English Translation, Part I ( the following in reply to this comment ) 00:00 Beethoven, Symphony No.4 in B-Flat Major, Op.60 - Adagio - Allegro vivace : Bayersiches Staatsorchester ( Live recording, 1982, Orfeo ) 05:03 What fascinates me about Carlos Kleiber is the obviousness of his interpretations. Yet Kleiber could make choices, make strong, in a sense divisive, choices - his interpretations of the Strauss family at the New Year's concerts in 1989 and 1992, for example, are unlike any other. The son of the great conductor Erich Kleiber, one of the greatest opera conductors of the first part of the 20th century - and whose Marriage of Figaro I absolutely recommend, in a superb Decca recording no less - Carlos Kleiber was a complex character. Introverted, shy and humble, three characteristics not often found in his colleagues, he made each of his performances an ideal for musicians and music lovers alike. At the desk he seemed to dance, in a kind of trance in which the musicians followed him, and in which he also took the audience along. The day after his premiere at La Scala in Milan, the press headlined "Toscanini resurrected". So I offer you a small overview - not exhaustive, as I believe that entire theses could be devoted to it - of what constitutes the art and, from what we know, the personality of one of the conductors who, despite all the knowledge accumulated, remains among the most mysterious and most adored in history. 06:08 Brahms, Symphony No 4 in E Minor, Op.98 - Allegro non troppo ( extract ) : Berliner Philharmoniker ( Live recording, 1994, Memories ) 11:35 Karl Ludwig Bonufatius Kleiber was born in 1930. His parents fled Nazi Germany in 1935, and it was in Latin America that he spelled his name. After a complicated start, notably because of his difficult relationship with his father - and we will come back to this several times - he made a name for himself in the 1960s, after having conducted operetta, and was engaged with the Stuttgart Radio Orchestra. He became a kind of local star and even took advantage of this status, starting to cancel performances - something that would become more and more frequent during his career. He made his debut at the Edinburgh Festival in 1966, and was soon called to the Bayreuth Festival, where he performed Tristan and Isolde from 1974 to 1976. Kleiber thus quickly became an internationally renowned artist. He conducted in the most important venues, at La Scala in Milan, the Met in New York, the Vienna Opera, and the greatest orchestras, such as the Vienna Philharmonic, with whom he collaborated for a very long time, the Berlin Philharmonic - which he conducted on two occasions, He also conducted the Berlin Philharmonic twice, in 1989 and 1994, the Dresden Staatskapelle, with whom he recorded two operas, Freichutz and Tristan, the Chicago Symphony Orchestra and, of course, the Bavarian State Orchestra, the ensemble with which he was most closely associated. But his appearances became increasingly rare, his health declined, and he refused to be treated for the cancer that was seriously undermining him. After a farewell tour in 1999, and a final concert in Cagliari, he retired to Slovenia. His wife, the dancer Stanislava Brezovar, whom he called "mother courage" in reference to his own infidelity, died in 2003. He wrote that "mother courage is no longer with me", and was found dead by his neighbours on 15 July 2004. 13:08 Wagner, Tristan und Isolde - Act I, Prelude : Orchester der Bayreuther Festspiele ( Live recording, 1976, Red Squirrel ) 23:16 Carlos Kleiber's repertoire was very small, to say the least. Of course, there was a certain variety, but the same works were regularly performed. If one has a recording of Strauss's A Hero's Life, for example - a recording that was intended to be published, but full-page advertisements had already been announced that Kleiber had finally forbidden its publication - one can listen to a number of Beethoven's 4th and 7th, Brahms' 2nd and 4th, Mozart's 33rd and 36th for the symphonic repertoire, in the opera several of Richard Strauss' Knight with a Rose, Verdi's Othello, Traviata or Wagner's Tristan. However, apart from these works that Kleiber performed regularly - more than a hundred Knights of the Rose, after all -, apart from these works that he was used to, he very rarely went outside his usual repertoire, even though he knew a much wider repertoire by heart. From time to time we find a foray, a sixth of Beethoven given for one of his children, a Schumann concerto with Christoph Eschenbach at the beginning of his career in 1968 or, as we were talking about it, A Hero's Life by Strauss in 1993. 24:12 R. Strauss, Ein Heldenleben - Der Held : Wiener Philharmoniker ( Live recording, 1993, Music Lover )
@Sofronichrist
