Problem is: It is just a copy, like a twin. So not real immortality. 😩 It's better to rely on biological solutions and avoid buses 😂
@KenOtwell
Жыл бұрын
You need continuation of consciousness but even then you get a bifurcation of identity (both the digital copy and the original human think they're the real one.)
@tompava3923
Жыл бұрын
No pun intended . . .
@mylittleheartscar
Жыл бұрын
I'd like to be uploaded, my belie is there would be a split or copy of my mind like a document if there was no way to transfer the process of being alive and conscious like pouring milk into a jar. I think it should be as easy to get optimized body as it is to buy food from a marker one day. I also believe biohacking could lead to us having all these things in combination with a link life to bridge the gap between the human and human made eco system
@EvieDoesYouTube
Жыл бұрын
As @tank5801 says, it woul be a copy. What appeals more to me is sensory interfaces, coupled with nanotechnology that repairs or replaces dead neurons as they die.
@Netanyahu-85
Жыл бұрын
I will insert 4 chips into my brain a Neuralink chip a Synchron chip a Blackrock Neurotech chip and a Paradromics chip to give me knowledge, information, intelligence, memory, a cyborg, and unlimited superpower in just one second..
@igoromelchenko3482
Жыл бұрын
But at the end you will get unskipable advertisements 😅
@Netanyahu-85
Жыл бұрын
@@igoromelchenko3482 In the end, it is useful.
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
@@igoromelchenko3482 For 99.99$/month, all ads are made redundant lol
@TropicalCoder
Жыл бұрын
I can't believe nobody questioned the basic assumption that Mind can be separated from Body. I don't mean physically - I am talking conceptionally here. Most of the brain is concerned with the physical body, and terminates in bundles of nerves travelling down the spinal cord. Of course before it gets there it encounters the brain stem. Then if you emulate the brain on a computer, can it even function without the I/O? Brain and body are intertwined. I've read that when we think, there are activations of the nerves in our larynx that formulate speech. Can we think without a larynx? And of course the brain is not an analogue of current neural networks at all. It works totally differently, transmitting neurotransmitters like dopamine across the synapse. It seems to use low frequency signals to synchronise its computations somehow. We have no analogue to that at all. We don't even understand it. Not even neuromorphic computing comes close. This is all science fiction - but admittedly fun to think about.
@marcellusbens6742
Жыл бұрын
Thank you I feel gaslighted, suddenly anyone who can code understands the secrets of consciousness all of a sudden
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
True enough, we don't know. However, simulating the brain is a lot more difficult than other organs, so the latter is presumed to be an easier challenge.
@moegreen3870
11 ай бұрын
@TropicalCoder - "Can we think without a larynx?" ya excellent point! in programming there is the concept of a "blocking function"... a function that blocks the further execution of a thread until the function returns with its results lmao it would not surprise me one bit if the brain is extremely entangled with the peripheral nervous system and other modules in very non-trivial ways... and possibly in semi-dependent ways? i.e. maybe parts of the brain freeze up or enter dysfunction if they dont get a reply from the larynx? i have heard rumors that there is also a "gut-brain axis" that is very thick with the fibers and the interconnections, like lots and lots of them! if this is the case, it probably would make it a naive assumption that neuro-imaging specialists only need to scan "this bit over here", and that they can just ignore "all those bits over there" one can picture the possible surprise when this potential lurking dysfunction might be discovered in the future, being like those 1990s videos about AOL's "youve got mail" timing out, or the Windows file explorer trying to copy files over and timing out 😂😂 my guess is if this is the outcome, the researchers are going to respond by trying to excise "external dependencies" in the digital copy... by trying to reroute the fibers or cutting them in the digital version or something and probably that will lead to alot of chaos haha btw, speaking of larynxes, several people have noticed that the famous programmer John Carmack (who recently entered into a partnership with a Canadian AI researcher) used to have a "verbal tic", where he would emit these subtle grunts or like larynx noises or something... i cant help but wonder if that was correlated with the amount of thinking he was doing? :p also a buddy of mine started to experience aphasia when he started thinking too much a decade or two ago. he had to drop out of college and netflix/chill for like 9 months to kinda sorta get his speech back! haha in my opinion your comment is spot on! there are numerous signs that point to the humble larynx as playing an important part in da whole enchilada! :) 👽
@springwoodcottage4248
Жыл бұрын
Interesting ideas, super well presented, but what is consciousness, what is emotion? If we can upload memories will this come with consciousness & emotions or neither? Such exciting & at the same moment terrifying ideas. What would it like to be immortal, what would we do, what would we feel, would we need sleep, would we sense the weather, the warm sun, the cold of winter…? We are blessed with so much, what would we gain & what would we lose? Thanks for sharing!
@orbismworldbuilding8428
Жыл бұрын
If consciousness has anything to do with information in the brain, that would be copied. Emotions have multiple aspects: -bodily and behavioral state -hormones/neurotransmitters -mental sensation and effect on thoughts A simulated brain might have simulated hormones and neurotransmitters, but might not. A simulated brain wouldn't have a body, but could simulate the activity of places where the body connects to the brain and cheat it that way. So i think there would be emotions but they might be different, less bodily more mental. The digital you might have alexithymia (the difficulty or inability to identify your emotions even if you do feel them). Autistic people often have a hard time identifying their emotions because they struggle with interoception(awareness of the body and things inside it). As an autistic person I'd imagine itd be sorta like how it was before i figured out how bring hungry but not yet starving felt, or how it was before i realized that fear makes my hands and feet feel cold.
@timothym.3880
Жыл бұрын
Our brain is so advanced that technology would truly need a 100 year revolution to make it even remotely possible, but let's say we have a way to map and upload our consciousness. I believe we would feel limited. I believe that the holy grail would be uploading directly to a clone to have any chance for a true autonomy to live forever. I personally think that uploading would be a step backwards, I think if we could make the breakthroughs to let us to truly make use of our entire brain that we would truly be able to do things that were previously undreamed of.
@tiagotiagot
Жыл бұрын
Without fully understanding, or at least having a significant level of understanding of, how the mind works; you can't really say enough of the data is already being collected to "upload your mind"; for all we know, there's all sorts of details that are missing, static charges, chemical flows, possibly some sorts of quantum chain reactions, microscopic magnetic fields, DNA expression, different shapes of molecular folding, phonons/microvibrations etc, there's tons of stuff that for all we know may hold key information required to replicate your subjective experience of existing as yourself, that are not yet included in current brain scans.
@dasanoneia4730
Жыл бұрын
There are a lot of issues with this idea one your making a copy of your brain on a server owned by who? Will you be your own user? will the storage be local to a server or distributed like on a blockchain? will you be downloaded into a robot body or what type of environment will your digital brain occupy? just to name a few?
@EmpressEris
11 ай бұрын
Depends on what you want to do. Probably a combination of both.
@74Gee
Жыл бұрын
Oh wait, literally every uploaded mind could be manipulated in unimaginable ways. Imagine being copied to 10000 versions then interrogated with threat of deletion until you disclose some information. Or if your internal clock were put 1 million times faster times faster, time would be 1 million times slower time slower. One hour would be 115 years, it would seem like everything has stopped moving and you'd go insane. You could also be put into a loop of fear for eternity. Jesus, it's not for me!
@LuisAlvarez-yz2tv
11 ай бұрын
You just explained the plot of “white Christmas” episode from the show Black Mirror
@hurley3000gt
11 ай бұрын
Correct, a program could be made to actually invent hell where you'd go for seemingly eternity
@Healing_Sounds_Santuary
Жыл бұрын
Think about this idea: A copy of your mind is not you. It is just only a mere copy.
@JennaHartDemon
Жыл бұрын
And what if you interfaced with the copy and bridged consciousnesses and then phased out the biological one while connected so the experiences merged and then clipped. What then if the continuum was there? The experience uninterrupted? The remapping of experience on the bio NN prevent, thus no deviation between the copies prior to shutdown. Who's experience is truest there?
@sinnwalker
Жыл бұрын
@@JennaHartDemonYea that's what we need for it to not be too risky. Cus it's true a copy is just a copy, but if it can be proven it's not just a copy, it makes it more viable.
@SpiderJerusalem2342
Жыл бұрын
@@JennaHartDemonIt would still only be communication between two copies and when the original is destroyed so are you.
@martiddy
Жыл бұрын
@@JennaHartDemonBut that's the thing! there's no way you can transfer the mind to the computer, because consciousness is the activity in our brains. If you stopped that activity, the consciousness of that person will be dead. You can only make a copy of the mind and have an AI clone version of you with the same experiences and personality. But the real you would be dead already. The only possible solution that I could think of is keeping your biological brain alive inside a vat while being connected to a computer. But I don't know how that would be possible without killing the person in the process.
@joe_limon
Жыл бұрын
@@martiddy I think you are underestimating the flexibility of our meat computers. We can already interface with it to control digital limbs as an extension of ourselves. Next we will see brain implants that expand our cognitive abilities. If all our memories get stored in a chip and you keep replacing adding silicon bits to that biological brain matter, that black and white divide you see as insurmountable dissolves into a sea of grey possibilities.
