The original cast was diverse from the get-go, and not just Uhura and Sulu, the crew included a clearly Scottish man and Chekhov, a Russian officer in the middle of the cold war
@Shiirow
5 жыл бұрын
yeah but today they view scots and russians as yet another "white person". all "white people" are singular culture-less shapeless entity to pin their hatreds on.
@milamberarial
5 жыл бұрын
Yeah, and Roddenberry's initial concept would have shown some of those characters even more. But the network was skittish about several of them. They made him take out the female first officer, and said that the Russian character couldn't be a higher officer. Roddenberry wanted to showcase a paradise culture but had to bow to nervous execs.
@tyguy6296
5 жыл бұрын
Why did I laugh so hard at "a clearly Scottish man"? I know you didnt mean anything with it, but the way I read it in my head made it sound super accusatory or something
@ItsAVolcano
5 жыл бұрын
@@tyguy6296 Honestly I just felt actually calling him Scotty while referring to his ancestry felt weirdly redundant. It does still sound off though 🤔
@redshirtveteran5688
5 жыл бұрын
@@tyguy6296 Maybe because Doohan was Canadian?
@iconian1387
5 жыл бұрын
"Star Trek and its fans embraced real diversity a very long time ago . . . where actors and characters were judged based on their own merits, and not because of their gender or race." Exactly.
@Daedalus_Dragon
5 жыл бұрын
Who asked anyone to judge anything on gender or race?
@Transgender-ProphetMohammed
5 жыл бұрын
Aaron Gaul where do you live?! on the moon?
@Daedalus_Dragon
4 жыл бұрын
03041976001 actually that is kinda the opposite of the leftist approach dude
@Daedalus_Dragon
4 жыл бұрын
For some reason someone responded to a comment from a year ago, and when it loaded, this video started up. I didn’t listen to the whole thing, but it is just as stupid now as it was a year ago. Completely wrong, it makes a lot of assumptions that are not based on anything but the narrators own biased nonsense. I’ve watch both season on STD twice and it does none of the things this video claims.
@Daedalus_Dragon
4 жыл бұрын
@@03041976001 When you say diversity hiring quota are you referring to what exactly? Certainly not Star Trek, because if you haven't noticed, diversity has always been a core tenant of the show since ToS. I have to say, back when this video first was viewed there seemed to be a rise in a vocal minority having some pretty major backlash against pop culture becoming more inclusive. I really don't get it. If you don't like something guess what - you don't have to watch it. It's that simple. You don't have to make a 7 minute video coming up with a list of "reasons" why it isn't good. Just say, "it wasn't for me" and move on. But people seem to have this entitled attitude that everything they like should be made and tailored to them and if a version comes out that they don't like they have to rail against it. THe show does not do any of the bullshit this person is claiming it does. Clearly they have some hangups and they are projecting those all over this series.
@williamgriffith9558
5 жыл бұрын
wasn't the Borg a bad ass enemy of the federation led by a woman too?
@ErickSoares3
5 жыл бұрын
Yep, but it stopped to be badass during Voyager.
@crimsonsamuraiftw
5 жыл бұрын
@@Isamolle Yep, the npcs definitely sound like a real life version of the Borg
@danielreick9904
5 жыл бұрын
@@Isamolle We are one, negotiation is irrelevant, we will adapt, the collective must grow. We are the Borg, Resistance is futile. :D
@danielreick9904
5 жыл бұрын
Queen: "I am the Borg." Data: "Interessting normally the Borg speak in 3rd person, never the first person. Are you the queen or something?" Queen: "I'm the begining, the end, the one, who is many. I am the Borg."
@Canadianvoice
5 жыл бұрын
@@ErickSoares3 did it though?
@Keglanek
5 жыл бұрын
I also love Samantha carter from the Stargate series, probably one of the best strong and intelligent female characters in science fiction. IMO
@mulberryman1305
5 жыл бұрын
totally agree Samantha actually did the rescuing more often than not
@trazyntheinfinite9895
5 жыл бұрын
best stargate action girl was meredith. 😝
@cobramcjingleballs
5 жыл бұрын
we shouldn't even be talking about strong female characters, but just strong characters PERIOD
@AstroTomK
5 жыл бұрын
Some great lines [ Carter: "Ah, sir... we can't call it the Enterprise." ]
@Karen1963Yorks
5 жыл бұрын
@@mulberryman1305 Sadly if they made it now She would be punching a white male character who was racist, sexist, stupid, a coward and as big as Tealc and that man would be punched through a window by the "strong woman" Small women beating massive men to a pulp is such a cliché these days and frankly I feel my IQ is being insulted.
@ryougahibiki941
5 жыл бұрын
"we don't dislike her because of her demographic representation, we dislike her because she's a horrible character" Beautifuly put
@JamesHardaker
5 жыл бұрын
it was the fans who started the conversation about her demographic. There was no big thing about her being black/female until the backlash from the first 2 episodes. If you had all just said "this show is shit - the end" we would be at the same place we are with Voyager.
@Azrael_Garou
5 жыл бұрын
Coated in sugary sweet is more like it. I thought you people "tell it like it is"?? Why the dance around the rhetoric like so many leftists are accused of?
@BeardofBeesPool
5 жыл бұрын
I've watched all of trek and still felt like the same Star Trek to me.. What put Janeway in that extreme of being horrible? Can you name some episodes/moments OVERALL in Voyager? I thought Captain Archer wasn't that great but I still mostly enjoyed the show.
@BeardofBeesPool
5 жыл бұрын
Shane Hawkins not that dumbass argument again... just because the federation resembles utopian traits that "look" like communism, doesn't make it communism.. The Romulians and Klingons (the enemy) have severed as an allegory for communism many times if you actually watch the movies and shows..
@BeardofBeesPool
5 жыл бұрын
Shane Hawkins Except the Federation doesn't regulate money like a state would for free stuff because there is NO money.. Gene Roddenberry's vision of the future is technology solves everything.. No one ever said "work for the common good" in Star Trek EVER.. If you watch First Contact and the episode of TNG where those people were cryogenically unfrozen, Picard says along the lines of "the penitential to make your self better.. to make your self more than you are" replaced the drive for money.. What's the point of money when you can replicate anything..and almost do whatever you want? Everyone collectively working for the common good sounds like the Borg..
@DigenisGR
5 жыл бұрын
Tywin Lannister to Cersei: I don't distust you because you are a woman, I distrust you because you are not as smart as you think you are!!!!
@danielreick9904
5 жыл бұрын
Tyrion to Cersei: If I would be able to fool father, I would rule the world.... Yes Tywin was a wise old ashole. :D
@giobia86
5 жыл бұрын
the problem is not diversity Kathryn Janeway: woman Chakotay: native Tuvok: black B'Elanna Torres: latin woman Tom Paris: white male Harry Kim: asian star trek never had this problem, nor problem with progressive ideas, the base of the star trek universe is an'illuminated progressive federation MG in TNG Riker fell in love with a hermaprodite and nobody had nothing to complain about it the problem with STD is just bad characters and bad plot PS: sorry man voyager is my favourite after TNG :)
@Argonautx66
5 жыл бұрын
WTFPurpleAlpaca well put
@RealityIsTheNow
5 жыл бұрын
Tuvok was a Vulcan. Trying to apply human racial notions to aliens makes no sense. Vulcans probably don't even make those sorts of distinctions. Would be just as illogical as when humans do it.
@giobia86
5 жыл бұрын
@@RealityIsTheNow i agree, mine was just an'exemple on the cast to show how little star trek fans care about racial or gender issues, race or gender has never been a problem in star trek
@sicilianotoronto
5 жыл бұрын
giobia86 Voyager is my fave after TNG too!
@Lloydy786
5 жыл бұрын
You forgot Doctor - Bisexual
@Cool70sfreak
5 жыл бұрын
Kirk: The explorer, the warrior, ready to go in and fight when it was called for, always taking calculated risks with the rest of the crew helping him decide on those risks (especially Spock). Picard: The new explorer, the thinker, philosophical and always collected, preferring to solve a situation through words and psychology rather than furious battles, scary when he gets angry. Sisko: The defender, the one ready to lay literally everything down on the line for not only his crew, but for The Federation itself, also a man who took many calculated risks with the help of his crew, and stopped at nothing for the good of all. Janeway: The commander, the scientist who stepped into the role of Captain and commanded respect from not only her crew, but every species she encountered, even The Borg. Her fury when angered is even more frightening than Picard. Archer: The ordinary man, the relatable person who became a good leader and the first explorer, someone who had to make mistakes to find out how to succeed, and eventually did. He would have succeeded even more had the show not been cancelled. What legacy will Star Trek Discovery leave behind in its Captain? It doesn't look like a good one so far.
@sjthjsdreadfather4867
5 жыл бұрын
Hes dead. He was the Terrarian captain who used the Discovery to get back to his own universe to satge a coup against the Emperor.
@MattJohno2
4 жыл бұрын
Pike is likeable, but he got replaced to be on the Enterprise.
@clouds5
5 жыл бұрын
Feels like the creators of STD haven't watched star trek... Sisko is the best example. He's just a human being and his skin color doesn't matter at all because he's a great character!! That'st should be, these are stories - what you need to do is tell a good story and write good characters. If you wanna preach become a pastor or something...
@jacobambos3885
5 жыл бұрын
It is my understanding that Avery Brooks only agreed to play Sisko if marketing promised not to make a big deal about his race. Seems quaint now, doesn't it?
@s0515033
5 жыл бұрын
@@jacobambos3885 There were a lot of episodes where his races was mentioned, though, regarding the plot.
@jacobambos3885
5 жыл бұрын
@@s0515033 I can think of 2. The one where he hesitated to visit Vic's in the holodeck because of the time it represented, and the one where he had the dream of the alternate reality where he was a scifi writer in the 50s. His race had 0% importance in the 24th century, as it should be. Unless you're referring to him being "Hu-MON," of which he was a prime representative.
@DarinRWagner
5 жыл бұрын
Every time I hear that STD finally made Star Trek diverse, I scratch my head.
@StraboSE
5 жыл бұрын
They were doing diversity hiring in the sixties, I know right
@TheAutistWhisperer
5 жыл бұрын
Darin Wagner Its almost if these clowns aren't even fans!
@owlhatch3812
5 жыл бұрын
I do the same for Dr who as well a fair few other things
@DanielM2006UK
5 жыл бұрын
When I hear STD, I think of something a little more crass.
@nerd1601
5 жыл бұрын
Dude, stop it! Your head must be full of scars now ;)
@luchomscyfy
5 жыл бұрын
It's a shame they forgot a masterpiece like TNG, how Picard and his crew meet in the briefing room, and every people gave his/her opinion on how to deal with the situation of the episode: Picard has a more diplomatic approach, Riker was more straightforward close to Kirk, Worf is a Klingon, with a more violent culture and race, so he's got a more of "let's attack" way, Data is more logic, Troi use more empathy and psychology, Crusher was humanistic, sometimes emotional, close to McCoy, LaForge it was more technical.... It was an expansion of the trinity of Kirk/Spock/McCoy, which I also loved. God, I miss the old times...
@toolegittoquit_001
5 жыл бұрын
Shut up Wesley 😁
@luchomscyfy
5 жыл бұрын
@@toolegittoquit_001 😁
@JAGtheTrekkieGEMINI1701
5 жыл бұрын
Yep that was awesome
@zombiegandhi8405
5 жыл бұрын
You don't have to miss them. The entire series is on Netflix. You can relive it whenever you want, as often as you want.
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
And Lorca wasn't anything like Picard. Remember HE is the captain. And he did take in opinions, he just tended to ignore them. I expect Pike to be that sort of captain, and Saru too, to a degree. Besides, the cast IS diverse and relatively well formed. I'd say Burnham is a cross between Data and Crusher, with a bit of flawed human being thrown in there, which adds to the realism.
