Hey all, Nick here! Thanks for the feedback on the first episode. Decided to go with the name Unpacked for the show, and we're working on the branding now for it with Javed! Should have a new episode up every other week going forward on the weekends, discussing big industry topics, some more personal takes on games, and so on. Hope you enjoy it!
@blunderingfool
7 ай бұрын
It's a plain and easy to understand, simple name. A very good choice in my opinion.
@HattaTHEZulZILLA86
7 ай бұрын
Games from the 90s NEVER had this problem. Sure, some of them have the usual bugs and glitches but you can ALWAYS come back and replay them, even DECADES LATER, WAY past the game's release date. No BS online connection needed too.
@christiandauz3742
7 ай бұрын
Imagine if all this money wasted on Live service games was instead given to Ukraine A double tragedy
@KateGrayCode
7 ай бұрын
The game isn't supposed to be fun. Fun can be satisfying, satiating, which is exactly what you don't want in a live service game. It doesn't drive revenue. The business model for live service is addict, then frustrate. Add in artificial limits (like season passes and things where you have to keep repeating levels to progress), or things that block progression until a certain amount of time elapsed (mobile games), then let people pay to avoid the artificial limits.
@rocko7711
7 ай бұрын
Love the “Always Sunny” reference
@Adamatronamus
7 ай бұрын
Live services = I can't play the game at my own pace = no game preservation = I don't play this game.
@JovialMantis
7 ай бұрын
They did say seasonal content will be repayable so you don't miss out on anything
@GreenLantern814
7 ай бұрын
Committing to not time gating content goes a long way for attracting me to the game. But the reality is that I'm actually pretty terrible at gaming despite being a lifelong fan. It takes me a long time to finish games, and I've got books and shows to watch too. After trying to come back to Destiny 2 after they turned off the expansion I was playing through, I'm not really interested in any live service anything. MMOs are a similar situation; I don't want to feel guilted into playing your game because I dropped thirty bucks on the subscription or battle pass, I want to enjoy my entertainment when I want (or can, really) and not be penalized for wanting or needing to spend time elsewhere. Give me another rock-solid single player or couch co-op game and I'm there.
@japz321
7 ай бұрын
if the experience is based solely on multiplayer, i can understand why publishers opted for live services and i can tolerate them if they're also free but if i'm buying a $70 game that has live service and also focuses on campaign/single player story experience, we're going to have a problem
@Sound557
7 ай бұрын
You hold yourself to standards like I do. I’m proud of you. Hopefully people will become like you and I and “live service” will die.
@alexanderrobins7497
7 ай бұрын
@@GreenLantern814 If something demands as much time as a full time job, I better be getting paid. I will spend as much free time on a game if I enjoy it, not because it is pushing FOMO on me. I understand timed modes and cosmetics as long as they show up again within a year.
@trident042
7 ай бұрын
It's funny that focus groups are mentioned, because - yeah, they probably did focus test this, and what's more, the focus testers might not even be gamers. They drag in people from "a diverse group" to make sure it's not biased, and in turn get people ranging from "never held a controller" to "only played a FIFA one time" and the odds of getting actual gamers is low as hell. So yeah, those people probably thought the game would make a mint.
@billbillson6779
7 ай бұрын
I have only enough time to have 1-2 GAAS games going. The demanding nature of GAAS games have to keep players playing means it's not worth to pick up live-service games the way you can with single players games or even regular multiplayer games.
@thinginajar
7 ай бұрын
Darren is the only one at Second Wind I can imagine owning Salo: 120 Days of Sodom on DVD - first thing I saw on the photo of the shelves at the start of the video! haha
@newphonewhodis7152
7 ай бұрын
As a fighting game player im used to play the same game for years and years. But at least there is always something to do that i enjoy inherently. I feel like im not against life services per se, but i never play them anyway (unless we count fighting games as life service.)
@kr1spness
7 ай бұрын
The real shame is after all those delays the game itself had potential with its boss battles....and there's only a few of them before Kill the justice league became kill brainiac across the multiverse. JL has 7 members, having less than that was a letdown, and unless season 7 brings 3 more with it instead of just Joker and a new Brainiac, this game will be dead. If they can churn out more Justice LEague content then maybe the core base will stay with it.
@10-OSwords
7 ай бұрын
The market for gaming is only "oversaturated" with crap. It is highly UNDERSATURATED with quality.
@jeremycards
7 ай бұрын
I'm really sad about the marvel's avengers game. I really enjoyed Miss Marvel in that story, and the parts of the single player campaign that were specifically designed for it were great (like the beggining and the end), i feel if they just kept the focus on Kamala and maybe 2 or 3 more Avengers and just made all of the single player hand crafted like those parts, it would have been a great game. Heck they did that with the Guardians of the Galaxy game and it WAS great (i'm sad that it didn't do well in sales tho, i think the failure of that Avengers game did splash into it)
@thomasfinch6292
7 ай бұрын
That’s all the review I need to hear. This game sounds like everything I was worried it would be
@SuddenCruelty01
7 ай бұрын
5,033 24 hour peak players on Steam right now and they expect this to last 13 seasons? I don't think this game will last even a month.
@wizzenberry
7 ай бұрын
helldivers 2 is 150k LOL, sony W
@Kris-wo4pj
7 ай бұрын
@@wizzenberrythats cuz the devs obviously wanna make it and they had fans for it with helldivers 1. No one wanted rocksteady to make this game. When it was announced i was confused cuz they were suppose to be making a superman game.
@NYKevin100
7 ай бұрын
@@SimuLordThat's not what the suits will learn from this. Instead, they will shut down the studios that are struggling too much, and try to replace them by buying some independent AA studios. Those new acquisitions will be given creative independence for a while, then the money machine will start squeezing them to produce more profits sooner, and the cycle continues.
@DroosterH
7 ай бұрын
@@Kris-wo4pj The thing is, how do you make a Superman game make sense? He's indestructible and nothing poses a threat to him. He's the ultimate Marty Stu character that doesn't work in a game loop.
@astcastle
7 ай бұрын
I just don’t know who they think they’re selling to. Marketing must know this is a life game, that’s how the developers made it, presumably at executive mandate, but there’s so goddamn many of them and only so many potential players. Is the goal to siphon people off other live services? There’s enough of them that if people want to play one, they’re playing one.
@armorhide406
7 ай бұрын
as Yahtzee says, Executives chasing trends will never capture that lightning in a bottle
@fieryrebirth
7 ай бұрын
Corporations typically chase trends in society, that's normal. What isn't normal is the cynical, if not sociopathic psychological manipulation of these models to get you to spend money in our pretty shitty economy.