@HenryCalderonJr
Жыл бұрын
It is incredible especially for family or others but it is not you unless they develop your actual consciousness and emotions can be duplicated completely. That spark of life our personal energy
@darthrainbows
Жыл бұрын
IMO augmented intelligence - a human brain with digital processing attached - is the gateway to digital minds. We'll start slowly, with small augmentations, brain-computer interfaces, etc, and as they get more and more advanced, the brain will become increasingly digital, until it is effectively an entirely digital mind with a bit of organic mush attached, which can be discarded with no ill effects.
@Real_MisterSir
Жыл бұрын
It's also more than likely the only possibility for the human species to continue its evolution. The better advances we reach in medical and bio field, and the more peaceful our world becomes, the less incentivized our species become to adapt and evolve beyond our current limitations. Morality aside, when we can care for every person and make sure everyone fit into society, it means no genes get excluded or favorized in the bigger picture. Basically, everyone will forever have a chance to forward their genes and when that's the case, a species has reached an evolutionary dead end. Biodigital evolution is the next logical step for mankind in this regard, if we want to move forward as a species. Then, as you say, we may evolve into a fully digitized species with entirely new opportunities ahead of us. Perhaps, the greatest questions about our own humanity can only be answered, if we abandon our current idea of what that "humanity" means.
@patc2515
11 ай бұрын
So you are just entirely disregarding the human soul which is acknowledged by basically every society or culture that's ever existed? How would you still enjoy the human connection you have with the loved one whos died and left behind only a digital format of their brain attach to some "mush". I'm not even being sarcastic or condescending, I am actually asking cuz this topic just makes no sense to me at all and I do not see how or why anyone is enthusiastic about it. I want to, but currently do not.
@view1st
11 ай бұрын
@@patc2515 You sound as if you are borrowing a concept that originates in religion. Religion, may I remind you, has no part to play in science. And no one has yet been able to discover a soul, much less study it. For instance, is what you call a soul an emergent property of biochemical and neurophysical activities of the brain - essentially a byproduct of brain activity - or a holistic entity that exists prior to the brain and/or independently of it You seem to be referring to metaphysical concepts that lie in the intellectual pursuits of theology and philosophy rather than the tangible world of the physical sciences.
@windsorek
11 ай бұрын
BORG
@nakazonegamestreaming896
11 ай бұрын
😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣😂@@patc2515
@TheMoonKingdom
Жыл бұрын
If I can't upload my subjective awareness, & I'm only uploading a copy of my mind; what use is it? How is it different from cloning? It won't be me, but someone like me having different experiences. At the point of branching awareness; how is it different from being born a twin? If we can learn to shift our sense of presence to a digital avatar, rather than just uploading copies, then we'll really be talking immortality:)
@Kratargon
11 ай бұрын
It’s different from cloning because value drift starts at the creation of the upload, whereas with a clone, value drift is ‘from birth’. If you share 20, 30, 40 years of your experience with another consciousness, you can be much more confident in how it will act in relation to how you want it to act, with a clone you have no idea what its personality might be. Plus you have to entirely re-educate a clone, while an upload starts with decades of experience.
@TheMoonKingdom
11 ай бұрын
@@Kratargon Be that as it may; it would still be another person having their own separate experiences. I see no use in that personally.
@stinkymccheese8010
Жыл бұрын
Interesting, but the opportunities for abuse is off the charts. The natural evolution of it would be a hive mind, personally I’d prefer the replacement of body parts with cybernetics or a fully robotic body.
@chegist
Жыл бұрын
I will not tolerate another copy of myself. This is too much.
@SoHappyToSeeYou
11 ай бұрын
Technically the copy already exists as uncompiled data ready to be processed when the models and machinery begin scrapping the records. You'd have to completely erase your history and hide from everyone and everything that you could affect forever.
@inspectorcrud
Жыл бұрын
You already uploaded your mind, in this video! Love your guests, great for the channel.
@cygnus_zealandia
11 ай бұрын
A tiny piece of it, frozen in time; yes....
@benchaselife
Жыл бұрын
Did anyone else think of the Dr. Who Cybermen? In that show they find that the Cybermen had to have a type of neural suppression because of the severe pain they felt not having a real body. I've got to wonder what possible horrific side effects of having a complete digital replica of a human brain that is deprived of all the physical embodiment and stimulus might be. I suspect one could not simply delete the parts that link to having a physical form without many substantial follow-on effects.
@JorgetePanete
Жыл бұрын
That pain must have been psychological in nature, keep in mind the phantom limb syndrome
@ExtantFrodo2
Жыл бұрын
if you want to talk about the problems presented by fiction writers we could be here all day, but to address what seems to be your concern Cybermen would not be very useful if they have no feedback from their "bodies" just like the prosthetics which don't have positional tactile feedback a so much harder to operate. Like so many have discussed before, there is almost no limit to the range and kinds of senses that can be incorporated to placate and even enhance our environmental and self awareness. This is in large part what people find so fascinating about direct to brain BCI like Neurolink(Tm). Even just expanding the range of the light spectrum we can see by a little would be utterly mind blowing. Now imagine having control over a prehensile limb, remote control of switches an dials and other electronic utilities in your environment. Imagine being able to integrate with the sensors and controls of a drone or an avatar in a game. We can imagine heaven or hell depending on how these and other technologies are used, but you shouldn't let fear paralyze you into casual dismissal of the potential. Give it some thought. There's more to this than what your post seemed to portray.
@mhd7832
11 ай бұрын
Porque a Máquina não Pensa por si só e o Dissimulador que coordena o que foi Gravado e não o que o Ser humano Pensa. Pois 😃 Máquina não Pensa não Sonha não Dorme não caga não mija . E tem que ter um que Pense por Ela #
@mhd7832
11 ай бұрын
E por isso que eu penso em Transformem o Biden's Trump's e Bush Clinton Obama Putin e outros em Máquina como um Servant sobre o Controle 🎮🕹️ e assim que eu venho dizendo.#
@mhd7832
11 ай бұрын
Objects For Facts #
@linuxwillrise
10 ай бұрын
that will not be you, but a copy you will still be dead.
@shai2972
Жыл бұрын
This is amazing, but classical AI will never be sufficient because it can't model cognition or the brain at the quantum level. If a true copy is to be created, these companies will need to begin thinking about collaborations with quantum computing companies. IonQ and Quantinuum are two such companies that have already begun work on this.
@Art-AI-and-beyond
Жыл бұрын
Creating a digital copy is great but I know that many of us would prefer our brains to be slowly converted to a machine brain piece by piece using nano tech over a long period of time which would then be free to go between the digital and real world. I know the end result would be the same as simply creating a digital copy but somehow preferable where there wouldn't be two versions or the human brain doesn't have to die first but instead is slowly transferred.
@artdehls9100
Жыл бұрын
And there's the rub. How would I feel knowing I had just sent off an incarnation of myself into what might be the best digital paradise of Rudy Rucker's imagination? Oh great what fun I have cancer this sucks but hey... I can check out some frame-grabs of the digital orgy and smile! Well no way I'm going to let that guy have all the fun, he's a selfish bastard and I know it! Let that sick puppy loose in cyberspace? Not a chance! But... If I get to go... well that's different.
@chegist
Жыл бұрын
In regards of space travel this will enable us to travel to the other Galaxies as information traveling with fractions of speed of light is way more realistic then organic forms traveling with speed of Voyager.
@ct5471
Жыл бұрын
Regarding the it’s just a copy argument.I would argue that consciousness already is not a continuous thing and it would be better to say the state of consciousness someone has at any point in time. There was a past me having a state of consciousness 5 years ago, and I may or may not be able to remember to some degree, making me think I am that person. Mind uploading would be similar as there would be a Version thinking of himself to be my continued self due to preservation of memories, probably better then right now in the biological way. It wouldn’t be more or less the me right now, than I am the me of 5 years ago. That continuous self is already an illusion. If I would set back all my memories of today to the state of yesterday one could show me a video of me going on my day that i forgot about and I wouldn’t associate myself with that me as I would lack the memories, despite that version on this day would have clearly had a state of consciousness at the time.