@LittleHobbit13
5 жыл бұрын
It's really the difference between trying to spotlight diversity and trying to normalize it. Previous Trek series normalized it, treated diversity as though it were the standard so the audience wouldn't think twice about it as they accepted it. STD tries to spotlight diversity, as though almost trying to shame the audience into feeling "this is what you SHOULD like, this is what you have to focus on". I'd much rather have the normalized diversity on screen because in the end that's what gets people to normalize it in their own lives which was more Roddenberry's intention to help us better our society.
@Lancor84
5 жыл бұрын
Explain how. I don't get how it "spotlights" any diversity. I found DS9 with Sisko and Jake was pretty spotlighty. In TOS and TNG we never had to hear about this "racism" stuff before.
@milamberarial
5 жыл бұрын
@@Lancor84 You did actually. Several times in fact. It just wasn't humans that were racist. In fact, I don't believe any Federation characters showed any racism in TOS or TNG. But there were several episodes between the two where a planet the ship was at had a racism problem. Part of what Trek used to do was spotlight social issues while showing the Federation as an example of a society that had gotten past (or in some cases, mostly gotten past) those issues. There was an episode of TOS where the dominant species was divided into two races. One with black on the right side and white on the left of their faces, and the other race had the two colors switched. And they were fighting just because of that simple difference. The crew of the Enterprise was surprised that an issue like that still existed anywhere. There are also shades of racism shown as "speciesism" instead. Such as the Klingons, Romulans, and even the Vulcans looking down on other species (the Vulcans tried to hide it, but it was there for some of them). So yes, TOS and TNG had racism, but shown in the light of a problem that any society can get past if they want to.
@gmajor1273
5 жыл бұрын
Totally agree.
@TechnoMinarchist
5 жыл бұрын
If SJWs normalised diversity, they'd have nothing to complain about. So they have to prevent that by acting like it ain't so.
@EstrellaViajeViajero
5 жыл бұрын
Well said.
@raedwulf61
5 жыл бұрын
I gave up watching DS9 during the second season of its first run, basically I just couldn't get into it for various reasons (grad school, new baby, etc). A few weeks ago I decided to give it a try again- and I am loving it! I get to see a Trek series that is new to me, and it is real Trek. Good stories, great characters, and Sisko is indeed a great captain played wonderfully by Brooks. In contrast to STD, there is no contest. DS9 is a winner.
@cbyrne9703
5 жыл бұрын
Yeah, DS9's first two seasons are a tad slow paced. Although they are no worse than most other series; far better than TNG's first season which is almost unwatchable today. It starts to pick up from season 3 and really gets going in season 4. It's also aged far better than TNG and even Voyager have.
@atomicsquid9836
5 жыл бұрын
Yes. Sisko as portrayed by Brooks was a strong, commanding leader that took 0 bs. He'll even pop a "god" in the nose when he tired of his crap.
@mikey2363
5 жыл бұрын
I'm halfway through Season 7 after rewatching it from the start (about the 3rd time). Best series out of them
@israelmartinez1744
5 жыл бұрын
Glad to hear it
@charleslennonbaker
5 жыл бұрын
Israelite Romero there is a feature-length documentary retrospective of DS:9 coming out next year [Blu-Ray/DVD]. It is being produced by Adam Nimoy (son of the late Leonard Nimoy) and Steven Ira Behr the original showrunner among others. The documentary will feature most of the original cast and crew and as an added bonus will include a plot synopsis for a season eight if DS:9 had gotten one. There are rumors that if the documentary does well (it achieved its Kickstarter goal plus in just a few weeks of its posting) that there may be a revival in some form in the future, maybe in the new "Picard" series. Most of the cast have been apt for a retrospective and many of the Trekkers who dismissed the show during its run have come to not only except DS:9 as not only a Star Trek show but "the" best Star Trek show ever produced.
@superzentredi
5 жыл бұрын
Kirk was a Cowboy, Picard a Diplomat, Sisko a Deity, Janeway a Scientist, Archer a Pioneer, and Burnham.. a diversity hire...
@ShamanMcLamie
5 жыл бұрын
I thought it was Archer the Pioneer, Janeway the Diplomat, Sisko the Sheriff, Picard the Telepath and Kirk the Gigolo.
@Karen1963Yorks
5 жыл бұрын
@@ShamanMcLamie Picard the old hippy Agreed on Sisko Kirk had very few women while Ryker would have screwed a black hole if he could have.
@timothyduffy8818
5 жыл бұрын
Kirk the (McGyver) always figured it out. Picard the father figure. Sisko the Traveler( On a Journey). Archier the teenager( everything an adventure. Burnham a rip of character from Gaming Site teaser trailer. (never fleshed out more then the Teaser)
@spicecrop
5 жыл бұрын
But but but, she's is a strong independent interstellar person of color.
@davejanes8091
5 жыл бұрын
Ouch. True, but ouch.
@gawainethefirst
5 жыл бұрын
It’s like they took Wesley Crusher, turned him into a black chick, and centered the entire series on him
@ivokonstantinidis9438
4 жыл бұрын
Man even Weasley is more likeable than Michael
@joelellis7035
4 жыл бұрын
Feeling even less guilty about shouting: "Shut up, Wesley!"
@laugenbrezel_
2 жыл бұрын
@@ivokonstantinidis9438 Epic Harry Potter X Star Trek crossover?
@Moribax85
5 жыл бұрын
you forgot one thing, that in my opinion topples all the others, and let me explain why: while black people in the '60s were a bold move, the jim crow period was already fading, so they were pioneers in that regard. but not as much as creating a russian character in full cold war era, just 4 years after the cuban missile crisis... that took balls of steel
@brettcooper3893
5 жыл бұрын
DS9 produced what was arguably the best episode of any Star Trek: "In The Pale Moonlight."
@Paulafan5
5 жыл бұрын
I loved the fact that all along Garak was planning to murder everyone. Well, the Senator, his aids, and that prisoner that helped make the holosuite recording. I don't think it's the best produced episode, but definitely an underrated gem. The visitor is amazing, with Tony Todd giving a shockingly emotional performance. Who knew Candyman had such range?
@DblOSmith
5 жыл бұрын
My fave episode in all trek.
@zoidberg444
5 жыл бұрын
If you can allow your anger to subside for a moment you'll see they did not die in vein. THE ROMULANS WILL ENTER THE WAR!
@zoidberg444
5 жыл бұрын
@@Paulafan5 How is that for diversity. The best character on DS9 is a bloody Cardassian. Basically a soviet space reptilian KGB agent. 🤔
@Zandiv
5 жыл бұрын
I loved how the Romulan shuttle decloaked in the shuttle bay, after the doors retracted...and if course, Garriks perfectly 'only a humble tailor' solution 😊
@HickoryDickory86
5 жыл бұрын
"Janeway treated everyone with respect. Unless you turned out to be that week's villain... then, God help you." Yes!!! XD Janeway is queen!
@crazymaner2003
5 жыл бұрын
The Captain that got the most trepidation from fans when cast was Picard: a white guy! He had to prove that a captain other than Kirk could lead ST.
@toolegittoquit_001
5 жыл бұрын
And he was British to boot 😱
@Karen1963Yorks
5 жыл бұрын
Good actor TERRIBLE scripts. The ship had a creche, Battles were seldom fought and when they were it was often by staff meeting. They had a Captain and first officer who often gave the Captain orders. They had a "councilor" A teenage brat, an officer who had a transporter phobia. A Klingon adopted by a mixed race couple who gave him cultural identity issues. There was even an episode where Picard got stuck in a lift with some small children. Seriously that happened. Not to mention the one where they visited a planet of ladyboys and Ryker was willing to start an interplanetary war if it meant he could shag one!!!!!!
@mikahael1
5 жыл бұрын
@@Karen1963Yorks Worf's parents were not mixed race couple. They were both white. >.> You're an idiot clearly.
@palimpalim5291
5 жыл бұрын
@@toolegittoquit_001 Yes, since then every French character in Star Trek has to have a British accent ...
@Quetzalcoatl_Feathered_Serpent
5 жыл бұрын
@Thomas Ritter Its a running gag that behind the scenes (in universe) that the creator of the engine design for the galaxy class made them shoddy due to being a idiot in engine design and was simply pushing it through hence why the constant performance issues with the ship. Apparently though the ship did manage to overcome the issues or was overhauled at one point that fixed the main issues right before Generations, I do know that ships after the Galaxy class didn't suffer such huge performance issues although now that i think about it Goerdi likely had repaired or modified the entire damn thing over its entire life time and thus the reason future ships didn't suffer was likely due to Geordi's modifications to the design I mean he had to be giving reports to starfleet
@JB-ym4up
5 жыл бұрын
Re watching Babylon 5 I see one episode of it has more content than a entire season of std or dr who. Not to mention the difference in quality of character development.
@hardwire5000
5 жыл бұрын
Yep, it's caled dumbing down. A very real thing, highlighted well by your example. These are dark times.
@no2party
5 жыл бұрын
God Yes! Such a good show!
@ToddCarpenterToddPCWV
5 жыл бұрын
You are so right. There were several times I would sigh and say wow that was a great episode ...and then it would come back from commercial and keep going. B5 episodes were jam packed!
@donaldpaluga
5 жыл бұрын
Not sure if bowlestrek is willing to kneel before Ivanova
@donaldpaluga
5 жыл бұрын
@@no2party Better than its ripoff Dee Ess Nein
@marscaleb
5 жыл бұрын
"Janeway treated everyone with respect. Unless you turned out to be that week's villain. Then God help you." LOL!
@sofiabruiz17
5 жыл бұрын
Surprises me how people usually put Voyager at the bottom. I grew up watching it, and I loved it, Captain Janeway was suuuuch a good role model. Rewatched it when I got older, and still think she is an amazing character.
@xxxCrackerJack501xxx
5 жыл бұрын
Voyager is the best Star Trek
@patricklenigan4309
5 жыл бұрын
I liked voyager too. I do hate how the final two episodes seemed to feel like cop-outs though
@sofiabruiz17
5 жыл бұрын
Patrick Lenigan uf, I hated the Seven/chakotay ending, I mean I would have prefered seven and kim or the doctor, or at least let them explore it more (although seeing how 95% of love interests in voyager go south...) At least they could have hinted or something it was too rushed and forced
@LordBruuh
5 жыл бұрын
Janeway is a decent captain but the writers never gave her any hard choices. She always had a free pass card.
@The_Keh27
5 жыл бұрын
Voyager is my wife's favourite Trek. Growing up I only saw a handful of TNG, never watched the original until much later. So when she had me record episodes of Voyager when they aired on tv, I ended up watching it all and enjoying it as well.
@DarinRWagner
5 жыл бұрын
One of the reasons why Sisko's race and Janeway's gender were not an issue to the Star Trek audience of the 1990s was because we'd already seen black and female captains already on Star Trek. It just wasn't an issue.
@rolkflameraven1483
5 жыл бұрын
Not to mention black female captions. The actress who played Gordie's mom (a captain) was also the captain that got hit by the whale probe in IV. The first, on screen, female captain who just happened to be black. STD brings nothing to the table save for Michelle Yeoh and Doug Jones, and they have gone out of their way to squander them as well.
@chrissgchriss
5 жыл бұрын
I remember when Brooks was announced as the commander of DS9 - most of my friends were excited because he was bad ass "HAWK" on Spencer For Hire! We were like Hell Yea! No black or white, just coolness. Kinda disappointed he had hair tho... Did they think he was gonna be too much like Picard?
@trazyntheinfinite9895
5 жыл бұрын
Chriss Gaines no. It was supposed to make him look "softer natured" A concept they quickly canned because since when is hair a character trait.
