My Amazon page! The gear I use here on the channel! - www.amazon.com/shop/metalcomplex Thanks so much for watching! You can support my channel on Patreon here - www.patreon.com/metalcomplex MC stickers! - www.redbubble.com/people/metal-complex/shop?asc=u
@forgedbydragon9683
2 жыл бұрын
This video has been much needed for many people, well said
@buddhamic13
2 жыл бұрын
I feel like a good portion of us, myself included, go through a sort of character arc when it comes to knives. We first start learning about knife steels, and we're okay with the "budget" stuff. Then our taste gets more and more expensive and soon we become steel snobs. Then we start realizing that knife steels are no where near as important as we thought it was, that there are so many other things that make a knife great and that it's not always about edge retention. Finally we make it to the end and have the same ideology MC explained in this video where you just buy what you like and let other people buy what they like. lol
@anotheridiot413
2 жыл бұрын
Late comment, but I just went through it myself. Passed up a nice Hogue off of someone because I thought 154CM wasn't good enough and spent the money on an M390 knife online. Love the thing, but I'm still not good at sharpening. Ended up continuing to carry my old budget knife, which uses 440C. Funny how that works.
@PuReBlOoD3478
2 жыл бұрын
Well said. I agree 1 hundo.
@MattH-wg7ou
Жыл бұрын
I dig 154CM.
@Nick_Gurr80
Жыл бұрын
You just explained my life bro
@chimchu3232
Жыл бұрын
Yeah, sort of. I kinda realized early on that s30v or s45vn works perfectly for me, and I have no trouble sharpening it, so I never went full steel snob. If you use and sharpen your knives, you quickly realize ergonomics, blade profile, and sharpenability are more important
@tomn1026
2 жыл бұрын
I'm 58 been collecting since about 10 years old. Back when 440c was the steel , another good old one was ats34 for sure , keep up the good work .
@ringbadingbingrading1181
2 жыл бұрын
I still wouldn't mind 440c, a good treat on it makes for a wonderful knife.
@kennycraig
2 жыл бұрын
440c, alot of us know. Gerber ez out was my first knife and I still use it.
@ringbadingbingrading1181
2 жыл бұрын
@@kennycraig I have my dad's old Gerber Mark I, here's to hoping I never have to use it.
@stevesutliff1004
2 жыл бұрын
Ohh ATS34 that was the top dog when I first started collecting,and 440c with a good treat was as good as anything you could get
@alpine1600s
2 жыл бұрын
Many of the factors in steel choice is availability. Cold Steel switched from CTSXHP because S35vn was readily available.
@TheStreamingEnderman
2 жыл бұрын
FINALLY. Someone daring to stand against the Super Steel Mafia. I salute you for your message, and your bravery for talking about this. I am of the mindset that a knife can't always be determined by certain factors. Different knives serve different uses. A C70 carbon steel traditional knife may be 1000 times more valuable to someone then some "Timascus framelock". Some people want corrosion ressistance as their main benifit in a steel. Some may want edge retention. Some may want a surgical steel that gets REALLY sharp, REALLY fast. Some may even want old school carbon. Like a knife itself, value is determined on what we choose to view as valuable. Nothing can ever change that. A SAK may be perfect to some folks, a Buck 119 to another. There is no super steel that will make a Case collector stop buying Case. A knife is only as valuable as we view it to be. Steel is just one of many factors to determine what we see as an ideal knife. Great video. I agree completely.
@Zensiv
2 жыл бұрын
I have no problem with D2 especially on my budget knives that are $20-60 it’s great. But when I see a knife $150 using D2 it’s hard for my brain to get over the fact that I feel it should be less since all my D2 knives are cheaper.
@Terrswithin
2 жыл бұрын
I met a young woman who realized through seeing my Spyderco on my pocket I was a knife collector . She had started her own collection and wanted me to come by and see her knives . Her eyes lit up showing me her collection . I smiled and complimented her new found hobby. Her knives were all flashy Chinese knives. What brings you JOY is what's important ! What worked for me as a truck Driver cutting rope , cardboard , Plastic and whatever ? VG10 Spyderco was my favorite work knife .A Damn good knife .Great working steel .
@nicholasmartinez1915
2 жыл бұрын
M390 is overhyped, and pushed to market by non knife users demands; S90V is tougher and has way better edge retention. Folding cutlery, being primarily for … cutting, I think edge retention and edge stability should be the focus. S90V > M390 and really should be the celebrated “super steel”. If you can put corrosion resistance aside, then tool steels offer a much better combination of edge stability, toughness, and edge retention. We as a community always have to be chasing the newest trends, especially in steels. We have had access to some of the greatest performing steels on folders, but we still need something new. Also…Geometry cuts.
