The biggest take away from this is that sinse you most likely in this new update want to have mixed-fleet composition it means that the early-mid game alloy investment to corvettes, destroyers and cruisers doesn't go to waste because you will simply use these ship types in late game, of course their loadout might change when you tech up but the ships themselves stays in your fleet.
@GMour53
Жыл бұрын
Bold of you to assume my fleets last that long
@TheSolitaryEye
Жыл бұрын
Paradox added scrappers just to help you get rid of obsolete ships, that's how bad the problem was. I'm glad they'll have some uses later on, although it's a shame that corvettes are still stuck in a bad position of not having a lategame niche.
@samsonthemanson
Жыл бұрын
@@TheSolitaryEye throw disruptors on your old corvettes and they're actually pretty lethal
@mrbouncelol
Жыл бұрын
@@TheSolitaryEye Scrappers give you approximately Jack Shit worth of alloys though. I haven't tested it but that's my feeling lol
@TheApeiros
Жыл бұрын
@@TheSolitaryEye I don't even need hands to count the number of times I had access to scrappers at a sensible time in a game 😐
@magmakojote1663
Жыл бұрын
This new Meta is way more interesting than the old one, well done devs!
@MontuPlays
Жыл бұрын
It's definitely a massive shake up!
@theodoremccarthy4438
Жыл бұрын
I’m really looking forward to playing this. I’ll probably grab the beta once I wrap up my current game.
@TheSolitaryEye
Жыл бұрын
You weren't into spamming neutron launcher battleships with impunity? Neither was I.
@noneofyourbusiness4133
Жыл бұрын
@@MontuPlays can you give me the stats of the new weapons? I have a heavily modded play through that I don’t wanna lose right now ;-;
@HadzabadZa
Жыл бұрын
So now we'll be stuck in a perpetual cycle of reacting to other players' rock-paper-scissors with 5x the effort required to do anything? Incredible game design. If only ship modules had absolutely any variety at all rather than the bare minimum +points with tiers. The failure of the combat system is fundamental and no amount of shuffling stats around will change that. They could've simply went for HOI4 combat, tried and true.
@alexanderhenderson2594
Жыл бұрын
I suppose if fleet designs have become more of a rock paper scissors deal where you need to actually know what your enemies have then maybe this will have a side benefit of buffing subterfuge.
@feurgott9332
Жыл бұрын
That's assuming the AI actually designs their ships
@samsonthemanson
Жыл бұрын
Criminal megacorps with subterfuge are a lot more interesting for sure
@sylvie_v2939
Жыл бұрын
The espionage system and much of the diplomacy leaves much to be desired
@teun911
Жыл бұрын
@@feurgott9332 the AI has pre-determined designs based on their ethics/government
@davidkubik537
Жыл бұрын
@@teun911 can you expand or post a link ? thx
@Sonar90
Жыл бұрын
Titans should have system wide auras and battleship fleet wide. Also more titan weapons please.
@daviddarby2888
Жыл бұрын
This, this is needed. And a juggernaut buff with some large slots and the ability to join a normal fleet as a capital ship
@wizardswine
Жыл бұрын
@@daviddarby2888 Horrifying flashbacks to my juggernaut jumping into a system 0.5 seconds before my fleet and dying.
@RWAKitty
Жыл бұрын
I didn't like the idea of giving battleships auras, but this has merit. Gives each distinct roles. Design-wise, you plan on overlapping auras and balance from there.
@goldenhate6649
Жыл бұрын
@@daviddarby2888 Yup, and maybe a speed buff? they are so unbearably slow that I refuse to use them as they just hinder any sort of war effort outside of defense. Also, can we get a fix to fleet building and the fleet menu that is so ungodly buggy.
@daviddarby2888
Жыл бұрын
@@goldenhate6649 A speed buff would be great, I'd also be good if it had some built point defense weapons considering the update in combat that's coming
@jasonpcrawfordauthor
Жыл бұрын
Monty’s tests are always fun to watch!
@MontuPlays
Жыл бұрын
More of a preliminary results summary here, but I hope you enjoyed it anyway!
@jsr9617
Жыл бұрын
I wonder how this balance will work against strong end-game crises. The meta was battleships and the goal was to get past the tipping point where you can engage an enemy fleet and not lose any of your battleships. It will be interesting to see if the changes alter how players choose to engage the crises.
@Nomadic_Gaming
Жыл бұрын
itll still work just use appropriate setups less battle ships more cruisers w neutrons and or missiles (the unbidden are getting decimated by the changes in this patch) and go from there range and speed are still your best friends for handling endgame crisis the unbidden are all shields the contingency is generally more balanced and the scourge u want point defense and range
@TheDashACorner
Жыл бұрын
Arc Emitter + Disruptor Battleships works wonders against all 3. Usually I go for X, 2 PD, 2H, 2S, 2M, 3A. I go for the 2PD and 2H because of Scourge. With 10000/6000 naval cap I wasn't able to refit my entire fleet in a year and it nearly cost me the game because my Battleships had no PD or Hangars against Scourge. (Scourge was second 10x Crisis) And since against unbidden and Contingency Armor and Shield Pen is pretty strong Disruptors are a neat addition.
@filipwolffs
Жыл бұрын
@@Nomadic_Gaming I do want to add to this that the devs have added some more point defences to the Unbidden so they're not completely helpless against missiles/torpedoes.
@leakingamps2050
Жыл бұрын
Not used the patch, but unless PD got a massive buff, it's kinda useless against significant level crisises. Did some back-of-the-envolope math and it suggests I need 1000+ Corvettes to have enough of for one enemy fleet, despite having repeatable?
@Nomadic_Gaming
Жыл бұрын
@@leakingamps2050 it did finally get fixed/buffed also strike craft dont act as a psuedo point defense anymore vs missiles and torpedos they only engage other strike craft them creating and pushing a new missile/torpedo meta is why they finally fixed it overall this update is a great shake up that finally changes the meta up for single player and def vs multiplayer you need to hard counter someone or u risk being hard countered there are a few generalist designs for fleet comps that i can see being ok for multi but they wont be as effective as specific counter play setups the range thing is also a huge change up btw that really really make you need to have the right ships and have them set right computer wise plus maybe not running huge fleets vs a few specialized ones and not having them all in a system at once like feed a bait fleet in then have the others join in or space them so one engaged first then they others kick in to help shred someone from multiple ranges so they cant try to close in on your long range ships from being locked in combat w your first fleet or shorter range ships
@ShummaAwilum
Жыл бұрын
I like the idea of system-wide strike craft range in principle, but need an option to turn it off so you have the ability to sneak/escape instead of immediately initiating battle with everything in the system.
@Vox_Popul1
Жыл бұрын
Maybe something like the current fleet stance system. Adding a “stealth” stance or something. Could also open the door to new stealth-related techs. I want a Romulan cloak dammit
@diveheadfirst01
Жыл бұрын
@@Vox_Popul1 Right! How was this overlooked! Stealth, guerrilla warfare, ambushes, or sabotage can’t be instrumentally used in Stellaris. It is such a shame I can’t ambush execute all my foes in a surprise assault in a seemingly unoccupied system. I mean they already have intel levels and espionage. It’s right there!
