something worth noting about chaos defiler's unusual templating. It's nontargeted, so it gets around things like hexproof and protection, but more importantly the decision is made on resolution. the opponent does not get to take any actions between finding out what you chose and it dying.
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
Yeah, that's sick. I should have put that in the video.
@Eisenwulf666
6 ай бұрын
Wow, i didn't even notice that. That's brutal!
@weenblizzard9780
6 ай бұрын
Doesn't protection also prevent damage though?
@SporePunch
6 ай бұрын
@@weenblizzard9780 It prevents damage but it doesn't prevent "destroy" or "exile" effects. For example, pro white wouldn't stop a Wrath from destroying or Farewell from exiling. It does prevent things like STP from targeting, which Defiler notably does not do.
@seetah2007
6 ай бұрын
That's right! So goodbye true name nemesis!!!
@scuffed_Raider
6 ай бұрын
another cool case with chaos defiler is that it chooses a permanent rather than targeting it, meaning it gets through any pesky protection affects :)
@AaronRotenberg
6 ай бұрын
That distribution restriction is insaaaane. WotC is going to have to figure out Universes Within versions of these cards at some point, because they clearly shot themselves on the foot with whatever licensing contract they signed with GW.
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
I'm hoping this is a one-time thing and that future releases go more smoothly.
@LibertyMonk
6 ай бұрын
It's really tough to work out non-cash purchases of licensed digital assets. Even just sales for in-game currencies can be tricky to work out, but giving out prizes of a free random chance at it? That's really difficult to work out with most IP holders.
@derekcline950
6 ай бұрын
The hope is that they reprint them soon in the non 40k form. The fear is that WotC will smell money and only print them in something like a pricey Secret Lair
@XenithShadow
6 ай бұрын
I am slightly confused. Wasn't there a massive kick up when the walking dead secret lair came out and wizards was like sorry we wont ever print mechanically unique licensed cards anymore. Did something change and now mechanically unique licesenced card are okay if they arent secret lairs? Why is there a restiction on just these licensed cards. Unless licensed cards in general are inelliglbe from being in treasure chests. Licensed cards have limited availability is kinda expected thought since it would be way to expensive to get a perpetual license to be able to continously produce the card.
@derekcline950
6 ай бұрын
@XenithShadow The ferver died down when WotC released a statement saying that they would eventually reprint cards that are functionally the same but with different names/art, like how the Godzilla cards worked in Ikoria, Lair of the Behemoths. I think people are starting to realize, though, that WotC really has no incentive to do this. Rick has been out for nearly four years and hovers over $50 with no signs of a reprint. And, frankly, he is the only card in that set that people might actually want if they did reprint them. Could you imagine WotC redoing all the art for the 40k, in a thematicaly connected and interesting way, just for a set that will sell for significantly less than the original 40k set? We're stuck with hoping they reprint the cards that actually see tournament play, knowing that these cards will see sky high prices until they do. Worse yet, if WotC decides to only release the cards that hit +$100, you know it'll be through limited means to push product, like Secret Lairs, Mystical Archives, or other supplemental product. WotC claims they don't pay attention to the secondary market but they've shown time and time again they price their product to the secondary market to maximize profits.
@kahlt_
6 ай бұрын
"but a 5/4 fucks in combat" might be the most real thing Ive ever heard about card evaluation in MtG
@uruk_bye1232
6 ай бұрын
As a lifelong warhammer player, $40 per item you want 4 of sounds just about right to me.
@Eisenwulf666
6 ай бұрын
Yup, kinda cheap nowadays, sadly 😅
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
Oof
@graefx
6 ай бұрын
The printing restriction is a beating. But thank you daybreak for the continued hard work. I just hope this doesnt become a trend for universes beyond
@ManaBirb_0.1
6 ай бұрын
I appreciate you not burying the lede and addressing the distribution model at the start of the video!
@LucasTheDrgn
6 ай бұрын
Poxwalkers getting to flashback cabal therapy for free is fun, by the time on cast triggers are checked, poxwalkers is already in the graveyard
@mclark347
6 ай бұрын
So a while ago I looked at ToSK and thought "This card *seems* good but I'm not hearing anything about it, so maybe it's just bait?" I guess it turns out I wasn't hearing anything about it because it wasn't available on MTGO yet.
