Chapters :- 00:00 Introduction 01:20 Tip of the Iceberg 06:30 Below the Surface 13:19 Middle of the Iceberg 20:43 Bottom of the Iceberg 28:21 The Depths
@johnnygyro2295
3 жыл бұрын
The theory that Shadow and Sonic were both created by Gerald, and thus are brothers, is not bad. Ironically, there's another theory that, in the Sonic movie verse, Eggman's going to use the Sonic quill he has to clone Shadow from it, giving him a new origin story. That or use it to power Metal Sonic... That being said, a bigger question is how the hell GUN itself wasn't shut down after the info on the ARK incident came out? Their secrets nearly got the Earth blown up!
@a.randomcomenter5482
3 жыл бұрын
8888
@a.randomcomenter5482
3 жыл бұрын
88888888 7
@myfellowsonicfans7131
3 жыл бұрын
@@johnnygyro2295 Government cover up probably lol. At the end of Shadow the Hedgehog though the President does talk to the GUN Chief about honoring people like Shadow and Gerald however, so if you take that as just being a few years between, you could see how they turned over a new leaf eventually.
@WaterKirby1994
3 жыл бұрын
No mention of Unused Chao Stuff like the 2-Tone Eggs & stuff regarding hacked chao like "Oh My Egg"? Also why wasn't Grind Race on this list? The fact that it's the only 2P Stage entirely exclusive to the mode should say something. It wasn't just part of an existing stage like the other 5 Level 1 Stages were. There are some theories that it may have been a scrapped Shadow Stage in the game that was abandoned in favor of Sky Rail. Also there's a lot of stuff in Shadow's game that was planned for Adventure 2 with it rumored that Digital Circuit was proposed as a potential stage.
@wistfulanthophila9317
3 жыл бұрын
I always interpreted the lyrics in pumpkin hill to be knuckles trying to stay calm by telling himself he's not scared
@nexisvids
3 жыл бұрын
Just like Shadow in White Jungle. "Shadow don't make me upset, I don't wanna hear you, Shadow don't make me upset... you're frightened at something..." Knuckles also lies to himself in an attempt to be brave I think. He's the kind of character that would totally lie about being afraid of ghosts.
@Josuh
3 жыл бұрын
To be fair those ghosts are absolutely horrifying
@YophiSmith
3 жыл бұрын
I heard in an interview that P-Hunnid had like 30 minutes to come up with lyrics. Sega wrote the music already and he had to work with the music with not a lot of background on the game. He had to actually rap Wild Canyon as Knuckles for a test run in front of Japanese people 😂. Then they said they liked it and boom, he was given the others.
@MicahBuzanANIMATION
3 жыл бұрын
YEs!!
@Nvtesokawaii
3 жыл бұрын
well yeah rappers have this ego some are real some fake.
@dabluepittoo-aqua4213
3 жыл бұрын
Not gonna lie, the character interrupting in the Shuttle Crash scene actually works to it's benefit. That's likely how it would go in real life, with everyone panicking and talking over one another.
@ThisJordo
3 жыл бұрын
I agree with your point, but the dialogue itself doesn't exactly work to that advantage. I mean Sonic cuts himself off multiple times in that scene alone lol But yeah they'd definitely just be yelling over each other anyway
@smileyjojo4913
3 жыл бұрын
Unintentionally realistic dialogue
@justingarrett2239
3 жыл бұрын
Those are the same reasons I kinda like the interrupting dialogue too. Like if Sonic and Shadow were to go head to head irl I'd imagine they'd start yelling over the top of each other they way that they did
@alexfield290
3 жыл бұрын
OH NO, DON'T PULL THAT LEVER! WOAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAH!
@snowcakes711
2 жыл бұрын
I actually thought it was realistic and for some reason kinda funny.
@aurafox1
3 жыл бұрын
Honestly, I actually like the fact that the characters constantly cut each other off. As a kid, I had no clue it was a mistake and just thought they were talking over each other. It actually usually happens during more hectic scenes. There are a few awkward moments where they respond to something before it's said, but I always thought they were just anticipating where the conversation is going. In a way, it actually makes the dialogue a tad more realistic.
@HellNutcase
3 жыл бұрын
In reality, noone is going to wait until you finish your insult.
@TheLimedew
3 жыл бұрын
Bro, you were living in the future as a kid. They’re talking over each other is just intentional and that’s what I’m going with lol
@TheHardStyleLife
3 жыл бұрын
dw I got that too but yeah even as a kid it was like man they could of mixed it a lil better
@aurafox1
3 жыл бұрын
@@TheHardStyleLife The sound mixing is a whole different story. I definitely remember thinking it was obnoxious whenever the music completely drowned out Shadow's voice.
@pepeoccult4269
3 жыл бұрын
@@TheLimedew Fun fact: they cut over eachother in other scenes in Japanese too, it's just that the bad english translation made it more abundant.
@a11ergies48
3 жыл бұрын
Sonic and shadows screams were not actually unused, they were put together and mixed into the biolizards scream
@DumDoDoor
3 жыл бұрын
Along with major audio editing to disguise this even more.
@a11ergies48
3 жыл бұрын
@@DumDoDoor ya
@Koko-cy4ff
3 жыл бұрын
Didn't the Biolizard use the same screams as Perfect Chaos?
@dabluepittoo-aqua4213
3 жыл бұрын
@@Koko-cy4ff @Koko210 The Biolizard has a multiple of SFX, including multiple different roars and screams. It's very likely that both the Sonic/Shadow fusion scream and the Perfect Chaos scream were used.
@Koko-cy4ff
3 жыл бұрын
@@dabluepittoo-aqua4213, yea, most likely. I just instinctively thought of his scream at the start of the final boss fight first.
@toppercent
3 жыл бұрын
I am a fluent speaker of Japanese. One reason for using the number 38 might be because the numbers 3 and 8 (san and hachi) can also be read as Sanba.
@thevioletskull8158
3 жыл бұрын
Thank you
@pablozanoto5801
3 жыл бұрын
Wow, real clever!!!