@Vox_Popul1
Жыл бұрын
@@diveheadfirst01 exactly
@dj_koen1265
Жыл бұрын
Hearing the words romulan cloak awakened something I didn’t know I remembered
@wodzu_9319
Жыл бұрын
Some comments from a modder: - Firing arc was already a thing for X slot weapons - it just was not shown in the tooltip. It also was basically meaningless, because battleships snap to the target rather than turn when at very low speed/stationary. This is not 1.9.1, where ships had very noticable hard cap on turning rate. Unless this changed, firing arcs are meaningless. - Evasion is still a underwhelming stat. While PDX removed some evasion sources, unless they changed tracking sources as well, it will still be underwhelming at its job. That's because tracking bonuses are largely a flat +, while evasion bonuses are +%. So it makes L and X slot weapons disproportionarly powerful against a stat that is supposed to counter them. You can push tracking high enough that X weapons can hit small targets somewhat reliably, which kills corvettes usefulness. I guess this issue will be somewhat masked with addition of minimum range to L and X weapons. By capping effective evasion (evasion - tracking ) to 90% instead of just evasion, than alone would improve corvettes substancially. Also corvettes have artificially inflated fleet power rating, because game multiplies the HP scores by evasion, so with 90% cap it sees it's HP bars as 10 times as large (10% chance to hit with no tracking) for purposes of fleet power calculations. - Frigates are a really unnecesary addition. All the roles they theoretically fit, could be achieved by corvettes just by tweaking some numbers, mainly how evasion works. - Starbases are REALLY in bad shape right now, due to being unable to tweak their module loadout. This really needs to be adressed. - I agree that battleships will still be a mainstay, due to simple economic consideration: they are the most effective firepower per BOTH cost and naval cap efficiency. This is because performance of slots scales more than the cost in relation to the size. Cost-wise, 8S = 4M = 2L = 1X, but performance-wise, scailing is somewhere around x2.2 - x2.6 per step, so Stellaris highly favors battleships. So "fixing" this would require a substancial cost-effectiveness reevaluation of the whole combat system. - Unless this was changed, Strike Craft are OP busted in any prolonged fight. They have disproportionally high unit production compared to DPS needed to kill one. Basically, it takes several times as long for a Flak to kill a strike craft than for the Carrier to rebuild it! From the stats in the video (25 Hull 50 Shield VS 9 DPS, 18 against shield + 25% pen), I estimate a 5-7 days worth of Flak DPS to kill one strike craft, while carriers produce 1 strike craft per day. 1 PER DAY! And carriers used to produce strike craft continuosly, the 8 unit cap per slot was NOT respected, so over time a swarm of angry bees will overwhelm any attempt at countering them by PD. You need about the same in naval cap worth of destroyers in full Flak config just to BREAK EVEN for strike craft fly-swatting with a Carrier config BB producing it. While strike craft are chipping away at your PD destros.
@goldenhate6649
Жыл бұрын
Can we also get less industrial repeatables? That area is so bloated it makes anything outside of energy weapons useless at the end of the game.
@XenoByte
Жыл бұрын
I really, really want starbase customisation as everytime I look at one and go "Oh cool, it's wasting all it's slots and being useless".
@5508Vanderdekken
Жыл бұрын
How easy is it to copy the combat system out of stellaris? I've had the idea of simulating battles with different ship sizes, components, etc. to see which one comes out on top... without going through the UI of the game. Probably incredibly easy to say but difficult to do
@AGuy-vq9qp
Жыл бұрын
Are x slots no longer worth 4 L slots?
@chrisdupuis2523
Жыл бұрын
@@AGuy-vq9qp X weapons were never worth 4 L weapons, it's more like 2.2 to 2.5
@cycat20
Жыл бұрын
It would be interesting to have corvette-specific weapons so that they can’t just be replaced by larger ship types.
@dbzfanexwarbrady
Жыл бұрын
Kamikaze , instead of retreating they Ram their Target
@amateurishauthor2202
Жыл бұрын
@@dbzfanexwarbrady kills the ramming ship, but deals massive damage to the target.
@wegner7036
Жыл бұрын
@@amateurishauthor2202 And shields need to be taken down first. Otherwise it wouldn't be fair to egalitarians/pacifists, who probably wouldn't be able to kamikaze.
@DrewPicklesTheDark
Жыл бұрын
@@wegner7036 Maybe they need to be an "extreme" version of the ideology? I can see extremist egalitarians doing something like a suicide strike (history has shown extremist egalitarians can be exceptionally violent). Or maybe certain civics, such as nationalistic zeal. Really only pacifists wouldn't make sense. Or maybe the for militaristic society, normal can do it, pacifists can't even if extreme, and for the others (spiritual, egalitarian, etc.) can only do it if extreme.
@CM-db5cg
Жыл бұрын
Corvettes are the only ship with swarm AI, which WILL get as close as possible to the enemy ships still. So unless you're going for a spesfically anti corvette build you're always going to want corvettes to get up close with the enemy.
@spectorofcomm
Жыл бұрын
Strike craft need to be specialized like other ships. They need to be put in the editor. That way you can make fighter hulls, or bomber gulls, or hell maybe boarding vessels. You could come up with combat computers , weapons load outs, armor and shield options. I feel that would be a really great way to give new life to strike craft
@molybdaen11
Жыл бұрын
They had been specialized bombers in the game before but the, had been fused to striker crafts (not counting the bio ones).
@pallen2645
Жыл бұрын
Running a brawler cruiser monofleet, all torpedos and small autocanons. Torpedos eat the armor at the same time the autocanons eat the shields, then once both are gone they tear up hull like paper.
@devindbass6711
Жыл бұрын
Dude, this is a killer video! Thanks for explaining the changes so very well. I haven't fired up Stellaris in a bit, mainly because of the lack of creativeness in the combat. With your excellent explanation of the combat changes I am ready to dive into Stellaris again. THANKS
@chriswilliams7182
Жыл бұрын
Frustratingly i'm waiting for this to be finalised and go into stable before playing much Stellaris currently, it's going change the dynamics of combat (imo in a really good way) so much that playing before these changes is going to feel pointless. Fleet composition is at the core of Stellaris and how you build your fleets is going to make a huge influence in how you build your economy to support it
@RichardPhillips1066
Жыл бұрын
This frequently a problem with complex ...long commitment games with a huge update coming seems pointless starting a new game without the update
@samsonthemanson
Жыл бұрын
Its gonna probably need a lot of rebalancing after release still but that's fine because itll shake the game up
@quoriander
Жыл бұрын
I absolutely agree about the missiles and at least system wide strike craft. Those are weapons that are absolutely key to most sci Fi settings, and having ship classes to cover specific roles adds so much realism.
@Ep3o
Жыл бұрын
Ah good, I can now do stupid challenges but with optimal navy’s!
@tobiesteenkamp4769
Жыл бұрын
Your thoughts on niche uses for ship types and more of an "all-rounder fleet" I think is spot on, good sir!!!
