Is Your Your Home Theater Setup for Reference Level? Enter the Road to 100K Giveaway (35 giveaways from 22 brands with over $30,000 in prizes) - youthmanreviews.com/roadto100k/. How to Calibrate Using Audyssey - kzitem.info/news/bejne/l5Bm2aqwkoVyeII Monthly Zooms on Patreon -www.patreon.com/youthman Best pricing on Home Theater products - youthmanreviews.com/sales/ Join us in July for MWAVE - midwestavexperience.com/ Submit your Home Theater - hometheatertours.com. Ways You Can Support: Patreon: www.patreon.com/youthman Youthman Courses - www.youthmancourses.com/ Youthman Merch - teespring.com/stores/youthman/ Follow Us: KZitem: Subscribe to this Channel: goo.gl/YEJ23p Youthman Crew Facebook Group - facebook.com/groups/youthmancrew Instagram: instagram.com/youthmanreviews/ Twitter: twitter.com/youthmanreviews/ Website: youthmanreviews.com/
@jebcamaro
2 жыл бұрын
I would think mine is. I’m running Khorns as mains and chorus 1’s and Cornwall 1’s as surrounds and a Heresy 1 as a center channel. My sub is a REL 15” Predator. Also Klipsch ceiling speakers. Jeff Rowland amps with a JBL processor. It’s fun!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
The video isn’t really about the equipment but was more about discussing what Reference Level is and calibrating your system for it.
@jebcamaro
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman Yeah, I had a brain fart🤪
@uceddiemo
2 жыл бұрын
I’ve been into Home Theater for decades but somehow your explanations make me feel like I just learned something new, keep up the good work you’re doing
@plompudu2529
Жыл бұрын
I'm simply turning up/down the level till voices are in the 55-75dB range(depending on how loud they talk) so i can get an "true to life" volume level. Going up to reference is dumb imo since this will start to damage your hearing after watching the full duration of a movie. The reference is only for mixing/mastering a single scene, not a full length movie in one go! Assuming you watch a 2h movie where 30mins of action scene happen, you're already at a high risk of damaging your hearing! For Bass is the 115dB more save tho since it's at the same percieved loudness as a ~90dB 1kHz tone. If you're listening at -10dB you're at ~HALF the perceived loudness of reference. 85dB(A) 8h till damage ocours 88dB(A) 4h till damage ocours 91dB(A) 2h till damage ocours 94dB(A) 1h till damage ocours 97dB(A) 30min 100dB(A) 15min 103dB(A) 7.5min 105dB(A) 4.43min
@XenogearsPS
2 жыл бұрын
bruh this is the most useful info I have ever watched when it comes to audio. No one explains these things, I'm trying to get into this hobby and I'm lost lol.
@cratedigga21
2 жыл бұрын
Yo! I feel the same way. This is very helpful to us newbies....lol!
@o.c.g.m9426
Жыл бұрын
Watch all the content you can and compare bros. Don't just foolishly toss thousands at these systems like I did. Buy WHAT U NEED not what u want or what everyone is saying to buy
@Youthman
Жыл бұрын
Glad you’re finding the videos helpful
@simplysean11
7 ай бұрын
Best video I’ve seen! Helped me use my spl meter correctly and wow! That’s all I can say just wow! Didn’t know the true effect of finding the perfect levels for my listening
@mikeberndt181
2 жыл бұрын
Forget & ignore all these people getting excited over the db levels being too high. Most movies average levels are below 65db. Brief moments you get loud explosions or really loud sounds. Most movies never sustain the high levels that people are concern-trolling about! The point of reference is like hdr/Dolby vision, no movies are 100% white full screen she whole movie. Reference level is I believe mostly about having the headroom for the big dynamic effects. If your system is low end or you forgot do disable the dnr on your decoder then yes you if playing at reference level will have a fatiguing experience, however if properly calibrated and with good equipment the dynamic range will be so wide that many times you will be so so far into the safe zone (hearing-wise) that yes the big loud sounds will frighten you or shock you. Professionals know that overusing these loud sounds loses its effect the more it’s used (with exceptions, private Ryan, Christopher Nolan). Good vid youth man keep it up!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the kind words Mike.
@jamiet74
2 жыл бұрын
Reference Level for speakers is 85dB with 20dB headroom for peaks (105dB) and 115dB for the LF Effects channel. The 75dB number only comes from AVRs using 30dBFS test tones instead of 20dBFS (due to them being too loud)
@avsolutions212
Жыл бұрын
30dbfs means, is your avr master volume? When you level matching the speakers do you put your master volume at -30dbfs?
@jamiet74
Жыл бұрын
@@avsolutions212 no 30dBfs means 30dB From Full Spectrum. The test tones in an AVR are 30DBFS, so set the MV to 0dB and each channel should be 75dB using a C-weighted SPL meter
@avsolutions212
Жыл бұрын
@@jamiet74 thank you so much for reply
@schemkesa
9 ай бұрын
That's what I also understood 85dB is reference lvl
@L3x4Pr0ne
2 жыл бұрын
Room acoustics make a big difference here too. The additive effect of bouncing echos in an untreated room can make something like -15 db seem either terribly loud and overwhelming vs very manageable.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
For sure. I’m all for adding room treatments.
@Burythelie
2 жыл бұрын
Absolutely. I was shocked seeing the 10db of room gain at 50hz. DSP can definitely do wonders.
@arranstokes4080
2 жыл бұрын
Yes all over this soundproofed my room and treated it. Also getting over -15db i need more power to my mains as it was muddy. Three power amp for frontstage fixed this as well as bass traps for all the corners and some diffusion around the room
@Jacob-ed1bl
2 жыл бұрын
I built my last home theater but had it professionally calibrated and it was at reverence level. At reverence it was way to loud for most of my guests but I loved it.