@shroomer8294
3 жыл бұрын
Neat
@laylamorrison9596
3 жыл бұрын
Man, I can't wait to see how deep Sonic 06's iceberg's going to go. Cause that game is DEEP.
@synthesoul
3 жыл бұрын
if you can consider it a game then... sure?
@sirbirbton
3 жыл бұрын
@@synthesoul Oh, it's a game no doubt. A very, VERY shitty game but a game nonetheless.
@rrrrr0_
3 жыл бұрын
Sonic 06 is unironically one of the best ones imo
@gracekim25
2 жыл бұрын
@Inept Robot what?
@MintyArisato
2 жыл бұрын
@@synthesoul sonic 06 was rife with potential, but it was poorly executed. if sonic 06 was remade with proper love and detail it would be phenomenal
@stygian4029
3 жыл бұрын
whenever I think of Big cameos all I can think of is that one scene where Rouge and Knuckles are fighting and big is in the back "lauging"...
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Haha yes indeed, just "laughing"
@tiny_98
2 жыл бұрын
Right I've only ever played the gamecube version so never saw his cameos except clips of the one before egg golem and City escape ones but I recently bought the 360 version and fucking choked when I saw him in the post mad space/meteor herd boss fight cutscene ill tell you now I wasn't expecting that
@nickhall358
3 жыл бұрын
29:40 That's one of the animals you can find in the stages to give to Chao. It's called "Half Fish" and is part of the Ghost group of animals along with the Bat and Skeleton Dog.
@Luigicat11
2 жыл бұрын
Oh, someone else already mentioned it.
@staidlystare
23 күн бұрын
I've gotten it bef it's one of the harder animals to get
@MishKoz
3 жыл бұрын
7:14 huh, maybe this is why Shadow says he'll grant Eggman a wish when they first meet. I always thought that was weird.
@YaGuyALT
3 жыл бұрын
Theres actually a lot of themeing in SA2 about shadow granting wishes, its evidentially more clear in the japanese version but theres also a lot of other like text in the game that refers to this too, such as the in game trailer for last story
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Excellent point Mish, thanks!
@redblack8766
3 жыл бұрын
@@YaGuyALT "Wishes are eternal"
@glacierwolf2155
3 жыл бұрын
It wouldn't be out of place, since the ending theme of Sonic 2 is a song from the band "Dreams Come True."
@hrrrrghOtacon
2 жыл бұрын
@@glacierwolf2155 the full soundtrack of the first game is from them
@Manynamesonehandle
3 жыл бұрын
5:29 im pretty sure it's supposed to be ironic. seeing as knuckles usually flexes his personality in this game and several others. he says he isn't afraid of ghosts even tho he is afraid of ghosts.
@KaiserMattTygore927
3 жыл бұрын
That or its him trying to reassure himself.
@WolforNuva
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah it sounds more like he's playing up a false bravado, "No way I'm scared of a little ghost" - only to be proven wrong once he comes face to face with one.
@purplowso
3 жыл бұрын
Hmm... That Kinda Sounds Like A Character From An Online Web Series That I Know... Hmm....
@lajbartek360
3 жыл бұрын
The Depths: -This is the only kids Game where villan *Pissed on the Moon*
@usadroopymeat1099
2 жыл бұрын
You mean this is the only kids game where villain committed war crimes like killing innocent people and astronauts that have families he must be executed for his crimes against humanity
@JacksonMcKay95
3 жыл бұрын
Building on the Sonic is the Ultimate Lifeform theory; if you're playing as Super Sonic at about the 4 minute mark in the Final Hazard boss, Shadow says "Hahaha Sonic! I think I've discovered what the ultimate lifeform is. It might be you!"
@Shadamyfan-rs8xc
2 жыл бұрын
I think Shadow was just being complimentary there
@RealBroccoliHour
Жыл бұрын
@@Shadamyfan-rs8xc I seriously doubt that tbh, it all just lines up way too well. That’d be like if Vegeta called Goku the true prince of all sayians. That’s too extreme a title to just be a ‘compliment’.
@peachy5454
3 жыл бұрын
The screams were actually used together to make the Bio-Lizards roars! Fun fact
@kaihedgie1747
3 жыл бұрын
34:33 - My rebuttal to this has always been that, despite Shadow being the first known character to harness Chaos Energy with a single Emerald, he has far less experience harnessing the power of all seven Emeralds. He was likely bleeding more Ring Energy because of it whereas Sonic has regularly used all seven Emeralds in multiple games and knows how to better maintain the Super form
@MDKGunner
2 жыл бұрын
I was going to mention this myself as by the events of Shadow the Hedgehog he's also been awake for far longer than in SA2 which takes place probably over the span of 2-3 days so he might not have gotten any sleep at all during it where as in his own game he actually gets each Emerald one at a time and get's used to using them all instead of all at once
@jeremy3705
2 жыл бұрын
I like to imagine that the battle takes place far longer than they intended and Shadow (realizing Sonic is a far better protector of earth than himself) feels the chaos energy depleting and uses his last bit of energy to allow Sonic to re-enter the shuttle as sort of a sacrificial act of heroism. Ive always imagined the rings didn’t really exist and instead chaos energy is just sort of limited. Kind of like when humans are struck by lightning, it all depends on how long the electricity flows through you in regards to damaging the body.
@brandonbaka1375
3 жыл бұрын
Sees Iceberg for History: Nothing Sees Iceberg for Lost Media: Hm okay Sees Iceberg for Sonic Adventure 2: This is the one
@gowares4ever992
3 жыл бұрын
Only legends do this sort of things.
@zeropointer125
3 жыл бұрын
A detail I liked in that in the Sonic X adaptation they state that 2 capsules were ejected from the colony when it was shutdown, adding more doubt that shadow was the ultimate lifeforms
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
That's cool! I'm not super familiar with Sonic X, so that's good to know.
@jeremy3705
2 жыл бұрын
Sonic X isn’t considered canon to the sonic series. Although I do believe that a lot of Sonic X was inspired by a lot of fan theory. Dark Super Sonic was just a fan canon until sonic x actually portrayed it as existing.