@christiandauz3742
7 ай бұрын
It's like creating great music Be inspired but also be unique and great
@AchedSphinx
7 ай бұрын
didn't fortnite do this?
@LadyDoomsinger
7 ай бұрын
You know the problem with chasing something, right? By definition you will always be behind it.
@i_am_ergo
7 ай бұрын
@@AchedSphinx Yes, they did. And no, they didn't. On the surface, they did go after an existing market once they saw the potential of the battle royale formula. But when you recall all the details, they actually _pivoted_ into said formula with an existing, finished product that no one would've developed from scratch as a battle royale game. Fortnite was a third-person cartoon with building mechanics - i.e. nothing like PUBG. I'd say it was less chasing a trend and more lucky seizure of an opportunity. And obviously, luck played a huge role in it. Epic didn't cook up the Fortnite plan. It just kind of worked out for them.
@Vesperitis
7 ай бұрын
I swear the editing team for SW are getting more unhinged and I love them for it.
@BamboozlerTX
7 ай бұрын
Love it! Want more wild videos like this
@EchoDoctrine
7 ай бұрын
Yep. Sweet Baby are villains
@mauromerconchini
7 ай бұрын
Between Cold Take, Extra Punctuation, and now this new series, I'm realizing that some of the best non-ZP material for me on this channel is hearing members of the team just say out-loud whatever interesting thoughts have been bouncing around inside their skulls. Good job with this one Nick, I'm always happy to have another opinion show to add to my diet.
@R3GARnator
7 ай бұрын
People only have so much time in a day. If you found a live service game that you like, you have no reason to try a new one. Inevitably, they come crawling back to a past favorite. So ultimately, the reason live services fail is the same reason so many MMOs failed.
@Freakuency_DJ
7 ай бұрын
I’ve been really enjoying Nick’s return to the video stuff. He’s a very passionate and knowledgeable dude who cares deeply about the industry. In this one and the last one; it could have been very easy to get heated and mad, but he stays level headed and insightful. No judgement to fans or haters - he’s just laying out the facts. Excited for more of this series.
@peterclarke7240
7 ай бұрын
Yep. He's got a real "I'm not mad, I'm just deeply disappointed" vibe going on, and I love it 🤣
@jones81381
7 ай бұрын
What's really wild is that the game includes Captain Boomerang, a character known for using boomerangs, and he's standing on top of a building shooting enemies with a sniper rifle. That's really the only bit of evidence one needs to know that boardroom suits dictated this game's development. Suit: "We should turn this into a looter shooter live service." Dev: " That's not the game we want to make and we truly believe that the live service and looter shooter markets are oversaturated." Suit: "Looter shooters and live services make money. Turn this game into one. Here's a list of popular characters for you to include that market research shows will increase profits." Dev: *looking over list then stops suddenly* "King Shark? Captain Boomerang? These characters don't really work for a looter shooter. They rarely if ever even use guns." Suit: "Listen, no one cares about the source material. They're popular characters right now. They'll bring in sales. Use them. It'll be fine." *proceeds to make 1000 other inane demands to ensure the game's failure all while thinking it'll bring in a billion dollars*
@affsteak3530
7 ай бұрын
I swear to god nothing killed my enthusiasm for this game faster than Captain Boomerang with a gun. Is it so much to ask to play as a goofy Silver Age villain?
@recklessmonster255
7 ай бұрын
That's the main feature it killed the hype for the game for me. When it was first announced, i was excited for all the Arkham style combos and counters i can do with the Suicide Squad characters, i imagined so many boomerang related gadgets and Harley using her bat or hammer for different attack combos, but it was revealed it was a looter shooter, my excitement went to zero. And i love some looter shooters, the Borderlands series is between my favourite games, but for a Rocksteady game, it just doesn't fit.
@mrshmuga9
7 ай бұрын
Thing is, even if they wanted some excuse to sell people loot, they could still stay authentic. Captain Boomerang could ya know, use boomerangs as a ranged weapon and you could easily add some lights or different casings to have variety. Same with King Shark. Oh, he bites people as his main melee attack? Give him grills then. I don’t know what he’d have for a ranged attack, but given this is a superhero world and all sorts of random tech, you could make some justification. Maybe he does some sort of ground slam that sends out a linear shockwave across the ground. Give him brass knuckles or gloves or whatever. But suits probably saw “guns” and said “stick to guns” or they wanted it out faster so there wasn’t a chance to experiment… or the studio is sapped of all/most of its actual talent, and the people involved just didn’t care.
@SpikedKirby
7 ай бұрын
it'd be cool to have a character that has to time their attacks to do more damage and get extra effects. Boomerangs work because you would be able to combo with them as they return @@affsteak3530
@affsteak3530
7 ай бұрын
@mrshmuga9 give Captain Boomerang a moveset based on the (now dead) Rogues tech. Ice, fire, tornado, lightning, sonic, and a sticky bomb boomerang. Pins on his hat and shoulder patch cosmetics. King Shark? Tech based hydrokinesis. Also fin based bling.
@manvslife271
7 ай бұрын
"Let's all laugh at an industry that never learns anything te-hee-hee"
@classycasual3910
7 ай бұрын
Doesn't really seem that funny anymore 😞
@fieryrebirth
7 ай бұрын
More like it doesn't need to learn anything as long as it is profiting continuously. Merit doesn't matter in the long run, and thus passion projects are left to die.
@GoFastLily
7 ай бұрын
😬😬😬
@TOGYS7
7 ай бұрын
@@classycasual3910 we're all crying on the inside
@ArDeeMee
7 ай бұрын
You‘ve got two options: Laugh, or cry. I think laugh is the healthier one…
@Strykenine
7 ай бұрын
You know what games are still fun? The old Batman Arkham games. And I can download and play any one of them right now from my library, and that (probably...) isn't changing.
@EchoDoctrine
7 ай бұрын
MORE players were playing Arkham Knight this weekend on Steam. And MoRE viewers on Twitch too. Arkham games still great, and servers will never shit down.
@AbbreviatedReviews
7 ай бұрын
I've always liked to say that "Live Service games will all one day be Dead Service games." They're all created with a tombstone half-chiseled ready for their inevitable demise. There's a generation that just expect this and don't comprehend that a "dead game" doesn't have to stop existing because the developers/publishers stopped funding the servers. But in an era where every piece of software is part of a "subscription" whether you want it to be or not, we don't even own the games we pay for regardless.