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Part II 28:06 Kleiber's son's work is overlaid by Kleiber's father's. Carlos mainly played what was part of Erich's oeuvre, the great opera conductor of the golden age: Freichutz, Tristan, Wozzek of course - which Erich Kleiber premiered - and of course the Knight of the Rose in the opera, Schubert, Beethoven or Mozart in the symphonic repertoire. Kleiber's father believed that there should be only one musician, and he wanted to ensure a stable future for his son, so he sent him to Zurich to study chemistry at one of the best faculties in Europe. Obviously, Carlos lived for music, and he did not stay long before applying for coaching positions. Carlos Kleiber's relationship with his father and his music was very complex, it is said that he was not to be told about it, that he could get angry at an orchestra shouting that these were his father's chords. Carlos Kleiber made his debut in the pit under a pseudonym, Karl Keller, so that no one would think he was a "daddy's boy". Although he received a note from 'Old Keller' recognising his talent, it seems that he suffered all his life from the comparison, his father having done everything to discourage him, before advising him to take up operetta, realising that he would not be able to dissuade him from pursuing a musical career. Carlos Kleiber is said to have once refused to conduct Schubert's Unfinished on the grounds that after listening to his father and Furtwangler he would have nothing more to contribute. So I propose a little comparison between father and son, on the first movement of Beethoven's "Pastoral". First, there is Erich Kleiber: 29:23 Erich Kleiber conducts Beethoven, Symphony No.6 in F Major, Op.68, "Pastorale" - Erwachen heiterer Empfindungen bei der Ankunft auf dem Lande : Concertgebouw Orchestra ( Rec. 1953, 東賢太郎 ) 32:45 And now here is Carlos Kleiber: 36:25 You can see that there are obviously similarities, the drive, the lightness, but there are also quite a few differences. The sound is fuller and yet there is more drive in the son's version, whereas the father's version is perhaps a little more stagnant. There is an elevation and a lightness in Carlos Kleiber's version, whereas even if there is more relief in Erich Kleiber's version, the contrasts are smoother and, in a sense, the orchestral flow is less powerful. But if there is one element that has been passed on from father to son, it is undoubtedly the lyricism that informs and runs through each of Carlos Kleiber's interpretations. Erich Kleiber was more inspired in opera than in the symphonic repertoire, and his recordings remain essential references in The Marriage of Figaro - a work that his son never touched - and The Knight of the Rose - in which his son would probably become the most accomplished interpreter the work has ever known, next to whom even Karajan seems artificial, a music in which he was nevertheless one of the most recognised specialists. But Carlos Kleiber knew how to illuminate everything he played with this lyricism and theatricality, even in the symphonic repertoire. There is a sense of spectacle that always seems innate when listening to a Carlos Kleiber performance. To give an example, the diversity of atmospheres that run through his Freischutz is absolutely hallucinating, one goes from total joy to a dramatism, that of uncertainty, of fate almost. 37:36 Weber, "Der Freischutz" - Overture : Chicago Symphony Orchestra ( Live recording, 1978, Artists ) 47:47 If we try to break down this lyricism that runs through Kleiber's entire work, we can identify two striking aspects. Firstly, there is an element of breathing that brings the music to life, and Kleiber is one of the very few conductors who can let the music breathe with such fast tempi - Furtwangler managed this very well, for example. Then there is a roundness, and the fact that it is combined with such fast tempi gives the orchestra a bounce that no other conductor can achieve. It's as if the orchestra is bouncing up and down with each bar in a natural yet ever higher manner, a way of building on its own phrase without ever going round in circles - in this respect Kleiber made a lot of sense of repeats in the symphonic repertoire. This bounce and roundness is particularly noticeable in Kleiber's interpretation of Mozart's Linz Symphony, with very fast tempi, but also with a real art of silence, a fragile play of balance that nevertheless gives Mozart's music all its vitality. 48:36 Mozart, Symphony No. 36 in C major, K.425 "Linz" - Adagio - Allegro spiritoso : Wiener Philharmoniker ( Live recording, 1988, Artists )
@Sofronichrist
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Part III 59:16 Although Kleiber regularly gave similar programmes, his ideas did not change fundamentally. Apart from the Beethoven Seventh in Cologne in 1972 at the beginning of his career, between the 1976 performance with the Vienna Philharmonic, the 1982 performance with the Bavarian State Orchestra, the 1982 performance with the Vienna Philharmonic, but this time in public, and the 1983 performance with the Amsterdam Concertgebouw, there are no significant differences in conception, and the one in 1983 with the Amsterdam Concertgebouw, there are no significant differences in conception - although I believe that fans will always appreciate the small differences and subtleties of sound and rhythm, and even of mood, throughout the symphony. Approaching the Seventh brings out another aspect of Kleiber's conducting: that lyricism I mentioned earlier is coupled with a lightness, a clarity, one might even say a sunshine. Kleiber's seventh is so obvious that it almost becomes a revelation. It is also without doubt the one that most effectively puts into music Wagner's words that this is "the apotheosis of the dance". The Allegretto is thus insanely complex, while at the same time one can discern everything that is going on - although I think one could always find something different, but perhaps that is also a matter of subjective appreciation linked to the moment of listening. It's readable, and at the same time it's totally alive. 