toxic weeb swf mass reported and stalked me after the last match. Never do slugmorph.
@aikorose3273
Күн бұрын
Xeno is kinda odd for slugging, the point of slugging is if you see someone to pick up the down survivor or try to you get em, but Xeno spend most of the time underground.
@Wizardbeard91
19 сағат бұрын
Hi bran!!!
@themrheadacheQ1
17 сағат бұрын
@@Wizardbeard91 Heyo o/
@Enchanteddy
Күн бұрын
When I think of slugging, I have to think of the game I had where me and my buddy loaded in with two randoms. None brought a flashlight, not one of us had a crazy meta built, and nobody bullied the killer. Hell, one of the survivors had 82 hours in the game. It was a pig who had a slugging build. We all quickly went down. She then neither put traps on us nor hooked, she simply let us all bleed out while humping me for 4 minutes. Judging by comments on her profile, that was the usual game style for her. For me as a survivor and killer main, I absolutely understand the need to slug in certain situations. I don't mind that, just like camping or whatever. Sometimes you just have to. But going into a game with the purpose to slug, especially if there's one person who's really good at looping just takes the fun out for me. Like great, that one person can run the killer for 3 minutes but we are all on the floor just watching from the distance while bleeding out. Or, well, you die with 1k points because everybody got downed. Isn't the purpose of the game to basically play tag? I'm not the best looper at all, but I want to have fun in this silly game. Dcing survivors and slugging killers take that away so much that I haven't touched the game in 2 months.
@GregPiggot
Күн бұрын
Ive been in that situation before and honestly i i always expect the loss as a solo queqe survivor so i didnt really care. I just went back to killer after the match anyway
@wyattwilliams3641
2 күн бұрын
As a survivor main, slugging makes the match feel nearly impossible and as such most of the time results in MANY DCs. People hate having their time wasted and slugging completely wastes all survivors time.
@rebarodriguez4803
Күн бұрын
Fr I hate being bled out
@hde1008
Күн бұрын
And thats why it is a loose loose situation, no one wants to have their time wasted, but if the killer doesnt they are put into a flat disadvantage. Slugging wastes survivors time, while not slugging wasted the killers time because unless they are a really good killer there is not much they can do.
@ymer6587
Күн бұрын
@@hde1008an average killer should be able to get a 3-4K without a 4-man slug at the start
@farcried8279
Күн бұрын
Cry then 😂
@ymer6587
Күн бұрын
@@farcried8279 I can’t tell actually a reply to me cus it doesn’t make perfect sense..
@Puffalope
2 күн бұрын
awesome video, kinda insane how much better the game feels when you just dont do the objective
@Noimnotathing
2 күн бұрын
Your content is my favorite since returning to the game after 2v8!
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
come to brazil
@Tibinksss
Күн бұрын
@@Carniveris r/suddenlycaralho ?
@Toughmittens
16 сағат бұрын
Kill survivors= objective fulfilled
@BBS-dl1lt
8 сағат бұрын
Is killing survivors not the objective?
@JaysaxDBD
2 күн бұрын
BHVR might see this, understand the existence of a problem and then just decide to buff anti-slugging perks for survivors.
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
this was just a convoluted way to get my bp back into bbq so if they see this pls gimme my bbq tokens back
@TTV_CamEatsLyons
2 күн бұрын
@@Carniveristhem removing the bp incentive from BBQ really changed things didn’t it
@nunmassacre199
2 күн бұрын
Idk how this is a problem. A good sfw can easily win tbh, Also its not enough that bhvr nerfed Almost Every gen defense perk and Buffed surv perks.. Also what Buff to anti slugging are u thinking about?
@Prof.Lusche
Күн бұрын
nah bro, theyll nerf pig, trust
@jamespotter779
Күн бұрын
Lol, what problem?
@Crispy_DAWG
Күн бұрын
Freddy’s high salt rate is definitely due to the fact the survivors bled out to one of the worst killers in the game 😂
@MissionControlDRG
Күн бұрын
Just the fact they lost is enough
@lovemollyxd4097
Күн бұрын
Freddy is really so hard to play, trying to play him without any perks at all makes it nearly impossible, as I'm not a killer main, neither play Freddy enough to be a master, when I play killer I usually prefer twins, they're fun😅
@Ashy_Slashy3
Күн бұрын
True lol
@EzekielPhillips-ep7vb
Күн бұрын
He 100% is not one of the weakest lmao I play Freddy almost all the time he’s my second fav besides ghostface and I get at least 2 kills every game most the time 3 or 4
@lovemollyxd4097
Күн бұрын
@@EzekielPhillips-ep7vb I can't play him really well, and he is hard for me to play, he is one of the weakest killers according to otz killer tier list and several others. Plus, I played without any perks for a personal challenge, which makes it more than extremely hard for me to get a 4k I did too get 2k and sometimes 3k, but it was unnecessarily exhausting
@ArshieMeBob
2 күн бұрын
Im pretty sure slugging evaporated my soul but also added thirty years to my life due to how much less stressful it was
@Xovak_nullus
Күн бұрын
No soul, no problem! Just become Vecna and transcend flesh with your years of life.
@BecketTheHymnist
Күн бұрын
"As someone who does plays survivor I acknowledge that this isn't the most fun play style to go against." YOU DON'T SAY
@BBS-dl1lt
8 сағат бұрын
I mean, neither is tunneling. Thats why you take your very meta anti-tunneling perks. If the meta changes, then just take different perks. The handicap survivors have right now with OTR alone is ridiculous.
@BecketTheHymnist
5 сағат бұрын
@@BBS-dl1lt I prefer getting aggressively tunneled vs getting slugged. At least when I'm getting tunneled I have multiple chases and get to actually PLAY A GAME instead of crawling around on the ground hoping that someone else can manage to pick me up.