@zal119
7 ай бұрын
Think live-service games are what killed my passion for gaming for a solid few years, I just didn`t realize it at the time. They aren`t games, they are work, they can never be fun, otherwise the "players" wouldn`t feel the need to buy the pay to win things from the shops. Nowadays I`d never even try a "free" game, there is no point, it`s just exhausting having to be constantly on alert to the many ways how a game company would try to trick me into spending more of my money on their "games". Behind every "chance" event I have to wonder if the odds have been altered specifically against me, to make me desperate enough to give in to just a little microtransaction boost to get me to the good part.
@clarkmichaels822
7 ай бұрын
The indie scene is more alive than ever though. There are plenty of great titles to be found that have none of the AAA-game nonsense.
@DenyTheWitch
7 ай бұрын
@@clarkmichaels822 Indie games have their own audience. I didn't buy an RTX 4080 to play Shovel Knight.
@yewtewbstew547
7 ай бұрын
@@DenyTheWitch There are tons of indie games with more impressive and demanding visuals than Shovel Knight though, if that's what you care about. But yeah, not many that will press a 4080 admittedly. That said, how many actual GOOD AA or AAA games are there out there that can meaningfully utilize a 4080? Even at 4K. Maybe like 1 or 2 a year if you're lucky. I'd assume you're playing most games at 120+ fps, because there's usually not much else to do with that performance.
@backlogbuddies
7 ай бұрын
4080 is worthless anyways
@Ghostel3591
7 ай бұрын
@@backlogbuddies the bottleneck of the whole generation is hardware of current consoles. Which means until we will be 2 years into next cycle with something like PS6 and XBOX720... Any game will run and look good on rtx3060/3070 because they will be made with limits of PS5 in mind.
@DatMageDoe
7 ай бұрын
A lot of the current issues with GaaS are shared with the MMO genre, namely that when you're making a game which commands a lot of time out of your playerbase, it also requires a lot of money and development time to keep the players sated. Once revenue starts to take a hit, content will start to slow down for the game, which encourages leaving the game for new pastures, which only reduces revenue even more, creating an infernal cycle that will continue until shut down. In addition, players only have so many hours in a day to spend playing games, if there are 10 games they want to play which each want them to put 20 hours a week into, expect them to drop all but 1-2 of them. In contrast, single player non-GaaS games are much better because you get a full experience out of the gate, and those games respect your time much better by letting you be able to get everything you want without forcing you to play 20 hours a week.
@boxhead6177
7 ай бұрын
But I also think a lot of AAA publishers don't actually know how to design, fund and budget for a Live Service game. Take a look at Genshin Impact or Fortnite, those are the two most expensive games ever made... they spend and keep spending to keep earning. Genshin costs $100 million to develop, and by the time its second anniversary they spent another $400 million dollars in post-content development. But all these AAA developers see the dollar signs of revenue and think they can cut costs, cut corners, cut staff (or lose staff due to poor retention) and crunch. I don't see EA or WB dropping half-a-billion dollars for a Live Service game, but that is what it takes. (Sony just bought Bungie for that price and hoped for the best, and then immediatly failed.
@yvindvego9404
7 ай бұрын
@@boxhead6177 genshin gets an insane amount of content too. i hav eheard there are 3 seperate teams working on patch content
@ryllharu
7 ай бұрын
@boxhead6177 All great points. Gacha are successful because they have a 2-week content loop, which is insane, but they invest a lot back into their games and they are generally of "AA Quality" or lower. Genshin actually fuels, supplements, or subsidizes the development of *three* separate games. Shareholders see the numbers it rakes in and don't realize how much of that money goes back into the games. Gacha live and die on those 2-3 week content update cycles, and by adding variety. The Live Service western titles are somehow missing that point. Lower development costs (but still crazy reinvestment) is what lets the successful ones thrive. The lower-budget ones are still getting an enormous amount of content. And dozens of gacha die every year, they can't afford 7 year development cycles before launch.
@chronosarcanos
7 ай бұрын
Just a add information, Marvels avengers when the servers shut down got a patch to remove microtransactions and made all the content playable offline. And the week before shut down got a huge sale.
@davidcarba7829
7 ай бұрын
It should be a requirement for the entire "Let's go whaling" conference to play before the intro to every live service game.
@TheLordDracula
7 ай бұрын
God it's wonderful to see a video from the man in charge himself. It feels like there's a purposeful diversity in the cast doing the videos on this channel and I'm totally here for it.
@SecondWindGroup
7 ай бұрын
Back under The Escapist, I really just had a lot of my creative drive driven out of me by having to report to corporate suits every week and trying to keep people coming to our content so we could stay alive. Now that I don't report to people that don't care about our content in the slightest and just wanted to pump us for money, I'm excited again and have been having a lot of fun just being back in the editing side of things!
@Jedi_Vigilante
7 ай бұрын
@@SecondWindGroup It is kind of amazing (and sad) how much power and authority these people have over our lives, isn't it? I mean, nobody voted for them, they aren't on TV or social media telling us what they are about, we can't ask them their positions on important issues that affect our lives. Hell, most of us don't even know their names or what they look like! But they often have more control over our lives and more influence over our time than the members of government we see on the news constantly...
@vukodlak5
7 ай бұрын
And a pleasant voice to listen to 👍
@xelldincht4251
7 ай бұрын
I hate this live-service trend. It makes games disposable products
@gamrknight8060
7 ай бұрын
No. Stop thinking, buy the battle pass, finish your dailies, get a new Mythic weapon, like a good CONSOOMER
@silkworm025
7 ай бұрын
I'm glad you mentioned "As numbers rain like confetti". I was watching some footage of the game from other KZitemrs and I felt like the numbers flow like blood decals in Brutal Doom. The impact of a Super Shotgun reducing a Cacodemon to gibs replaced with a stream of digits, the game *telling* me I've done damage in place of making me *feel* like it. Is this what the modern audience wants? Their upgrades reduced to simply changing the weapons color and making the number go up? Thinking of Project Brutality for Doom, I'm reminded of how *every* weapon you get has a specific use. The starter pistol has a silencer, so you can force some infighting with a little strategy as you bait returning fire. The SMG fires faster with a bigger magazine, the .45 uses more ammo per shot but hits like a truck. Every weapon category has this kind of system in place, making each one special. The live service model paints an item orange and tells me I got something amazing. The Dragons Breath shells light up the room and lets the combat tell me I got something amazing. "Fire! Fire fire waaaaaaah!" vs "400, 400, 600 (but in orange)"
@gamrknight8060
7 ай бұрын
"bro trust me, this weapon does +0.5% damage against Infantry-type enemies, it's GOTTA be good, AND the name is orange!!" I'm so glad Cyberpunk scrapped this fucking system and now works like a real video game instead of an Excel spreadsheet with how many numbers there are
@mrshmuga9
7 ай бұрын
I don’t know why, but Borderlands is basically the only time I’m okay with having numbers displayed. Every other game that does it that isn’t an RPG, it feels wrong.