@zeropointer125
2 жыл бұрын
@@jeremy3705 Never said it was canon. I just liked the creative decision
@RealBroccoliHour
Жыл бұрын
@@jeremy3705 Sonic X is ‘canon’ to an extent. It was made by Sonic Team, and a lot of its concepts and ideas made its way into mainline.
@jordandillow3423
11 ай бұрын
yeah tell this idiot he is wrong
@DeepFriedOreoOffline
2 жыл бұрын
"This isn't the first time Knuckles music has lied about his character..." It actually defines his character perfectly. He acts outwardly rash and aggressive to hide the fact that he is actually quite emotional. It's a trope made fun of a lot. There was an episode of a sitcom where a younger women starts dating an older guy cause he is mature and mysterious. But overtime she urges him to be emotional with her, and once he starts he cant stop. He gets to the point where it's been so long since he's dealt with his emotions that he cries during sex and she breaks up with him.
@JohnnyVector
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks, I love that characterisation of Knuckles
@NA-cw3mm
2 жыл бұрын
Its official, Knuckles cries during sex
@moobysnaxx6086
2 жыл бұрын
Bruce Willis in friends confirmed
@Shadamyfan-rs8xc
2 жыл бұрын
Poor guy 😟
@lavieunrose8134
3 жыл бұрын
I always interpreted Shadows memory of Maria’s request as him misunderstanding, and remembering incorrectly out of anger, and it wasn’t until Amy gave him that speech on the Space Colony ARC that he finally realized she meant that he could give earth a chance to be happy. Because he’s been a living time capsule for nearly 50 years, I would imagine he hadn’t been able to go through all of the stages of grief, and so we see him change thru out the story going through those stages. Denial, when he believes he can get revenge for Maria, Anger, when he misinterprets her final request, Bargaining, when he asks eggman to threaten the earth into surrendering, Depression, when he sadly reminisces Maria’s memory before Amy approaches him, and Acceptance, when Amy give him a speech about earth.
@BvngeeGvm
9 ай бұрын
Nope
@TheRealJaydenJohnson
3 жыл бұрын
Sonic isn’t the ultimate life form... what you see is what you get, just a guy who loves adventure
@pepeoccult4269
3 жыл бұрын
What can we say? He dies hard!
@undeadbatman9762
3 жыл бұрын
He is both and he doesn’t know that. Seriously those Echidnas literally worship him as a god.
@Beta_Mixes
3 жыл бұрын
... ... ... ... ..... ... ... *And piss rocks*
@derickvera573
2 жыл бұрын
@@Beta_Mixes B L E N I S
@polocatfan
2 жыл бұрын
I mean he isn't now. Shadow the Hedgehog retconned it.
@LiveHedgehog
3 жыл бұрын
I like the theory that Sonic and Shadow's super-powered Chaos Control at the end of the game fixed the moon.
@JSpyx
3 жыл бұрын
I love that they returned big's cameo's in Sonic and the Secret Rings again x) Also, I remember really well that people thought "Super Shadow" was actually "Hyper Shadow", I read about this because apparently in the SA2 gameguide, the name "Hyper Shadow" was written in there for Shadow's super form, so that's what people went off from
@firestonehaku
3 жыл бұрын
I remember this as well. It always confused me, as I don't remember the game ever acknowledging Shadow as "Hyper Shadow" at any point in the game.
@justcallmekai1554
3 жыл бұрын
@@firestonehaku Yeah I thought ppl were just making that up but now I know were that misconception comes from. Weird.
@KaiserMattTygore927
3 жыл бұрын
I remember that too, never agreed with the people that thought that either.
@Cornmeal_Rat
2 жыл бұрын
I remember I had a toy of super shadow labeled as hyper shadow back in the day too
@apollomaster9301
3 жыл бұрын
My prefered headcanon is that: Sonic is indeed the ultimate life form, but was only prophesized 50 years ago. Sonic was born as the ultimate life form, meanwhile shadow was the closest approximation of ancient echidna murals that gerald found. I've never liked the idea that sonic was on the ark, because for me it invalidates shadow as a character entirely. Shadow being a clone of sonic and coming into his own still lines up with how his story progressed.
@GoldenGrenadier
Жыл бұрын
It makes more sense the other way around, for sonic to be an upgraded clone of shadow or the descendant of one that escaped or something. That would give GUN a good reason to want to recapture Sonic in addition to shadow.
@novelezra
3 жыл бұрын
"Concept art of Rouge also exists, showing her with smaller-" "-Oh no!" "Wings" "Oh"
@peterpumkineater69346
3 жыл бұрын
*b a t b o o b s*
@beanoptodon
3 жыл бұрын
Tiddy
@Terrazon
3 жыл бұрын
*booba*
@undeadbatman9762
3 жыл бұрын
Got us the first half not gonna lie.
@clayton7993
3 жыл бұрын
34:26 you could argue that the reason Shadow "dies" when using chaos control is actually because he produces a lot more chaos energy than Sonic but at the cost of leaving him completely exhausted once all his power gets used up.
@MetaKnuxXbeats
3 жыл бұрын
This is probably my favorite iceberg video you created. I always loved the lore implications of SA2. It can be very bizarre looking back but that's what makes it so awesome.
@xxxxx6869
3 жыл бұрын
The animal in the chao blackmarket in sa2b is a "half fish", one of the ghost type animals (half fish, bat, skeleton dog) that can be collected in the stages. Technically it fits into the background as it shows the players that they are going to get items that are useful to chao raising. It does implies that the black market is involved in (i assume illegal) animal capturing and reselling. I think it's also hilarious that it's located in a closet in a kindergarden.
@solumanblevins5906
3 жыл бұрын
16:09 I remember there was an exploit in the SA2: Battle edition where you could collect all the rings in either Tails or Rouge's car lvs and carry that number over to a lv of your choice, netting a perfect score on every lv. Since netting all rings in a lv nets you an automatic A Rank it was an easy way to 100% the game. Used it on the Xbox-360 version. Edit: 22:08 Should point out that that was an Evil Bunnie from a Alt Universe, hence the skinny Robotnik.
