I suggest watching our latest video (published today) where we talk about power output during functional workouts such as Cindy. 👍
@BruceDouglass
Ай бұрын
Thanks - this is an interesting summary However, I don't understand your advice for determining FTP with continuous exercises such as push ups, pull ups and air squats, because you have to monitor the power output to determine power. How do you determine the power being generated when doing pushups or air squats. It's fairly easy with cycling and even running, but it is far less obvious with the circuit training activities you propose. Nevertheless, I appreciated the distinction between measuring FTP for strength vs endurance athletes, and the recommendations for % of FTP to use for VO2 max training. Now that you've covered the individual workout for improving VO2 max, I would be interested if you would address in a future video how many of these workouts should be done as part of a training program. Current philosophy appears to be the 80-20 Z2/Z4 training split, but this was arrived at by noticing what elite athletes tend to do. The problem with applying that universally is that elite athletes have a huge volume (20-30 hrs/week) and this split may be necessitated to give those athletes adequate recovery time. It isn't obvious that the same split is optimal for athletes with much lower volumes, such as 5 -10 hours/week. It seems entirely plausible that with lower overall training volume that a higher percentage of high intensity work might be better. I've not been able to find much in the literature addressing this specific concern though. - Just a thought 🙂
@firehorseweddingphotograph3995
Ай бұрын
As someone who trains 8.5-10 hours per week and has been following 80:20 in favour of Zone 2…and experienced my overall fitness go backwards by following ‘The Science’, I have gone back to a 50:50 split and expect to start seeing improvements again. So many variables, but high volume Zone 2 isn’t working for me.
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Bruce you are touching on the points I am exactly thinking about. 1. You are correct, power output during functional movement is hard to assess. But two things on that. I will be releasing a video in 2-ish weeks where I explain the function of a new wearable that can accurately estimate the power output during functional movements. I first did an FTP test on the rower, then did a 'FTP' using functional movement and the wattage during BOTH modalities (row and functional) was EXACTLY the same. I am pretty excited about this device and software - stay tuned for that. Secondly on that point, even if you do not know your exact power output while doing cindy for instance, it can be beneficial to know your rounds and reps during such a 20 min effort. As this is a good estimation of your FTP, you can start progressively overloading and retesting to better understand of your training is enhancing your 'functional' cardiovascular system, given there is no muscular fatigue during the movements. 2. You are entirely correct. There is nothing magical about zone 2. It is just a simple method to accumulate more training volume without getting overly fatigued. If you train
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Makes sense.
@Nehpets1701G
21 күн бұрын
Really helpful video - thanks for sharing your knowledge 👍
@wod-science
21 күн бұрын
Pleasure!
@bodekreis
Ай бұрын
Thanks for the nice explanation! In Cycling sport the 20min FTP test is still a common thing. But the determination of individual FTP is difficult with using just the 95% rule. Another test protocol used is critical power. Where you use 2 or 3 different all out test of different time domains. With this approach, the individual anaerobic capacity's can be respected. A time trial of 4-5minutes is good to determine power at VO2 max. And a longer timetrial from minimum 10-12 minutes. And with this 2 tests the critical power can be calculated. This test protocols are also used for remote diagnostics like Inscyd or Aerotune.
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Cool, thanks. Yes, we have done critical power test in CrossFit athletes (pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/38849121/). Did not hear yet about the comparison of a 3 min test vs. 12 min test. Will look into it.
@DrJoeSarti
25 күн бұрын
Fantastic!
@matheuscabral2202
Ай бұрын
Very nice video!! Using Training Peaks as a source was also a great move. Their TSS metrics and also the articles are very very useful for endurance athletes training!! Great content
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Appreciate that
@ulf.
Ай бұрын
What to measure for the 20min Cindy Test? HR with a chest strap? People could use RPE/RIR instead of a fixed number of reps. For example break/stop when you feel RIR=1 what includes bad movement quality (technical failure), e.g. break plank during push-up, imbalanced foot pressure during air squat, no squeezed shoulder blades during pull-up. AMRAP20 - unbroken squat pattern till RIR=1 - unbroken push pattern till RIR=1 - unbroken pull pattern till RIR=1 The stations must be close together to minimize transitions.
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Yeah, a possibility, but not easy to implement for not-super-advanced-atheltes. Very hard to know your RIR during a WOD when you are working close to muscular AND cardiovascular fatigue. I have a video coming up next week showcasing a device that can estimate power output DURING functional movements. Highly interesting, curious what you'll think about it.
@gerym341
Ай бұрын
Thank you for your advice. It's very much appreciated.
@SuperDonBest
Ай бұрын
Very useful information 👍 Thank you.