@timmk94
7 ай бұрын
Just been playing Skull & Bones Open Beta. Almost all of your points are very present in that game. What hit hardest is you can see the potential greatness, but it's been pushed aside to make way for the live service.
@thechevyferrari9559
7 ай бұрын
This game makes me so fuckin sad, cuz when I heard “Co-Op Suicide Squad game by Rocksteady where you take down the Justice League,” I thought that would be INCREDIBLE!!!! The variety in the close quarters combat styles, ability to do combos with eachother, fighting big bosses together… And it’s such a dropped ball. And Redfall was the same damn thing last year for me, Arkane Studios is my genuine favorite developer (both Austin and Lyon), and that one still stings. It reminds me of a joke in the show Silicon Valley where this billionaire was like “oh, digital currency? Yeah no, alotta money in that, did a big push, made like 13, only one worked though, kinda.”
@EXiLExJD
7 ай бұрын
Games with Live Service crap is an immediate turnoff for me. Can't wait till the industry stops chasing that trend, most people only have enough time to play a couple and the dumbass execs need to realize that.
@LadyDoomsinger
7 ай бұрын
It's not just about time for me: I've played enough Live Service games to realize that their content, as a general rule is almost always bland, boring and uninspired. It's not just time consuming - it's a waste of my time in the first place. I can waste my own time just fine without paying for it. I'm actually quite good at it.
@EXiLExJD
7 ай бұрын
@@LadyDoomsinger Agreed, most of them are mid at best.
@LadyDoomsinger
7 ай бұрын
@@Zynet_Eseled Microtransactions, always online. Not worth my time.
@LadyDoomsinger
7 ай бұрын
@@Zynet_Eseled Besides, it's some kind of looter-shooter or a similar genre, right? Never cared for those types of games anyway, I find them rather boring, even if they're not Live Service Games. Give me a narrative driven RPG or Adventure-Puzzle game any day. I'd even prefer some Walking Simulators over Shooters, honestly. But I admit, that just comes down to my personal preference.
@LadyDoomsinger
7 ай бұрын
@@Zynet_Eseled "well priced" is a nonsense statement to someone old enough to remember a time before content was cut out, repackaged, and sold separately as "microtransactions" and "dlc". Scamming people into paying for cosmetics is pathetic and I have no patience for it - just as I have no patience for the grind designed specifically to wear players down until they spend money to skip it.
@sterling7
7 ай бұрын
"We'd like you to pay full price for a game that _might_ be good, eventually, if you continue to pump money into it. In the mean time, we're hoping that social pressure from other players will keep you invested and putting a part-time job's worth of time into it, not because it's enjoyable in itself, but because our market plan is counting on it." I _get_ why a marketing department would think that is a good idea; what I don't get is why they think anyone with two brain cells would buy such a product more than once.
@mrshmuga9
7 ай бұрын
Because they foolishly believe they have “the one”. Not because there’s any reason to, but because they want it to happen.
@PlebNC
7 ай бұрын
Meanwhile Deep Rock Galactic is showing them how to make bank AND make a pro-consumer live service game.
@jamie7472
7 ай бұрын
And the way they can do it with a fraction of the production, budget or marketing of these AAA live service shills. It just baffles how even after years of repeated flops this still keeps happening.
@devilmikey00
7 ай бұрын
Pro-consumer live service is an oxymoron, there is no such thing. The entire concept is anti-consumer by design. You pay us forever until you don't at which point no one gets to play this thing ever again. A live service is a dead game walking the minute it launches, it just depends how long until the trigger is pulled by the publisher. That's not good for any consumer ever.
@Jotil
7 ай бұрын
Warframe needs to be in this conversation. They have been churning out absolutely massive updates for 10 years now without any subscription or other bs AND has tradable premium currency.
@AnBlueLemon
7 ай бұрын
@@devilmikey00 That's not how deep rock works though. It gets seasonal updates, but after each season the contents of the battle pass go into the regular loot pool. The battle pass is free, too. Also, the game is fully p2p and can be played offline. The only monetization it has is cosmetic dlc packs that release with each season. It really is like, the only pro consumer live service game.
@yodasears
7 ай бұрын
@@Jotil and their tenth year content was some of the strongest ever... and they have very consistent player numbers.
@Jedi_Vigilante
7 ай бұрын
A lot of these games can be summed up as "I already have Borderlands at home, and it doesn't require another $10-15 every month to play"... There is a lot of dopamine production in the "big numbers, bright colors, lots-o-loot" game model, but just like anything else it has diminishing returns over time. Eventually, the same amount just doesn't have the same effect. You can either try to ramp up the quantity, or look for a different source. Game publishers hate trying anything new because there are fewer assurances of a return on investment, so they go for the ramp up option. The problem is we've already hit critical mass here, and now what was once fun and exciting is now just more grind. The fact that it is also tied into a financial model that is a never-ending money sink certainly doesn't help...
@iambicpentakill
7 ай бұрын
I had the same thought re: Borderlands, though I suppose that I'm not the target audience
@recklessmonster255
7 ай бұрын
I love Borderlands, i love DC and i love Suicide Squad, but this game just doesn't interest me at all. It's like the game was intended to market for me, but it failed completely. I really hoped this would have had Arkham style combat and less wacky movement (and also no live service), it would have been a day 1 buy for me.
@ClanCrusher
7 ай бұрын
That comment at the end about Focus Groups was extremely subtle and visceral. I love it.
@fieryrebirth
7 ай бұрын
I expect Nick to up the ante in the future such as, "I hope we players have made your shareholders happy."
@Wraithfighter
7 ай бұрын
I do think we're coming up on the end of this craze, yah. Feels like a lot of companies saw what those early Live Service successes were pulling in, the notion that you can have all the ongoing sales success of a F2P MMORPG without the MMORPG, and launched big projects to try to take advantage... and they all ran into each other. There's just only so much room for these types of games, and its probably been known for a while that a lot of these games were most likely going to fail, but sunk cost won out in the end. Folks have to remember that these massive projects are like ocean liners, it takes a LOT of time and effort for them to change direction. Suicide Squad was announced with a trailer in 2020, which probably means they'd been working on the game for a few years already. Probably too late to pivot at that point, and they really only had the options of canceling the game or seeing if they could at least make some of the already massive production budget back...