@Smclaugh08
Жыл бұрын
s30v is underrated from my understanding there’s many benefits over S35 vn and heat treat is most important. like benchmade s30 v is rock solid steel while i’ve heard mkm m390 on a specific model heat treat wasnt up to par and there having problems with edges rolling easier than it should preform but every steel has its pros cons based on specific needs
@bones10145
8 ай бұрын
I dunno. I have S30v, S35vn, and m390 blades. They're all pretty sweet. :)
@shenmisheshou7002
2 жыл бұрын
When I see the debates on steel I am reminded of the great Stereo "Spec" wars of the 1970s. IT was all about the "specs" and not much about the overall design aspects. Many people would be hard pressed to hear the difference between various components, but the purists would test some big brand name and declare it better. And this is they way I see steel. For most people the steel should take a back seat to the overall design, ergonomics, operation, and esthetics. I have a $20 Ganzo Firebird G-lock that I enjoy using more than some knives that cost 10 times as much. The steel is 440C and I would declare that I could go 99 days out of 100 and never feel like the knife should have better steel. Now my EDC is a Bugout aluminum but I would rather have had a "lesser" steel at a lower price, but that is the way the knife comes. I prefer it over the Ganzo because it is so light and thin that it disappears in my pocket, while the Ganzo feels heavy and bulky by comparison. I could have been happy with VG 10 if they would have offered the Bugout with aluminum scales at a price maybe like $160.
@jlogue751
2 жыл бұрын
I like trying out and having at least one example of each steel. Because I like to . That being said s30v is probably the best all round when done by spyderco and benchmade and if you have a decent sharpening apparatus then any steel isn’t that hard to sharpen really
@jlogue751
2 жыл бұрын
I have came to the same conclusion.. It's not Is chippy easy enough to sharpen holds an edge just fine It's stainless And I like it's toothy edge
@jlogue751
2 жыл бұрын
Oh hell I just replied to my own comment what the fuck
@spike--
Жыл бұрын
@@jlogue751 LOL
@Ulixes83
2 жыл бұрын
I think that knife design and blade geometry are more important than blade steel.
@ElonaldTrusk
9 ай бұрын
My favorite steel all around is AEB-L. Im starting to love magnacut but AEB-L is tried and true.
@blueridgeocean
2 жыл бұрын
Pretty much to me a buck 110 w/ 440c, 420hc or s30v are fantastic blades and their heat treatment made it so. My benchmade s90v saddle mountain is EXTREMELY sharp! My mini bugout s30v edge is nothing to write home about unlike the s90v blade.I'll use my bucks for everything, but I won't use my saddle mountain for the same tasks I put the bucks to because it's for a specific task that the blade excells at that same steel from the same company in a different design may not be a good choice. At the end of the day though I will not be able to tell the difference between s30v s90v or any other abc123 steels that are considered "premium"
@davidh0159
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you. It's not more valuable if it takes much longer to sharpen and maintain but holds the edge just as long.
@thui7889
2 жыл бұрын
Honestly, after using 20+ different steels, CTS XHP is my absolute favorite. It takes a keen fine edge, which makes superbly clean laser like cuts on cardboard (99% of my usage). I rarely experience any fuzzy cuts. It sharpens easily, a few passes through a 600 grit stone to remove deformations, and 10 passes on a leather strop each side will get it scarily sharp. Those "higher tier" steels such as maxamet and K390 don't create quality cuts like CTS XHP. Sad that it's being slowly phased away.
@izayus11
2 жыл бұрын
On which knife? Because, not to knock down xhp, but if you are talking about the chaparral, then that is pretty much the perfect geometry for an urban edc
@benjaminmichaels1759
2 жыл бұрын
I just want a steel that can resist sweat. if I keep a knife in my pocket on a hot day in humid climate the inside of my pockets tend to get soaked and it affects my knife. Stuff like d2 end up getting corriosion way too easily and I don't always want to carry some 300 dollar knife on me. What would you guys suggest is the best affordable steel in this type of situation?
@markjg2275
2 жыл бұрын
The budget steels are just fine for use I like 1095 and other carbon steels work great. I do have some Spyderco knives with Cru wear S30V and other steels. Though I prefer 1095 carbon steel like GEC traditional folders and custom 1095 , L6 carbon steel fixed blades. I like steel I can touch up easy and sharpen instead of edge retention and more difficult sharpening .
@TheAdam2877
Жыл бұрын
I remember when m390 was considered middle of the pack. Now it is for some reason considered to be at or above k390!?
@TeensierPython
11 ай бұрын
Man, I need to become a steel snob. I like knives a lot and never paid much attention to the steels they use.
@ccv1616
2 жыл бұрын
Great take on steel choices. I'm partial to steels that can hold an edge but not a PIA to sharpen. Thank you.
@kylecaraway8662
2 жыл бұрын
It's funny to cause steel quality will vary company to company. So if you get m390 steel from one company and they use a cheaper lower quality version of that steel type you get a lower quality blade. This same problem exists in the damascus steel world. It all depends on where the company sources its steel. It's just like computer chipsets and how fast they can run. Not one chipset of the same model is actually the same.
@LH_Vagrant
2 жыл бұрын
I certainly do care a great deal about blade steel, but only up to the level where it is consistent with the rest of the knife. I don't want a MagnaCut blade on a steel & plastic handle with poor ergonomics and no attention to detail. Conversely, I don't want to buy a stunningly pretty and comfortable knife that is almost perfect and then have the blade be 8cr. The components and craftsmanship should be consistent and then the price needs to match those.
