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@bubblesofthecoast6393
Жыл бұрын
3:46 Actually just learned this in-class. Basically, due to the design of the wing, the vortices generated by it allow delta wings can generate a lot of lift in quick bursts, but this same lift generation also generates a lot of drag. Generally speaking, drag expands exponentially faster than lift, so when an airfoil generates a lot of lift very fast, it generates drag even faster, resulting in delta wings retaining their energy worse than a more conventional airframe. Hope I simplified this enough
@matthewredman7814
Жыл бұрын
Yeah it's why gliders have insane amounts of lift but cant go fast. More lift=more drag
@bubblesofthecoast6393
Жыл бұрын
@@matthewredman7814 Exactly, you got it
@plat216
Жыл бұрын
Not exactly, drag doesn't "expand exponentially faster than lift, " not for regular airfoils that aren't stalling It's more practical to model lift and drag coefficients as functions of angle of attack, and when graphed, it becomes clear that although the rate of change of the lift coefficient is greater than that of the rate of change of the drag coefficient initially, as the angle of attack increases (usually approaching a critical value like stall/flow separation), the drag coefficient will begin to overtake the lift coefficient; another very informative way of analyzing lift, drag, and AoA, is the lift-to-drag ratio as a function of angle of attack given constant velocity, which tends to be greater than 1 initially but then decrease as AoA increases (and then it might increase again but we don't talk about that because no one flies at 155 degree aoa) it depends on the shape of the airfoil, but that is generally the case And because of this, planes are flown with small AoA, optimizing lift-drag efficiency delta wings are not like ordinary airfoils, they instead rely on flow separation and vortex formation over the top surface of the wing, creating a region of low pressure, to generate lift at extreme AoA, and at near 0 AoA, the wing barely generates any but like i said before, at such AoA, the drag coefficient tend to be pretty high so in any attempt to maneuver, a delta wing aircraft will sacrifice relative large amounts of kinetic energy to drag due to the high AoA nature of its maneuvers
@bubblesofthecoast6393
Жыл бұрын
@@plat216 Yea, if you get into the nitty gritty that is the case; thanks for deeper dive into it. I just really kept it simple cause I wasn’t sure how deep I could get into it before confusing people. Only mentioned that drag increases exponentially compared to lift due to the induced drag coefficient equation, which doesn’t account for the friction and separation drag, but it is correct thst lift starts off higher than drag, or else planes wouldn’t really be able to go anywhere efficiently, and a lot of factors go into it, such as airfoil shape, both for the cross-section and wing type (elliptical wings being the best and tapered wings being not as efficient but easier to manufacture), and altitude to name a few off the top of my head. Did I miss anything or make any errors in this statement, plat?
@josecoronadonieto6911
5 ай бұрын
@@bubblesofthecoast6393 Now we will never know
@RIGAUX_
Жыл бұрын
Every update i swear, gaijin just dumps on French mains
@badapple2221
Жыл бұрын
And it really hurts all the time...
@floh3r
Жыл бұрын
Honestly being a “main” of a small nation ingame is kinda dumb. I mean only the big 3 get Love and we all know that for at least a couple of years now…
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
France has joined Britain in the suffer box
@badapple2221
Жыл бұрын
@@Spitflyer At least britain has vehicles lmao
@brooklyn4k759
Жыл бұрын
SO TRUE!!! That’s why you guys are getting the most modern fighter jet this update right?
@ommsterlitz1805
Жыл бұрын
Mirage III E and C had a similar flight model as the Kfir but it got nerfed as it's the tradition for vehicles in France tech tree. France is only for masochists or people that want to buy all premiums as it have few playable vehicles at their own tier and a destroyed economy. Delta wings are not a permanent airbrake like warthunder is portraying and there is countless Mirage III videos out there to show it do insane low and high speed turn even some with hardpoints showing it's not the whale they made it to be in this game.