@markthompson6139
Жыл бұрын
Montu, have ypu taken a look at some of the tests run by Tachyon Lance? Initially his torpedo cruisers would roll over anything, even with a full kit of PD on the opposing fleets. Then he found a counter in the carrier battleship. After multiple tests he had difficulty in getting anything to beat the carriers if they engage from opposite ends of a system. Artillery battleships died, torpedo crusiers died, anything smaller was eviscerated. He finally tried to hard counter it with nothing but shields and shield hardening on the arty Bb, and was able to get a win but those BBs were themselves evisceracted by torp cruisers . So a bit of Rock Paper Scissors aling with some tactical engagements. Also, have you tested the torpedo multiplicative damage to starbases? It may have been updated recently but initially they didnt do any bonus danage.
@felixmustermann790
Жыл бұрын
his torp cruisers rolled over everything because they were neutron launchers i guess ? then its no wonder because Neutron Launchers are still HitScan meaning when they they dont travel like normal torps or missiles, they apply their damage instantly so PD is useless against them
@comet.x
Жыл бұрын
you said the gateway fighter thing might be problematic, but the strategic value of having a huge bastion loaded up with fighters with a gateway in the system sounds awesome. And being able to harass enemies from *outside* the system would have a huge amount of strategic depth and stop fighters from just being 'weird missiles'. Fighters could even have a range on how many systems they could jump away from their mothership based on research, which would be huge
@kaijuking5971
Жыл бұрын
You peaked my interest with that statement
@nichtmal5208
Жыл бұрын
I really liked your ideas to the balancing at the end of the video, a niche for every ship type instead of corvettes and stuff being left out is the best thing we could hope for. I really hope the devs are hearing this!
@TheDarthnoll
Жыл бұрын
You know Montu, I just want to say a big thank you. You put so much effort and time into keeping everybody updated on the games mechanics, and I cant even begin to tell you how much I appreciate it. So thank you very much.
@titaniumwolf1123
Жыл бұрын
Love how this dudes balance suggestions are literally just him making his favorite play style and fleet makeup extremely broken to a ridiculous degree and that's literally the thought that went into it plus a couple completely assinine percentages thrown in to buff things nobody would ever notice to hide the agenda at hand 🤣🤣🤣 Brilliant, truly
@dakaodo
Жыл бұрын
This sounds great! Coming from Homeworld and other RTS / 4X games, I had always felt like the old/current Stellaris combat system was too simplistic. Just slam together a big tactical blob of ships. The rock paper scissors element was found in picking weapons, shields, and armor modules. Going forward, it'll hopefully be more fun and engaging, using balanced or situational deployment of ship types.
@lanecazier9011
Жыл бұрын
This is an amazing channel for Stellaris fans. I love how you often just deliver useful information, lots of youtubers take a while to get to the point and talk a lot, without giving useful info. Coming to this channel is always great because it's so straightforward. Even when you ask for viewers to like the video, you keep it brief. Subscribed, and will start supporting you on humble bundle as well.
Can't wait for the video (s) that explains how each of the best types of ships and weapons goes together. And what ratio of ships is best
@Mika-ph6ku
Жыл бұрын
Since there is not really a #1 go to ship design anymore this means that intelligence plays a much more important role in warfare now which is a detail I really like.
@madmotorcyclist
Жыл бұрын
Implementation of regen during battle, minimum range, and now firing arcs is absolutely awesome.
@TheEpicTaco100
Жыл бұрын
So excited for this! It's been needed for a while
@MontuPlays
Жыл бұрын
I hope it was worth the wait!
@TheRealWormbo
Жыл бұрын
@@MontuPlays Definitely was for me. At least I have some idea what I need to watch out for when designing ships and fleet compositions. Do you think this makes it viable to put additional effort into figuring out details about an enemy's ship configuration?
@rubricance9617
Жыл бұрын
I like how this update seems to make mixed fleets viable and not just battleships or vette spam in late game but because mixed fleets are now the way to go with even mixed hull designs within that fleet id really like it if you could save a preset for an entire fleet so that when youre making ships you can set starbases to make entire fleets at a time. like it would make 4 corvettes in a row, 4 frigates, 2 destroyers, and a battleship to make one preset "fleet" that you could tell it the composition of beforehand as a saved preset so its just one click to add all that to a ship building queue. just to make it easier for people to already have their fleet ready to go instead of having to spend time merging fleets and trying to figure out how many starbases should be producing each ship so that their fleets end up more or less balanced as they want them ship number wise.
@anna-flora999
Жыл бұрын
You kinda have that with the fleet manager already, so it shouldn't be too difficult to include the preset option
@felixmustermann790
Жыл бұрын
create new fleet in fleet manager, press build... not hard...
@Hlevi87
Жыл бұрын
As how you should equip your ships increasingly depends on how your enemy does the same, I'd love to see some integration of ship design and intelligence. Also seeing enemy ship builds only at very high infiltration (maybe at max, not sure) is a bit annoying. I'd love to see a system that gives you bits of information already at lower levels, like: "they use a lot of armor" at 40% infiltration, and then at 45% "it's 65% armor and 35% shield - but we dont know what level of armor and shield".
@AwesomeJedi182
Жыл бұрын
To improve on your strike craft idea, they could also have different types of strike craft, like interceptors and bombers Or maybe strike craft customisation by giving them a targeting computer like thing but it's just formations that affect their stats , like loose formation, wedge formation, line formation, etc. This can be done for fleets too.
@subatomicseal7789
Жыл бұрын
Would also be nice to not have every strike craft swarm devolve into the Laser Tornado
@theshadymememan2265
Жыл бұрын
Love the new changes so far, glad all weapons have a use now and its not just fleets of neutron launchers late game. This may also make espionage more advantageous to learn the enemies fleet compositions to attempt to counter them.
@jtillman8251
Жыл бұрын
ECM modules reducing engagement range could be a good way of balancing your increased strike craft idea
@George_K.
Жыл бұрын
I think they should add a button for scrambling strike craft just like they added a button for fleets to do quantum catapult jump.
@anna-flora999
Жыл бұрын
I could see the one system over carrier engagement working somewhat, but not as the actual carrier engaging them. What I'd imagine might work is an ability for carriers that allows them to spawn a mini fleet only containing the strike craft, that can operate in an adjacent system for a certain amount of time but can't be reinforced. That ability would need to have a certain amount of cool down, and maybe you can only have one strike craft swarm active per fleet at a time. Potentially also making it so that the carrier modules gets a large debuff while the swarm is active
@mehemynxm6974
Жыл бұрын
Making phase disrupters not completely useless would be great. That and allowing us to fit out our own starbase designs.
@kaijuking5971
Жыл бұрын
It is needed plain and simple
@Riderofrohan11
Жыл бұрын
Appreciate the hard work your doing Montu. I do hope this helps diversify and make it so the battleship horde aint the only way going forward.
@grandengineernathan
Жыл бұрын
I find it really interesting that other people found other metas, such as the swarm missiles or the death of battleships
@sqocks8254
Жыл бұрын
This is a very interesting video Montu. Thank you for making it. ❤️ I am just glad that the Dev reduced the available evasion bonuses. Perhaps one day they can also adjust the ship/component cost upwards to account for excessive amount of borderline free production bonuses that are currently in the game.
@lolmanmagee2785
Жыл бұрын
as someone who never really bothered with fleet design, this scares me as i may now be required to learn it. seems cool but like i might suck now.