@BBS-dl1lt
4 сағат бұрын
@@BecketTheHymnist why do you make it sound like slugging=bleeding out. Unless your teammates are terrible, they’ll just pick you up. It’s easier the pick someone off the ground than it is to pull them down from hook.
@saitouhajime3
2 күн бұрын
Honestly, if a slugging meta happened, I'd just quit playing. Every match with a slugging or tunneling killer is boring, uninteresting, and just...feels malicious.
@Yami_Oni
Күн бұрын
When I play survivor I like being slugged. Since I can still move around and sneak around lol. Being hooked takes away all control from me, so it’s boring lol. (Plus I run soul guard, so if I really want to get back up. I can.) However BHVR just needs make hook counts actually matter for Killers instead of kills. Because as this video basically shows. The incentive to slug and tunnel is literally the best and only way to really do anything as killer.
@iXSIKOBOIXi
Күн бұрын
I actually think there are so many Anti-Slug perks out there that if the meta became slugging there would be no problems just switching to "Unbreakable, We're gonna life forever, MFT and Exponential". It's really not that hard if everyone is doing it. It only feels bad because people bring anti-tunnel perks which reward you for being unhooked, so if you don't get hooked you can't benefit.
@FrankLeaderOfTheLegion
Күн бұрын
I frequently think about quitting right now because of how prominent gen rush perks or exhaustion perks are.
@kapkeik4681
23 сағат бұрын
@@iXSIKOBOIXithe problem is, if survivors are going to make their builds against slugging meta, then tunnelling will become much stronger. there’re not enough slots to “anti-things” I think the problem should be solved at the ground level
@GenericUserName443
12 сағат бұрын
@@kapkeik4681 The solution: BHVR getting their head out of their arse and actually show what people bring in the lobby, this way soloQ don´t continue to get horribly screwed over and they can bring a semblance of balance into the match. It´s ridiculous that this has not been added years ago already.
@Camscam
6 сағат бұрын
I'm actually SO EXTREMELY HAPPY you decided to make this video! I've tested this myself and realized that slugging is heavily promoted on most killers. I'm hoping that Behavior sees this so that they realize just how prominent it is. It's not fun personally-both slugging and being slugged-and I hope there's a way we can resolve this in a healthy manner before the rules of the game changes and EVERYONE starts to do the same.
@soubhikpal2067
2 күн бұрын
Thank you for the killer specific review of the video. Its quite rare for these analysis videos to fully account for the killer variation.
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
I am still sad I was missing three characters, but I'm so thankful for everything that participated!!
@Noimnotathing
2 күн бұрын
Oh sick. I’ve been seeing so many content creators mention you asked them about this, and I’ve been expectantly refreshing your channel excited to see the culmination. Let’s go!
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
A few production errors will always be my downfall, but I am very happy with the end result! Thank you for the support!!
@tildaeeswinton1990
2 күн бұрын
34:35 wow, Hag winning 850% of slugging games really makes you reconsider her on the killer tierlist :o
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
Big meaty claws elevated the win rate
@dkres82
2 күн бұрын
Hag is better than most give her credit for.
@WiwuX
Күн бұрын
I'd be in a random match as killer then just have the game end with a merciless victory and message saying "Hag won their game so you do too!"
@SuzukaLova
Күн бұрын
Hag was top 5 and got power crept, she’s really fucking good
@frosche9191
Күн бұрын
@@dkres82yeah hag like a solid a tier maybe high b
@zmpixie
2 күн бұрын
i love the knight dead by daylight (slugging withered my soul away though)
@SWIVELGOD
2 күн бұрын
omg its tarhos kovacs wife!
@thelegendgamer9639
2 күн бұрын
As a knight main, I did not know I had a wife.
@mastermario6637
2 күн бұрын
Knight bagged himself a maiden
@Doncroft1
20 сағат бұрын
I blame them increasing survivor time on hook to 140 seconds. The closer the time on hook is to the bleedout time, the more appealing slugging will become.
@flop1203
8 сағат бұрын
240 seconds is no where near 140😭😭
@Doncroft1
8 сағат бұрын
@flop1203 If you count the time to carry and hook, it actually is pretty close. Not to mention the time wasted by anti-hook perks and strategies, like dealing with bodyblocking, blinds, pallet saves, and sabotages.
@horcerordbd
2 күн бұрын
The video is really good, but holy hell I did NOT have a good time slugging 😭 I legitimately feel like I was freed from my shackles after the ten games were over.
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
nemmy main free to tunnel once more
@horcerordbd
2 күн бұрын
@@Carniveris you are so cruel to me i would never i am a good noodle
@OsuchinRiberu
2 күн бұрын
I’m shocked at how little the amount of salt I received compared to the other players. Like that’s wild in comparison. 👀
@schmoferino
Күн бұрын
We equipping WGLF after this one ‼
@QuestionedTurkey
2 күн бұрын
I’m just confused on what the point of this discussion even is. You said yourself that survivors are unprepared for this playstyle which allowed it to really shine, but then provided stats where it’s an uncommon meta where killers performed better, when… I don’t really see why that matters? If survivors start experiencing this meta, they’ll just adapt, bring anti slug, and then we’re just in the exact same boat but the video game is less fun for everyone. I just don’t understand. I can understand your point that it feels like time is being taken from killers, but the stats don’t lie. Killers when 7/10 games, which is a LOT, and survivors lose almost every game on average. Only 30% of perks were anti tunnel. I just don’t get it. This narrative that killers are losing time and survivors are weaponizing anti tunnel and it’s putting killers at a disadvantage just feels like confirmation bias. They’re winning. They win 75% of the time. That’s a LOT. Why does it need to be more often? I’m not trying to be disrespectful, but it genuinely feels like the survivor experience isn’t being taken into account for stuff like this. The game going in a slugging direction would be DETRIMENTAL to the health and vibes of the game. Nobody would want to play anymore. So I’m just trying to understand what exactly you’re trying to say with this video. Full respect, I love me some stats, not trying to come off as a bitch, I’m just genuinely curious and honestly baffled.