@grandmasteraj855
2 жыл бұрын
I’m glad it was well revered at those levels
@mephInc
2 жыл бұрын
Keep in mind that reference level is used in large rooms(theaters). In a smaller space, you'll likely run 10-15db lower.
@Jacob-ed1bl
2 жыл бұрын
@@grandmasteraj855 It sounded fantastic! Unfortunately I sold that house along with the theater. I'll build another one day, I always do lol.
@Jacob-ed1bl
2 жыл бұрын
@@mephInc I turned it up! Joke lol
@TerminatorJuice
2 жыл бұрын
I've been calibrating my theater to Reference for a few years, and the closest I get to reference for a good mix(like any WB movie) is between -22.0db to -18.0db, and that's loud as heck in my room. For MCU and Disney movies I have to go closer to -15.0db to -13.0db.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I’m usually -15dB to -10dB.
@jaydoublebusy
2 жыл бұрын
Dude i can listen comfortably(my comfort/not others)at about 28db.Granted i have not dialed in my ARC/Genesis.My boot up level is 35 db.
@arranstokes4080
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman i thought you went louder -6 to -12 is my listening level
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
28dB? Do you mean -28dB? Nothing wrong with listening that low. It’s just not very impactful to me.
@jaydoublebusy
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman yes,my settings is boot up -35db max 0db
@markanthonywilliams4976
2 жыл бұрын
I have to chime in and say that 85dB is LOUD. I do watch certain movies at that level but I have to disagree and say that 85dB is indeed very loud.
@jstoli996c4s
2 жыл бұрын
Agreed 💯
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I listen to music around 85dB. I don’t find that loud in a fully acoustically treated room. Curious if your room has acoustic treatment?
@nathanjones4039
2 жыл бұрын
Because it IS loud! I stated that above as a disclaimer as anything 85 dB and above can cause permanent damage, that’s just common knowledge, a simple Google search will provide that. Anyone that doesn’t find that to be loud over an extended period of time regardless if one’s room is treated or not is irrelevant, and has already probably sustained some sort of loss already. We just need to be safe with our hearing, this isn’t meant to be an attack on one’s personal preference at which they listen to music/movies, it’s just about being safe while doing so.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I’m all for protecting our hearing. That’s why I personally do not watch a movie at Reference volume. I’m typically between -15dB and -10dB. A simple Google search shows 85dB at 8hrs could result in hearing loss. Movies are at most 3hrs. I listen to music maybe 45 min at a time every few months. Pretty sure neither of those pose any threat to hearing loss.
@Mrtscrp30
2 жыл бұрын
For a noobie like myself your video content is a master class for us up and comers in home theatre.
@Dave-zk4fv
2 жыл бұрын
You’ve just given my setup a new life/experience, thanks!
@musicman8270
2 жыл бұрын
When my neighbors start screaming that's reference level
@TokeBoisen
2 жыл бұрын
It's worth noting that cinema reference of ~85 dB is really rather loud in a smaller room or theater, due to the nearness to the speakers and the small-room acoustics at play, compared to a theater. In general -10 dB is recommended for in-home systems due to these differences for a perceptible match.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
That probably explains why I typically watch at -15dB to -10dB
@brysonfitzgerald5238
6 күн бұрын
Honest question.... is it really true that smaller rooms or poor room treatment will make the perceived SPL too loud, particularly at reference level? To me, this doesn't make sense, because 85db should be 85db, whether it's a small or big room. Basically, if you measure with an SPL meter, to reach 85db you will need less power in a small room (same is true if you move physically closer to the speaker). Conversely, a large room or a longer listening distance from the speakers with require more power to reach 85db. But as you can see, 85db is 85db, as long as you are calibrating accordingly. Maybe it's not the decibels that are what we perceive is changing when the room size changes.... maybe it's its things like timbre, reflections, decay, and reverb causing one room to sound good with one source but terrible in a different room, same source?
@TokeBoisen
6 күн бұрын
@@brysonfitzgerald5238, some of it is psychoacoustic, that the sound is perceived as louder, and some of it is that for most domestic rooms, room treatment is worse and therefore decay and reflections are less controlled, resulting in a higher perceived volume as well.
@michaelwyckoff7593
2 жыл бұрын
Ha ha 😂 the old MAXELL guy in the chair being blown away.Clever Michael.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Michael. It fit perfectly
@michaelwyckoff7593
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman ha ha I gave away my age oh well no big deal ha ha ha ha 😂😂😂
@asiergurrutxaga
2 жыл бұрын
Actually, the LFE channel is supposed to measure +10db in band compared to the screen channels. That means, +10db at 30Hz, same thing at 40Hz, 50, 60 and so on. To measure this you need a real time analizer (RTA), not an SPL meter. If measured with an SPL meter, the LFE channel will normally measure around 90 db with -20dbfs pink noise, not 95 (~80 with -30dbfs noise), and peaks will be closer to 110db rather than 115.
@moveezy5591
2 жыл бұрын
-20 is where I mostly watch movies -15 for most Marvel movies and streaming services I have never watched a movie at reference
@michaelslocumbsr.2286
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Youthman! Always the Teacher....