01:00:22 Beethoven, Symphony No.7 in A Major, Op.92 - Allegretto : Bayersiches Staatsorchester ( Live recording, 1982, Orfeo ) 01:08:14 Kleiber often - if not always - showed a great sense of humour. His rehearsals attest to this - the two captured in 1970 of the Freichutz and Fledermaus overtures in particular, which can be found on KZitem. Kleiber regularly spoke in pictures to get the message across. He did not like to be idolised, and remained unapproachable to anyone who seemed too blind to him. Not that Kleiber wasn't serious - that would be an absolute aberration, given the amount of harried repetition he required. But he knew how to make musicians and singers click, and he regularly did so with witty remarks. He loved Saki, for example, the English short story writer with his acerbic yet distinguished humour, and there is a certain playfulness that shines through here and there in his recordings, whether in La Traviata or, of course, in the Fledermaus, which is sometimes so serious under the baton of some of his colleagues - an interesting fact that reveals all his humility, Kleiber always recommended interpretations other than his own, and in the Fledermaus he greatly admired Clemens Krauss' recording. One performance in which the playfulness and humour of Carlos Kleiber is clearly evident is that of Haydn's 94th symphony, the 'Surprise'. Kleiber thus manages to exaggerate, almost to magnify the line without his interpretation ever becoming caricatured. 01:09:23 Haydn, Symphony No.94 In G Major "Surprise" - Andante : Wiener Philharmoniker ( Live recording, 1982, Memories ) 01:15:14 The musicians tell us that Carlos Kleiber always outdid himself, despite his peculiar - and difficult - temperament, as much for the musicians of the Vienna Philharmonic, to whom he explained that in the second movement of Beethoven's 4th symphony they had to play "Therese", the name of Beethoven's beloved, while they played "Marie", after which, faced with the incomprehension of the Philharmonikers, he cancelled the concert, as for the hall managers for whom the conductor was a nightmare. Indeed, it seems that Kleiber needed the ideal conditions to perform, especially as he almost had to be pushed onto the stage with his terrible stage fright and fear of failure. The conductor cancelled very regularly - if not most often - and reduced his appearances to a few per year, which could be counted on the fingers of one hand. For the record, he was able to take a return plane ticket for each day of rehearsals. Those who were able to hear Carlos Kleiber in concert are privileged, and they are well aware that these were special moments, more so than the concert of any of the other conductors of the time. 01:16:05 Brahms, Symphony No.2 in D, Op.73 - Allegro non troppo : Wiener Philharmoniker ( Live recording, 1988, Music Lover ) 01:24:26 An introverted character, with whom it was difficult if not impossible to get too close, Carlos Kleiber is a figure apart in the musical landscape. He gave only one interview - and that was in the 1960s, when he was not the real star he would later become. He did not attach himself to any orchestra when he was at the height of his fame, even turning down an offer from the Berlin Philharmonic to succeed Karajan in 1989. I had several sources to write this podcast. I recommend the two documentaries on Kleiber, as well as an excellent series produced by Deutsche Grammophon and available on KZitem - I'll give you all the links in the description. In German there is Alexander Werner's website and the biography he wrote. Finally in French there is the Encyclopaedia Universalis article written by Alain Pâris, and there is the portrait written by Christian Merlin in his conductor's guide "Les grands chefs d'orchestre du XXe siècle". Christian Merlin has also produced a wonderful podcast on Kleiber, which you can find on the France Musique website. I wanted to finish the podcast on the opera that Kleiber gave the most, the Knight of the Rose, and its final trio, here performed in 1973 by Claire Watson, Brigitte Fassbaender and Lucia Popp, and of course Carlos Kleiber and the Bavarian State Orchestra. 01:25:30 R. Strauss, Der Rosenkavalier - Final trio : Claire Watson, Brigitte Fassbender, Lucia Popp, Bayersiches Staatsorchester ( Live recording, 1973, Sadanori Kobinata )
@martinstremlow2997
11 ай бұрын
He was the greatest
@santiagodeloscaballeros3743
7 ай бұрын
Toutes mes félicitations et mes remerciements pour votre partage de cet excellent document!