@AlkisGD
Жыл бұрын
You are right and that's why some people in the comments here are suggesting we slowly convert our brains piece by piece so that there's a consciousness continuum, in a sort of Ship of Theseus way. Even as a thought experiment, I've been struggling with this since back in the day of Dust 514, a video game with cloned mercs whose brains were scanned by implants at the moment of death and then imprinted on a fresh clone. Altered Carbon had a similar premise and it solved the copy problem … by making it illegal in-universe for more than one copy of a person to exist. (Delicious drama ensued.) I'm really curious what the psychological effects would be for society, people contemplating getting copied and people who are copies. Personally, I have no interest at all in getting copied, because I can't identify with a copy that can exist simultaneously with me. If I were a copy, my memories would create the illusion that I'm not, so I don't believe I'd dissociate from the original (or past copies), unless I really sat down and thought about it. Like, contemplating that I could be days old while having fond memories of events from decades ago. Finally, there's the classism of it all. I'd bet anything that rich narcissists would jump at the opportunity to get copied, even if there's no consciousness continuum. Through sheer narcissism, their consciousness would become immortal, amassing untold amounts of wealth and influence 😬
@ct5471
Жыл бұрын
@@AlkisGDi have another comment elsewhere in the discussion section. A solution would be to simply extend our biological neocortex to artificial neocortex in the cloud, which would also be part of our consciousness. Luckily the neocortex is already modular and semi-redundant via cortical columns. We are unaware of their inner workings and only experience their communication as consciousness. Over time we wouldn’t recognize even if the biological parts would bit by bit be dying of, also we could that way synchronize the instance which contains biological aspects with completely non-biological based instances and the memories of their lives would also be synchronized with the, let’s say, hybrid instance. We might even have multiple bodies all at once, biological or otherwise plus much more virtual ones living in VR. So we would have all the advantages of mind uploading from the start plus our illusion of a continuous self could be maintained. But then even now the matter my body and brain are made of are entirely different from the me of 5 years ago, only the patterns in which they were assembled more or less survived. This would be the case in the above solution as the process would be both gradual and immediate thanks to the synchronization of instances.
@azbidotch
Жыл бұрын
@@AlkisGD deep thoughts, thanks. However, i think, knowing that i am a copy can very well be part of myself. I mean, i know i am the child of my parents, which is kinda a mingled copy of them. Nevertheless: me as an instance is me as an independently conscious instance, no matter if there's a flesh-and-bone first-born twin around or not. Yes, the rich narcissists. That's a political, or if you want, educational, problem. It exists with or without copying. Sadly hard to come by.
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
I think it's probable that if a perfect copy of your brain could be created, down to the sub-atomic level; even if we still don't understand consciousness, it will be enough. However, as this is extremely difficult computationally and scientifically, the hope is that we figure out how to do it with more imperfect replications of the current substrate.
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
@@ct5471 I prefer that we actually understand consciousness instead of accepting risks, but I do agree that your proposal is a good start.
@coolfarazadil199
Жыл бұрын
Nanobots would seem ideal for something like this, please look into it. Great video ❤
@AORD72
11 ай бұрын
Far better to scan using magnetic interference.
@carolineoakshett8520
Ай бұрын
Like they haven't!
@baraka99
Жыл бұрын
Anastasi, are you a transhumanist? The human experience involves a lot of feedback between the body and the brain. All kinds of organs regulate and synthesize components that influence your mood and way to feel and think. Perhaps if you can emulate all the bodily functions as a parallel algorithm then perhaps you could have another human experience inside a machine.
@azbidotch
Жыл бұрын
- the 2nd version is basically what Zoey Greystone did. - regulation is only ruling in regulated areas - in the "outer" realm everything is possible, and i think where people with enough money exist such realms will only be a matter of time. - there is also that black mirror episode where consciousnesses are being tortured in some ways. - of course, the "me" should be the owner of the digital entity of myself, and be able to make legal decisions for myself, if unique, or at least for itself if several instances exist - or should they? digital entities definitely need ethical rights. - whether i (have to) die before i'm being digitally activated might be likely, aka a regulary prerequisite (sometimes i hate safety-first regulatory minds), but not necessarily desirable for all. it might be cool to brainstorm with myself, wouldn't it? - peter f hamilton has the idea of humans living in a simulated environment for free (call it a sort of universal basic income if you want. which has IMHO to be the only fair way) - and in his novels they can change back into a clone of the physical body if they want to. cool idea. - do i want to? it's very fascinating. surely tempting. depending on circumstances: definitely. i mean: what's the alternative? i die anyway.
@yw1971
Жыл бұрын
The uploading is far away, but if we can build biological computers, than maybe we can link to them & make them undying.
@dvrrwd307
11 ай бұрын
I like the idea of uploading "me". Not just my mind. They haven't said anything about continuity. If you upload your mind, it's just a copy. "You" aren't living longer, your copy would be. Everything they talked about sounded like uploading a copy of your mind. I want continuity involved in the process. Before I upload, I'd want to know it's the original "me" and not just a copy. If not than the original "me" would just live and die like normal. I would be uploading to extend my life, not create a second me.
@LorenzoMcMaster
9 ай бұрын
If getting only your mind saved without your body doesn't look like a good deal, don't forget that the god deal sold to us for 20 centuries was not better and didn't include any guarantee. Don't forget that with the advance of robotics, sooner or later you will be able to get back an even better body that never get painful teeth trouble.
@dvrrwd307
9 ай бұрын
@@LorenzoMcMaster I agree with you about gaining a better body and all, but you miss my concern. I want the original me to live on, not a copy. My copy could be around and see what the future holds, but I'd still be dead.
@Christophorus84
9 ай бұрын
@@dvrrwd307I would recommend looking into that “God Deal” - million times better than rotting an eternity in a digital hell, hoping no one turns you off or being forgotten stuck inside a frackin’ machine. But in the end there will be no “continuity” by moving into a machine. On the other hand, Jesus promises: whoever believes in me will have eternal live. With Jesus there is real continuity. Real eternal live. It’s the real you, not a copy of you.
@dennisnielsen8030
5 ай бұрын
Lets imagine we implant a chip in your mind and now we start transferring data to that chip, and after we have collected all of it, we make an exact body double of you, and connect the double to the chip with a wire.. Lets then say that (just like when you move things with your mind on computers) you switch back and forth between controlling the double and the original, to prove that 'you' are actually in charge. That should be proof right?.. No.. How do we know that 'you' didnt die somewhere along the process, and the 'now you', is actually just a copy that think he was you? We cant know.. Just like you cant possibly know if today is actually the first day of 'your' life, and all the memories is the only reason that you believe it is continuously.. How do you know you lived the life of yesterday, and it wasnt some past brain neurons living that life?
@dvrrwd307
5 ай бұрын
@@dennisnielsen8030 I've heard that the body replaces every cell in your body over a 7 year period. That would mean that you are transitioned for one body to another seamlessly. Seems like there could be some way of doing things that way. What we need is a lot better understanding of what makes a person a person. Until we know that, we can't be sure of continuity. Unfortunately, I have no confidence that anything will be done before I die. I'm 65 and no where near read for my life to end. Instead I'll remain trapped in a deteriorating body until I die. I would be happier if I knew there was a way I could go digital or have a way to reverse aging.
@vazap8662
11 ай бұрын
We don't know whether mind uploading is possible at all, on a conceptual level. I'd say affirming that we're close to achieving it is either naive or manipulative.
@michaelwulfsohn1931
11 ай бұрын
Fantastic video, really liked it. If you want to do a follow-up, I suggest interviewing Robin Hanson on his book "The Age of Em". He uses social scientific principles to explore the nature of a society of human brain emulations. For example, what happens when some emulations run a million times faster than others, how would emulations interact with biological humans, is it like dying if a person creates a temporary copy of themselves then turns it off, etc.
@genepozniak
10 ай бұрын
If a copied mind actually became conscious within a computer, devoid of any sensory inputs, it would quickly go insane! People in sensory deprivation tanks for too long begin to hallucinate, and THEY still have some sensory input.
@MikkoRantalainen
8 ай бұрын
It should be pretty simple to simulate suitable default sensory input. For example, simulate the feeling of sitting in a chair ina room with light grey walls and smooth lighting - a generic experience would be enough to satisfy the mammalian enough to avoid going insane. In addition, if you do the scanning process willingly, you would be already thinking about it, which makes it easier to accept the results. The interesting part is that one version of your consciousness will go directly from the scanning moment to experiencing the fully digital simulation. The simulated sensory input for the simulated brain should probably start from generic scanning experience and continue from there. The interesting part is to launch multiple copies of yourself in the simulation and give each one different objective in digital life. For example, one copy of you could work forever to try to generate sustainable fusion power, another copy of you could focus on becoming a poet. Neither copy would never require a biological body to be successful in the objective they're pursuing!
@tedviens1
Жыл бұрын
The ultimate test of Awareness within a thinking machine will be the indication of an Out-Of-Body experience. If one is not comfortable with an Out-Of-Body experience one cannot really understand the phenomenon of our Awareness.
@KVMD
Жыл бұрын
i'd be more interested in uploading data into my mind than the other way around
@SoHappyToSeeYou
11 ай бұрын
That's just learning, that's already what you're doing right now.
@kevy1yt
11 ай бұрын
This all precludes the mainstream assumption that matter begets consciousness. What if it’s the other way around? That consciousness is a prime force that beget matter. Then is any of this even needed?
@jamesbarisitz4794
Жыл бұрын
The military would enjoy building the perfect soldiers brain and uploading it to a robot body. Imagine what's on the horizon of possibilities when quantum computing and ai merge to work on our ideas.
@alancollins8294
Жыл бұрын
Serious question: A simulated copy of my brain is akin to making an immortal clone but I still die so how does that make me immortal?