@cobramcjingleballs
5 жыл бұрын
as a kid, I hated the mushy episodes with Janeway where she showed her femininity. Like romance novels on holodeck. Next gen played romantic things off for laughs. My favorite line from star trek ever is from worf on dating advice: " Go to her, beg like a human." Sisko's romance were always more like dating.
@stratosmaximus1246
5 жыл бұрын
I think that the main reason is, as mentioned in the video, the internet was in its infancy during the early/mid 90's. Shitty opinions spread like cancer on the internet these days but it wasn't a thing back then. There are millions of morons in the world who can't be bothered spending the time and effort required to do the most basic research in order to form their own opinion. They will just blindly accept the 'facts' presented by any old nameless, faceless, disenfranchised keyboard warrior. Is it any wonder SJW, NPC and third wave feminism type themes have seeped into our society in such a short amount of time? How many transgender kids would we have today if the internet had never been invented? It's not that I have a problem with others having an opinion that differs from my own or a lifestyle choice I wouldn't personally adopt. The internet(or social networking, at least) tells these drooling simpletons how to think and what to believe. Which they do.
@ppipowerclass
5 жыл бұрын
Man, good points. Can I go back 30 years, so I can watch all of the GOOD Star Trek shows again for the first time?
@crimsonsamuraiftw
5 жыл бұрын
Yes. Netflix
@danielreick9904
5 жыл бұрын
@@crimsonsamuraiftw he said first time, thatswhy he wants timetravel so that his memories would be erased. So Netflix alone won't do the trick, don't you think?
@TheSouloftheDragon
5 жыл бұрын
Of course they forgot. They couldn't be bothered to do research on past Trek.
@cbyrne9703
5 жыл бұрын
Well technically you can't forget things you never knew in the first place.
@jakerocinante1133
5 жыл бұрын
TheSouloftheDragon clearly they didn’t. Plus Sisko was a bad ass captain, Janeway wasn’t bad either.
@paslotplayer
5 жыл бұрын
Amen. Agreed
@boydmerriman
5 жыл бұрын
Darn, you said it before I did! But that is so true!
@darkdawnbringer
5 жыл бұрын
Yeah they actualy had no one who has ever seen a klingon... So they had to make something up, they went with "angry Trump seporters"... Yeah nothing shows that you are progresive like making your political oposites the big bad enemies... Such love and unbiased film making... XD
@TheEmeraldApe
5 жыл бұрын
That awkward moment when representation was actually done better in the late 90s and early 00s than now. We've actually regressed somehow.
@framedanddried
4 жыл бұрын
Totally agree Mr. Emerald...I think it’s because in the 90s and 00s the representation and diversity was about learning to see past the differences and recognize our common humanity, common hopes and fears..and judging a person by their actions and not group identity..all those concepts were then weaved into compelling stories that made you think but didn’t tell you what to think...now the diversity is fake..it’s pure virtue signaling from the creators...and worse the stories and characters are dull, annoying, and preachy.
@ColonelBragg
5 жыл бұрын
DS9 in my opinion was the pinnacle of Star Trek
@krane15
5 жыл бұрын
I think that's because more than any of the other ST shows, the characters of DS-9 developed and changed the most.
@crimsonsamuraiftw
5 жыл бұрын
IMHO they had the best writing of all the series, its quite the shame that never carried over into Voyager.
@beayn
5 жыл бұрын
I agree. DS9 had really great stories during wartime. The federation was always a happy, peaceful place for so long and now its people are faced with all out war... made for some great story telling.
@ColonelBragg
5 жыл бұрын
@@crimsonsamuraiftw There was a guy who was a Rodenberry purist i can't recall his name but he was the main cause for the stagnation of star trek
@TeaJay83
5 жыл бұрын
DS9 also had the best written villian i have ever seen on TV, Gul Dukat
@aredblip1315
5 жыл бұрын
I find science fiction to be usually more intriguing when it asks interesting questions and honestly explores all sides rather than when it simply picks a side and preaches.
@sullygroot924
5 жыл бұрын
Modern sci-fi in a nutshell
@ninjabearpress2574
5 жыл бұрын
"What does God need with a starship?"
@Dargonhuman
5 жыл бұрын
That's what I love about The Orville, specifically the episode "About a Girl", where they fully explored all sides of transgenderism, consent and choice without being preachy or condescending but also left the ending open without a firm resolution so that the viewer could come to their own conclusions.
@slighter
5 жыл бұрын
And where exactly did Disco preach in any way? Granted, you could argue that the Klingons stand for a more nationalist thinking and there is a clear positioning against that kind of stuf with the Federation and Discovery in the center but even there we see the other side of the medal in a lot of episodes. So, where is the preaching?
@ninjabearpress2574
5 жыл бұрын
My only grudge with The Orville is no one who militarys for a living would act like that. MacFarlane needs to get a USN advisor for his show.
@brianfuller5868
5 жыл бұрын
Both Avery Brooks and Kate Mulgrew are solid actors and played solid well written characters. Both were great members of the Star Trek legacy, without pandering. But the clueless writers at STD likely are not aware of their place.
@shawn6860
5 жыл бұрын
As Avery said sisko was a captain that was black. He never played the character as a black captain..only just a captain.
@trazyntheinfinite9895
5 жыл бұрын
God i miss old trek.
@Dargonhuman
5 жыл бұрын
@@shawn6860 I remember seeing that interview and I couldn't help but applaud it. The really frustrating part about STD is, Sonequa Martin-Green actually is a decent actress and I really, really want to support her in Star Trek, but Burnham is such a god-awful character that I simply can't. I love Sasha Williams and would gladly fight beside her to put down a herd of walkers, but whenever I see Burnham I just want to punch her in the face - which, oddly enough, is a testament to Sonequa's acting talent and why I like her as an actor.
@Paerigos
5 жыл бұрын
@@shawn6860 that is really the point is it. He is on that captain (or commander) chair because he is capable person who deserves that post unquestionably. he commands respect by his skill, competence, knowledge, experience. And well is not afraid to punch Q. (Picard would never hit me... "I am NOT PICARD!" (When you think how much Sisko hated Picard at the time I would consider it the most "in character sentence ever") Just remember the scene where Dukat and Weyoun talk about him when they try to figure out how to partition The Federation after war. Otherwise Clever and intelligent man who supposedly fails to acknowledge Dukat´s greatness.
@shawn6860
5 жыл бұрын
Indeed because he was not a label he could be a great character. If only new writers could get that idea.
@hatuletoh
5 жыл бұрын
I'm so glad you mentioned "Far Beyond the Stars", and...what's the one where Sisko doesnt want to do a holodeck simulation of 1960s Las Vegas, and he finally admitted he felt weird doing a simulation about a time and place where "people who looked like [him] weren't welcome". And...damn, cant even remember this now...but another character says that it's all right, that the sim isnt meant to be the past exactly as it was, but the past as it should have been. I always thought that was an explanation largerr than just the episode; it was an ethic that could be applied in any case like that involving art, i.e., having non-white actors in a Shakespearean production. Damn, I'm not the biggest ST fan in the world by a long shot, but those were all some seriously meaningful, honest, and intelligent TV shows.
@jhouston6
5 жыл бұрын
I believe it was badda bing badda bang that you were thinking of.
@hunterssports
5 жыл бұрын
Thanks Hatuleoh 1 You had me searching for it, I'm now going to watch it on netflicks. Benny Sisko, a '50s science-fiction writer, envisions a future where a black man commands a space station. Show: Star Trek: Deep Space Nine Season number: 6 Episode number: 13 Air date: 9 February 1998 www.google.com/search?q=%22Far+Beyond+the+Stars&rlz=1C1CHBF_en-GBAU822AU822&oq=%22Far+Beyond+the+Stars&aqs=chrome..69i57j0l5.3015j0j8&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
@bushie09
5 жыл бұрын
"it was an ethic that could be applied in any case like that involving art, i.e., having non-white actors in a Shakespearean production." So white people aren't able to have a history, culture or homeland that is uniquely theirs, Huh well cant wait for the remake of roots with a white junta kente then I'm sure it will be a smashing success or disneys live action Mulan starring Rhianna
@commentfreely5443
5 жыл бұрын
i hated NG but last year watched about half of them. I then watched all voyager, and went from thinking i would hate it, to loving it. now watched the last few NG. maybe i should try deep space 9, but i feel it sucks.
@XxbeastnbunnyxX
5 жыл бұрын
@@commentfreely5443 honestly I myself thought I would hate DS9 not due to there being a captain of "race" but just the fact of it being centered in a station instead of a ship traveling. Let me tell you how wrong I was, I loved DS9 the cast/ crew was incredible I definitely recommend watching it
@EdsLorraine
5 жыл бұрын
As someone who has been watching Star Trek from age 6, Discovery feel like a complete insult to my intelligence. Star Trek has always been a place for diversity. Not FORCED diversity, but true, naturally occurring diversity and not only in earthen cultures of the crew, but also the alien ones. How many episodes of TOS focused on Spock’s Vulcan beliefs and the crew’s acceptance of them? How many episodes of TNG and DS9 were about Worf trying to find his place in how own Klingon culture? Discovery is absolutely atrocious and I personally like to Pretend it does NOT exist.
@sheilaolfieway1885
5 жыл бұрын
The only issue i have with older star trek series is the lack of Catians and other aliens in the federation ,though this is probably more due to budget than anything alien costumes cost money....
@slave2isis
5 жыл бұрын
Are you kidding me? Have you ever watched TOS?
@slave2isis
5 жыл бұрын
it was forced then as it is now.
@slave2isis
5 жыл бұрын
@Roger Brown yes it has been.
@slave2isis
5 жыл бұрын
@mike carson people remember the past with rose colored glasses
@Vtorch
5 жыл бұрын
Damn....you're good bowlestrek. Everything you said about STD is absolutely correct. I saw the cast and showrunner LIVE at NY Comic Con, all the wanted to talk about was acceptance, love, & diversity.......as if it was a real huge problem in the world.
@slighter
5 жыл бұрын
Well, we can walk through all of the statements of the video and check the facts. I would hold against your claim and say most o it is not true.
@Urrelles
5 жыл бұрын
Another thing. Why are people comparing Michael to captains in previous Star Treks. She's not a captain. She's a criminal. Lorka is the captain and he lacks compassion. Which in turn caused his crew to lack compassion. Just because Michael is the main character doesnt put her on the same level as Star Fleet captains. She doesnt have that training or principle.
@Pepperoniman776
5 жыл бұрын
They compare her to captain because by and large she has the role of captains in previous shows.
@s0515033
5 жыл бұрын
Janeway was a criminal too. She literally allied with the borg to wipe out a civilization trying to defend itself FROM the borg. She's a disaster and violated Federation laws nonstop in Voyager. Lots of federation officers are of dubious standing.
@TweiLimLou
5 жыл бұрын
she is close to becoming a captain no?
@stephenfgdl
5 жыл бұрын
because she is the main character on this show?
@jflaplaylistchannelunoffic3951
3 жыл бұрын
@@s0515033 Species 8472 was at first trying to wipe out all other species, so of course they had to be stopped.
@shaindaman13
5 жыл бұрын
I've always heard that STDs were bad. This one is no different.
@ethanpet113
5 жыл бұрын
Hey now, as a geek I have some favourite STDs, and come to mind.
@andrewvillers8302
5 жыл бұрын
People writing Trek today aren’t Trek fans, just like people writing Star Wars, aren’t Star Wars fans. They’re fans of having a platform with which to push an agenda.
@mknight7209
5 жыл бұрын
So god dame true
@donskiver
5 жыл бұрын
Truer words have never been said.
@grantpflum6844
5 жыл бұрын
Far to accurate and true. Nerdrotic had a video on this concerning the 11th series of Doctor Who. Out of all of the writers for that series, not one of theme has a single piece of Sci Fi work in their IDBM record and all but two are political script writers. Gee, I wonder why they have problems with that series?
