I think the theory has more potential to explain the development of cultures and societies of humans rather than the vast change from earlier hominids to homo sapiens.
@damien1065
2 жыл бұрын
I was thinking along the same lines. It could have sparked the idea of god
@Marklar3
2 жыл бұрын
You say rather than, but I don't think you can separate developments of cultures and societies from the vast changes of earlier hominids.
@Imabeatyouman
2 жыл бұрын
Agree. Which Terence will probably still be remembered and credited
@orbismworldbuilding8428
2 жыл бұрын
Yeah that sounds about right
@joshfloyd7755
2 жыл бұрын
I think it's fairly reductionist logic, it seems to me, that it would have happened by degrees, the mental expansion brought on first by tool use, then the ability to harness and control fire. These lead to cooked animal protein, and shared space around the communal fire. To these factors add the mushrooms, which in modern times are being proven to not promote nuero-plasticity but also nuero-genisis, ( see John's Hopkins study 2019) even in advanced aged people. To this add the knowledge that we have an endogenous cannabanoid system which proves we co-evolved with the cannabis plant, it offers some evidence , I'm not stating that stoned ape is solid ground, but at least plausible, to my limited understanding
@sandman45
2 жыл бұрын
When people talk about Terence McKenna they always talk about his crazy theories (which he himself was very critical of), they never talk about his main points; what drugs have on material evolution. The one drug to be legalized for most of the modern era was alcohol which creates dominate behavior, compared to other drugs like weed and shrooms that create more passive attitudes. McKenna is basically saying that drugs play a key role in effecting our material conditions.
@KamilDeKerel
2 жыл бұрын
Man the talk of McKenna where he explains how alcohol and tobacco actually cause anti social behavior and just a worse atmosphere in total, compared to countries or places that use psychedelics or weed and such, these people were very open and involved with eachother, more social and less violence
@ras_krystafari3333
2 жыл бұрын
& that "I entertain these idea but I give no belief over to these things, I don't believe in these theories..... the truth requires no belief, it is the truth" Why doesn't she see for herself? "Stoned on mushrooms you might forget your bow 🙇♂️ " that is lost him & the interview credibility that's pathetic strawman argument, is wildly immature & insulting that's not even how the effect works long term just wow. Microdosing which does work that way is proven practice that pushes the tech industry today, to ignore that is willfully ignorance. This seems like it had good intentions & harshly judgment closed minded research, please we can do better. It's not black & white she should be moving forward considering this theory not taking & fighting it as fact, What in The Science! What in the Name Of Progress!
@thecrimsonfuckeralucardlor5087
2 жыл бұрын
Exactly, it's just that psychoactive drugs affect our mental ability and how we act. Like saying water is wet fire burns and if you drop a rock it falls to the ground. Not that we gained intelligence from drugs, just that they shaped our behavior to a degree that still has effects to this day. Since we still use them.
@jxhnny_gxddamn
2 жыл бұрын
McKenna even said low doses for hunting
@michaelwerkov3438
2 жыл бұрын
yeah, the material and cultural element... the "historical materialist" element, if you will, is definitely the far more convincing, and ultimately relevant, part of his ideas. and while "historical materialism" has that kind of unfortunate historical link with V.I. Lenin (see [1]), I think that a good, opening historical materialism is one of the best historical methods we have... but more... one of the best analytical frameworks we have for a sociological and political-economic analysis of what is driving our current development (and problems) and how to address that. [1] (leading some people to insist that a "proper" understanding of historical materialism *inevitably* must lead "scientifically" to "socialism"... except that Lenin et al., mean *their* specific, authoritarian, "socialism", and their VERRRRY generous self-appraisal of their own "science")
@KierenSerreynKS
2 жыл бұрын
I've experimented with a lot of psychedelics and I can definitely understand why it could make you a better hunter. You feel way more in tune with your surroundings; you hear better and you see sharper and clearer. You feel like you're part of nature at a level that's impossible to feel when sober. Staring far in the distance, or at clouds, the stars and the Moon are some of the most satisfying things you can do on a high dose of LSD or psilocybin.
@cosmiccomedy7394
2 жыл бұрын
I agree, visual acuity is definitely increased with psilocybin.
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
There is no evidence to show that it improves visual acuity. You will not do better on an eye exam. However, it helps with visual perception, which may help you with identifying patterns or doing a jigsaw puzzle. You may feel like you have better eyesight, but what you may be experiencing is seeing details that your brain previously ignored or took for granted. Pretty cool! However, there’s no evidence to show that visual perception makes you a better hunter. Haha
@davidgough3512
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions Many don't realize how big a role present awareness, patience and stillness play in hunting. The right dose can erase time and allow a prolonged sense of open awareness and unbroken alert presence. Also: dilated pupils gather more light in low light when animals are most active. Or for tracking in low light.
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
@@davidgough3512 If you can show me a controlled study that demonstrates that psilocybin improves visual acuity, then we’ve got data we can discuss. Until that point, it’s just anecdotes.
@davidgough3512
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions Perhaps you have mistaken me for another commentor. Nowhere did i mention acuity. In fact my experience agrees with your suggestion that pattern recognition plays more of a role. Also, the (admittedly ideosyncratic) enhancement of the ability to sit still and remain alertly present, and the fairly universal dilation of pupils at even small doses (won't make the eyechart any clearer but will make it more apparent in dim light ) are symptoms other than acuity. As for evidentary studies, we're 50 years behind, thanks to recent prohibitions, part of the heresy crushing since emperor Constantine, and a current inhibited interest in profit investment into researching the unpatentable.
@damianbouras
2 жыл бұрын
I thought the stoned ape hypothesis was that psilocybin played a factor in the sociocultural part of the evolutionary drive of human intelligence. Not the sole reason and not the direct cause of genetic change.
@mobleyMobley
2 жыл бұрын
Right, if u listen to terence explain it, it was fairly well-thought-out. I personally believe Terence is greatly underestimated, the guy was basically a genius.
@bear5945
2 жыл бұрын
In the Amazon and Mexican indigenous society's its use is still an important part of those society's structure.
@fdrake4508
2 жыл бұрын
and also played a factor on language development
@mikek4040
2 жыл бұрын
@Kristie Hansen And what were the apes before they were apes? ANd before that and before that? Everything is made from the same thing. So you could say we evolved from an eukaryote also and be just as accurate.
@mikek4040
2 жыл бұрын
@Kristie Hansen The evidence is that there are over 10 million different species. Which would me that all different life forms would have started around the same time and then through natural selection, be what they are today. However, if the evolution theory is contemplated then a single life form could have branched out into all the different species due to natural selection, into what we see today. So to your point, though, I have not seen evidence either of one species turning into another species but it was explained to me this way, just like a rainbow you cant tell where one color really ends and starts a new color. Now if we look at genetics then its probably evolution.
@george.beard2409
Жыл бұрын
Psilocybin mushrooms and psychedelics generally are very beneficial substances and can really help people with mental health issues.
@nikacadoallahcado6135
6 ай бұрын
@@JoshuaMichaelHowe to try and legalize it id imagine
@daikucoffee5316
2 жыл бұрын
That’s crazy, have you ever done DMT?
@hectorthesolfather5059
2 жыл бұрын
Clearly she hasn't lmao
@TheInterestingInformer
2 жыл бұрын
@@hectorthesolfather5059 twas a joe Rogan reference
@johnanthony2218
2 жыл бұрын
Along with richat structure and ancient Egyptians kinda weird
@spencedog
2 жыл бұрын
It’s a Joe Rogan reference, for all the AFABs that don’t get it
@rumblerowdy5332
2 жыл бұрын
Not yet, just tried a small dose of shrooms. Working my way to the top
@ahmetberat7357
Жыл бұрын
Psychedelic's definitely have potential to deal with mental health symptoms like anxiety and depression , I would like to try them again but it's just so hard to source out here.