@diprosla592
Жыл бұрын
J35D is also suffering from the nerf of its manevourability in mouse aim mode
@VerdigrisTrees
Жыл бұрын
Ehh, call me a masochist but I've loved the challenging playstyles and quirky vehicles of France, and I've never used a premium to grind (only the Yak for SL)
@thomasmacdonough288
Жыл бұрын
Idk France still has a lot of good fighters, ie Jag, Etendard, Mystere, but yeah the Mirages super disappointing
@VerdigrisTrees
Жыл бұрын
@@thomasmacdonough288 I'm with you but please don't call the Jag a good fighter it's an actual brick
@thomasmacdonough288
Жыл бұрын
@@VerdigrisTrees Idk about that man between the GR.1A, GR.1 and E I have 279 kills to 153 deaths, and on the E alone I have 99 kills to 27 deaths with a 61% winrate Ik K/D isn't the best determiner for a plane's quality but when the gap is that big I feel like it has to speak to something about the Jaguar's ability to fight
@Bullet4MyEnemy
Жыл бұрын
Whilst you still have energy, use it to climb, if you have altitude you can dive to get speed back allowing you to use your superior instantaneous turn to better counter adversaries with better sustained turn rates. If you flat turn you’ll just bleed all your speed and still need to dive to get it back, eventually running out of alt, so it’s unsustainable. Mirage is a classic one circle fighter, MiG-19 is a classic two circle fighter. You need to keep turning into his turn, creating high aspect shot situations; because you can flick your nose around much better. He needs to turn away from your nose to get behind you, for low aspect shots, because his AOA is much worse.
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
My biggest problem was starting off that dogfight on equal terms
@vizender
Жыл бұрын
I really feel like French delta wings are not modeled correctly. They lose speed in high AOA maneuvers, but they don’t seem to get the lift they should have, making them literal buses that does not turn. They should be able to turn much more when doing those high AOA maneuvers at 600-900kph, and yet they don’t. But they do have huge drag, so all the negatives with few of the benefits
@Hunting_Party
Жыл бұрын
14:29 the magic has a 1.5 second fuse timer iirc. You fired too close and the missile simply won’t proxy.
@collander7766
Жыл бұрын
1.8 seconds actually, compared to every other missile's 0.5 seconds. That shot still should have been within proxy range tho
@Hunting_Party
Жыл бұрын
@@collander7766 I thought it’s 1.8 motor burning and 1.5 fuse timer. Which means that you have a short window of effective range, especially since the drag change that limits the range of missile when the motor burns out.
@collander7766
Жыл бұрын
@@Hunting_Party the booster is 2 seconds, the proximity fuse delay is 1.8 seconds.
@tino6176
10 ай бұрын
I don't know if they made some changes after this video was released, but I just got to 12.0 in the French air tree and so far the Mirage IIIE has been my absolute favourite plane in the tree, and it shows in the stats. 68% wins and K/D ratio around 2.3. Maybe it just fits my playstyle.
@milanvnuk
11 ай бұрын
I love this plane, I have opened it on the first day of 11th aniversary and imidiately bough talisman on it. 4 days later I opened Mirage 20005f😊
@bootstraspbill
7 ай бұрын
Bro i lost a turn fight to a Su-25 with this plane, thats how bad it is!
@balthasargelt4075
Жыл бұрын
As much as I love this plane, its not the best 10.3 by a mile, however its very good in the right hands imo
@kilo7880
Жыл бұрын
It’s a monster, and one of my favorites. At 10.3 it can consistently reach Mach 1.1 on the deck
@PvtPartzz
Жыл бұрын
You didn’t win the dogfight at 16:17 because he went horizontal. You won it because he reversed in front of you multiple times for no reason.
@slobroold8664
Жыл бұрын
This is my most played vehicle in warthunder, I always thought it was a very good but the more I think about other vehicles at the br this one actually requires a brain unlike the mig21 smt or f5c where you just place your mouse on the enemy and win. With the repair cost changes, the premium spam, and the fact that the f5c simply hard counters you I’ve dropped the game.
@codyfox2876
Жыл бұрын
"unremarkable and frustrating" - gets multiple aces in it. Yeah, sure the Mirage 3E is not as dominant as it once was given the all aspect missiles being added to other planes at its BR, but it is still quite capable at 10.3. It's an exceptionally good support fighter. Don't try to be super aggressive with it. That's just the role Gaijin has given to all French jets. Maybe that'll change once we get the MICA, but until then you have to fly all of them like that.
@samk7974
Жыл бұрын
Cold hard facts.
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
This is one of the things I have tried to articulate (perhaps poorly) in the video. It's definitely not meant to get down and dirty and almost needs the team around to do well (first game shows that nicely).
@Hunting_Party
Жыл бұрын
@@Spitflyer there are planes that you can get good results with simply because “it’s at 9.3-10.3 with missile and flares”. Doesn’t mean you will have fun doing it. The mirage is a perfect example.