@rycohen22
26 күн бұрын
Hey Doc! Great video and content, as usual! During the 4min intervals, aiming to hit 110-120% of the FTP, should we be worried about the HR zone we are into? or is it keeping the power output at the recommended % what dictates HR? Ill give you the data of my first session trying this protocol. On a separate day, I did my 8min ON, rest 8min ON FTP test on the echo bike. The FTP (test wattage - 5%) was around 190watts (they were not max efforts, I finished both 8min intervals @ ~175 bpm. Male, 31 YO, 1.85m, 105kg, body fat between 25-30%) 110-120% of the FTP is 209 to 229 watts. I did 4 min ON, 4min OFF, 5 rounds on the Echo bike 2 days after the test. The rounds results were: 1: avg 204 watts @ 151bpm 2: avg 222 watts @ 163bpm 3: avg 230 watts @ 172bpm 4: avg 230 watts @ 174bpm 5: avg 230 watts @ 175bpm The above bpms were noted after the end of each 4min interval (so, maximum HR reached) That averages to 223 watts across intervals. During the rest periods, HR dropped to around 100bpm after the first 2 intervals, and to 110bpm after intervals 3-5. Was this an ok attempt? Sorry for so many data and such a big wall of text 😅 I appreciate your kind attention and thanks for the help and the content you put up here, its pure gold!
@wod-science
21 күн бұрын
Great breakdown. This looks great. No, HR is not the key variable here, WATTS are. How was the RPE on a scale from 1-10, I bet it was not 10 given the fact you could do all intervals.
@rycohen22
12 күн бұрын
@wod-science thanks very much!! Yeah, I'd say the RPE was between 7.5 and 8.5. Intervals 1 and 2 were ok, 3 to 5 got tough. Since you said in the video it was supposed to be hard, I thought it should have been harder 😅 The recovery time was just right to go again, with enough juice to hit the rpms for 4mins. Can we mix Ergs on the same session? Like 2 intervals on the echo bike and 3 on the rower, or like 2 echo 2 row 2 ski (i know this adds up to one extra round 😅). Thanks very much once again!
@matheuscabral2202
Ай бұрын
Joe Friel’s updated the standard 20 min. all out test actually. On the Training Peaks arcticle he wrote, he says to do a 30 min. time-trial like effort (on a uniform manner - not starting too hard and getting significantly weaker), then discard the first ten minutes of the effort, the remaining 20 minutes average power should represent your FTP. The more times you do this test, the more accurate your FTP will become, for you will learn the way to reproduce the test in a more uniform manner. :D
@ulf.
Ай бұрын
longer trials make more sense for endurance people who are on a higher level. I'm not doing much cardio (but mainly maximum strength, explosive strength, some CrossFit and the shorter the better). 2k row is "cardio" in my brain (~7-8min). 5k is basically a punishment (~20-24min). Doing 30 minutes or 60 minutes wouldn't make sense for people struggling with these time domains. For real endurance athletes it would be too short.
@brum293
Ай бұрын
@@ulf. No the 30 min time trial test is still the better test. Sure a crossfiter that’s not a doing a lot of endurance will probably score low. But the point is to estimate MLSS, not try to find an easier test that is further away from the truth. It’s the same with 1 rep max strength testing where you do 1 rep max and not like 10 rep max…
@ulf.
Ай бұрын
@@brum293 I prefer an easier way to test. Aren't the intervals the actual training lateron? This FTP tests are just to get a reference value, and not the training itself.
@brum293
Ай бұрын
@@ulf. What are you looking to get out of it? What are your goals? How are you going to prescribe training based on the test?
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Interesting, did not read that one yet.
@Vic_BelGa
Ай бұрын
Let’s say that an athlete performs 20 rounds on Cindy, his “FTP” would be 90% of 20 rounds = 18 rounds or 0,9 rounds per minute; makes sense? In this case, 4 x 5 min at 110 % of 0,9 round per minute equals to 0,99 rounds per minute, any suggestions? Thanks in advance 😊
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Yes, that would be a good way to structure it indeed. I have a video sceduled for next week Tuesday showing a device that can estimate (accurately) power production during functional movements. Stay tuned for that one.
@gokuryu
Ай бұрын
I use the Norwegian intervals with 4min of work with 3 minutes rest repeated 4 times.
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Jep, and at which intensity (threshold or rather VO2max)?
@xm002007
27 күн бұрын
How is this different compared to the oxygen utilisation training you mentioned before? That was a sprint workout with 1:10 work to rest ratio. Is that no longer recommended?
@wod-science
21 күн бұрын
It is. That video was more to make the distinction between delivery and utilization limited atheltes and hence to fine-tune training. The method explained in this video is for a more general population to simply improve VO2max and overall fitness (when you do not know whether or not you're delivery / utilization limited)
@xm002007
20 күн бұрын
@@wod-science 🙏🏻 thank you
@basketberoende
28 күн бұрын
I did the 2x8 min on the row. Got an avg of 315w on the first internal and 295w on the second Would you say that is close enough?
@wod-science
21 күн бұрын
Yes, that is very good capacity. Something we see in semi-final, even Games atheltes.
@ulf.
Ай бұрын
What interval ranges would be ok for training besides 5x 4/4min? Is 3/3 or 2/2 too short? What would be too long?
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Everything above 2 min and probably below 6 min (depending on how advanced / trained you are).
@danniseliger5172
Ай бұрын
So as someone leaning more towards strength I should work at 110% of the 90%😅
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
Same :)
@wod-science
Ай бұрын
'Leaning towards strength'... Nice way of saying you should work on your cardio :)
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