@tomrandell2979
Жыл бұрын
Psilocybin containing mushrooms saved my life . The drastically reduced my benzodiazepine withdrawal allowing me to quite illicit pill addiction after three years of heavy daily use before it would had became medically dangerous to quit . It has also helped me survive depression .
@lucasanthony5648
Жыл бұрын
The Trips I've been having have really helped me a lot , I finally feel in control of my emotions and my future and things that used to be mundane to me now seem incredible and full of nuance on top of that I'm way less driven by my ego and I have alot more empathy as well.
@gaeliqbal3952
Жыл бұрын
@@lucasanthony5648 Tripping is not all that bad but one has to find a good mycologist to teach you the right things you need to know
@hunterjonathan9259
Жыл бұрын
@Frank Teddy This whole thing is pretty new to me, can I try 3 grams?
@eliascharles9742
Жыл бұрын
@@lucasanthony5648 I am feeling the same way too, I put too much on my plate and it definitely affects my stress and anxiety levels. I am also glad to be part of this community.
@costcolawschool
2 жыл бұрын
it is also unscientific to do experiments of this type for a few months only on adult rats. giving successive generations of mice mushrooms on a regular basis over the course of about 40 years would be the way to conduct this study. by the time it concluded the mice might be in charge of the planet like hitchhikers guide.
@davidgough3512
2 жыл бұрын
😁🤪😉👍
@mortenwintherolsson3237
2 жыл бұрын
… or the sentient yoghurt from “Love Death + Robots”…. But as anyone who really knows where his towel is could tell you, humans aren’t descended from those simians anyway; we were wiped out by the useless third of the population (hair-dressers, fine arts experts, PR consultants, anything with human resources, executive managers, and so on) of an alien civiliazation, after they were tricked into crashing their escape rocket (to escape the impending *DOOM* of 2012-like proportions for their planet, although that was a made-up story by the useful two thirds of the population, who promised they would be following RIGHT after the useless left) into pre-historic earth. They were a bit confused at first, f.ex. they didn’t have any money, until some marketing guy noticed that money is green, so are tree leaves, now tree leaves will be our money. This idea, however, led to terrible inflation, since their money now literally grew on trees, but their military (useless, remember?) offered to solve the inflation problem… with flame-throwers… since the leaves wouldn’t grow on trees, if only they burned down everything on the planet that carried green leaves… Oh yeah, and the original ultimate question about life, the universe and everything was lost with this unforseen change in earths programming (earth is a supercomputer designed by mice, well duh!), but a slightly erroneous copy is preserved in the mind of one Arthur Dent, eventually read by a paranoid android from before Radiohead, and eventually revealed through a game of Scrabble. The (erroneous) ultimate question of life, the universe and everything is: “What do you get if you multiply 5 by 7?”… I prefer the lab mice’s take on it for artistic reasons, though: “how many roads must a man walk down?”, so profound, so deep, so empty of any coherent meaning or message… EDIT: I like Dylan Thomas too. I won’t go quietly into any dark night, I rage to the point where the neighbors complain that I won’t accept the waning of the light. But that poem is waaaay over-used, and Robert Zimmerman is a MUCH better poet in my not-so humble opinion.
@BobardeZanzibar
2 жыл бұрын
You would need strong evidence to support this especially since the mechanism proposed is Darwinian selection and that would be very difficult to perform in lab settings.
@jeddrance6863
22 күн бұрын
Yes, as they become in charge of the planet egos may form whether be tool language psychedelics etc but it seems like these all combined or more likely theory’s of evolution if evolution is really the truth ?
@shotakonkin2047
2 жыл бұрын
In scientific terms hypothesis and theory means different things, a theory explains observable facts and such while a hypothesis is basically an untested idea. A hypothesis turns into a theory once the tests are conclusive. Linguistically this is only a hypothesis.
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
Agreed. It is a hypothesis, not a theory. The only reason we used that language in the video is because it is more commonly called the "stoned ape theory". I even did a search on google trends and significantly more people look for "stoned ape theory" rather than "stoned ape hypothesis". But you are correct that it is only a hypothesis.
@TheHunterGracchus
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions Besides, if you look at historical usage of the word "theory," it hasn't always been that anal.
@boarstatus3450
2 жыл бұрын
"how convenient this perfect substance happen to be in the right place at the right time?" Psychedelics can be found all over the earth from mushrooms,herbs,cacti,seeds even animals.
@rugdoc97
2 жыл бұрын
Billions of years ago too before us
@edwarlock8244
Жыл бұрын
The entire universe is only possible because of very convenient, perfect conditions.
@connorrekdahl3754
Жыл бұрын
Exactly, there are some very fishy points here that she tries to make. And even if it were the perfect time, I think that would only aid more of what Terence said concerning the purpose of the mushroom so I doubt it would hurt his point regardless
@gschaaf713
Жыл бұрын
right? and what about life itself? is that her response to the formation of life? Because the first single celled organism was also very convenient but that happened didnt it?
@cadencemccracken4229
2 жыл бұрын
"A hippie version of intelligent design" - SHOTS FIRED 🤣
@bonanza27
Жыл бұрын
i feel so seen rn 😂
@TheTrancemaster90
2 ай бұрын
on point!
@Zara2010gSm
2 жыл бұрын
I want to add, to Terence defence, that he was always very undogmatic. He frequently pointed out to his audience or readers that everything he said might as well be the ravings of a lunatic, and that you should make what you wanted out of it. Nevertheless, ideas can be very powerful and this particular theory has caused a lot of debate, engagement and speculation. That is one of the main driving forces of science. Without curiosity, discourse and open-mindedness whe have nothing, only status quo.
@alexc1105
2 жыл бұрын
The stoned ape theory would make a lot more sense if reindeer ruled the world
@alexc1105
2 жыл бұрын
@@rickshawredemption ...Because how so?
@Competitive_Antagonist
2 жыл бұрын
Stoned ape theory makes more sense when you're stoned.
@alexc1105
2 жыл бұрын
@@rickshawredemption That entire statement proves you clearly haven't a clue about reindeers, evolution, this video, how to justify a statement with reasoned arguments or psychadelics. If you are going to level a charge of ignorance against me please explain why you think I am ignorant not just of what (which was pretty redundant as it followed a one sentance statement... it wasn't going to be the geopolitics of modern day Persia was it)
@patrickholston7090
2 жыл бұрын
@@alexc1105 I think what Noah is trying to say is that reindeer are known to consume Amanita muscara mushrooms, which are not actually considered to be psychedelics. Though they are famously hallucinogenic, A. muscara mushrooms are said to produce, beyond anything else, a state of sensory distortion and delirium, as opposed to psychedelic drugs which are of course regarded as having the potential to enhance perception or produce more meaningful states of mind. In the community of psychedelic enthusiasts, A. muscara is typically not given much reverence for these reasons. I don’t share this in support of stoned ape theory but rather because I thought you mind find it interesting and because it might clarify this misunderstanding.
@alexc1105
2 жыл бұрын
@@patrickholston7090 There is a gap in my mycological knowledge there. I did think (mistakenly) that the Fly argaric contained Psilocin or psilcybin as well as muscolin. I think to be fair though, Noah Boblett just wanted to be... a bit of a troll...
@jsmith7348
2 жыл бұрын
“ I get why this theory is appealing , it’s very neat “ Boy oh boy does that explain a lot of peoples political views
@user-gh9yl3io8b
2 жыл бұрын
I bet your political ideas are very based and cool, and not just following others around you
@kenfalloon3186
2 жыл бұрын
As flawed as Mckenna's idea is, l think it's also overly simplistic to assert that psychadelics played no part in the evolution of human consciousness. Transcendant experience is core element of the psychadelic effect, a key component in the evolution of religion and is a feature of human societys as far back as we can find any trace of ourselves. We are revelation junkies.