@Sofronichrist
7 ай бұрын
Merci infiniment !
@marichristian1072
Жыл бұрын
What an exquisite interpretation of Brahms 4th Symphony. An enchanting podcast. Thank you.
@Sofronichrist
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Thank you very much 😌 !
@MegaClassicguy
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Mon Dieu qu’est-ce que c’est beau et vos commentaires sont si intéressants ! Vous avez d’autres portraits de ce type? C’est si vif mais plein de vie et de rebonds extraordinaires comme vous dites. Il y a un sens de l’humour totalement absent chez Furtwängler (c’est normal quand on a été le principal chef d’orchestre sous le IIIème Reich!). La qualité du son stéréo me frappe toujours chez Kleiber et Celibidache par rapport aux vieux sons monos de « l’âge d’or de la direction orchestrale ». Karajan semble bien fade par rapport à ce génie. C’est très différent de la « tradition germanique » de direction orchestrale débutée par Wagner et portée à son sommet par Furtwängler : tempi lents, expressivité extrême et pesante. On ne sort du tragique que par la dimension spirituelle mais sans jamais de légèreté et d’humour. Merci infiniment. Je suis impatient d’écouter d’autres analyses de ce niveau 😉
@Sofronichrist
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Merci infiniment pour votre retour ! Je ne sais pas si le fait qu’il n’y ait pas d’humour chez Furtwangler est spécifiquement lié à son attitude sous le IIIe Reich ( dans ses premiers enregistrements il n’y en a déjà pas beaucoup ) ou plutôt à une certaine idée de la métaphysique et de la transcendance ( deux traits qui amènent rarement à l’humour en principe 😂 ). En réalité je n’identifierais pas Furtwangler à la tradition germanique comme on l’entend ( tempi lents, lourdeur ou tout du moins épaisseur etc ), car il peut y avoir d’une part une certaine retenue ( en fait Furt joue beaucoup sur l’énergie, qu’on retrouve tant dans les transitions que dans les thèmes comme le disait Brendel ) et d’autre part il varie énormément ses tempi ( personne n’est aussi rapide que lui dans le Final de la 7e en 1943 ou de la 2e de Brahms en 1945 ). Mais s’il peut y avoir la légèreté ( le mouvement lent de la 9e de Schubert dans le studio de 1951 ), qui n’est d’ailleurs pas empêchée par la matière ( cet espèce de crépitement qui caractérise le son de Furt ) c’est bien clair qu’il n’y a pas vraiment d’humour ! Mais on gagne vraiment à écouter les enregistrements de cette époque dans un bon mastering clair et véritablement nettoyé ( dans ce cas là la mono n’est pas vraiment gênante je trouve ). Karajan comme tant d’autres semble fade par rapport à Kleiber dans les œuvres que les deux chefs ont joué, mais il y a tant d’œuvre que Kleiber n’a jamais dirigé ! Si ce type de portraits vous intéresse la playlist de ceux qui sont publiés est ici : kzitem.info/door/PLwovaEVoT1mJwNSKUE61AXbCfVaIcPHPc
@MegaClassicguy
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@@Sofronichrist Je vais écouter tous vos portraits avec le plus grand interêt. En ce qui concerne Furtwängler, je ne voulais en aucun cas dénigrer mon chef d’orchestre adoré (et le Dieu de Carlos Kleiber!). Mais grâce à votre portrait de Kleiber j’ai pu mettre des mots sur la différence avec Furt. J’ai été trop court sur la tradition germanique. Comme je vous l’ai dit ailleurs, c’est moi qui ai écrit les articles de Wikipedia sur Furtwangler en français et en anglais (aussi la partie sur la direction orchestrale dans l’article en allemand). La tradition germanique (Wagner, Bülow, Nikisch, Furtwängler) ne se limite pas à un tempo de base lent et très expressif. Les variations de tempo dans les transitions et les vitesses folles vers lesquelles elles mènent en font aussi partie. Il semble que Wagner le faisait. Furtwängler aurait adoré