@jaek__
Жыл бұрын
@@Hunting_Party F-5E, MIG-21SMT, F-8E, are the most fun I've had in a long time in War Thunder.
@Froggmeningreen
Жыл бұрын
So "exceptional' that almost nobody plays it nowadays.
@bobybot9320
Жыл бұрын
This is libel, i grinded the entire high tier french air force with this, mostly feeding off A10s and SU25s, but even against more serious opponents, it's a good plane.
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
Sure you can farm attackers but if you come up against anything that can climb or dogfight (or both) you’re a sitting duck regardless of the situation. Imo this is the weakest 10.3 plane and that’s what the video is about
@bobybot9320
Жыл бұрын
@@Spitflyer Agreed that it isn't a dominant fighter, but with how the meta was a few months ago, 2 great missiles 1 meh fat IR 550 and good positioning netted me a good survival rate with 2-3 kills per game
@Donut833
Жыл бұрын
Hey Spit, I know you’ve spoken on Gaijins business decisions before. Could you do it again? The community is really fired up at gaijin and the more people talking about it the better. Thanks in advance.
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
Video soon
@Donut833
Жыл бұрын
@@Spitflyer Thanks!
@admiralgeneralaladeen1851
Жыл бұрын
hey spit, just wondering how you got your afterburner to look like that, it looks absolutely sick but i cant find anything online about new effects
@bdub1682
Жыл бұрын
User skins can change afterburner colors There is a new afterburner effect coming but it's not that
@lukigensfm
Жыл бұрын
its the RAAF market skin
@TheAmazingCowpig
Жыл бұрын
This is a plane that had its day in the limelight when it first released, and hasn't since. It's just suffered from more competitive planes coming out. Back in the day, its competitors were the F-4E and MiG-21 SMT, and the SMT did not have R-60s yet. The Magic I was a game-changer for IR missiles, it was incredibly maneuverable for the day, when the next best thing was like... an AIM-9J. It was a missile that you could throw at an enemy in an actual dogfight and expect it to hit, without needing to be as careful as a 9J by comparison. The radar Matra was equally potent because many targets did not have chaff, or even RWR, and was good for reliable head-on kills at the start of the match.
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
I think you're talking about the IIIC. The IIIE entered the game when the F-4E dominated. It always curbstomped the IIIE but the IIIC could hold on
@TheAmazingCowpig
Жыл бұрын
@@Spitflyer Well, true, actually, but IIIE had one big improvement over the IIIC, at least in my opinion: actually having countermeasures, which added just that much more survivability in battles.
@RyzawaVT
Жыл бұрын
This thing's FM is one of those models that are clearly off and yet have somehow been that way for a long time. Sadly won't be the last vehicle under-performing for an obnoxious amount of time. I think IcePotato, the 15km su-7 was a bot account, I notice bot accounts tend to do that, unless it's just a really petty player that wants to win on time/tickets...
@EL_CHPP0
Жыл бұрын
Mirage now costs 21k SL to repair, it used to be 14. I find getting 2 kills per game is the average and would have to get a downtier more .
@fastgoodkiwi9570
Жыл бұрын
it used to be 10k at one point, was my SL grinder and fun machine for a time haha
@mathieu722
Жыл бұрын
"Unremarkable And Frustrating" probably why Gaijin wanted to push his repair cost to the second highest of every jet, at 21K :/
@casualspawnpeeking3680
Жыл бұрын
That's actually fucking criminal holy shit 💀
@DioTm
Жыл бұрын
The F-86A-5 is still 20k for some reason as well and you have to fight faster things than you with missles every game
@kamalal-hamid4634
Жыл бұрын
Try using sun controls… that thing would be pulling a *heck* of a lot more at all speeds, low in particular-it would sort of solve the problem you had in situations like at 13:55 😁✨ (at least that’s how it was with the premium kifir-thank you test flights.) lol
@spectre0969
Жыл бұрын
Spit what’s ur opinion on the f14B?
@cyxclr8
Жыл бұрын
The magic's have nerfed to hell and back
@Soggy-Soy-Toy
Жыл бұрын
Noticed this yesterday the Magic’s felt like trash compared to a month ago. Before they would semi lead target now they’re like aim 9g
@duc1755
Жыл бұрын
@@Soggy-Soy-Toy 9js just seem better off the rails and with the heat sensitivity changes, it makes no sense to to fire more than 2km away anymore rather have a fast missile with fast proxy time than something for longer range. IR long range missiles suck hence why 9gs are mediocre and same with magics
@CheekyM8
Жыл бұрын
Thx for the vid, great as always! May i ask for a vampire/venom vid, or both maybe?