@BobardeZanzibar
2 жыл бұрын
The stoned ape hypothesis specifically argues that it triggered it and that is what she is arguing against. It also wouldn't be the drugs that caused the changes in brain evolution, it would be culture. Just like art and religion or traditions would affect brain evolution.
@lindboknifeandtool
2 жыл бұрын
@@BobardeZanzibar why would it be culture, and not drugs? Psychedelics are proven to promote neurogenesis... a direct injection of a serotonin analogue, flooding your brain creating new connections. Couldn’t you argue that culture came from mushrooms? You can’t count out early humans taking powerful psychedelics. 5 dried grams, would probably be half a meal for these people. They were taking huge doses.
@jamesthorogood1479
Жыл бұрын
"How convenient that this perfect substance happened to be in the right place at the right time." This is a flawed line of thought in my opinion. One could also reflect on our improbable existence and say: "How convenient that our sun just happened to be the exact distance away from our planet to harbour life". This is known as the "anthropic principle". IF the sun wasn't absolutely perfect, we wouldn't be here to say otherwise. IF psychedelics weren't available, our brains wouldn't have evolved enough to say otherwise. It doesn't prove anything (of course), but it's another cog in the mechanism.
@SinfulSoulBand
Ай бұрын
My hypothesis about the sun being at perfect distance is that the sun is conscious. Stars in general. Some kind of conciousness, even if different than humans. Cant prove it, but interesting thought... In the same sense, perhaps substances are also part of conciousness
@Fractal_Entity
2 жыл бұрын
I simply don’t find this any more convincing than his ideas. We don’t know enough to say the hypothesis is true, and we certainly don’t know enough to say that it’s “too easy” to be true. No one in their right mind says that it’s an umbrella solution either, it’s probably an aspect of psychological evolution, not the sole cause.
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
The point of the video was to show that the ideas posed by the Stoned Ape hypothesis are not supported by any research or evidence. The claims that McKenna made do not align with existing data. And you're right that other theories should be similarly scrutinized. But at least there's _some_ supporting research. So they really should be more convincing because they're the only ones with some backing based in science: www.pnas.org/content/early/2012/10/17/1206390109 www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S0047248417303597?via%3Dihub www.pnas.org/content/95/3/1336
@Fractal_Entity
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions Thanks for your response! I definitely appreciate your video, I just think it’s important that we not rush to discount these hypotheses as “bad” overall, because while it might not be an umbrella solution, the central ideas may still lead to some important discoveries.
@onsightitify
2 жыл бұрын
Seriously. What ever happened to Occam's Razor? Lol
@ekay4495
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions Still quite a dismissive and slightly unscientific perspective on the theory since we literally don't have any research into it. Imagine before any new discovery everyone just said, well no data supports it so can't be this new thing, quite a ridiculous answer.
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
@@ekay4495 First, we have research about related topics that have shown results that do not align with McKenna’s claims. Second, this *is* how science works. The burden of proof is on the creators and researchers of a hypothesis. Without substance to back it up, it’s just a fun story. It can exist, but that doesn’t make it legit.
@Orland013
2 жыл бұрын
It's important to mention that most ancient cultures had some sort of shamanism. Shamans used to be what priests are to modern religions. So it's not hard to imagine that those ape-humans were taking psychedelics as a way to connect to the gods, spirits, animas or whatever cosmology they had. If psychedelics precede religion then I don't doubt that they were an important asset in the homo sapiens evolution.
@orbismworldbuilding8428
2 жыл бұрын
Probably the origin of those concepts like god and spirit world
@theunwantedcritic
2 жыл бұрын
Seeing shit that’s not there and making up a religion or cult around visions has not been a good thing.
@donjuan2001
2 жыл бұрын
Maybe. Religion serves a utilitarian purpose, being that it enabled collaboration on a mass scale independant of factors such as familial bond or location. It can prompt people who have never met to see one another as friends thanks to a mutual interest, which in turn opens up the potential for trade and cooperation in procuring resources or hunting. Simply put, its an effective means of gettings strangers to organize. I think the fact that religion engendered profound tangible benefits is most likely to be the cause for it's widespread proliferation, rather than psychedelic use. Maybe psychedelics were indeed involved in some capacity, but I don't personally believe they played an integral role.
@orbismworldbuilding8428
2 жыл бұрын
@ippos_khloros good point, if anything it'd influence culture and culture would influence evolution/biology.
@MikeTython369
2 жыл бұрын
Santa was essentially a shaman.
@petersmythe6462
2 жыл бұрын
Sleep deprivation is also "chemical binoculars." The problem is that there's a goddamn reason your eyes do all the postprocessing and filtering that lowers the resolution and constrains the focal range. You see a lot more of the blue end of the spectrum especially and you see movement where none exists. You also see a lot of irrelevant things like dust floating in the air or little St. Elmo's fire at the tips of leaves and such. And pareidolia goes crazy and you see animals where there are none. I would argue that this probably makes you worse at hunting, not better, but that's just my guess.
@archonking7449
2 жыл бұрын
The video isn’t about sleep deprivation though…
@tony7951
2 жыл бұрын
Not a very good guess huh.
@crabtrap
2 жыл бұрын
In regards to ego death being not meaningful to apes: fresh mushrooms would be quite tasty to hungry apes. Its a meat substitute w/o the danger of hunting. Its really not that hard of a concept.
@MadsterV
5 ай бұрын
Also, they're fun. Elephants and some birds have been caught repeatedly seeking fermented fruit and then drunkenly stumbling around. Animals are not judgemental, what feels good gets repeated.
@kekero540
2 жыл бұрын
“If all you have is a psilocybin mushroom everything else starts to look like your mom” - my mom
@davytyler
2 жыл бұрын
I'm a huge McKenna fan, it is important to hold his hypothesis to the fire though. McKenna may have had a lot of wisdom and understanding of both human nature, language and psychs, but that doesn't mean that everything he said was true. I appreciate the perspective, and you make an excellent argument. You brought me around on this.
@Competitive_Antagonist
2 жыл бұрын
It sounds plausible that a substance could cause a rise in creativity, that causes you to change your environment, causing genetic adaptation to the environment bringing various advantages. Though, just because it's plausible, it doesn't make it true. I also appreciate honest scepticism when dealing with ideas like this. Truth should never be rejected because of personal bias. I can understand how the reality might be offensive to some, especially with the bigoted attitudes to certain substances. If it was scientifically and generally accepted that psychedelics accelerated human evolution, then there would likely be much less of a stigma around them. Though, we can't challenge bad ideas with more bad ideas.
@env0x
2 жыл бұрын
mckenna was a loon but this is one of his only theories that actually made any sense. there's a lot of holes in it for sure, but for it to be dismissed just because the guy who thought of it was crazy is ridiculous. every time some new breakthrough scientific discovery has been made it was by some guy who everyone thought was a lunatic.
@davytyler
2 жыл бұрын
@@Competitive_Antagonist exactly. It's not healthy to build a mythology just because we like the impact that it would have now. It's better we end the war on psychedelics by modern ancidotal evidence of safety and hard data from experiments. Inventing this version of psudo-history will only serve to make mushrooms and the people who take them, to be crazy.
@Corey-dk3xi
2 жыл бұрын
World-class comment.
@deancameron3740
2 жыл бұрын
He himself did not take his ideas around psychedelics as gospel, they were just ideas to be pondered over but people seem to think that he was the psychedelic messiah. He said himself I'm just a guy that said I don't even take myself seriously
@Holobrine
2 жыл бұрын
Clearly more research is needed. The specifics that Terence McKenna suggested are wrong, but there’s plenty of room to study the hunting advantages and disadvantages other symptoms may have. Personally, I believe this theory deserves refinement, not outright dismissal.