@AlkisGD
Жыл бұрын
With enough narcissism, it's good enough, I guess 😛
@azbidotch
Жыл бұрын
i think it boils down to "am i making a contribution to [specify] or not?" that makes you justify the duplication of self. i'm not talking of working day and night, more like, providing some cultural enrichment of sorts. and certainly it's up to you. you don't have to. :-)
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
We do not currently know how to move the stream of consciousness, but it's unlikely to be impossible, as it already emerged once from a different substrate (ie at birth).
@alancollins8294
11 ай бұрын
@@lilemont9302 emerging is different from moving, that's never happened before but I agree that it should be possible in theory.
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
@@alancollins8294 Oh, yes, I do agree that it's not the same- but afaik, everything in the physical world can be moved. I'm just saying that it obviously follows some process. Materialists in this regard have a very strange behaviour where they suddenly act as if the soul exists and doesn't exist at the same time ("you exist because of physical laws, but something about you cannot be manipulated by physical laws, because, uh..."), when the concept of transfer gets brought up. I have never seen an actually cogent explanation from this, so I assume it's some rhetorical loop.
@Scottiedoesit
Жыл бұрын
I would 100 percent volunteer for my brain to be used in this tech. Love it.
@Zurround
Жыл бұрын
Then you are out of your mind LITERALLY. You can have your brain amputated and put in one of those "jars" in this video if you want but me: HELL NO.
@marius165
Жыл бұрын
You pass out during the procedure... And the next thing you know is... you are a bodyless unstable mind in nothingness for a seemingly infinite amount of time... constantly stimulated but with no input or purpose, going crazy for eons... in a million instances... Just some random scientific test.
@spring9603
Жыл бұрын
@Scottiedoesit :))) Some churches are still looking out there for you.
@Zurround
Жыл бұрын
@@marius165 What you are describing is TERRIFYING. Scares me more than "regular" death.
@azbidotch
Жыл бұрын
you @@Zurround as you are dead anyway. it's a separate instance of your ... gathered information, which is being activated. Don't worry, you get your death.
@ivanalcolea
Жыл бұрын
This is mind-blowing, I like it :)
@virtualworldsbyloff
11 ай бұрын
As long as the self aware "Me" goes along, I am volunteer nr 1, WANT TO LIVE FOREVER !!!
@carolineoakshett8520
Ай бұрын
Well you won't know will you?!
@blijebij
Жыл бұрын
Mind uploading is intriguing. However, is it possible to upload the integrated state of an information signature, I think not, so this is essentially capturing a snapshot of someone's memory? While impressive, this concept might not be as straightforward or powerful as some people might imagine. But it is ofc an impressive start and very interesting branch of science&technology.
@nonyabiz9340
11 ай бұрын
Glad someone else on here understands how limited this tech concept is. Anyone who signs up for this will not experience anything their snapshot experiences because they will be dead.
@JMeyer-qj1pv
Жыл бұрын
The part of AI I wish my mind could do is to have a huge context memory. The human brain can only keep 5 or so different things in working memory at once, so we can only solve small problems. An AI brain can have an almost unlimited context memory and keep thousands of things in its working memory, so it can tackle much bigger problems and at a much faster rate.
@Nobody-Nowhere
Жыл бұрын
And what type of problems are you solving in your life?
@flor.7797
Жыл бұрын
for people with adhd it’s max 3 😂
@monad_tcp
Жыл бұрын
" The human brain can only keep 5 or so different things in working memory at once " That's not entirely true. I can keep easily 500.000 tokens of context without any effort or tool, if I were an LLM. And if I keep some textual notes, I can easily keep 2.000.000 tokens, I would be like GPT6 or something (2M tokens isn't really a lot, that's like a chapter of a textbook). Sure, I can't keep more than 9 items at once in my hippocampus, but I can keep things that long in my working memory, I just kind of have to swap them out and in of the hippocampus. Its like focusing, I know the information is there, I only need to focus, that takes energy and I get tired after doing it for a couple of hours.
@valves100able
Жыл бұрын
Very intereseting. This year Nobel in Physics is about «“We can now open the door to the world of electrons. Attosecond physics gives us the opportunity to understand mechanisms that are governed by electrons. The next step will be utilising them,” says Eva Olsson, Chair of the Nobel Committee for Physics.» Maybe their work can be used to increase the resolution and acuity of signal capture inside the individual neurons...? There is still a long way before we can create exact copies of a brain so that we can upload them.
@45rpm.
Жыл бұрын
I can imagine a future technology where someone could upload their mind to make a copy but I can't imagine it ever being possible for the person themselves to feel that they have had their consciousness moved from their body and into a Raspberry PI - or whatever - and they are looking out of the Pi's camera module and hearing via the microphone socket. Is that what Randal Koene meant at 6:50 ?
@DrTheRich
Жыл бұрын
There was a game that played on this concept. Where they uploaded their brain to a pc to send it across the stars, only to realize, that after uploading, they were still in their own bodies.
@encyclopath
Жыл бұрын
no one ever explained why one would expect anything else to happen.
@moshie61
11 ай бұрын
Yes just like cloning your body doesn't make that clone you, copying your brain won't make it you either... They are copies and therefore something other than you... even if they behave the same...
@45rpm.
11 ай бұрын
@@moshie61 Yes, that's a good way of putting it.
@msergio0293
11 ай бұрын
I think the same bro
@leematthews6812
Жыл бұрын
I pity any machine that ends up with *my* mind uploaded to it! 😄😁😆
@ct5471
Жыл бұрын
Regarding timelines: I think the main determinant for most tech, whether it's mind uploading, longevity escape velocity, molecular nanotechnology, fully immersive VR, or highly advanced brain-computer interfaces, is how quickly we can achieve artificial general intelligence (AGI). Whether AGI is based on the same principles as the human mind or not, once we have it, we would most likely enter a positive feedback cycle. In this cycle, AI would continuously improve itself, both software and hardware-wise, and consequently accelerate all other areas of science and technology. Some people now think wir LLMs etc.we'll achieve AGI this decade, but recursive self-improvement could follow very quickly afterward. We could potentially be talking about just a few years after AGI. In this scenario, we might see developments like mind uploading happen relatively quickly. So, it may all hinge on how fast we get AGI up and running.
@larryjamison8298
Жыл бұрын
DR ALAN THOMPSON! Technically ALREADY ARRIVED YESTERDAY!
@christopheraaron2412
Жыл бұрын
We may be able to do a lot of what you're just talking about with just simply very good extremely powerful narrow AI perhaps being guided and directed by on existing large language model.
@perc-ai
Жыл бұрын
agi is already exists using the world perceptron model its just not as advance as we want it to be yet
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
Yes, AGI would be very, very helpful. Unfortunately, it comes with the caveat that it could be an X-risk... but it seems we've chosen this path whether we want to or not. Alas, man has dreamed of God ever since he woke up- now, God is coming.
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
@@perc-ai Not really. While generally intelligent AI does exist, AGI is usually intended to mean general intelligence on the level of a human- this has not yet been achieved.
@Zurround
Жыл бұрын
There is nothing at all CREEPY or DISTURBING about transferring a dead person's mind into a computer. This is not at all creepy as hell and the stuff of nightmares. Nobody would ever be very very disturbed by this.
@azbidotch
Жыл бұрын
i agree, but some comments show otherwise 😕
@motjuste8549
Жыл бұрын
I've crossed paths with very few minds worth preserving. It's not a path to immortality. We're all still going to die. The consciousness you recognize as you is not going to follow a digital copy into a machine. I'm not sure you could preserve a consciousness even if you replace an organic brain piece by piece with an artificial brain. I see the possibilities for some great sci-fi/horror movies.
@lc2c177
Жыл бұрын
Yeah I don’t get why all the geniuses in the video sound as delusional as some religious zealots..they sound like they’re living in a dreamland
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
We do not currently know how to move the stream of consciousness, but it's unlikely to be impossible, as it already emerged once from a different substrate (ie at birth).
@lc2c177
11 ай бұрын
@@lilemont9302 these guys are talking as if they know what it is, “we will be able to travel across the universe in silicone” sound like idiots
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
@@lc2c177 Fair enough.
@ericleavitt9281
11 ай бұрын
@@lc2c177science always seems crazy at first. You just arent capable of anything other than linear thinking. Ape.