@clarkmichaels822
7 ай бұрын
I think it's telling that the last few massive successes in game design came from smaller (indie) studios or even mods that evolved into huge IPs as they got picked up by big studios. Fortnite is a modded version of a coop defense game that was made by the Epic developers who were fans of PUBG which was originally a mod of ARMA 3. Dayz was a mod of ARMA 2 which spawned a whole bunch of pvpve survival games. League of Legends is one of many offshoots of DOTA which was a mod of Warcraft 3. Counter-Strike was a mod for Half-Life. Minecraft was made by one guy in JAVA. Binding of Isaac, Vampire Survivors, Dwarf Fortress, Stardew Valley, Undertale, etc. Point is, you can't really look at big studios to innovate anymore. There are some tried-and-true methods that work well (GTA, Nintendo stuff) but even that isn't about innovation as much as refreshing the same old crap. If you really want something fresh and new, the ones with the most money are the least likely to give it to you. Find the one passionate person in their basement programming their own little game to get something good.
@noirscape_
7 ай бұрын
It's telling that your average mobile game feels like it has a less predatory gameplay loop nowadays than a big bucks live service game.
@handson4580
7 ай бұрын
thats because triple A developers LOATH mobile games and want to be like them in revenue gain
@Jedi_Vigilante
7 ай бұрын
@@handson4580 According to Ubisoft, they are now quadruple A developers now... because THAT'S what will drive more interest in their games lol
@Subject_Keter
7 ай бұрын
That why I just play 1.7.10 Minecraft.
@eric.is.online
7 ай бұрын
Well the big bucks mean they can have psychologists on staff to optimise the Pavlovian conditioning these games overtly leverage to extract money from players.
@Hammerheadcruiser
7 ай бұрын
God, isn't that a scary thought.
@Boomerangofjustice
7 ай бұрын
I think another layer to all this is that either players have already bought an engagement ring to another live service game and can’t be pulled away, or they’re already been burnt out and they’re savvy to all the tricks another LS game will pull. I’m definitely in the latter camp with Destiny 2.
@mrshmuga9
7 ай бұрын
Or a third thing, they’re interested, but want to see how it’s supported and if it’ll be supported long. If the game is good but they take 4 months to release an update, that initial interest will subside, and proven it’s not worth investing their time.
@EnemyOfEldar
7 ай бұрын
Proposal: it's not that the industry doesn't learn from its mistakes, it's that projects have so much momentum that it takes years to turn the ship around. Sometimes the sunk cost is too great. See this and Redfall.
@2020-p2z
7 ай бұрын
Also, it doesn't matter if 9 high budget live services tank and fail if just one blows up and dethrones Fortnite, or one of the other big ones. It's like a gambling addict chasing the big payout. It doesn't matter how much they lose along the way, as long as they win big.
@nemtudom5074
7 ай бұрын
I absolutely love the punk, anti-establishment attitude of the second wind crew, finally people saying the things that matter!
@andreasottohansen7338
7 ай бұрын
i got recommended this after trying out the open beta of Skull and Bones, and being immensely underwhelmed. I am walking away, still lusting for the pirate parts of Black Flag (sword play, sailing and ship combat, exploration) to be made into its' own full thing. Back to Black Flag, Rogue, and Sid Meier's Pirates! for me.
@blunderingfool
7 ай бұрын
Oddly enough the thing that's kept my personal favourite Pavlov going was never a live service, it was the community fostered that enjoy making all manner of new content in terms of maps, weapons, and custom game modes.
@CrysJaL
7 ай бұрын
Communities make the experience last longer. With both Runescape and Warfraem it was the people I could talk to in various chats that kept me engaged until I eventually still had had enough.
@yewtewbstew547
7 ай бұрын
@@CrysJaL Yeah I was gonna say Warframe was a good example of that. I also lost interest, but the community aspect of it with the clans and stuff kept me engaged for 600 hours. Haggling with people in trades etc. Same with Runescape actually, but like 20 years ago I mean. Runescape is unplayable to me now, even OSRS, because you almost never see anyone talking. The game's playerbase is like 50% bot farms, and everyone else is either chatting in discord instead or just playing it like a singleplayer game. If you played the game in 2004 your friends list was full by the end of the first year because people playing it back then were constantly chatting to each other whilst they did stuff. Some complete random comes up to you whilst you're chopping a tree and asks "WC lvl?", then 5 hours later you were doing quests with him lol. That's basically gone now.
@austemousprime
7 ай бұрын
@@yewtewbstew547 That is such a shame, it really seems like Discord, encouraging people to be in their own "social silos" is killing social experiences.
@CatOperated
7 ай бұрын
At this point I don’t touch live service games cause you never know when stuff you paid for is gonna be ripped away. It’s not even a question of if.
@WeeNiallism
7 ай бұрын
This is amazing. BRB sending to 50 people.
@mukkah
7 ай бұрын
5:35 Think my earliest recollection of disliking "live-service" style content would've been way back when WoW 1st came out with repeatable "Daily" missions. It just felt so low-effort. I did them. Ran all the dailies, got all the things. And ye, learned how non-rewarding it all really was. Half-full glass, we're on the downward slope of the live-service mountain. It'll still be rough, so many devs losing their livelihoods, but at least it's winding to a close much like the MMO race in the late 2000s heh
@grayshadowglade
7 ай бұрын
Well Nick, these are great. I dig it. It's honest, forthright, very direct, succinct, and inspired the following tag line for ya... Let's get this all out in the open, all right?
@slynthehedgehog8061
7 ай бұрын
The thing is... Warframe exist. No battle passes, no extension to buy every 3 months, none of that. And we do get newbies regularly. And DE (the developer) laid off some people, sure, but it was their publishing branch, nothing to do with the game. And the game IS good. And propose so many different game loop, it doesn't get stale unless YOU make it stale. I think live services CAN work, but only if they take inspiration from how Warframe does it, and more importantly, their devs who are fine with people taking a break from it.
@Elleander1
7 ай бұрын
Work of countless passionate developers being tossed away as the revenue slightly declines... Man that hit me hard.
@nobodyinparticular9640
7 ай бұрын
I don't know if we can say for sure that the work put into these "games" had any passion at all. From what I remember of the interviews of the devs behind Anthem, I believe the devs there were pretty much forced into making the game, 'cus EA was jelly of Destiny and wanted the same thing, more or less.