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I do my best
@MyFatherLoves
3 ай бұрын
Gold information. But you missed part of the question... "because all sources have different levels". Most (if not all receivers/processors) have the ability to set different input source volumes. I have a Denon. So, what I do is level match my system to reference volume and leave on -0db. I then play a blu-ray that I know has strong transients in it (gun fire, loud wooshes, hard punches, whatever...) and turn off my subs. I then play through that loud section of the disc several times while running an SPL logger set to z-weighted measurement of some sort (REW has an excellent one). You can also just run a simple SPL meter from amazon, set to c-weighted, fast and then stare at it while playing that loud passage on your movie. If it hits over or doesn't quite hit 105db, then navigate to your settings, input, input source volume, and then change it. What if your system doesn't hit 105db (at the main listening position) and your input source volume is set to -0db? Then, adjust your trims up (evenly) and try that loud passage again. Continue this rinse and repeat until you hit 105db peaks from your speakers. However, do not allow any of your speaker trims to go past -0db. You could run in to digital clipping. Then, you do all of that over again but with your subs on and this time be looking for 115db peaks. Once again, do not allow your sub trims to move past -0db. Try increasing the gain on your sub(s). What if you do all of that and still can hit those SPL metrics? You have now officially confirmed that your system cannot hit reference level at your main listening position. Move your listening position closer if possible and consult the following link (Harmon Room Mode Calculator) to help you position your seat outside of a null in your room: www.harman.com/documents/Room%20Mode%20Calculator_0.xls The instructions are very easy to follow and require minimal effort to achieve real results. Simply place your seats outside of the nulls and experiment with placing your subs right at the nulls on your you front and/or side walls. Home Theater Gurus has an easy to follow guide if you are not very good at self-teaching and I've posted a link to that below: kzitem.info/news/bejne/wod7uKKfn4J9lH4&pp=ygUWaG9tZSB0aGVhdGVyIGd1cnUgcm9vbQ%3D%3D If you've done all of that and you're hitting reference volumes, rejoice! Now adjust each input source volume to match and you're done! This will go much faster on each consecutive input. If you've done all of that and still can't hit reference volume, you've officially exhausted all of your options and you'll just have to be content with what you have. ORRRR you can use your new-found scientific data in a special presentation to your significant other to explain large packages arriving at your doorstep.
@scruffy8861
2 жыл бұрын
Changed my volume scale setting like you showed and watched some action scenes. At -24dB conversation seemed just right in my sweet spot chair and explosions packed a wallop.
@danielwander605
2 жыл бұрын
Good information. I think what the question was referring to was how different sources and different content are calibrated to different reference levels. So while a system may be calibrated to what one considers reference, how do you know what reference level actually is for each thing you are watching? I think the answer is: you don’t know, but it doesn’t really matter. Just put the volume where you are happy and enjoy. It would only be an issue if you find you have to crank your system way up above 0 to get to a volume you’re happy with. If that happens more than occasionally then you may want to recalibrate as you could be introducing digital clipping and noise into the system.
@VandepoelM
2 жыл бұрын
Yes, i wanted to know, how do i know that i am actually watching something at reference when im watching a movie via netflix or via disc. Also there are differencesbetween hardware devices like Roku, google tv orr a Windows PC.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Hi Michiel, unfortunately as shared above, there isn’t a way to know. The only control we have over is calibrating our system to reference. Maybe you can use an SPL meter to get an average volume of the source you are watching but it’s easier to adjust your volume to your liking. I do not recommend watching content at Reference volume as that is pretty loud.
@danielwander605
2 жыл бұрын
@@VandepoelM I’ve wondered that also. People refer to “reference” all the time but it can be pretty relative thing. Anyway, I don’t think there’s a way to actually know you’re listening at reference for one specific piece of content.
@SweCrue
2 жыл бұрын
Exactly. Great info in the video as always by Youthman, but not answer to the question. My dream is that every streaming service has a "channel" or program with looping pink noise at THEIR ref lvl.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
There is t an answer to the question because it simply cannot be done. All we can do is adjust our volume to our preferred listening level if a source is lower or higher than what we like.
@mephInc
2 жыл бұрын
I calibrated with the built in software, then manually adjusted each speaker to 85db at 0. I generally listen at -20 for normal shows and up to -10 for good movies.
@milkman100001
2 жыл бұрын
reference is what you feel is the best sound you have ever heard with in your room. then work all future purchases based on that reference. this is a different angle on reference. not every one can or have the money to install an expensive installation which can achieve reference levels.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Even inexpensive systems can reach reference level
@popcornbobGCC
2 жыл бұрын
I think setting up a system to reference isn't too difficult with today's tools. The problem is can the speakers/amps handle it, proper equalization, room treatment, etc. and is the source actually mixed/encoded to that standard. I've found that sources these days do not seem to ever have a consistent level. Most but not all Blu-rays encoded in DTS-HD need to play at -14dB which is 10db off the reference of 85db, so 75db in addition to the +4dB boost most tracks do because they lack a dial norm setting. If the standard -27dB dial norm setting is encoded, you can run those tracks at -10dB. I don't run atmos/DTS-X here but when they fold down into 5.1/7.1 they are most often encoded way too loud to run at -10dB let alone reference. And it's all over the map. I've often times taken a 5.1 DTS-HD Blu-ray track and sync'd to a 4K UHD disc just to avoid the poorly remixed immersive audio. The Bourne Identity is a great example of this. I've also captured some cinema audio tracks from DTS theatrical discs and I can easily run those at -10dB. 0dB is just too hot in a small room. But I consider this a reference and will compare a home mix to them. It really provides a lot of insight into what is wrong with all this home stuff. Shoot, LDs and even some early DVDs have better audio than their Blu-ray counterparts despite being lossy. It's all in the mix! TL;DR: you can align your system correctly all day long but the remixes and encodes on so many modern discs are horrible. Streaming content is even worse. No consistency at all.
@thepiecesfit5049
Жыл бұрын
This is partly why I feel Dynamic EQ fails because it assumes a 0 reference level. And it is quite clear that the volume swings depending on the disk. I was kind of excited with the premise of the video but simply calibrating your system will not solve this issue. I generally get a feeling right away how loud a movie should be and adjust it to my liking.