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
I did acknowledge the survivor experience, but this was genuinely about data and the killer playstyle and adjustment to the experiment at hand, not necessarily focusing on survivor feelings, so I'm sorry if you feel like I'm ignoring their wellbeing. I'm not trying to state anything other than from my own personal experience as Killer from what's be frustrating over the last month or so of meta and to see if other killers feel the same. Despite anti-tunnel perks being comprised of /only/ 30%, they were also the perks that have been the most notable. Even without the experiment at hand, I don't notice the stress of deja vu more than I notice the frustration of off the record and decisive strike being weaponized in my face. Of course it's not fun to be slugged, but why is it that there's an overall higher winrate percentage when you ignore a main component of the game? 70% of win rate is perfectly fine, I agree, but when an overwhelming majority of killers acknowledged that their games are easier and less stressful when you negate hooking, it's something to be aware of. I am not trying to fix any meta or offer solutions, and the flows of builds to adapt to playstyles isn't anything new. You can have a counter to everything in the game, of course people can see builds being adjusted as a result. Again, this was just a fun video showcasing data based around an experiment spawned from tweets and forum posts I've seen.
@Kazrain973
2 күн бұрын
Great killer on their main with a great build win 75% of the game showed in the experiment. You're totaly right, you just forgot that not every killer is those participant.
@JaysaxDBD
2 күн бұрын
"The game going in a slugging direction would be DETRIMENTAL to the health and vibes of the game." I thought that was the entire premise of the video, looks to me like you missed the point. It shouldn't make the experience harder for the killer if they're hooking survivors, when it takes all the effort to get them on the hook in the first place.
@jpjukes
Күн бұрын
One point I'd like to add to this is the fact that a lot of these killers are very good at what they do. Just take momo and alf (both winning over 1k games in a row) an "average" killer is unlikely to perform as well during these games if they played under the same circumstances.
@DrussNBubba
Күн бұрын
DBD STATS IS EVIDENCE GUYS 🤡🤡 Lets pretend that survivors don't dc, give up on hook or just suck complete ass at looping.
@dat_lamp
2 күн бұрын
Slugging for strategic value is always smart. Sometimes, you just need to apply pressure on three fronts. Someone on hook, someone bleeding out on the ground, and another person in chase. Keeps the 4th off Gens.
@franzukato2822
Күн бұрын
Yeah but most killers nowadays slugs all and right at the start of the game, I actually respect slugging strategically more than their whole freaking intent.
@ScooteyBootey
2 күн бұрын
man i love slugging
@SenatorGronerd
2 күн бұрын
man i love booty
@thefakebanette3483
2 күн бұрын
Wait a second that's not the line
@floraldarkness4204
2 күн бұрын
Man, I hate you as a human being
@Shizooocore
Күн бұрын
Man killers love to get gen rushed 🙆
@GMLWatcher
Күн бұрын
This is why I never took off Unbreakable
@WebzGallery
2 күн бұрын
Just want to thank you for putting all this together! As a software dev (Not a dbd dev) myself I like looking at community driven experiments like this because they are very insightful! I hope you continue to enjoy the game and bring out more interesting discussions like this!
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
Glad you enjoy it! I really appreciate that!
@TheRealJovaYT
Күн бұрын
0:14 Timestamps for those with short attention spans. Idk if 40 sections and 40 minutes of information is easy to remember for a lot of people.
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
Timestamps in the form of chapters and the pinned comment should have the section that those are looking for! I mentioned it with the assumption of people probably just wanting to see how their main/favorite content creator did.
@CindersVT
2 күн бұрын
Sadako
@Revvium
Күн бұрын
850% winrate on slugging hag is so strong, I strive for the day where i can put 12 people on the floor at once. What a blissful utopia we would be in if this were possible.
@ericdavenport7120
Күн бұрын
I can almost garaumtee at this point they're going to buff anti slug instead of buffing regression perks after hooks
@N0obusMaximus
2 күн бұрын
People say survivors have no business complaining about slugging, because they could've used anti slugging perks like unbreakable. That's like saying you have no business complaining about flooding because you could've bought flood insurance. It doesn't change the fact that floods suck. Survivors can hate slugging, and still not use perks for it because most of the time it's not going to get any value. Thankfully, slugging is still uncommon.
@iXSIKOBOIXi
Күн бұрын
Well apparently the Data shows that slugging is actually very valuable as almost across the board the killers won more games when Slugging than when hooking
@ymer6587
Күн бұрын
@@iXSIKOBOIXiI mean yeah obviously holding the survivors hostage whilst they bleed out will result in a 4K, and yes killers that go into a match with the intention of slugging will almost always bleed the survivors out
@zedsdemise7586
Күн бұрын
@@ymer6587 thats not holding the game hostage by definition, maybe you shouldnt make claims on things you dont understand?
@ymer6587
Күн бұрын
@@zedsdemise7586 it kind of is considering survivors literally can’t do anything at all, just how survivors hiding is. Sure it can’t last until the server shuts down but I think you know what I mean by that
@Peachrocks5
Күн бұрын
What bothers me the most here is that so many players on both sides view everything as an us vs. them and don’t care about how tedious the game is, they only care about winning. In a game that is this imbalanced. It’s ridiculous. Some people really need to be ignored when it comes to slugging, proxy camping, tunnelling and killer bullying. Fun MUST come first. Design elements where players spent large parts of the game doing nothing must be destroyed.