@beldin2987
5 жыл бұрын
At least Seth McFarlane is a true Trek Fan ;-)
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
Oh is it... Gene never tried to push an agenda. Or the writers of TOS. Or TNG. Riiiiight. Did you actually watch those shows? Holy crap were they trying to push agendas and lecture people, especially on TOS.
@captainspire9094
5 жыл бұрын
I am sure CBS just forgot to watch a show called Star Trek when making STD.
@Balthizaur
5 жыл бұрын
DS9 was great, love the focus on REAL Klingons.
@nickpatterson6099
5 жыл бұрын
def my favorite ST series. them being limited to the starbase led to a real history and knowledge of different species and politics in the universe
@MarvinMonroe
5 жыл бұрын
Klingons
@mikefergusson9405
5 жыл бұрын
I love how ds9 was the mos eisley of the Star Trek universe, the love hate between quark and odo, garack the former spy and conspiracy theorists, I still want to hear morn talk
@Talon771
5 жыл бұрын
House of Quark is one of my favorite Star Trek episodes
@Balthizaur
5 жыл бұрын
@@Talon771 For me it was watching Martok win his crew back after being captured by the Dimnion, Martok is my favourite character in all of Star Trek.
@JasonFoxTheGreat
5 жыл бұрын
Captain Sisko is my favorite Starfleet Captain as well.
@cristianion2056
5 жыл бұрын
do you remember sisko barbeque?
@cristianion2056
5 жыл бұрын
i love it
@omegaspacey9030
5 жыл бұрын
Thats not how you spell Admiral...
@kittycats2827
5 жыл бұрын
ILL HAVE MORE OF THE BLOODWINE!!!! I Love Sisko! Im definately Kirk/Sisqo/Picard/Janeway/ mumble mumble anything else. The stories on DS-9 were so fresh and gave us a glimpse at a father reach into the universe with new alien groups that just werent vulcan/rolumlan/klingon copies, and a peering into the edge of it that could render the whole thing apart. As well as some nice human touches on existing characters and alien races we knew.
@ghost7524
5 жыл бұрын
The first and only thought I had about Avery Brooks being Sisko is "Whaa?!??! That's Hawk from Spenser For Hire!!" . But, he did not disappoint at all!
@andreamcmahon6352
5 жыл бұрын
Janeway proves we could have had a great female Doctor if they chose the right actress and written the character better. To this day Joanna Lumley is my favorite female Doctor.
@donaldpaluga
5 жыл бұрын
BLASPHEMY!-Bowlestrek
@jameslefebvre7173
5 жыл бұрын
Kate Mulgrew would be a good choice as the Doctor. Who says they always need to be British?
@Paulafan5
5 жыл бұрын
@@jameslefebvre7173 What's funny is hearing people say the Doctor can be female, but has to be British! That's hilarious!
@pwnmeisterage
5 жыл бұрын
@@Paulafan5 It is a funny comment. But the show has always been uniquely British, it's actually appropriate (and important) for it to retain and be part of British identity in a world where entertainment keeps getting poured into the (American) media-money melting pot.
@thoughtfortheday7811
5 жыл бұрын
I think Joanna Lumley would be a good Doctor. When was she in the TARDIS, then? Was it a Children in Need event?
@Erikjust
5 жыл бұрын
Biggest problem i have on retrospect with Voyager was that after each episode the reboot button was hit. Ship nearly destroyed in one episode, its clean as if it had just left the factory. The amount of torpedoes and shuttles used and lost in the entire show was ridicules. Seven of nine most of her episodes was 7 learns a new lesson that she forgets in the next episode. The show could have been different, but the writers simply seemed to have run out of ideas. If the show had been more true to the premise by the end of the show Voyager would more or less look like a Frankenstein monster of different scavenged alien parts, that was more or less jury rigged into working with one another. The Equanox ship was a more realistic version of the Voyager ship then the actual voyager ship was. Also thanks to the reboot button there was very little character development from Janeway as none of her actions really carried through to the next episode. We saw bits and pieces here and there about her really feeling guilty about her actions, here and there and we saw in an episode where the characters got their dreams fulfilled (as part of a hallucination brought on by a monster to lul its prey to sleep as it was digesting them) that Janeway kinda hoped that her husband would divorce her and maybe move on with his life. The seeds of a great show was there but it was never realized.
@Erikjust
5 жыл бұрын
@@sadako24 Yeah its was a bit the same problem Star Wars The Clone Wars had in the first few seasons when they threw in General Grievous and other such known characters and made them fight the Anakin or Obi-Wan and then put up the question is this is the end for for our gallant heroes will they survive this treacherous trap? And we could all just sit a moan in unison... No it isn´t and yes they will. Because we knew they would get out of it, there was little to no tension in it. The Clone Wars first got really good when they moved away from it and either focused on side characters or just stories. I think Voyager could have been good if they had moved more away from the whole "Now we are this close to home." and maybe just focused on the crew and survival. An example could be the Year of hell, we know in that episode where Tess traveled in through time, that she witness the year of hell and wrote a report on it. Well i know if i was captain on Voyager i would order every officer on deck to read that report till they would know it forwards and Backwards and then start figuring out solutions as to how to either avoid that sector of space or if impossible, lessen the impact once they entered it. Then maybe a season after that episode Voyager enters the year of hell and we start seeing all those preparations starting to pay off also some unforeseen consequences showing up, etc etc. I think that way if the will the ever get home was shifted into the background as something that was there, but it just wasn´t the main focus of the show, you could stretch it out to the seasons we got. But you are right in the "Will they get home?" got old really quickly.
@donaldpaluga
5 жыл бұрын
Maybe if there WAS no 7:09 there would be no President Obama
@galexeqe
5 жыл бұрын
Yeah same, there were so many plot points that were "conveniently" forgotten in following episodes that it got a bit annoying. A good example was Threshold where they build an engine for a shuttle that allows it to travel at warp 10 but the problem is that anyone travelling on the shuttle can't withstand the strain on their body. Solution, do they automate it to go back to the Alpha quadrant and use it as a supply shuttle between the federation and the ship or even have the Doctor pilot it? NOPE we will class it as a failed experiment and just NEVER MENTION IT AGAIN
@dado-7775
5 жыл бұрын
It was great show with few fair flaws that you pointed out, but imho that was not that extremely bad. Ship armament shuttles flaws could be chewed up (perhaps they found a way during the travel to produce torpedos) Also there were some great characters developement (Doctor, relations between characters, even Seven, etc) Though, there was one big issue which you didnt mention, a point which annoyed me the most, inconsistency with Ship's strength. On some occasion they were having equal fight with strongest enemies, as tactical borg qube (which was ridiculous) on the other times they were barely standing ground with inferior or obsolete ships. Basically you couldnt ever get feeling what was Ships strength, except wait what producer will decide it to be in any given episode. There were to many episodes in which they were just too easily overpowered, and boarded, from that prospective it looks absolutely unrealistic they could make it all way back to home. All in all,yes there were a flaws, which did exist and bother, but ever since new Abrams era, I tend to appreciate voyager much more then in time it was originally introduced.
@greengreeneya2102
5 жыл бұрын
Voyager is still best ST series in my opinion. And definitely a much, much better series than Discovery crap.
@VulpesChama
5 жыл бұрын
Picard made some very famous and awesome line. But the best line in all of Star Trek is something I can relate to and it came from Janeway: "There's coffee in that nebula." - I know that feeling of finally getting coffee again. And it gave her character. If I had to name my favorite Captain, it'd be Picard. But if I had to name Captains with a lot of character and a defined personality, it'd be Sisko and Janeway. Both are much more believable Captains or Officers than Kirk or Picard. And even if in Voyager the story writing was sometimes off (how's that ship looking as new all the time?) or some characters were partially annoying (Chakotay), all of them made most of the time sense. Each of them was somewhat believable. In both DS9 and Voyager, which is as I'd say the great strength of both of these. And I like that Sisko was in the beginning a character defined by anger (His reaction to Picard?) but also calmed by his duty. And then there's all this stuff in DS9 that showed that Federation Officers weren't the shining knights of good. The implied connections between Admirals and Officers with a rogue intelligence agency (okay, those episode weren't the best, but they gave depth to the universe, which is after such a time also important). Or my favorite Episode within all of Star Trek: In the Pale Moonlight. A very bitter episode that left you feeling somewhat... uneasy after watching it. Enterprise with Archer had its (extreme?) ups and downs. Can't really like it, but also can't truly dislike it either. It's okay. Somehow. - I don't know, I actually came to like ST:D (like seriously, STD? Some kind of higher level trolling the community from the writers? Nevermind). Even the Michael Burnham Character. But my problem with her is not that she is a bad character per se, she isn't. The problem is, that she is bound to find the solution. In previous Star Trek series the solution for a problem often came unexpected or from some side character or even better, some character interaction. B'Elanna and Janeway had many of these moments, and they were great. Each giving the other another part and both getting to the solution, while each on their own wouldn't have. Burnham is... what people call a Mary Sue. But the worst thing is, she doesn't needs to be one. And it's not to blame at the actors or the characters, it's a story choice the story writers made. ST:D (Seriously why?) could have been easily a top notch ST series. Everything is there. Characters with personality, a story with enough twists and turns but not too much. But they ... well fuck it up and it turns mediocre for todays standard.
@dennisweiss6621
5 жыл бұрын
Very nice writeup ... I sometimes feel dumb for not getting the things that rile everyone up, during my initial viewing of a show or movie (not really dumb, but you get what I mean), but just enjoying the good moments of it. And I remember how I got really pissed at Captain Lorca, when he left that guy rotting in the Klingon prison, thinking "gimmi a break, he is still a human!" and then it suddenly all fell into place after the big reveal at the end. This moment was my defining eye opener, that saved the show for me, but I can see why a lot of people weren't happy with it and its many flaws (and I still don't get the Klingon reimagining).
@kruleworld
5 жыл бұрын
although i liked Mulgrew, i felt her character was written very inconsistently. but the only character i actually hated was Neelix. ugh, who can be that chipper in the morning?
@kenchy318
5 жыл бұрын
Totaly agree with you, and also I loved that line with the nebula and coffe.
@globalmalfunction
5 жыл бұрын
Evil Ash I liked the doctor. Him and seven of nine seemed to be the only characters with notable character development throughout the show. Not that Janeway or others were very poorly written (Paris was a solid character), they were just stagnant
@florenceb1031
5 жыл бұрын
The only way ST:D was intentional on the part of the creators was if they decided to break with naming conventions for the shows' acronyms. TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY, and ENT all lack any reference to Star Trek in the acronyms.
@SaroDantra
5 жыл бұрын
The Oriville is more Star Trek than ST:D.
@shadowrealm8014
5 жыл бұрын
Where can I watch It for free
@legendp2011
5 жыл бұрын
if your Australian it's on "www/ SBS/ com/ au" for free, if not you can still try
@BusyBody69
5 жыл бұрын
@@shadowrealm8014 Watch what for free? The Orville? It's on tv every week now that the new season is in full swing.
@shadowrealm8014
5 жыл бұрын
@@BusyBody69 I don't watch TV Just stream stuff online
@BusyBody69
5 жыл бұрын
www.seriestop.net
@Paerigos
5 жыл бұрын
Well the best episode of Star Trek canon - is done by Avery Brooks - and it is In the Pale Moonlight. I can live with it. Because I can live with it.
@SeatBill
5 жыл бұрын
Agreed. That ONE episode showed more about the nature of war, and what it does to people, than the entire season of Discovery EVER came close to doing, in my opinion.
@szeddezs
5 жыл бұрын
After years of putting off watching DS9 because the first two seasons bored me as a kid/teenager, I've finally watched it almost all the way through by now, and _damn_ What an episode.