@CornBredCrusader
Жыл бұрын
Just going to point out that once again, the "ship role" button actually doesnt do anything besides automatically setting up which ship components are included, but you can do that manually and mix and match. The thing that does something in regards to this is the ships combat computer (ie line/artillery/swarm/etc
@SamsIsDead
Жыл бұрын
i think battleships are in a really good position right now. It makes sense for them to be literally better than everything else, since they are unlocked later in the game, cost more alloys, and take more time to build. I think giving them auras would really break the game as stacking the same effect too many times would have wild consequences, while putting a cap too low would severely hurt the effectiveness of BBs. Perhaps making them a little more expensive in terms of alloys and/or strat. resources would be better than nerfing them. I also think that strike craft having infinite range would be really cool, but make it so starbases have a chance against them. Perhaps X-type weapons have longer range and prioritise the ship with the largest fleet power, but are more expensive? Another thing, I think that sublight speeds, warp speeds, and build times are way too high. Ive always felt like the game would be better if fleets moved around faster. Perhaps this is an opportunity to do that
@here_bedragons
Жыл бұрын
I do like the overall direction of things. However I am sad to see max evasion destroyers go away. It was fun to be able to have a unique ship type that a specific empire type could excel at and be really good at
@braxon
Жыл бұрын
What are your thoughts about using autocannon corvettes to fix brawler and torpedo cruisers at range and soften those ships up for artillery ships.
@4SeasonProducer
Жыл бұрын
1.Use hit and run 2. armor frigates as heavy as possible and put the best possible torpedoes 3. find an enemy heavily focused on battleships and cruisers 4. watch as you slowly chip away battleships after battleship 5. run down the remaining and helpless corvettes with your own ships
@chriswilliams7182
Жыл бұрын
Another idea for strike craft for use against larger ships and starbases is Space marine carrier modules. Launch a wave of landing craft to board the enemy ship and do x damage over time (for x seconds?). Mobile Infantry attacking enemy installations.
@Rob-fq2sd
Жыл бұрын
So: Corvette: Missiles (early to mid) Frigates: Torpedo (early to mid) Destroyers: Picket, Autocannon Cruiser: Torpedo, Disruptors Battleship: Kinetic Artillery I really like your balancing ideas at the end of the video.
@rektanglex
Жыл бұрын
They should make a policy to allow Kamikaze with ships and if enabled then your ships will ram enemies when their fleet power is overwhelming or if manually ordered to
@jameshildebrand907
Жыл бұрын
So far my experience with the new combat rework has been issues with engagement with Fallen Empires. Lower size ship fleets have simply been wiped out requiring higher hull ships just to withstand long enough to cause damage. The new emergency FTL rework has been a large part of the problem and I end up with full fleet wipes more often. My normal play style never involves taking the Super macey tradition, but I've now been taking it for hit&run policy. My main concern has been a forcing of tradition selection for combat effectiveness. Given, this is when I have been facing Fallen Empires and normal empire engagements have not changed too much. I have found that autocannon corvettes are quite effective to rush in, pummel down shields, allowing larger rear ships to then utilize armor/hull defeating weapons more effectively. Likewise as Montu addressed in the video, armor is far more significant than previously. Ultimately it seems early cheesing of Fallen Empires is my only difficult step to overcome as it's hard to resist obtaining that juicy dark matter tech so I can utilize my normal policy of FA&FO with the neighbors.
@marciusnhasty
Жыл бұрын
Unlocking entire Supremacy tradition tree to access military doctrines was bothering me even before this rework. I'm not against the need to unlock entire tradition tree as much against all doctrines being tied to one specific tree. Spreading them out like the federation types would be my suggestion.
@MrWeeseAChine
Жыл бұрын
Fallen empires should be difficult to beat; they are the most advanced civilizations in the galaxy until late game. You shouldn’t be able to just clown them with whatever because you want their shield tech.
@raideurng2508
Жыл бұрын
I've just been going full laser battleships and they tear up pretty much anything.
@kapitankapital6580
Жыл бұрын
I would like to see more variants of strike craft, maybe just fighters and bombers or maybe include interceptors too. Interceptors are best against other strike craft, but have little effect on ships, fighters are strong against bombers and light ships like corvettes, while bombers have lower tracking but higher damage, making them better against larger ships (they could even have the torpedo mechanic of doing more damage the bigger the target). I know it's not a groundbreaking idea, but it's something I'd like to see.
@aapee565
Жыл бұрын
All hail the great algorithm, here is your comment. I've been using this battleship design in single player: - Arc emitter - 2x Hangar - 2x Point defense - 2x Medium Disruptors 50-50 armor and shields, with auxiliary slots being w/e you feel works best against the enemy. I used hardening components, as it felt like the AI could never beat me anyway if they couldn't penetrate my repeatable-buffed shield and armor values. What the ship is meant to do is to just support the Arc emitter as much as possible. Arcs have been a weapon capable of solo-carrying the damage of a battleship ever since 2.0 at least, so using the rest of your slots to fill in gaps can make a very effective jack of all trades that the AI can't counter. Arc emitters can kill literally anything in the game, and with 10 minimum range, they practically don't have one. Point defense allows you to kill torpedo ships without too much trouble. If they are enough torpedoes then you could get overwhelmed, but it isn't like the AI will make a full torpedo cruiser fleet. Strike craft will counter enemy strike craft and counter any corvettes/frigates you may come across. The disruptors don't really have to be there, but I guess they help a little against enemy bruiser/torpedo ships. I assume this design would lose to a full artillery ship, but it would be interesting to see how torpedoes would fare. Would two point defenses per battleships be enough to win.
@BrettStrydom
Жыл бұрын
Please note that you say that at the start of the game, we should consider using the marauder missiles but we won't get that until very much later in the game once we have researched them so the only missiles available at the beginning of the game is Nuclear missiles.
@JiriUlip
Жыл бұрын
I have played some 100 hours in this beta on GA and all crisis types with pretty good results. The backbone of my fleet is battleship with x slot, hangars and pd in the middle and medium in the rear for extra utility and for killing pests which make it close. Yes, You lose some dps, but the survivability is crazy as it shots any torpedoes and fighters on its own. I pair them with lots of torpedo cruisers and some picket destroyers. I also put regen tissue on everything as you can then push all the time repairing while on the way to the next system which is rightfully yours. Despite that I pack above average shielding as psionic admirals have natural shield hardening which is insane. World eater perks are also nothing to scoff at (although in the extreme late game when you have the galaxy under control so you can't be at war with anyone and you still need to fight he crisis it can get pretty expensive). Overall great changes!