@jorenbosmans8065
2 жыл бұрын
As with any theory that has clear and measurable ideas, it deserves decent study indeed. I just wonder if people will accept the results (both supporters and opponents)
@TimiPigeon
2 жыл бұрын
And somehow your view will be dismissed even though it’s the most rational, nuanced and thought out Welcome to modern discourse
@jorenbosmans8065
2 жыл бұрын
@@TimiPigeon it might be. I like to be naive and it will be mostly like this in the public discourse and less in the scientific
@omargiovanni7767
2 жыл бұрын
@@ronsnow402 In a starving situation would be the difference... as the dudes in sylicon valley using this as a edgy competing tool
@maaaaaap
2 жыл бұрын
@@TimiPigeon if you present it with actual evidence and not in a youtube comment section, your chances to not be dismissed will be a lot better
@matteocontardo7406
2 жыл бұрын
I'm afraid this video might be missing a key point. In my opinion it may not be the "being stoned" part that helped in any way (i.e. you don't necessarily hunt better when stoned; likely you hunt worse), but the repeated use (in small doses, during specific occasions, by specific members of clans, etc) over tens of thousands, if not hundreds of thousands of years, that has had a somewhat permanent impact on our species' brain development. How can one prove that ingesting a specific substance for countless generations via countless individuals has or doesn't have an impact in the overall evolution of the species? I'm tempted to say it is not possible to prove nor disqualify, but worth many many hours of discussion !
@onism3053
2 жыл бұрын
Messing with psychedelics like mushrooms, dmt, and peyote, I have definitely expanded my mind. I dont think it's far fetched at all.
@bryanjackson8917
2 жыл бұрын
Messing with beer and weed, I have definitely expanded my waist line.
@LiliumCruorem
2 жыл бұрын
As a fighter I have experimented with psychedelics and combat. There is potential for neurogenesis when ingesting mushrooms. I don’t find my personal anecdote to be facts or anything. But i did feel an amplified intuition with my body; also my fear was dissolved and I was able to see my opponents as what they were. My reflexes felt hypertuned, my vision was clear, my mind was empty but for the instinctual movements. It was an educational experience. The peculiar thing is that I have been able to reproduce this state of clarity when completely sober when I focus.
@samuelkernohan267
2 жыл бұрын
You could say that psycadelics helped along the way, but there are so many other factors that it couldn’t possibly be the only thing that got us to where we are today
@Vence.
2 жыл бұрын
Caffeinated Modern Man Theory >
@kenanthenanex
2 жыл бұрын
Yes!!! We ate beans
@jaybingham3711
2 жыл бұрын
Drunk modern man theory...err hypothesis. Never did hominids not have plenty of access to fermented fruits.
@skramzy6628
2 жыл бұрын
Argues that our hungry ancestors wouldn't eat a lot of shrooms because they don't have egos (what?!) and therefore wouldn't experience ego death (supposedly why WE eat lots of shrooms). Immediately goes to an expert explaining that some chimpanzees like mushrooms so much they get erections upon seeing them! I'm actually not deeply committed to the stoned ape hypothesis, although I find it as good as any other theory in explaining the bizarrely rapid mutations that lead to super fast brain growth. But I'm sorry, this video just makes a god-awful case against it. I'm especially peeved that it mostly presents a straw person Lamarckian-type evolutionary approach to the theory. In other words, she's arguing that the theory states the effects of the shrooms on the adults who ate them led to bigger brains, rather than the far more plausible take that shrooms ingested during pregnancy could explain the sudden increase in fetal brain mutations that the theory seeks to explain - irregardless of whatever they did to the adult hominids.
@mortenwintherolsson3237
2 жыл бұрын
Wait… psilocybin causes mutations? Ok… source? Or brief explanation of proposed mechanism?
@skramzy6628
2 жыл бұрын
@@mortenwintherolsson3237 You know what, I think I may have made a Lamarckian type error myself. I was assuming that a drug with well-documented evidence for altering neural networks could have a profound effect on the developing neural networks of a fetus, and that when these changes were beneficial, they would be passed on. But although those changes would precipitate birth, they wouldn't necessarily alter the genes of the child, would they? There are epigenetic possibilities here, and chemically-induced mutations are a possibility, but on that level, If psilosin effected genetic change, it wouldn't necessarily impact the neural genes, I don't suppose. Maybe I'm the one making god-awful cases here.
@mortenwintherolsson3237
2 жыл бұрын
Honest mistake, but yes, I believe it is a mistake, still 😊 Altering the state or even structure does not necesarrily change the “blueprint” (dna). I wouldn’t be too surprised if it DID alter DNA in some way, I just don’t see how right now :)
@skramzy6628
2 жыл бұрын
@@mortenwintherolsson3237 Thank you for correcting me. Much appreciated!
@kaim3ra17
2 жыл бұрын
i took shrooms this past weekend and hypothesized the stone ape theory myself before i even knew what it was lmfaoooo.
@jorenbosmans8065
2 жыл бұрын
About the theory that psychodelics increase your Capacity to hunt. Which culture uses them to improve their hunting? It is a serious question. If there are cultures doing this, then it can be that there is some support to this theory. If no hunting culture does this, then you should wonder why.
@67kingdedede
2 жыл бұрын
ive heard word of peoples like mayans having used them
@jorenbosmans8065
2 жыл бұрын
@@67kingdedede really for hunting? I've heard many stories of them being used for warfare, but not hunting. I'm not saying you're wrong, I just want to check. If you are correct, it would lend some plausibility to the theory.
@Paul-ou1rx
2 жыл бұрын
When the only tool you really, really, really like using is a getting hammered....
@zachzeurcher6450
2 жыл бұрын
It definitely does enhance your vision at low doses.
@KierenSerreynKS
2 жыл бұрын
Improves my vision even at high doses. And so does LSD. I love staring in the distance when tripping, makes it a lot easier to stare and focus on tiny subjects very far away.
@somerandomfoo1723
2 жыл бұрын
this is true, but i feel like if apes were to find mushrooms theyd most likely just plop 1 or 2 of them in theyre mouth and eat em
@jorgparker2463
Жыл бұрын
I've heard a lot of tripping stories, and they are very exciting,I would love to try magic mushrooms but I can't easily get some, Is there any realiable source I can purchase from??
@mirabelwatson7863
Жыл бұрын
I have been looking for a legit seller to buy from.
@Elizabeth-gu8hx
Жыл бұрын
@Laura Polonioli came across the comments about bergwilly1 and I must say he is a genius.
@carsonelias4594
Жыл бұрын
Does he ship to Canada?
@markaxel9799
Жыл бұрын
This whole thing is pretty new to me, can I try 3grams?
@patriaciasmith3499
Жыл бұрын
How did it go? Is this person reliable? I’m in the same boat as you. I want so bad to try it.
@J0MBi
2 жыл бұрын
Here's a thought exercise: imagine how much easier it would be for non-academics to understand these concepts, and consequently how many less angry people there would be, if the word "theory" had the same meaning in science as it does in other fields/everyday usage.
@joshfloyd7755
2 жыл бұрын
( claps slow)
@LowMedow
2 жыл бұрын
Have You Ever Cosumed Psilocybin Mushrooms Before? 🍄
@joshfloyd7755
2 жыл бұрын
@@LowMedow I have. Both socially and on lone explorations.
@davidgough3512
2 жыл бұрын
Don't know how it got past them in high school science and math. And yet everybody has followed detective crime dramas, where the scientific process is applied to evaluate evidence, test hypotheses and develop a theory on what went down.
@WolvesHart79
2 жыл бұрын
Or imagine how better informed people would be if they understood what a scientific theory actually is instead of applying the shorthand version that people attribute to it i.e. lots of people mistakenly think theory is synonymous with a guess without understanding the scientific methods that go into something actually being deemed a formal theory.