@TedToal_TedToal
Жыл бұрын
Where do I start? First, as others have pointed out, you’re making a copy, you’re not extending your own life span. How do you feel about having a copy of yourself out there? How would you feel if there were many copies, maybe thousands of copies of yourself out there? How would you feel if one of those copies did something bad? Would you feel at all responsible? How would you feel if your copy were clearly messed up mentally and extremely agitated? Do we grant it all the rights and privileges of a full human being? Will anyone disagree? Playing around with this stuff is akin to playing around with genetic engineering of brain development genes within human germ cells. It is unethical because we have no idea of the consequences. I don’t think those electron microscope scans can work without slicing up the brain into fine slices. Building a simulation of the brain based on its neurons and their interconnections is not going to give you a good copy of that brain, because there is so much more involved besides just the neurons and their interconnections. I don’t believe even the strength of the connections can be measured from a scan. We have barely scratched the surface of understanding the molecular biology of the brain. It is certain that many, many surprises await discovery. It wouldn’t surprise me if we found that quantum mechanical interactions play a role in the workings of individual neurons. We don’t even understand yet the physical basis of memory. Ask a neuroscientist if research funding is adequate and he will laugh at you. Ask him if funding could be increased quite a bit and still have enough unanswered questions to be studied. He will laugh laugh at you then to. There are enough unanswered questions to absorb 10,000 times the existing funding. And research takes time. It’s going to be a long while before we really have a good in-depth understanding of how neurons and the brain work. The issue of consciousness is of critical overriding importance. And we really have no idea what it is yet. That needs to be well-understood before embarking on a project like this. I’m guessing it’ll be 100 years before we begin to approach answers to that question. Humans are more than just a brain, our bodies are a crucial part of who and what we are. I don’t think a simulated orgasm is going to be anywhere close to a match for the real thing. Think about the feeling of touching another human being. About the integration of our senses of sight, sound, touch, temperature, vibrations, all contributing to an integrated experience in our minds, that is missing from the simulation you describe. And silicon and metal and carbon fiber components just wouldn’t have quite the wonderful feeling that the human skin gives us as we touch another organism or thing. It is supercilious arrogance to entertain for one moment the idea that our technology is anywhere near ready to take on the task of emulating something that took 4 billion years of evolution to create. We lack an understanding of what that 4 billion years has done to shape our brain. Be able to predict the consequences of this kind of technology? Impossible. When we embark on this, we embark onto a journey into the unknown. Be able to control nasty outcomes with regulations and laws and ethical standards? No way, we can expect nasty outcomes to be part of what happens. We’d better take it slow and easy, study ourselves, emulate aspects of ourselves, simulate aspects of our brains, being cautious the entire time, learning slowly, learning more and more about the mysteriousness of the human being, which we really are woefully ignorant about. We are nowhere near ready to be gods. Take a look around you at what is happening on this planet right now, and ask yourself if human wisdom is up to the task of creating something of the order you are talking about.
@marcellusbens6742
Жыл бұрын
Thank you, it’s a sad lesson to learn the average human is truly far less capable than any would hope
@Dr_Tripper
Жыл бұрын
This puts a whole new twist to walk a mile in my shoes! No need, I'll just upload your experiences, run them in a VM, and feel what you felt!
@q123q123q123q
7 ай бұрын
Not without memories
@shawnprosper9362
Жыл бұрын
Thanks for sharing
@brandoncahuec4922
11 ай бұрын
The problem of the black box in mind loading really worries me. If we are going to study something as deep and personal as the mind, I don't want even a single shadow of a doubt that that is what we are doing.
@jaywulf
11 ай бұрын
Dont worry, spooky three letter agencies are working on this problem already. Likely running human experiments.
@dmonee6196
11 ай бұрын
Eh you’re gonna die anyway. If we aren’t perfect at first, we’ll get there close enough for humanity. Our own memories are quite imperfect, as is our perception of existence. At least we’ll have options.
@Fredjoe5
10 ай бұрын
Nice idea, too bad it'll only be a copy.
@virajelix
Жыл бұрын
Excellent video, Anastasi. Yes! Without any doubt, we are living in a Cosmic Simulated Mind; but not in a sense of Matrix movie; rather, in a sense of Cosmic Mind simulation as we make simulation inside our individual mind with a big essential difference. Such knowledge is only possible in deeper understanding of existence.
@troywill3081
Жыл бұрын
I totally followed your thinking. I have thought so as well myself.
@ExtantFrodo2
Жыл бұрын
the simulation hypothesis posits that given the evident growth of computing capabilities it's not unreasonable that a universe could possibly be simulatable and given that possibility and the vast infinities involved the likelihood that we are ourselves just one of many such simulations is far greater than the likelihood that we are lucky enough to be the exclusive top level unsimulated universe.
@erobusblack4856
5 ай бұрын
😂EEG, infered, ultra sound 3 modality bci coupled with BrainGPT and mixed reality, time, brain activation tasks, life story, questionnaires to train a fully autonomous virtual human with cognitive AI
@havocthehobbit
Жыл бұрын
In sci-fi ,Dark Matter, did this well ,where they put their bodies to sleep , then upload their minds into clones light years away, then re-upload the clone experiences when you wake up into your original mind when yout clone is put to sleep. Also love what Altered Carbon did with their imagined tech as well as laws against only having one version of yourself active at a time.
@Yewbzee
Жыл бұрын
Great video and discussion. Advanced as the technology might become, there’s still the philosophical quandary of identity and continuity. Even if we can replicate a brain structure perfectly in a computer, would that really be ‘you’? It’s reminiscent of the classic Star Trek transporter debate. When crew members are beamed down, is the original person essentially terminated, with a new copy made at the destination? This new ‘copy’ might feel like they’ve continued on, but the original no longer exists to have those feelings or consciousness. So, are we merely transferring data or genuinely preserving the essence of self and consciousness
@ADreamingTraveler
Жыл бұрын
This is what I think about a lot. If you can upload and store copies of yourselves then which you is the real you? Each version would be convinced that that version of itself is the real version. The video game SOMA dwells into this topic heavily about mind uploading. It's one of my favorite games of all time and highly recommend it if this stuff even remotely interests you. If you don't really play games don't worry it's not a hard game to play lol
@commanderdante3185
Жыл бұрын
Amazing interviews Ana. Bostrom is a genius.
@govcorpwatch
Жыл бұрын
We can't upload a mind because science has shown that "the mind" exists outside of space and outside of time. How can you capture data points that don't exist in physical reality? I think this whole topic isn't well thought out as relates to consciousness and being human.
@dchdch8290
Жыл бұрын
Agree!
@robertbelongia6887
Жыл бұрын
A model of consciousness to validate the before (organic) and after (digital) being equivalent reminds me of the movies Transcendence or Chappie Is it a copy or are these companies attempting to transfer the one being? One is legacy or historical, or narcissistic reasons, the other is science fiction immortality or god like. Anyhow, the fmri brain copied to a digital one seems to also require a digital fmri body (spine, arms, legs...) to complete the simulate individual. As Nick Bostrom alluded to that some parts of the digital brain can removed to be more efficient but is that the same person or a LLM type entity? Interesting topic reminds me of the Ship of Theseus, yes?
@Dron008
Жыл бұрын
Great topic, Anastasi. I thought about it a lot. The question is "Is it enough to copy just connectome (connection of neurons) to copy mind"? There are also other glia cells (astrocytes and others) in brain which sometimes do the same work that neurons do and recent discoveries showed it. But what is more important, do we also need to copy instant state of each neuron and synapse to copy mind? I mean level of neuromodulators etc. These things could store our memories. I think that in first experiments it needs to try to make a mind uploading of some simple worm with just a hundreds of neurons, then we need to train a worm (like choosing a way for food) and check if cloned mind has this ability. BTW about methods. I read some time ago about significant progress in improving the resolution of MRI using strong magnetic fields, up to a single neuron. We would have huge ethical problems with cloned minds of course. It is even hard to imagine them now. When one can easily make millions of minds, millions of their own copies... Wow...
@klauszinser
11 ай бұрын
That would mean a copy of where there are - around 80 x 10 ^ 9 Nerv Cells and - around 100 x 10 ^ 14 Connections. Even the brain changes when learning etc, I cannot imagine that just such a scan would represent the information in the brain. Well, bit on the other side, where is it then? It reminds me of the brain of Albert Einstein. I think it is partially still in a lab. It's a very interesting subject.
@azhuransmx126
11 ай бұрын
They will copy a rat mind first, if the artificial robotic or simulated rat does the same choices than the original counterpart, we could they captured the ghost inside the bottle, but I suspect that they will soon be differentiated as time goes by, due to small disturbances, noise and sensitivity differences of the order of micro amperes and milli volts between the artificial and the biological body. Is inevitable I think.
@ADreamingTraveler
Жыл бұрын
At least half a century seems a bit conservative of an estimate. Remember many thought that AGI would not be here until at least 2040-2050 at the earliest. And now look where we are. We've almost reached AGI and once we create AGI it won't be long until we achieve ASI which would go on to make mind uploading a reality...hopefully. Either way this could be possible in a lot of peoples lifetimes especially with AGI and other technology extending our lifespans.
@Nobody-Nowhere
Жыл бұрын
So, when you have uploaded your mind to a computer and are then waiting to die. How immortal do you feel? :) Because how does this negate you not dying?
@dchdch8290
Жыл бұрын
Yeah, that probably won't be you anymore. But a kind of offspring
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
@@dchdch8290 We do not currently know how to move the stream of consciousness, but it's unlikely to be impossible, as it already emerged once from a different substrate (ie at birth).
@joe_limon
Жыл бұрын
Mind uploading is the first step. The trick we need to figure out is how to transfer consciousness in a way that you become digitized without fear of dying and being replaced by a clone.
@Citrusautomaton
Жыл бұрын
Very true. Think about a scenario like SOMA (if you haven’t played the game then PLAY IT) in which your conscience being transferred is based upon a coin-flip. Exciting and scary all at the same time!