@BotSupportIronValiant
2 күн бұрын
Ironic that salt kills a slug, due to it being mostly made of water
@wheatdraws532
2 күн бұрын
Was super fascinating to get some insight on this while people were recording footage for this. Great report!
@brennab2577
4 сағат бұрын
I’m a survivor main, married to a killer main. We both agree with your video. SoloQ is a disaster but also killers have it rough in surprising ways survivors can’t often notice. I really hope this kind of data keeps coming out it because I think it’s a much stronger case for BHVR since it’s actual trackable. I love the approach. I will be tuning in for your future experiments ❤
@ima_cat_meow
2 күн бұрын
Finally got to see who created the slug experiment. Tbh been waiting for weeks lol
@xrenoid292
Күн бұрын
As if I had read (literally watched) an article in a scientific journal, it is very pleasant to contemplate such a volume of work, comparisons! I have a positive viewing experience, thank you very much!
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
Thank you!! I really appreciate that! The data analysis was one of my favorite parts about this entire process!
@GreysTavern
2 күн бұрын
I still found it telling that generally as killer players, we didn't enjoy slugging. (Alf's a monster what do you want with me. XD) Like, overall we didn't WANT slugging to be the stronger play style.
@DrussNBubba
2 күн бұрын
Who is we?
@GreysTavern
2 күн бұрын
@@DrussNBubba :p Most of us.
@detectiveswanson5956
Күн бұрын
@@GreysTavern no
@iXSIKOBOIXi
Күн бұрын
I think that comes more from the Survivor playbook than anything. We've all been conditioned into trying to play in a way that makes it more fun for the other side when they don't do anything to make it more fun for us.
@Maverick2736
Күн бұрын
@@iXSIKOBOIXi Pretty much this. If there's a thing I absolutely hate above all else, it's getting salt in endgame chat (or worse: an angry spiteful hacker on a revenge quest to screw with your system/account/etc), so that conditioned me into playing by the survivor rulebook and loosing most of my matches to 2k's and 1k's. Ideally, the game should be well-balanced enough *_not_* to produce such an arbitrary set of outside rules established by players and enforced by the threat of toxicity, but DBD being an experimental competitive game with spaghetti code and devs of questionable talent is what allowed the survivor rulebook to blossom in the community. I'm not even bothered that I have to play by survivor rules--I just wish playing by such rules was the most efficient and beneficial way for killers to play as well. But it sadly isn't.
@fieldagentreaper
2 күн бұрын
what a amazingly well done video carni
@chrisbaldwin8570
Күн бұрын
Honestly, Behavior only has themselves to blame for this one. Just have a survivor auto hook after say 20 seconds on the furthest hook from the killer and you would improve the flow of the game immensely for both sides, as survivors wouldn't be left to bleed out forever, killers wouldn't have to carry long distances from corners if they didn't want to, and it would promote more chased based gameplay. Right now, hanging only 1 survivor until they are dead and slugging the rest is really the best way to play most killers and it honestly shouldn't be that way.
@ArinadDBD
2 күн бұрын
Amazing video!!! I was glad to participate! It's very interesting to see how universally slugging resulted in better outcomes for almost every killer!
@ThePhantomSafetyPin
Күн бұрын
Except Ghostface apparently, he's not here.
@HauntLich
Күн бұрын
8:20 It's completely insane to me that the Survivor side of the game has gotten this bad. I don't even want to PLAY Surv anymore because people do this so much. This data means that even if BHVR removed your ability to die on first hook on purpose, people would just DC, which I guess is still better because then you'd get a bot, and bots know to do gens and actually get their flashlight saves. But the quitter epidemic is out of control. I feel like it's every other game, regardless of if I'm killer or survivor, and regardless of which killer I play or how. It's just a coinflip if each person's first hook is gonna be their last.
@LammerGammer
Күн бұрын
slugging is at its best when it’s only 3 survivors. Pro matches focus on tunnel 1 person, then slug the other 3 to win.
@DHKrieg
Күн бұрын
It's not a surprise. Hooking is not just risky and creates no pressure but it's outright forced downtime on the killer. It's the game literally giving survivors a free break to sit on gens
@jpjukes
Күн бұрын
I would say it depends massively. Lots of builds provide you with a big incentive to hooking a survivor (pop, pain res, bbq). If you hook the survivor in basement next to a 3 gen you have just gained a massive amount of pressure on every killer in the game. Smart survivors will try to run you away from the gens that need completed and that's when you are losing pressure as killer. To counter this as killer you just have to learn when its best to drop chase, when to tunnel when to play more passively and protect a strong close set of gens. That is why Momo (as an example) is one of the best blights in the game (imo), he is fantastic at using blights power, knows who to chase, when to drop chase and what areas of the map work best with his kit for blight.
@wish-maker
6 сағат бұрын
As a chronic booner I need yall to slug so I can get expo value pleaseeee
@ultimachain8677
Күн бұрын
I’d personally like to see you play nothing but solo queue survivor for a month straight and see how often you “go next” or DC. You do main killer for a reason, after all. 😭
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
Hi! I do mainly solo queue when I play survivor, and I play survivor as equally as I do play killer. Killer is more fun for me, but I appreciate some of the skills as survivor so I play it as often as I can! :). Solo q is fun imo.
@ultimachain8677
Күн бұрын
@@CarniverisThanks for the response! Tbh that’s awesome you play both equally to get a feel for what both experiences are like and the hardships of both. Me personally the survivor experience is just miserable and terrible, so I try to play killer more.