@user-fd7vt5zx7q
2 жыл бұрын
Your looking way too close! The mushrooms in and of themselves is only a very small percentage of the overall pressure it applies to the growth of the species. The pursuit, the collection, processing etc would have a synergistic effect. Not the single substance, it and of itself, alone.
@BobardeZanzibar
2 жыл бұрын
How is that different from, say, hunting or gathering?
@onsightitify
2 жыл бұрын
I can definitely attest to psilocybin improving visual acuity. My eyesight is not what it used to be when I was younger, but when I go mushroom foraging on a low dose of 1 - 2 grams, the details of the forest floor are greatly enhanced, and I usually spot more mushrooms. Edges are sharper. Depth of perception is improved (more 3D). Details in the rocks, leaves, and trees pop. And as for its affect on the language centers of the brain, this is also verifiable. On large doses of 7 - 10 grams, I have had spontaneous glossolalia, sometimes speaking in multiple languages.
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
Your visual _perception_ is definitely affected, but there is no evidence supporting improvements in visual _acuity_ . Your brain may have an easier time identifying patterns and perhaps spotting mushrooms would be easier, but it doesn't improve your eyesight.
@onsightitify
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions Next time I will skip the foraging and take an eye-test. ;)
@lucacottle5692
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions visual perception is not the same as perception of visual perception. If you feel you can spot things easier, that perception will positively affect your visual acuity. Don't downplay the placebo effect.
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
Visual perception may be affected by mushrooms, but if you are saying that an increase in visual acuity can be attributed to the placebo effect, then you are effectively saying that it is _not_ caused by the mushrooms. Instead, it is caused by the mind.
@abrum8869
2 жыл бұрын
Maybe I missed it, but the video never ( up to the 21 minute mark ) never gave evidence that mushrooms did not aid in the development of language, harnessing fire and using tools. The impression I got was that the video author is saying those skills, not magic mushrooms, was what spurred humanity onward. In so far as I understand the conversion as a whole, I don't think the development of those skills totally excludes psychedelics.
@samus598
2 жыл бұрын
Yeah I also found that to be weird. Seems to me like a culture eating mushrooms would suddenly find different values, and would start highly prioritizing traits like vocalization, singing, creativity, etc. It seems plausible enough to me that the introduction of psilocybin into their communities would alter the natural selection as singers/vocalizers became desirable to men and women as much as physical strength. I dont think the theory is supposed to explain everything or discount other factors, it's really a straw man on her part.
@abrum8869
2 жыл бұрын
@@samus598 I know that Sillypsybun has helped me a great deal. I can only imagine what it could do on an evolutionary timeline and with societal/tribal collaboration,.
@BobardeZanzibar
2 жыл бұрын
Do you have evidence that they do? She specifically began the video saying that we can't know for certain but that mushroom use is not necessary or sufficient to generate consciousness especially when it would have taken millions of years of continual use for that to be the case.
@josemelendez537
2 жыл бұрын
This over looks small mushroom related statues and other artifacts found in Mexico and India. Some dating as far back as 600 b.c. There seems to be more evidence pointing to it being true than not. especially after hearing the argument against it.
@shamanstarrpeacefully4536
2 жыл бұрын
Terrence Mckenna did not believe in his theories. He always welcomed the intellectual community in to discuss his strange ideas and get down to the bottom of things.
@shamanstarrpeacefully4536
2 жыл бұрын
good video
@melodycraft9239
2 жыл бұрын
in before Joe Rogan fanatics get defensive XD
@codrutispasoiu
2 жыл бұрын
Good one 🤗
@JewJon08
2 жыл бұрын
I'm so steamed, I could cook broccoli!
@shalberus
2 жыл бұрын
Last time I was this early I was a stoned ape
@chiklachikla7641
2 жыл бұрын
Lmao
@evangelinemartell3366
2 жыл бұрын
I never hear anyone talk about how it could very likely have had an epigenetic effect. There's never going to be just one thing that expanded our brains so much, and psychedelics were likely fed to children as well, this is all to say that language likely formed alongside this phenomenon
@evangelinemartell3366
2 жыл бұрын
@@sophiedee2557 ?
@KateeAngel
11 ай бұрын
prove that psychedelics were likely fed to children? You have none. Most current hunter-gatherer shamanistic cultures use those ONLY during rituals, only by adults, and not even all adults. In many cultures only shamans can take psychedelics
@FreePokemonGiveaway
2 жыл бұрын
That language part was really bizarre to me. There are no words in the human language that can form the aforementioned neural connections. You can’t talk a human out of depression. Language is a tool to express and understand ideas. Psychedelics are a tool to improve cognitive ability while not during the dosage itself but in the long term effects. Comparing the two is like saying the frame of a house is more important than the internals of it. Both are imperative to creating the entire body of work.
@nathanbertoch1617
2 жыл бұрын
You can absolutely talk a human out of depression, what do you think therapy is?
@FreePokemonGiveaway
2 жыл бұрын
@@nathanbertoch1617 Therapy is for a myriad of things and depression is only one of them. Have you ever heard of anti depression medication? Why would this exist if words were enough?
@nathanbertoch1617
2 жыл бұрын
@@FreePokemonGiveaway I'm just saying therapy works for curing depression. Not for all people in all cases but people have absolutely been talked out of depression. Saying that they can't is bullshit.
@FreePokemonGiveaway
2 жыл бұрын
@@nathanbertoch1617 you can be talked out of a mood. You cannot be talked out of a chemical imbalance.
@vladsilviudumitrescutudor4397
2 жыл бұрын
"We invented agriculture so we can make beer" ... where did this come from? We invented agriculture for food to feed the people, we added hops and whatnot to our agriculture to make beer.
@dei2226
2 жыл бұрын
fermenting cereals is the oldest known way to preserve them from mold etc. Hoops is not essential to make "beer".
@spaceowl5957
2 жыл бұрын
Humans actually shrank after doing agriculture, suggesting malnourishment. Hunter gatherers we’re the same height as modern first-world people. There always a great video about it by “Trey the Explainer” (amazing channel btw) but I can’t remember which one.
@spaceowl5957
2 жыл бұрын
So food was probably not the reason they started doing agriculture
@spaceowl5957
2 жыл бұрын
Beer is more plausible
@liquidstar9
2 жыл бұрын
good point. it makes more sense to me that discovering fermentation and beer would have been a natural and swift consequence of farming, specifically because farming is so ridiculously effective, as soon as you get the hang of it you often end up with more crops than you know what to do with. these excess crops would, to my thinking, be the first place a person would stumble upon fermentation. especially if you were in a very wet region.
@edmundpope6415
2 жыл бұрын
people just want psychedelics to be have some important meaning attached to them
@ezraboyle2236
2 жыл бұрын
Take DMT and then come back and tell me there isn't...
@transsexual_computer_faery
2 жыл бұрын
enter into those portals and you'll understand why we place such importance.
@edmundpope6415
2 жыл бұрын
@@transsexual_computer_faery You've proven my point, i ve tripped many times and experienced the dissolution of the ego multiple times. And what has it given me? Good things, but it is not a perfect, magical cure. These chemicals put you in a mental state like no other, and can be incredibly dangerous. They should be treated with the utmost respect. They probably arent responsible for the development of human consciousness. And, quite frankly, they are highly dangerous. Especially during dissociative ego death moments.
@transsexual_computer_faery
2 жыл бұрын
@@edmundpope6415 "important" and "dangerous" are not mutually exclusive. i personally do not believe psychedelics spawned human consciousness and i didn't assert as such in my earlier comment. just a whole lot of assumptions on your part. you only provided one very specific statement, which is what i commented on. so no issues there.