@PygmalionFaciebat
Жыл бұрын
@joe_limon Exactly thats the keypoint. We dont really know how consciousness is occuring in the brain. We have very vague knowledge about it... literally only two small pieces of knowledge : a) we are quiet sure, that consciousness ends when an organism dies. And b) we are sure, that with aenasthesia (narcotics) we lose consciousness temporarly. Thats literally our knowledge about what we can quiet sure. Beyond that, we have million theories - none of it is really proven. Sir Roger Penrose has in my opinion the best theories so far (microtubuli) about consciousness. Dont get me wrong, i am quiet sure, he is also wrong - but it is the ''best'' we have so far. We really need to figure out, what conscious actually is, and how it works - how it occurs in organisms. When we figured it out, we are able to work with it - like transfer it. Unfortunately it seems for me, we are at least hundreds of years away from it, probably even thousands of years away from it.
@Nico-di3qo
Жыл бұрын
gradual uploading... in this way there would be continuity of consciousness.
@PygmalionFaciebat
Жыл бұрын
@@Nico-di3qo Thats a claim. No prove for it, that it works. But i admit, its a good idea from you.
@AlkisGD
Жыл бұрын
The enormous assumption here is that consciousness is "extractable", that it isn't simply a feature of our brain and its chemistry. As a thought experiment, imagine "extracting" a program from your computer and putting it in another one. There is no actual transfer: information is copied to another location, then deleted in the source. The program is just a pattern of states in the hardware. If you make a perfect copy, then it will be exactly the same. I see no reason to believe humans are any different. There's nothing to extract, only things to copy: neurons, hormones, microbiome, etc. If you succeed, you get a perfect copy that's indiscernible from the original, but still a copy, a second agent. Unless you destroy the original, then they both can exist at the same time and will immediately begin to diverge as they experience different situations and environments. At least that's what I think, Dunning-Kruger and everything.
@derasor
11 ай бұрын
My 10 year old self was going to become me, but I'm not my 10 year old self. Uploading may work the other way around, I will not become my upload but my upload will *be* me at uploading, and then he will begin his own process of *becoming* that will be completely alien from what has been experienced before. The experience of becoming itself is very dynamic, ''plastic" if you will, and this will not be uploaded since it is a real time flow. The data used in the upload will be an instantaneous state, plus the most important part, somewhat faded and fuzzy memories. For a proper upload, imho, you'd have to store the 'flow' as experienced internally (not as devices, such as a camera, would record it) and not mess with the biowetware fogginess of memories. I also grow less and less convinced about intelligence having such a extremely large space to grow as currently accepted. 'Intelligence' may already be at a somewhat close max resolution. Beyond max resolution it could exist but it becomes irrelevant, and other factors, such as actual creation become more pertinent (intelligence is just a prerequisite to the entirety of labour needed to actually make things real) Also don't buy that we are in a simulation. Imo, we may be experiencing a 3d-space shadow of the actual higher d space-time (thus the hints to simulation) but we are at base reality Anyway, thanks for tackling the subject, very interesting. Cheers
@Ranshin077
Жыл бұрын
Just think of the ego. People will do anything to keep a part of themselves from dying. In all honesty, humans do enough damage in the small life times they have. We dont need people to live long in the vast majority of cases. Although certain scientists and geniuses through history would have been able yo do so much more with more time. So in a small percentage of the cases I think this could do a lot of good. But just kind of reminds me of pantheon... be careful what you wish for. With great power and all that Jazz.
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
Humans, as a matter of fact, are the only species on Earth which consciously tries to do good, at the expense of its innermost impulses. I reject this anti-humanist thinking in its entirety, based on this evident fact.
@Aurelia-song
Ай бұрын
cope
@forgamos2000
Жыл бұрын
One question, they are able to map the brain of fruitfly completely. So do we have a living fuitfly (digitally) that is able to thing like a real biological one and is living inside a computer?
@CatNolara
11 ай бұрын
This is pretty wild. What I'm wondering, how will you ensure that the virtual brain continues developing as well as it does normally? Although, it will surely be different, don't know if for the better or the worse. We'll see, I guess. Anyway, the game SOMA is a great example of what scary implications this technology has.
@kristynsotelo1452
11 ай бұрын
it would be hooked up to a AI system to speed up learning.
@CatNolara
11 ай бұрын
@@kristynsotelo1452 sources?
@bengsynthmusic
8 ай бұрын
Developing in what sense?
@CatNolara
8 ай бұрын
@@bengsynthmusic develop in the sense of if it will behave the same when you're learning stuff etc. The connections in the brain are continually changing a little bit, just less as you grow older. I don't think anyone could model how these changes take place in a way that it behaves exactly the same.
@bruceplenderleith838
10 ай бұрын
you cannot upload something you don't understand, at best you can map and copy a neural net, the whole thing is a con
@codatheseus5060
Жыл бұрын
I think there are a couple other issues we should keep in mind. 1) Neurons are NOT STATIONARY! They do move and can move quite a bit, creating completely different pathways along the way. 2) There are probably a TON of very important neurons scattered through your body which should also be scanned and copied into the virtual mind. How awful would it be if we copied someone's mind but they felt off the whole time they existed because there were neurons which made up who they are just missing in their current copy? 3) Human Rights. We need to find ways to make it more than just illegal to torture people forever or anything of the sort even by accident. We need to make sure there are no virtual environments which are terrible for the occupants. We need to make sure they have real human rights in the real world too.
@solifugus
11 ай бұрын
Yes but based on activity in the environment, after initial placement. Neural nets that will replacement will do something mathematically equivalent.
@aclearlight
11 ай бұрын
These are very good points. I would add that we SERIOUSLY do not know how consciousness works, but it does involve an extremely complex interplay of physical and electrichemical phenomena in a highly dynamic, highly-dimensioned, "edge-of-chaos", metabolically sustained sequence of states. My sense, after considerable study, is that we're not even close to having this figured out enough to simulate it yet much less transfer "it".
@ghimbos
11 ай бұрын
imagine tomorrow you wake up and are completely paralyzed, can't see, can't hear, can't speak ... Now, this is how your uploaded mind will feel like ... Thus, my guess: this is torture enough ;-) Assume you could somehow reconnect with your uploaded self, what do you think/expect it would "tell" you? Maybe some new "inventions" or solutions for unsolved math-problems? I don't think so. My guess: "KILL ME! PLEASE!" ;-)
@solifugus
11 ай бұрын
There is no consensus on what consciousness is. Personally, I think it's just the stream of items in working memory.
@ghimbos
11 ай бұрын
@@solifugus may be ... However ... - what would it "work" / live with since it's got no senses? - what would it "work" / live for since it's got no body and can not move? - how would it KNOW anything? ...
@mrd6869
Жыл бұрын
AI will take off and it wont leave us completly in the dust. We have a small path to catch up or at least compete. Thats the neural interface and biotechnology. (Btw the neural interface will be wireless...no chip implants) Now with AGI making discoveries it can help us to figure out HOW to merge AI & human biology. We must become more than human. We must become transhuman.
@danmarquez3971
Жыл бұрын
Consciousness is a super interesting subject. It has long been hypothesized that consciousness is an entity that exchanges energy with biochemicals. For a pain receptor to create pain, for example, it must trigger a means to transmit energy to consciousness to perceive pain. All effects need energy. Detecting the energy exchange is the key to understanding consciousness.
@BRM2X
Жыл бұрын
Smart, never thought of that.
@Zurround
Жыл бұрын
This is creepy as hell. CREEPY AS HELL.
@Exania88
Жыл бұрын
if that is the case is the energy the language itself used to make consciousness or is energy a biproduct of the language needed to manipulate the energy needed to make consciousness?
@spring9603
Жыл бұрын
@@Exania88 energy is the vehicle, the means by which the encoded signal is transmitted. What actually consciousness is, we don't know. Mostly we speculate but we have no idea. The biological brain is a very important part of it. I'm arguing that intellect and intelligence is directly linked to self-awareness and a part of consciousness. I'm arguing that the ability to introspect and recognize yourself as aware, is directly linked to the intellectual capacity and henceforth to consciousness. I'd assume that a person with a mental underdevelopment, is not able to acknowledge and introspect on self, on awareness. Is not able to acknowledge themselves. Is less aware, is less conscious. This doesn't mean that they can't suffer or feel, just that the complexity of the mind is reduced and mind complexity is generating self-awareness and consciousness. So, I'm betting on the biological brain and chemistry as being the promoters and generators of consciousness but I'm guessing that's not all. The self exists but it's not aware due to intellectual limitations.