@nothingrhymeswithorange5294
3 жыл бұрын
Fun fact: Shadow the Hedgehog was originally only going to appear in Sonic Adventure 2, but his popularity caused Sega to push for his return in Heroes. Originally E-102 Gamma was considered to reappear.
@mrmrhihi1
3 жыл бұрын
So did you watch the whole video or
@nothingrhymeswithorange5294
3 жыл бұрын
@@mrmrhihi1 Yeah, why?
@mrmrhihi1
3 жыл бұрын
Because he says this word for word at 36:50
@MintyArisato
2 жыл бұрын
@@mrmrhihi1 to be fair he didnt say the gamma part. I've always secretly wished they could bring him back even though its literally impossible, lol
@Shadamyfan-rs8xc
2 жыл бұрын
I like Omega better honestly
@willrichard6921
3 жыл бұрын
The whole alternate paths thing being intended for SA2 but ultimately used in Shadow The Hedgehog show that it is the true sequel. It picks up a lot of themes and threads from SA2, and has many shared locations in stages. Thematically, many melodies from SA2, including Live and Learn, are used in the OST. In my opinion, Shadow The Hedgehog is the last game that tries to keep any sort of continuity. I miss it...
@KYLE1654-v7m
2 жыл бұрын
Sega/Sonic Team : "Screw you continuity!!!"
@willrichard6921
2 жыл бұрын
@@KYLE1654-v7m Very true!
@l1ghtd3m0n3
3 жыл бұрын
When a single game in a large franchise gets its own iceberg, you know it’s gonna be good
@marronhak2441
3 жыл бұрын
I think 38 & Sambe De Amigo is like the thing with 39 & Hatsune Miku as well as 24 & Puyo puyo. Basically, numbers have different ways of being read or sounded out and some people like to take those and make it sound like something else. 2 can be read as "fu" and 4 can be "yo/yon" so it makes "fu-yo" which sounds like "Puyo". They even made Puyo Puyo 4 as Puyo Puyon, mixing puyo and yon.
@Roroprata
3 жыл бұрын
That's definitely it, 3 can be read as "san" and 8 can be read as "ha/ba", making "sanba" or samba
@mcpduffs
3 жыл бұрын
San is 3 in Chinese. And Japanese ba is 8 in mandarin
@Gunblazer42
3 жыл бұрын
@@Roroprata The Japanese love number puns. If you ever see "573" in a Konami game, that's ko, na, and mi (In MGS4, Drebin's number is 893 for ya-ku-za). If you see "765" in a Namco game, that's na-mu-ko, as well as "876" after the merger for ba-na-mu (BANdai NAMco). There's actually an entire TVTropes article based on the idea, called a "Goroawase Number".
@Roroprata
3 жыл бұрын
@@Gunblazer42 Interestingly, as far as I know, the yakuza example is actually backwards, the name yakuza came from 893. That's because it is one of the worst hands in a japanese card game called oichokabu, worth literally 0 points, so it was used to call people "good-for-nothings", and the name stuck.
@taputrainer8463
3 жыл бұрын
19:10 In Wild Canyon around where the air pushes Knuckles up, you can see two Sonic styled humans next to the master emerald. In Pyramid Cave, in the section where you need to get the key near the end of the level (where two mass produced gammas are on large stones) there are depictions of people with Sonic hair and Knuckles hair, I think it implies that Sonic’s people gave the master emerald to the Enchidna race. The video Sonic is an alien also is basically the Sonic Ultimate lifeform theory mixed with another theory that Sonic is the last of his alien kind
@taputrainer8463
3 жыл бұрын
In Death Chamber in the secret room needed to complete the lost chao mission the same Sonic styled humans can be seen praising a chao, I feel that since this is a singular hidden room where a chao mission is complete I feel that this could be some hint that Sonic’s people brought not only the chaos emeralds and master emerald to the Knuckles Clan but also the Chao. Another comment on another video mentioned how the desert section of the game takes place on Angel Island because it’s sandopolis both have ghost enemies, an Egyptian aesthetic, and a giant golem as a boss. It’s also been stated that apparently since Chaos passed onto the afterlife that Angel Island permanently stayed in the ocean which fixes the problem of how the master emerald was stolen again since Knuckles explains in a recap segment that Rouge stole the master emerald. Since SA2 takes place in San Francisco, Angel Island is place where it’s real life inspiration is and would explain a lot of plot holes SA2 had. The iceberg should definitely be updated to add these.
@SPEEPSHighway
3 жыл бұрын
Cool vid! I like a lot of the points made and there were really good explanations. I got some extra info on a few of the points for anyone that wants it: - In the DC version, A Ranks are for the extra characters. Costumes can be unlocked by beating the stages with any rank. They're all purely cosmetic (unlike SA2B) and none of them have sound effects other than Amy. You can even Spindash as Metal Sonic with Shadow's yellow aura. - The girl on the posters in Speed Highway is an un-named spider girl made by Satoshi Okano, he posted about it on twitter a while ago. - A debug build Hidden Palace released has the World Ranking menu before it was removed. Although, the ranks are random and you obviously can't connect to the server. - The out of bounds layout in White Jungle is a very early version of Green Forest. If you load that stage with White Jungle's objects it'll match up perfectly. It predates E3 2000, because the only enemies are Beetles. - Thanks to the huge vertical shaft at the end, Eggman can hover back in bounds and still beat Cannon's Core on a pirated disc. I think it still locks you out of the lost chao and getting an A though. - The screaming clips from SA2:Preview were combined together and filtered to make the Biolizard's roars. Weirdly, it also has clips of David Humphrey screaming in the English voice list but nothing was done with them. Also here's a cool thing from recently that'd fit right into this thing: The Fortune Teller in the Kindergarten was originally going to be the Library Chao. Her textures (aside from the mask and crown) have the library's name in them and she can be seen on a drawing in the entrance area like the other Kindergarten staff. The blush on the cheeks of the Chao in the drawing is on the Fortune Teller's model, but isn't visible due to incorrect sorting (Something the DC would automatically correct).
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks! Thanks for the extra information. I had no idea the Speed Highway poster character was a spider girl, very cool.