@Froggmeningreen
Жыл бұрын
Having only recently unlocked the mirage 3C and E, it's a really painfull experience. Even more so when you take into consideration that it should have been the highlight of the french tech tree, to end up with something that is incapable of winning a fair fight with most of its competition, including in downtiers is gonna put me in another serious War Thunder break.
@Bullet4MyEnemy
Жыл бұрын
In RB most of the delta wing fighters are heavily gimped by the mouse aim instructor, which restricts how hard the jet can actually pull by a considerable amount because it’s designed to prevent you from getting the jet into an uncontrollable state. In sim you can whip your nose around much faster because there is no limit, it’s on you not to pull so far into the red that you lose control. When you utilise your energy well you can really surprise people with the angles you can generate and hit some pretty high angle snap shots with a bit of practice. In RB it’s just a pretty sad triangle.
@Philnn4641
Жыл бұрын
Oh really? Didn't the Mirage 3C destroy the Egyptian aircraft with one week? But you Americans lost against Migs in Korea...
@Castrix99
Жыл бұрын
I don't see any issue in the Mirage 3E besides that it's a bit slow to accelerate. I've loved it from the moment I got it a year ago and even put a talisman on it while having a k/d of roughly 1.9. Dogfighting an F5C is a death sentence in the long run for sure but you can pull some dangerous turns to win the fight early on. The plane's never let me down unlike many other 10.0's - 10.3's
@jeandelacroix6726
Жыл бұрын
Thrust. It's all because of thrust. The 3E struggles versus MiG21 SMT because the SMT has a much more modern engine. SMT should either be at the Mirage F1's BR or F1's being lowered to SMT's BR. They are fairer match technologically.
@kermit5399
Жыл бұрын
Ah yes the Mirage IIIE, a perfect example of how the Air Realistic Battles instructor totally castrates the ability of a large number of aircraft but especially delta wings in game to pull accurate amounts of AoA and degrees/s. The Mirage IIIE whilst being a 1000kg heavier, has a similar flight model to the IIIC and other III/V variants. Essentially, in simulator-full-real controls they fly like they should, however it is the AI instructor that artificially limits the aircraft's ability to turn and in this case it hits the IIIE the worst out of all the III/Vs in the game for no good reason. This thing is easily outclassed by the MiG-21SMT and MF that share a same BR of 10.3 except do everything the Mirage can but better, not to mention the instructor doesn't effect them nearly as much. It's something I believe isn't talked nearly enough about but once you notice it the issue is pretty obvious. I can't tell if it's some soft balancing factor to keep some aircraft from vastly out-performing others in say the one-circle fight in the case of deltas or if Gaijin is terrified of giving players more control of the aircraft in fear of stalling/flat-spinning. This is just a sad jet and it makes me even sadder because there is no reason it should be :(.
@Dylllllaaannn
Жыл бұрын
Can you possibly make a video o. the French yak 3, it’s a hidden gem and is beautiful
@PaulieLDP
Жыл бұрын
Thar RAAF skin looks great though.
@Jaeger_89
Жыл бұрын
Missiles aside, there is no plane that doesn't struggle against the Mig-19...
@UchihaMadaraGr
Жыл бұрын
That's why you don't dogfight it...And even in reality this plane was built for seer performance, but that was the point that missiles got better (during Vietnam) and MiG 21 was a better platform, even if worse in classic gunfight. Similar case with F-8s and Phantom... In any war it fought , however, pilots feared the 19 more than a 21 in close quarters . So , while game isn't RL or anything... at least it stays true to the legend in some occasions. However, let's be realistic here... You don't have to play the 19s game, you can lead it to yours and win. Priority being keep away from his guns and lead it to speeds it can't handle but you can...
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
I would argue that the Crusaders don't struggle as such but they're a whole BR above it
@Jaeger_89
Жыл бұрын
@@Spitflyer Yeah, 9.3 is hardly getting uptiered past 9.7 currently. So the Mig-19 is having a very good time. Provided the pilot is aware enough to keep an eye out for 9Gs and Ds being warmed his way...
@tavolo2969
Жыл бұрын
Have you seen the new dev stream?