@monad_tcp
Жыл бұрын
The problem with this idea is that it presumes consciousness exists in a immaterial pocket universe that's mediated by biochemicals. This is like the brain in a jar hypothesis, or that other hypothesis that the brain is a mere antenna. The best description that I ever found is that consciusness is like a chain reaction in a nuclear reactor. The chain reaction doesn't really exist as a physical thing anywhere in the reactor. You only have atoms that either are emitting or blocking radiation. Those atoms are emitting neutrons, the chain reaction is neutrons being exchanged. I think that what brains do is a similar thing, neurons emit signals, the signals and the brain and the neurons, none of those are conscious. Sure the brain requires energy to generate the signals, but conscious isn't that either. It is literally an emergent property of the signals themselves. And I say that its like a nuclear reactor in a way, that if you have too much signals, you have a meltdown, a convulsion, the consciousness stops, if you have too little signals, that's a coma. Its only at the boundary of order and chaos that it appears, because it is an emergent behavior. Consciousness doesn't exchange anything, there's no boundary, there's no mediation between body and mind, there's only mind. What the body does has no relation to what the mind perceives. Sure, the body can affect the signals, but the mind has to interpret the signals, for all it knows, the signals magically just happen. The mind really is some sort of software, because that's how software behave, your operating system don't ever know there's a hard-drive in your computer, it just sets registers, internal registers of the CPU, its own internal state, that somehow affect change outside, aka, the hardware. And the opposite, the hardware can only set those registers. That's how a computer works. There's also no direct connection between software and hardware, except though mediation of abstraction. Because software is also an emergent behavior of calculating machines, you tear down every piece of your hardware, and you're never, ever going to see the soul of the machine, even if you put the hard drive in a microscope and look at the bits, you're still not seeing the actual software, only a dead representation. So if you can't ever reconstitute your "simple" computer state from the hard drive without actually running the program, what's the chance of brain upload every working. Well, except you can do that to computers if you know the representation of physical signals and abstract logical signals, this is the boundary, its an abstract boundary, not a physical one. So you're never going to understand consciousness from just looking at the signals in the actual hardware. Heck, that's amazingly hard to do even for computers, and we know both layers of the abstraction. Maybe there's a way to relate signals from consciousness to the outside signals, but that needs to be a self-experiment, no human ever had a brain-interface to its own brain, ironically .
@solifugus
11 ай бұрын
The problem is sheer capacity. Certainly, no single chip will be able to do this. You would need many, many, many to make and run a copy of a person. I think one individual person would be a huge project requiring a whole room, like some of the earliest computers. It's a fun philosophical discussion, though. If a person has Alzheimer's and, before each brain region dies, a chip is put over it learning from its input/output. As each brain region dies, the chip then takes over for it. At what point are you no longer you? But neural networks are very crude brute-force learning systems, based on the old crude Hodgkin's and Huxley model. We can do better.
@questionreality6318
11 ай бұрын
Uploading our consciousness to a computer would be a big mistake if it would ever be possible, but we are much further from being able to do this than people realize. Our stay in limitation was supposed to be temporary - not permanent. I made a KZitem video that touches on what consciousness is and many other topics, called “Simulation Theory - an unexpected conclusion” if it has any interest. Thank you for this video.
@DinoCism
11 ай бұрын
A copy is just that: a copy. It's always going to be limited in detail and incomplete because a human brain has many different brain states. It sounds like we will succeed in creating a copy of something we still don't understand (the human brain) and will then just project onto it our desire to believe that what we are talking to is a copy of our loved ones when it's just some AI's best approximation based on its parameters and programmed assumptions. This video actually makes me feel like we are nowhere near what she wants to believe will happen. I like sci-fi too, but in the realm of actual science there's no room for this kind of aspirational projection. People are gonna be really disappointed when they see what their supposed copy actually amounts to in reality.
@inknoidrobot1227
Жыл бұрын
Yup! I'm definitely for it. I mean why not? If you taking many school of theory? Such as Christianity or Buddhism, and even the Islamic faith. Don't they say you all are supposed to live by a certain god- line of principles? But if you look at them all when it comes to the different religions? It's all about guidelines or instructions on how you should" lead" your life. So in theory, how could you go wrong with a simulated cloned reality? It's almost like we been doing it for centuries already. So why not be open to this new way of living? I mean even some people followed cult leaders lol? If your up for that why not an ASI leader? At the end of the day with many test and human Alignment on it where it's full proof. Then why not🎉.
@CiaranMcHale
Жыл бұрын
One possible dystopian future use if/when this technology matures would be for the police to upload the memories of a suspect into a computer and then interrogate the uploaded memories. This could be broadened in scope to such interrogations being used as part of a screening process for people applying to work in sensitive government positions, and then eventually the technology might be used in regular job interviews, for filtering possible romantic partners, and divorce proceedings to verify whether a spouse has had affairs. Will any of these scenarios ever happen? I have no idea. But even if they don't, I wouldn't be surprised if science fiction authors write about such possibilities.
@larion2336
Жыл бұрын
Yep. And a cursory look at how our govts and corporations behave today leaves no doubt that they would happily pursue all of these avenues, and more. This technology is a nightmare.
@orbismworldbuilding8428
Жыл бұрын
That is horrifying and i never thought of that
@FloridaMeng
11 ай бұрын
New meaning to cyber security
@Scybes
11 ай бұрын
I have a learning disability (Short-term, working memory) and I really hope advance brain imaging can help with diagnoses and new treatment. I just need some more RAM in my brain, and I mean that quite literally.
@jasonsebring3983
Жыл бұрын
This is cool and there is obviously a lot of work to do in engineering to enable the digital self to feel real. It will not just automatically work that way most likely. For example, imagine being able to think without feeling and what a meaningless existence that would be. The entire body would have to be fully simulated along with virtual environments or being able to be embodied in robots into the real world that had the same high fidelity input as a real human. We are not just our brains, we have nerves (neuronal structures) extended throughout our entire body after all.
@orbismworldbuilding8428
Жыл бұрын
Feelings are partly physiological and partly hormonal and partly mental. You'd still feel the resulting thought processes and possibly even the mental sensations of emotion, but not nessecarily the bodily ones unless they simulate the activity of your brain stem that connects to your spinal cord/body too. I imagine itd be like a phantom body.
@willykang1293
Жыл бұрын
That book Superintelligence was also the book Elon Musk recommended.
@M4R0Zzz
Жыл бұрын
Making a digital copy of oneself, unless you perform some kind of transferring of consciousness, will not make you immortal or anything like that. And thus completely useless for you. Best case scenario, you just make a copy of yourself that is close enough so that other people perceive 'it' as you.
@zanfr123
Жыл бұрын
there are theoretical ways but they are slow, very involved and risky
@matekolonics
Жыл бұрын
@@zanfr123 what are these theoretical ways?
@cameronhuff5170
Жыл бұрын
Exactly. We don't even know for sure that consciousness is generated by the brain. There is no specific pattern of neural activity that we can point to and say "that is what generates consciousness". Not a single one. We don't even have a sensible hypothesis on what kind of pattern can generate consciousness. For all we know, consciousness, rather than being a result of patterns in physical matter, could be completely seperate from physical matter. Perhaps seperate from spacetime itself. We simply do not know. We know nothing about consciousness or the nature of experience and I'm tired of mainstream scientists pretending like they do.
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
@@cameronhuff5170 We indeed do not know, but the conclusion of this is not that it's somehow impossible to know.
@xenuburger7924
Жыл бұрын
This is a field with a bright future. However, you might explore whether the brain is a computer or actually more of a radio. Chiral enhanced spin selectivity plays an important role in generating torsion waves at the frequencies of the fine structure of molecular oxygen. What we call Qi. This energy can be detected by an oxide tunnel barrier with a persistent spin helix structure. The high frequencies involved can be converted to a useful frequency range by fabricating an adjacent structure to inject an appropriate local oscillator spectrum.
@johnstjohn4705
Жыл бұрын
I would sign up for it in a heartbeat.
@BenCaesar
11 ай бұрын
Interesting , what is appealing to you about it ?
@johnstjohn4705
11 ай бұрын
@@BenCaesar To be able to stick around and see what happens.
@jhol2752
11 ай бұрын
what if it required the total destruction of your organic brain to create an flawless copy?
@Friederich.87
Жыл бұрын
Danke für den Upload. Most of these questions can be debugged. By ascending a mountain, or tapping into the power of 5G in darkness.
@Chuck_Hooks
Жыл бұрын
Plenty of terminal patients who have nothing to lose by volunteering for these kinds of experiments. Hopefully, tech will one day allow us to "reset" the bodies we already have to stop or reverse aging, disease etc.
@Zurround
Жыл бұрын
Filmed back in 2000 Arnold Schwarzenegger did a movie called THE SIXTH DAY about a group of people who had effective immortality because if one of them were to die they would have their mind uploaded then have a new body cloned in a chemical vat and then once the body was fully cloned the mind would be "downloaded" into the brain of the new body. It was a bizarre movie.
@MementoTurtle
Жыл бұрын
@@Zurroundbruh that movies spoiling reality
@encyclopath
Жыл бұрын
The technology doesn’t do that. At best, it can only fix someone from the perspective of everyone else. Going to the doctor to be killed so a healthy duplicate can be sent home to your family is not medicine, but madness.
@jdsguam
Жыл бұрын
Nothing to lose? WTF? What if you end up in a permanent nightmare inside some tech on a shelf?
@Chuck_Hooks
Жыл бұрын
@jdsguam I am holding out hope for option two: For lack of a better word, a "reset" of our own bodies that will stop or reverse aging. And eliminate disease at the same time. If I was terminal, I would rather volunteer for those kinds of experiments, and presumably, I would still retain the mind and body I have, just younger and disease free. Doesn't seem farfetched at all if we're talking seriously about uploading minds.