@derubor
7 ай бұрын
I firmly believe that the Live Service model is dying, at least the side that isn't free to play, but publisher uphold that model because the games were years in development and reworking them into a more sustainable model costs more money. Sony cancelled quite a lot of their 12 planned live service titles, but sadly not all of them.
@christopherlyndsay8611
7 ай бұрын
Well the one that’s just come out, Helldivers 2, actually seems very promising.
@migleroide
7 ай бұрын
I completely agree with you. I see all of these perpetually on-line game series as nothing more than a money-grab which is bankrupt of ideas. More of the same, over and over with a veneer of new skins; I'll play old single-player stand-alone and indie titles. These guys won't get my money.
@VallornDeathblade
7 ай бұрын
Even some of the pioneers in 'looter shooter' design like Borderlands have crumbled ino unrecognisable slop, and games like Destiny 2 seem to perpetually struggle with cycles of player burnout and people getting completely fed up and tired with stringing 3 hours of content over 7 weeks of weekly released 'story' missions. I think you hit the nail on the head with the focus on single-player success stories for a similar reason to why Manga is outselling Comics, people want a coherent, focused story experience without the kind of dross the industry uses to try and create a perpetual money printer. Think of the eternal "reboots" or "events" of comics and look at the 3-monthly "season" cycles of Live Service models, I think they're pushing people away for similar reasons.
@Fatheroftearsx
7 ай бұрын
And the thing is I'm just so tired of it dude whether it's the streamer who has to play this game because they need the the viewers to the fact that every one of these games are all the same It's too much I said it for I'll say it again we're in a gaming recession and it's just begun and Microsoft is leading the bankruptcy
@EliHansen729
7 ай бұрын
liking and commenting for the algorithmn, hope you guys and gals continue to find your pace and find your place in the industry.
@wolfVFV
7 ай бұрын
Man evolve shutting down hurt so much it had so much potential and looked amazing
@ziljin
7 ай бұрын
Thia is why i stick to single player only games. They got dozens of hours of gameplay. No predatory FOMO tactics. And yea lots of new games are bad now but with little patience you wait a few years the game gets fixed and is 50+% off its finally ready to play and worth buying. In the meantime plenty of older games that are on deep discount during sales still worth playing. Especially if you enjoy open world sandboxy games you can play them forever.
@JachymorDota
7 ай бұрын
These "Live Service Games" aren't games, these are services with games attached. The monetization is the first design objective, everything else has to wriggle around that - which results in basic gameplay loops, since you need "content" that can be easily influenced by your purchase decisions.
@tristankahl6843
7 ай бұрын
I’m just personally surprised that Warfrane didn’t come up once in this video as one of, if not the only game to get this model right
@darkowl9
7 ай бұрын
I uh... don't know that I'd say Bungie pioneered the live service one. Destiny certainly had a lot of marketing and is recognisable. But I'd probably give the pioneer distinction to Digital Extremes and Warframe. They arguably really proved it was possible to do a looter shooter style live-service game. It's more the case that Bungie copied DE's homework (Xur vs Baro Ki'teer as just one example, etc.).
@PyramidCake-xe9lt
7 ай бұрын
Especially since Warframe released 18 months before Destiny 1 and has a higher daily playercount than Destiny 2... just Bungie bias I guess.
@jamesrule1338
7 ай бұрын
The main problem I see with live service games, and I say this a lot, is playing one is like having another job. A person really only has the time and money to play one. I play Warframe. It's a flawed grindy mess with a story and art style I like, with some fun gameplay. I've sunk too much money into it (free to play but cosmetics ain't cheap) and way too much time (over 3000 hours, I've been playing it for about 6 years now). Now I can only speak for myself, but I imagine any player of a live service game must think the same, but if a new game wants to grab my attention it has to have enough content, and be a good enough game to not only be better than the one I'm playing, but also overcome the cost I've already sunk into my current live service game. And Suicide Squad just isn't it. Neither was Avengers. The amount of effort needed to create a live service game that can compete in the current market of live service games would be better used to make a solid single player experience. But companies just see "Fortnite make lots money, we want lots money" and run their heads to the same brick wall over and over again.
@ONYX-365
7 ай бұрын
Who keeps on telling these gane companies we want this shiiii ? *They're lying!*
@doomspud6302
7 ай бұрын
I constantly tell people that live service games, or anything with microtransactions, simply cannot be good. Because the entire game has to be designed around those systems from the very beginning for them to actually work. And those systems are always anti-fun. Even if you don't notice it, every part of the game is negatively effected by the mere existence of those systems. So like a house built on sand, its incredibly difficult to make anything solid on top of such a weak foundation. Now, this doesn't mean you can't enjoy these games at all. They almost always have at least some small part that's still fun. That's the hook that gets you in the door, and hopefully willing to ignore the mountain of intentional problems surrounding the good parts. Not to mention how these games are anything but permanent. Either because the servers got shut down, or because a patch comes out and ruins everything you liked about it, they all inevitably become unplayable. And that point is coming faster and faster every day. And because all these flaws are intentional, they will never improve. Its pointless to wait and hope that any live service will ever become more fun, because that's simply not what companies behind them ever want. So the only thing we can do is abandon the whole idea, and let it starve to death.
@ghost_dog990
7 ай бұрын
It's awesome that you're making content right alone with Frost and Yahtzee! Love all you guys and can't wait for more!
@ty_sylicus
7 ай бұрын
Live service games? I really can't be bothered.
@deterlanglytone
7 ай бұрын
For me, I don't think I can trust a live service model. I might've been programmed to think oof it as explotititve from both a consumer but also for the people that make it. So I don't like buying them. But secondly, I also just never liked the idea of the Sucide Squad Game titled "Kill the Justice League." Just never interested me. Even if the game's writing is or was or could be stellar, top tier with characters so tightly written that you can bounce a coin off, I wouldn't buy Kill the Justice League. Its not appealing to me personally as a concept. Probably wouldn't have a issue with a Sucide Squad game that say ran blackops missions or just had a Just Cause vibe to it, where your taking down a Tyrant. But make it DC themed, like a Supervillain has conquered a country with Mind Control or something and plan and reaching out. Justice League are restained by UN Carter, so Waller takes out the Sucide Squad to cause some mayhem. Even if they don't fix the problem, if they make it worse the country's new super Tyrant will probably be forced to accept Justice League help. But I particularly don't want to kill characters that are basically my childhood icons. It being on the title alone years ago made it a no seller. No matter that I loved Rocksteady's last few games.