@TimiPigeon
2 жыл бұрын
This discussion is simply far to derivative and contrived for my taste, and I think you’ve missed McKenna’s point completely. “Stoned Ape” is also a misnomer or misleading term, as it’s quite ludicrous to think that contact with psychedelics somehow miraculously and instantaneously caused a slew of psychological and physiological changes in ancient hominids. No. The essence of the matter, which beyond all these abstractions and minutia of particularities, precedes, pervades and underpins all of human history, from the early hominids to you and me talking through these funny black squares. Perhaps an early dose spurred some kind of early curiosity and fascination, which has endured and evolved with us as we hunted and herded animals, farmed our crops, and had prolonged contact and a relationship with psychedelic substances, which is reflected in our very neural chemistry. A better term would be “psychedelic symbiosis hypothesis”
@trololopeth
2 жыл бұрын
The slow-zoom while you're talking is very psychedelic
@stewartcocotis7830
2 жыл бұрын
“i don’t understand why apes would keep eating the mushrooms” proceeds to tell us that mushrooms give monkeys erections
@CapaneusoftheGnosticLegion
Жыл бұрын
Another reason why this theory is popular, is because it literally is proven to regrow and as well as completely grow new neurons and strengthen the neurons responsible for sensing your environment.
@cynical8330
2 жыл бұрын
It was cooked food, cooked food meant we had to spend less time chewing so we had time to develop brains.
@bryanjackson8917
2 жыл бұрын
But you had to first develop the brains to cook the food. Clear example of circular reasoning. Not only that, cooking the food didn't necessarily mean you had to spend less time chewing. Ever ate an over cooked chicken?
@cynical8330
2 жыл бұрын
@@bryanjackson8917 I mean my anthropology professor could be wrong. If anything I would say it's multiple factors, including psychoactive drugs and cooked food. Edit: Like it's said in the video, it's very likely psilocybin was used by early humans. We have evolved for throusands of years along side psilocybin, I've no doubt it's had an effect.
@bigfoot3866
2 жыл бұрын
You take some mushrooms and do some complex tasks. You won't get very far lol. As a hunter and someone who's tripped alot it's harder than you think.
@FloppyCat1990
2 жыл бұрын
Mushrooms are also a lot more potent nowadays. They didn't have the ability to dehydrate them and take much large doses, and other things.
@NoLefTurnUnStoned.
2 жыл бұрын
Small doses heightens vision, hearing and general senses. Very good for hunting. Tripping off your head on high doses surely not a good hunting aid.
@bt_photo
2 жыл бұрын
Psychedelics are probably responsible for religion(s) though. By the way, the mushrooms you labeled as Cubensis on dung are Psilocybe Cyanescens, which grow on wood.
@friedchickenUSA
2 жыл бұрын
i know the last bit is presented as kind of a joke, but i wanna point out mckenna didnt necessarily believe all the ideas he put forth. alot of ideas he did get, but he decided to present them as such, and worry about skepticism after the fact. as he got older, he did grow increasingly doubtful of his ideas, the extraterrestrial one included.
@arvink5537
Жыл бұрын
Argument for stoned ape theory: Someone thinks its true. Argument against stoned ape theory: You don't think it's true. We're getting no where with this.
@LiberLotus
2 жыл бұрын
Something I spent a lot of time thinking about as well, thanks for that walk through! I agree that Terrance (and I do love Terrance) was overstating the scale of influence that psilocybin could have had, and it's important to be clear on that. One thing that was stated is that entheogens have been given to chimps and other high primates. Does anyone had a link to those studies? I looked through the references but I wasn't sure if one of those books were where that statement came from. Lastly, regarding the idea that Terrance believed that the mushroom was an intelligent species that made it's way to earth to commune with us... You have to remember that Terrance was also a mystic of sorts, who, like so many of us that engage in this form of spirituality, gravitates towards the implication of pan-psychism. The "Gaia Mind" and so on. I never saw it so much that Terance believed the mushroom itself was intelligent, but rather that as a part of the Gaia mind of nature "arrangements" were made [by the "universe" then] to see to it that this catalyst would cross our paths. I myself have had encounters with this oracle, but I have never seen it as an expression of the fungus itself, but rather the fungus is a early contributor into what became the collective mind of the bio-sphere. Psilocybin is a channel you get tuned into, and in that channel lies an "other", and that other is a deep intelligence that appears via a manifestation that is involuntary of your thoughts or actions, wherefrom I do not understand. That being said, anyone who's smoked DMT knows the content of these kinds of visions do not come from the lexicon of your living experiences.
@llamamusicchannel7688
2 жыл бұрын
I hear you I entered this journey as a total close minded atheist that wanted nothing to do with anything spiritual. Many of my friends have been the same. Over the last few months we have all converted to this sort of idea of the universe setting a scene. There's just been too many coincidences during our trips together it's been hard for us not to acknowledge that it feels like the outside world was playing with us.
@chrishusoen
Жыл бұрын
I believe it. Psychedelics open our minds to creativity, re-balancing, spirituality, thru enthalpy. Mushrooms not just psychoactive but other sacred plants are highly beneficial (plants for pain (wild lettuce), sleeping, energy, mental focus, night sight clarity (xanga/ibogaine).. we are so blind with mental blockage (we rather watch tv then forage in the forest or roll up to fast food for convenience..) these guys had all the time in the world to trip and benefit, explore our natural side. Lastly there is ancient cave art depicting signs of psychedelic use. Literally mushroom headed cave art so ancient they can't date.. Haha.. enjoy
@thegoblonoid
2 жыл бұрын
2:34 - thats a 3D portrait of Terence by Fabio Paiva. Just to give credit.
@ACoupleStoners
2 жыл бұрын
He was incredibly quick to dismiss the idea that an organism could create something that would effect another species as a whole. But that's literally what alcohol and caffeine and tobacco have done to our society. I don't think that anyone can argue the history of these 2 substances has had a massive effect on humans as a whole.
@petersmythe6462
2 жыл бұрын
No experience with psychedelics but visual acuity is definitely improved by extreme sleep deprivation. The issue is that post-processing doesn't seem to be a thing so it's more paroidoliac and also much bluer than normal human vision. I would go so far as to say sleep deprivation fundamentally alters color perception and probably blue sensitivity. The downside is that paroidoliac hallucination provides a lot of false positives and you can completely irrelevant phenomena like dusty air currents in a normal room or St. Elmo's fire on everyday objects.
@willcooper8028
2 жыл бұрын
Disclaimer: I’m not a supporter or believer of stoned ape theory I think the idea of a hypothetical, positive effect of psilocybin mushrooms on the hunting skills of early hominids (and the general skills of modern humans) is often misunderstood. I don’t believe that psilocybin consumption can increase reflexes, visual acuity, hand-eye coordination, etc. Any person’s capacity in these areas would likely be higher in a “sober” state. However-as discussed in this video-the psilocybin can suppress anxiety, which would likely hinder any person’s ability to perform skills to the height of their capacity. The maximum level of proficiency a person can reach after consuming psilocybin is likely lower than the maximum level of proficiency that same person can reach under normal conditions. However, that person’s ability to reach their current maximum level of proficiency-that person’s likelihood to reach a state of mind in which their proficiency is being fully utilized-may well be higher after psilocybin consumption due to the effects it has on the mind. A person may more readily access “flow state” due to psilocybin consumption, which may then allow them to better capitalize on their admittedly lowered skills and capacities. I know this video points out that the existence of an ego is required for the phenomenon of an “ego death,” but I’m not convinced that it is required for the phenomenon of a “flow state.” Regardless, this understanding of psilocybin and its effects on skill and performance may be crucial in having this discussion.
@Pabloesc571
2 жыл бұрын
Ask boxers that do mushrooms before sparing about this and come back.