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
I’ve had rough days as survivor, and I’ve had rough days as killer, so I absolutely get it!
@GregPiggot
Күн бұрын
Solo queqe survivor creates killer mains😂
@EzekielPhillips-ep7vb
Күн бұрын
@@GregPiggotthis is so accurate lmao killer intill full squad of friends come online
@Jblicky_Roadkill
2 күн бұрын
You should try doctor, with knockout+sloppy butcher+claustrophobia+ Distressing. An do not hook survivors. Just slug them. It’s pretty easy, and fun. (Put the add ons, discipline and order. You can also trade out sloppy butcher, for septic touch too).
@schmoferino
Күн бұрын
Can I ask what makes it fun?
@tomsea5769
Күн бұрын
The sheer amount of times I went from unliking to liking the video is unreal. Like seven times
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
Did u end up liking it
@KenoughsEnough
2 күн бұрын
I've been drawn about this a long time as someone who primarily plays trickster. I'm generally a 12 hook gamer, but current iteration of trickster has snowball potential. This is made worse by not really having map presence and the more common prevalence of not just anti-tunnel, but worse, AGGRESSIVE anti-tunnel. It's not to have ds and otr to prevent the tunnel, it's to force the use of them to waste my valuable time. Why, then, should I not slug? Now multiple instances of strong perks aren't getting use. Now I'm turning a frustrating game into one where I'm firmly in control. It's a combination of design choice by the devs and game choice by the players and it's generally confusing. That being said, I'm not a Saturday morning cartoon villain. I don't really care about the outcome of this game and prefer running no slowdown, off meta perks and my favorite outcome is 8 hooks, no kills, and a friendly end game after a fun game. But if I'm leaning forward in my raid shadow legends g fuel gaming chair because this team is being annoying, there's rarely an incentive to hook in current patch.
@MrRevenge567
18 сағат бұрын
"Clown had an incredibly in-depth review" I'd expect nothing less from arinad what a man
@Eloxist
Күн бұрын
Killers need incentives to hook not only with perks but at base kit. At this moment, due to most of the survivor meta perks being related to hooking and being so relevant, slugging just became the stronger alternative. Now, I actually think that going from the 4 man slug playstyle from the get go is not actually that good on most killers, but if you are able to get two people down, it'd be more optimal to go for the other two (depending on the killer). A combination of a hook and multiple slugs would be a good combo for a lot of killers but the point still stands that focusing on slugs is stronger than focusing on hooks.
@MightyJabroni
Күн бұрын
It is nothing new, though. Slugging always had the advantage, that you can set your sights on whatever, straight after getting the dying state. That will always be a tactical reality, no matter what.
@Eloxist
Күн бұрын
@@MightyJabroni That is true, but due to the current meta its just more value overall, hence why you see it more often.
@maxsiqueira666
Күн бұрын
I think a good idea would be 5% haste for 10 seconds after hooking and Monstrous Shrine baser kit for all hooks
@cyberjab
Күн бұрын
For everyone panicking, idk how this is problem, if slugging outperform only in getting more 4k than 3k Sum percentage of 0-2k for slugging and hooking basically even(difference is single game) And from the video it's not really clear how many hatches there was. I'm pretty sure that hooking had more hatches escapes and it's difference surely affected final result. I think it's a big loss not including amount of hatches escapes. But i must say that having results for every single killer was really good
@xtremefps_
Күн бұрын
Excellent video! Was wondering where you had gone and had hoped you were okay. Definitely worth the wait. You know, there's been many days where I wondered, what if I just slugged to win instead of hooking, and then this video comes out. I was getting so close to making a slugging build to fk around and find out. Thanks for the information. Once again, great video!
@asideofsalt.6645
22 сағат бұрын
With the amout of perks surviors get from unhooking and the risks of sabo and blinds.... Yeah slugs are better
@zaddydemi7381
2 күн бұрын
The dredge player experimented on me 😅, Oh wow 2:57
@kaned3570
2 күн бұрын
remember when bhvr tried basekit unbreakable in the ptb? it wasnt implemented because hooks didnt respawn after a death so there were dead zones exploited. now they do i believe basekit unbreakable will be introduced in a future update but i could be completely wrong, thoughts anybody?
@ima_cat_meow
2 күн бұрын
thing is they might have to balance anti slug perks like were gonna live forever so they would need to do that along with other things if they were to i troduce that.
@MissionControlDRG
Күн бұрын
It was because the finishing Mori old idea meaning all 4 down at once meant the end
@jpjukes
Күн бұрын
I think basekit UB would kill the game. So many killers that massively benefit from slugging would drop down at least 1 tier and once again this buff would benefit swf's more than solo's.
@phillipleslie8653
2 күн бұрын
was looking forward to watching this video thank you carn and all killers that contributed
@CulturedDegenerate
18 сағат бұрын
The fact that Skull Merchant's salt and DC stats for hooking were comparable to some much stronger killers' slugging stats is hilarious. She's so bad now, come on guys
@luisbatista7923
Күн бұрын
Personally I only slug when is like 2 survivors or I KNOW if someone is near, especially if I am around a pallet or they use Flashlight. Otherwise Hook. I just try to take advantage of the situation so I dont hook somebody and 3 gens pops out of nothing
@Kenneth-od9rn
7 сағат бұрын
I really enjoyed this video, and I have a suggestion. If you were to replicate this experiment, I suggest adding a condition of "Mixed." This experiment demonstrates two extremes, only hooking and only slugging. A lot of killer mains also do both, and only slug with the intention of pressure, not bleeding out. For example, let's say you have 3 injured survivors with 2 hook stages and the last injured survivor has no hook stages. In this scenario, a killer may slug the no hook stage survivor because they won't die on hook, and then go pursue a killable survivor with the 4th one on the floor to force a killable survivor in a vulnerable position since they have to pick up the slugged one. Slugging for pressure is a lot less boring for survivor because it is intended to just buy you extra time to chase another survivor or pressure a gen, so the survivor will typically be picked up quickly and not slugged too often. Additionally, slugging for pressure can backfire, because you're not trying to slug everyone at once like you do when bleeding out, so again, even quicker pickups and you could be misplacing the pressure on the wrong person. I understand slugging is boring and abusable, but when done sparingly (2 survivors are slugged for 30 seconds total in an entire 10 minute match), it can be a fair experience for both sides. The idea is you reap most of the benefits of slugging as killer, while barely making the gaming more annoying for survivor. However this just a hypothesis, and maybe the mixed condition would peform the best or even the worst out of the other two.