@xboxgamer474246
6 ай бұрын
Phil! You are an Ancient Tomb gamer! You must play Painter with Chaos Defiler!!!
@doomkingraye7692
6 ай бұрын
FINALLY MY MIRACLE DECK ON THIS CHANNEL
@McCoreman
6 ай бұрын
Was thinking the random splash damage that Defiler does against Show and Tell deserved a call out. It breaks all non-instant speed follow ups to S&T from an opponent's S&T.
@johndoriansmith
6 ай бұрын
I've cast Mawloc more than a few times, and let me say, the card is awesome. It did serious work in Jund Nic Fit, and I'm excited to see what else it might slot into now that these cards are on MTGO.
@Blackstar-rf9yp
6 ай бұрын
Another reason to be interested in Toxicrene is that it also disables mana abilities on lands. Cradle and Sol lands are no longer accelerants when this is in play.
@kittycatpilot
6 ай бұрын
Toxicrene could also see play in some kind of Depths strategy. It functions as a Blood Sun that's easier to get out of play than an enchantment, and GSZ-able ofc.
@GeoQuag
6 ай бұрын
Noise marine doesn’t fit into the standard creative technique deck because it’s mana value breaks the cascade chain. I think alternative builds with it will be less consistent, and the storm burn spells do a good impression if you aren’t doing a full cascade plan.
@317nikey
6 ай бұрын
Toxicrene also notably kills Urza's Saga.
@GamiHQ
6 ай бұрын
I'M FREAKING OUT PHIL, I CAN'T WAIT TO DEFILE SOME CHAOS A little dubious about the pricing, but hopefully something can be worked out...
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
*fingers crossed*
@vonmatrices
6 ай бұрын
Wait, should I freak out?
@data_abort
6 ай бұрын
Took a long time given the power level. The point of these was to mess with eternal formats. Maybe primarily commander. I don't think WotC actively manages legacy. But the power level is fairly similar to commander, so good commander cards threaten to be good in legacy unless they are good primarily because they affect more opponents. So yes, freak out I think.
@3012mathias
6 ай бұрын
I dont know how practical even more miracle creatures are, but Sister Repentia seems like a pretty great 2 mana deal as well. It dies very easily, but is just as dangerous if unchecked and a draw 2 death trigger is nothing to scoff at. Also Hierophant Bio-Titan is a sick card. I could imagine modern scales playing that if it was legal, but it's probably not good enough for legacy, I'd guess. Maybe not far off though? Idk.
@ankaarne
6 ай бұрын
Oh cool 40k cards on mtgo, awesome! ***hears the restrictions*** Nah fuck that shit....
@Frontline35
6 ай бұрын
I completely forgot about poxwalkers. I have an unfinished zombardment deck with poxwalkers.
@RTSK-be2pm
6 ай бұрын
AYE BOUT TIME, ngl had given up hope. Good on them for managing to figure it out, even if that distribution method seems worrisome.
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
Yeah, I think this is one of those times where we take this as a win despite the awkwardness.
@Dhips.
6 ай бұрын
Classic GW move with the pricing.
@Alikaoz
6 ай бұрын
You CAN'T stop me. I WILL Freak out. Edit: Also, Daybreak said LONG ago that they had issues with the Games Workshop agreement specifying that the cards could only be distributed as whole decks, so the chest thing isn't that surprising.
@MackNJacishopper
6 ай бұрын
Holy crap Triump of Saint Katherine is NOT A legendary creature??? wtf lol so powerful.
@quantum_beeb
6 ай бұрын
I’m gonna love seeing mawlok eating orcish archers daily. Sick of bow masters haha
@WGG-01
6 ай бұрын
I think something you missed with toxicrene is that it is one of few decent creatures that can deal with a murktide.
@quantum_beeb
6 ай бұрын
Surprised you didn’t mention nuking urzas sagas with toxicrene
@merrja
6 ай бұрын
Flawless sponsor integration!
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
Honestly, I didn't plan on it, but Moxfield is legit great.