@SeatBill
5 жыл бұрын
@@szeddezs Avery Brooks has always been an underestimated actor (I used to watch him on the old "Spenser: For Hire" series, and he made his presence felt even as a gun-toting thug!), and I think there's a case to be made for him being one of the greatest Star Fleet captains of all time! The only one who was married, the only one who was a widower, the only one with a child of his own, a SF Captain who turned out to be "the Emissary" of a planet he'd never set foot on before he was assigned to Deep Space Nine....and a captain who LIED and DECEIVED others to get one empire (the Romulans) into a war on the side of the Federation and the Klingons, against another empire (the Dominion) and went on to win that war! You can't write a better character than that! He went farther in many ways than James Kirk EVER did in his career; and yet, few people talk about him at all. I just don't understand it. Brooks KNOCKED it OUT OF THE PARK with Sisko, and most of the rest of the actors on DS9 weren't bad, either, Even secondary characters like Martok earned their place in ST history!
@Paerigos
5 жыл бұрын
@@SeatBill Well "Look at this Gagh Worf... its barely moving... I tell you Worf... WAR IS MUCH MORE FUN WHEN YOU ARE WINNING!"
@ShumaiAxeman
5 жыл бұрын
Best damn episode of any show Ive seen to date.
@mason6300
5 жыл бұрын
In a world so focused on individualism with 24/7 social media, you would assume identity politics would decline, however, the opposite is happening as people feel inadequate with themselves.
@jedi1josh
5 жыл бұрын
I think the only time Janeway brought up gender was an episode where one of her subordinates calls her "sir" and she replied that while "sir" was technically appropriate, she prefers "ma'am". I wish I knew what episode it was but I'm fairly certain it was early on. Possibly even the first episode.
@szeddezs
5 жыл бұрын
Yes it was the first episode, with good ol' jittery Harry Kim.
@5roundsrapid263
5 жыл бұрын
Yes, the pilot. That really showed to me that she was tough but feminine.
@RobKMusic
5 жыл бұрын
She prefers "Captain". Ma'am if it's crunch time… and it's not crunch time yet.
@Grendel1967g
5 жыл бұрын
When Janeway was played by Genevieve Bujold.
@denisl2760
5 жыл бұрын
Calling female officers "sir" is really weird. I think it started in the British Royal Navy? In the US Navy its always been "ma'am".
@davidthomas347
5 жыл бұрын
The race or gender of the characters never mattered much to me. I just assumed that in the future depicted in Star Trek it would be normal to have female captains on spaceships. But women and men working together is a normal trope in science fiction. Just think of Aliens or.Starship Troopers where female soldiers fight with the men. Now that is real equality
@DanielM2006UK
5 жыл бұрын
Quite agree, it's not the gender that makes them a good person or to put it another way: "It's not who they are underneath, but what they do that defines them."
@Tysakasa
5 жыл бұрын
With regards to Starship Troopers, that was really only in the movies and TV series. In the novel, no women were allowed in the Mobile Infantry. Men could serve in Fleet, but were never allowed to be the Captain of a ship, think the most they could go was low ranking officer on the bridge, but not much else. For the most part, men were the boots on the ground, women were the ones flying the ships. Yet even with that kind of divide, the genders were still equally treated, I think both were also allowed to be Sky Marshall as well (only read the book once, been meaning to read it again XD )
@Argonautx66
5 жыл бұрын
Fight? They shower together too. They’re all about equality.
@ninjabearpress2574
5 жыл бұрын
Read the book again, to be a Sky Marshal you have to have commanded a Mobile Infantry unit and commanded a ship.
@davidthomas347
5 жыл бұрын
I have never read the book. I am purely referring to the movie. In the movie, we see a society where men and women are given the same opportunities and there is no sex difference in occupations. Both men and women fight and work together. I am sure that the novel and the book have one thing in common: that people have to earn their rank or social position through hard work and merit. No man or woman is given favours due to their sex or race
@funzjag
5 жыл бұрын
I’ve been a Trek fan since the original. I was four years old when I started watching Star Trek. I never thought that anybody could be a better commanding officer than Kirk. Then Ben Sisko came along. I never thought that a series would be called Star Trek and turn out to be pure trash. Then Discovery came along.....
@ph1980
5 жыл бұрын
The other good thing about old Star Trek was its ability to shock you. As you say, Sisko was such a good CO. Such a good officer, and then you see "In the Pale Moonlight". Avery Brook's monologues in that episode as he showed what an amazing officer had been pushed to do by the War. It gave me chills. I still think Brook's performance in that episode is the single finest acting performance in the history of the show - and when you consider some of the actors that have been in the show - that's quite a claim to fame.
@funzjag
5 жыл бұрын
ph1980 I’d have to agree with you. If follow the characters like we do, his desperation made him act immorally. He achieved his goal though. The Romulan Star Empire fought with the UFP. To me, that episode was as disturbing as a horror film. The only other major flaw of Captain Cisco was his obsession with Eddington. Let the damn guy go. You’ve got more important things to do. The UFP turned their backs on the colonials that settled planets that were just given away to the Cardis! Those reptiles have no regard for individual rights or the Federations’ values. This is where I go on a tangent, as if these stories are real. I’ll quit while I still can. Thanks for responding. Live long and prosper 🖖
@mulberryman1305
5 жыл бұрын
I agree with you DS9 dealt with bigotry, slavery, racism, even religion the big difference being it wasn't shoved down our throats
@Paulafan5
5 жыл бұрын
Trek has always dealt with the big issues, but they wrapped it in a good story with good characters and it was all organic in nature. It wasn't forced or artificial (most of the time).
@AmurTiger
5 жыл бұрын
In many ways the topics were shoved down our throats but they had the writing to back them up. I mean they have whole flashback to racist eras of earth for Sisco more or less to deal with these otherwise out of place issues but in the context of well-developed characters that we'd learned to care about and a reasonable plot for the episode. And really the crux of this is the character writing where they view the character from their modern status first and their role in the universe second which breaks our suspension of disbelief and makes the whole thing feel like an attempt to manipulate the audience at which point it's more or less impossible to get them to buy into anything you're selling.
@serpentsepia6638
5 жыл бұрын
I remember an episode of DS9 where Captain Sisko questioned why his senior staff visited Vic Fontaine, since the program was set in the 1930's/40's -- a time when blacks were not accepted in white society. Kasidy Yates, Sisko's girlfriend, explained to him that she goes there because of how it should have been, not for what it was in the past. This opened Sisko's mind and for the first time he joined his crew to help remove a computer virus by playing out the program. Today, sjw's viewpoints are the exact opposite as Sisko's. Sisko was willing to open his mind and his heart, while sjw's remain closed-minded and distance themselves from reality. Even reality set in fiction.
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
Seriously. WATCH DSC. With an open mind. They are NOT shoving it down our throats. Not more than they did in previous Trek shows. DSC in that sense at least is absolutely fine and in line with Star Trek. It's (misguided) press interviews done to create attention and generate interest.
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
@@unknownindividual The looks, yes. That's hardly Trek. The science too. I hated how the ships flew around, how they shot at things... it was terrible. But I do sometimes see a bit of Trek in the writing, and especially in the characters (excluding the mirror universe ones). It's an ok show with potential, which I guess is all we can hope for in a first Trek season (in that sense it is VERY Trek). Now, did you notice anyone shoving SJW messages into your throat in DSC? Please give me examples if you did. I mean in the show itself, not in interviews. I could probably find examples in previous Trek shows, especially in TOS, but in DSC...
@gravytrain8041
5 жыл бұрын
Brooks was my favorite captain too. And Janeway was a ballsy, die for my crew captain. Without being a feminist, SJW shitstorm. Kate M was a well rounded Woman. Strong and brave, without losing her femininity.
@commanderlopan
5 жыл бұрын
I want to say that I'm grateful for this piece you've produced. In the 90's I was a kid who had spent his formative years watching Star Trek with my parents, aunts, and uncles. I was bathed in TOS and TNG from my earliest TV watching years. But man oh man, in early 1993 I do remember racing home frantically from an extra-curricular function to catch the debut of DS9. For me it was a particularly special occasion. It was the first Star Trek series I watched the debut of, as I was just a little too young to catch The Next Generation at its beginning. But there was definitely more to than that. My father is black, and a huge Star Trek nerd. It was definitely a memorable moment for him and myself seeing a black Commander front and center in the action and story as the star. I remember feeling a kind of contented pride to see Sisko grow and evolve as a dignified, contemplative and powerful figure with strong convictions. Dad likened my experience to his experience watching Uhura on the bridge alongside Kirk and Spock when he was a boy. Uhura, who was an elegant, respectable and talented officer working amidst her peers on the Enterprise. It was inclusive and cooperative. But when I see Burnham on the bridge ... my blood boils. My whole family has largely panned Discovery, while my father and I have groaned with agony and rage. Star Trek night used to be the night we'd all drop everything and tune in. We dreamed of a future better than our past and present. We even maintained this tradition through the run of Voyager and Enterprise ... for better or worse. But those days seem long gone now. This current iteration is mean-spirited and kinda backwards. It's flippant toward what Trek used to be. It's aggressive, preachy (with nothing to say), and "in your face". My dad and I, we've had our struggles here and there for representation and inclusion, NOT forced diversity and spiteful identity politics.
@mgelliott1
5 жыл бұрын
I think folks don't give Major Kira/Nana Visitor her full due. She had a great backstory. Was a complete bad ass....and she stood up to Sisco and Kai Winn (and also Quark). She was also sexy and beautiful and had "feminine" scenes. One minute she was giggling like a school girl talking about "boys" with Dax, the next she was going toe-to-toe with Dukat. I actually would have liked to see her in the captain's chair in her own series. I liked her far better than Janeway. Not KM's fault, but the writer's fault. I never really understood what she stood for. She contradicted herself and her actions so many times (not evolved like Season 1 Sisco to Pale Moon Light Sisco), but back and forth. I just kept wondering, which Janeway do we get this week.
@rustknuckleirongut8107
5 жыл бұрын
Major Kira was a great character, but was played by one of the worst actors in the history of Trek. The woman playing her seemed to be more of a stage actor over emphasizing emotions, facial expressions and movement for the benefit of the back row in a theater rather than a screen actor capable of playing with the nuance the camera is able to pick up. For me her "stage actor" tendencies ruined the character and made her unbelievable as a real person.
@patrickfrost9405
5 жыл бұрын
Major Kira... No, no... CAPTAIN Kira! Yeah. I like the sound of that.
@kieron39
5 жыл бұрын
@mgelliott1 funilly enough, Nana Visitor wanted to audition for the role of Janeway while still filming DS9. The director or her agent or someone had to get it through to her that it would have been crazy to try and work that schedule.
@planescaped
5 жыл бұрын
@@rustknuckleirongut8107 Well she was literally a last minute replacement after they couldn't get the actress who played Ro Laren in TNG to do it. And yeah, Kira was pretty painful the first 3-4 seasons. After that she was *a lot* better though, and I actually grew to like her more than Dax... if only because Terry Farrel left the show before it ended! Damn you Ivanov--Dax!
@therwfer
5 жыл бұрын
@@patrickfrost9405 Wasn't she Colonel by the end? People got promoted a lot in DS9... Sisko became Captain, Worf became Lt. Commander, O'Brian had all sorts of insignia, Rom became Grand Nagus, Bashir became a freak, Dax became a cute chick, Odo became liquid.... only good old Quark never changed.
@satoau1
5 жыл бұрын
it was that first interview: "Not even just with me - we also have the first Asian female captain and we also have the first female captain with a female first officer. We have a very positive relationship there. And we have the first openly gay officer, as well." this isn't strength of diversity, this is divisive, putting people into separate boxes according to what they're deemed to be, making sure we continue to think of people as different and categorize them appropriately. contrast this to sisko who was a captain never a black captain, janeway who was also a captain but never a female captain, and every other member of every cast who was never anything more, less or different than just a person.