@SPEEPSHighway
3 жыл бұрын
@@JohnnyVector Yea, the info (JP) is in this tweet: twitter.com/okanotion/status/1292606063661862913
@risingrevolt
3 жыл бұрын
Aye cool to see you here
@CrystalGreymon
3 жыл бұрын
In the final battle of the game Shadow has some dialogue where he guesses that Sonic is the Ultimate Life Form. Considering the fan theory, I just find that coincidentally interesting.
@typreegamingtpg2198
3 жыл бұрын
I do believe that Sonic is meant to be the Ultimate Lifeform, but I personally think that he was somehow born from the natural world, as opposed to being an artificial creation made by Gerald. I think a hypothetical SA3 (had it been made in place of Heroes) would've definitely followed up on this though, seeing how it was intentionally left ambiguous. Either way, the real answer doesn't matter at this point, since the place that the franchise is at now (and where it's headed) doesn't seem like it has the drive to tie up a 20-year-old loose end like this any time soon.
@matthewbrooks5470
3 жыл бұрын
26:49 Well, “Shadow the Hedgehog” basically claimed that Shadow was created in part by space Satan
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Haha yeah, the lore gets completely out of control
@ScorchLawson
3 жыл бұрын
2 things: 1: In the Final Hazard boss fight there's a chance that Shadow will say that he thinks Sonic is the Ultimate Life Form. 2: It's pure coincidence, but in 1995 Infogrames developed a multi-platform rail shooter called Chaos Control which had a release on the Sega Saturn.
@erasmotamayo1937
3 жыл бұрын
24:00 In the Lego Dimensions Sonic Pack they made a joke about this.
@GreenSwede
3 жыл бұрын
I believe Soap shoes were added quite late to the game due to issues with lack of funding. They basically saved the game thanks to the adverts. Also Eggman saying "Yosh" is because the voice actors were given the Japanese voice lines for sounds. There are other cases of this happening too like when Sonic jumps at the Egg Golem before the battle starts and he says something from the Japanese voice line.
@firestonehaku
3 жыл бұрын
Correct. I thought this was generally understood by the voice delevery.
@pepeoccult4269
3 жыл бұрын
TERIIIIIYAAAAAAAAH!
@katmiller4162
3 жыл бұрын
29:36 The creature beside the Black Market Chao is a Half Fish that you can give to chao as a creature power up. The attributes it gives to your chao is a flame emotion bubble (like the one Dark Chaos Chao has when you reincarnate your chao 3+ times)
@GreenSwede
3 жыл бұрын
26:12 This happens on legit copies of the game too, though apparently not all of them. It is possible to hover to safe ground and continue the stage.
@pepeoccult4269
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah, same here. I buought a new version of the game after that though.
@mariomario761
3 жыл бұрын
13:11 Me trying to name every person in the Great Josh Battle
@crisismoon880
3 жыл бұрын
I’m gonna have a crisis if this video doesn’t blow up. Love your Sonic icebergs.
@agreedboarart3188
3 жыл бұрын
I have no idea what I'm watching but I love Sonic Adventure 2 so I clicked. Had no idea Soap shoes were an actual thing.
@Ness_and_Sonic
3 жыл бұрын
Sonic X explains the moon thing as Robotnik rebuilds it himself, but he does it in a way that if you forgot he has an IQ of 300, you'd think he simply made a mistake and that Sonic's the villain. Sonic fixes his "mistake", though.
@TheMooseOnTheLeft
3 жыл бұрын
Also, the tidal locking of the half-destroyed moon is very possible irl. The moon is already tidally locked and the most dense part should rotate to face the earth if a big chunk went missing.
@Lochlin.B
3 жыл бұрын
26:02 Hey, that's my video! Really cool to see it used for discussion, thanks. :)
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks! It was a cool video
@trashlord3214
3 жыл бұрын
22:07 Actually, that's an alternate version of Bunnie, though it's a pretty popular fan theory that Bunnie getting roboticized early in life might've kept her from developing N.I.D.S. herself.
@ShrunkedDude
3 жыл бұрын
28:10 now that you mention it, a palace beneath the sea and turtles. Sounds familiar with Sonic heroes level Ocean Palace!
@TheMGMfan
3 жыл бұрын
Fun fact, I used to think that the Biolizard was actually Chaos in a new form for some reason. I think part of it was SA2 being the sequel to SA1, which meant it only made sense to kid me that Chaos would appear in both, and it probably didn’t help that I only played SA1 as a kid, even then not beating it until 2017 or 18 (it should be noted that I was born in 2003, so I grew up in the early 2010s and just so happened to be into retro gaming), so before playing SA2 in 2019, I didn't know what the Biolizard actually was. However, the biggest thing I remember making me think they were the same character was how similar the Biolizard was in appearance to Perfect Chaos, which I find interesting given the theory of Gerald basing his inventions after ancient echnidnan murals, including the one of Perfect Chaos for the Biolizard. EDIT: I also gotta say that those Christian-themes SA2B ads are the best worst thing to ever come out of Sonic hand down. I get what they were going for, it's clearly based of the idea of Good vs. Evil that serves as the basis for the whole game, but to demonstrate that by putting biblical imagry and stuff in an ad for a Sonic game is so dumb and so funny. This is also the first time I ever heard of these, which makes sense as I'm an American and judging by the latter ad being in German and the former one saying that it was distributed by Infogrames, which was only the case in Europe, I believe this campaign only happened there. Point is, I'm glad I know about this.
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks! Yes, I saw those ads in game magazines so it was probably limited to Europe. I also had a fried who was convinced the Biolizard was Chaos as well! Haha, good memories.