@garryhammond3117
2 жыл бұрын
Super excellent description of how this all works. Personally, wifey and I listen betwen -10 db and -15 db depending on content and find that a very comfortable (but impressive!) level. - Cheers!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you Gary. My listening preference is the same as yours. 👍
@garryhammond3117
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman I suppose individual "comfort" levels would be closely tied to speaker efficiency, although cal should compensate for this - my mostly Klipsch speakers are very efficient - as you know. 😁
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Regardless of how efficient your speakers are, the volume level is going to remain the same. The only difference is with extremely efficient speakers, your trim levels are going to be way in the negative versus a speaker that is not as sensitive, your trim levels will be up near and close to zero and possibly might have to be in the positives to reach Reference levels
@declanfarber
2 жыл бұрын
In a previous system, I set things up so that the SPL of a “standard test tone” was 83db, w/a 360watt amp driving the center, and it was very satisfying, no matter what the neighbors might have said. More recently, with a Marantz 7703, 73db as indicated on that unit is okay, although I often have to push it up to 76. What I would suggest is to get the blu ray of Spielberg’s “War of the Worlds” and play it on your system, and whatever level you have to turn it down to to preserve your sanity, Bob’s your uncle and that’s your happy place. Using Audyssey, BTW.
@Miskatonic-University
2 жыл бұрын
LOL, the key sentence here is "no matter what the neighbors might have said". The problem is that it usually matters if you want peaceful coexistence 🤣
@declanfarber
2 жыл бұрын
@@Miskatonic-University If you’re below 60 dB C-weighted at the property line, you should be good. Thankfully our house has very good insulation, sound-wise, and to my knowledge we’ve never exceeded that, with over 3100 continuous watts of amplification. :^)
@Miskatonic-University
2 жыл бұрын
@@declanfarber Yes, I understand. But I live in a European capital in a flat...so Reference level is a sad joke here. Someday I will retire and move to a house where I can crank up the volume 🙂
@roostermike123
2 жыл бұрын
@@declanfarber I often wonder how much the neighbors actually hear from my subwoofers.
@declanfarber
2 жыл бұрын
@@roostermike123 You could always go outside to the nearest property line and test it. There are some really good SPL meters out there (please not an iPhone app, those things are IMO next to useless, relying as they do on the Apple mic). I have a pair of Hsu VTF-3’s, and it’s a brick building, and using C-weighting (as you should) it’s not a problem, even during “stress testing”. BTW, I’ve been a big fan of Hsu Research since the 90’s days of the giant tube monsters, they are totally impressive, and IMO very musical. They don’t get a lot of attention in the “high end audio press” because reviewers can’t get their heads around how good they are for the money, and, um, they don’t spread the money around with advertising. You can draw your own conclusions about what that means. ;^)
@ghambino1
Жыл бұрын
I follow Youthman video on setting speakers at reference level and it took my theater to next level. How I know? People who listened to my system before and after knew the difference right away.
@Youthman
Жыл бұрын
I’m glad you found the video helpful
@pancerowany2008
9 ай бұрын
In a typical living room, the walls do not absorb sounds like they do in cinema theaters. Therefore, the reference level in cinemas is pleasantly loud for us. The same reference level in the living room results in unpleasant sound sensations. On my RX-A680, I set the listening level to -20dB or -15dB. Rarely at -10dB.
@Youthman
9 ай бұрын
I have a fully treated theater room and Reference is too loud for my taste.
@chrislukowski1825
2 ай бұрын
It seems to be that the actual scale (+1 number = +1dB) is the same for relative and absolute scales, just the representation is different. Absolute scale is 0-98 and relative is -79.5dB to +18dB (same possible increments) which tells me that for Marantz AVRs "reference volume" is 80dB.
@tfk40
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the explanation, always curious about that. I listen between -20 and -15 db, plenty loud in my room. My Yamaha auto calibration isn't the greatest so I manually adjusted all after calibration.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I too am usually between -15dB and -10dB
@mephInc
2 жыл бұрын
You're fine. Reference level is used in large theaters. The smaller the room, the easier it is to get louder
@jimhamlin6551
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman me too!
@thomasferguson139
2 жыл бұрын
Hello again Youthman. Well wow!!! Great info!! I have the Klipsch rf7s for fronts, & 5 rc7s for center/surrounds, 2 SVS pb3000s and I usually listen at the highest -15. I just tried at reference level 0 and I thought my eardrums were going to blow out. So then I went up to -5 and it sounded really really good but still just a little bit too loud. I Eventually went up to -10 and that was perfect, but wow what a difference that made in total surround sound and hearing things that I never heard before. Just insane. Definitely paranoid about the neighbors or the police showing up lol but WOW
@jimmymills3773
2 жыл бұрын
Another terrific youthman video. You always explain things so simple. I always look forward to all your videos
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you Jimmy. I want everyone, regardless of their AV experience and background, to be able to enjoy the concepts that I share on my channel.
@MattCiprianoMusic
2 жыл бұрын
This is very similar to what I’ve seen done when you pink noise a room with a new sound system. The mic is set in the middle of the room and a full frequency tone is automated from the board and it automatically raise and lower levels for optimum clarity. Super cool! I really like how you explained how what reference volume really is. I learned alot in this quick video. Great job!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Matt that’s pretty cool that you can do that with a pro audio system as well
@midbass.maestro
2 жыл бұрын
Your on to something with this type video! The thing so far you have done well is in the choice of question
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
That’s Chris. I’m trying to serve my audience the best that I can. Figured answering their questions that many others might have would be good
@OMGRC
Жыл бұрын
Great info 👍 I have heard of this reference level before but thought it was to loud in my personal opinion. That is the nice thing about having your own setup you can play at the level you want. 👍 I think movie theaters are too loud and they don’t have any bass. My family we watch movies around -30 or little higher. I did get just run room correction on my pioneer receiver a day ago. I have dB meter so I might just adjust again. Thank you and love you video of your home theater transformation over 15 years 👏
@matt927
2 жыл бұрын
I have learned so much by watching your videos, thank you for making it easy to understand!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Matt. I just finished editing a new video. Should be uploaded within the hour
@dometweeter7093
2 жыл бұрын
-15 to -10 is my systems sweet spots. 🍿
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Mine too
@lequidsnake
2 жыл бұрын
Brilliant video. couldn't be perfect timing. I have a DB mic too and today going to make sure all my channels are at the same DB at the listing area.