@Daedalus_Dragon
4 жыл бұрын
I know this is an old thread, but someone commented and it got me back to it, and I read your comment. So your complaint is you saw an interview where an answer to a question was about how they have diversity and several "first", because the show doesn't make a point to call ANY of that out, also I am sure if you looked for it there is an interview where they point out that Sisko was the first Black Captain and another stating that Janeway is the first female, in fact, one lazy google search later treknews.net/2012/06/13/avery-brooks-benjamin-sisko-does-not-define-me/ ew.com/article/1995/01/20/star-trek-voyagers-first-female-captain/
@satoau1
4 жыл бұрын
@@Daedalus_Dragon no that's not my complaint at all. my complaint is that in their misguided attempt to be inclusive, they've in fact been discriminatory. sisko wasn't a black captain, he was a captain, and he wasn't put into the role because he was black, nor was janeway a captain because she was a woman. previous iterations of star trek were inclusive because a person's race and gender were immaterial. in new star trek however, people are intentionally divided by race, gender, and sexuality and pigeonholed as such. this promotes discrimination because it teaches people to be aware of differences and divide people into different groups, rather than view all people as equal. the article you post discusses janeway's being the first female captain as a point of interest. she's a captain who happens to female, without any suggestion that the show is somehow good *because* it has a female captain. the article specifically says it will be different with a female captain, not better, and doesn't ask for any applause for it either. your sisko article seems to agree with me even more strongly "the presentation of a man dealing with loss" not "a black man dealing with loss", and "without their color being the critical aspect of what or who they are". until now there was nothing in star trek about a person's perceived group affiliation being what defines them.
@Daedalus_Dragon
4 жыл бұрын
sato AU your response only serves to confuse me. Did you actually watch the show? At no point during ANY episode of DISCO do they talk about gender or race. It plays absolutely no bearing on anything. No one is divided or grouped based on anything. Your comment makes zero sense. You are saying that “people are intentionally divided by race, gender, and sexuality and pigeonholed”, but calling that statement a gross misconception is being generous. That comment simply has no basis in reality at all. Please feel free to prove me wrong, find any evidence of that IN the show and I will gladly look at it, but I’ve watched through both seasons twice, and your statements simply don’t hold water.
@satoau1
4 жыл бұрын
@@Daedalus_Dragon again you're commenting on things i did not say. i didn't say during the show, i'm referring to the production and writing of the show, as evidenced by what we see on screen and in all these interviews. discussion used to be around characters and their struggles and hardships, now it's about what group characters should be in based on their identity. there's a massive difference between a hero who happens to be a woman, and a woman who happens to be a hero. do you disagree with that?
@Daedalus_Dragon
4 жыл бұрын
sato AU So you just don’t like a handful of interviews you’ve seen? Who cares. I haven’t watched any interviews with the cast about the show. As to the writing, if it isn’t in the show, how is the writing affected by it? That makes no sense.
@ceranko
5 жыл бұрын
The Klingon redesign people should be beaten and chased out of town. The Elephant man wants his makeup back Discovery! Klingons are not animals!
@Kronosfobi
5 жыл бұрын
I didnt watched the original star trek. Can you tell me whats bothering you with the new klingons?
@ceranko
5 жыл бұрын
They are totally unlike the movies and TV series. They look like deformed people with elephantitus of the face! The makeup is so bad it effects the way the actors act they cant even move their heads and their voices sound like their mentally challenged. .Its a compleate shit show. Klingons should look like they did in deep space 9. They are bad ass warriors. The redesign is shit!
@Kronosfobi
5 жыл бұрын
@@ceranko alright thanks.
@ceranko
5 жыл бұрын
@@Kronosfobi It pissed me off they destroyed the Klingons. Even the ships and costumes are ridiculous for the Klingons. And they never had cloaking devices in this era. Hopefully it will get better.
@Kronosfobi
5 жыл бұрын
@@ceranko like i said i am far from a fan. I just saw discovery and only reasons i kept watching was terrans and spor drive tech sounded interesting (which i learned it actually never existed in original series.) If you are saying it then its mostly true. This video itself proves it. I hope this season will be better.
@Jimmer93
5 жыл бұрын
Just shows how much the world has actually REgressed!
@codyw1
5 жыл бұрын
We have regressed so much since the 90s it is unbelievable. Truly a modern Dark Age of ignorance.
@Jimmer93
5 жыл бұрын
Precisely! :-/
@donaldpaluga
5 жыл бұрын
I blame the Shadows
@SuperLloyd84
5 жыл бұрын
I blame the internet.
@tommat86
5 жыл бұрын
@@SuperLloyd84 Not to forget 9/11 and the politics after it. That changed a lot quite drastically
@willowfalls7528
5 жыл бұрын
They really knew how to make a good show back in the 90s, (all the Star Treks,Babylon 5, etc). I have no idea WHAT they're thinking nowadays.
@pwnmeisterage
5 жыл бұрын
They didn't bother to watch Trek, they don't understand Trek, they don't _like_ Star Trek. In fact, they don't even like sci-fi. They just follow the money. It shows in the shows. This show is reviled by Trek and sci-fi audiences, it hasn't attracted the interests of other audiences, it's already struggling for budgets and resources even before Season 2.
@CrashRaindog
5 жыл бұрын
One of my favourite parts about Sisko in DS9 was in the first season he was clean cut, very Starfleet looking. Second season he has a shaved head and a goatee and looks seriously mean when he faces up to adversaries.
@JamesBurrTV
5 жыл бұрын
The issue is not only NOT diversity, it isn't even about forced diversity. Look at the New X-Men from 40 years ago - an African, a Japanese man, an Irishman, a Canadian, a Native American, a German and a Russian. Not only was that diverse, it was forced diversity - they did it deliberately. They even did it because of "representation"! However, the difference is, in the 70s they did it then created real characters within those roles, characters who then had stories and crises and relationships..... like real Russians, Germans, Canadians etc. What they DIDN'T do was use them as empty mouthpieces for intersectional politics or advocates of Marxist Queer or Feminist Theory. Trouble is, the NPCs have so polluted and soured things now, that if Claremont came up with the new X-Men today, instead of just reading the stories, people would knee-jerk react by going, "Erg, look at all this forced diversity crap." As others have pointed out, the SJWs and NPCs have actually caused a regression in attitudes.
@Seele2015au
5 жыл бұрын
JamesBurrTV same goes with the "sex change movies": remakes of successful, established movies but with male characters replaced by females such as the Ghostbuster reboot, Ocean's 8, etc. Let's not forget the forced ethnicity changes such as the 2015 version of Fantastic Four where the Human Torch just had to be black. And we all know how dismal these films are.
@AlexM-wq7in
5 жыл бұрын
When has any character ever mentioned "Marxist Queer or Feminist Theory"? Bad writing is just bad writing. It has nothing to do with the diversity in the cast or with the political message of Star Trek (which has always been progressive, and rightly so). Stop blaming the flaws of STD on "forced diversity" or "SJWs". I think right-wing fans have made it almost impossible to criticize a show like STD on its merits because so many have unfairly attacked it for offending their political sensibilities. I hate the show, but I hate the reaction of right-wingers to it almost as much (even more when it crosses into online harassment). Can we all just calm down?
@silas0898
5 жыл бұрын
+Alex M "I think right wing fans have made it almost impossible to criticize..." Ghostbusters was shit yet you couldn't criticize it because it was all-female and you would be labelled sexist by left wing creators, actors and media, look I don't particularly like either side currently, you are both paranoid and extreme, but it's the left that are shutting down criticism and only allowing positive reviews of their poorly written garbage. Actually look at some of the people accused of "sexist and racist" reviews of Star Wars and Star Trek Discovery for instance and you will find mostly fair criticism unless you actively search for a MGTOW review yet supposedly the entire fandoms are toxic, it's bullshit.
@Grinder-one
5 жыл бұрын
Excellent video with terrific points. Sisco's color along with Janeway's gender, were only as significant as Picard's baldness...a distinguishing observation in the first couple of episodes which had left your mind by episode 3. Racism only exists today because certain people want it to....by certain people, I mean those that call everything and everyone, racist. And exactly the same goes for sexism.
@CritStanley
5 жыл бұрын
No, racism still exists today. Its just many people seem to have forgotten how to tell if someone is racist or not. :( Or better yet, many people who were oblivious to racism's existence but have had their eyes opened and have their hearts in the right place, aren't properly recognizing who is racist and who isn't and just get mad when people defend something or themselves. Basically any SJW of any just cause or fight. SJW's simply aren't helping the cause they wish to fight for but are instead just making it worse. Its heart breaking. To list some examples Black Lives Matter and Feminism were legit, but SJW's who listened to them and felt they should help, didn't learn how to fight for them and even who to fight about it. Now when people think of Feminists they think of SJW Feminazis instead.
@possiblymaybe6711
5 жыл бұрын
If u watch the show burnhams race and gender do not come up ever. She’s treated just like any other Star Trek character of the past. The only people who made a fuss over her identity were people who were upset that cbs picked a “diversity hire” . I’m sorry but racism is still very much alive and the reaction of racists to her casting is proof enough. Racists made her existence such an issue that now the shows being blamed for choosing her. Unbelievable
@psal8715
5 жыл бұрын
Janeway is my favorite Captain. Of all the captains she felt the most human.
@jgelt
5 жыл бұрын
and Lt. Cmdr. Shelby. A character that gave Riker a legitimate run for his money. She was an aggressive, careerist, and highly competitive. Yet, she was likable with many admirable characteristics. The writers put a new character in direct conflict with a beloved main character. All her qualities seemed genuine, no one would ever accuse her of being a Mary Sue. It takes good writers and good acting to put someone at odds with a well liked existing character and have the audience not hate that character. Even , more respect that character. I think she would have been a good recurring character or a good character for a spin off show.
@donaldpaluga
5 жыл бұрын
I think a LOT of people didn't like SHelby because she might replace Riker.
@shawn6860
5 жыл бұрын
Ya and that go get it nature was a factorin loving or hating her.
@jgelt
5 жыл бұрын
@@donaldpaluga that would be a natural reaction. Some of her critiques of Riker cut close to the bone. But did you hate her becasue she was a woman? Did you hate her becasue her character seemed to be gifted with abilities that didn't make sense? Did you hate her because she the writers gave her political gravitas because of her gender? Did you hate her because she was a powerful woman? I suspect the answers to all these are "no." The dislike we feel for her is that she is a legitimate challenger to character we love. The points she raises about Riker stagnating can't be brushed off as completely untrue, which makes her challenge all the more real and dramatic . Once the challenge abates one can respect her as a character. The actress did her job and the writers, theirs.
@maxis2k
5 жыл бұрын
THANK YOU for mentioning how the media in the 90s was free of this identitarian crap. I used to be able to watch shows like Family Matters or Fresh Prince, with an all black cast, and I literally never even noticed their ethnicity. They weren't "black" people. They were just people. Unlike today where you watch a show and they can't go five minutes without reminding the audience what ethnicity and sex a character is. All this does is make characters seem LESS like people and more like a political oped piece you'd read in the NY Times. As for STD, the people in charge of Star Trek Discovery have quite proudly come out and said they don't care about the past Star Trek lore. So it isn't hard to think they actually don't know about Sisko and Janeway and thought Michael was some totally ground-breaking character. Nevermind they had a black female captain as far back as the third movie. And a black female admiral with Geordi's mom. And Michael isn't even a captain or an admiral. She's technically lower on the chain than Uhura was in the original Star Trek. The story just bends over backwards to make her the lead because current year is all about non white, non male. Also, reminder that JJ Abrams admitted he couldn't even watch all of TOS. So he also just made shit up for his reboot in 2009.