@madokalover
2 жыл бұрын
The regular Knuckles/Rouge pyramid stages have Chao hieroglyphs on the walls. The Hard Mode mission of Meteor Herd has two red GUN robots not seen anywhere else. There's a dark gray GUN robot enemy that bounces you back if you attack them (you can see them in Sky Rail). They can only be killed by Sonic using the optional Magic Gloves that you get in City Escape. However, there is only one of these enemies that you can encounter with Sonic. It's located in the bottom path at the beginning of the Hard Mode version of Green Forest. In SA2B's 2-player mode, if you play Green Forest as Metal Sonic and hold B to activate his shield at the beginning of the level before he hits the ground, you'll gain so much speed that you'll fly off the stage and underneath it, but you won't die. Instead, you fall forever. The camera will even pan up to let you see the stage disappear in the distance. The Chao World has a physical location on the map in the Stage Select screen. Is it actually located there? Hidden Base is the only level in the game with 2 Chao containers instead of 3. You're pretty much 100% done with the game when you unlock Green Hill Zone but the game still ranks you at the end. It's the only A rank that isn't used to unlock anything. Tails and Eggman can attack Chao in the Chao Garden if you cycle through your available B button actions with Y (on Gamecube). Otherwise they can't harm Chao at all. You can dig up pumpkin and skull hats (skulls in the Dark Garden, pumpkins in the other two) randomly (very low chance) with Rouge and/or Knuckles. They sell for 50 rings. Some of the randomly chosen Chao names are names of people and organizations that worked on the game (usually they are the names in all caps). Despite being a main selling point, Shadow is the character with the least amount of stages, with only 4, and the only character absent from Cannon's Core. The Chao Lobby music is from SA1, but I think it was unused there. IIRC the Hard Mode mission of Mission Street has less than 100 rings in it, so it would be impossible to complete the 100 rings mission in this version of the stage. Adding to the Biolizard/Chaos connection, the very last section of Cannon's Core right before the boss fight has a water slide in a large tribal/primitive-looking tunnel very similar to a section of Lost World from SA1. During this water slide only, the music changes to something similar to the music that plays during that section of Lost World. Cannon's Core in general and especially the Biolizard's room have water and stone structures reminiscent of the echidna tribe's architecture.
@maiselph7456
Жыл бұрын
Correction: Mission Street in SA2B has 99 rings, so for the mission where you need to collect 100 of them you have to use the return ring and get the last ones at the beginning of the stage.
@TheQuinnAce
3 жыл бұрын
While it is possible to believe that shadow is speculating, if you do the final biohazard fight and switching your character instead of doing the objective once, or basically an odd number of times to have Sonic be the one doing the final hit, you can hear Shadow tell Sonic that he thinks he's the ultimate life form. I thought it was neat because it shows that Gerald already had a concept of Sonic before eggman started dealing with him. This plays into a lot of the new games concepts. Like metal Sonic wanting Shadow clones because he's a good copy of Sonic in Sonic heroes. Even in Shadow the hedgehog they make it seem like it was a joint effort. The real question is whether or not Sonic was presented as an ultimate life form in the past. If you want to get to the bottom of the iceberg try to figure out why they were copying Sonic before he was alive. Time travel has been a thing in Sonic games but they've never touched this. It can also play into the idea that Sonic getting his powers is a concept that could have been established before he existed. The Archie comics deal with all of these things very well but it's not canon. A part of me wishes that it was Canon because then they can make better games but they always seem to ignore the continuity.
@justhumanthings6711
2 жыл бұрын
Honestly I kind of liked it when the voice dubs interrupt each other a little bit, because it makes the characters feel like they had enough of there rivals trash talking or in the case of the scene with Tails’s ship it makes it seem like the characters are having a bit of a swabble.
@LARKXHIN
3 жыл бұрын
I always took Pumpkin Hill theme as Knuckles' bluffing and not being honest.
@yomilemondragon1721
3 жыл бұрын
All these years I NEVER knew the floating particles in Security Hall were money. I always thought it was weird that there was random stone-looking debris floating around in this metal, industrial vault with no stone in sight. Also, I never thought the implication was that Shadow had implanted memories of Maria telling him to get revenge on Earth- I always thought he didn't quite remember what she said, but remembered his anger and fear in that moment and projected is own desire for revenge onto her words, creating false memories for himself organically.
@TheHeavenlyBuddy
2 жыл бұрын
11:49 this is what having a conversation with your equally talkative friends feels like
@birbbabybirb
3 жыл бұрын
If Shadow really was based on a mural of Sonic, and Shadow is the Ultimate Lifeform, then Sonic is ALSO the Ultimate Lifeform, even if he wasn't created on the ARK. Shadow was literally made to BE Sonic. Gerald might've even thought that the mural was of the "Ultimate Lifeform" and that it was predicting his experiments's results. So was Shadow what the report talked about? Yes. But is he really what he was intended to be? No, because that's actually Sonic.
@MLPPixel727
3 жыл бұрын
Yes, BioLizard does look like Perfect Chaos. I wonder if it’s because of Chaos energy put into the Ultimate Lifeform.
@Shadamyfan-rs8xc
2 жыл бұрын
I think Shadow becoming tired after using chaos control can be explained by him being less experienced with the chaos emeralds, whilst Sonic had gone super several times before.
@JohnnyVector
2 жыл бұрын
Makes sense
@ohsat_games
3 жыл бұрын
20:28 It's common in Japanese to use numbers to spell words, which is made easier by the fact that numbers can be read in different ways (and with certain amounts of leeway when it comes to puns and wordplay). 38 could actually be read as "samba" (as a combination of san + ha(chi)). I thought the 34°N 12°E thing would be such a case as well, but I haven't been able to puzzle it out. Great video, by the way!
@WaterKirby1994
3 жыл бұрын
What if you played around with the coordinates some? Try 34S, 12W or 12N, 34E & see if you find anything then?
@Mima_the_vengeful_spirit
3 жыл бұрын
@@WaterKirby1994 12N; 34E leads to a lone pyramid in Soudan
@WaterKirby1994
3 жыл бұрын
@@Mima_the_vengeful_spirit That seems a lot more promising, all the hints in Mad Space are reversed, makes sense the music title there would referring to a reversed location as well.
@Kurisu545
3 жыл бұрын
Wow, and I was just i looking for iceberg videos.