@omardiaz3840
8 ай бұрын
Thank you for this explanation it was beyond clear.
@johnscott4385
2 жыл бұрын
Great info. For the first time I understand reference level. Thanks!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Glad you found the video helpful John
@jeffleonard343
2 жыл бұрын
Ha this video came out at the right time!! Been wondering what reference means the past couple days.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Check that out. That’s pretty cool Jeff thanks for sharing glad you found the video helpful
@paulrobinson7881
2 жыл бұрын
wow i never new that thankyou learning all the time thankyou 👍
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Me too Paul
@Vitone22
Жыл бұрын
I listen to my movies no more than -18db and it’s loud @10ft away. Can’t imagine doing reference volumes 😳
@VandepoelM
2 жыл бұрын
Next question. The different sound formats, theyre a bit confusing. 5.1, 7.1, 9.1 and then also atmos or dtsx. This gets quite complicated if you go into details. For example: in 5.1 you want the surround speakers behind the listener on the sides. If you want to upgrade your 5.1 to 7.1 you actually need to move these speakers forward, to the side of the listener( a little in front of them helps the sound from being blocked). And add back surround behind the listener. But what if you dont have a back wall? Back surrounds on the side, behind the listener and one pair in front, is this a good compromise? Or just bad? If you watch 7.1 content on 5.1 setup, are the two channels combined? Then you have front wide speakers, what content uses these? Is this part of atmos? (If yes, how often is this properly utilised?) I tried to find answers about this, and it took a while to digest all this, and im not 100% i understand it fully. You could split this up in multiple videos probably.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Honestly you have a pretty good understanding of it. Dolby Atmos speaker guides will show you what angles your speakers should be placed at depending on the speaker layout of your system - www.dolby.com/about/support/guide/speaker-setup-guides/
@Bigromeo43
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you!!!!! Wondered why my old Yamaha would show relative (had no idea of the difference until you taught me), and why my new Sony shows absolute. I will check to see if my Sony can make this switch. Thanks again!!!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Glad you found the video helpful Benjamin
@chrisbow1776
Жыл бұрын
Great clear info, cheers. The only problem is what to do with neighbours😂 I need a detached cave where I can play at the volume I want.
@Youthman
Жыл бұрын
Invite them to join you. 😉
@damiengvideos4337
Жыл бұрын
Great explanation! Yeah -20 is about all the wife can handle. I like -10 and that is loud as hell. Can’t imagine listening at 0 reference all the time!!!
@plompudu2529
Жыл бұрын
10dB louder is perceived as 2x louder so it would be ca. 4x as loud as your wife can handle xD
@gman1087
2 жыл бұрын
Great tip...cheers youth man
@thesaskatchewankid
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the explanation, YM!
@Mrtscrp30
2 жыл бұрын
Great video I was curious as to why I was seeing a negative volume on videos I thought it was a balance change due to running amplifiers I changed mine to relative thanks Micheal .
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Glad to help
@RockRocky09
Жыл бұрын
love your shorter videos with tips like this also! thanks!
@Youthman
Жыл бұрын
Thanks Rock. I like to provide a variety of content (long form, short form, full podcast, podcast clips and KZitem Shorts).
@Burythelie
2 жыл бұрын
My ego makes me want to reach reference level but my tinnitus tells me "don't push it" haha!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I’ve never had my ego make we want to go above what my hearing tells me is good for me. 😉
@bowlnut17
2 жыл бұрын
Some mixed up information in this video. For reference volume (RV), all speakers should be calibrated to 85dB, which gives speakers 20dB headroom (105dB) and LFE 30dB headroom (115dB), just like in the movie theatre (ref Dolby Atmos Cinema Technical Guidelines white paper). In the movie theatre, the calibrating engineer is listening to 85dB pink noise, but the AVR manufacturers decided that would be too loud and fatiguing for the home user, so they reduced the pink noise by -10dB, to 75dB. And that is why you set your levels against 75dB on your SPL meter. Like this you will still hit 85dB at RV, but that is ONLY if you use the AVR pink noise generator. If you use an audio disk or other source for pink noise, you have to read the accompanying information as it might require setting your levels to 85dB or other. (source of info is Audyssey Labs FAQ Audyssey Dynamic EQ and Reference Level, in particular read the Audyssey Labs responses on pages 6 and 7)
@bowlnut17
2 жыл бұрын
For further in-depth explanation about calibrated loudness levels, find the article "The Misunderstood 0.1 LFE Channel in 5.1 Digital Surround Sound" from 2000
@DustinBartlett
2 жыл бұрын
I just compared an old Avia calibration dvd to the internal tones on a Denon x3600h. When the reciever tones were set to 80db with the relative master volume scale set to 0, the Avia test tones that are supposed to be 85db are 85db.
@thepiecesfit5049
Жыл бұрын
While we assume they adhere to these mastering standards it is clear some movies are louder than others. An example is Tenet. I feel like with some movies you really need to get the SPL meter out. I’m fine really not watching at reference level. Want to save my hearing for old age.