@asche_bm
Күн бұрын
Hot take: Baseline Unbreakable. Problem solved. *out before killer mains start to yell at me*
@GreysTavern
Күн бұрын
It's not a bad idea at first glance. The problem is it falls apart the moment you consider things like: Survivor goes down under a pallet. Another survivor is hovering near by for the pallet save. Killer can't pick up without getting stunned, and can't chase the person hovering without the downed survivor picking themselves up. Lose/lose. It needs some heavy conditionals to avoid it being a problem, which is why when they tested it they never added it.
@maxsiqueira666
Күн бұрын
@@GreysTavern If this slug meta continues and increases, they will probably have to add even what the killers hate because they are the ones who are putting themselves in this situation.
@asideofsalt.6645
22 сағат бұрын
It'll be weaponized just like basekit BT is
@asche_bm
14 сағат бұрын
@@GreysTavern Then give it the condition that it is activated when there's only two survivors left. That would at least prevent this disgusting slugfest to avoid hatch. Which to me is the most annoying and probably also most despicable sort of slugging. Hatch is meant to be 50/50. If killers cannot handle that, they should play something different.
@BBS-dl1lt
7 сағат бұрын
@@asche_bm I'm a killer main and I agree something needs to be done about this. Dont get me wrong, i love a 4k as much as the next girlie, but slugging for it just feels sweaty and gross. I love the excitement of that final showdown for hatch. Honestly I think hatch should just spawn at 2 survivors left At 2 survivors left, the game is pretty much over anyways. With 2 survivors left, one of them can get hatch, and once they do, the exit gates power and the final survivor can try to open one. I'm absolutely fine with that as a playstyle. I truly believe securing a 4k as killer should be HARD not something that happens every single game like the current norm is.
@chrisbaldwin8570
Күн бұрын
That 850% hag win rate though.
@azurefruit3240
2 күн бұрын
SO much work was put into this and I’m very impressed!!
@spookydragon2018
Күн бұрын
Great video!! The data and analysis is so cool, I love videos like this 💜 thank you (and the other players!) for your hard work on this!! 🐎
@LeesStillGaming
2 күн бұрын
Lets gooo, really well made video!!
@Carniveris
2 күн бұрын
lees failing cj compilation next btw
@LeesStillGaming
Күн бұрын
@@Carniveris It's going to be a REALLY short video
@Foxsura
Күн бұрын
I went against OsuchinRiberu during one of the Deathslinger slugging matches. The match was on Toba Landing, and we definitely needed more organization to get through it than we did given that we were all presumably solo players. Slugging builds are a nightmare for solo queue. But hey, I got hatch!
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
If it helps,,, Osu feels bad about slugging.
@Foxsura
Күн бұрын
I hopped in his stream after the game. He was super chill and talked about the experiment he was doing. I forgot to check back on how it went, so this video was super lucky lol
@melijahv
2 күн бұрын
4k win condition at 75% what are killers complaining about then?, that's a crazy high number. I play both side but very casually.
@GreysTavern
2 күн бұрын
Keep in mind most of the people doing this challenge are some of the best people at those killers. With how poor matchmaking is you rarely get a "fair" match at that point.
@leonenjoyer
Күн бұрын
@@GreysTavern Xeno completed all killer win streak with NO PERKS OR ADD ONS. There was a 2000 win streak Blight and many others, whatever killer mains do they will always win. So what are they complaining about?
@GreysTavern
Күн бұрын
@@leonenjoyer Again, it's largely a matchmaking problem. For example: in over 700 games I only had 4 that were "close" games (2 wins, 2 losses). Virtually every other game was randoms being fed into a meat grinder. If every game was like those 4, I'd never have gotten near the winstreak I did.
@mashttyx
Күн бұрын
Almost every survivor you encounter is either terrible at the game or chilling in pubs at 3 am, so it makes sense that youll win matter what even if youre just decent at the game
@mashttyx
Күн бұрын
@@leonenjoyerbro just casually used one of the top 5 best players in the world against pub bots as an example (plus even he lost the streak many times so its not like its that bad, otr ds dh still carries even if survs are bad xD)
@ignorance413
Күн бұрын
damn hag got the 850% winrate when slugging 😭💀
@windego999
Күн бұрын
I wound up being part of a match where a nurse tried to slug for this experiment but I had Unbreakable and the 2 Kates + my friend had WGLF so they couldn't actually kill anyone despite playing nurse because everyone kept being brought back up ASAP. So to the killer called "I hate meg players" if you see this comment, it was neat playing against you.
@taleladar
Күн бұрын
Even though you didn't analyze twins, I can just tell you from experience that 90% of games vs twins I've been in or witnessed have involved all four players on the ground slugged, or say, one person on hook and the other three slugged. Victor is just nasty and imbalanced.