@andrewcritic2227
3 жыл бұрын
I fell in love with this theoryes that havent any objective and in fact are just fanfictions
@tomtheconqerur
3 жыл бұрын
21:35 when you said "nid's", I can't help but think of tyranids from 40k
@queenviren
3 жыл бұрын
So that whole “shadow being an ultimate weapon” theory holds a bit of water. There’s the events of sa2, but let’s not forget shadow the hedgehog. I always thought it was strange that he just knew how to operate guns, swords, and various other tools. And he never questions it either, almost as if it’s second nature. Idk, just something to think about.
@flaregamer64
3 жыл бұрын
I'm loving all the SA2 content that has been popping up in my recommendations. Nice video btw!
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks a lot!
@ilovethelegend
3 жыл бұрын
I suspect the test text in the Knuckles stage makes more sense in Japanese; Like, maybe those phrases are all spelled or pronounced similarly.
@lautaromaria6040
3 жыл бұрын
They are! Those "aparently" random phrases in english, are actually a play of words in japan
@TheReZisTLust
3 жыл бұрын
Soap eventually became Heelys and thats wonderful
@pepeoccult4269
3 жыл бұрын
Can't wait for SA3 to have Heelys.
@TheReZisTLust
3 жыл бұрын
@@pepeoccult4269 they already have it in SA2 but they got rid of the wheels and made them hover for the future tech
@IorekB92
3 жыл бұрын
Why does no one ever talk about the creepy laugh at the end of Mad Space's music? Like literally at the very last second you can hear a very odd 'HaHaHa' kind of laugh, it is easier to hear with headphone on. I found this out just from listening to the OST like over 10 years ago, at night, safe to say I was freaked out xD
@WaterKirby1994
3 жыл бұрын
There is no end to Mad Space's Music, it just loops endlessly regardless of whether it is heard in the game's soundtest or when playing the stage itself. How did you even access the Creepy Laugh, some youtube video that probably added it at the end like several KZitem videos do with creepy things?
@NUKELEDGE
Жыл бұрын
A year late but that's the sound of the musicians after a recording session finishes that they forgot to fade out, likely due to how quiet it is.
@pgj1997
Жыл бұрын
28:27 According to TCRF... "These are actually supposed to be the roars that Biolizard makes after Knuckles finishes his speech to stop the Chaos Emeralds in Last Story, but because these clips are heavily filtered in the final game, you can't make them out."
@HOTD108_
2 жыл бұрын
The Big the Cat level cameos were actually restored in the digital versions of Sonic Adventure 2 Battle.
@oreo_frito
Жыл бұрын
They really gotta remake the Adventure duology with some interconnectedness and finally make 3 become the true conclusion to project shadow being linked to sonic being the ultimate lifeform, along with the echidnas knowing of his coming leading to precaution of Chaos being mistaken for a interpretation of sonic based on their designs. Would be cool to see if it all ends with the end of the world being solely preventable with sonic giving up his life leading to the conclusion of the adventure story. Maybe even a remake of Sonic 2-3&Knuckles with animated scenes leading up to the Adventure story
@timati3532
2 жыл бұрын
In the final fight with the biolizard, if you take long enough, shadow says "I think I have figured out who the ultimate lifeform is! It must be you(sonic)!"
@JohnnyVector
2 жыл бұрын
A few people have mentioned that one. I've heard the line and always thought it was said in jest but it's further evidence.
@LordBob
3 жыл бұрын
Something else worth mentioning is that there is an island called Angel Island in the San Francisco Bay
@EveryoneDisagreesWithPJ
7 ай бұрын
for the part for the bad audio at the like rocket cutscene, I think it’s perfect doe cause it sounds like their real people fighting and cutting eachother off lol
@Bonkpunktexe
3 жыл бұрын
great video, but you missed something: the creature that the chao in the black market has next to him is actually a half fish, which is an animal you can give your chao in sa2.
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Thanks!
@johnpett1955
Жыл бұрын
29:36 this creature is really just a bigger version of one of those animals you give your chao. It makes your chao have a fire above its head.
@Yuli_Ban
7 ай бұрын
Shadow's quills resembling Super Sonic is certainly one thing, but the smoking gun to me is the fact that Shadow's aura is gold rather than red or black. What about Shadow's design suggests his jump/spindash aura would be gold, besides maybe his inhibitor rings (and if that alone is enough, why isn't Amy's aura gold, or why isn't Sonic's aura white like his cuffs?). It seems obvious he's a mimic of Super Sonic to me.
@star7communicator
3 жыл бұрын
It's always odd to have that lingering thought that Shadow might be an unreliable narrator. I don't think we'll ever get this level of depth from the franchise ever again, as far as lore goes.
@justcallmekai1554
3 жыл бұрын
Yeah I never saw it that way until now. I feel bad for Shadow. He could have just sacrificed himself over a promise that never happened or at least heavy skewed. That dude goes through alot more than most characters in the series.
@pepeoccult4269
3 жыл бұрын
Ok, so, I already had an idea that Sonic was the ultimate life form. Some spit balling as ideas being: 1. Sonic could not use the fake emerald for, as it was made to not be as good as a normal one, so he would have to get the power from within himself. This also explains why he's able to do so. 2. He seems to be able to use chaos power better than the person who claims not only to be the ultimate life form, but to have experience from 50 years ago. He should have at least a little muscle memory, right? 3. Being the nerd that I am, I already read the strategy guide, and understood it was not that cut and dry. If Sonic was Shadow, he would have to change his name. Now, whether or not said by Maria, he would have understood from Gerald Robotnik that he could make a sonic boom by, at some point, breaking the sound barrier. Sonic boom. Sonic. That is when "Sonic" was born. Ok, maybe the last one was a little superstitious, but the others could only be explained if Sonic was A. The original and he's lying about his age, or B. He is the ultimate lifeform and he's lying about his age. I personally choose B, as making Shadow in a fit of rage seems like something he'd do.
@chriscombs21886
3 жыл бұрын
~18:50 huh, i didn't expect to have gundam flashbacks while watching this
@JezElectro13
Жыл бұрын
i just realized that maybe one of the reasons Sonic and Shadow are rivals is competition: Who really is the ultimate life form? Sonic or Shadow? (i think Sonic because he's in prophecy and helped World more the Shadow did)
@tol9090
2 жыл бұрын
I'm sure it has been said, but at 29:37 the animal in the Black Market is a Half Fish, a rare animal found in the action stages. It is in the "Ghost" group, and makes a Chao have a eerie flame instead of their signature "dot" on their head. To me, it looks like the Black Market merchant, interested in weird and rare stuff, just chose the rarest and spookiest animal as his pet.