@NoLefTurnUnStoned.
2 жыл бұрын
Mushrooms in small doses absolutely heighten sensory capacity. Especially hearing and vision. You’d have to take them to know.
@salamangkali-allmartialart4836
2 жыл бұрын
As a heavy user of these substances, I have to say that they are overhyped, much like the Stoned Ape theory. Many wild animals consume magic mushrooms, but don't reach the same level of intelligence. What I believe is, psychedelics only contributed to our intelligence, but was not the sole driving force behind it. Psychedelics gave us spirituality, and thus superstition, and thus religion, and thus rituals, and thus the ability to organize ceremonies based around calendars, which would lead to the formation of clergies, which would then become the record keepers of their respective societies, (notice the word "clerk" comes from "cleric") and because of their propensity for record keeping, would become the first scholars, and start the first academies and universities. It's no secret that the first and most od the top universities were originally for training clergymen, the same clergymen who created the scientific method, which created the modern world. To this day, the titles we award to academics, like Doctor and Professor, were originally the titles of saints and other religious leaders - particularly, Doctor was first used for the Christian apostles, who purportedly used mind-altering substances.
@foaarmedforces4175
2 жыл бұрын
I forgor what u said
@mistorWhiskers
2 жыл бұрын
This is in level of ancient aliens for me. It implies it took in outside force to make humanity what it is and I don't think that's the case.
@shortcutDJ
2 жыл бұрын
hello, i've grown kilograms of mushrooms during lockdown. *pats himself on the back✋
@bubbleworld4172
2 жыл бұрын
You are the hero we deserve.
@megaultradamn
2 жыл бұрын
What's your name and your address
@georgecarlin2656
2 жыл бұрын
Both sides are wrong because they exaggerate too much. Of course DMT and a myriad of other things played a role in human evolution, the question is how much exactly.
@MIOLAZARUS
2 жыл бұрын
Have you ever done mushrooms yourself? I think every person should talk about what they know from experience.
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
It’s funny that so many people in this comments section feel the same way about mushrooms, yet speak so confidently about human evolution without any experience or training to talk about it. In any case, you can rest assured that we’ve got plenty of experience.
@tlnyk5609
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions so I take it as a yes i assume
@MIOLAZARUS
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions I dont know anything about human evolution. It was a simple question with no ill intent. I just know how little I know. And that's a good thing i think🤗
@NoLefTurnUnStoned.
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions “Rest assured that we have plenty of experience” Really? I assumed that you had no experience with psychedelics.
@grahamsell3863
2 жыл бұрын
Have there been studies where modern day chimpanzees have been given mushrooms? I think that’s the only way to confirm/deny this theory for good. If you give small doses of mushrooms to chimpanzees, do they get better at language? Do they get better in any way? Even if the process is slow, we should still be able to detect it.
@bokchoiman
2 жыл бұрын
I agree with this experiment.
@bloodypommelstudios7144
2 жыл бұрын
We need to ask do they get better at language etc and then are the ones who are best at language etc more likely to reproduce than they otherwise would be. The study of ape language acquisition has had a LOT of quackery in the field too so the study would need to be controlled very carefully.
@dei2226
2 жыл бұрын
Have you watched the video? )
@8lec_R
2 жыл бұрын
Gonna take waaayyy too long. Besides I can't imagine how difficult it will be monitor this experiment and make sure we don't bias the results somehow
@bloodypommelstudios7144
2 жыл бұрын
@@8lec_R Yeah a few hundred years and 1000s of apes to give a reasonable chance for beneficial mutations.
@therandomyoutubechannel3026
2 жыл бұрын
Let's give psychedelics to the apes and see what happens 😉
@alemirdikson
2 жыл бұрын
I think the Stoned Ape Hypothesis is a better explanation for the evolution of society and perhaps even technology, but certainly not biologically. Languages, cultures, religions, myths, philosophies... Yeah, all of these could be assisted by psychedelic use. They didn't turn us from ape to man, evolution did that just fine. But it may have enhanced our ability to create and evolve society.
@alkumhcounseling8634
2 жыл бұрын
Another thing that is completely ridiculous about the stoned ape theory is that in order for an organism to have a brain that could experience the effect of a hallucinogen, clearly it would have already evolved. If you want new or bigger parts of the brain you need to be talking about protein more than anything else, which was actually the case as anthropological evidence suggests that increase meat consumption led to our larger brains. The same thing has been observed in other species which have gone from non carnivorous or omnivorous diets to them. Protein intake is part of why octopuses, squids and cuttlefish have much more developed brains and nervous systems than closely related clams. There is just so much wrong with the Stone Day hypothesis and it is a perfect example of people cherry picking facts because they want something to be true.
@sumitshresth
2 жыл бұрын
My 2 cents. When you are in outdoor camping what are the things that mind considers important? Fire, shelter, food and community of friends. Once you have the first three then you look for friends. Thats where psychedelics or even alcoholic drinks came into play into human civilization. Once humans had their fire and were full with day's hunt did they tried these things to calm themselves down for a nice sleep for a next day of adventure and uncertainties of aftrican jungle life.
@davidgough3512
2 жыл бұрын
Psychedelic experience and the concepts of language and symbol awareness are inextricably intertwined.
@RickL555
Жыл бұрын
Ha! That clip from 2001 was brilliant. Thank you so much for making this. Psychedelics have greatly improved the quality of my life. I'm one of those people that had otherwise untreatable depression and anxiety until psilocybin stepped in to the rescue but as you can imagine as an atheist and an enthusiast of all things science I'm pretty much a loner in the psychedelic community. I'm constantly having to remind people that the Stoned Ape Theory is a neat idea but doesn't have a whole lot of concrete evidence behind it. If I also took the time to explain to everybody how the words theory and hypothesis kind of got mixed up in how they're used in modern times and actually isn't the proper scientific application, I wouldn't have any friends anymore.
@ShirksDireWolf
2 жыл бұрын
id like to note that Terence McKenna later on said that he doesn't believe the stoned ape theory is the hole story. And his brother has said he probably wouldn't believe it if he was around today. I for one believe that psychedelic's played a role but it was similar to how coffee changed us. maybe psychedelics made us more creative or entuned with are emotions.
@donjohnson7189
2 жыл бұрын
Yes but then what is the answer to how this indeed affects the brain and have you ever tried any??🤔
@z0uLess
2 жыл бұрын
What annoy me most in the sciences is peoples inability to grasp time when evaluating causality in human behavior.
@davidgough3512
2 жыл бұрын
Do tell ! what took many millenia, even geologic time, is so often compressed into what we think of as "history", which better fits our penchant for story telling.
@vito4283
2 жыл бұрын
I am not a scientist, but i learned in my math classes that if you decide to take a sample of 16 people, you cant percieve a significant difference. Although, with an amount of 1000 people or more, you can. Then the experiment no longer has a chance factor. All i am saving is that Fischer did not execute a very professional or reliable experiment, in my amateur eyes. (Referring to 13:40 )
@naftalibendavid
2 жыл бұрын
It was very gracious of you to spend so much time on what is essentially an unfalsifiable hypothesis that even Terrence did not take seriously and then come up with an alternative explanation that the average psychonaut can find so thought provoking. Great work.
@malloryboyd
2 жыл бұрын
The way I see this theory: Psychedelics enhance pattern recognition skills and can provoke synesthesia, both of which is necessary for the development of language. However, primates could not have been the only animals using psychedelics, so where are the talking cats and dogs? I do find this theory very interesting, but I hate that it doesn’t take other animals into account.
@zh4835
2 жыл бұрын
I didn't know that there are so many professors in the KZitem comments.