@JustIn-op6oy
2 жыл бұрын
My "surgical steel" case Sodbuster brings me as much joy as any of my folders with a "supersteel".
@MattH-wg7ou
Жыл бұрын
My Benchmade 9051SBK "AFOII" has been my main user for about 15 years now, and honestly I dig the 154CM. I can get it crazy sharp and it lasts long enough for me and its easy to resharpen to crazy sharp again. I also have an old mini presidio 2 with 440C and it definitely has noticeably shorter edge retention but it too can get crazy sharp. Also that hollow grind makes it a great slicer. The only "premium" steel ive tried to sharpen was S30V and it took significantly longer than 154CM or 440C. Im scared to even try to sharpen my M390, Elmax, S45VN, 20CV, etc knives because of that experience with S30V. Id rather just send it off to a pro. Especially since I dont have the diamond stones for my Lansky, only the medium one is diamond. Sorry for the essay.
@klaassiersma4892
2 жыл бұрын
I can tell you, s30v steel with a good heath treat like that cryo treatment that Paul bos seems to use with some Buck knifes stil makes it a pretty amazing knife steel, what manifacturers do with the stuff ( heath treat, cutting geometry) is more important to me than what the exact steel formulation is.
@MF_UNDERTOW
2 жыл бұрын
The cost to produce a steel doesn’t interest me at all. The material science nerd in me looks at steels strictly in terms of performance and it’s undeniable that some steels outperform other steels in various applications. I also like to read Larrin Thomas’ articles and watch KZitemrs that test steel performance. That being said, I buy all kinds of knives in all kinds of steels because I enjoy knives.
@M.A.CKnivesandDrums
2 жыл бұрын
I never knew a knife steel video could get so deep.
@desertratedc9596
2 жыл бұрын
Dude, I love D2 for a couple of reasons my self... It is budget priced, holds an edge pretty well, and I don't have to worry about the corrosion issues because my geography and care habits don't really let it become a issue. It is a little tough to sharpen but once you upgrade to a diamond sharpening system it isn't a problem anymore. I also buy and like both S35VN and S30V but the price difference between them and D2 sometimes don't make sense. Never had M390 but have been looking at one along with a CTSXHP, 20CV and M4.
@cecilm3720
2 жыл бұрын
Great video. Knife-steel-snobs should be made to watch it. My favorite is still 440c.
@vorskin1112
2 жыл бұрын
your argument is valid. but I will continue to force myself into this false dichotomy so that I feel better about spending 800 on a production knife......
@everydaybladesinc
2 жыл бұрын
I’m not a knife expert But I did stay at a holiday inn express last night. Lol😂
@btl5008
2 жыл бұрын
People get FAR too hung up on steel type. It is on the list sure, but heat treatment and edge geometry are way more critical too performance in my experience. So long as the steel is of a decent quality, its rarely a deal maker or deal breaker. My favorite steel is CTS B75-P, which is essentially BG-42. The vast majority of people will never push the limits of a super steel on a pocket knife anyways. So as long as its a good design and the maker knows how to properly heat treat whatever steel they are using, you will likely be just fine even if it isnt the newest latest greatest supersteel to hit the market
@irishpotato8816
2 жыл бұрын
As long as it cuts to your liking then any steel will do. Personally I do like having the premium materials as a way to treat myself.
@simartnullnet
2 жыл бұрын
Well done, thank you!
@bravest81
2 жыл бұрын
I had ABSOLUTELY no problem paying $275 for an AD20s last week in D2. D2’s performance is suited just fine for what I do with knives and I put the majority of the value in the fact that is American made, with quality parts and precision, and has a new locking system.
@nomojo1110
2 жыл бұрын
Great video mate. The steel properties - fit for [my] purpose's - are far more important to me than perceived value. Gotta say though, shouldn't CTS-XHP be in the "Budget-range" being that it's just the best elements of 440 & D2 combined... just kidding 😁 Cheers!
@robinpohl2702
2 жыл бұрын
Honestly most of the time either a swiss army knife or mora would do the trick just fine, were all just spoiled
@matsherwood6277
2 жыл бұрын
I have a bunch of different knives in a bunch of different steels. I think that's cool. 😊
@philvallee645
Жыл бұрын
Perhaps this is really a case of apples and oranges. Perhaps there is more room to evaluate the virtues or I should say ‘attributes’ of each steel within a category rather than compare between categories?
@experienceprecision5406
2 жыл бұрын
I've been saying this for so long. Anyone that's a knife maker or familiar with steels before the "Super steel " boom.
@danielmccabe6559
2 жыл бұрын
Spot on information 800 for 8cr hahah. Mr complex had another video on steels it was great information also. Have a good day to all.
@CKshouta
2 жыл бұрын
he's seen the light, HE'S SEEN THE LIGHT!
@alwayswinning97
2 жыл бұрын
Is there a reason why MC never mentions Knifecenter?
@Thomamps
2 жыл бұрын
For me the name has the same importance as blade steel. They can add a bit of value or take some away.
@jdearing46
2 жыл бұрын
Great points but can't always get folks to listen to reason. 😉 Another thing I see is the hype train and value based solely upon the brand name. It's from this company so it's better than that company type of thinking. Instead of buying a knife for functionality many are buying for collectability thereby driving up costs imo. Things like that seem artificial to me somehow. To each his own though.