@sanguineaurora8765
Жыл бұрын
My idea: Reduce the number of L slots on battleships by 1 or 2 and replace those with other slots. Battleship is historically a weapons platform for all types of stuff. Even the most dedicated battleships in reality and or sci-fi has some amounts of secondary weaponry. Make 1 or 2 L slots on a battleship converted into 2 picket and 1 medium slots, that way battleship alpha builds go down in power but they get new ways to present themselves in an engagement. Also as for making fighters more effective: Make them missile or torpedo carry platforms. They can be split into 2 categories; Interceptors and Strikers. Interceptors fight against enemy fighters and shoot down missiles while doing minimal against enemy ships while Strikers unload a salvo of torpedos or missiles before retreating and being released again. Like a ww2 type bomber/fighter scenario. That would make a full salvo run from a fighter group EEEXTREMELY scary while making them counterable enough. Additionally; a screening type of combat computer can be added to corvettes and frigates specifically. It would make them hold position around your longer ranged ships and specifically target whatever comes close. Give them a freakishly high rate of power increase so that they can annihilate enemy Strikers trying to launch their missiles to your larger ships, that way you can actually roleplay as a carrier strike group, your smaller ships, rather than trying to suicidally engage and circle around the enemy battleships, would stay back and protect your high value targets. This way, if the opponent tries to be smart and forgo the screening duties in favor of more artillery ships, they'll get disintegrated by striker type strike crafts launching torpedos at them
@alistairgrey5089
Жыл бұрын
Simple solution for the fighters fighting in an adjacent system: the ships launching them have a significant cool down before they can launch more. Basically, if a fleet is engaged by the fighters and wins they can go after the carriers with minimal resistance from them.
@zestypigeon2729
Жыл бұрын
So if lasers have no minimum range you can still use a laser stacked battleship only fleet and still have an easy enough time against corvettes. I've traditionally done all laser all armor fleets so my playstyle seems to have gotten buffed (even more so without the neutron launcher stacks to counter armor).
@JB-ue6lf
Жыл бұрын
I just want them to optimize the damn game so there isn’t horrendous late game lag
@G-Fiti
Жыл бұрын
I'm afraid my Like Button filed a restraining order against me, because of all the things that you asked me to do to it. But that won't stop me!
@trentonwoodcox7586
Жыл бұрын
Where the heck are you getting some of this footage? I thought I'd seen all the cinematics, but that footage at 13:00 looks new to me....
@grilledchicken2881
Жыл бұрын
Interesting that you find 3xP destroyer better, basically you're saying a P slot is as valueable as an M slot (in this specific context at least) rather than an S slot how the stern of the ship implies. I've been considering to try 3p destroyers out but always decided to use a gunship bow with a picket stern in the end. Picket weapons have suprisingly high DPS. Do they perform well in direct ship to ship attacks? Of course an autocannon would be stronger, i'm just asking if you get the stated DPS number especially if we compare it to lets say a small laser of equal tech level which often has less DPS (ergo P>S, even if ACs are better than P you can mix them with anti armor PD which beats lasers/plasmas or at least matches them)? As for autocannons, -75% still means 5 points of damage which is less than most weapons but nowhere near to nothing. I think they are absolutely broken, although disruptors are also too strong versus hull modules which are now terribly weak. I like to assume 3000/3000/3000 as a baseline. If my AC does 5 DPS vs the middle but shreds the 2 other thirds then that's still awesome especially since it can be easily supported by very strong anti armor weapons like torpedos and tachyon lances. Not a fan of battleship auras simply because i don't want to juggle even more templates. As for your strike craft idea, maybe we just need map settings that allow us to have larger systems and combat ranges. Right now i build my fleets roughly like this: 4 destroyers (gunship with M laser, 2 AC, 2 Picket) 2-4 cruisers (torpedo+AC, s slot back so i can have 3 aux slots. 2 are afterburners since 3 would make them faster than afterburner destroyers) 1 battleship (artillery, the way you build it) 1 carrier (i seriously considered dropping battleships altogether and replacing them with carriers, they seem to be strong in this meta since it's all about wrecking those ships that carry devastators/AC/disruptors at knife fighting range)
@jaredpearce4244
Жыл бұрын
They've already coded the Hyper Relay networks to not go through Gateways and Wormholes. I don't think that would be a problem to also exclude Fighters from it.
@lordfijor1386
Жыл бұрын
The Meta is a lot more interesting, but I see something coming out here. 2 fleet strikes. 1 fleet for Ship v Ship combat, the other kitted out for Starbase smashing. Possibly allowing for more multi pronged pushes into enemy territory
@dooomninja
Жыл бұрын
another idea to help covets could be tweaking evasion. if the pre-tracking cap is removed (post tracking would still be limited) this would mean you would need specific high tracking weapons to counter covets. because the way percentages work even the tracking from sensors can over double the number of hits (80% will dodge half the hits of 90%). if balanced right covets could be cost effective vs torp/brawler cruisers, so they would need to be countered by dedicated brawlers of carriers.
@EyeOfMagnus4E201
Жыл бұрын
I like the idea of missiles and fighters having longer ranges. They should be able to hit enemy ships at much higher ranges than unguided projectiles or dissipation prone energy weapons. I also think that making plasma weapons brawler weapons as counterpoints to autocannons would be good, as disrupters acting on their own work well, but don’t synergize well with autocannons by not scraping off armor like energy weapons would. Having an energy brawling weapon would be good. Energy artillery weapons might be nice too, but actually just having kinetic artillery might be interesting. I think minimum range is okay mechanically, but conceptually it’s questionable, especially with plasma weapons (though it could be explained with multistage projectiles or guided shells that kick in past a certain range with large or spinal-mounted projectile weapons but not with plasma weapons). Likewise, I understand the mechanics behind torpedoes doing variable damage, but logically any weapon powerful enough to severely damage a cruiser or battleship should vaporize smaller ships. Having combat work mechanically to give smaller ships more longevity later in the game is good, but since Stellaris has many role-playing elements, the mechanics should not be immersion braking, which minimum range borders on and variable damage torpedoes wander into doing.
@metehanunalvesazarkadaslar6300
Жыл бұрын
Hey is this still up-to-date? Gonna get rid of the ancient weapons need late game designs :D
@Alex_FRD
Жыл бұрын
Hopefully the momentum keeps going and we get a ground combat rework, too.
@MontuPlays
Жыл бұрын
Only a fools hope...
@maklommc
Жыл бұрын
I just want ground battle art. Just something to let me know I'm actually fighting xenomorphs or psychics and not just little circles
@Tetley1985
Жыл бұрын
O god just watched your weapons tier list and then this, looks like eveything is on its head!
@hawktangerine405
Жыл бұрын
I really like the idea of pulling fighters from nearby systems. Opens up some skirmish warfare strategies of deploying fighters to harass unprotected starbases on the frontier as well as guerrilla warfare. They would need to be limited in range and have a longer recharge time if used in that way making it vulnerable to counter attack. I don’t think it would be too overpowered since we’re already looking to make point defense a standard in the navy.
@silentjay3272
Жыл бұрын
I’m just finishing up my first 3.6 play through, I really enjoyed the new combat set up.
@UmbralKnight19
Жыл бұрын
Interesting thing is, even though I agree Neutron Launchers have been definitely nerfed, they still *hit* instantly the moment they're fired if they hadn't missed, which means point defense doesn't work on them, unlike missiles. I wonder what the implications of that is exactly.
@CorvusABray
Жыл бұрын
The strategy I always found viable as a jack of all trades was 50/50 split on corvettes with point defense/flak in one slot and the other two with auto cannons OR plasma cannons as two separate classes to strip shields and armor from the enemy fleet. Some torpedos, and cruisers fill out a carrier /screen line. Then a hand full of artillery battleships. with a 100 strong fleet, 40% corvettes, 10% torpedo, 40% cruisers, 10% battleship
@butcherpete2182
Жыл бұрын
The problem with giving Battleship auras is that it causes lag. You can see this with the NSC2 mod which has quite a few auras. I could also see strike craft causing lag if they could jump into adjacent systems like you suggest.