@sagecoach
Жыл бұрын
Where is inherited intelligence beyond DNA / RNA carried in the reproduction of all life? We have cells living in cells holding information without a brain. A human embryo cell itself is loaded with multi-mitochondrial and other complexities transmitting information. How do brain cells utilize this attribute? Will this factor of a life transfer in its superficial data? You have stretched this progress into immortality probably not the same thing.
@mortavius-the-mad
11 ай бұрын
You can do even one better: you can grow your mind from the body into a machine over a period of time and create a superposited mind between body and machine so that when the body dies the part of the mind that grew into the machine still remains... You would need, both, a receiving server and a bridge device to deal with the bandwidth issues. The process would take a while but you would essentially turn your body into a peripheral as you slowly migrated the original mind over to the monolith server. Then when it dies you don't die with it.
@SimonAudiosuite
11 ай бұрын
A bio-mechanical ship of theseus
@mortavius-the-mad
11 ай бұрын
@@SimonAudiosuite This is true, but it is better than a mere copy, because some of the original consciousness and awareness, possibly the most vital bits, will be there.
@Talsynth
11 ай бұрын
Interesting. The mind could be like a fungus, if it can access a system, it can also remain in that system. This should be tested and experimented further upon. The concept that the mind grows out of the body is mind boggling. The mind might just be a matrix of the universe itself, thus why it could in theory grow into any matter. A mind inside of a mind, inside of a mind and so on. (edit) Like a simulation that simulates itself. If this is the case, we should not worry about our minds dying. Because they are just a branch of the infinite chain of mind. And we would just be thrown back into an earlier and older mind or a new mind from that same precursor mind. But we wouldn't mind, for we would have no memory of it.
@DeadzoneMusic
11 ай бұрын
You have a vibrant imagination, but the brain is not capable of functioning without the nervous system throughout the rest of the body
@Talsynth
11 ай бұрын
@@DeadzoneMusic That is true. But but we are talking about having the mind detached from the brain. The percieved continuity from the brain into another platform. The brain itself is a reality creating hardware device. And if we link that to an external proccess. What would then stop a merge of them? And if they are merged. Then both will be you. If you cut away one of your brain hemispheres right now, you are still you. And the hemisphere which is left will take up the slack and act as the brain. The machine could in theory do the same thing. The percieved continuity would change.
@andrewmutavi590
Жыл бұрын
An uploaded mind would be at the mercies of those manning the servers and at the mercy of external programmers,so no I wouldn't want to be uploaded,am more curious about using nano tech to optimise cellular regeneration,I believing that the body at 100% regeneration would be for all intents and purposes, immortal,n that is something that I fancy,awesome video by the way
@tomdebruyne2196
Жыл бұрын
Being uploaded would be really interesting. Some thoughts: how amazing would it be to travel to outer space with your uploaded brain and let it operate a robot. Would it be necessary to be in sync with that uploaded brain to share experiences so you can grow together with your digital twin? Syncing would be necessary to be able to be uploaded from a young age, if not, from when is the brain developed enough into a real personality in order to be uploaded and considered a copy of a person? Would our brain be able to use all the experiences our digital twin has in its own life, or would we need to be connected to an artificial brain to be able to being supplemented with all these experiences and knowledge? Same goes for the general knowledge of LLM’s, now we’re able to chat with LLM’s, but will we be able to directly tap into ‘LLM’s’ or trained artificial brains to expand our own abilities, knowledge, .. ? So many questions to be answered 😅.
@DrTheRich
Жыл бұрын
To be honest, i don't think it would feel as uploading. You, your consciousness, would still keep living in your own brain. You would make a copy of you that would travel the stars. But it wouldn't be you. There is no reason to believe that scanning and duplicating your brain would also transfer your consciousness. All that would happen is a robot that believes that it's you would be experience all those amazing things, while you would still be here, being sad realizing it didn't work as you imagined.
@ExtantFrodo2
Жыл бұрын
@@DrTheRich That can be said for the kind of uploading that Anastasia spoke of in this video, but there is another way that would involve a nanotech invasion or your brain. They would reside alongside your neurons and learn to mimic their individual functions so they can replace them whenever they die. At some point all of your biological neurons would be gone replace by electro-mechanical ones that were indistinguishable from the biological original. Even then a bifurcation (like a scanned duplicate) would be a separate individual entity whose conscious identity would diverge from the original such that remerging would be quite upsetting and unnatural (if it could even be done). Maybe I'm talking out my ass. Maybe if one grew up in a world where this was common place it wouldn't seem unnatural at all.
@sprky777
Жыл бұрын
Read the Bobiverse series. 1st book, We are Legion Total 4 books Explores this very subject
@lilemont9302
11 ай бұрын
@@DrTheRich We do not currently know how to move the stream of consciousness, but it's unlikely to be impossible, as it already emerged once from a different substrate (ie at birth). However, yes, it wouldn't be a mere duplication.
@jacobmagana4258
11 ай бұрын
@@lilemont9302there is no "stream of consciousness", that's an illusion. as long as the information is more or less the same and the rules of the simulation are close enough to that of real neurons, there is no functional difference between living normally and uploading your brain. the pattern/structure is what matters, not the matter/substrate
@iliasiosifidis4532
Жыл бұрын
This not mind uploading, it's called san junipero :D (black mirror episode) Maybe alter carbon
@dchdch8290
Жыл бұрын
one more point, both guests Randal and Nick are just great. I love that you covered such a complex and controversial topic as Mind Uploading from both technical and philosophical side.
@disruptivegarage
11 ай бұрын
whenever this gets done you could also upload to a different creature alltogether, biology is capable of it. an exact clone probably not for a while, a very good approximation, likely. its basically newgame plus. fun thing all shit would lose meaning then, we would be mere steps away from creating our own perfect creature
@PiccsChannel
11 ай бұрын
I 100% hope I live long enough to see the world in which this is possible. I would definitely do it.
@OneLeggedDiver
11 ай бұрын
Unless you’re like 70+ yrs old I think you’ll be around to catch that wave
@35andyman
11 ай бұрын
This technology won't allow "us" to live on indefinitely. At best it'll be an exact copy of our memories and personality that'll be indistinguishable to anyone that knows us. Scientists in the field of consciousness research are coming to the realization that we are a lot more than the meat computers some would like us to be.
@rustyspottedcat8885
11 ай бұрын
Brain == Master simulator. If you make rain simulation by computation will CPU get wet ?
@alexestin8553
9 ай бұрын
We lose consciousness every time we sleep or are knocked out, at least until we enter deep rem and start dreaming, which isn't most of sleep. In a meaningful way, our consciousness dies every night of actual sleep until the lower functions tell our system to reboot. We believe this is continuous consciousness because we refer to the thoughts and memories every instance of ourselves added to the pile one at a time. This is our save point. I don't see this as any different.
@jackfrost2978
Жыл бұрын
While there is effort to copy information. There is no effort to copy essence. Even if you could copy and transfer all the information into a computer. It would not function the same way as the information functions in a living brain. If they can't figure out how to transfer someones essence. They are just wasting time. Hollow copies.
@feltonhamilton21
Жыл бұрын
Consciousness is two entities Chemistry and trigonometry bonding life relationships and unrealistic things like phone conversations and anything that helps with awareness.
@REZZA2020
Жыл бұрын
Consciousness is non-local. Uploading a human brain to a digital substrate is to confuse the mechanism with the source.
@alancham4
11 ай бұрын
No it’s not close and hopefully this dystopian nightmare will never truly be possible.
@Brambrew
10 ай бұрын
I'd prefer the quiet dignity of becoming a skeleton, thanks.
@jodylufc4481
Жыл бұрын
The brain evolves due to organic interactions and needs, so after a few days the brain and upload would no longer be the same anyway.
@KoshDukai
11 ай бұрын
Why the use of "mind uploading" term, lending itself to confusion and allowing people to think that YOU are being transferred to a new platform? Maybe "mind copying/mirroring/modeling" would be closer to reality, because the original YOU isn't MOVING anywhere, just being copied. Almost like your twin isn't YOU (as a bad example). When/if this becomes a reality, YOU are just instancing copies of your "mind copy" (at the state of how it was at the time of the copy) which then both will diverge from that point onwards. Who owns/controls those mind "copies" then ? Most likely the platform owner, not you. As a very rough example, think of KZitem (the platform) and your videos (your "mind instances") ;) YOU'll know that's not you but others might/will not. If perfect, it'll be (probably) indistinguishable from the original YOU and that'll open another whole level of a very messy can of worms to everyone, especially YOU, while alive. This process might only be useful to others (getting copies of YOU), never to YOU.
@mutualattraction1382
Жыл бұрын
The brain is limited by the cranium so existentialism is the mechanistic way of discovering divine oneness.
@ZionistWorldOrder
Жыл бұрын
no to transhumanism, ill take my tek and keep my humanity too thank you. Its not the potential of technology or science i distrust, its the human minds behind it.
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