@Dargonhuman
5 жыл бұрын
Don't forget Admiral Cartwright from Star Trek VI, who no one saw as a black admiral but the admiral who conspired with the Klingons to assassinate the chancellor.
@ortzinator
5 жыл бұрын
I find it interesting that you mentioned Fresh Prince since that show had countless plot lines dealing with life as a Black American. There was even a Black Lives Matter episode before BLM existed.
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
When you ACTUALLY watch DSC, no one gives a crap about Burnham being black. Or female. Or any other character, for that matter. It's a non issue. People are literally color blind. The only place where people made a fuss about it was in interviews, where it was used to draw attention to the show. And that it did. It's free ads. The only thing that draws attention is Stamets and Culber being gay, but it only draws attention because they openly show it. The characters in the show don't care. They'd be surprised if someone told them that's not normal or acceptable. Which is the kind of society that TNG etc. also portrayed (look at the episodes where Starfleet officers looks down on species that limit the role of women, for example). DSC is the story about how a promising officer can fall from grace with one poor decision, and how she gets back respect and changes as a person. It also shows an idealistic, TNG kind of officer in a society that is more like ours, more pragmatic. A society where Section 31 is openly accepted.
@Dargonhuman
5 жыл бұрын
@@ortzinator True, but that show treated the subject as more, "This is how I grew up," and not "This is my victimhood." There was one episode I remember where a group of black kids were making Carlton feel bad for not being "black enough" (by their definition) and Will called them out on it saying that they were wrong for holding onto such outdated, racist ideas and they should be aspiring to be more like Carlton, a respected member of high society than the stereotypical hoodlums they thought were "true blacks". So, yes, Fresh Prince did tackle those social issues - and it tackled all facets of those social issues including the problems within the black community.
@possiblymaybe6711
5 жыл бұрын
maxis2k god one more person assuming this show talks about her race and gender every episode when it’s yet to be brought up.
@A-Milkdromeda-Laniakea-Hominid
5 жыл бұрын
Bravo, well said up and down side to side.. I actually shed a couple tears for 1950s sci-fi writer Bennie during his breakdown. Avery's performance was so good, I could feel the utter frustration of being treated so poorly despite behaving impeccably. I agree, best ep in all of Trek (and it takes place in the past lol.)
@InvisibleAvenger
5 жыл бұрын
My recollections of the early days before DS9 aired is the same -- the main (and basically only) concern was making a Star Trek show that took place on a space station rather than on a starship. I don't remember anyone having issues with the casting.
@TerraExodus
5 жыл бұрын
I had that same feeling. I wondered how the story would evolve if the cast was in a static location and not in motion. Worked out rather well though, you got too see how the Federation operates as a community.
@ellennopeland5381
5 жыл бұрын
Janeway is my favorite captain, tbh. She was just the driest, "ugh, here we go again", "can you believe this shit?", and no-nonsense lady In the entirety of Star Trek. And I love it.
@sirbletchley
5 жыл бұрын
Deep Space Nine is by far the most underrated of the Treks. Sisko is my favourite captain after Picard. There are a lot of people who still don't realize how good that series was.
@chromosomeboo
5 жыл бұрын
Nothing before 2005 matters to these people... its a very sad world that we live in today.
@MasterFhyl
5 жыл бұрын
There was one time I can think of where Sisko's race was seriously mishandled. In "Bada-Bing Bada-Bang," Sisko threw a wildly out of character hissy fit and initially refused to help his friends (in the zero stakes plot of the week) because of "how racist real-life vegas was in the 60's." It made no sense in the context of episode, or even the show as a whole. (The Federation is post-racial, and the chip Sisko has on his shoulder is WAY out of place.) True, Sisko was proven by the episode to be in the wrong. But it was still grossly out of character for him. And side note, "Real life Vegas in the 60's" was highly progressive for its time if you care about that sort of thing. Particularly Sinatra himself (Who the Vic Fontaine character is at least partly based off) was heavily instrumental in helping desegregate Vegas, outright refusing to play shows at places that were racist.
@codyw1
5 жыл бұрын
That was down to Avery Brooks' own issues with it, I believe.
@MasterFhyl
5 жыл бұрын
@@sadako24 It was the only time in 7 seasons of the show that I viewed Sisko as "the black captain" (which is in itself commendable I suppose), mainly because in that instance, he made himself "the black captain". The Benny Russel stuff I think was well earned for the show (especially since they waited several years into the run to do it, and it was framed in the context of real life racism, specifically surpassing it.) Sisko getting butthurt about the real life setting for the holodeck program came off to me as childish, and ironically even a bit racist. (Which for the record, I do NOT believe Sisko is in literally the entire rest of the series.)
@thomasplummer8103
5 жыл бұрын
@@sadako24 I hadn't thought of that but in retrospect, that probably explains it. In fact, being from the post racial federation probably made that experience worse-- Sisko would have never had to actually face racism in his life before that moment, and would have likely been as real to him as the Vikings are to us. We know it happened, and it was terrible in many cases, but there is enough distance that it feels kind of half real. To be thrust into it would have been deeply and profoundly scarring, and would have made a huge impact on how he viewed the past.
@MasterFhyl
5 жыл бұрын
@@codyw1 It was a bad choice.
@Karen1963Yorks
5 жыл бұрын
@@sadako24 Agreed. I think Worf had the same issue with holo Deck scenes set on Earth in the early 20th Century. Rewriting history.
@Dare_To_Game
5 жыл бұрын
Sisko is also my absolute favorite captain in Star Trek history.
@Terry.W
5 жыл бұрын
I loved Captain Janeway... superb actor and had a commanding personality... Jodie Whittaker could learn a lot from her.
@Call_Me_Matrix
5 жыл бұрын
It's like they never seen star trek. Seriously, the show pushed diversity in it's FIRST SEASON!
@thefirstprimariscatosicari6870
5 жыл бұрын
They probably only saw the Cage, where 90% of the characters were white men or women with a few Asians here and there.
@Dargonhuman
5 жыл бұрын
The difference is, when Star Trek first aired in the 60's, there were some real and serious civil rights issues being fought over in both the courts and the streets. By the end of the 90's, when shows like DS9 and Voyager were coming out, society in America had come so far that most of those issues were no longer relevant as the struggles of the 60's and 70's had been won and nearly every one had equal rights (nearly, because the gay rights issues were just being brought up) then these ignorant, upstart SJWs started stirring the pot and bringing back old issues that had already been settled in favor of the minorities until we're where we're at today and having the same conversations as the 60's.
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
@@Dargonhuman Society has developed backwards. Not because of SJW, though there truly was some backlash over PC nonsense. In any case, many people are more (openly) racist these days.
@livingtonu
5 жыл бұрын
Sisko is also my favorite Star trek captain by far he didn't get the attention he deserve.
@michaelhoule2134
5 жыл бұрын
great vid... my fav voyager line... "theres coffee in that nebula"... best line ever.
@fancypenguin2092
5 жыл бұрын
OMG I quote this on all the time
@theblitz9
5 жыл бұрын
Sadly, with just a few changes in names, you could create an identical video about what has been done to Doctor Who.
@finrodbrs
5 жыл бұрын
I think he already has done that.
@Karen1963Yorks
5 жыл бұрын
The Doctor Who thing is SO MUCH WORSE.
@GeorgeMonet
5 жыл бұрын
You could change a few names and make an identical video for many different series across many different mediums, including the fine arts.
@Paulafan5
5 жыл бұрын
@@Karen1963YorksBoth are equally awful. Star Trek is about hope and the best of humanity, while Discovery is about 42 minutes long. Doctor Who is just a PC mess.
@jjohn713
5 жыл бұрын
What CBS did with Star Trek was bad. Then BBC had it's "Hold My Beer!" moment with Doctor Who.......
@davidanttila9305
5 жыл бұрын
"I'm not Picard!" - Ben Sisko
@danharmon8763
5 жыл бұрын
Well, there is one positive here. Thanks to crap like STD I don't watch as much TV as I used to.
@johalun
5 жыл бұрын
Yep. Luckily we have good options like The Expanse and Travelers.
@voltairespuppet
5 жыл бұрын
True. But now I watch way to much youtube instead, all complaining about crap in TV programs.... have I become a grumpy old man 40 years ahead of schedule?! ;)
@danharmon8763
5 жыл бұрын
@@voltairespuppet Maybe you have been a grumpy young man, because most intelligent people find dismay at things that are controlling or obvious. Most of us want to be entertained by movies and TV and when Star Trek first appeared there was nothing like it anywhere, and that originality made it good. Also the original series may have had a few moral lessons here and there, but they never beat us over the head with Liberal Global Feminists Agendas. Star Trek Discovery FAILS as entertainment, but it succeeds as PROPAGANDA. Perhaps we are not so grumpy after all. Maybe we're just FED UP!!
@nicholasleclerc1583
5 жыл бұрын
2:00 LOOOOL !!!! 👌👌🏻👌👌🏿👌 Note: This was EVEN closer to the end of the segregation era
@nicholasleclerc1583
5 жыл бұрын
creapsmantic What do you mean ? That sports locker rooms are still segregated by race ?
@histguy101
4 жыл бұрын
"A Character starts in one place, and ends in another." That's character growth. Character development is _us_ learning about the character, and how that continuing adding of dimension informs how we look at the character.
@tomjw7
5 жыл бұрын
Voyager was my favorite of all star trek. Janeway was great. 7 of 9 was awesome as well
@galexeqe
5 жыл бұрын
The only reason they go on about diversity is to draw your attention from the fact that they stole their entire storyline, characters and all from a video game and then apparently threatened to sue the creator of said game if they pursued it "The great Oz has spoken, pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. The great Oz has spoken" They're nothing but two bit charlatans with zero originality and a complete lack of knowledge of their own franchise
@TerraExodus
5 жыл бұрын
What game was it?
@galexeqe
5 жыл бұрын
@@TerraExodus Its an indie game called Tardigrades by Anas Abdin
@TerraExodus
5 жыл бұрын
@@galexeqe Thank you. I've not played the game, I can barely remember the plot to STD. I remember some youtubers talking about it. When I first saw that scene, I was confused AF.
@grantbitman1448
5 жыл бұрын
DS9 was so well done and Avery Brooks is so great. Just seeing that still from "Far Beyond the Stars" I began to tear up. It's such a powerful scene. It is real!
@shauntempley9757
5 жыл бұрын
Agree wholeheartedly. Sisko and Janeway were amazing Captains. It is for this reason that I won't touch STD. I am having enough trouble with Whittaker's Doctor.
@Galactusz007
5 жыл бұрын
TV Star Trek: 1. Star Trek the original series 2. Deep Space 9 3. The Next Generation 4. Voyager 5. The Orville 6. Enterprise 7. Star Trek Continues 8. Star Trek the Animated Series 9. Turkish Star Trek 10. Discovery
@rodgon123
5 жыл бұрын
You forgot to put Battlestar galactica and its Reboot and buck Rogers and stargate above std in the list
@rodgon123
5 жыл бұрын
And flash gordon too
@radiofiendify
5 жыл бұрын
Turkish Star Trek? I am intrigued and shall boldly go to find out more :)
@danielreick9904
5 жыл бұрын
@@radiofiendify tell me the results of your search please.
@danielreick9904
5 жыл бұрын
you should add the german parody dreamship surprise to the list as well. :D
@modernvictorian1174
5 жыл бұрын
Such a great video. Sisko and Janeway never egregiously drew attention to what made them different from previous captains. They simply took the stage, filled the shoes, and stole our hearts. They were awesome because they were dynamic, human characters, not because of any virtue-signaling or attempt to be politically correct. They were true captains, not politicians.