@ryanschmidt3319
Жыл бұрын
The big thing for lag is the population. I don't expect this to be anywhere near as damaging to my pc.
@RyderMCG
Жыл бұрын
@@ryanschmidt3319 well now youll have pop lag AND aura lag enjoy
@victoriasteichen122
Жыл бұрын
I’ve always preferred mixed fleet composition over doomstacking, and I’m glad to see that the new meta supports this. A typical mid game fleet for my synthetic empire consists of 10 FFS (strike corvettes), 10 FFG (torpedo frigates), 5 DDR (picket destroyers), 3 CLS (line light cruisers), 1 CAS (artillery battleship), and 1 CVS (strike carrier). Usually 10-15k fleet power depending on equipment levels. Most engagements with similar powered AI fleets result in a victory and the loss of 1-2 FFS/FFG class ships. The benefit is that I can typically field 5-6 flotillas of this size and each flotilla is sufficiently powered to operate semi independently
@victoriasteichen122
Жыл бұрын
My FFS class; plasma weapon x2, auto cannon x1, crystal infused plating x2, shield x1, regenerative hull, swarm CC
@victoriasteichen122
Жыл бұрын
FFG; disrupter + torp. All other same as FFS, +1 armor, torp CC
@victoriasteichen122
Жыл бұрын
DDR; 2x ea crystal plate, armor, shield. 1x flak, 2x PD, 2x disrupter. Regenerative hull, picket CC
@victoriasteichen122
Жыл бұрын
CLS; Crystal, armor, shield, autocannon x2, plasma x3, M slot missile x 1, regenerative hull, shield capacitor, line CC
@victoriasteichen122
Жыл бұрын
CAS; Kinetic X slot if available / kinetic L slot x2, all else L slot plasma. Crystal, armor, shield. RG hull, artillery computer
@HostageMax
Жыл бұрын
I feel like stormcanons will be better on cruisers, cause torpedo do additional dmg to armor
@aapee565
Жыл бұрын
If you use penetrating weapons, you won't have to do any shield damage to kill enemies whatsoever, as torpedoes ignore shields as well.
@Surgeplus
Жыл бұрын
While this is a little late with Orion being live, I had a thought about strike craft and gateways. It was mentioned that the idea of strike craft using gateways could be a problem by enabling the setup of "megadeath defenses". Simply put, I feel that strike craft cannot be allowed to use gateways. Gateways should require a craft to have certain systems to reinforce their structural durability enough to survive the trip, and strike craft should simply be too small to have those kinds of systems. But they should be allowed to cover the entire system as part of the system defenses. I also feel that energy weapons should have a 25% shorter range (minimum) than missiles and torpedoes (whichever is shorter). Energy dissipates over distance, while projectile weapons keep going as long as their on-board fuel and momentum allows. Just remember to make sure you have a targeting solution or your kinetic rounds will keep flying until they hit some poor shmuck somewhere sometime years or centuries down the line. :p
@jacobe2995
Жыл бұрын
about the Juggernaut if you q up a bunch of ships in it right before combat you can kinda turn them into a sort of uber carrier where enemy ships will keep getting distracted by the small ships it produces. haven't really messed with the idea but the thought came to me while messing around.
@L4sz10
Жыл бұрын
I would like to see capital ships work like, well capitals, command centers that are coordinating battles. I wouldn't solve this by stacking aura though, more like a boost that is "cast" on smaller ships, as a weapon that always hit friendly ship and give them a temporary boost that wears down. The more battleship you have in the fleet, the more ships they could hit with their boost. This could be like extra disengagement chance, increased accuracy, tracking, or evasion, as they are helping the other ships navigate the battle and getting the firing solution. This would make it dependant on fleet size, because an aura would affect every ship in the fleet, a weapon-like "spell" can only affect certain amount of ships so the more ships you need, the more capital ships you need to coordinate. And by taking down enemy capital ships may actually help taking down the smaller ships as more and more ships will lose the bonus they provide.
@zacharypurdue4584
Жыл бұрын
It’s interesting, I use kinetic artillery and Gigacannons on my battleships to drop shields and then plasma armed cruisers with loads of medium slots, battleships drop their shields and then boom the plasma rips their armor and hulls apart. Plus autocannon swarm corvettes to keep pushing
@sithalo
Жыл бұрын
One way they could prevent strike craft gateways swarms is prevent them from being able to use gateways under some lore. Say that the gateway isnt just as easy as walking through a door and that ships below certain sizes have a high chance of being lost in other space. Maybe allow the player to sent a strike fleet through but at with 75-90% loses. I have not played it yet but I like most of what Ive heard so far. That said, I dont like a few things: 1-There should be no frigates. Unless they get their own art model and dont just use the corvette one. But even then, if you make a specific copy paste class for a role then you might as well make a copy paste class for carriers and siegeships. XL weapons should be removed from battleships and should instead be given to a special copy paste siege ship that has the XL slot and maybe a hand full of small turrets. Not bristling with turrest but just a handful of small ones. And carriers should have their own ship class copy paste that packs 6 hangers and the handful of left over slots are pd/missile. Do I think they should really do either of those? No not really (maybe the Seige Cannon one) but they might as well if they are going to be copying the corvette just for a single role. I know what they are doing is hard work but right now this more than anything just sounds lazy. Admittedly there are some unused corvette models iirc. So they could scale those up and add some not so exact same (but still pretty exact same) 2-Torpedos should not do more damage the bigger the ship class. Now if it was a gravity torpedo or gravity beam or something relating to gravity or mass or something then sure. Then it becomes a really cool idea. But a normal weapon dealing extra damage just because the ship is bigger is a bad idea... There isnt really any reasonable reason that the current weapon deals more damage. Thats a very gamey mechanic. Like how in normal strategy games when a rocket launcher or tank fire at an infantry unit and the soldier just fires back with its rifle. 2.5 The minimum range thing is another wierd one. Honestly if the ship is closer it should be easier to hit. Lasers being able to target ships right ontop of them but Kinetics not being able to makes no sense. Just like with the Torpedo thing feeling gamey this just makes it feel even more gamey. There isnt a reason for it other than paradox needs an easy way to make mixed fleets a thing. Dont get me wrong, I know its a game. And I love the game, that doesnt mean I gotta agree with all their changes. Hopefully these are all stats that modders can tweak. But you never know with them. They could have left the various FTLS in the game and let modders play with them still but they ripped it from the code. 3-Torpedos should act like missiles. Idk if that is a change they have done or not, but torpedos being hitscan is also really stupid. I personally think all non-laser weapon types should be projectile based not hitscan but at the very least Torpedos certainly should be. Unrelated but one thing I think that would vastly improve combat is if they added ammo to weapons. Not like ammo in the sense that you have to keep supplying your ships with ammo but something where Autocannons have 30 ammo and fire 3 rounds a day and take 4 days to reload. Or where a normal mass driver holds 8 rounds, fires 1 round every 2 day and takes 6 to reload. Mechanically it would allow new weapon types. You could have a burst fire weapons that fire off 3 shots in quick succession and then has to reload or actual proper multimissile launchers (the swarm missile is not a good solution). If PD had ammo/charge capacity, then missiles would be able to stay viable. Burst launched missiles could overwhelm pd during its down time. Sure if you launch 6 and 5 get destroyed thats not great but it still makes missiles more viable than launching 6 and having 6 get destroyed. Most importantly I think it would make battles more pleasing to look at. Instead of a near constant stream of fire. 4 isnt really a balance thing outside of the PD. I just think that doing such would add to the variety of weapon types and to the look of combat. Sure you could sorta make the look of a burst fire weapon with particle effect sorta but it wouldnt look great and would not work with missiles. It would be better to just to make one particle effect/projectile and have the game fire off the effect/projectile 3 times in quick succession.