@mattakudesu
2 жыл бұрын
I'm a novice budget knife collector so D2 is about as premium as it gets for me
@trentondjudy
2 жыл бұрын
I only listened because you sound like Stephen Crowder giving a knife review.
@jamellelangfordiii3586
2 жыл бұрын
Until magnacut gets added.....
@metal_complex
2 жыл бұрын
That's what they used to say about M390. Magnacut is just another composition. It might be a composition a lot of people like, but it's just the next thing.
@jamellelangfordiii3586
2 жыл бұрын
@@metal_complex, totally agree, but that was my point. This list will be done again and within a few years magnacut will just be the defacto "best" because. I have a Mini Grip in 20cv which I don't use for hard tasks, because it was a gift and I don't want to abuse it. It is still super sharp and cuts whatever I need it to. I also have a Microtech UTX-70 Cali legal (yes I live in comifornia, unfortunately) in 204p. I use it daily for stuff I probably shouldn't, like staple remover, and I haven't felt the need to sharpen it yet. As a side note, the 1.9 inch Cali model is super useful for when you just need something pokey/sharp, one hand, OTF buttery goodness (still a Microtech). I don't sharpen things outside of cooking knives, but I have heard those steels will be a bitch to sharpen without specific equipment. Face that challenge when/if I get there. BTW, I have been looking into getting a good trail/camp/outdoor work fixed blade, and I really like the cold steel AK-47 fixed blade in 3v. What are your thoughts for toughness and field sharpening? Love the channel!
@jar6588
2 жыл бұрын
My steel balls are M390 😳🤣✌️🍺🇺🇸
@firstlast2514
2 жыл бұрын
Great video.
@lukepaulson3428
2 жыл бұрын
People worrying about steel when they are opening Amazon boxes that has tape designed to be ripped open with our freaking hands. 🤣
@MrLlama999
2 жыл бұрын
Wait what? Really?
@shadeshiest22
2 жыл бұрын
Lol all these knife youtubers just use expensive knives to open packages of more expensive knives
@delphicdescant
2 жыл бұрын
I've tried opening a few Amazon boxes without a blade of any kind and... If that's what it's designed for, it's designed poorly lol. Those thing are *at least* going to need some teeth.
@doctoruttley
2 жыл бұрын
So true! 😂
@false-set
2 жыл бұрын
Agreed, everything should be 8cr13mov so I can afford it.
@RovingRoninEDC
2 жыл бұрын
You have no idea how happy i am to hear someone like you, who has influence, say that about Blade steel. There are people slamming Chris Reeve for not using M390 or S90V and completely overlooking the detail and craftsmanship. And, Oh yea....The ability to sharpen your own knife!
@1581zebra
2 жыл бұрын
I’m a long time CRK fanboy and I would never buy another CRK if they switched to something like M390. Thankfully, they know who their base is, and that we’re looking for stable blades we can use hard when we need to.
@chrisnotyourbusines7739
2 жыл бұрын
I'm using my knife on job site cutting all sorts of stuff. If i can't afford to loose it, or sharpen it with my small fallkniven stone it's of no value to me.
@FrankTranDesign
Жыл бұрын
I’ve been looking for confirmation like this about the Joker Nomad with N695. Thanks for making such an awesome video with a few sheets of paper. Well done
@eyesintheskies
Жыл бұрын
@@chrisnotyourbusines7739 your doing alright if you can afford to lose a sebenza
@Stolas1777
Ай бұрын
@@eyesintheskiesfor real I can’t even afford to buy a sebenza much less lose one lol
@adamgibson6005
2 жыл бұрын
We have gone from utilizing how valuable something is to ourselves, to worrying about what value it has to someone else. This is YOUR collection or hobby, being bought with YOUR money. Who cares what someone else thinks, do it for whatever reason brings you joy, I have a buddy that is trying to buy 1 of every animal named knife (1 knife per animal), want to talk about a crapshoot of knives from a materialistic standpoint, but each one brings him the same joy so who cares what someone else thinks. Much Love MC , this video was 100% needed, we need to learn our self values again!!
@sweetdrahthaar7951
2 жыл бұрын
Grail animal folder would be Aardvark Inkosi Insingo.
@LeLilley1
2 жыл бұрын
Perfect response!!
@JustIn-op6oy
2 жыл бұрын
Turn him onto a spyderco meerkat. It's a fun little knife with a lock mechanism that just makes me smile.
@regularguyknifechannel5753
2 жыл бұрын
I love m390, I love my knives in m390, would I still love those same knives in a different steel? Absolutely, it’s the total package that generally makes a great knife. Having said that, I have fantastic luck with m390, I feel like it holds that “just sharpened” edge a bit longer, plus I don’t wait till it gets really dull before I touch it up and generally I get away with just a good strop with green compound.
@tallica4life81
2 жыл бұрын
Proper heat treat matters more to me.