@neros_soren
6 ай бұрын
Man...Toxicrene is just amazing. It fixes your mana, answers DRC and Murktide AND shuts off utility lands. Will be interesting if cards from WH40k will still be viable with MH3 around the corner.
@Glennisch-iu6yo
6 ай бұрын
I've tried Noise Marine in Creative Technique. It's a starter for the chain, as well as a wincon that doesn't require combat. I like it a lot.
@ReyaadawnMTG
6 ай бұрын
There might be something with Karn and Bowmasters, they can draw out your opponent (and yourself) when stacked properly.
@Frontline35
6 ай бұрын
Mawloc is a beast. I can’t wait to see some gameplay with it.
@1234567890rom
6 ай бұрын
The distribution is a yikes. Especially since I don’t know if wizards can print magic versions just because card types are definitely gamesworkshops ip.
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
There is 100% some licensing awkwardness here.
@IronTigrex
6 ай бұрын
I think they stated that if they did, they could make versions with "magic types", like tyranids are named "space locuts", astartes are "megahumans", but it's not a guarantee and some of the decision makers probably like the idea to introduce more universe beyond stuff that has an inate fomo aspect to it to maximise sales.
@thekevmeister77
6 ай бұрын
Defiler takes out show and tell pretty well, sweet
@ElLocalo
6 ай бұрын
Concerning Poxwalkers, where do you cast the second side of adventures from? :D
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
Exile!
@jr-6025
6 ай бұрын
I'm very happy they're finally coming to MTGO but i hate how it's being implemented.
@alpha34098
6 ай бұрын
I don't like this either. But, if that's what Wizards could manage to compromise to get an additional contract with Games Workshop (we all know how greedy these executives are, even more than Hasbro's sometimes) to get these Precons into MTGO, well, there's not much we can do about it This is one of the biggest issues when making Universes Beyond products. Specially when it comes of IPs of big caliber
@MelonGator
6 ай бұрын
One thing to remember with scarab swarm is that it along with the tokens it creates are artifacts which really help scale an Urza's saga token up.
@WGG-01
6 ай бұрын
Imagine playing canoptek scarab swarm in a grinding station artifact deck.
@joshbaker8767
6 ай бұрын
Toxicrene is more similar to a tutorable Blood Sun, not Blood Moon, seems interesting to me.
@Moersfreak
6 ай бұрын
Dune mode achieved. The spice will flow. About the Toxicrene: it stuffs Urza's Saga. Might be relevant, I'm not sure though. And the scarab swarm might be a banger against Delver if you can get to 4 mana, which is of course not guaranteed. Empties the graveyard for DRC and Murktide, and all their removal is 1-for-1, so the tokens are really obnoxious for them.
@LibertyMonk
6 ай бұрын
It's cool that they *finally* worked out some type of licensing for it, but I really wish it wasn't impossible to convince 3rd parties to accept in-game currency or loot box giveaways as part of some kind of deal.
@hobonugget7332
6 ай бұрын
Could you loop poxwalkers with gravecrawler and phyrexian altar similar to KCI? Declare the cast of gravecrawler and sac poxwalkers to pay, then get pox back with its trigger? Not sure if it works in this case but that could be used for infinite mana/etb if you can do it.
@alpha34098
6 ай бұрын
Well, i always felt like Poxwalkers should've been an Zombie Army that gets Amass X (where X is equal to 2 plus the amount of times Poxwalkers returns to the Battlefield from the Grave) everytime it returns from the Grave. That way it would be much on par with how Poxwalkers are in the Warhammer 40K
@oelboy
6 ай бұрын
I feel like there are a few IP contract lawyering issues behind the cards not being in chests, however, I bet as soon as in-universe versions of needed cards are released, they will add them as a renewable resource. Still not pleasant...
@prodigaIProdigy
6 ай бұрын
Granted I haven't followed Legacy closely since these decks come out, but has nobody tried anything with Trazyn the Infinite? I figured "Necrotic Ooze for artifacts" had enough potential for instant wins that there'd be some kind of list doing the rounds.
@lorkain
6 ай бұрын
cant wait to see Poxwalkers in action , my fav card from the whole set even if its not hte strongest, i use it in my lands deck alongside Flame Jab or Raven's crime currently
@RumpledNutskin
6 ай бұрын
I can't wait until Triumph of Saint Traft comes to mtgo!