@deadchivalry1698
7 ай бұрын
Here's the thing though. Anthem had the building blocks to be an amazing singleplayer game. Solid combat and traversal, a good story with high stakes, an insanely detailed world and lore. It was all there. The requirements of liveservice killed Anthem. It could have been the third main Bioware singleplayer IP, alongside Dragon Age and Mass Effect.
@Barnesy1301
7 ай бұрын
I want to like the Suicide Squad game so much. It had everything going for it; good main and side characters, good premise, good studio, etc. But then they perfectly snatched defeat from the jaws of victory when they revealed it was an always online, live-service gear-grinder with 3 unique mission types repeated infinitely from start to end. Add on a $100 AUD price tag and mediocre gun-play and you've successfully lost me. The worst part of all is that it wouldn't be impossible to "fix" the game from where it currently is. A few more varied missions that aren't just "go to location, kill everything, obtain loot", an option to play offline to experience the story without the online gear-grinding (maybe even a local multiplayer option in offline mode), more emphasis on the individual characters' combat styles and making them feel like actual classes instead of all of them playing the exact same and shooting the exact same guns (e.g. Deadshot being more critical hits/priority target focused, Shark being more of a tank and having more abilities related to heavy weapons and/or melee, Boomerang being more hit-and-run and running around at top speed drawing agro from the team, Harley maybe pulling more from the Arkham games and focusing on hitting combos and dodging hits, etc.), and I could see this game being upgraded to perfectly average, perhaps even good. But since it's a live-service game, the plug will likely be pulled in a few months time when the studio decides it isn't worth keeping the servers running, meaning all of the good parts will be thrown out and the issues will never be fixed, condemning this game to being remembered as below average forever.
@fieryrebirth
7 ай бұрын
The Live Service model feels like a grift. Not many "gamers" notice this, but standards change, subconsciously. Many who are familiar with this kind of model may see the designs that are meant to keep you playing for arbitrary reward and "progress" just to make number go higher. Sure, this has been a thing most recognizably since the Diablo 2 days, but in our current era of corporate-power grabs and increased toxic game industry, you're either hustling or grifting. These games feel like they're meant to capture a lot of players with loose wallets and a lack of standards, get rich from them, then kill off the game to save even more costs. Rinse and repeat. God I hate corporatism.
@KitePerson
7 ай бұрын
It's just so depressing man. Artists and programmers had to design and code the game, to meet the bare minimum corporate wanted Rocksteady to reach. And what's the result? Suicide Squad barely even reached the numbers Crystal Dynamic's Avenger's had on the first day.
@heikitsune2181
7 ай бұрын
It's funny seeing the western gaming industry try to copy what Japan has done with gacha, and not only fail at every level but seemed so dumb to not look at what excatly got things like Granblue, Blue archive, genshin and many others to make money hand over foot. It dosen’t take master class in economics to understand little investment, big pay offs; not putting over 200 million bucks in something and expecting twice that at a rapid rate. Regardless it'll be nice seeing this trend over here die. Leave the gacha stuff to people who actually know what the fuck they are doing. Make actual games for crying out loud.
@exitYT
7 ай бұрын
I think Warframe surpasses Destiny in terms of monetisation and live service execution. The dev team had their mistakes and backtracks, undergone several changes, but still working on and expanding their truly F2P game.
@AegixDrakan
7 ай бұрын
Gunning down hordes as Beeg Numbers rain like Confetti needs more than just that to hold interest. Even the great ones in the genre (hello Warframe) need something that can genuinely hold the long term interest, and can make the grind feel worth it (in Warframe, that's the collection aspect, and the fact that basically any weapon and Warframe can be viable, where the more stuff you gather, the easier it is to experiment with new builds. It's not a treadmill, it's a staircase.) And given that I barely have time or interest even in Warframe, after the 1,300 hours I've put into it... If even one of the great games in the genre isn't keeping me locked in, what hopes does something like Suicide Squad have?
@flozenen6468
7 ай бұрын
Live service games have no business being priced 70$. You either make it free with micro transaction (like genshin impact) or 20-30$ and 2-3$ for each new content.
@88Opportunist
7 ай бұрын
The problem isn't the Live Service model itself, as a fan of both of miHoYo's big gacha live service games I can I attest to that, the problem is the morons at the top think they can just fart out another contender with minimal effort and budget and make even more money that their competitors. They don't understand that the reason these games are so popular is that they are just damn good games with a ton of content BEFORE they are live service games. Genshin Impact, whilst it will require a grind to be able to play it all, has more single player content than any big budget single player game, heck at this point it has more than most series of games. Destiny 2 had compelling campaign, that was fun to play, long before it raked in millions in cosmetics sales and established itself as a life service. Genshin Impact may have made billions, but its cost is also past half a billion and well on towards being a full billion. miHoYo has their own orchestra FFS, I don't see the aspiring Bobby Kotick's of the world ever sinking that level of budget and commitment into their contenders and that is why they will all fail.
@jcace13
7 ай бұрын
The idea that players will just drop whatever live service game they've already invested countless hours of their time into to swap to your product is a thought these kinds of developers and publishers need to forget ASAP. Suicide Squad isn't going to do Destiny numbers because the Destiny players aren't going to play it.
@stephenmeinhold5452
7 ай бұрын
The problem with live service games is thet they talor the gameplay to extend it. that equates too- lots of filler content and nerfing your weapons or combat so you will grind for upgrades. i dont mind paying £60.00 for a game that lasts 10 - 12 hours as long as its fun and engageing though out the whole campaign and has some reply value. but sadly they will never give up trying as the rewards if it works are so good.
@ravenbeast8639
7 ай бұрын
At least the crappy Marvel's avengers game allowed you to play the characters with their specific powers & talents!!! This game gives you Destiny in DC skin and in third person!
@ItsapaulPlays
7 ай бұрын
Live service = hard pass, simple as. My money goes to games I like to play, not avenues for companies to sell me things.
@infinitesquarez
7 ай бұрын
2:47 "...and even those studios [inaudible] on those games..."
@CommanderBohn
7 ай бұрын
Live-service IS a cancerous thing that should be shut down for good. I mean how many live-service games are out there that would've worked better if they were instead normal games instead?