@JoseMr57
2 жыл бұрын
Bingo ,plus for me how the edge grind is and the bevel finish
@shadowcastyt
2 жыл бұрын
I agree, just bought a sebenza and it kinda sucks hearing people say “eww gross, $450 for s45vn” Shut up, maybe overpriced but it’s worth it to me
@bloodymarvelous4790
2 жыл бұрын
I just bought a Sebenza in S35VN with black micarta inlays, and it's one of the greatest knives I've ever handled. Not because of the steel, but because of the way the knife's put together. I'm so impressed with it, I've ordered a Macassar Ebony inlay Sebenza (in S45VN now) from Chris Reeve directly.
@57HEMIviken
2 жыл бұрын
Congrats on the sabenza !
@张哲-d4e
4 ай бұрын
for a my Hinderer ek 3.5,its just the same😂"425 dollars for a s45vn".just don't give a fuck about others' words,i can use my money to buy the knives i like instead of buying the knives others think highly of😊
@matthuck378
2 жыл бұрын
My personal favorite steels (that I actually own and use) are D2, 14C28N, CTSBD1, 154CM, s30v, and s35vn. I also haven't spent more than about $150 on a single knife.
@kpfagerberg
2 жыл бұрын
I know. I look at some knives and really like them but can’t justify paying over $200
@mengxi6157
Жыл бұрын
Though I have spent more, it won't stop me from liking D2, S35VN, etc. So much easier to sharp them.
@kylemccaffrey3003
2 жыл бұрын
That slam on the table was absolutely necessary and very well timed 😂 thank you for the refreshing take on the community, great content as always.
@markknotoff5888
2 жыл бұрын
For me the ablity to sharpen easerly is imported to me. Tlhats why I love Curware, or Cpm 45. Thanks for putting blade steel in perspective.
@57HEMIviken
2 жыл бұрын
I remember when s30v was all the rage and now a lot of people 💩 all over it like its "stainless steel" from a gas station knife. I prefer budget and mid range steels on my users like a lot of others here have said. Excellent video!
@ericthorpe5670
2 жыл бұрын
I'm still a huge fan of s30v as well as LC200N (mostly for its stain/corrosion resistance), but damn there's something about m390!
@appalachiangunman9589
2 жыл бұрын
Yeah you can actually put a good edge back on S30V and other mid-range and especially budget steels without breaking the bank on sharpening equipment.
@no1fibersplicer525
2 жыл бұрын
The days when only a CRK or strider came in S30. When VG10 and 154Cm were too quality steels. (Still are IMO)
@LAG3
Жыл бұрын
I like S30V and VG-10. I have a couple knives with 20CV and S90V. Honestly, I haven't done much of anything with them as far as being able to report on their edge holding capability. Great video. 👍
@wayneholmes637
11 ай бұрын
I remember when 440C was the high end premium steel for knives.
@brandonseals6732
2 жыл бұрын
I'm so sick of m390 and it's analogs... its everywhere...
@JohnSmith-ze6mz
2 жыл бұрын
Funny
@jakescoolstuff22
2 жыл бұрын
154CM baby!!! The N690CO (*NOT N690) on my Steel will Gekko Mini is amazing, it takes a laser edge relatively easily and has good edge retention. I’ve got D2 on a freakin $550 Medford Infraction! Who cares! Haha.
@CKshouta
2 жыл бұрын
N690 IS N690Co. The version without Co is called N695 which is basically 440c (but tighter composition because Bohler's QC is good )
@jonathanwatson268
2 жыл бұрын
After the cost of making the steel the cost of wear from machining and finishing the steel can add a lot to the end cost too. Stuff like Maxamet has you going through way more end mills, bits, and grit material than 440C. I can't remember if you mentioned heat treat (I'm sure you did) but a proper heat treat and whether or not you have to outsource to get it can make a noticeable difference in the cost of a blade. I've seen it mentioned that Sal Glesser said that maxamet is really rough on the machines and it's why Spyderco is one of the few companies working with it.
@mattlombardi54
2 жыл бұрын
I’m so glad someone is making a video covering this topic. One of my favorite knives uses 14c28n. It’s a pretty cool steel, and the knife is really well made and under $60
@kirklobo3880
2 жыл бұрын
Would this be the QSP Hawk by any chance?
@johnryan1386
2 жыл бұрын
I recently bought a fixed blade for outdoor use in 14C28N by Ruike. For value for money it’s fantastic
@vanny101
6 ай бұрын
I love my Kubey Hydra 14c✊🏻
@g.dilla.
2 жыл бұрын
My value equation: Rants + Table Slams = High Quality Content.
@bobbthompson
2 жыл бұрын
The most overrated knife spec: blade steel. The most underrated knife spec: lock bar access.
@cadencramer2747
2 жыл бұрын
My EDC is an S45VN Sebenza and I love the steel. It's really easy to strop it when it gets a bit dull instead of doing a full sharpening every time. However, I use M390 and 20CV at work. Three reasons for that: 1. I need the best edge retention possible because I can be at work for more than a month at a time, and my KME system stays at home. 2. I sweat like crazy, so corrosion is a concern with less stainless steels. 3. Toughness isn't much of a concern because we carry other tools for prying and cutting hard materials if needed. I don't particularly like sharpening M390 and 20CV though because it takes a lot longer than S45VN.