entendre Wagner diriger et il a étudié avec l’un de ses disciples. Ça remonte même à Beethoven lui-même. On sait qu’il faisait varier le tempo souvent. Le point important c’est que la vérité n’est pas dans la partition elle-même : il faut comprendre l’oeuvre et ensuite les tempi viennent d’eux-mêmes (dixit Beethoven lui-même). Il est en effet connu que Furtwängler pouvait avoir une direction plus stable et avec plus de retenue (on peut comparer les versions de l’ouverture de l’Alceste de Gluck de 1942 et 1951: la dernière adopte des tempi beaucoup plus stables et c’est beaucoup plus réussi). C’est aussi le seul semble-t-il qui ait dirigé tout le finale de la 7ème de Beethoven au tempo indiqué sur la partition sans aucune variation. On ne sait pas comment les musiciens ont tenu le choc (en 1943). Donc Furtwängler est parfois inclassable, c’est vrai, car il essayait toujours de nouvelles choses. Pour l’absence de sens de l’humour vous avez raison d’insister sur la dimension métaphysique et transcendante: c’est le cœur de l’art de Furtwängler et ce qui l’a fait, entre autres, sortir de l’horreur de vivre dans une Allemagne nazie. Néanmoins, quand on lit sa vie et son carnet personnel on voit qu’il est traversé par le tragique au moins de 1933 à la fin de sa vie. Il fait des descriptions terrifiantes des allemands qui l’entourent sous le troisième reich et après la guerre il est toujours terriblement tourmenté par ce qu’ont fait les allemands et les critiques du reste du monde bien qu’il était infiniment moins compromis que Karajan ou Böhm par exemple. Il y a une joie de vivre extraordinaire dans la musique de Furtwängler pendant la période 1949-1951 en particulier dans la 9ème de Bayreuth que vous allez publier prochainement si j’ai bien compris. Mais il avait du mal avec la légèreté en général : écoutez son enregistrement de la petite musique de nuit. C’est vraiment pas son truc. En bon français, je compare parfois ses enregistrements à de très grands vins de Bordeaux ou de Bourgogne avec beaucoup d’âge. Rien n’est plus fort et meilleur en terme de goût mais ça ne doit pas se boire dans n’importe quelle circonstance. Ce n’est pas une boisson rafraîchissante et pétillante qu’on boirait l’après-midi en pleine chaleur. C’est pourquoi certains disent que c’est trop, comme d’autres n’arrivent pas à apprécier les plus grands vins. En tout cas, je vais réécouter encore votre portrait de Kleiber et je suis impatient d’écouter les autres. Mais je vais prendre mon temps. Il faut profiter ! Merci encore, vous êtes vraiment quelqu’un de très intéressant !
@Sofronichrist
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@@MegaClassicguy Merci infiniment pour votre commentaire qui me fait très plaisir ! Pour la 9e de dimanche c’est une version à Vienne en 1951 ( celle de Bayreuth est déjà sur la chaîne dans une version remasterisée par EMI au Japon ). Et je trouve qu’on parle effectivement trop peu de cette joie de vivre et de ce sentiment de liberté qui traversent les enregistrements de Furt, et qui se remarques particulièrement bien en effet entre 1949 et 1951 ( le premier mouvement de la 7e de 1950, le premier mouvement de la 9e de Schubert en studio par exemple ), et cela s’entend peut-être davantage avec le VPO qu’avec le BPO. Excellente journée :)
@MegaClassicguy
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@@Sofronichrist l’ouverture de Léonore II en 1949 dégage une joie de vivre extraordinaire et c’est avec le BPO. J’ai pas eu le temps d’écouter Chopin en direct. Excellente soirée :)
@Fritz_Maisenbacher
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1:01:44 oh God ...; the singing of THE SECOND VOICES .... oh God, this is dramatic, dramatically beautiful, so close to death ...
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