@gozzilla177
7 ай бұрын
Remember when you could buy a game, and you weren't seen as companies wallets? They built solid full games shipped em and we bought em up! 😂 this is why baldurs Gate and pal world got so many numbers they are just simple fun games not trying to monetize us lol
@The_Knife_Pie
7 ай бұрын
Tfw doesn't even mention Destiny Before it was cool title of Warframe when naming successful live service games. Truly it is the forgotten step child of the industry
@TJM990
7 ай бұрын
The more i look back on the hellscape of live service, the more i really do blame Destiny. It effectively was the first and that's the only reason i think it's still alive, sunk cost.
@evildude951
7 ай бұрын
My personal live service casualty is Dreadnought. Hugely fun alpha and beta with an addictive multilayer loop, that was in 'beta 2' buried under paid services and a dumb tier system
@SkippD
7 ай бұрын
Such a satisfying game to play early on that just got crushed by its service model.
@Miepasie
7 ай бұрын
I think an issue with the philosophy behind these games is that on release, you're arguably buying the game at it's lowest point. Every live service game launches at it's weakest state, then (supposedly) gets better with content updates, balance patches, DLCs etc. It's just not a very enticing sell to play something like suicide squad and finish the campaign when it's essentially in an extended beta still. You'll have to play through all of it again when there's new characters, new missions etc. so why even bother in the first place.
@goodmanpatryk7155
7 ай бұрын
I never undestand how anyone can buy live service games with price of normal game. For me myself I never bought this type of games, couse i don’t see a point spending money on base game where everything is behind wallpay. Its like buying house where is mostly nothing in it at same price of Perfectly furnished and nice painted.
@SinaelDOverom
7 ай бұрын
"Same studio" in name only. All the people who were responsible for Arkham games being good left a while ago.
@daviddamasceno6063
7 ай бұрын
The more companies lose money on dead end projects like these the better. We should always vote with out wallets and buy games we're really interested into.
@SpottedHares
7 ай бұрын
Soap Opera Games. No ending just a constant stream of tune in next time with a release schedule designed to never give you time to stop and think and move on.
@Cassapphic
7 ай бұрын
The contrast in the near adjacent launch of suicide squad and granblue fantasy relink shows how people will still enjoy games with some of these traits if they're given the appropriate care, uniqueness and respect for the player. By focusing the game much more on cool bpss fights it avoids the generic trash mob slop most of these games fall into and manages to feel more like monster hunter, while being mpre fast paced and approachable.
@Dom380
7 ай бұрын
Is Destiny 2 successful? From what I've heard it's still never made a profit
@SirMatthew
7 ай бұрын
Trying to make the next Fortnite is like trying to win the lottery. It's not gonna happen, yet corporations will keep paying the idiot tax trying to win big.
@devilmikey00
7 ай бұрын
That's not even getting into the mobile side of the live service equation which completely collapsed last year. Much like MMO's there is only a finite amount of time and money people can spend and only a handful of games can succeed when time and money are constantly demanded by a game. By the time any studio is chasing a money sink multiplayer trend of any kind, it's already too late.
@Immudzen
6 ай бұрын
Marvel's Avengers would have been a better game if it had just been a coop game.
@willg3220
7 ай бұрын
Good video! You guys have some video diarrhea, though .. not everything you do needs to be live or made into content 😮
@Vedrlaufnir
7 ай бұрын
They will always chase the money, and sadly, even single player games will suffer from this, just because they want to have all the money, instead of getting some of the money. I still can't believe how we've come to accept horse armor garbage, and gacha games should be crucified along their 15 bucks skins (looking at you Genshin and your almost 30 bucks skins); and while I agree there's value on all those pretty skins made by someone, I don't think they should be worth like... half an Elden Ring; hell, I can buy Palworld for the price of one stupid skins.
@zero95lucky
7 ай бұрын
Man, I don't like star wars But your pfp is adorable
@aerozord
7 ай бұрын
the irony of people being less willing to get these games out of fear it wont exist in a year, making it more likely it wont exist in a year
@Haaambuurger
7 ай бұрын
You game with snacks? Doesn’t the controller get greasy?
@strain42
7 ай бұрын
A Suicide Squad game that delivers a solid single-player experience that's fun to play like Arkham Asylum and City. That was it. That was all they had to do. Like you said, I'm not sure who told them they needed to do something else, whether it was focus groups or executive meddling, but I really wish I knew who to be mad at for how this turned out. This being Kevin's final project is honestly the ONLY reason I might ever pick it up. And because like you said, it's possible it'll just be completely delisted in a year or two and it'd be nice to snag it before it goes up in price online.
@chwenhoou
7 ай бұрын
Arise, workers of the games industry. Spit in the face of your overlords and join the picket line. Abandon your cubicle cages and create the art you want. You have nothing to lose but your shackles.
@Feeble_cursed_one
7 ай бұрын
And your paychecks to pay for the food and stuff
@fieryrebirth
7 ай бұрын
@@Feeble_cursed_one Trust me, settling with a small-time job is usually MUCH better than working for an apathetic corporation doing everything they can to make your lives worse to save a dime, and that's what striking workers usually do to cover rent/costs. Corporate culture has been increasingly anti-worker since the pandemic and it's not stopping.
@schemage2210
7 ай бұрын
It is possible to make the live service model work. Sadly too many companies want the cash at the end instead and not the work it takes to get there. Make good product, make lots of sales. Why is that so hard to comprehend???
@PaulDozierZZoMBiE13
7 ай бұрын
I've been a gamer as long as video games have been around. As I entered my 50's, the games I saw coming down the pipe were just dismal. I don't want to play crap like this and it seems like every company on the planet is trying to find a way to shove this kind of crap into every corner of the industry it can. I simply don't even look at these games anymore. I love Batman, Gotham City, Spider-Man, et al. But I'm not going to waste my extremely diminished gaming time on a money sink. I've watched ever fad and seen them all come and go and I honestly cannot remember a gaming trend as toxic as this "Live Service" model. I watched every developer think they could topple WoW as they built their ill fated MMO games, I watched as every shooter -whether the core game warranted it or not- had a multiplayer mode shoved into it, and I've seen almost every franchise I love be hollowed out and have the company that owns it try to sell my memories back to me piecemeal. At this point, I barely game anymore. If this is the best they can offer me, there are plenty of other hobbies which can hold my attention. And when I do get a rare chance to game, I tend to just load up an old favorite and relive some "good ol' days" of one era or another. This Live Service model is getting ridiculous and the sooner it withers off and ends, the better as far as I'm concerned. 'Old man yells at cloud' jokes may begin now.
@zero95lucky
7 ай бұрын
You've got a couple decades on me but our stories are the same.
Пікірлер: 657