@dr.oetqer
2 жыл бұрын
I agree. As a daily user I prefer well balanced steels like Cruwear or S35VN. At work I like to carry S110V for the reasons you mentioned, it's stainless, holds an edge for a long time and pretty easy to strop back.
@Stahlwerk88
2 жыл бұрын
I thought working a double was rough, but this guy’s work day lasts all month?!
@cadencramer2747
2 жыл бұрын
@@Stahlwerk88 my standard shift is 48hrs, but the longest I've been at work continuously is 58 days. That still doesn't hold a candle to our military though, I couldn't do a year or more at a time.
@Tuxedosam.
2 жыл бұрын
I come from a kitchen knife collection background and I am just getting into folding knives. The thing that shocked me the most was people with this mentality (seems to be more prevalent in this community).
@patrickmccrea3455
2 жыл бұрын
My favorite steel is Elmax it is fairly easy to sharpen and retains a good edge thanks bro😁👍
@trentonmouser
2 жыл бұрын
M390 is for people that don't use their knives
@JohnSmith-ze6mz
2 жыл бұрын
Thats why the edge retention is so much longer.🤣
@CKshouta
2 жыл бұрын
@@JohnSmith-ze6mz omg that cut is so deep you could call it... Magnacut
@THExDUDEx8624
2 жыл бұрын
My favorite steels are the more "midrange" steels. 154,s35,s45. Thanks for the video.
@brenp403
2 жыл бұрын
I know I'm falling into the trap that was discussed in this video, but I don't think s45vn is midrange, heh.
@THExDUDEx8624
2 жыл бұрын
@@brenp403 🤷🏼♂️ maybe you are right. I was kinda going off of what the community in general thinks. I hear 154 called budget . I don't agree with that. I fell into the m390 20cv s90 is better no matter what. I have learned for my use I like 154 and s35 because I use my knives so much ,no matter what steel it is I have 2 sharpen fairly often. I just love how easy the more" mid grade" steels are 2 maintain and or sharpen. I still love the other steels. I only have one knife with xhp and I am super happy with it. I think it's a problem when people think if a knife doesn't have m390 or magnacut it's not good. Would love 2 hear what steels you like and why.
@HamBone86
7 ай бұрын
Same here. I love 14C28N and Nitro V. It makes sharpening so enjoyable.
@spydercofanboy4433
2 жыл бұрын
As a US Marine, the steel only needs to get me through the mission. Today, working for the Postal Service, it really hasn't changed.
@teddyperkins3406
2 жыл бұрын
so the demands of the U.S. postal service are on par with those of the military? Ill be sure to thank my mailman for their service. Ive taken them for granted for far too long :(
@spydercofanboy4433
2 жыл бұрын
@@teddyperkins3406 You're welcome. I work at a processing facility and find myself in need of a blade more often than I would like.
@CNYKnifeNerd
2 жыл бұрын
@@teddyperkins3406 As a former marine, I can tell you the post office does a whole lot more to make your day to day life better. Maybe you should consider thanking them...
@WheresWaldo05
2 жыл бұрын
If you're no longer a marine than you're no longer a marine. Make sure you use past tense. I don't care what anyone says, when you're done that title doesn't stay with you forever. And I can't stand any of you military guys cause you constantly have this dire need to announce that you were in the military cause you're all so desperate for attention.
@spydercofanboy4433
2 жыл бұрын
@@WheresWaldo05 Once a Marine, always a Marine. The mission is certainly different. I don't have to carry AK bar fighting knife but I carry a Spyderco PM2 instead.
@robkeener7740
2 жыл бұрын
I in the past I bought into the steel hype. Don’t get me wrong there are steels that are better than others. As I learned more about knives , sharpening , grinds and use I now buy a knife on geometry first then ergos and design. In the last year I have bought a few knives in 8cr because it was well built and I liked the design. Quess what ? They work great at cutting stuff. Maybe they dull a little quicker than more premium Steel but it’s not like you use it once and it won’t cut through hot butter like some act. Buy what you like !
@hinklehymer6893
2 жыл бұрын
The more I use M390 the more I dislike it. I work landscape construction and beat on my knives a lot and ease of sharpening is very important to me. For me steels like S35VN and even 1095 have been awesome and way more preferable for the majority of tasks than M390 because they're way easier for me to sharpen.
@b80-s9i
2 жыл бұрын
THIS comment👆 👍👍👍
@richardsimmons6526
2 жыл бұрын
I strop my my cruwear and rex45 daily and never have a issue it takes 40 seconds and I'm done.
@hinklehymer6893
2 жыл бұрын
@@richardsimmons6526 it depends on what you're using it for. I've cut sod (around some curbing) with m30 and the wear on the blade is far greater than what 40 seconds of stropping with fix. In situations like that the difference in edge retention between m390 and aus8 is almost meaningless because everything will dull just as fast when you run it though rocks and dirt. I'd take ease of sharpening in that scenario. I realize not everybody does this on a daily basis, but that's also the point of the video.
@richardsimmons6526
2 жыл бұрын
@@hinklehymer6893 sod does do a number on blades in a hurry. Cut paper against a steel bar when I forget were my utility knife went and the rex45 strops back to hair popping pretty fast.