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
Just got home I’ll have a look now
@diprosla592
Жыл бұрын
@@Spitflyer can i have a question? Do you think that its FAIR that swedens only FRALE EQUIPED draken is Premium J35XS? Shouldnt it be copy paste in tech tree just like F104S?
@nolanwaddill8472
Жыл бұрын
I’ve extensively played and loved the IAF Mirage IIICJ (now Shahak). To me it’s very powerful at 10.0, and unless I’m missing something it seems that the IIIE is better armed in return for a 10.3 BR, so I feel like I’d do well in it. Different strokes for different folks I suppose.
@ovrwrldkiler
Жыл бұрын
3e is a bit heavier than any of the C variants(engine gives a bit more power but weighs more so the accel is a wash and you turn worse). Still worth it for flares though IMO. Im just glad they fixed the wings. For the longest time after release this thing loved to just fall apart whenever you started pulling hard. I still remember how it had like 6G max pull on release. Thankfully they realized that was fucking dumb and have fixed the FM since then.
@calimdonmorgul7206
Жыл бұрын
People just don't know or like how to play them the rest of the issues stem from Br compression.
@akagalaxy_4403
Жыл бұрын
I have to disagree, im uite fond of the Shahak (Israeli Mirage) dispite it not having flares
@jamesnewson195
Жыл бұрын
Top tier needs more balancing
@bittenamehiereinfugen3713
Жыл бұрын
Its not the plane. The mirage is a boom and zoom plane cause of its massive speed advantage and has the best missiles in the game with countermeasures what else you want? You fight mig21 and F5E. A mig19 cant do anything against a magic 1 but when you turnfight a turnfighter stop crying about it
@HeyImKatyusha
Жыл бұрын
let me show you how to mirage 3E
@methal0-111
Жыл бұрын
I'm spading it right now and am close to a 4.0k/d (something like 15D 53K I think)
@phroggphrog3194
Жыл бұрын
18,000 repair cost 😊
@yuxih_david
Жыл бұрын
I don't know if i'm playing the f5c wrong or something but I always struggle to dogfight a5c for some reason, they have such good energy retention it's ridiculous
@SINNED.VII33
Жыл бұрын
LOL
@gsilvy4k570
Жыл бұрын
Its tricky to fight against a competent A5C player. But with the F5C, dont hold S like every wallet warrior does, try to keep your speed high, preferably above 600-700 kmh. Once you dip below that speed range, youll start to struggle, you cant extend because your acceleration Isn't good enough, and you cant sustain your energy in a turn fight at low speeds. Avoid going into the vertical with an A5C.
@Northern00
Жыл бұрын
Big tip: F5C CAN turn, but it doesn’t mean you should. You can beat absolutely anything in a dogfight provided you don’t dip below 0.9 Mach. If you can learn to turn at a rate that you can maintain 0.9 Mach, you’ll find other players you’re fighting will bleed all their speed before you, and you can clean them up that way. Wait until you bleed their energy & then strike, but if they run, youre screwed cuz the F5C is just slow
@yuxih_david
Жыл бұрын
@GravityWell No need to be so salty. I've already unlocked the f16adf and knows how to play the game decently well it's just sometimes i feel like the a5c is oddly maneuverable for an attacker and have some good engines at the same time
@collander7766
Жыл бұрын
@@Northern00 "absolutely anything" lol no
@rstebnicki
Жыл бұрын
Vote with your wallet, don't feed the snail. Otherwise nothing will change.
@mikeflagger7723
Жыл бұрын
I like it but it feels underpowered / sluggish
@casualspawnpeeking3680
Жыл бұрын
That's because it is gaijin gimped this plane for no reason irl it has much better low and high speed maneuverability even with some of it's pylons loaded
@DanteSonOfDeath
Жыл бұрын
Very nice 🖤🖤🖤🤘🏻 let it be prop next time d
@mallamar6862
Жыл бұрын
its skill issue, mirage is honestly great
@Spitflyer
Жыл бұрын
Definitely not a skill issue given the background footage
@BaATep
Жыл бұрын
@@Spitflyer it is while the mirage 3e is not the best 10.3, like you said, it is not terrible the mirage can win dogfights if you properly manage your speed
@Epic_candle
6 ай бұрын
I enjoy the C more
@LeonAust
Жыл бұрын
Play a real flight sim, like DSC as this game is for dumb people and far from realistic.
@willsills6353
Жыл бұрын
Dude is flying 2 circle in a 1 circle plane and expects his plant to be superior smh 🤦♂️
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