@jacobbrown9894
3 жыл бұрын
In Japanese number wordplay, 38 can be read as Sanba with n and m being kinda interchangeable in Japanese so it could also be rendered as Samba. Wordplay with numbers in common in Japan because most numbers have 2-4 ways to say not including just using the English name, leaving off a syllable, using interchangeable letters like b/v or l/r, etc
@monkeyoptics
2 жыл бұрын
if you wait to the point where the colony is about to hit the earth shadow tells sonic he thinks sonic might be the ultimate lifeform
@CammieRacing
Жыл бұрын
I always thought the overlapping audio lend itself as a sense of realism. People arguing don't politely wait for each other to stop talking.
@anyadarlingg
2 ай бұрын
The chao key glitch!! I actually experienced this with Dr. Eggman. I cant remember which stage tho. I was SUPER confused lol i just exited the game 😂
@jackepong6300
Жыл бұрын
From what we do know, whoever was in that first capsule fake memory or not is not the same shadow we see later. Gerald gives it away in his diary that the shadow we see is based on his original data from the ark, meaning the 2nd shadow was made while he was imprisoned.
@FehNorth
10 ай бұрын
27:43 Dry Lagoon* It is possible to clear Eggman part of Cannon's Core by hovering to the right until you reach the "huge fall area" before the corridor leading to the last room.
@sorokabeloboka8818
Жыл бұрын
The one on 18:51 isn't actually a Bernal Sphere, but an O'Neill Cylinder depiction. Another type of space colony settlement that was later used as a standart design of space colonies for Gundam series.
@smitty1647
Жыл бұрын
knuckles' songs also confidently declare his lack of interest in rouge. i think it's supposed to be his inner voice trying to convince himself
@TheRoxasx2000
3 жыл бұрын
I am surprised they did not make Chao in Space into a game. Could be a good spin off sonic game.
@HelluvaOpp
3 жыл бұрын
Maybe the REAL reason why he’s scared of ghosts is because, he cannot admit he’s scared of the ghosts
@Mima_the_vengeful_spirit
3 жыл бұрын
what the...a...a ghost?! (before King Boom Boo)
@HelluvaOpp
3 жыл бұрын
@@Mima_the_vengeful_spirit yeh, he can’t even admit he’s scared of Ghosts, Knuckles is scared of them and can’t admit he’s afraid of Ghosts
@romeants8049
3 жыл бұрын
Awesome work, you have a very good voice for narration. And who doesn’t love sonic adventure? Subbed!
@JohnnyVector
3 жыл бұрын
Thank you!
@astro6683
3 жыл бұрын
holy crap, this came out at a perfect time thanks!
@schelleanne09
Жыл бұрын
Dunno if someone has already mentioned it, but in Japanese, there are several ways to say the names of numbers due to the counter system and the "on yomi" and "kunyomi" Kanji reading system used in the language. For example, the number 1 could be said "ichi" "i" or "hi", depending on the context or on if the Kanji is compounded with another. This means that, in effect, you can phonetically "spell" things using numbers as a sort of code or shortcut, much like how in English we use phrases like "C u l8r" or "4ever", etc. A great example of this usage of numbers to spell words/names in Japaese can be found in Danganronpa 1, the character Hifumi can literally spell his name as 123 using numbers. The popular vocaloid character, Hatsune Miku can spell her name as 39, Mi-Ku. (Note: Funnily enough, 39 can be said as "Miku" or "Sankyu" depending on the context; "Sankyu" sounds very close to how the Japanese tend to phonetically say "Thank You", so you might spot some of this usage that way too, much like my former kei car's license plate had while I lived abroad. It was a used car and used to be a transport service car or rental apparently, so the - - 39 plate was a choice, not a coincidence.) Getting back on track, I can speculate that Samba the Amigo is being referred to with the number 38 because you can read it as "San" "Hachi" separately, or "Sam-Ba", by using the rules of phonetic compounding in Japanese, similar to what we see with the words for the numbers "300" and "800", respectively, "San-byaku" and "Happyaku". In theory, the N in "San" would be clear, but in practice, when combining it with a consecutive word that begins with H, can, in some cases, sound more like "M". For the word "Happyaku", we do away with the "chi" in "Hachi" and add "-pyaku", the modified sound for "hyaku" (100) when it is combined with the number 8 prior. Ultimately leaving you with a VERY complicated (but fun) way to spell or refer to "Samba" the amigo. Apologies for the long and probably not super clear explanation. I hope it's a nice tidbit of info for anyone who was curious though. :)
@IrregularZero
3 жыл бұрын
16:22. Oh hello. I don't mind actually :^)
@AlphaDog26
3 жыл бұрын
Happy to see you here
@SprunkCovers
2 жыл бұрын
I have been playing SA2 for quite literally 20 years and never noticed that NIDS is a reference to AIDS, every day I learn something new about one of my favourite games ever!
@oriongurtner7293
Жыл бұрын
The small green creature next to the Chao Merchant is a reference to The Creature From The Black Lagoon, one of the OG Monsters from the early days of filmmaking
@dr_popcorn
2 жыл бұрын
"This bondage is a success!" makes me believe that Knuckles is a sadomasochist who thoroughly practices the art of kinbaku.
@zuchary
3 жыл бұрын
Damn i already knew this stuff. This was a nostalgic ride though.
@niaschim
3 жыл бұрын
The green creature next to the black market salesman is one you can collect in SAB2 in the green forest sonic stage, that branching path, where you can bounce down to a hidden alternate path, or move forwards: He's there; right before it branches. He gives your chaos a badass flaming orb [instead of the normal chao orb] (the floaty head things) (the swamp creature replaces it with a will'o'the'wisp) I guess knowing that puts me in a minority of SAB2 iceberg fans. But there's stuff I didn't know, so... touché *shrug*
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