@tb2324
2 жыл бұрын
Michael, incredible description of reference. With that said, I interpreted the question differently. I didn’t understand it relative to your system being calibrated to reference, but how do you know where reference is relative to different source material. Not all source material is mastered the same. There isn’t a 100% standard. Take all the marvel movies for example. People have bashed them for how weak they are compared to other studios. I find that I watch most movies around -15 to -12dB. Marvel movies, I have to turn my system up to -10 to -5 to get roughly the same volume I typically listen. Meaning, listening at 0 for say a Marvel movie vs Bumblebee will be a massive difference. Anyway, take or leave my thought, but that’s how I interpreted his wuestion
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
If that is what he was referring to, there’s nothing you can do about it. If it’s not loud enough, simply increase the volume. There’s no calibration that will account for that.
@tb2324
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman my old Denon allowed you to adjust the volume before doing the auto calibration. Those on AVs always recommended setting it at -10dB for the calibration. I recall doing that once, then did it again at 0 then I forgot over time which one was reference. Lkl
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Current AVR’s do not need to adjust your volume prior to calibration.
@Lamski3
2 жыл бұрын
This is how I interpreted the original question as well. He specifically mentioned "different sources"... So a UHD disc player vs. Plex on an HTPC vs. a Roku or Apple TV. All playing the same movie may all measure different SPLs at the same "relative volume" on your receiver. How I do it is calibrate to a calibration disc using your UHD player and just adjust to whatever the streaming services/playback devices give you... They will all play back at different levels so if your device or receiver has a trim or "input level adjust" you can get it to closely match using an SPL meter. Otherwise you just have to live with it and adjust the volume based on your ears' preference.
@superhero9977
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks youthman!
@rickdiculuss6049
2 жыл бұрын
No way I could listen at 0.0 haha I'm with you on the -15 to -10 can't imagine why I would go past that
@ajamesc55
11 ай бұрын
I listen to mine at around -25 to -20, I couldn't imagine 0db, my neighborhood be pissed lol
@schemkesa
9 ай бұрын
Absolutely true and clear explanation, but as I understood 85dB is the average spl for reference lvl? Anyway, with my wife I listen at -10dB 😊, but when alone I like it at 0dB 😄. It's particularly interesting to calculate how many watts you need for that 105dB! That's why I upgraded my main amp to 2x 525W
@Youthman
9 ай бұрын
You are correct. Reference is 85dB with peaks of 105dB. During Audyssey calibration, it uses 75dB for test tones because 85dB is loud to our ears, but it calibrates at 85dB
@AudioGearhead
2 жыл бұрын
I've got to do some reconfiguring, my current levels are scary at 0. I've ran the YPAO on my RX-A1080, but I don't think it can adjust the levels low enough with how small my room is and how big my speakers are lol. Klipsch AL-3 La Scala's, R-34c, KG 2.5's, R-41sa, R-120sw x2, in a 10x11 barracks room with concrete walls. I do have dampening to cut the echo out, but man it's crazy how it all sounds at reference.
@jaydoublebusy
2 жыл бұрын
My Anthem MRX is PUMPING at 28 db.Im running Emotiva T2+ L/R Towers,Klipsch 64 III center,2 Klipsch SPL 120S(sub) and Paradigm ADP 590 V.5 surrounds.
@bestjoy2163
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks ,Michael !Really learn a lot from your video!👍
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you kindly
@parupudiphanindra3126
4 ай бұрын
Excellent video which I come across
@Tuiahsa
2 жыл бұрын
Hmmm.....interesting as always Michael! Keep up these vids!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I’m trying 👍
@SavageAirCinema
2 жыл бұрын
I watch movies at -15db. But, when I have company over, they prefer it at -20db.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I’m opposite. When I have company over, I usually turn it up a bit lol
@nickcifarelli8887
7 ай бұрын
GREAT SIMPLE VIDEO
@glengatt3941
2 жыл бұрын
Thought as much the giveaway are only for us and Canada, well it is what it is
@jonathanperez618
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks! 🙏 YouthMan this is an amazing Video.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you Jonathan
@nathanjones4039
2 жыл бұрын
Contrary, while 85 dB may not seem loud, according to OSHA that’s where hearing loss can start! Anything over 85 dB in as little as an hour can cause long term hearing damage. I’m only into 2 channel music, but I like your channel a lot, but I’d never think or advise that 85 dB is ok for sustained listening. I want to listen for a lifetime!
@jacobharley7117
2 жыл бұрын
You can listen to sound at a level of 85dB SPL for ~8 hours before hearing damage and permanent loss occurs.
@nathanjones4039
2 жыл бұрын
@@jacobharley7117 no thanks. If you choose to do so, that’s ok.
@jacobharley7117
2 жыл бұрын
@@nathanjones4039 I would not advocate doing so as it is quite fatiguing. Just letting you know that it won't cause permanent harm :)
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I do not know any local cinema that plays a movie below 85dB and we’ve all likely seen countless movies and our hearing is still intact. THX wouldn’t create a standard knowing it would be detrimental to people’s hearing.
@jacobharley7117
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman Precisely - I am a sound designer so I don't like to listen at 85dB all day because it wears my ears out fast. I'm also listening in a nearfield environment so that is a factor. My reference level is calibrated with -20dBFS RMS pink noise to a reading of 75dB SPL C-weighted, Slow on an SPL meter. That is a measurement taken individually per speaker. I know when my monitor controller says 75dB how loud certain elements of the mix should be and as a result I can make mixing and sound design decisions based on the pressure I feel on my ears at that level. That is really what it is about - getting used to a consistent level where things sound correct in your room! Whether you are watching for enjoyment in a home theater, at the cinema, or work in the audio industry in some way :)
@chrissheldrick4073
Жыл бұрын
Nice one... Keep going man..