@owensmith2995
Жыл бұрын
What if we got new types of strike craft instead of just increasing range? The different types could do very different things as well. For instance I think it could be solved with 3 types Interceptors: attsck anything in the system, fastest fastest speed, bonus against attacking other strike craft and similar dps to normal strike craft against larger ships. Bombers: mid range slowest flight speed bonus against attacking ships depending on ship size similar to torpedoes but not good against other strike craft. Scout: mid range, mid flight speed, mid damage, bonus tracking and accuracy against missiles and torpedoes, and adds +1 detection radius to the fleet. Each slot fills a unique role and so it encourages you to have a mix in your fleet. If you bring an all bomber fleet and enemy has all interceptors their interceptors are going to be able to do some stuff to your ships still, while your bombers do next to nothing. Idk just a thought maybe it’s making the game over complicated however I think it would be enjoyable
@fluets5658
Жыл бұрын
I think that the only issue with the starfighters ideas that Montu has had here is how, once in combat, you essentially lose control of your fleet until one side retreats or is destroyed. Perhaps if starfighters still brought up the combat menu, but didn't prevent the other person from giving orders to their fleet it would work super well!
@brunopizutti3783
Жыл бұрын
One thing occured to me when you mentioned that the juggernaut is able to repair as if it was a shipyard: supply lines If there is one thing that is VITAL for any kind of war (but most importantly for the long lasting ones) is a constant supply line to keep a military force operational. So, imagine that if instead of having a massive flying shipyard, all you’d need to repair and maintain your stuff is a unimpeded hyperlane from your fleet to your territory, but in the other hand, if u dont have such thing, your fleet would suffer more due to attrition and for being stranded, and i wouldn’t even need a micromanage system, just something that works like the migration and comercial routes work (imagination and numbers) and you would have a more realistic approach on war attrition, logistics, etc. Perhaps this was already stated by someone or taken in consideration by the devs, but still, i leave this comment here expecting to help this game to evolve
@elbalerto
Жыл бұрын
Have you ever noticed brawler fleets 'death-spiraling?' In my testing, corvettes/frigates with short-ranged weapons tend to whirl around in empty space when pursuing ships that have artillery/carrier ai. One second my torpedo frigates are chewing up battleships, the next they just spiral around instead of actually attacking enemy fleets
@bisman
Жыл бұрын
ye, you need to save close the game and restart to remove this bug
@chrisdupuis2523
Жыл бұрын
This honestly sounds like my "star destroyer" type of battleships will be more effective. I arm them with: 2(L) Kinetic Artillery 2 Point Defense 2 Strike Craft 2(S) Auto Cannon 2(M) Plasma Cannon 2 Armor, 4 shields, Carrier Computer, Regenerative Hull Tissue, and Targeting Computer (whatever it's called). I basically designed them with the intention of being able to competently engage any opponent at any range, they only lose in a 1v1 with pure artillery battleships. They can "take on their weight" against anything else. Add a Titan, some artillery battleships, and fill the rest out with picket destroyers and corvettes, and you've got a fleet that can usually engage multiple enemy fleets back to back with very few casualties. I'll usually run 1 titan, 10 artillery battleships, 10 battleships as described above, 20 picket destroyers, and 20 corvettes, it comes out to 236 fleet power. *One note though is against awakened empires and end game crisis you will be constantly replacing corvettes and destroyers.
@andriyvasilchenko3783
Жыл бұрын
I have one question. Let's assume that we talk only about corvette ships. I hear often that point and flack defense is weaker compared to simple laser or railgun. But actually, they are not, in the early stage of the game they do better damage up to Lazer/railgun level 3 or higher. Only Level 3 kinetics or laser are better than the basic point of flacks, especially flacks as it is very difficult to find other kinetic level 3 weapons in early game, because there are other priorities especially if you play ring, habitats, or you are blocked without a good amount of habitable planets and you need specific engineering targets in research but not a rail guns. Am I right? Can you advise also how to make weapon tests somewhere for ships?
@absie6287
Жыл бұрын
Missiles have travel time and can be shot down, they're your ideal short range weapon! Plus, missiles ignore shields and do bonus damage to armour! You need to swap out the artillery stern on the battleships too, the one with 2 M slots also has a third A slot, and a whirlwind missile & auto cannon combo works to mitigate their short range vulnerability. I've taken to a late game fleet mix of: 10 carrier battleships (not artillery stern) 10 artillery battleships (not artillery stern) 20 anti-missile picket destroyers 1 titan with the tracking aura And as many neutron & missile frigates as will fit
@dzzykzzy8683
Жыл бұрын
It's about time disruptors became useful. Felt like such a waste of a research slot for years now.
@urnad12345
Жыл бұрын
@montuplays you mentioned that you thought battleships should have auras to increase their value, I have a bit of a spin off idea instead. What about adding electronic warfare? It could be a fleet wide number which stacks based on the sizes of ship in your fleet, with small ships adding to the number less than large ships. It could be compared to an enemy fleet, with a number of say 200 cancelling out an enemy fleets 220 and leaving their capability at only an advantage of 20. This could then lead to various other buffs, and intel or society research along with alliances and ethic choices could all play a role in the types of enemy debuffs or fleet buffs this stat could provide. It could be simple to code, simple to add, and put an extra layer into the game that wouldn’t add much headache or extra thought. I have a bunch of ideas around this concept if you’re into the idea, but I’d be especially curious to hear some of your thoughts on this.
@marsar1775
Жыл бұрын
im playing on console, so im an update nd a few dlcs behind. what shipset re you using for this video?
@johnl9763
Жыл бұрын
The counter for Carrier Fighters in other systems is simple, the Quantum Catapult. Launch your fleet behind the Fighter screen and kill the Carriers before their fighters can return.
@Lunatic410
Жыл бұрын
I love carriers and really wish they had a substantial role in the game. I think system wide engagement range is an extremely good idea, but I think letting them engage 1 system away is a bad idea (think it would be far too problematic). I like to think of fighters as your standard TIE fighters, no light speed for you! lol - but yeah, I think your system wide engagement idea is brilliant.