@Bootitan
6 ай бұрын
Skorpekh Lord will be cool to see as well, and maybe others from that deck?
@nicholasfarrell5981
6 ай бұрын
'Bout time. Hopefully we see you get to toss a Canoptek Scarab Swarm in D&T, or Chaos Defiler into Painter, at some point.
@clemenskremer5094
6 ай бұрын
Crap... Should have waited with my donation video 😂. Glad to finally see the cards added!
@TheAngelRaven
6 ай бұрын
Toxicrene could be good against Dredge, since it turns Bazaar into a fair land.
@xremming
6 ай бұрын
It should be noted that the cards are really not any more limited than they are for paper Magic. As far as we know (and based on past and how Games Workshop operates) there was only a single printing of the 40k EDH decks for paper. WotC still of course has the chance of doing "In Universe" versions of the most wanted cards in the future and those could also be released digitally.
@wicked2874
6 ай бұрын
This might be a bit too durdley but the black deck had a couple blood artist effects for artifacts printed and some neat stuff to look with welder and even kci combo
@54321eclipse12345
6 ай бұрын
Poxwalker seems insane. Good thing Ragavan and Dreadhorde Arcanist are banned in legacy. But even a Brazen Borrower can bring it back, thinking about it Questing Druid can bring it back in multiple ways.
@keatsta2928
6 ай бұрын
i don't understand why they didn't start working on universes within versions as soon as it was clear some of these cards would be eternal playable. they really treat mtgo like an afterthought, even though it has a fanbase and pricing model that most other companies would kill for. we're being asked to spend $600+ to get playsets of relevant cards with FOMO timing, we can't just blame games workshop for that, wotc HAS A SOLUTION that they just chose not to implement out of apathy or greed.
@TheKozzakk
6 ай бұрын
I have been interested in starting to play on mtgo due to you, could you perhaps make a video that shows the basics of mtgo?
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
That's beyond the scope of my channel. I would bet that Tolarian Community College has probably made something like that though!
@MemoryLaneWizard
6 ай бұрын
Plague Drone in False Cure combo - let's go! (lose some rounds!)
@gabrote42
6 ай бұрын
AWWWWW YEEEEEAAAAAAA! 1:05 OOOOOOO NNOOOOOOO!!! I better see eight sextillion of those being purchased or they are gonna be SCARCE 2:35 Common GW L 18:12 It's alpine moon, which is a decent card, but this doesn't cantrip and is edictable
@timothyharrelson6645
6 ай бұрын
I wonder if the limited time sales of the digital 40k cards and delay in offering them is perhaps issues with licensing agreements with GW
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
100%
@assault410
6 ай бұрын
the card availability is almost certainly GWs handiwork. no one hates their customers more than GW.
@uruk_bye1232
6 ай бұрын
They'd rather you bought a miniature, honestly. They don't hate their customers, just customers that want them to sell something they're not interested in selling. It's their IP, and they want it to be a special thing. This is one way of going about that.
@assault410
6 ай бұрын
@@uruk_bye1232nothing says let me check out tabletop 40k more than a limited print run. using fomo to sell cards is certainly anti consumer
@p1k4nurxp13sr
6 ай бұрын
I believe there’s a green graveyard hate tyranid that’s reasonable to gsz for
@benjaminsouthworth5698
6 ай бұрын
These cards are going to be so expensive oh god
@noneofyourbusiness4133
6 ай бұрын
Game Workshop continues to be very EVIL AS DAMNED HECK.
@AArdW01f
6 ай бұрын
Where do i buy Triumph of Saint Catherine and how do i use it? 😂 90 seconds in and he addresses my concerns.
@user-lh5fp7bf2c
6 ай бұрын
I think charging $ for digital cards, (pictures) is utterly insane. I really think mtg should be a product that once purchased should translate automatically to your ability to own that product or card digitally. Companies would be free to offer their services to play vs other players and format allocation ect... but to tell players who already pay far too much for physical cards for this game to pay even more to play the cards you already own is literally deceitful and possibly illegal business practices. Im dying for the beautiful American businesses to create another player friendly online format that automatically offers all mtg cards to players free of charge, who prove they own physical copies of the cards. So what wotc sues? Well then that opens up avenues for countersuit under monopoly laws and antitrust laws. I say let the free market be free and allow the consumers to chose the winners not big Corps. Im probably wronge about some of this but im 100% correct with this whole idea.