@DrDingleBarry
2 жыл бұрын
Great video Michael!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks
@danielloshak4249
2 жыл бұрын
Very helpful. Thanks.
@davidfoster3661
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for sharing this great information.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks David
@danmaier2077
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you so much for the Video Greetings from Austria 🇦🇹 Europe
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Appreciate it Dan
@sporegazm
2 жыл бұрын
Great vid as usual. Hopefully this explains things well for the casual enthusiast 👍 curious though...did you notice a difference in your listening volumes after you switched from the klipsch to JTR? Because in my experience, that vast majority of people can't bring their MV to 0(reference) because of 2 reasons - 1. Room gain and 2. Underpowered equipment distorting/clipping, without realizing it. In my experience, that vast majority of people don't realize that A. Their speaker equipment isn't even capable of those volume levels or B. Their speakers are capable but are being vastly underpowered and introducing distortion/clipping when trying to turn their MV to reference, because their amplifier is not capable enough This is where speaker sensitivitys really matter and come into play I noticed a massive difference when i went to a PSA mtm210 with a true 98db sensitivity. Suddenly, my speakers sounded effortless and I found myself getting to reference without the "ow it hurts my ears" sensation. Im pretty sure the JTR are the same or even higher....and while klipsch claim high sensitivities as well, often their numbers are highly exaggerated(not sure about lascalas tho). Just curious if you experienced a similar thing in your space when you made the switch? 😃
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thank you kindly. Listening volumes have always been between -10dB and -15dB, regardless of what speakers I've owned. Both my LaScalas and JTR speakers have no problem reaching Reference levels and beyond without distortion. I have always said, "Your ears will give out well before the speakers do." LaScalas were 104dB sensitive and JTR are 101dB. Both ridiculously sensitive and easy to drive.
@sporegazm
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman ahh that makes sense your volume levels have remained consistent then. That is some great sensitivity levels on both! I had no doubts ur system reaches reference cleanly. Just was curious about a difference...because klipsch has been known to exaggerate their sensitivity ratings quite a bit. But the lascalas are their high end stuff, so who knows...either way, both are high end and highly sensitive speakers ✌️. Thanks for sharing
@sporegazm
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman p.s. while i can reach reference as well, it all depends on source material like u say. But i average about -10db myself as well.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Yeah there are guys that are driving a La Scala’s to pretty ridiculous levels with less than 10 watt tube amps
@sporegazm
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman wild! Would love to hear a pair some day. Klipsch's high end stuff looks deadly :)
@roostermike123
2 жыл бұрын
Great video youthman and excellent explanation as usual. But just to clarify, doesn't this still not solve the issue of different sources being at different levels? Ive been using the 0-98 level just cause I find it easier, but I do like the reference way as well. Either way, I still often just do a quick rough estimate using my phone SPL meter to see what the sound level is. Some movies it's loud at one level, and the next movie will be super quiet at the same level. And then it complicates it if you switch from Xbox blu ray to an Amazon stream.
@roostermike123
2 жыл бұрын
Sorry youthman. Saw your answered this on one of your other posts. I'm usually pretty good with just doing the quick check on my phone to make sure I'm not being too crazy. I've watched you videos about your awesome JTR speakers (as well as you videos with your Klipsch lascala's), do you always watch movies with the speakers calibrated at their correct level or do you ever turn up the level on your subwoofers a few dB?
@kevinweithers1223
2 жыл бұрын
You have it a bit wrong Youthman. Technically, when you calibrate, you want 0 to be 85 db. Thus, -10 would equate to 75 db. You don't want to make 0 equate to 75 db because true reference is 85db at the 0 setting .
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
How am I wrong? Audyssey does the calibration which is between 75dB up to 105dB peaks. 85dB is a good average of what you will hear throughout the movie. And who is Steven?
@screwface1971
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman 85 dB is reference, the reason that AVR's calibrate to 75 dB is because some people found 85 db test tones too loud so they do it at 75 instead.
@kevinweithers1223
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman Sorry, was trying to remember your real name and Steven popped in my head. Sorry about that.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
It’s all good Kevin I get that all the time. It’s because my last name is Stevens 🤣 The video doesn’t even go into manual calibration so again I’m not sure why you feel the information I provided was incorrect. Every Google search I’ve made does not mention anything about calibrating to 85dB. Just curious where I can find that info.
@kevinweithers1223
2 жыл бұрын
I use my analog spl meter to confirm the numbers. However, the idea that 0 should equate to 85db is widely known. Wish I could find some links for you.
@robertrobitaille320
2 жыл бұрын
Have Yamaha receiver. Most movies I play is at -31.5. Is not might vary to -35. Will to listen to this video. Since I'm my 30 minutes lunch :-) Good question, we often here about reference level. To what the heck is that. Also why ask sound is always in mines.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Glad the video was helpful
@frankvasquez3255
9 ай бұрын
Hey bud, love your KZitem channel. Man, learn a whole lot of information about hi power home theater systems. Have a question on separates. I have a Marantz 7706. I have a 2 front, center, rear surround, and 2 front Dolby atmos up-front on the wall. I'm using 4 XLS Drive core crown amplifiers. When I calibrate my system I set the gain volume at 85% on all amps don't want to set at 100% don't want to damage my speakers but I'm sure they can handle the pink noise when calibrating the speaker set up. I'm also using the audyssy pro application. My question is, should I set the amps at 100% when running the system calibration? I would appreciate any inf bud. Thank you in advance
@ricardonieves8136
2 жыл бұрын
Hi there, I live in Clermont and I’m a home theater designer. I have 3 show rooms. 2 in my house. Let me know if you want to come over and check it out.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Ricardo that would be great. Feel free to submit them on my website www.hometheatertours.com
@ZND2022
2 жыл бұрын
Damn! I wish I could crank my system to -10db, my wife would kill me if I watched a movie that loud 😂 the loudest I have it is about -15db, and that’s already loud as heck in my room!