@FTGMotorsports
5 жыл бұрын
You are 100% on target with your assessment IMO, The entire Star Trek / Federation universe from day one was not concerned with identity politics (the possible exception being early episodes of Enterprise and Archer's treatment of Vulcans). People were judged for their actions and character in every case. Sisko was complex yet strong and you could see by his actions why he was a captain - the character traits all Star Trek captains possessed were his, it was obvious he earned the position. Any Star Trek fan knew race did not matter, after all Spock was Vulcan, Sulu and Uhura were strong independent and capable people from the original series, race did not matter - not to mention the Kirk Uhura "interracial kiss" . Janeway, and especially Kate Mulgrew's performance was brilliant as you said, and transparent on Gender. She was a leader that any man could follow and respect, and we all wanted our daughters to grow up and be Janeway. STD and so many shows today can only show non-male, non-white characters as strong when they are tearing down white male stereotypes and our society in general. Hollywood is just getting it wrong and its possible it will be too late because they realize it.
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
Guess what. DSC is transparent on gender, sexuality and race. It doesn't matter to the characters, it's not an issue, it doesn't give them an advantage or disadvantage. Burnham was a traitor, and was treated as such. Regardless of her being a woman or black. That didn't buy her anything. She previously got into her position by being brilliant, smart, and a decent human being. Not by being black. IMHO DSC, and Burnhams arc is about the person BECOMING a great officer and then captain. There's an arc to her. She starts out as flawed, but learns valuable lessons along the way. Because that's how real life works. No one is born perfect. It is about actually earning the position of captain (which she does not have yet! She is just a science officer). Actually, Burnham in the pilot reminds me of Picard in the flashback episode, where they reveal how Picard got his artificial heart. He was a cocky, arrogant young officer to be. Then he was stabbed. He learned humility. Cut 20, 30 years into the future, and he has become the captain we learned to love. Burnham is at the start of that journey. It's different, it is interesting and it has potential. The Kirk Uhura kiss was absolutely inserted into the show for political reasons by the writers. Have no doubt about that. It's forced into the show. And they had to tone it down: The characters didn't act out of free will. That was as far as the writers were allowed to go. Kirk and Uhura weren't enjoying it and they didn't want to do it. The gay kiss between Jadzia and her former lover (who used to be male!) was edited out by multiple stations. And that was in the 90s. Gender and race politics were clearly on the mind of Star Trek writers from the start. They just didn't give interviews where they congratulated themselves on how great they were. That is the only difference. (And that the writers used to be better than the new breed).
@cormoran2303
5 жыл бұрын
I'll see their Michael Burnham and raise them a Tryla Scott
@DblOSmith
5 жыл бұрын
I'll see your Tryla Scott and raise you Silva La Forge.
@Coramelimane
5 жыл бұрын
My *entire family* mother, father and both sisters would watch DS9 every saturday night during it's run in the 90s.
@michaelkpate
5 жыл бұрын
I always felt like the biggest issues Voyager and Enterprise had were not the casts or the writers but the meddling Network Execs at UPN. We will never know how much better the shows could have been without that.
@svenzo1199
5 жыл бұрын
Enterprise season 3 and especially season 4 redeemed it for me though and Voyager had classics like Year of Hell going for it so its a damn shame that Moonves cancelled Enterprise just as it was getting good.
@michaelkpate
5 жыл бұрын
@@svenzo1199 I thought Enterprise Season 3 was absolutely ridiculous and an utter low point - just a terrible way to try and insert 9/11 into the Star Trek Universe. I never saw season 4 because I lost interest.
@svenzo1199
5 жыл бұрын
@@michaelkpate You should season 4 is in my opinion one of the best seasons in Star Trek history, it just has a shitty begining story and the worst finale of all time, but inbetween you will find gems like "Terra Prime", the Vulcan arc, the birth of the Federation arc and most importantly the best mirror universe episodes in all of Star Trek "In a mirror, darkly" which are set completly in the mirror universe without any prime universe intervention. And season 3 also had it gems like "Damage".
@berthayling1032
5 жыл бұрын
Ugh. Can you say Dean Valentine? He took over after Lucie Salhany was ousted -- late '97, early '98 or so -- and wanted to clear the decks of *everything,* including Voyager, which was only saved due to Paramount's refusal to axe its flagship series. Most of the shows he commissioned were beyond dire. Truly odious, godawful nightmares.
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
@@svenzo1199 ENT was cancelled because by the time it got good, everyone had stopped watching it. This was the time where people didn't sit through bad seasons of Star Trek in the hope of it improving eventually. All shows but TOS had started badly, but with ENT people didn't stick around anymore. They gave up. This happened to the extreme with DSC, which started very, very poorly, and then quickly got better. But having all the decent episodes behind a paywall was probably a dumb idea. They should have dumped episodes 1 and 2 (maybe show them mid season as a flashback episode? Like they did with The Cage? Or just scrap them, because god were they awful!) and started with 3 and 4. Maybe then more would have stuck around.
@artamussumatra6286
5 жыл бұрын
This kind of horse sh*t is why I stopped watching regular TV, hardly ever stream anything that went into production after the ‘016 presidential election, and only go to the movies on very rare occasions now. NPCs have literally destroyed the entire entertainment industry.
@L1A1Rocker
5 жыл бұрын
Yep. I'm dreading what they've done to the Terminator franchise.
@rangelo7281
5 жыл бұрын
If you get a chance watch The Expanse, it's a slow takeoff but once it gets going it's amazing, and total lack of BS race/gender politics. Yes the cast is diverse but it's never an issue.
@LucDevine
5 жыл бұрын
Star Trek is a Liberal show.
@Cbarnes230479
5 жыл бұрын
Luke Devine Liberal, yeah. Not virtue signalling NPC crap. I can easily coexist & learn from liberals but intersectional bullshit is polarising and devisive.
@LucDevine
5 жыл бұрын
Ah ok so Joe Biden is your limit. And probably your next President 'lol'.
@dmjnoble
5 жыл бұрын
Sisko is one of my favorite characters ever not just from star trek.
@MrMortull
5 жыл бұрын
STD: For when the 24th century's *United Federation of Planets* (with its however-many member worlds and several dozen member SPECIES) just isn't diverse enough for you.
@MrAlexanderLang
5 жыл бұрын
Sisko was my favorite Star Trek captain aside from Picard.
@oldskoolchomp81
5 жыл бұрын
I did forget about janeway. Thanks for reminding me, ugh. Sisko was a beast and frankly, my favorite captain.
@delta4phoenix4
5 жыл бұрын
“God help you.” God is powerless compared to the fury of the caffeinated Captain of the Voyager. I love Voyager, even though it has its fair share of problems and plot holes. I watched one episode of STD, and was massively disappointed. I had hoped for a character equal to Janeway, not this... soulless abomination of a character.
@JohnBeebe
5 жыл бұрын
powerless compared to the fury of the Un-caffeinated Captain of the Voyager
@Frosty1979
5 жыл бұрын
They didn't forget. They simply never knew in the first place. Star Trek is just another tool they got their hands on, which they can use to push their agenda.
@Daedalus_Dragon
5 жыл бұрын
What agenda? who are "they"?
@Frosty1979
5 жыл бұрын
@@Daedalus_Dragon SJWs. People who think of themselves as very progressive and morally superior. Often self hating too, when they are white. Also very self righteous and unable to see the flaws in their own ideology. Currently they are mass produced in American universities and have unintentionally helped Trump becoming president of the United States.
@Daedalus_Dragon
5 жыл бұрын
Frosty1979 and who working on STD is an SJW and what agenda do you believe they are pushing?
@Frosty1979
5 жыл бұрын
@@Daedalus_Dragon Please, don't pretend to be stupid.
@Daedalus_Dragon
5 жыл бұрын
@@Frosty1979 It was a legitimate question, I watch the show and have no idea what agenda you think is being pushed, or who is behind it
@michaelkelleypoetry
5 жыл бұрын
Back in high school, around 2007, I came home from school, turned on the TV and came across re-runs of Star Trek Voyager that came on everyday at 4:00 pm. It quickly became my after-school routine; I loved Voyager. I had always watched TNG and Picard as a kid and thought the "new" series was so cool. I realized she was a woman as I have eyes, but she did so well in the role that it was never an issue for me. From the first episode I saw, I was hooked on ST:VOY. I actually think Q in one of the episodes got it right about her, describing her as one who exuded respect from everyone and yet, was still feminine. Too often female characters are written to be respected so much that they are no longer feminine.
@fredleggett923
5 жыл бұрын
Boy, you and sfdebris should have a livestream about psychopathic Janeway. And Janeway talked down to EVERYONE. They even made her into an admiral in Nemesis, barking orders at Picard, no less. She luuuuuurved the power.
@fredleggett923
5 жыл бұрын
Oh, I agree about the equally part. She was always primed and ready to bitch-slap the nearest crewmember or alien that gave her a sour eye, male, female, or unisex. She had an equal opportunity God complex.
@donaldpaluga
5 жыл бұрын
@@fredleggett923 and of course EVERYONE knows #IvanovaIsGod
@fredleggett923
5 жыл бұрын
I was more of a Tracy Scoggins fan myself, but yeah, I'd definitely do Ivanova in a heartbeat. Tamlyn Tomita was also hella hot back then.
@azraiel1984
5 жыл бұрын
I kept an open mind and watched the pilot to Star Trek discovery... Mistakes were made, Mistakes were made. Now I know for sure it is a series that never should have been made. It's a bullshit virtue signaling mess. 😵That's money well spent 😒
@andreamcmahon6352
5 жыл бұрын
I watched the whole forgettable thing. NPC fan art, if there is a thing, is the category I put it in.
@svenzo1199
5 жыл бұрын
I dont even want to pirate it.
@davidcopplestone6266
5 жыл бұрын
I watched Episode 1. Thought it was bad, but was prepared to give Episode 2 a go, thinking it has to improve. Nope, just more mess. Badly written, awful characters you don't care for; and completely ignoring the previous series.
@kadajawi6567
5 жыл бұрын
@@davidcopplestone6266 Episodes one and two were awful. Like, Naked Now levels of bad. IMHO they should have scrapped those. Just start with episode 3. It would have been a better show. I hated the first two episodes, the later ones were ok, with a few positive exceptions. Not ground breaking, sure, but good enough to give it a chance. And shall we list the bad TNG episodes? The Naked Now (3). Code of Honor (4). The Last Outpost (5). Lonely Among Us (7). Justice (8). Haven (11). And many more. It's a surprise the show even survived season 1.
@Japjongetje
5 жыл бұрын
Avery Brooks played in a TV series in the 80's: Spenser for Hire. The character was named Hawk, Later on there was a spinoff series created in 1989 , A Man Called Hawk that unfortunately only lasted one season. In this series he playes a tough , smart, streetwise character that takes no crap and gets the job done At the start of DS9, Avery Brooks had transformed his entire appearance so that people that he looked nothing like his character from Hawk... He played Sisko almost somehat as a man, fearful of being responsible for a deepspace station. During the DS9 seasons you could see the transformation (looks wise) to the Hawk character as if to show that he was gaining more and more confidence.
@LeaderoftheFates
5 жыл бұрын
I’m a white I grew up with Picard, but my fave captain has always been Sisko.
@GrnXnham
5 жыл бұрын
I liked Sisko because he was a badass. Picard was a diplomat. Sisko was a warrior. Remember how Picard always sat around and talked to Q? Sisko just punched him. "I am NOT Picard!"
@RoseBaggins
5 жыл бұрын
@@GrnXnham best line ever
@jimmym3352
5 жыл бұрын
I like Picard a little more, only because I can identify with him more (a loner intellectual type). Sisko definitely grew on me. I didn't like the religious stuff in the Premiere with him, but he just got better as the show went on. I feel the same about Janeway. She got better as the show went on as well.
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