@Fry_Guy
6 ай бұрын
Now they just need to add Lineprancers
@Omnicloud7strife
6 ай бұрын
If you wanted 4 copies of a card, it’s $160. Gross.
@alistaircushnie5551
6 ай бұрын
Can you not sell the remaining cards to the bots? Appreciate you will still not recoup, but it shouldn't be 160.
@GollyGoshSensation
6 ай бұрын
Any chances for the greatest fish in magic to come back is now totally gone with Chaos Defiler joining the meta.
@brianmcgoldrick9529
6 ай бұрын
Wizards' capacity for moneygrubbing knows no bounds
@kingsquibblebort
6 ай бұрын
Great video Phil!
@Papiness
2 ай бұрын
Wish they do more cards! Lore doesn't seem far off despite being space oriented.
@wesmorris3529
6 ай бұрын
Doesn't pox walker trigger off of cascade as well? And suspend. 14:10
@wesmorris3529
6 ай бұрын
Also toxicrene seems like a dark depths hoser but it's actually another way to pop a depths. Toxicrene, depths, sac toxicrene to cabal therepy or like any removal.
@RayZ3d
6 ай бұрын
Thank you so much, I'd love to hear your opinion on "Blood for the Blood Gods!". Currently playing it in my prossh food chain combo deck where it is suprisingly easy to cast for 3 (ofc few legacy shells can keep up with the amount of creatures prossh produces in edh). Also you brought me to legacy, thanks for that Phil, have a good one!
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
Cool cards for EDH, too tough to cast in Legacy.
@AdjectiveObject
6 ай бұрын
Looks like I'll never play legacy online, that price is so prohibitive, and with the limited release I don't expect to go down💀
@kevink.8809
6 ай бұрын
Thanks for the great info! Great video!
@maxzakh
6 ай бұрын
Poxwalkers not having a smallpox effect is such a flavor fail.
@ProbablyP3
6 ай бұрын
Unfortunate but unsurprising that IP law has become the new reserved list. I wonder if the old Universes Within treatment could even be done without GW's approval, as they would still include the original name (and in the case of Tyranids, trademarked creature type!). On a lighter note, a fun fact about Poxwalkers: "When a player casts a spell" triggers are checked after all costs are paid. So when you sacrifice a Poxwalker to Cabal Therapy, the ability triggers to bring them back to the battlefield immediately!
@ReyaadawnMTG
6 ай бұрын
Canoptek Scarab Swarm + Winota ???
@John_Doe742
6 ай бұрын
Damn this looks cool as hell
@colinrooney711
6 ай бұрын
Thanks for your thoughts :)
@slippyminaj
6 ай бұрын
Finally, a card that makes Up The Beanstalk playable in legacy
@IeuroI
6 ай бұрын
Toxicrene and Scarab Swarm both seem like absolute piledrivers against lands decks
@swampybwoy
6 ай бұрын
If you have time I’d love to see more videos like this, do you think any of the fallout cards will have legacy implications ?
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
Uh, there's a white equipment that is really good. Something Formalwear?
@saltefan5925
6 ай бұрын
Your description of this MTGO practice as "scary" is pretty charitable albeit pretty accurate for the precedent this is setting. I don't know if it's a matter of Hasbro forcing WotC into squeezing as much money from a product, GW just telling WotC "no, this is limited" and the company then not making the decision to not go through with it in order to keep MTGOs cardpool as "fair" as it has been till now, or a decision by WotC themselves. And quite frankly I don't think it matters too much when the end result is mostly the same. I think Hasbro will take note of the money this practice makes and push MTGO towards repeating it.
@jiturnha
6 ай бұрын
It's likely imo to be a simple case of MTGO not being part of the original contract for licensing and having to be negotiated after the fact. I don't think it would be a case of "no, this is limited" - the license has probably already expired and this is a limited reinstatement for digital sales which again would have needed renegotiation and is not going to be perpetual because no company anywhere issues perpetual licenses anymore.