@IVIorat
Күн бұрын
Objective data gathering is always good, and I think it's a valuable experiment, so big props for putting it together! What I fail to understand, as someone who has played competitive or team games for over 20 years, is how a 74% chance of a 4k (88% chance of a "win" if we include 3ks as wins) whilst hooking is deemed enough to switch to another playstyle, as if it isn't remarkable for one side to have such dominance in standard play, particularly when most other competitive games are far more tuned to 50% winrates in a given skill range. Maybe I'm lucky, a statistical outlier that isn't lining up against bully squads every second match but my experience in other games makes killer in dbd feel like a treat. That's not to say killers are entitled by nature, as far more often these days I'm experiencing survivor DCs after first hook, a bad opening chase, or even more frustratingly intentionally dying on hook to force a 3v1 in a game that - looking at the data - is already an uphill struggle. Surely, the epidemic of rage quitting has to be a priority of bhvr and the community
@GreysTavern
Күн бұрын
The actual answer is that BHVR lumps the entire top 5% of the matchmaking pool together. That's like placing plats against challenger players in League or Top 500 in OW. So in those situations you can see how if someone was actually the equivalent of top 500/challenger, the vast majority of their games are going to be against plats/diamonds just because there are way more of them. Which in turn results in really screwed up win rates because they are just stomping on people who should never have been matched against them in the first place. I can personally attest for example, that in 700+ games, I only had 4 that were "close" (2 won, 2 lost funny enough). Almost every other match was the system basically just feeding people into a meat grinder because it wasn't at all a balanced match.
@IVIorat
Күн бұрын
@GreysTavern top 5% is madness. Back when I played OW regularly, I was comfortably mid-masters and my younger brother top 500, it was no contest head to head. Without a solid MMR system, likely making queue times unbearable for high skill players, I don't know how you navigate that issue
@GreysTavern
Күн бұрын
@@IVIorat Yup. That's honestly the entire problem. Now imagine how many times your brother would win if he was top 10 and you were plat. Probably hundreds if not thousands of times in a row. And that's basically how killers end up going on crazy winstreaks. That's why I keep trying to tell people that killer going on these long winstreaks isn't because they are suddenly insanely OP, it's just a matchmaking problem. Now combine that with most of the killers in this experiment being the equivalent of Top 10, let alone Top 500, and you start to see how the data ends up this way.
@lunamoonfall651
Күн бұрын
What in the hell that Plague gameplay was insane to watch, I can only be more surprised at how good people are at this silly slugging game.
@schejosar
2 күн бұрын
Oh baby, it's finally here!!!
@anonymouscletus
Сағат бұрын
9:37 THIS WAS THE MOST INSANE DOWN IVE EVER SEEN. I never knew her vomit kept momentum
@Indigo_Ninja
2 күн бұрын
I LOVE!! SLUGGING!!!
@EpidemyYT
2 күн бұрын
W video, happy to be a part of it! I hope my excel comments gave you some laughs, and as always, bubba diff :)
@ljawshl
Күн бұрын
I am super surprised you didnt ask coconut, This has his name written all over it
@eggsample.
Күн бұрын
Awesome vid! Btw what's the second music here? 0:23
@saintofthemoon1192
Күн бұрын
4 man slugging as dracula is easier than hooking survivors as him
@franzukato2822
Күн бұрын
Slugging also results in less bloodpoints after the match , as a Killer main I disdain this play style boring for me to play as the killer, absolutely infuriating to play survivor against, as both as a killer and survivor I care more for the bloodpoints than of the rankings.
@MatiMuffin
19 сағат бұрын
can we nerf Hag already? the 850% win rate is insane, Lisa done broke the scale XD
@MistarZtv
Күн бұрын
Excellent video. Wow who knew punishing killers for doing their objectives and weaponizing anti tunnel perks would lead to endemic slugging. 😭 😭 Thankfully slugging isn't too common yet where I play survivor and I genuinely I hope that it doesn't catch on.
@Dyeoxy
Күн бұрын
bhvr what have you done to your game I hate this slugging conversation, but this was a great and informational video.
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
I really wanted to preface the video because I understand there has been a lot of discourse on it, so I appreciate you watching! I've been playing the game for a bit, and it's not that I /want/ this to be meta, but it's definitely something that needs addressing, but I also don't know if it will be addressed in the right way.
@maxsiqueira666
Күн бұрын
This might be working for killers now, but in the long run all that will happen is: BHVR will give a breakable base kit or buff and introduce more anti slug perks.
@BBS-dl1lt
7 сағат бұрын
Yeah but i'm ok with this. Then survivors need to choose between which anti-whatever perks they want to bring and the killer can play accordingly. Anything that opens the door for more build variety is a good thing.
@ChannelYumYum
Күн бұрын
I LOVE SLUGGING. Jokes aside, great video. I love data like this.
@mattheworzol6405
Күн бұрын
Survivors are so used to hooking, they fail to understand that slugging is part of the game. It’s not op, it’s just everyone is basically a beginner to this play style, like they just started playing the game
@ymer6587
Күн бұрын
4 survivors on the floor is literally uncounterable without perks, occasional unplanned slugging when there is a good snowball is fine but killers that intentionally bring a slugging build and bleed everyone out is unfair and unfun for everyone involved
@mattheworzol6405
Күн бұрын
@@ymer6587 4 survivors on hook and there is nothing they can do??? Like that doesn’t prove anything also it’s legit better for killers to hook than to slug
@ymer6587
Күн бұрын
@@mattheworzol6405 A. If you’re actually hooking survivors they’ll just die instantly on hook when they reach 3rd stage which before that they can do stuff AKA the objectives B. Statistically no a 4-man slug will basically always end in a 4K
@mattheworzol6405
Күн бұрын
@@ymer6587 your point a: when you down a survivor, the other survivors on the map can come and save you instantly if you recover, and the others can still do objectives, the only difference being that the slugged survivor loses health slower. Point B: 4 survivors on hooks is an Instant win anyways, so your point of “4 downs is a win” is invalid
@ymer6587
Күн бұрын
@@mattheworzol6405 with the slugging build the first statement is ignored since it’s removed from said equation and you can’t just insta hook all 4 survivors? Assuming they’d be on first hook they would all have the chance of self unhooking although low chance, they could also possibly wiggle off
@Crimok
Күн бұрын
As a Twins main I always prefer to mix hooking and slugging and dislike to go for full slugging right away. I will go for slugging all survivors to win the game if it makes sense. I never tried it with a full build for slugging but the winrate will probaby be really high because Twins is a strong killer and designed to slug.