@diveheadfirst01
Жыл бұрын
What I think needs to happen is they add more dimensions to the fight. Instead of just guns playing at your advantage, what about the ability to get away or hide the fleet? Cloaking techs for Corvette and frigates that can only be detected by special armaments for say destroyers? Then corvettes could be like endgame ambush predator ships and quickly run away when in danger basically requiring the enemy to have to stop and gain intel on systems before just bulldozing their way through systems. Or have special armaments for the frigates that allow them to disrupt and add hexes on your foes such as less sublight speed or evasion making it easier to target and shoot down enemy ships. Like a gravity well that prevents enemies from retreating? Or a EMP pulse gun that targets singular ships to disables enemy shields, disrupts enemy lasers and weapons and basically could cripple a ship out of the fight? Idk I just want more tactical options rather than blind charging to my enemies. I want to lay a trap and sow confusion and frustration to my opponents. I mean it would be nice for a systems intel level to matter more than just “oh looks like you have a fleet there”
@robjohnson3095
Жыл бұрын
Have missile range increase according to tech level. Say scaling range, tech 1 missile = 100 range, tech 5 = 300 range or even 500 throw in the super long engagement of fighter craft as well, and there would be a realistic extreme engagement range battle phase before the artillery phase and then brawling phase
@TheRewasder97
Жыл бұрын
I think we need a change in the Supremacy tradition. In fact, it should be replaced for a few exclusive between them fleet doctrines. Same with Unyielding, it should be exclusive with them. Should we focus on defence(unyielding)? Carriers(spacecraft carriers)? Big Ships(fleet in being)? Small ships(trade interdiction)? Names come from the naval doctrines of HOI4, but it's just that, or similar. I think that having just a Fleet tradition and 4 policies is kinda lacking, plus you can swap them, so not very diverse there. With this excluding traditions you would be able to use any ship clas all along the game. But don't make it just "Corvette tradition", "Cruiser tradition" or the like, but make traditions that give bonuses that make sense and have an actual philosophy behind them. Maybe the Fleet in Being "Big Ship" tradition could give better point defence for smaller ships, for example. Maybe so that the Small ships tradition is not such a clear choice for the short, early campaigns, the Big ship tradition could give you a "Dreadnought" class, which would be halfway between a cruiser and a Battleship, but being worse than both, as a way to have a heavy hull early on. Make it slow to build and move, expensive but powerfull with many small slots, some picket, a size 6. So the early size 20 fleet could be 3 of them and a couple of point defence corvettes. And to make the small ship tradition viable late game too, give them tons of evasion, over 100%, to counter tracking. Make them need to invest heavily in small weapons and high tracking. They could also give new ship components, like the carrier tradition could give a carrier component to smaller ships and give bigger hangars for ships that already have them. Make it so that every tradition is op at their thing, but is made lacking at other things. Like the carrier tradition would give you gigantic ammounts of strikecraft, but it would be hard countered by point defence, but not just any point defence. You would need to be investing very heavily for point defence to counter it, leaving you with very few normal weapons to counter theirs. TLDR, give us the way to focus in a playstile that feels strong and rewarding in its own right, and it's different from the others.
@odycz
Жыл бұрын
They should add one more stat. Projectile speed. Which should determine max range where tracking can be applied.
@sylvie_v2939
Жыл бұрын
@Montu: Slight correction. They will attack with the SHORTEST range using Swarm configuration and some other targeting computers (once those are researched). They will attempt to use the LONGEST RANGE weapon (backing up if needed - though faster ships will always close the distance) Can energy torpedos still be shoitdown? Are there any ship components, hulls, sections, defenses, or starbase components that have little to no use in the meta? What should I focus on research-wise in single player / FFA for all-arounder survivability? What do you think of hardening? What do you think of neutron launchers if the enemy has a lot of point defense? Possibly even 10% point defense in their citadels using 1:10 ratio defense platforms (of two different types)? What should I even put on defense platforms? Are titans and ion cannons even useful in the new meta? For missile changes - instead of getting, say, 200 range all-at-once, maybe they (and to some extent level 2 and 3 strike craft perhaps) get more range; starting at their current values; but keeping their advantage over artillery. Do you think strike craft problem is related to the combat computer not being useful (adding engagement range)? Do you think there should be a dedicated escort carriers, strike carriers or full carriers like anything that NSC does?
@Kingfisher_2376
Жыл бұрын
Sorry to butt in but I think I have a couple answers that might help. Particle Launchers are still mostly the same, behavior wise: Hit scanned energy weapons (thus immune to PD) that work their way through all three layers of health. That's why, I think, the "E. Torpedo" role falls so far behind: Neutron Launchers can depend on their +50%/+75% damage modifiers to armor and hull but need kinetics to work through shields first. Even against a Battleship, the size multiply only barely brings its damage back up to Medium-weapon levels (15.12 average daily). As for Strike Craft: I suspect a big issue is that they spend so much time fighting each other, rather than attacking ships. On balance, it takes on Advanced Strike Craft an average of 5 days to shoot down another Advanced Strike Craft while it takes a Carrier only one day to replace it. Flak seems to help, but not all that much. This means you would need to outproduce Strike Craft more than 5 to 1 simply to start dealing damage, at which point, you'd probably be better off using Devastators and Artillery to shoot down the Carriers. Obvious Disclaimer though: I'm an XBox player, so these conclusions are based on observations of other players and educated guesses.
@sylvie_v2939
Жыл бұрын
@@Kingfisher_2376 this reply doesn't seem to be placed on the right topic
@sylvie_v2939
Жыл бұрын
@@Kingfisher_2376 I agree carriers are underwhelming, and because they spend so much time fighting other fighters, I'm not sure the fix - maybe cap the number of replacements in a single engagement? And they need to be able to launch their fighters earlier. I did mention the combat computer (carrier CC) but don't know if it's worth losing the other bonuses, and suggest maybe they might want to split the "AI role" of such into configurable behaviors separate from the CC's bonuses.
@Kingfisher_2376
Жыл бұрын
@@sylvie_v2939 Sorry if I was a bit excessive/unhelpful. I was replying to your questions regarding PD against Neutron Launchers and "useless Carrier computer" (ie: Carrier CPU still reads as useless, -but I suspect Montu used Artillery CC given the build he showed- ) (Correction: Upon rewatching, Montu did use Carrier computer). I lean more toward reducing Strike Craft hull/survivability. If they actually died on a daily basis, it might be worth it to try and overwhelm the enemy Carriers' spawn rates with more Strike Craft or Flak.
@grammaton3773
Жыл бұрын
Very important question: Can you actualy build full shield/armor bypass fleet? Because if you cant, bypass weapons would be completely useless. If you trade aprox. 40% of dmg for ability to bypass while another ship in your fleet chew all those shields and armor your first ship bypasses, you are on aprox. 80% of possible total dmg (60%+100%/2) and you kill those shields and armor anyway.
@Rain4est1337
Жыл бұрын
In a way in like the way corvettes get phased our for fleet combat. Early game: corvettes carry you Mid game: corvettes repurposed to patrolling trade routes
@zamba136
Жыл бұрын
Armor Hardening is the bane of my existence, with my Disruptor/Cloud Lightning/Arc Emitter/Missiles/Torpedoes/Fighters playstyle.
@JaySwag77
Жыл бұрын
I wish I had found this video earlier, I've been watching some of your older videos and thinking, this isn't how things are going in my current game!
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