@matteroftim3
Жыл бұрын
Seeing people talking about psychedelics without ever doing it, especially scientists or bigots makes me sick. It's like talking about going 10 billion stars away after one Rick and morty episode. Smoke some dmt. Take some shrooms. Then come back and talk. I'm not taking about the theory of Terrance. I don't really care. I talk about the attitude.
@pokefreakster
2 жыл бұрын
An excellent video; your conversation with Dr. Pascal Gagneux was incredibly insightful and very engaging. I'm subscribing for sure, looking forward to more!
@acsilver2777
2 жыл бұрын
It's not a higher state of consciousness. It's simply a substance induced altered-state of consciousness
@f.maximo7760
Жыл бұрын
If you haven't had a psychedelic experience with Mushrooms, I recommend you to do it and put your hands to work on this investigation 👍🏾 You got nothing to lose and I'm sure you'll find out a lot more than you think you know through conventional channels! Take it easy! But take it 😎 Nice video tho
@KateeAngel
11 ай бұрын
the only thing you find on a trip is your own hallucinations. Surely, they may be valuable, and may trigger your imaginations etc, but that information comes from inside of your brain, so it can't teach you about the outside world
@davidpritt5080
Жыл бұрын
Each discussion on psychedelics should include a disclaimer on whether the person speaking has done them and in what doses. As soon as this obviously intelligent professor said you might forget your bow and arrow while high on psilocybin, I had to assume he’s never actually experienced it. I’ve hunted on psilocybin using a firearm, and I’m a soft bodied American who spends way too much time sitting. Imagining that someone who LIVES to hunt would forget their weapon on mushrooms is frankly laughable. I’m sure he’s an expert in his field, but it seems he’s not in this one. I do wish him well.
@lucacottle5692
2 жыл бұрын
You lost everyone with experience in psychedelics when you suggested consciousness is exclusive to humans. EVERYTHING is consciousness.
@bellacurtis6026
2 жыл бұрын
Exactly. Experiencing life as an individual and having an ego is different than (and in a way opposite to) experiencing consciousness
@KateeAngel
11 ай бұрын
I get it that other complex animals probably have consciousness, but everything? nah, that is why so many of you psychedelics enthusiasts sound like woo-woo nonsense sellers.
@gerwit4713
6 ай бұрын
Nice video, I have a question. How many different psychedelic experience did you and the sir in the interview have had yourself?
@sandollor
2 жыл бұрын
The people that are getting upset about you questioning and commenting on the stoned ape hypothesis are clinging too tight to an idea as if it's part of their identity or something. Many people want a simple answer because it's something they can grasp. Try not to spend too much time placating to these types of people. Not unless you have a lot of time and a lot of patience and it's something you're serious about tackling otherwise it might be a waste of time. Well done work as always.
@epicbruhmoment6985
8 ай бұрын
I think what makes this theory satisfying to me is that when you really think about Humans as an animal it's mind breaking to comprehend just how vastly different from everything else on this planet and how frequently we just ignore fundamental laws of nature like it's nothing, it just seems like there must be some sort of outside catalyst responsible for the bizzareness that is humanity. But that's less scientific theory and more into the realm of beliefs.
@uberneanderthal
2 жыл бұрын
it's our hands and vocal apparatus that set us apart. most likely our brain and nervous system would've evolved to take full advantage of these tools, and the tools in turn became more refined as our ability to use them increased. and the loss of our 'rib'/baculum likely had more influence on cultural development than any psychedelics.
@StoriesByAi_
2 жыл бұрын
i agree
@SotraEngine4
2 жыл бұрын
I wonder if language began as a danger alert system, kinda like some species out there uses some sounds to alert others of dangers. Maybe next step would be simple hunting and gathering coordination and language got slowly more complex from there. More complex coordination and planning needed more advanced language to convey
@logannelson6473
2 жыл бұрын
"I seriously doubt your hunting gets better if you're stoned on mushrooms" lollll
@davidgough3512
2 жыл бұрын
A light dose dilates pupils, heightens sensory acuity and renders time irrelevant.. what hunter wouldn't want these advantages ?
@strongsmarthappy5970
2 жыл бұрын
I know LSD is different, but Dock Ellis threw a no hitter trippn' in 1970. A comment on youtube pointed out his name on the roster would be Ellis, D. (LSD) Hahaha!😀
@phredphlintstone6455
2 жыл бұрын
My friends dog ate shrooms. Took it to the vet cuz we didn't know what was wrong. Vet told us that its fairly common, said he even gets about half the dogs again. So at least some dogs like it. As for right place right time....what time would that be? After a rain? In a dense forest?
@jamescorbin5638
2 жыл бұрын
Your arguments against the theory employ more speculation than does McKenna; for example, you posit the fact that other species are attracted to mind altering substances but claim no effect on their evolution, as if one can determine evolutionary change within a snapshot. And the example of language doesn’t account for the experience which often cannot be sufficiently explained via language. And finally, “ego death” is experienced only with very high doses, neglecting the more subtle effects of a casual dose.
@repeatdefender6032
2 жыл бұрын
I've done plenty of mushrooms, in my personal experience i know there is no flipping way I'd be better at hunting while on them. I'm not even seeing reality when I'm tripping, the idea of doing anything productive, let alone something as dangerous as hunting, is laughable. I have to wonder if that guy ever even took mushrooms himself.
@bryanjackson8917
2 жыл бұрын
Obviously he did, and hallucinated that he was on a hunting trip.
@NoLefTurnUnStoned.
2 жыл бұрын
On small doses Einstein. It’s well known that micro dosing enhances sensory perception. Obviously tripping off your nut is not helpful for hunting.
@JesperHellvik
2 жыл бұрын
Yeah, I never bought it. Why didn't the other apes become enlightened and grow bigger brains if we have the same mushroom eating ancestor? And why didn't the goats, the sheep, the cows and other mammals that also ingest psilocybin mushrooms either? I do love listening to Terence though!
@TrevorJrHotkiss11
2 жыл бұрын
I imagine it's because we already were different from other animals. Mushrooms work differently on different organisms. In fact it tends to be somewhat different person to person.
@JesperHellvik
2 жыл бұрын
@@TrevorJrHotkiss11 and the fact that it tends to be different from person to person speaks against it changing a whole species.
@bokchoiman
2 жыл бұрын
@@JesperHellvik Perhaps as the brain grew the effects of psilocybin was amplified.
@Matthiastalks
2 ай бұрын
Biologist here. In my opinion, the only thing which can be explained by this theory is that we can break down psychedelic/mind altering substances pretty effectively compared to other animals.
@punksci6879
2 жыл бұрын
Ah but what about the stoned aquatic ape theory?
@redhidinghood9337
2 жыл бұрын
Minus and minus make a plus am i right
@neurotransmissions
2 жыл бұрын
Damn! You found my one weakness!
@punksci6879
2 жыл бұрын
@@neurotransmissions Any chance of a video on my weakness of William H. Calvin's How Brains Think? Love the book but don't know enough neurophysiology to know if it is a good theory.
@carpo719
2 жыл бұрын
As a psychedelic advocate I've always thought it was a bad Theory myself. Sounded good back in the 90s when i read McKenna. But further thinking leads to other conclusions. Now that's not to say that many of the components of the argument are not valid. They do seem to increase your senses and heighten your awareness. So it seems like a logical conclusion.. I'm likely to think that psychedelics help smaller groups attain a certain state of awareness, but as for how to transmit that to Future cultures, maybe epigenetics play a role. I don't think we will ever know. But if we think about it carefully, it's not too far of a leap to imagine that language was developed early, then writing was developed with the aid of psychedelic substances. Perhaps we can tap into underlying archetypes while we were under the influence. It's fun to think about. But as far as Evolution I'm guessing other components of our environment played a bigger role as we were forced to live in different places
@FloppyCat1990
2 жыл бұрын
Small groups wouldn't include instances of art all over the world depicting mushrooms?
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