@davedoss4164
2 жыл бұрын
@@hinklehymer6893 pp
@dash8465
2 жыл бұрын
I think there’s a misunderstanding about where the value is, a buyer’s expectations, and what is required of the owner to reap the rewards of a premium. Premium steels aren’t just harder to machine, they’re vastly more expensive to machine… they wear and chip bits/cutters much more rapidly, the feed speed is slower (so then is daily production), they shag finishing belts much quicker, the heat treat processes are often more complicated and time consuming to extract the very best attributes (otherwise, why bother, right) and finally they’re more labor intensive to sharpen. The value built into the blade is manifested as noticeably better edge retention and/or toughness and its wholly appreciated by those of us who can (properly) razor-edge our dulled elmax or m390 blades in just a minute or two on a Ken Onion without buggering up the edge or chewing on the handle or scratching the side of the blade. “Premium” steels aren’t really for those who have not yet paid their dues practicing sharpening, or those who like to cut staples in cardboard boxes or who like digging in the rocks. My personal favorites… zdp189 folders, elmax hiking/camping/hunting fixed blades when I need it to hold a keen edge for a few days, 3v hard use fixed blades with sharpening options available, A2 and 1095 long term survival blades as they can be kept razor sharp with only a strop and Tormek paste (3v too if you’re determined and take your time).
@Ephem13
2 жыл бұрын
I'm going to add onto this, a knife with proper geometry for the task at hand in any left column steel is better than a knife with poor blade geometry for the task in the right column steels.
@adog4949
2 жыл бұрын
D2 is a very good steel, I prefer it over all of the "mid range" steels
@Fred_yolo86
2 жыл бұрын
i get hate for it but i really like d2
@christianmolick8647
2 жыл бұрын
D2 is a great example of the complexity of blade material choices. It has great properties, but in my sweaty hands where I live by the sea it quickly corrodes even with frequent oiling.
@TheStabbyCyclist
2 жыл бұрын
This is actually a great problem to have. I still remember the days when there was essentially no choice when it came to blade steel. Personally, I'm so sick of M390/20CV/204P. Ease of sharpening and corrosion resistance have become my preferred features in a steel. I'm a big fan of Vanax. Sadly it's one of the hardest to come by and could probably be considered Supremium™.
@drunknnirish
2 жыл бұрын
If those two things are what you value most high hardness AEB-L is right up your alley.
@TotalDbag24
2 жыл бұрын
I think the golden age was about 5 years ago. There were tons of steels being used giving variety. ZT came out with maxamet and vamax35 and had production knives in elmax, s30v, s35vn, and m390. Kershaw was throwing SG2, cpm154, s30v, bdz1, cpm d2, and m4 knives out. Spyderco was using the cool laminated super blue and their many sprint para2 runs. Now, other than limited editions, which seem to be less prevalent it's all standardized. Manufacturers just use like 2-3 steels for their whole lineup.
@steverodgers8035
Жыл бұрын
You where right that I was looking at the knives in the red dress 👗 (I know it's blue) my hardest steel rn is cpm 3v
@nathanf1759
2 жыл бұрын
Finally something I can send to my “non-knife” buddies that have knife questions about what to buy. Lol
@michelangelo644
2 жыл бұрын
I've always thought two kinds of ways about this. First, I remember when bark river "accidentally" had a knife or two that was labeled 20CV, but in reality, was almost certainly A2 - honest mistake or not, it makes you wonder. I know there's been other instances of things like that but that's what comes to mind. Far and away the easiest way to spot something like that is corrosion resistance, and that's what tipped that off, but for most stainless folding knives, that wouldn't be an option. Say s30V vs M390 - most of us aren't in a corrosive enough environment that we'd really notice that. Long and short, I think steel is so incredibly overhyped in knives it's ridiculous, but I also wonder how much anyone would even know the difference between s30v and m390 if it wasn't labeled. Yes I know half the people reading this are sharpening experts and know how different steels feel under their stones, etc... but I wonder if you were given 5 unmarked blades and 5 steels and not told which was which how accurate your assessment would be. And people reading this are in the 1% of the knife world that know about this stuff. It is amazing how much we trust the maker to give us the advertised steel, especially when that information is almost impossible for us to verify in many instances on the end-user level. The other thing that's probably even more important - the material makeup/chemical composition of the steel is one thing - that's what most people look at when they see steels and try to differentiate performance differences. In truth, probably even more important is the heat treat of those steels. All S30v is not created equal. All m390 is not created equal. All D2 is not created equal. I would rather a company work exclusively with a given steel and extensively push the boundaries of what's possible with heat treat and cryo than have them jump into some new wonder steel and not do that work. Heat treat is so incredibly important, and not nearly enough questions are asked about it. Most people see m390 and think that's that - they don't even stop to ask where it came from and who heat treated it, and how extensive the manufacturer's experience with that steel is. There's no real point to all of this. Good vid - got me reminiscing about this stuff.