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
You could always send her shopping 🤣
@ZND2022
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman hahaha, she’ll be doing a lot of shopping 😂
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
🤣🤣🤣
@ZND2022
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman hey youthman, I have dual ported SVS PB-2000 pro subs up front, I want to add another sub Behind my chair for added tactile response, should I go with another PB-2000 pro or can I go with a sealed SB-1000 pro?
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
My understanding is it’s more difficult to integrate ported and sealed subs so my personal preference would be to keep them all the same type.
@davebuccino4626
2 жыл бұрын
Awesome information
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Thanks Dave
@stereomc3954
2 жыл бұрын
My set up is set beyond reference levels. 😁
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Be careful. Hearing loss is irreparable
@Lowkey_nxthxn
2 жыл бұрын
So the speakers gotta be at 75db and the subwoofer will be at 85db?
@alliemonster8149
2 жыл бұрын
I've never watched anything on my set up at reference level, -15db is about as loud as I dare go, I'd like to keep a good relationship with the neighbours.
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Reference is too loud for me as well. I’m typically between -15dB and -10dB
@scottnovitsky9253
Жыл бұрын
Just set to reference on sr-7013 but now volume won't go above -6bd, volume limit is set to off. Watching via Amazon
@HometheaterEnthusiast
2 жыл бұрын
The reference volume also depends on the trim of ur levels setting
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
The trims are used to calibrate to Reference.
@HometheaterEnthusiast
2 жыл бұрын
But I think if u do some changes in the trims manually like for level matching and doesn’t consider the reference level at that time it may cause a deviation rit, ? just to avoid confusion .
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
If you’re making adjust to the trims, it should only be done using an SPL meter to make sure there at reference level. If you choose to deviate from that, of course you’re going to run into an issue of not being calibrated for Reference Level
@HometheaterEnthusiast
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman got it, 😊
@qbanb8582
Жыл бұрын
I've seen many articles and videos that you calibrate all speakers and the subwoofer to 75 db for reference. I having done that and doing it with the subwoofer being 10 db hotter. I easily like the subwoofer being 10 db hotter compared to the other speakers. My question is this case of preference? When I measure the levels after using Dirac I found the subs were calibrated to around the same level as the other speakers around 75db. I guess I'm wondering which is "right" from a technical perspective.
@Youthman
Жыл бұрын
Most people run their subwoofers hotter than the rest of their speakers and that is 100% normal. I tend to run mine about 5-6 dB hot in my room
@nomorepictures7673
2 жыл бұрын
How do you calibrate to reference? Do room calibration at reference level?
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
I shared the video in the description and at the end of the video
@jonlaye2537
2 жыл бұрын
I also listen at -10 to -13 volume. 0 is way too loud. Pioneer VSX-503, external amplification.
@Classicman.43
Жыл бұрын
-10db?! Man it’s hot in there lol
@chrisl9813
2 жыл бұрын
I'd never heard the terms relative and absolute volumes . I always preferred the relative setting I'd had with my Pioneer AVR and missed them moving over to Sony when I upgraded to Atmos capable AVR. Sadly Sony doesn't allow me to change this ...
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Absolute numbers vs relative to reference 😉
@kenestra123
7 ай бұрын
How do you change a Sony receiver from Absolute to Relative?
@garysmith8455
2 жыл бұрын
Hello Michael, I have a Marantz 6011, (just running in 5.2) and -12 has always been the magic number in my 24x18' space. I am thinking this is with C weighting for those DB measurements ?
@Squishmallows24
2 жыл бұрын
I have tried using SPL meters to setup my speakers but it just doesn’t work for me. The readings jump so much that i can’t set it to 75db. It hits 75 but then goes down to 72 and then to 76 and then back to 75 and then back down to 72 lol why??? I just end up using an app on my iPhone that it’s way less jumpy. When it hits 75 it hovers Around 74/75 without all the spikes
@avsolutions212
Жыл бұрын
After audyssey i want to speakers level matching with spl meter so now what is the reference volume to do?
@pierrecastanets1974
2 жыл бұрын
Is my denon broken? I ran Audyessy and my center channel at 0dB MV plays at 95db at my listening position. I re-ran the calibration a few times with the same result.
@pez7031
2 жыл бұрын
My amp goes to ELEVEN.
@specialformula14
2 жыл бұрын
i cant handle any more than -16 on my setup.. but i am running 2x 7 channel monoblocks and 14kw 240v on my subs
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Nothing wrong with that. But if your system is calibrated for Reference, -16dB will be the same volume regardless if you are using the internal amps of an AVR, separates or even massive monoblocks.
@Chris_K.
2 жыл бұрын
Michael, I somehow disagree. Not considered to my understanding is the speakers efficiency…. At least if comparing to my Anthem AVM60. I usually listen @-25dB on the scale which is about 78dB SPL per single speaker measured… the efficiency of my speakers is at 96dB. Assuming somebody else’s speakers with 81dB, he must turn up the AVR to -10dB to achieve the same SPL, correct?
@Youthman
2 жыл бұрын
Speaker efficiency wouldn’t change what Reference Level is. My speakers are very efficient so my trims are close to -12dB. With less efficient speakers, your Anthem will simply increase your trim levels to calibrate to Reference. No matter what AVR, processor or type speakers you have connected, if they are all calibrated for Reference, 0dB will be the same for all
@Chris_K.
2 жыл бұрын
@@Youthman ok, did never look at it like that… very nice you answered
Пікірлер: 353