@maxsiqueira666
Күн бұрын
same. I only slug as a twin if I have 2 or more survivors together, overwise, i do'nt do it. i have slug gameplay as a survivor and killer
@Crimok
Күн бұрын
@@maxsiqueira666 It's just more comfortable to not lose all your pressure because of exponential, unbreakable or whatever. But it's important to keep them busy. That's the main reason why I don't go for full slugs unless there are multiple survivors injured and I know where everyone is. I also want to play Twins in the most fun way for the survivors because Twins is already disliked by many people so I want them to feel as good as possible when they play against me.
@Deadly-Shunpo
9 сағат бұрын
I mean as a survivor main, I absolutely don't want more time on hook if all it does it let killer mains come up with more ways to justify what should already have been a banable offense if done aggregiously ; slugging. There's nothing worse than looking at your hook states as a rescource you're supposed to have the same amount of every game, and then killer charecters/perks/add-ons/'playstyles' just completely avoid core game structure and leave you with this absolute just non-game. On a similar note 4Ks shouldn't be 'standard' you absolutely should have to earn them.
@foolishmortals6748
2 күн бұрын
IF ITS AROUND IT GETS DOWNED.
@agentvenom3342
Күн бұрын
So if you choose to do this place style, don’t you miss out on a lot of blood points? Like I’m curious how much blood points you would get
@thefakebanette3483
Күн бұрын
I did the Chucky games for this looking through my vod the average was about 28k which is about normal honestly
@agentvenom3342
Күн бұрын
@@thefakebanette3483 interesting thank you. Do you think it will be less because you have less hook states yeah, that’s very interesting
@thefakebanette3483
Күн бұрын
You are still chasing and doing everything else to get bp. And you still get points from hook stage it really wouldn't change that much on how no is gained on the killer side@@agentvenom3342
@toddfoolery6380
Күн бұрын
Recording the "Salt %" must have been an. . . . . . . Interesting part of the experiment. 😂
@TreRiot
Күн бұрын
Honestly I prefer slugging over hooking I hook from time to time but I mostly slug I play Huntress dredge hag nemi and doctor mostly.
@uncirtyne
2 күн бұрын
With exponential being such a decisive perk in play when it does appear, shattered hope might be really good if you want to slug
@RandomDude20004
Күн бұрын
your hag slugging build winrate is 850% great video though
@Carniveris
Күн бұрын
We gotta nerf the hag ig
@FrankLeaderOfTheLegion
Күн бұрын
I do really wish they would just carpet bombe every single gen rush and gen regression perk. Then buff bade regression by a lot. Then buff the lackluster killer perks: i.e. most hexes, forced hesi, etc. There are a ton of other changes i want to happen. But this would be a great start
@BBS-dl1lt
7 сағат бұрын
I love hexes thematically, but I will forever hate the rng of totem spawns. Just makes it not worth it. I think hexes should have thrill of the hunt clease timing as basekit. They're too easy to destroy when survivors find them in the first 20 seconds of the game. As a killer main tho, i also wish they'd rework boons. I think they're super fun to play against, but I kinda hate how easy it is to counter them. You hear and see them from a mile away (unlike hexes) and i can just insta stomp them. I wish they played more like hexes. They were active at the start of the game, covered all or most the map, they didn't make that super loud noise, and if I wanted to deal with them, i had to go out of my way to find them and take care of them. Similar to hexes, they would be high risk, high reward. If i didn't or couldn't go find them, the survivors had a massive advantage, if I did go and snuff them, then the survivor would be essentially down a perk slot. It could also open the door to a boon version of pentimento too which could be fun!
@Dromaeosaurs
5 сағат бұрын
34:38 Looks like Hag is the best slugger
@Quinnsek
Күн бұрын
I think it would really help the slugging situation overall if they made the much needed decision to nerf pig
@awoo_hoo
Күн бұрын
I'm curious what would happen if you added a condition to killers where they would haave to hook the survivor if they were really close to a hook lets say like a 4 steps away idk. If a survivor is not near a hook or lets say there are no hooks in immediate sight then they are left slugged. I'm not sure if it would make a significant change in data or not. Great video!
@theplaguedphoenix
Күн бұрын
darn I wish I could've played twins for this experiment
@yusales483
20 сағат бұрын
Nice video. BTW, the killers must be beasts to have those wr LOL
@turboyabo864
Күн бұрын
as merchant before update you could slug 2 suriviors put trap right on top of them and it was up to them to simply crawl out the trap or stay and risk have your team mate get scanned. i cant explain how well this worked but thankfully where few surivior smart enough to either crawl out the trap or duck walk and heal the down suriviors or get rid the trap,.
@Luxxxor
Күн бұрын
devs predicted slugging meta thats why they buffed we are gona live forever
@magi_n7
2 күн бұрын
Plague DBD my betrothed (carn let me pick up the slugs please GOD)
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