@toxictraveller1892
5 ай бұрын
Blade shape and geometry have more to do with function than anything else. Steel choice is about longevity, environment, and ease of use/preferences. Just my 2 cents. Like the vid. Long time user and collector
@metal_complex
5 ай бұрын
Ya I read the Larrin Thomas article too 😉
@alpine1600s
2 жыл бұрын
TITANIUM is the money factor of the knife world. It is so much more expensive to machine, than aluminum, heck even more than cast iron. I don't care for titanium. It belongs in high tensile applications and in fireworks.
@AudibleVisibIe
2 жыл бұрын
Gimme that xhp, s35vn, Elmax. Hell gimme that 14c28n!
@CultureStress
2 жыл бұрын
This is my favourite one of your "commentary on the knife community" videos ever. I love the pieces of paper and how they were used, as well as the points you were making As a guy who genuinely prefers s45VN to 20CV in almost all use cases, I'm definitely going to like this video regardless, but I still think it was *especially* well done :)
@mensaswede4028
2 жыл бұрын
I bought a knife made of M390 because I didn’t want it to rust on the boat, and I wanted a nice knife. I had no idea it was a premium steel, and that there was such controversy over these things... lol.
@DanDannyDanielleBob
2 жыл бұрын
I kinda wish there was a hogue deka in s30v, s35vn, or s45vn. Its the best value in an axis lock (he was mirin my 940), but as a gift to someone as their first 'premium' knife, 20cv isn't the right choice for someone who might beat it up and doesn't have fancy sharpening equipment or experience, and hes not so good a friend that I am going to throw down that butterfly tax on a gift lol
@OGBladeReviews
2 жыл бұрын
Great vid on the psychology of knife collecting, and how we think and compare, particularly since most collectors don't use or sharpen a blade enough to realize advantages of one steel over another. Again, it's a mind game that's likely at the heart of collecting most anything. Careful that we don't fall prey to our own over thinking, comparing, and virtual "slicing and dicing." 👍😁🗡️
@charliemcawesome5012
2 жыл бұрын
Ummmm Complex yeah. M390 is best. Duh.
@283blood
2 жыл бұрын
It's all mostly a fad. I was collecting knives before it was cool, and before anyone knew what EDC even was. My first expensive "cool" knife was a Loveless chute knife ($150, holy crap) followed by a Randall #14. I remember when you just had to have German 440C, then a couple of years later it was 154CM, then it had to be "hand forged", then later stock removal. Truth is, most of us don't need "super steel" knives. The average Joe uses his pocket sticker to open envelopes, boxes, cut twine, trim fingernails, you know, regular guy stuff. Most people, if it wasn't marked, wouldn't know the difference between 440C, and S35VN, or Nilox. They just know they like a particular knife because it's cool, or "purty", and it works to cut stuff a couple of times a month on average. And those people that buy "wonder", and "grail" knives, then stick them in a Pelican case forever, their knives could be made out of Zinc for all the actual use they'll get. If you like it, and it cuts the stuff you need it to, when you need it to, that's all that matters in the end....Unless you just have a bunch of money sitting around doing nothing important.
@allthingsknives
2 жыл бұрын
This a a great point MC most people need to use their knives and determine which steels work best for them. They need to look at their daily use and determine which attributes are best for them. For a hard working tradesman who is hard on his knives M390 is an awful choice as it will most likely chip but Cruwear or 3v may be perfect for them. Another factor is who makes it, how are their heat treats, geometry and ergonomics. An 8cr at 8 thousandths behind the edge will cut M390 at 40 thousandths all day.
@cheekfun
Жыл бұрын
I definitely like corrosion resistance over mostly everything else, I can deal with sharpening but having to clean up rust is a pain. so most of my favorite steels are n690, s35vn, m390, cpm3v(coated), and vg-10.
@CedricAda
2 жыл бұрын
Wonderful vid man, my brain went straight to the super limited run spydercos in exotic steels that could very well be in 440A for the amount of use they will get!
@metal_complex
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks man! Spot on! 👏
@regan.8077
2 жыл бұрын
VG 10 is my favorite steel because its so easy to sharpen that the edge retention does not matter to me. Plus its very corrosion resistant.
@regan.8077
2 жыл бұрын
@Jesse Robinson thats weird. I took mine in the ocean and it didn't rust. I did clean and oil it after though.
@richardkev3077
8 ай бұрын
You are so correct! I felt myself getting sucked down the steel-lined rabbit hole. Then one day, I was making some feather sticks. And what steel was I using? A fixed blade with its cheap, outdated, and antiquated 1095. The other thing that occurred to me was that most of my folding knives are budget to mid-quality steel. But I have one S30V, one BD1N, one K390, and one El Max. And what did I realize? Other than the K390 (which is tiny and lives in my 5th pocket), the other knives with above-average steel sit in a drawer, shiny and unmarred. Why? So I started carrying the premium steel knives in rotation. So far, no conclusions compared to budget steel knives in daily use. But I’m out of the rabbit hole and feeling much better.
@DanielDan-rg9zw
4 ай бұрын
Let's say I like this knife in all the elements, exept for the next question, should I pay 25$ for a small vulpis, just the blade m390 model with brass handles! Is that a good price for those materials?
@dmp762
Ай бұрын
When trying to get the best bang for your buck, you're not going to care about the differences in manufacturing costs. You care about how much it costs and and how good is the product.
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