@swampybwoy
6 ай бұрын
@phil , will you be buying 4 copies of each deck personally? Or just the one with triumph of saint Katherine? Or none of them?
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
I am hoping to just borrow cards.
@crucible_of_words
6 ай бұрын
I guess there is nothing stopping them from putting the 40K decks on sale some time in the future. The limited run this time around is likely to drive up purchases, but they could easily put them back online for another short window because clearly this gets around the licensing issue and neither GW or WOTC will pass up the free money.
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
Uh, I'm not so sure. I think what you're saying makes sense, but this really seems like a tricky licensing situation, and I wouldn't count on seeing these around again.
@crucible_of_words
6 ай бұрын
@@ThrabenUniversityThere is some copium from me for sure, I see it as a hopeful possibility xD
@a_fuckin_spacemarine7514
6 ай бұрын
TRIUMPH!
@GiantBenA
6 ай бұрын
Zoanthrope!
@forcemarine
6 ай бұрын
FOR THE EMPRAH!!!
@kyleucf
6 ай бұрын
What happens if nobody really buys these thinking they’ll just pick up the cards they need cheaper once the hype dies down, but they never drop b/c they are so scarce nobody has them and they cost an arm and a leg? If these truly are only a one time buy, it seems like free money to buy a bunch. These are gonna be worth a fortune. What am I missing?
@jaggededge11
6 ай бұрын
In the short term, that is definitely an option (Unless everyone thinks it's free money season and massively floods the market). However, there is nothing said about being able to sell the decks at a later date (So if there ever was a massive shortage, it might be possible to renegotiate another sale). Other than that, it is also possible for WotC to make Universes Within versions for the majority of the popular cards without much issue (Outside off needing to make a few subtype anologs).
@jasonmccrory
6 ай бұрын
I hate the Reserve List. Guess how i feel about this release plan....
@oskarmagnushararson7629
6 ай бұрын
40$ x 4 x 4 for a 4 of every card is 640$ that is a lot of money :/
@chadoftoons
6 ай бұрын
Ah so the collecting card game wont let you collect the cards? Whats the point then? They are not incentivized to reprint these at all too even if they promise they will as the scale of out of universe has gotten out of control. They would have to stop doing it for reprints to catch up or let them become de-facto pre-orders on important defining cards for both competitive magic and fun driven magic and imagine them just showing mechanically or/and thematically unsound cards into sets so they get reprinted. Miracle, cascade and ravenous would all need to make a return or the templating would just be obviously out of place since they would not be keyworded if they get reprinted in sets without these mechanics. Another issue i see with this is that its a dangerous path for the future of magic online. It will be harder to actually wanna be on a platform as outdated as it is while being unable to possibly have what you might need for the format you are playing in. I doubt there will be such scarcity that it will have such an effect but before the platform was in a better place. Somhow i cant even blame wizzards they have been quite greedy recently sure but games workshop has a track record of heavy handed IP licenscing that forces the hand on awkward money grubbing like this. That stuff will kind of take all excitement out for me for the cards being available or seeing content for it too, its going to have an aftertaste of bad buisness practices with it atleast for a while
@PaulBTheLibrarian
6 ай бұрын
So if you have enough cash to buy four of one of the decks, which one do you suggest? Or do you buy one of each to spread the risk/reward?
@ThrabenUniversity
6 ай бұрын
I personally won't be buying any of these, and I'll be hoping to rely on the community to borrow the cards I need to record. I think if you're speculating, Triumph of Saint Katherine is probably the best of the cards from these sets.
@VanHornJosh
6 ай бұрын
Poxwalkers is broken in hogaak it goes infinite
@imanujakku
6 ай бұрын
Ouch on the distribution but thats some fun new toys until mh3 breaks all formats lol.
@janmelantu7490
6 ай бұрын
WotC: “they’ll be $40 per deck” Me: “that sounds reasonable, a little cheaper than they were in paper” WotC: “and that’s the only way you can buy them” Me: “what the actual fuck?”
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